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I was wondering how would you compare the reading experience on your HD2 vs Kindle/Sony/whatever E-INK Reader.
What do you use more for reading and why ?
If you already have a HD2, would you also buy an ereader on top of it or is the HD2 good enough to read books daily ?
I've got a Nook and use it daily for a few reasons
and there the same reasons people own and e-reader in addition to a laptop.
The e-ink screen is much better for reading than an LCD. I like to go outside on my lunch break and read. In full sun the e-ink screen is actually better than paper in my opinion, and worlds better than my HD2.
The screen size. The HD2 screen is huge for a phone, but it still a little small for a book. I do have both the Kindle and Nook apps on my phone, but rarely use them. You really don't get much text on the screen at a time, and it feels like you are constantly flipping pages. The size of the Nook feels "right" to me. I know that's subjective, but that's how I'd describe it.
battery life. I'm running an Android build and I love it, but I barely make it through a workday on a charge. My Nook lasts at least a week on a charge. I usually plug it in on Friday evening when I go to bed, unplug it in the morning and it's good for another week. that's with about an hours worth of use each day, a few minutes with the wifi on.
I've got the wifi only version of the Nook, and owning the HD2 played a part in that choice too. with the newer Android builds, the built in wifi hotspot works, so if I want to browse the B&N store on the Nook I can do it through my own hotspot.
I hope that helps
Ebook reader 1 Smartphone Nil !
I'm interested then, why did you pick the HD2 as your smartphone ?
I think you are comparing chalk and cheese, (apples and oranges if you will). eBook readers are designed for a single purpose hence they are larger and are optimized for displaying text. Smartphones are, effectively, phones with a small laptop built in and are designed to carry out all kinds of tasks.
If you want to read a lot but an eBook reader of your choice. If you want a really capable smartphone that you can read a book on buy an HD2.
I use microsoft reader which Ive had for several devices. I find reading fine. An obvious comment perhaps, but generally a smart phone is not normally going to compare well to a specialist set-up (ereader, games consule, mp3 player etc) but its an excellent all rounder, and saves having to carry around several devices.
(make that 1-1!)
I've been whole-heartedly reading books on my Hd2 for a year now. I'mm aware it;s probably not great on the eyes but I've not felt any problems from it, and I find AlReader2 the most fantastic reader out there (check it out if you need, it's on this forum somewhere).
However I've been using Android exclusively for the last two weeks and I hate every book app which is on there, they're all clumsy, awkward (e.g. in regards to where they store files), and they're almost exlusively bad at just reading plain text or HTML files. Some of them are good at allowing you to download free books on the go, and I can't help but enjoy the odd page-turning animation, but on th whole they are style over substance, and no match for AlReader.
Reasons why I won't get a Kindle (altho the new one looks great)
1) I think the gadgets are still a little over-priced (although it's come down now)
2) eBooks are definitely overpriced! Anything above £3 is too much, imo
3) Can't read ...in the bath! Big no-no!!
4) DRM
Silencer23 said:
Ebook reader 1 Smartphone Nil !
I'm interested then, why did you pick the HD2 as your smartphone ?
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great big gorgeous screen
sleek sexy design
fast processor
gobs of RAM
16GB sd card included
choice of OS
enough reasons?
somebody above said something I agree with as well, about multitasker vs unitasker. My phone does a million things for me all day long and most most of them pretty well, but the best thing is it is pocketable and always with me. It's like a swiss army knife. The phillips head screwdriver in your swiss army knife will get the job done, but the job will go better if you go ahead and get a proper #3 from the tool box. Similiarly, I only need the Nook to do one thing, let me read comfortably for a long time. I read a lot so $149 was OK with me. You'll probably not be surprised to read that I also carry a zune hd 32GB in the opposite pocket from my HD2. I like to have the right tool for the job, plus I love gadgets
I've been reading on various electronic devices for years now. I started on a palm m500, then a Tungsten T3, then a a Tungsten E2. I was a service engineer, so couldn't carry a lot of books with me.
