Database Users

Official MicroSD card support, what Google has said

So, apparently, it is still not supported and Google has no solution yet.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2275..._details_emerge_the_little_things_add_up.html
This detail, which came out in conversations I had with Google engineers today, explains why the Android file system organization is, well, a mess, and why I’ve had such inconsistent experiences with Android and removable storage across the various Honeycomb tablets I’ve tried (and I’ve tried all of them that are available so far).
“We don’t want to expose the user to file locations,” explained Hiroshi Lockheimer, director of engineering at Google. “How do you manage that as a user? The not-good answer is with the file browser.” Lockheimer says that many of the experiences I’ve seen so far are what individual hardware manufacturers have enabled, as opposed to what Google has provided natively. The good thing is that Lockheimer says Google is looking at ways to do this; but the problem hasn’t been solved yet.
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Is it me or does that say nothing still?
Google says they don't want to give you a file browser / file explorer / file manager.
Fine - there's plenty of third party apps to that on the market - but why not fix the SD card slot support?
Although I agree that some of the structure stuff is a bit of a mess - there's lots of random folders created on the SD card, like .android_secure, .bookmark_thumb etc. that you probably don't want end users seeing.

At least now it's clear that it's Google who has to fix the SD Card issue and not Motorola.

poisike said:
At least now it's clear that it's Google who has to fix the SD Card issue and not Motorola.
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I honestly didn't read that at all...?
I read that google were working on some sort of file manager, not SD card? am I misreading it? as far as I can see file manager, and SD card are separate issues?
also the transformer, and custom kernels have the sd card slot working, so not sure who is at fault for the xoom

Why is there a difference between the tablet and the phones?
I have access to the SD Card and file system there.
Not like every Windows user on the planet has never seen "My Computer". Organizing files is not some obscure concept that is to high level for users.

From what I can understand:
USB file system means the OS access the usb disk in block level which the app (file browser) will have access to the full path of the file.
The one that is supported by Honeycomb right now is MTP. This is totally different compared to USB. The actual file system is implemented by the device, not by the computer's operating system.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Transfer_Protocol
My prediction, this USB thing will be solved by the upcoming ICE CREAM SANDWICH.
Because by then, phone and tablet are merged ... everything which is supported by phone (like SD card) must be supported by tablet.
So, yeah, we must wait till end of this year or early next year (worse case).
Still, it is too long for Motorola with their "promise", no?

@Kcarpenter
Very true - but I think the problem may lie with the Xoom using the MTP instead?
or is that a load of rubbish?
Eitherway, I guess from the Google point of view - they want it simple and try and hide the stuff they don't want n00bs messing with (a bit like Apple hide everything too so all their iOS are n00b proof!)
Also Phones open up to mass storage straight to the card - you don't get access to the internal memory at all. Whereas with the Xoom you would want access to that because there's loads of space there

gogol said:
My prediction, this USB thing will be solved by the upcoming ICE CREAM SANDWICH.
Because by then, phone and tablet are merged ... everything which is supported by phone (like SD card) must be supported by tablet.
So, yeah, we must wait till end of this year or early next year (worse case).
Still, it is too long for Motorola with their "promise", no?
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Click to collapse
What about just fixing the kernel like timat's - that'd do the same job for now

Still don't understand why they would slack on getting the SD card implemented. They have so much riding on honeycomb success. And the LTE radio needs to get installed too. Time to ramp it up.

I agree they should be able to enable it considering one of our own has already done so with a custom a kernel, I still love my xoom though!
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk

mwaychoff said:
I agree they should be able to enable it considering one of our own has already done so with a custom a kernel, I still love my xoom though!
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk
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Click to collapse
agree completely.
and the LTE thing is running on awhile now - didnt someone say that the samsung tab 10.1 might beat Xoom to be the first LTE HC tab if Moto don't buck up?

Who needs google when you have bigrushdog?

Just did the 3.1 update and SD card slot still doesn't work. I thought it would've fixed this.

