Database Users

G1 Very Sluggish

Not that I'm asking for help about the sluggishness, it's just that the G1 is just overall way more sluggish than my friends iPhone 3G. As in web pages load WAY faster (Wifi on both devices being used). The UI is way more snappy.
And I understand the trade offs I'd get with an iPhone. No true multitasking or alerts from apps (like twitter email etc. . .) No Gmail push (I think) no Google Cal sync over the air, or contact sync OTA. All these things are great, but I dunno, I think I'm going to crossover into iPhone land soon. The G1 just became a let down for me after using it closely for about 6 months. And using other peoples iPhones on and off.
This is just a rant. And mostly I'm talking about browser load speeds and UI. It would be nice if Google maps oriented the direction we're facing since it has a compass. But the new update is moving in the right direction. Love the walking directions. But I think I'm gonna move on to 1 app at a time, Draconian app approval, HYPE land, release 5 HW revisions before making a new product, iPhone land.
Any Takers. Who can refute my arguments. I'm using Google Ion ROM also.

Heh, and the iPhone 3GS supposed to be even faster!

You're pretty much begging for a flame by asking that in here.
It's all down to personal choice and preference. Your thread isn't about your 'sluggish G1'; You're asking us to convince you why you need a G1.
Nobody cares that you no longer want a G1. But don't make a new thread masquerading as a plea for help that is really about:
Any Takers. Who can refute my arguments.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

i hope you enjoy your seemingly faster (much more expensive, much less useful) iphone.
my personal experience has been different, but you seem like the kind of person who wouldn't be convinced even with hard evidence.

Alright. Well. I don't benchmark or use "hard evidence" tests, I just go off the feel of things. Of course I know the iPhone is locking you into a Lot of things. But a jailbroken iPhone 3G / 3G S will be more fun app / mobile safari. And as far as a reason for keep the G1 I'm not looking for a reason. I've rooted the phone, used apps2sd 2 with an ext3 partition. Made sure data/data is in intmem etc. . . The Rom dev is great, but an iPhone is like having an SL500. Of course more gas, higher maintenance cost. G1 is like having a nice truck that's a hybrid. It just doesn't feel as sexy. It can do Way more, but its a truck.
I'm cool with hearing other reasons why the G1 isn't sluggish etc. I'll listen, but I was just posting this out of my frustration of a slower browser and slower UI. I don't really know what the flame talk was about or me covering up intentions. These are just phones. But I think a jailbroken iPhone 3G beats out a rooted G1. Plus I'm not trying to ssh into my linux server with debian installed over hero.
Anyway, its just a conversation I wanted to spark with people who understand what I'm talking about. Not to mention the apps are a big plus too. And don't get me wrong, the g1 is good for the things it was built to address. The iPhone will just be more fun.

do you have all the newest and update firmware and radio installed?
your title is misleading.
also, only way to find out which one is better......... go and get both and use both and decided from there

I'm pretty sure I have the newest firmware. Haykuro's that was causing bricks on non PVT boards. I was using JF 1.51 ADP. I moved to cyanogen mod of JF. I moved on to hero, then google Ion rom. Oh and the sapphire rom. Ion rom was fastest, but iPhone's overall fell and touch is simply night and day. So is the browser. Steel was great before cupcake but it closes so much now its not even useable.
Oh yeah, radio is up to date too, hence the non bricked phone. Nevermind no 3G here in our area. I just want to hear others opinions before I drop 300 / plus a deposit for bad credit / and charging me for txt msg! But I'll have more apps.

The g1 does seem to get sluggish over time. I would try a wipe. That should restore the speed of the phone.
However, there's no getting around the performance of the iphone as it supports 2d hardware acceleration. The g1 and android only does software rendering so its never going to be faster than the iphone until the google devs start supporting 2d hardware acceleration (g1 has a graphics chip so it should be possible).
I personally don't find the g1 very sluggish. Maybe its sluggish compared to the iphone (I don't know as I don't have one to compare with), but on its own, the g1's UI is quite snappy (i'm running cyanogen ROM).
larrygates said:
Not that I'm asking for help about the sluggishness, it's just that the G1 is just overall way more sluggish than my friends iPhone 3G. As in web pages load WAY faster (Wifi on both devices being used). The UI is way more snappy.
Do you have a lot widgets running or background tasks? All those take up memory and cpu cycles which will end up slowing down the phone a lot.
And I understand the trade offs I'd get with an iPhone. No true multitasking or alerts from apps (like twitter email etc. . .) No Gmail push (I think) no Google Cal sync over the air, or contact sync OTA. All these things are great, but I dunno, I think I'm going to crossover into iPhone land soon. The G1 just became a let down for me after using it closely for about 6 months. And using other peoples iPhones on and off.
This is just a rant. And mostly I'm talking about browser load speeds and UI. It would be nice if Google maps oriented the direction we're facing since it has a compass. But the new update is moving in the right direction. Love the walking directions. But I think I'm gonna move on to 1 app at a time, Draconian app approval, HYPE land, release 5 HW revisions before making a new product, iPhone land.
Any Takers. Who can refute my arguments. I'm using Google Ion ROM also.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Here's my take:
I love the iphone ! I think it's the best comsumer phone (and i'm not kidding). The 1 app at a time applies to G1 too (almost): try playing Mafia then going to the browser (or another game) and back... Good luck with that !
Now the reason i use the G1 is that i NEED to be connected to yahoo messenger, i NEED to have my tweets as soon as they come (i use twitter for work). And i NEED a hardware keyboard. And i NEED weather on a widget, and background downloading of RSS feeds (NewsRob). And i NEED better integration between apps (i'll explain).
When Push notifications come to the iphone, things are going to change. It will be very close to what i have now on my G1. The only things missing would be the RSS thing and the HW keyboard.
About the integration: I can click share on a picture, and it will list the programs that can do something with it (like Twidroid). I really like this, and there are more examples.
Now, what you have to ask yourself is: What do YOU need ? When you know that, you'll know what you have to choose.
Bah, long post. I hate long posts.