The HD2 is every bit as good as the palms for reading on. Yes, it's not as good as a dedicated book reader, but it fits easily in my pocket, and I have a huge library at my disposal.
I use Freda, & really rate it.
Actually I have a Kindle and a Nook as well as the HD2. Yes the Kindle and Nook are awesome but truth be told I use my HD2 way more. I actually prefer the LCD. It, strangely, seems easier on my eyes and I can read before bed without having a light on. I always have my phone with me which makes it easier to just pick up a book. The reads are too big to carry around with me all the time. I know I am in the minority here but I wanted to throw my 2 cents in
I know we are probably no very close at all to the release of the Nook color 2 but i want to know what you people want to see in the next nook.
I want to see
1. 1 Ghz Processor Stock (not having to put custom kernel onto)
2. One camera on front of the device
3. HDMI port
IIDeViiNII said:
I know we are probably no very close at all to the release of the Nook color 2 but i want to know what you people want to see in the next nook.
I want to see
1. 1 Ghz Processor Stock (not having to put custom kernel onto)
2. One camera on front of the device
3. HDMI port
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Click to collapse
All three are pretty much unnecessary for the ebook market.
Nburnes said:
All three are pretty much unnecessary for the ebook market.
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If the original only had what was "-necessary for the ebook market," none of us would be here
Taosaur said:
If the original only had what was "-necessary for the ebook market," none of us would be here
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Lol
I agree it will probably have the Camera, maybe the 1ghz processor(but definitely not dual core) and definitly no HDMI port. lol that last one was just dreaming... but a guy(or a women) can dream
I suspect louder speakers! lol
I agree with burns... If they do anything to the Nook Color, it'll be make it lighter. I doubt they'll continue to try and compete in the Tablet market. It would just be silly, especially with Amazon positioning themselves to make a tablet that undercuts everything on the market less of chinese tablets.
I do agree it's unlikely that the tablet 'sweet spot' B&N hit with the current NC will still be there around October when it's time for a new device. They would probably be smarter to focus on increasing battery life and lowering cost while increasing their color-specific offerings (kids books, magazines, cookbooks/how-to).
Same device, slightly new proc maybe but....
Half the weight!,
Sent from my NookColor using XDA Premium App
Please, oh please...an 8.9" screen that approximates the page size of a "trade" paperback.
This has been my reading goal from the beginning as 6 is too small and 10.1 is too large.
More up-to-date processor (though the current is doing just fine) and full Andorid Market access without rooting (let the quality of the unit speak for itself...don't hamstring it).
A truly non-glare AND (largely) non-reflective screen.
A front firing speaker!!!
8 1/2-9.0 would be a real "Goldilocks" range though I have gotten quite used to the 7"!
And, last but not least, a removable battery or significantly extended battery life.
A user serviceable battery for sure
Def. the battery
lighter
better "anti-glare" technology, whatever that may be
camera would be nice, but probably won't get it
Proc would be nice too, and may get that
Speaker quality is really imperative....
Here's hoping!
DB
Honestly I don't expect anything out of the Nook Color 2, because I don't think it will have the same developer community so I won't want one.
The Nook Color is what it is because from October of last year, to this month (when sub-$300 Galaxy Tabs began popping up on the internet) it was the best tablet value. For much of that time, it was BY FAR the best tablet value- beating other options by $hundreds.
That is no longer the case, and it won't be the case for the next Nook Color. We will probably keep our pace of development on the original for at least another six months due to critical mass, but the next great hackable ereader is probably that tablet Amazon is keeping under wraps.
If B&N is smart they won't replace the first Nook Color for a while (aka sometime in 2012)...
Who needs a tablet in 2012? We'll all be gone anyways! lol... silly interwebs-peoplez.
There will be no crazy nook color 2.
The nook color does everything an ereader should do, too much in fact. B&N dont want you to buy the NC they want you to buy BOOKS! Adding more features to appeal to this community is the LAST thing they will do.
If anything they will revise the current nook with a better anti glare coating, hopefully a better speaker and i would not be surprised to see a locked bootloader and the ability to boot from SD removed.