Yea, I read that article yesterday. It has NOTHING to do with the sdcard support.
Google was explaining why android in general has a fairly chaotic/unintuitive filesystem structure... NOT why they haven't biuld in support for SD.

it was well known this update was not addressing the sd slot. No wjere not one single ppace has google or moto saidnthe sd lotbwil not be active by the deadline they stated. They could give us slot access right now but the issue is as has been aluded to they would either have to give full file sys access or no file access like the phones. For those that will say it doesn't matter give us access. It matters to them as they will be creating huge issues with tech support by the much larger majority of users that would delete things that would kill or hamper the device. I mean even on here you have tons of people that can't follow clear simple directons to flash an update without screwing it up some how. Can you imagine Suzzy home maker or joe the guy who can not figure out how to do a windows update would do with full access. My guess is they will be doing a update with a file manager and permision set so nothing past the sdcard parent folder can be accessed and programs installed will have premissions set to prevent accidental delete without going into the file manger settings to change them to allow change of permisions.
This will solve both the issues and allow both sd card and internal storage access without opening up the core files to tinkering by BDUs

Kit Kat 4.4 and external SD cards

I have read and I like the new restrictions on "external SD card" use. It will prevent a lot of apps from leaving crapola all over your device.
It does not restrict your use of data etc. It just keeps you organized. If you want to uninstall an app and still keep its data, you can simply move the data to a new folder.

mangurian said:
I have read and I like the new restrictions on "external SD card" use. It will prevent a lot of apps from leaving crapola all over your device.
It does not restrict your use of data etc. It just keeps you organized. If you want to uninstall an app and still keep its data, you can simply move the data to a new folder.
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Click to collapse
You must be stock and unrooted....Kit Kat is a major pain in the rear to root users..

jauger said:
You must be stock and unrooted....Kit Kat is a major pain in the rear to root users..
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Click to collapse
True - I only root my devices when they are out-dated.
I don't think the 8013 has reached that point yet.
I am still happy with its performance.

But what I am understanding is apps are corralled to their own folders. This implies to me that some I rely on will cease to work. Example:
I use folder sync to keep lecture notes synced between my 10.1 and S4. By my read of KitKat, folder sync will be prohibited from writing to the lecture notes folder.
What about photos? Different apps to adjust photos depending on what I want to do.
And what about ES File Explorer. Won't it become useless?
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk

jauger said:
You must be stock and unrooted....Kit Kat is a major pain in the rear to root users..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry if I may be asking the obvious, but in what way is KitKat a pain for root users?

starbuckk said:
But what I am understanding is apps are corralled to their own folders. This implies to me that some I rely on will cease to work. Example:
I use folder sync to keep lecture notes synced between my 10.1 and S4. By my read of KitKat, folder sync will be prohibited from writing to the lecture notes folder.
What about photos? Different apps to adjust photos depending on what I want to do.
And what about ES File Explorer. Won't it become useless?
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We don't have all the answers, but I'd bet dollars to donuts there will, at least, be work-arounds" for any on these problems.

mangurian said:
We don't have all the answers, but I'd bet dollars to donuts there will, at least, be work-arounds" for any on these problems.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There aren't. I've had KitKat since weeks after release (S4 GPe). I've been in touch with many developers and made them aware of the issue before it went mainstream. Bottom line, here's the limitation in the simplest of terms.
-An app can read any file on the MicroSD Card.
-An app can only modify contents within a self contained subfolder
So, file managers won't work if stock and unrooted (read only, no writing). FolderSync doesn't work. ES doesn't work (it will tell you that it created/deleted/modified the folder, but then when you refresh, the change never happened).
A good example of how this works would be with a bare bones gallery application. If you store your photos in a random folder within the SD card, the Gallery app can view them. However, if you try to delete a picture, it will only remove from the gallery and remain on the SD card. After a device reboot, it will reappear in the gallery (this also happens with Google Photos and the stock Gallery app).
Another way to do this would be for the gallery app to copy all photos to the gallery subfolder and ignore photos outside of this folder. And if you remove the app? Photos are gone (except what was at the original location). But, this just causes duplication issues.
Lastly, applications can be given permission to read/write to VERY specific ContentProviders and folders. So eventually, you'll have a shared folder called "Pictures" that any gallery application can modify as needed. However, this function is, again, for very specific usage and still prevents file managing apps from doing what they're intended to do.