Do you find the G1 UI significantly more sluggish than the iphone?
RPG0 said:
Here's my take:
I love the iphone ! I think it's the best comsumer phone (and i'm not kidding). The 1 app at a time applies to G1 too (almost): try playing Mafia then going to the browser (or another game) and back... Good luck with that !
Now the reason i use the G1 is that i NEED to be connected to yahoo messenger, i NEED to have my tweets as soon as they come (i use twitter for work). And i NEED a hardware keyboard. And i NEED weather on a widget, and background downloading of RSS feeds (NewsRob). And i NEED better integration between apps (i'll explain).
When Push notifications come to the iphone, things are going to change. It will be very close to what i have now on my G1. The only things missing would be the RSS thing and the HW keyboard.
About the integration: I can click share on a picture, and it will list the programs that can do something with it (like Twidroid). I really like this, and there are more examples.
Now, what you have to ask yourself is: What do YOU need ? When you know that, you'll know what you have to choose.
Bah, long post. I hate long posts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

dwang said:
Do you find the G1 UI significantly more sluggish than the iphone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If i were to rate UIs of phones (based ONLY on smoothness) i would give the iphone an 9/10 and the G1 a 8/10.
The thing is... actually the difference mostly comes from the touchscreen sensitivity. There are two bad things about the G1 here:
SPOILER ALERT: After reading you might notice new bad things about your G1...
1. Try touching the screen with a small part of your finger (the very tip) and you'll see it won't register. This happens more in real life than you would think...
2. Try opening the notification bar SLOWLY and you'll see it shakes as you move your finger. If you stop mid-way it will shake most of the time... Actually any list will shake if you drag it and then stop... kinda cheap.
3. The sides of the screen in portrait have a "snap" zone. Try moving an icon to one side, and it will stop folowing your finger at a moment, then it will snap to the border. (On my phone this only happens on the right side. On the left side it's worse. I CAN'T register touch on the edge there. It's a nightmare to move an icon to a screen to the left.).
I knew HTC was bad news when i dug deeper into my Kaiser.
So.. G1 actually 7/10... Android on a good phone 8-8.5/10.

Yes this is exactly what I'm talking about. I'm not very in the know, but I do know how to follow directions and root phones. But YES the missing HW acceleration is felt when I go from iPhone to G1. It's unsettling. But . . .
dwang said:
The g1 does seem to get sluggish over time. I would try a wipe. That should restore the speed of the phone.
However, there's no getting around the performance of the iphone as it supports 2d hardware acceleration. The g1 and android only does software rendering so its never going to be faster than the iphone until the google devs start supporting 2d hardware acceleration (g1 has a graphics chip so it should be possible).
I personally don't find the g1 very sluggish. Maybe its sluggish compared to the iphone (I don't know as I don't have one to compare with), but on its own, the g1's UI is quite snappy (i'm running cyanogen ROM).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You gave pretty much all the reasons I waited for the G1 and went with it. I knew it acted more like a computer and actually integrated different api's into 1 whole (if you will). Or let the app devs get to the api's. But I like having my feeds come to me without thinking, I like twitter updates, I love gmail being like my old blackberry exchange solution. I WISH live maps or mesh or whatever it's called for Windows Mobile 6.1 would come to android. Someone asked about widgets etc. I disabled all widgets, actually I wiped to a clean Ion Rom that isn't running anything in the background but essentials. It's the HW accel I'm thinking, and the sensitivity of the touch screen. It's great on the iPHone. These were the replies I was looking for. Just something to chomp on before I make any moves. Cause I'm seriously thinking about making that move. I'll lose a lot though. But I'll gain a lot back.
Oh yeah, how come maps on the G1 doesn't auto orient like the iPhone does now. We have a compass, and the new maps is better, at least it shows the direction, but I have to rotate the phone though.
RPG0 said:
Here's my take:
I love the iphone ! I think it's the best comsumer phone (and i'm not kidding). The 1 app at a time applies to G1 too (almost): try playing Mafia then going to the browser (or another game) and back... Good luck with that !
Now the reason i use the G1 is that i NEED to be connected to yahoo messenger, i NEED to have my tweets as soon as they come (i use twitter for work). And i NEED a hardware keyboard. And i NEED weather on a widget, and background downloading of RSS feeds (NewsRob). And i NEED better integration between apps (i'll explain).
When Push notifications come to the iphone, things are going to change. It will be very close to what i have now on my G1. The only things missing would be the RSS thing and the HW keyboard.
About the integration: I can click share on a picture, and it will list the programs that can do something with it (like Twidroid). I really like this, and there are more examples.
Now, what you have to ask yourself is: What do YOU need ? When you know that, you'll know what you have to choose.
Bah, long post. I hate long posts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

The iphone 3gs does look pretty great, but I'm not switching from tmobile to att just for the iphone. There's going to be some nice android phones coming down the line, hopefully with upgraded cpu and memory to match the pre and 3gs. That should narrow the performance differences significantly. And hopefully android 2.0 (donut) finally implements 2d hardware acceleration.
larrygates said:
Yes this is exactly what I'm talking about. I'm not very in the know, but I do know how to follow directions and root phones. But YES the missing HW acceleration is felt when I go from iPhone to G1. It's unsettling. But . . .
You gave pretty much all the reasons I waited for the G1 and went with it. I knew it acted more like a computer and actually integrated different api's into 1 whole (if you will). Or let the app devs get to the api's. But I like having my feeds come to me without thinking, I like twitter updates, I love gmail being like my old blackberry exchange solution. I WISH live maps or mesh or whatever it's called for Windows Mobile 6.1 would come to android. Someone asked about widgets etc. I disabled all widgets, actually I wiped to a clean Ion Rom that isn't running anything in the background but essentials. It's the HW accel I'm thinking, and the sensitivity of the touch screen. It's great on the iPHone. These were the replies I was looking for. Just something to chomp on before I make any moves. Cause I'm seriously thinking about making that move. I'll lose a lot though. But I'll gain a lot back.
Oh yeah, how come maps on the G1 doesn't auto orient like the iPhone does now. We have a compass, and the new maps is better, at least it shows the direction, but I have to rotate the phone though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