The "hacking" community has been great thus far because now they can say we have sold "eleventy billion machines"! Now that they have that bit of marketing under their belt theres NO reason under the sun to cater to us anymore and every reason to start locking it down and protecting their interests...
My guess is it will probably happen as soon as amazon uses nook marketing against them. "XX% of nook colors are running the amazon kindle app" Makes one appealing tag line for amazon. If that happens the shareholders will put an end to the fun quick enough.
TLR the original nook color is probably as good as its going to get for us.
For me Nook is perfect as it now with CM7 + OC kernel:
Fast and smooth for ebooks, web, music, movies and casual gaming.
As the bug for battery life is fixed, it is astonishing about power.
Wifi is really ok with my MB511 (tethered 3G/Wifi from the backpack to the nook).
Maybe a bluetooth keyboard or a dock like the asus transformer and i have a netbook
For the size, 8.9" would be great without screen border.
I'd like to see at least a mono mike input
for voice control & email - SMS to text apps and voice chat
The fabled Amazon tablet will have a lot to say about whether there will be another NC, and what it will look like.
We should do everything we can do prolong the life of the NC now.
Still rocking the Incredible with the XDA Premium App.
The only improvement I can think of considering this is an ebook device would be a better screen for use outdoors as others have said.
The current screen is awesome indoors... great color, great viewing angles. I'm also impressed how good the touch sensitivity is for a resistive digitizer. But outdoors I can barely see what I'm trying to read through the reflection of my face or of the sky.
Had I bought this primarily as an ereader I'd be disappointed.
chrisjs81 said:
I'm also impressed how good the touch sensitivity is for a resistive digitizer.
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Good sensitivity "for a resistive digitizer" is a rather poor review of a capacitive touchscreen
Taosaur said:
Good sensitivity "for a resistive digitizer" is a rather poor review of a capacitive touchscreen
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Whoops. I swear I read it was resistive before I bought it. Either way it's quite good the only issue I have is the position jumping when I lift my finger off (such as when using the arrow to move the cursor) I don't have the same issue on my phone but that may just be the angle since the NC is so much larger.
Considering picking one up used for $120 or less (BTW, any deals better than the $135 certified pre-owned on B&N's site would be appreciated). I've considered loads of other tablets (mostly 7"), but fact is, I don't want to spend much, at least not on the tablet itself.
Anyway, at $120 or less, is it worth picking up, or should I look at something else? The things that draw me to the Nook Color are price (obviously), screen type/quality (not super glossy = awesome), USB OTG (considering plugging in a keyboard and using it for notes), Bluetooth (for headphones), and support/dev community.
My main uses would be reading books/comics, watching videos (nothing high-res), and possibly taking notes as mentioned earlier; there'd be very light gaming, as anything more serious would be reserved to an Xperia Play when I get one later. I doubt I'd install much just to try and keep it running as smooth as possible.
Expandable memory is nice, but not necessary, and I could live without either USB OTG or Bluetooth if the other was present. Camera/GPS/etc. definitely isn't necessary. Don't care for dual-core and whatnot as I know I won't really use/need the power.
Also, quick question about the Nook Color - are there any major issues left with CM7 for it, or is it basically complete? And how is CM9 in comparison (at the moment)?
nookcolor is a great tablet for $130 (give or take in price) but im ruuning cm7.1 for months now with no bugs or problems at all, it is a very stable rom. Screen is very nice, not to bright or to dull.
I got mine new for around $120 too. It is a great value although it does not have camera or other peripheral options.
tourist2 said:
I got mine new for around $120 too. It is a great value although it does not have camera or other peripheral options.
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You get what you pay for
Sent from my HTC Wildfire S using xda premium
Android311 said:
You get what you pay for
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Sometimes, you just pay more because you're an idiot.
The Nook Color has an exquisite screen, and it's better than the Kindle Fire (which I also own). Also, the Nook Tablet screen is exactly the same. It's the right resolution and sharpness. The iPad 3 is probably too much, especially since it runs very hot and eats the battery.