jaykresge said:
There aren't. I've had KitKat since weeks after release (S4 GPe). I've been in touch with many developers and made them aware of the issue before it went mainstream. Bottom line, here's the limitation in the simplest of terms.
-An app can read any file on the MicroSD Card.
-An app can only modify contents within a self contained subfolder
So, file managers won't work if stock and unrooted (read only, no writing). FolderSync doesn't work. ES doesn't work (it will tell you that it created/deleted/modified the folder, but then when you refresh, the change never happened).
A good example of how this works would be with a bare bones gallery application. If you store your photos in a random folder within the SD card, the Gallery app can view them. However, if you try to delete a picture, it will only remove from the gallery and remain on the SD card. After a device reboot, it will reappear in the gallery (this also happens with Google Photos and the stock Gallery app).
Another way to do this would be for the gallery app to copy all photos to the gallery subfolder and ignore photos outside of this folder. And if you remove the app? Photos are gone (except what was at the original location). But, this just causes duplication issues.
Lastly, applications can be given permission to read/write to VERY specific ContentProviders and folders. So eventually, you'll have a shared folder called "Pictures" that any gallery application can modify as needed. However, this function is, again, for very specific usage and still prevents file managing apps from doing what they're intended to do.
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Click to collapse
Seems like the android team need to add some sort of "firewall" implementation, for apps users WANT their old ability back and still provide their users with this security for the majority of their other apps, it doesnt have to be all or nothing, .......make the most secured option as default, for basic users, while giving the power users the option to "fine tune" it, i.e. the "firewall" analogy

jaykresge said:
There aren't. I've had KitKat since weeks after release (S4 GPe). I've been in touch with many developers and made them aware of the issue before it went mainstream. Bottom line, here's the limitation in the simplest of terms.
-An app can read any file on the MicroSD Card.
-An app can only modify contents within a self contained subfolder
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just to be clear, if I write an app and want to write (not modify) to an external SD card I must write to the self contained folder.
Is that correct?

mangurian said:
I have read and I like the new restrictions on "external SD card" use. It will prevent a lot of apps from leaving crapola all over your device.
It does not restrict your use of data etc. It just keeps you organized. If you want to uninstall an app and still keep its data, you can simply move the data to a new folder.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't see how you think it doesn't restrict a user's data but keeps the card organised, when I have all my data (a LOT of work PDFs and docs, plus some photos), all nicely filed away and synchronised with my NAS, and other tablets; and now I cannot do this. I cannot organise my content at all (actually I am struggling even to put it on the SD card, except by taking it out out plugging it into a USB adapter into my PC). Until now, I have never had any apps leave crapola on my SD card. I used to be able to save lecture recordings direct to a nice "recordings" file on the SD card. Now it has to put it somewhere obscure (android/data/.somthingrandomthatisapaintofind).

It seems this works on some apps and not on others. For example foldersync doesn't seem to be able to write to the external sd card anymore, nor does X-plore, however, Es file Explorer seems to be fine about it, and happily writes files to the sdcard?! So if ES can do it, why can't the others?

jenacadabra said:
I don't see how you think it doesn't restrict a user's data but keeps the card organised, when I have all my data (a LOT of work PDFs and docs, plus some photos), all nicely filed away and synchronised with my NAS, and other tablets; and now I cannot do this. I cannot organise my content at all (actually I am struggling even to put it on the SD card, except by taking it out out plugging it into a USB adapter into my PC). Until now, I have never had any apps leave crapola on my SD card. I used to be able to save lecture recordings direct to a nice "recordings" file on the SD card. Now it has to put it somewhere obscure (android/data/.somthingrandomthatisapaintofind).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm on kitkat for over month now and I don't know what is big buzz about. I did not notice any different behavior from my external card. I can read and write whatever I want using pc explorer. Es works fine. Stock my files is fine too. So can somebody explain problem litte more please?
Type from KitKat bar.