See I'm worried about that. Why wouldn't android have he hw accel. I'm using an iPhone now to post this. Hw key is good, but this iPhone is very nice. I'll try to hold out and see. But I'll take it up the a!! Yeah I'm getting one. A 3G S.
dwang said:
The iphone 3gs does look pretty great, but I'm not switching from tmobile to att just for the iphone. There's going to be some nice android phones coming down the line, hopefully with upgraded cpu and memory to match the pre and 3gs. That should narrow the performance differences significantly. And hopefully android 2.0 (donut) finally implements 2d hardware acceleration.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

larrygates said:
See I'm worried about that. Why wouldn't android have he hw accel. I'm using an iPhone now to post this. Hw key is good, but this iPhone is very nice. I'll try to hold out and see. But I'll take it up the a!! Yeah I'm getting one. A 3G S.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well you laid out the talking points pretty well in your first post (and frankly aside from multitasking, iPhone OS 3.0 has fixed a lot deficiencies), so if you're set on an iPhone, just go for it.
Frankly, if having used a G1 for a while you are still considering an iPhone, then the iPhone is probably a better product for you. Reasons such as avoiding being locked into Apple's closed ecosystem probably weren't ever a factor for you at all.

Hey thanks for the civil post. The last thing you said is a hard one along with at&t. Apple is pretty slick with marketing, and they're hardware upgrades really screw you. Plus I think one of the guys here said something about dual core chips in phones next year.
About the Eco system hopefully jailbreaking side steps a lot of the walls on the phone. We'll see. I need to wait some things out and see how the dev team comes along. Someone said I should look into the pre, but I wonder if its similar to the G1.
jashsu said:
Well you laid out the talking points pretty well in your first post (and frankly aside from multitasking, iPhone OS 3.0 has fixed a lot deficiencies), so if you're set on an iPhone, just go for it.
Frankly, if having used a G1 for a while you are still considering an iPhone, then the iPhone is probably a better product for you. Reasons such as avoiding being locked into Apple's closed ecosystem probably weren't ever a factor for you at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Bah. This is only personal preference nonsense. Go get the iphone if ur tired of the g1.

larrygates said:
Hey thanks for the civil post.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just because i'm using and love the G1 doesn't mean the iPhone is a bad phone. I really don't have time to spend writing up a long convincing article why you should stay with the G1, let alone flame-coat it.
The last thing you said is a hard one along with at&t. Apple is pretty slick with marketing, and they're hardware upgrades really screw you. Plus I think one of the guys here said something about dual core chips in phones next year.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All hardware obsoletes, iPhone or otherwise. It's just a fact of tech life. If you constantly wait for the better hardware upgrade then you will never have any hardware at all.
About the Eco system hopefully jailbreaking side steps a lot of the walls on the phone. We'll see. I need to wait some things out and see how the dev team comes along. Someone said I should look into the pre, but I wonder if its similar to the G1.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Obviously the phone is better in some respects than others. But for example it will only sync with iTunes. I will never install iTunes or Quicktime ever again because they are poorly written pieces of spyware crap. Also, the cloud sync clearly prefers Mobile Me as the primary service. Remember when Mobile Me launched? It was a pile of cowpie. Even Apple admitted this.
The iPhone has a sleek interface and a powerful advertising machine behind it. That's why it and the iPod are such popular devices among consumers. However, being that I am an engineer by trade, I'm not so easily swayed by Apple's glitzy advertising. In that respect, iPhone's deficiencies, past and present come into stark contrast. For example, the inability to multitask userapps is just ridiculous. I actually want to receive my emails and instant messages in realtime, without having to open the Google App. Some people say "just use SMS", which opens up a whole new bag of rant about how SMS is the most ridiculous ripoff scheme ever...

One thing I want to mention regarding sluggishness is if u are running one of those third party home apps like dxtop or ahome, I would try uninstalling those and see if your sluggishness goes away. Also, badly written widgets can cause slowdowns as well. The g1 isn't as fast as the 3g but it really isn't that slow. Especially if u are running ion at 528mhz or cyanogens rom.

jashsu said:
Just because i'm using and love the G1 doesn't mean the iPhone is a bad phone. I really don't have time to spend writing up a long convincing article why you should stay with the G1, let alone flame-coat it.
All hardware obsoletes, iPhone or otherwise. It's just a fact of tech life. If you constantly wait for the better hardware upgrade then you will never have any hardware at all.
Obviously the phone is better in some respects than others. But for example it will only sync with iTunes. I will never install iTunes or Quicktime ever again because they are poorly written pieces of spyware crap. Also, the cloud sync clearly prefers Mobile Me as the primary service. Remember when Mobile Me launched? It was a pile of cowpie. Even Apple admitted this.
The iPhone has a sleek interface and a powerful advertising machine behind it. That's why it and the iPod are such popular devices among consumers. However, being that I am an engineer by trade, I'm not so easily swayed by Apple's glitzy advertising. In that respect, iPhone's deficiencies, past and present come into stark contrast. For example, the inability to multitask userapps is just ridiculous. I actually want to receive my emails and instant messages in realtime, without having to open the Google App. Some people say "just use SMS", which opens up a whole new bag of rant about how SMS is the most ridiculous ripoff scheme ever...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Out of curiosity, how is SMS the most ridiculous ripoff scheme ever?
Also, a friend of mine has a 3.0 beta developer firmware of the iPhone which allows multitasking. I myself found a cheap 4gb iPhone on Craigslist and am planning to unlock it for (most likely) a backup phone or business phone, when I've seen both phones and compared for about a week I'll post my findings here.
I was noticing the same sluggishness and such with the G1. You have to remember that, if you're like most users on the forum here, you -are- using an unsupported version of the phone, and it's not working how it's supposed to and how the provider intended for it to be used. Someone else mentioned this, but third-party apps also contribute to that. Depending on what you use, some apps could constantly be taking up extra memory and make your use of the G1 more of a chore, because of the time it takes to open up even a browser.
Anyway, to OP: You could just do what I did. Instead of spending $300 on a new iPhone that you have to dump out another extra $x-amount for new service at AT&Suck, why not just buy a used one on Craigslist or eBay and unlock it? Then you can use it with your current T-Mobile service and not have a lot of extra loss. You don't even need to get rid of your G1, just use one or the other as a backup or something.

what do google and android want out of this?