Even if you don't want to root or replace the ROM on your Nook Color, it's still a great tablet with a screen that is better than any other.
I love the color Nook. I f only it had a microphone , it could do everything I need
DigitalMD said:
I love the color Nook. I f only it had a microphone , it could do everything I need
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Some success in that area. Check out this thread:
http://www.androidtablets.net/forum/nook-color-technical/15172-headset-microphone-nc.html
Money
vote Kindle Fire
Forgot to update, ended up getting one for $100 in great condition on Craigslist. Immediately popped in a 32GB microSD and loaded CM7.2, lowered the screen density to 120, and I love it.
Definitely go with the Nook Color
I bought it when it was originally priced at $250. I live in Canada and drove down to the States to pick it up since BN doesn't ship to Canada. Even with the release of newer tablets, I'd buy another Nook Color over the others simply because it's the best bang for the buck.
I use it for my commute -- reading PDF books, listening to MP3s, watching videos, and the occasional game.
FWIW, I've owned an Ipad, Ipad2, and Blackberry Playbook. However, I couldn't justify the $400-600 price tag and sold them.
CM 7.2 is very functional, assuming you can live with the fact that apps won't recognize it as a full-on tablet. Within that limitation, it does everything just fine that you'd expect. The only shortcoming on your list is bluetooth support, as ranges can be limited.
At anything below $150, I'd says it's definitely worth a buy. You can blow that much with a night on the town, and have nothing but a headache and a strange rash to show for it.
Just to let everyone know that for some reason (good or bad), CM7.2-RC1 KANG on my NC is last FOREVER
I don't even know I should smile or not. It has been left idle (with virtually no use, screen off) for a WEEK and still has roughly 65% left in the tank.
Don't get me wrong, I've enjoyed my NC for some time and still continue to do so (as I already own it and it's just good enough to still do what I need, namely play around with new OS code ala CM9).
That said, even at $199.00, it's way slow compared to the competitions products at the same price ranges. NT is much better but doesn't even have BlueTooth at all, from my understanding and shown in it's tear down.
This means that if you need BT, albiet with a less than 10 inch range, the NC is probably the only "eReader" with BT using CM7 or CM9 at that range.
If you are thinking of the tape for gaming? Don't, it's opengl is good enough to entice you with some titles running, but it'll be lag city once there is enough onscreen action.
Thinking of it for Video? Semi-don't. Sure it's IPS screen will impress, but 720P video will not be 100% smooth and it doesn't have the video processing to do anything higher. Pretty much 480P res when you use NetFlix.
Can't buy new? While you can get a cheap NC off of Ebay, keep an eye out for several of the top end earlier generation tabs as the new ones entice users to upgrade.
SeaFractor said:
Don't get me wrong, I've enjoyed my NC for some time and still continue to do so (as I already own it and it's just good enough to still do what I need, namely play around with new OS code ala CM9).
That said, even at $199.00, it's way slow compared to the competitions products at the same price ranges. NT is much better but doesn't even have BlueTooth at all, from my understanding and shown in it's tear down.
This means that if you need BT, albiet with a less than 10 inch range, the NC is probably the only "eReader" with BT using CM7 or CM9 at that range.
If you are thinking of the tape for gaming? Don't, it's opengl is good enough to entice you with some titles running, but it'll be lag city once there is enough onscreen action.
Thinking of it for Video? Semi-don't. Sure it's IPS screen will impress, but 720P video will not be 100% smooth and it doesn't have the video processing to do anything higher. Pretty much 480P res when you use NetFlix.
Can't buy new? While you can get a cheap NC off of Ebay, keep an eye out for several of the top end earlier generation tabs as the new ones entice users to upgrade.
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Click to collapse
Yeah, Bluetooth was one of those things I just can't live without, even with the limited range. I definitely wouldn't have picked it up for any more than $100 (I would have just gotten the new NT if it wasn't much more expensive). Video hasn't disappointed me - standard/non-HD video is good enough for me and plays just fine. As for gaming, I intend to get an Xperia Play to use exclusively as a gaming device and just use that - although I may skip it at this point, as I have plenty of PC games, and the tablet is taking up a lot of the free time I had previously.