norbarb said:
I'm on kitkat for over month now and I don't know what is big buzz about. I did not notice any different behavior from my external card. I can read and write whatever I want using pc explorer. Es works fine. Stock my files is fine too. So can somebody explain problem litte more please?
Type from KitKat bar.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see - you are just using the USB cable I assume. The functionality I have lost is to:
a) wirelessly synchronise multiple pdf/document files in multiple folders and multiple subfolders, whether edited on the Note or on PC (or both).
b) Used a file management app to organise files & folders on my home network between my PC and external SD card. It was even able to wirelessly copy my work direct from the NAS.
None of the apps I used stored any files on my SD card and because they have taken away my access to my SD card I cannot sync my files properly. I realise I could just plug the cable in, but that is not practicable when I am editing 100s of documents in 100s of different subfolders a day - an automatic sync is fantastic. Android is strongly geared towards the "leisure" side of the market and I am going to have to take another look at Windows tablets if they don't fix this (except I would miss the S Pen!)

The_mitch said:
It seems this works on some apps and not on others. For example foldersync doesn't seem to be able to write to the external sd card anymore, nor does X-plore, however, Es file Explorer seems to be fine about it, and happily writes files to the sdcard?! So if ES can do it, why can't the others?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What device are you using that can write to SD using ES? I have the Galaxy S4 GPe (i9505G) and ES cannot do anything with the SD Card.

Have you updated ES? I heard they upated to fix it.
As I understand there is something called storage access framework that is supposed to be the replacement for direct file access.
I haven't seen kitkat. FolderSync is my biggest concern.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk

jaykresge said:
What device are you using that can write to SD using ES? I have the Galaxy S4 GPe (i9505G) and ES cannot do anything with the SD Card.
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Click to collapse
I'm on a Samsung galaxy note 3, with kitkat 4.4.2 and ES file Explorer 3.1.1

Yes, thanks to a post somewhere on XDA I am now using ES file manager, which as you say, will work with the ExtSD on Kitkat (though I still prefer Astro myself).
I still can't sync my content though which is the bigger problem. I used to use SyncMe. A fantastically easy to set up App that would seamlessly sync content across multiple devices (still works fine on my Note 8). I can't find anything to replace this at present.
Sent from my GT-N5100 using xda app-developers app

The_mitch said:
I'm on a Samsung galaxy note 3, with kitkat 4.4.2 and ES file Explorer 3.1.1
Click to expand...
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What ROM are you using? Are you on stock 4.4.2 OTA without root?

jaykresge said:
What ROM are you using? Are you on stock 4.4.2 OTA without root?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, stock unrooted Samsung kitkat 4.2.2

The_mitch said:
Yes, stock unrooted Samsung kitkat 4.2.2
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Click to collapse
On my device, ES 3.1.1 allows me to create a folder but I cannot edit or delete the folder. I cannot create, edit, or delete files. If I delete folders, they will initially disappear, but will not actually delete. They reappear upon a refresh.

[Q] Question about the new Kitkat update for note 3

So im a samsung galaxy note 3 user i love the way my phone is i havent rooted yet cuz didnt feel the need to, but i recently got the update for kitkat that i havent pushed yet as i read that it is terrible, due to the fact it stops you from using your external sd card, now im trying to understand this as it very unclear, so my question is when it says that it doesnt allow third party apps to write on the external sd card, does that mean apps that are not from google play can not be saved on the sd card, or is it all apps third party and google play apps cant be saved on the sd card.
I just want to get a clear view of it so i can decide not to update to kitkat and just keep jellybean on it or update to it. For example i got tons of songs saved on my external sd card i generally use the stock music player, but if i say i download a music player from the google play store will i be able to access my songs off my external sd card if i upgrade to kitkat, also is getting apps off the google play store consider third party apps since its not stock or is third party apps consider apps from other site other then the google play store,
Thank you for assisting me in this just want to know whats, as i rarely dont download apps i just use my phone for business and personal like videos and music and making word docs,