I know that when Android began development their focus was on apple and they wanted to compete with the iPhone. Which is a commmendable goal because the iphone ineluctably changed the mobile device world for the better. This makes me think Android has a lot they want to do with the stock ui and not just fixes to further stabilize the software but to give the UI a seeker look and add functionality.
On the other hand I've read here that Google just wants to make a stable UI available for companies like MOTO and HTC to skin and for developers to customize and improve.
Id like to think that Android has big plans for my new nexus one.
So do you guys think Google looks at HTC's sense and says " its all going according to plan, companies are taking our software and vastly improving it so we do the leg work and get our software on mass amounts of phones and manufacturers can customize it to their liking and their customer preferences" or do you think they say " wow HTC has really made phenomenal improvements on our software so we need to step up our game and make 2.2 and on more competitive"
I do understand its open source implying the intention for third party customization. but if android didnt want their own ui to be the preferred ui i don't think theyd even offer phones that way, i just hope android isnt stopping short on purpose to let developers put the finishing touches, thats a great option to have but id rather not be compelled to root.
I'm not saying android stock isn't very solid. Other than sense its the best ui available. I'm just trying to clarify whether android wants stable software by them at the heart of every mobile device and customized by those manufacturers or if they want android stock to be competitive in and of its self. Personally I'm hoping for the latter.
Your thoughts?

I don't know if their focus is so much of pushing people to make their own but more of focusing on the availability. They seem to want to always have the availability of customization and freedom. I think they see Sense UI as "Hey people actually love our work and are willing to spend days/months on working to make something of our product."
Unlike with Apple, they're like "WTF? You're not allowed to do this! No you can't see the specs of our phones you have to guess!!"

Unlike with Apple, they're like "WTF? You're not allowed to do this! No you can't see the specs of our phones you have to guess!!"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
touche.....

i can't see google having any problems with sense UI, any improvement is great. Anything that will make more people use android and use google's services, im sure they will be happy with. Somehow i don't think they are happy with the deals the other companies have made with bing and yahoo though.

DMaverick50 said:
but if android didnt want their own ui to be the preferred ui i don't think theyd even offer phones that way
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Click to collapse
You're completely missing the point about why Google wants Android.
They don't care if the stock UI isn't the best or most popular.
They don't care about Blur.
They don't care about Sense UI.
You're missing the big picture here.
Every time you search...
Every time you use maps...
Every time you use voice input, Google Goggles, Gesture Search, Listen, etc.
Every time, they're collecting that data, selling it, using it to improve their services even more and thereby making even more profit on their improvement in services..
Mobile ads within apps, and elsewhere within the UI...
Not to mention taking a cut out of sold apps.
Nothing is free, especially not data, and you can bet your ass Google is cashing in on it since that's what they do best.
Stop thinking about the UI, and start thinking behind-the-scenes. Look at the big picture.

O
Paul22000 said:
You're completely missing the point about why Google wants Android.
They don't care if the stock UI isn't the best or most popular.
They don't care about Blur.
They don't care about Sense UI.
You're missing the big picture here.
Every time you search...
Every time you use maps...
Every time you use voice input, Google Goggles, Gesture Search, Listen, etc.
Every time, they're collecting that data, selling it, using it to improve their services even more and thereby making even more profit on their improvement in services..
Mobile ads within apps, and elsewhere within the UI...
Not to mention taking a cut out of sold apps.
Nothing is free, especially not data, and you can bet your ass Google is cashing in on it since that's what they do best.
Stop thinking about the UI, and start thinking behind-the-scenes. Look at the big picture.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I definitely understand what you're saying, that they want their software on as many devices as possible. That was actually the first of the two possibilities I offered. Officially google initially indicated they wanted to compete with apple (the second possibility I offered) and as a nexus owner I hoped for the second but it makes a lot more business sense to make their software/applications ubiquitous. And at the end of the day, google has a bottom line to worry about. So I guess in the end the manufacturers using android but customizing it probably offers a more thoughtful interface (though many, many prefer stock) but having stock android is more likely to receive updates fastest while some customized skins may not receive them period. Seems like a win-win for consumers regardless of android and Google's strategy.

I never saw Android as a competition to iPhone. There are huge differences between them. To start with, iPhone is a hardware and Android is an OS.
Android is not just targetted towards phone.. but also a more lucrative platform buisness. Android is targeted towards Windows and Linux and not iPhone.
Windows CE and Linux are pretty much the only choice for platforms. Many GPS units, car control systems, Controllers for many equipment etc.. are all Windows CE or custom linux. Android is targeting this market share. Therefore it is not surprising that Android has similiar policies like Win CE and linux to keep the core seperate from UI. Customers can choose their UI to adapt their implimentation. e.g. many of us don't even relaize that our car GPS has windows in it or our routers has linux in it.
Of course there are other advantages of controling a platform. They have been nicely sumarized by paul.

Buying a Nexus One...help needed

I'm from India and nexus one isn't officially launched. I know that if I buy the unlocked version, I'll be able to use it here in my country. I just wanted to know what features of this phone would be blocked in my country (i don't think any). Will I be able to use the GPS? iPhone worked flawlessly but I'm not a big fan of apple. I just don't like it. I really wanted an N1, because of android OS (custom roms) and the hardware its offering. If there is anything more you guys want me to know about the phone, please enlighten me

Its better than the iphone... thats all you need to know

Its a great phone buy one

Hopefully this attempt is mature and coherent:
PROS-
Multitasking
Maps and free gps navigation are accurate and awesome
Having a desktop is great for widgets and other customizations
Camera has adequate megapixels
5 screens is convenient
Google's apps are useful
Some multitouch capability
Live wallpapers are very cool
UI screen transitions are swell
Having access to Google apps can be really convenient
Amoled display is beautiful indoors and at night
If you want to root the phone the possibilities are abundant
CONS-
The stock and third party keyboards are terrible, HTC keyboard is less awful
The touchscreen is jittery
The amoled display is invisible in sunlight
Cameras pictures aren't what they should be considering the hardware
Most third party apps are useless
Randomly reboots
Sending mms is unreliable
Utilizes half of the ram it is capable of using
Browser is, for lack of room to elaborate, "finicky" (dont expect it to resemble a pc's browser)
I have 3g and full bars where I live but I lose all signal in most buildings (probably tmobiles fault)
In general I prefer Google to Apple. The Nexus is one of the better phones out there, I initially thought it was the best for the first couple of weeks, I haven't rooted and new software problems present themselves routinely. Since so many of the issues appear to be software related, If Google becomes motivated to address the multitude of those issues they could make this phone hands down the best mobile device for a pretty long while.

uhh... Cool story bro?
Anyway, everything should work in india, except google voice and maps navigation, except you can get a working(albeit limited) version from this very website. Check with your service provider for their frequencies. The original n1 is 900/2100, and a new one is out that supports 850. So find that out before you buy.
You will not be disappointed by this device.