And I don't mind the lack of tablet apps on CM7 - I find CM9 a bit too sluggish to consider the switch at least for now.
Barnes & Noble has decimated their Nook development group.
Their latest endeavor, the white Nook Glow is a mish-mash of old and new software.
It appears that they've dropped the other two Eink models.
I do not ever expect to see any further updates or developments from B&N.
Eink has always played their cards close to their chest.
They have always presented their products as OEM, that is for manufacturers only.
To get the most out of devices with Eink displays application developers must also have a good understanding of Eink.
Just go to the Eink website, there is no useful information available.
A visit to Eink Developer Center shows just one kit for development of tiny readouts, not full displays.
I am not sure that I agree eInk is dead. I think it will have a niche market out there for a while. I am one of those people who really don't like reading on a back lit screen for any length of time. Perhaps it is due to my job where I stare at back lit LCD monitors all day long. In any case, I want to read on an eInk screen, not a back lit LCD. Until someone develops another tech to take to place of eInk, there will be people like me looking for eInk devices.
As for the eInk Nooks. They are dead. The future of eInk devices is high resolution 1024 x 768 capacitive touchscreen like the Kindle Paperwhite or the newly introduced Tolino Vision from Germany.
Hmm, that new Tolino looks interesting.
Still, I wouldn't say that 600 x 800 vs 768 x 1024 is the biggest deal for me.
The screen resolution is adequate for my eyes.
That it's the Carta display, whiter and faster would be some incentive.
A faster processor, more RAM and a more recent Android would be a win.
Of course I like eInk, I just think with prices being more than an LCD tablet it will remain a niche market.
It is my impression, from what I have read, the the extra resolution is somewhat necessary to make up for the extra layer needed for the capatitive touch screen. I agree that the 800 x 600 on a Nook with an IR touch screen is plenty good enough for these 50+ year old eyes.
No, E-Ink isn't dead. I have had a NST and I've been very satisfied with it as an e-reader. It's still easier on the eyes than even the best backlit display. My hope has been that someone might develop an E-Ink tablet not only for reading books but also for other text-intensive apps. Check out meetearl.com, for one interesting possibility. In the meantime, some folks have figured out that the Kobo line and the Tolino line are very similar in hardware. Long story short, I now have a Kobo Aura HD running Gingerbread from a microSD card. And it's not too bad at all. I don't use it for games or video, but it works well for the apps I've wanted to run on an E-Ink display. Gingerbread is old now, but significantly better than Eclair. The folks at Earl plan to use KitKat. It's still in development. No, E-Ink isn't dead yet!
Sent from my Nexus 7 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
I will have to admit that I bought a Nexus 7 tablet (1st gen, 32G) because my NST was less than completely adequate for some things. However, now, months later, I still find myself using the NST for almost all my reading. It is lighter, and easier on the eyes than the Nexus.
Dead? Maybe, but you can have mine when you pry my cold dead fingers off of it!
MildBill
All the black eInk Nooks have disappeared from the Barnes & Noble website.
You can only find them on places like eBay now.
I'm not sure about the brick-and-mortar stores, I'll have to check.
I am interested in how the Tolino will work out.
There is this video (in German): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SulHahVHxIE
It doesn't really look impressively better.
I spend 99% of my time doing straight reading and my NST works as least as well as that.
eInk devices are going to be primarily for those who (like myself) like dedicated devices. I want my camera to take pictures, I want my phone to make phone calls, I want my eReader to read, and I use a tablet for other media (video / web / music). I believe that there will always be a market for such devices, whether that market is sufficiently lucrative for products to be developed and sold is another question.