This should be in the Q&A section
portebr3 said:
when it says that it doesnt allow third party apps to write on the external sd card, does that mean apps that are not from google play can not be saved on the sd card, or is it all apps third party and google play apps cant be saved on the sd card.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It means any apps that Samsung hasn't pre installed. That includes apps from Play Store.
portebr3 said:
For example i got tons of songs saved on my external sd card i generally use the stock music player, but if i say i download a music player from the google play store will i be able to access my songs off my external sd card
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You will need to duplicate the music into that apps folder or it won't be able to access the music
portebr3 said:
if i upgrade to kitkat, also is getting apps off the google play store consider third party apps since its not stock or is third party apps consider apps from other site other then the google play store
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They are also third party apps as I said above.
And yes, this is a major annoyance but it isn't Samsungs fault. Google changed how sd cards work in 4.4 and later Android versions.

The Kitkat SD Card restriction can be explain in simple like this :
Global Read, Restricted Write ( for 3rd party apss).
Meaning, you can use any apps (stock / 3rd party) to read anything on your SD Card, BUT you will need Stock App from Samsung or using Root for Global Write privilege or use 3rd party apps for Restricted Write (only in its own folder).
You can store Music from your PC via USB to your SD Card (Global Read & Write from USB), and then you can use any phone apps (stock/3rd party) to play (read) the music as it will be considered as only reading not writing.

Examples
nlatifolia said:
The Kitkat SD Card restriction can be explain in simple like this :
Global Read, Restricted Write ( for 3rd party apss).
Meaning, you can use any apps (stock / 3rd party) to read anything on your SD Card, BUT you will need Stock App from Samsung or using Root for Global Write privilege or use 3rd party apps for Restricted Write (only in its own folder).
You can store Music from your PC via USB to your SD Card (Global Read & Write from USB), and then you can use any phone apps (stock/3rd party) to play (read) the music as it will be considered as only reading not writing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello thank you guys for the assistance i know this could be a pain so just so that i am clear. If i install a third party app say a third party music player, how would i make a folder for that app to put my music on. Step by step examples would be helpful. I'm not sure if i install the third party app will it automatically create a folder on my SD card and ill have to access the folder thru my pc to add the music to it. Or after installing the app i would manually create a folder for the app on my sd card. thanks in advance im a noob trying to be somebody

portebr3 said:
Hello thank you guys for the assistance i know this could be a pain so just so that i am clear. If i install a third party app say a third party music player, how would i make a folder for that app to put my music on. Step by step examples would be helpful. I'm not sure if i install the third party app will it automatically create a folder on my SD card and ill have to access the folder thru my pc to add the music to it. Or after installing the app i would manually create a folder for the app on my sd card. thanks in advance im a noob trying to be somebody
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All u need to know is already answered in the last paragraph of my answer.

It means app developers need to update one tiny permission for it to work. Most are too lazy to do so, however. That'll change once the S5 is out, since it comes pre-loaded with 4.4.2.... They won't have a choice if they want to keep selling.
Also, N7Player works perfectly fine with music on the MicroSD. They fixed it almost immediately. Stock music player is, like most stock apps, rubbish.
In fact, most popular apps have been updated to write to SD in 4.4. I've not run into any issues since about a week after 4.4 came out.