DMaverick50 said:
I'm a huge fan of android but the iPhone is better than the nexus and better than android so far, which is really pathetic because the nexus has better specs and Google had ample time to see what works best about the iPhone but they chose not to learn from the most successful mobile OS on the planet. I've really been holding out hope that android would get their **** together. the g1 and mytouch were fun and cute little phones but the nexus purported to be a 'superphone' it has super potential but id definitely rather have an iPhone 3gs. I can't even see the damn screen on full brightness when the suns out. Android is better for geeks, and that's cool but its not for me, I want a phone that is backed by its maker. I don't have time or interest in fixing my own phone or having 3 different browser apps to collectively do what safari does. Every day I find a new bug in the android software. My confidence in android takes a hit daily.Today's android failure I found in a gizmodo article about thickbuttons or whatever its called keyboard, the article indicated that the iPhone already uses that technology. Only it does it better because androids crappy third party app moves the buttons over it doesn't simply enlarge them, so the letter isn't where you expect it to be. I tried it and thought wow finally some innovation for android. But buttons move and it isn't useful, plus its already on the iPhone in a useful implementation. Im so tired of having to rely on ****ty third party apps to do what my phone should out of the box. I've stopped looking at 'just in' apps, 99.5% of them are useless. I'm tired of waiting for google to update android to utilize this expensive hardware. I've got a year until my contracts up, if android hasn't got their **** together by then I'm moving my family to the iPhone. I'm sorry to many of you who read this, I really do like android, but I've been with android since the g1 and its just not good enough.
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Click to collapse
I might have taken this post seriously if you didn't ramble and write like a 13 year old who just got his first phone.
Anyhow OP, I can't really see any features that you'll miss out on. I'm from the UK and apart from Google talk (US only), everything else works fine.

DMaverick50 said:
I'm a huge fan of android but the iPhone is better than the nexus and better than android so far, which is really pathetic because the nexus has better specs and Google had ample time to see what works best about the iPhone but they chose not to learn from the most successful mobile OS on the planet. I've really been holding out hope that android would get their **** together. the g1 and mytouch were fun and cute little phones but the nexus purported to be a 'superphone' it has super potential but id definitely rather have an iPhone 3gs. I can't even see the damn screen on full brightness when the suns out. Android is better for geeks, and that's cool but its not for me, I want a phone that is backed by its maker. I don't have time or interest in fixing my own phone or having 3 different browser apps to collectively do what safari does. Every day I find a new bug in the android software. My confidence in android takes a hit daily.Today's android failure I found in a gizmodo article about thickbuttons or whatever its called keyboard, the article indicated that the iPhone already uses that technology. Only it does it better because androids crappy third party app moves the buttons over it doesn't simply enlarge them, so the letter isn't where you expect it to be. I tried it and thought wow finally some innovation for android. But buttons move and it isn't useful, plus its already on the iPhone in a useful implementation. Im so tired of having to rely on ****ty third party apps to do what my phone should out of the box. I've stopped looking at 'just in' apps, 99.5% of them are useless. I'm tired of waiting for google to update android to utilize this expensive hardware. I've got a year until my contracts up, if android hasn't got their **** together by then I'm moving my family to the iPhone. I'm sorry to many of you who read this, I really do like android, but I've been with android since the g1 and its just not good enough.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FFS learn to use paragraphs, Jesus Christ.
All I read was "I'm sorry to many of you who read this" -- yes, because of the eye strain
Maverick: You should really just make a thread outlining the OBJECTIVE flaws you see with the N1. You always complain, but it's never based on fact.

liam.lah said:
uhh... Cool story bro?
Anyway, everything should work in india, except google voice and maps navigation, except you can get a working(albeit limited) version from this very website. Check with your service provider for their frequencies. The original n1 is 900/2100, and a new one is out that supports 850. So find that out before you buy.
You will not be disappointed by this device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know google voice won't be available but why would map navigation not work here? It works on all other phones.
Most of the 2g networks function at 900/1800 MHz and 3g at 2100 MHz. So I guess, tmo version would work fine but I can get AT&T one to get the additional 850

I ask you your opinion (Android vs iOS)

I currently have two tablet: ASUS Transformer and new iPad. I am writing an article on the Android vs iOS (only the operating system).
I would like to hear users' opinions about why you chose Android, or do you own both? What is good or bad is in Android/iOS. What Apple/Google is doing better than Apple/Google. If your answer is, Apple is crap, do not bother to comment.

Andoid: Open source
iOS: closed source with limited functionality.
Enough said.

People hold strong opinions so watch out because this article will flame like hell. I will say that Apple is crap, but I will explain why I say this. Given the freedom of Android, I'd choose nothing else. Given the advanced level of control over your device, I'd choose nothing else. Given the open source availability of our beloved OS, I'd choose nothing else. Given the diverse choice of apps on the Play Store and the larger amount of free apps, I'd choose nothing else. Aside from that sort of stuff, Apple's BS just plain ticks me off. How these a-holes can actually try to monopolize the technology industry and file all of these lawsuits against their competitors (not to mention the fact that they are being goddamned hipsters and trying to claim that they invented the slide-to-unlock and face unlock features... I'm truly surprised they haven't dug up the inventor of the wheel and tried to sue him). Samsung, Google, and all of their competitors are forking out an arm and a leg to lawyers. Sorry if I seem like I'm pissy, I just don't like the fact that Apple is trying to ruin Android, when it's so beautiful.
This is my Tapatalk 2 signature. Rockin' the app on my Nook Color running ICS 4.0.4, courtesy of Dalingrin, Fattire, and our other beloved XDA weenies (nemith, keyodi, arcee, hacdan, etc.)