We have an NST and a new Kobo Aura HD. I did all my serious reading on my NST. It's still one of the best eReaders out there. If the NST ran a newer version of Android, I would have looked no further. But, I wanted to be able to read books and articles from a few other apps on an E-Ink eReader, apps which won't work on Android 2.1. When I learned that the Kobo eReaders are very similar to the Tolino line, and that someone found a way to run the Tolino Shine's ROM from a microSD card on a Kobo Aura HD, I became very interested. I went and did it. The Tolino ROM works fairly well on the Kobo. The Kobo reader has some good features, like Pocket integration. If you put the NST and the Kobo side by side, you can see the improved resolution on the Kobo. But I still prefer the way the NST formats and presents ePub eBooks. I hope I'm wrong, but it seems like B&N is bailing out of the eReader business. That would be sad indeed if it is true.
Sent from my Kobo Aura HD running Gingerbread
Renate NST said:
Barnes & Noble has decimated their Nook development group.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Source?
http://www.geekwire.com/2014/layoffs-hit-barnes-nobles-nook-division/
http://www.businessinsider.com/barnes-and-noble-hardware-engineering-staff-2014-2
http://www.techspot.com/news/55625-...arnes-nobles-nook-engineering-department.html
http://www.techweekeurope.co.uk/news/end-in-sight-for-nook-following-job-cuts-138724
Renate NST said:
http://www.geekwire.com/2014/layoffs-hit-barnes-nobles-nook-division/
http://www.businessinsider.com/barnes-and-noble-hardware-engineering-staff-2014-2
http://www.techspot.com/news/55625-...arnes-nobles-nook-engineering-department.html
http://www.techweekeurope.co.uk/news/end-in-sight-for-nook-following-job-cuts-138724
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you!
New Sony Dpt-S1, 13" reader looks like intersting use of Eink technology. But screen refresh still looks better on Nst with fastmode/norefresh
and PocketBook Cad reader, strong specifications like for eink
13",1 Ghz dual core, android 4.0, 2gb ram...
The take-up probably would have been far quicker had ereaders been cheaper. I'm guessing the biggest cost of an ereader is the eink display itself? Is it really that much more complex in it's design than an lcd that prices seem to be high for most ereaders (i know the technology is different, i mean the manufacturing process costs)? Most people would opt for a tablet as you can get really good ones with beautiful screens (Nook HD for example) for less than the price of a new Kindle, Kobo etc and you can do SO much more than just reading. Yeh, ereaders are easier on the eyes, but i doubt most tablet owners care about that when you add all the other functions of a tablet.
I think ereaders will always continue to exist, and i think as more and more people start using their tablets for reading entire books as opposed to just websites, articles, magazines etc, they're going to look to something that's easier on the eyes and ereaders will always be an excellent option, especially if more less restrictive ones come out that allow you to sync other files as well very easily without having to root them and install apps like dropbox, airdroid etc yourself. Kobo's Pocket for example is a great addition, but far more options to the user would be better, such as choosing which article sync app you wanted, Pocket, Readability, InstaPaper etc. Sync apps should also be the norm such as options to choose between Dropbox, gdrive, etc as well as maybe a basic browser like Opera Mini (mini so you get basic text versions of sites rather than the full sites that ereaders struggle with and output ugly results.
What i'd really like to see is great tablets with all their power, but with the addition of an eink display attached to the back Yeh, it's going to be thicker and slightly heavier but i think it could work. Similar to to Yotaphone, but not as rubbish as the Yotaphone (i read really bad reviews), instead, the eink side would work the same as any other touch screen ereader. You can even have a cover that flips over to cover the backside so only the screen you're looking at is exposed so if you put it down you don't have to worry about scratches. The implementation could be so much easier as well, instead of trying to figure about how you get the image on the eink side (a problem Yota did not fix well), you could just mirror the tablet side exactly, so there's no additional complex software conversions to do, that way if you want to end your web browsing session on your tablet and read a book, just open your ereader app, flip your tablet and read on you eink side and flip pages the way you already do on an ereader via touch.
If i had the money and the know how i would be designing a Tablet/Ereader hybrid like that myself. Had this idea for a long time, but never understood why someone didn't do it (other than the cost). I'm sure there are reasons that others will point out maybe, but i'd much rather buy a Tablet/Ereader hydrid long before i buy the failed SmartPhone/ereader hybrid as the latter is pointless, reading on a small phone even if it is eink is still difficult and makes you strain your eyes.