ShadowLea said:
It means app developers need to update one tiny permission for it to work. Most are too lazy to do so, however. That'll change once the S5 is out, since it comes pre-loaded with 4.4.2.... They won't have a choice if they want to keep selling.
Also, N7Player works perfectly fine with music on the MicroSD. They fixed it almost immediately. Stock music player is, like most stock apps, rubbish.
In fact, most popular apps have been updated to write to SD in 4.4. I've not run into any issues since about a week after 4.4 came out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So Shadow are you having any problems with the new update on your note 3, i heard the stock camera is buggy.
Also i used to be able to download paid apps games like gta or need for speed on my phone well thunderbolt before i got the note 3. All i needed to do was put the file they supplied and put in the data folder or somewhere in the android folder i think it was obb folder, so my question is with the new kitkat update will i still be able to put free paid game apps on my note 3 or will the kitkat prevent me from doing so.

portebr3 said:
So Shadow are you having any problems with the new update on your note 3, i heard the stock camera is buggy.
Also i used to be able to download paid apps games like gta or need for speed on my phone well thunderbolt before i got the note 3. All i needed to do was put the file they supplied and put in the data folder or somewhere in the android folder i think it was obb folder, so my question is with the new kitkat update will i still be able to put free paid game apps on my note 3 or will the kitkat prevent me from doing so.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I only have about 12 paid apps from Google play (Out of 198) and the rest is from 'alternative sources' (we all know which ones.) Works fine, no issue. KitKat does nothing against it.
As for the stock camera, I've not noticed issues. I rarely use it (Prefer FV5), and when I do I set everything manually (I'm a photographer, so I can't stand pre-determined settings and filters). So whatever issues others have I probably bypass.

ShadowLea said:
I only have about 12 apps from Google play (Out of 198) and the rest is from 'alternative sources' (we all know which ones.) Works fine, no issue. KitKat does nothing against it.
As for the stock camera, I've not noticed issues. I rarely use it (Prefer FV5), and when I do I set everything manually (I'm a photographer, so I can't stand pre-determined settings and filters). So whatever issues others have I probably bypass.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok whoa 198 apps damn i never even reach 10 apps lol but thats amazing, so shadow what would u suggest u think i should take the update or not take the update, I dont think ill be rooting as i heard the knox app will alert my carrier Eastlink that i rooted and void my warranty but thinkin i about it for the future.

portebr3 said:
Ok whoa 198 apps damn i never even reach 10 apps lol but thats amazing, so shadow what would u suggest u think i should take the update or not take the update, I dont think ill be rooting as i heard the knox app will alert my carrier Eastlink that i rooted and void my warranty but thinkin i about it for the future.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rooting will trip the knox fuse permanently, this means you won't be able to get warranty, or use knox on your device forever. (a very long time), it won't "alert" your carrier by itself but they will check the counter in download mode and know if you need warranty.
I'm on Kitkat and don't see any issues, camera works perfectly and I use it very, very regularly so I'm sure.
Not sure about the SD Card stuff, I haven't encountered a situation where something didn't work on that department so idk.
It's Google's fault (the SD Card) btw.
I would recommend updating as always, but be aware that you can not downgrade.

I came across an article about the SD permissions setup in 4.4 and there is an app available on Play Store that will restore SD card functionality (need to be rooted of course):
https://play.google.com/store/apps/...d&utm_medium=WidgetWeb&utm_campaign=Playboard

zedman169 said:
I came across an article about the SD permissions setup in 4.4 and there is an app available on Play Store that will restore SD card functionality (need to be rooted of course):
https://play.google.com/store/apps/...d&utm_medium=WidgetWeb&utm_campaign=Playboard
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you have root you can even "fix" the sd permissions with a terminal emulator app; there's a thread somewhere here about it.