Hi!!,
I currently have iPad 1stGen and TF101
I just decide to change to Android becouse of many mods and tweaks i can do (open source), it's very funny for me, and with patience and read, you can play withot kill your data.
I have to say that iOS (Without jailbreak) is boring for me. But iOS have a year of advantage versus android, in terms of quality and performance hardware-software, and they sell more devices, and more, and more, so they have more customers, more potential buyers and much more money to spend.
Both are similar, a store... a developer community... the fact is that in a future, I think one cannot survive without the other. And android is growing too!.
rjarl

Goatshocker said:
Andoid: Open source
iOS: closed source with limited functionality.
Enough said.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure if that's a benefit to the end user.
Some would argue that android is buggy and has low quality apps because it's so "open", while apples tight reign over the iOS ecosystem ensures a reliable, consistent and high-quality experience for the user.
Honestly, the "average person" doesn't give a damn about open or closed source. They just want something that works with minimal fuss, and that's why Apple can sell more iPads in a week than all Android manufacturers can in a quarter.
I love android because it can do everything I need it to do. My wife loves iOS because it allows her to do everything she wants it to do. The difference is that I'm always maintaining my Android devices, that is, I'm always monitoring the battery or checking for excess wake locks or apps that don't play nice, which she doesn't have to worry about those things at all.

Both are around to suits difference preference in term of functionality, design and fashioned for end users like us..
Some really like to customised, root, flashing and all those freedom you would get in Android world but some doesn't bother and use what the gadget has to offer officially and some just follow others or the latest technology without knowing what best..
I have a friend who just follow and get what others have. Everybody in the office bought iPad and so does she but all she knows and do is playing the build-in facebook mini games.. Jailbreaking an iPad/iPhone wouldn't be as good as rooting an Android devices ..
I choose Android both phone and tablet for the easy customise(root, CWM and custom roms) and the ability to connect to PC as removable drive without needing another program to run..
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using XDA Premium HD app

I love my android tablet. The flexibility is key for me. Maybe the average user doesn't care about open source, but the average user could care about things like, widgets, different keyboards, customization of the homescreens. For me I like, and pick my android products based on the development community around it. I had a G-tablet first, now an asus slider. And I own an HTC incredible, running ICS, something it was never thought it would be able to do, and its all because there is a great community around it.

farsight73 said:
.... the ability to connect to PC as removable drive without needing another program to run..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 to that, one of his greats features!!!! just like a removable disk

Need to ask question in other venues. Asking here is like asking if you should buy a chevy truck on a ford truck forum.

I use both. The IOS platform is largely an application launcher. As such it has some limitations on it's functionality. This is by design to make it easy for new users to learn and use, and most of all remember. The ISO interface is very clean and simple and was built by some amazing designers. Given the numbers of IOS users it is obvious this strategy of clean design and simplicity has worked.
Android looks very much like what I see in a lot of application designed by developers. It has a lot of developer centric features such as extensive settings and customizations. The UI has some behaviors that must be learned and remembered to operate effectively. One example is press and hold to get to additional functionality.
Because it was developed by developer instead of UI designers, Android is more feature rich. It makes extensive use of multi-tasking and multi-threading. Also, Intents makes functionality sharing and extensions to the UI such as different keyboards very easy. But, this also increases the complexity
At the end of the day neither system is right or wrong. They are just right for different sets of users.
- IOS is easy to learn and remember. Everything works by apps and you can press one button to get back to familiarity of home. This restricts the options you have in apps which is perfect for a more casual user.
- Android allows for complex UIs which can let users interact with apps in complex manners. This can result in a very powerful app, or a complex mess. But, this is the type of apps and Android is the type of OS that power users want.
Jerry

The question Android vs iOS is same Linux vs Windows...
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using xda premium

I've owned both iOS and Android devices. I'm currently using an iPad2 64GB 3G. Android has the potential to be a great tablet OS, but as it stands currently it's just too much of a mess IMHO. In order of importance (too me) I feel that display, followed by OS stability, functionality, developer support, and customization are the deciding factors in choosing a device. The custom ROMS within the Android camp are nice (I primarily used the Revolver ones), however all the goodness that ICS was suppose to bring about fizzled. Perhaps the communities expectations were high. The TF201 (which i tried and returned) was rushed to market for bragging rights (Quad Core and Ice Cream), while overlooking so many design flaws (MicroSD Slot, WiFi performance, GPS, colour saturation, and most importantly OS Stability). In addition ASUS position on locking the unit down means that those wishing to try a Developers ROM are forced to void their warranty. So what do I miss now in iOS? Well widgets are the biggest thing. Those and live wallpapers tho I'd bet chew into one's battery.
One thing that nagged at me was the disparity of data plans. I use an older Palm Pixi Plus (cell phone). On that I pay $10 for 100MB. When I was living with the TF101 I could tether it to the Palm (but it was slow), so I looked into the portable hotspot solutions. The problem I saw was the huge price differences (data regardless of the device accessing it should be priced the same IMO) 5GB on a Flex Plan costs $70, whereas 5GB on the iPad costs $35.
Prior to the iPad I've never owned a single Apple device and a despised iTunes for all it's bloatware and autostart services, I've ran Windows (since 3.11 ) and Ubuntu (since Hardy) on my systems.
There are alot of biases between these 2 camps, frankly I just want a device that works as advertised, doesn't crash and force me to reboot or cold start. The first time any of us pick up a device to complete a task while wondering if the device will work as we hope, is the time we should be asking ourselves is that device honestly meeting our needs

It should be noted that while we have the option of customizing Android to our hearts content, customizing can lead to a drop in stability and poor battery life. Custom ROMS can often break basic functions of the OS and make apps incompatible or just plain unstable.
What Apple users miss from android, they gain in device stability, app compatibility, amazing battery life, consistent app experience and a simple "pickup and go" experience. This is what most people are looking for. Even the average android user won't take advantage of widgets, custom keyboards, custom ROMS and kernels , etc. That stuff is often reserved for the power users who like to tweak and control everything on their device... And power users make up a small percent of the total user base.

worldindo1 said:
People hold strong opinions so watch out because this article will flame like hell. I will say that Apple is crap, but I will explain why I say this. Given the freedom of Android, I'd choose nothing else.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What kind of freedom are you talking about? I can't even root this thing, so it might as well be IPad in my hands right now..
I haven't used any apple device and probably won't. Because of the price. That's what makes difference between Apple and Android devices before I even have got any