I think the Nook Simple Touch is really the optimal format in many ways.
6" is a good size for reading reflowable text.
It's not that great for page formatted (i.e. PDF).
It's too bad that B&N cut so many corners.
Not all the delay can be blamed on the eInk itself.
The processor is slow and there isn't a lot of RAM.
It would have been nice if they had gotten the Jorjin chip with Bluetooth.
I can compare navigation speed on large documents using the same reader app (i.e. my new app) on my Nook and my old disused Kyocera Rise cell phone.
The Nook shows as pretty slow.
I agree, it is sad that B&N ruined the Nook e-inks.
Was never (and am still not) a fan of Amazon devices.
E-ink devices are still evolving.
My next e-ink device is getting closer to release. http://www.meetearl.com/
Being full Android KitKat device, it has the options I want and a few extra.
I am not really sure if e-ink is going in or out.
I see contradicting moves out there:
- Best Buy has eliminated all e-ink readers from their (brick and mortar) stores. I went to three of them this past week and only Kindle Paperwhite is present. Their explanation: tablets are replacing them.
- hower: one can see bigger e-ink readers being released, which also have more of their Android base exposed: Onyx Boox M96M Zeus, ICARUS eXceL 9.7". It seems that those producers of ereaders that still want to be in the market add features so that they bring the feature convergence on their side.
I personally love the e-ink displays and would very much like to have a modern phone/tablet using it. Keeping my fingers crossed !
We all love the Nook but it's getting kind of old in the tooth.
Ok, the Glow4 (7.8") finally upped its game to 1 GB RAM, but that was kind of necessary.
It also added Bluetooth, something that could have been done cheaply and easily to earlier models.
Although I'm no fan of using the latest and greatest Android version, 4.4.2 is getting a bit old.
I understand that this is a tough business where every little part on the BOM (bill of materials) will hurt you.
Still, using single core processor is so yesterday. A Raspberry Pi Zero has quad core for $10-15.
To my mind a 6" 300 DPI reader is about optimal for flowing text reading.
For frequent or work PDF reading I'd want a 10" 300 DPI reader instead of high power reading glasses.
The 8" reader seems to fall uncomfortably in the middle.
The Kobos are Linux based, not Android.
Onyx has some decent choices in their (confusedly similar) product palette.
The older stuff has Android 4.4, the newer stuff Android 9.0
They have quad core and even octa core.
The "Poke 2" looks pretty nice for a 6", but why did they have to add the silver styling?
https://onyxboox.com/boox_poke2
(Oh, well, some sandpaper and a can of black spray paint would fix that.)
As I am in love with the Aard dictionary, my NST has been simply wonderful. But I understand Kobo no longer support an SD card. Where to now?
Same boat. I just got rid of my GLP BNRV510. Hated the light grey, small dictionary font. Also reading PDF seemed to convert those documents to oversized images. My NSTw/GL was awesome. I was going to upgrade to the new NGLP7.8 but the specs and issues with overheating are a turn off. Also I have read reviews stating that you can't side load books anymore? This may also apply to the GLP BNRV510 with the latest firmware update too. Which eReader now?
The Glow2 (BNRV510) is my main read.
If I have to read a PDF, I read it in landscape at two "chunks" a page.
I wouldn't think that B&N would try to lock down sideloads and I don't anticipate it would be hard to defeat.
I hope not but I understand the arguments for your question. To be honest NST as it was not my first choice (first choice was some Sony model) but I love it now. Last time I checked Kobo Aura looked nice but that was long ago and I do not know how things look now on the market.
Recently I was scrubbing my head around this issue. How I see the problem with NST? Well B&N locked out anything and everything humanly possible to prevent users doing something they did not wanted them to do. Devs unlock most of the obstacles out of protest or because of challenge ahead. As it runs ancient version of Android apps are scarce and disappearing fast. Writing an app dedicated for NST might be an act of love toward hardware base made by dedicated fanatic but we can assume there are not to many such individuals around today as Rennate said Nook is old.