portebr3 said:
Ok whoa 198 apps damn i never even reach 10 apps lol but thats amazing, so shadow what would u suggest u think i should take the update or not take the update, I dont think ill be rooting as i heard the knox app will alert my carrier Eastlink that i rooted and void my warranty but thinkin i about it for the future.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
KNOX the app and KNOX the eFuse have nothing to do with eachother. (except that KNOX app won't work if you trip the fuse). It won't alert your carrier. It'll just set a flag in your device saying you tripped it, and they check that if you try to claim a warranty issue.
Most of the apps I use haven't got an issue with the SD anymore, with a few exceptions like the OfficeSuitePro and Kingsoft (annoying..). Since I keep my internal memory clear of personal data, all the apps are installed on the internal memory and don't require the MicroSD. I move any files it saved on the internal memory to the SD myself through ES File Explorer. Easier than rooting. (I own two MicroSD's 64GB, so I can swap them out when I need to. One is a secondary SD with purely films and tv shows and comics, in case I get stranded on public transport again).
In all honesty, I rather regretted updating. Mine worked flawlessly on 4.3, but I updated out of curiosity (And because 4.4 has RAW compatibility), and got a massive battery drain for killing the proverbial cat in return.
Consequential factory reset rendered my Helium backup MIA (Had to reinstall each app, back them up and manually replace the backup files with the old ones in windows, then restoring), which took about 12 hours.
Got the Mediaserver bug which I never had. More or less fixed it, but it wakelocked my phone from 100 to 0 in 5 hours flat last night again. Gone now, but it'll be back..
So you should really just ask: "Does mine work without issue on 4.3?" "Yes?" "Then stick with it."

Apps Still Have A Loophole For Writing To The SD Card.

The secret to modifying files on the SD card is in theMediaStore*class. It's a*Content Provider*with access to the database built by the Media Scanner. This is mostly useful to apps like the gallery and music players, but anything that wants to see locally stored images, audio, or video will probably use it.
We’re really interested in a child class calledMediaStore.Files. Its job is to give links (URIs) to apps so they can query the database for files on a specific storage device. Through this mechanism, developers can get a specially crafted link that can be used to open a file with write access.
It seems that this method works because the links actually call on the Media Store to open and edit files. Since the Media Store runs with system privileges, it is free to make changes on external storage devices. In essence, apps are able to masquerade as a system service for the purpose of writing to the SD card.
Total Commander*appears to be the first*to have discovered*and implemented this workaround. There are still a few known bugs and some devices, like the HTC One M8 with its /sdcard2 mount point, aren’t supported yet, but it’s almost completely working on the Note 3. While the code has been in Total Commander for quite some time, a*recently posted beta*cleaned up several bugs and makes it the best implementation we've seen.
Source: http://www.androidpolice.com/2014/0...ng-to-the-sd-card-on-kitkat-but-for-how-long/
Check out "Total Commander - file manager" - https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.ghisler.android.TotalCommander

I expect this will be too quickly fixed to get excited about.
What it needs is for Google to add a permission, even with loads of warnings and confirmations, to allow us to make our own choices - and allow the use of file managers and other apps that need access to the whole memory card.
I'm willing to take the risk Google!

But, this is Sony, so even if Mr. Google fixes it, it'll be sometime in 2015 before that appears on a Z1, if ever.
Sent from my SGP512 using Tapatalk

[Q] KitKat SD card simple questions...

Okay, looking at KitKat for both my Note 10.1 and my Note 2.
I want all the updates and potential performance benefits, the only thing I'm concerned about are the SD card permission changes. I've read through various threads but still can't quite get it settled in my head. I'm not rooted on either and know that is an option but, in the meantime...
I like having my sd cards organised as I want, managed via ES explorer, directories for music, books, videos, documents etc.
I use Moon reader for my books, Poweramp for my music, Beyondpod for my podcasts.
ES file explorer to copy files between card and dropbox etc.
I like to be able to open and edit text documents from a number of apps.
I sometimes copy ebooks from my dropbox to the books folder on either device. Same thing with music and text documents if I want a local copy.
My Note 10.1 is 16GB so I use the move to sd card option for lots of apps.
What am I going to lose...?
Thanks.