EP2008 said:
It should be noted that while we have the option of customizing Android to our hearts content, customizing can lead to a drop in stability and poor battery life. Custom ROMS can often break basic functions of the OS and make apps incompatible or just plain unstable.
What Apple users miss from android, they gain in device stability, app compatibility, amazing battery life, consistent app experience and a simple "pickup and go" experience. This is what most people are looking for. Even the average android user won't take advantage of widgets, custom keyboards, custom ROMS and kernels , etc. That stuff is often reserved for the power users who like to tweak and control everything on their device... And power users make up a small percent of the total user base.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed the vast majority of users have no interest is hacking their device. They want it to simply work!
Further someone mentioned that price is a factor. Yes however now that we've seen a price drop on the iPad2 it's a moot point

hairpower said:
What kind of freedom are you talking about? I can't even root this thing, so it might as well be IPad in my hands right now..
I haven't used any apple device and probably won't. Because of the price. That's what makes difference between Apple and Android devices before I even have got any
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To answer your question simply. Without jailbreaking an ios device you cannot:
1ownload roms or any emulators, this includes all SNES,n64,psx etc etc
2:You cannot run freeware music software like grooveshark ( my favorite), it was banned from appstore, and now only resides in cydia (jailbreak + montly fee is required)
3:You cannot download torrents. Jailbreak is required, even then it is a not a good experience.
4: you cannot transfer files directly to folders, an SHSH connection is required, which requires jailbreak.
All these things you can do without rooting, so you are not holding an ipad device my friend, you would have notice it.
The best thing about android is that developers can make their own apps and spread them for free to the community, that experience can be obtained with iOS and cydia, but It can cause some real problems in your phone, and decrease its battery time.
When you use cydia apps, sometimes you will notice very unstable behavior from your idevice, like winterboard or dreamboarder, which caused my phone to brick itself.
in more simple words, To get an android experience on an apple device, you will make the iOS more unstable than applefanboys claim android to be.

EP2008 said:
Not sure if that's a benefit to the end user.
Some would argue that android is buggy and has low quality apps because it's so "open", while apples tight reign over the iOS ecosystem ensures a reliable, consistent and high-quality experience for the user.
Honestly, the "average person" doesn't give a damn about open or closed source. They just want something that works with minimal fuss, and that's why Apple can sell more iPads in a week than all Android manufacturers can in a quarter.
I love android because it can do everything I need it to do. My wife loves iOS because it allows her to do everything she wants it to do. The difference is that I'm always maintaining my Android devices, that is, I'm always monitoring the battery or checking for excess wake locks or apps that don't play nice, which she doesn't have to worry about those things at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I completely agree, ios is for the simpler person, who do not care about reaching the full potential of their device, they just want it to work.
Sent from my HTC_A510c using xda premium

worldindo1 said:
People hold strong opinions so watch out because this article will flame like hell. I will say that Apple is crap, but I will explain why I say this. Given the freedom of Android, I'd choose nothing else. Given the advanced level of control over your device, I'd choose nothing else. Given the open source availability of our beloved OS, I'd choose nothing else. Given the diverse choice of apps on the Play Store and the larger amount of free apps, I'd choose nothing else. Aside from that sort of stuff, Apple's BS just plain ticks me off. How these a-holes can actually try to monopolize the technology industry and file all of these lawsuits against their competitors (not to mention the fact that they are being goddamned hipsters and trying to claim that they invented the slide-to-unlock and face unlock features... I'm truly surprised they haven't dug up the inventor of the wheel and tried to sue him). Samsung, Google, and all of their competitors are forking out an arm and a leg to lawyers. Sorry if I seem like I'm pissy, I just don't like the fact that Apple is trying to ruin Android, when it's so beautiful.
This is my Tapatalk 2 signature. Rockin' the app on my Nook Color running ICS 4.0.4, courtesy of Dalingrin, Fattire, and our other beloved XDA weenies (nemith, keyodi, arcee, hacdan, etc.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
totally agree on all points!!!
---------- Post added at 01:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:36 PM ----------
from what i gather, iOS is simple whereas android is sophisticated!!!

A year ago I bought an iPad to replace my laptop. I did this because I used my android phone more then my laptop to place things on internet. For example on auction sites.
It wasn't what I expected. iOS is too secure. Something simple like searching a foto in your filesystem and upload it isn't possible. Even when iOS is jailbroken!
Now I have an android tablet, which can replace my laptop completely.
An iPad is nice for internet or reading your mail. Or for an electronics noob.

I can understand if people like iOS more for its stability, but for the generation that's under 35, how can anyone be too stupid to use Android? It's honestly not more complicated (I got my first tablet, TF101, last year in the summer, then my first smartphone about a month ago, SGi777) and you can do so much more. I've used my girlfriend's iPhone a lot (waiting at the bus stop, hanging around her place without anything to do.. etc.) and it's really hard to believe that anyone would want an iOS product for its "simplicity" because I'd say that it took me maybe two hours to understand how to manipulate Android as much as you can manipulate iOS (and of course, I learn more ways to manipulate Android as time goes on because it has so many possibilities that open up as you root and gain more control..).
Now, I'm a physics major, and I work with some computer programming languages, but none of which would really help for my learning experience with Android. I play games, but not much since early high school, so that wasn't it either. I use my computer, but not really for anything that requires super knowledge about computers. I've used iOS on a computer before, I've used Windows on a computer before, and I've used Ubuntu (really awesome, except it doesn't play certain Windows games which made me not completely switch over).
I guess the real difference between the two is the perception held by the masses. Yeah, Android is also cheaper (kind of, I mean, the good phones cost as much as iPhones but go on sale sometimes) so that kind of fuels the perception in lots of places. I know that in China, many of the wealthier folks like to buy things that are superfluously expensive for the reason that they are more expensive (my postdoc mentor being an example), and that's probably one thing that keeps this "iOS is the elite, Android is the poor man's choice" kind of thing going.
Sorry for the rant.
tl;dr: Android is as simple as iOS if you want to do only what iOS can do, but Android gives the user the potential to go farther. The main difference is the perception in the eyes of the masses, and that perception is tied to marketing and prices.

Switching To Windows 8 Phone

Hello... hope this finds everyone well.
I am a long time android user and keep getting the urge to jump into the windows phone arena. I was just curious from those who have done the switch what you found good and bad about the experience. Just looking for justifications from either spectrum really before doing so I appreciate all of your time and look forward to hearing your experiences.
Thanks!!

Tancreddo said:
Hello... hope this finds everyone well.
I am a long time android user and keep getting the urge to jump into the windows phone arena. I was just curious from those who have done the switch what you found good and bad about the experience. Just looking for justifications from either spectrum really before doing so I appreciate all of your time and look forward to hearing your experiences.
Thanks!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, it's nice to see you're willing to make the switch.
Honestly, there are some things from Android that you're going to miss here, but there's also a bunch of new exciting stuff on WP, so in the end it all depends on your ability to adopt something new and different.
Although I don't use an Android phone as a daily device (because that place is taken by my Lumia 820), I have one for various mods and stuff, and I just find WP a better option for me (but obviously both have their advantages and disadvantages). The difference in performance and optimization is most visible on low-end hardware - WP excels there, Android not so much. There's also a difference in terms of features and customizability - all those nifty things you could change/modify/replace in Android are mostly not in WP. The hardware of WP mostly caught up to Android, so there shouldn't be any deal breakers there. The store is growing daily and now includes most "major" apps, but it really depends on you whether you'll be able to find your apps or not.
But before you decide and make opinions about WP, I urge you to wait for the 8.1 update - it brings a lot of new stuff and further refines the user experience, so it'd be wise to make judgment based on that. If you can, I suggest you get a cheap WP to have the first taste of the platform, and then decide if you want to upgrade or go back to Android.
In any case, make a decision based on your own opinion and experiences, it'll surely be the right decision for you.

I switched from my Nexus 4 to my Lumia 520 a few months ago.. one thing I noticed is the speed difference. Even though the 520 only has 512 mb of RAM, it feels more fluid than my Nexus 4.

I actually just made the switch.
From a Nexus 4 to a Lumia 925
Its been about a week, so far not regretting it at all. I managed to find all but i think 3 apps or so that i used on android in the WP store. One thing you will notice, some apps dont have all the functionality as they do on android.
What i do notice about WP is that everything is much more fluid. Tasks are easier and quicker to do. Also, in a lot of cases some of the apps on WP are generally nicer than you'll find elsewhere. I am really glad i made the switch. My main reason for switching was because i was just bored with my Nexus, wanted something different.
The only thing that its really missing at the moment is a google music app, i noticed like the day i got my WP, google changed the api or something in google music with borked all the gmusic apps on the windows store. But in everyday use, i dont miss it much. I just use pandora.
Give it a try, people hate on the apps and selection (i did too at one point) but WP has a great selection and some of the apps are absolutely beautiful.

Many people have a go at WP without ever trying it so well done to the OP for this thread.
I have had 10 Android phones and 4 tablets in the past 4 or so years. I think Android is a fantastic OS, easily the most powerful, feature rich and customisable available. In January I was contemplating swapping my N4 for a N5. However looking around at the fact that Android is so popular now I thought about trying WP8. So I got a brand new Ativ S for £140. The plan was to run two phones for a bit. The thing was I never looked at my N4. I know the lack some Google services is a problem but I have music, email & calendar one way or another so I can still interact with my Android family members.
The biggest let down in WP8 is the browser. IE is …. erm not very good. It needs text reflow (but so does Chrome) as a start but in reality MS need to open the platform to allow other browsers to run their own engines.
My advice is to see how tied in you are to Google and Android apps and see if any are missing on WP8. If the missing ones are vital to you then maybe WP8 isn’t for you.
I am now waiting for the new set hardware coming later in the year. I will then decide whether to get a new WP device or go back to android.

finbaar said:
The biggest let down in WP8 is the browser. IE is …. erm not very good. It needs text reflow (but so does Chrome) as a start but in reality MS need to open the platform to allow other browsers to run their own engines.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Luckily, IE is getting several improvements in 8.1, so it'll be a more viable option for people. The thing that's missing the most IMO is password management. Every decent browser should have it...
finbaar said:
My advice is to see how tied in you are to Google and Android apps and see if any are missing on WP8. If the missing ones are vital to you then maybe WP8 isn’t for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, if you're heavily tied into Google's ecosystem, you may need to reconsider your choice. Not that support for Google's products and services totally sucks, but it's quite lacking compared to what it could be (mostly Google's fault). But the good thing is, if you manage to make the switch to Microsoft's services, they've got you covered.

Me too.. my final android phone was the Xperia z (for a few days).. i just got bored of Android, wanted something different... i may get the LG G Pro 2 when it comes to the Market as a second phone, but my Nokia 1520 is not going anywhere in the near Future.

Super_Sport said:
Me too.. my final android phone was the Xperia z (for a few days).. i just got bored of Android, wanted something different... i may get the LG G Pro 2 when it comes to the Market as a second phone, but my Nokia 1520 is not going anywhere in the near Future.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am considering a WP however the applications ... Will I be able to install free programs like we do on Android? I can download games and chunky programs from android app sites, and don't burn my precious internet credit.

agispapatias said:
I am considering a WP however the applications ... Will I be able to install free programs like we do on Android? I can download games and chunky programs from android app sites, and don't burn my precious internet credit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Depends on how you define "free". There's free and trial versions of apps available on WP as well. There's only one store for WP, but you don't really need 10 app stores just to get your apps, do you? But if you're talking about piracy, you're out of luck.

DaviUnic said:
Depends on how you define "free". There's free and trial versions of apps available on WP as well. There's only one store for WP, but you don't really need 10 app stores just to get your apps, do you? But if you're talking about piracy, you're out of luck.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I mean is the system accessible like android? In android I can download and install apps from other sources like app sites.
Do WP has a similar system?

As I said, no, and doesn't really need one because quality apps are found in the store. The only other source of apps are homemade apps, but you need dev unlock for that.

DaviUnic said:
you need dev unlock for that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It`s free. And @reker says you`re free to install 10 apps now (was 2 for free unlock).