If you have Root, install this app and you should be able to write to your SD card
https://play.google.com/store/apps/...utm_source=42matters.com&utm_medium=WidgetWeb

kempas said:
Okay, looking at KitKat for both my Note 10.1 and my Note 2.
I want all the updates and potential performance benefits, the only thing I'm concerned about are the SD card permission changes. I've read through various threads but still can't quite get it settled in my head. I'm not rooted on either and know that is an option but, in the meantime...
I like having my sd cards organised as I want, managed via ES explorer, directories for music, books, videos, documents etc.
I use Moon reader for my books, Poweramp for my music, Beyondpod for my podcasts.
ES file explorer to copy files between card and dropbox etc.
I like to be able to open and edit text documents from a number of apps.
I sometimes copy ebooks from my dropbox to the books folder on either device. Same thing with music and text documents if I want a local copy.
My Note 10.1 is 16GB so I use the move to sd card option for lots of apps.
What am I going to lose...?
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ESFileExplorer for one. You'll have to use Samsung's My Files instead because it has universal permissions. You'll be able to open files stored by specific apps in other apps (EG: open a document created and stored on external SD by Hancom in Polaris) but you'll have to save it somewhere else because the second app won't have write permissions for a file/folder created by another app. Apps still have access to the external SD but now it's on a 1:1 basis. For example, if you have an SD folder called "Documents" that you centralized all your documents in (no matter where they were created) every app can see it and open files in it. But they can't save to it because they don't have write permissions. So Hancom can only save external SD files in a folder it created.
Google's always hated external SD and now they've made using it so cumbersome people won't want to. They say it's for security but if any app can open and read SD files and still copy or save them elsewhere what makes that more secure? Maybe I'm missing something.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

toyanucci said:
[YouTube Video Here]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great video tutorial for those who've rooted. There's really two external SD card conversations, one for those willing to root and another for those who can't or won't. Sadly, the latter group is stuck with discussing new ways to do things involving external storage that used to work on 4.3.

BarryH_GEG said:
Great video tutorial for those who've rooted. There's really two external SD card conversations, one for those willing to root and another for those who can't or won't. Sadly, the latter group is stuck with discussing new ways to do things involving external storage that used to work on 4.3.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think because of the SD Card issues I might be tempted to root although I will have to first see how it affects me whenever I do get 4.4.
Sent from Galaxy Note 10.1 2014 Edition via Tapatalk.

Geordie Affy said:
I think because of the SD Card issues I might be tempted to root although I will have to first see how it affects me whenever I do get 4.4.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You'll lose KNOX, screw up DRM-protected content to varying degrees, and give up access to Samsung Hub content and AllShare Cast. You can install Xposed which can trick some apps in to thinking a rooted device isn't but installing it and configuring it is a project unto itself. Not trying to sell you for or against but it's not as pain free as some folks make it out to be. Before SELinux enforcing and KNOX you could root, tweak, run TriangleAway, and unroot and you'd be as good as stock. Life's not that simple anymore. Also, If you resell your tablet it can also affect its resale value and not disclosing its altered status qualifies it for a return under eBay's buyer protection program should the buyer file a claim. I use KNOX so rooting's not an option for me.

All root breaks is Samsungs gimmicky crap no one uses anyway. There are better things out there that all work with root just fine.

GldRush98 said:
All root breaks is Samsungs gimmicky crap no one uses anyway. There are better things out there that all work with root just fine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Speak for yourself. Comments like yours leave neophytes with a false sense of security and then they post "why can't I _____ after rooting?" I'm not saying root is good, bad, or indifferent. But there are people that use that "gimmicky crap" and they should know before hand that they'll potentially lose it if they root. Even if you think the alternatives are better.

I have never used Samsung Hub nor Allsharcast and I dont intend on re-selling anyways and also never use knox.
I think I'm going to start researching how to root and the rest of the stuff and might do it regardless as I'm sick of certain restrictions (main reason I left apple years ago). But at the min don't have time to spend on researching so will have to wait. I purchased extra warrenty from the store I bought it from so woste ccase I will get them to fix it if after i trip knkx I need something fixed.
Sent from Galaxy Note 10.1 2014 Edition via Tapatalk.

Thanks all, may well have to root then. Although just got a Samsung dvr/bluray combo today and that allows remote connections via allsharecast so if that works as I hope them may have to stick on JB...
I assume app move to sd card is still possible?