So without further ado there are few roads as I see that could be taken if NST is to continue ahead.
1. Upgrades to Android version as far and much its hardware allows and using slightly more up to date apps for it (like CM11 approach running from SD card allows).
2. As Android is just an overlay on Linux leave it as is for B&N sake and good sleep but make some dual boot solution that will actually allow us to boot Linux (something in the line of Ubuntu for devices but not exactly so because as far as I remember that work only for versions of Android above 4) as that could give user maximum possible ability to customize it for his/her use.
3. Just say bye to B&N and build new NST OS from scratch be it Linux or another version of Android as that might be easier due to a clean slate/paper ahead and being less bound to a obstacles made by B&N.
4. It might be possible to create also dual profile on the current NST OS but given its restrictions that might not be of some great use - (B&N profile and user profile). What other forum members think about it?
P.S. I did not want to create separate thread about this and this thread seemed to fit in the general idea of talk about it. I hope Rennate wont mind.
Nah, I don't mind.
I use the same reader app on my Glow2 and everything else, including my $70 Walmart Onn 8" tablet.
Even a cheap-o (single CPU) tablet has 2G vs the Glow2's 0.5G
For better or worse, people like the Android ecosystem as a way to make apps.
Of course, Google & Co are working on making everything ginormous and expensive.
(And adding even more pointless animations.)
It's always a question of how much work you want to put in to fight annoying things.
Renate NST said:
Nah, I don't mind.
I use the same reader app on my Glow2 and everything else, including my $70 Walmart Onn 8" tablet.
Even a cheap-o (single CPU) tablet has 2G vs the Glow2's 0.5G
For better or worse, people like the Android ecosystem as a way to make apps.
Of course, Google & Co are working on making everything ginormous and expensive.
(And adding even more pointless animations.)
It's always a question of how much work you want to put in to fight annoying things.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am glad that you do not mind and find this discussion still within topic you started.
As always you hit problem in the head with much less words then me. I have always wondered what are the limits of hardware requirements needed (minimum) for some tasks/programs to run reliably. And we see that people test those boundaries each day.
You are correct that Android had given people app making opportunities. Sadly recent trend is to take away that from us on old devices as this one. I agree that "awww look its so shiny and buzzing" might look nice but regarding information value its pretty much crap (no way to put it politely sorry). Information is what the people using books/ebooks find to have some merit and it is in the form of text, graph, still picture mostly. I accept that sometimes video can be better tool for presenting certain information but general trend is not in that direction. Information in any shape and form I will accept gladly. Sad truth is that today we have to duck and fight against flash advertising and eye candy web UI of very little value and dubious quality.
I have some doubts what would be the most likely way to continue that is why I made that post. If it was my thread I would make a poll but even here I am willing to hear what is your opinion? Amongst four options I wrote up what would you most likely choose as a way forward? Also if possible please explain why.
1) I think doing an upgrade of Android version on an older device is a bunch of work and hardly justified.
2) I'm not a fan of dual boot. I like to keep things simple. Especially on my main reading device where I just want to pick it up and read.
Android "Linux" has quite a few different things than normal Linux. If you want Linux, get a Kobo.
3) Porting something new to the NST is a lot of work. See #1
4) I don't see the necessity of dividing profiles. I also don't understand what you're looking for.
Ok, I'm a fan of the NST, but it's had its day. The Glows have better resolution and backlight.
You get your choice of capacitive (Glow2) or IR (Glow3) touch screen.
The Android 4.4.2 on the Glows is not so bad yet. (The NST Android 2.1 makes life difficult.)
I think more memory, Bluetooth and a better processor would be on my wish list (in order).
Yes, the Glow4 has Bluetooth.
With enough effort you can fix any little technical thing in life that annoys you.
(I just spend this morning grinding and filing down a piece on my brand new guitar because I couldn't stand the design.)
It's a question of time and also how many people your effort would help.
I think an Onyx Boox is in my future, but I wish they didn't have so many silly models.
It's funny, I still use my original Nook Simple Touch, but a few times a year I find myself curious and looking to see if there's a perfect e-reader out yet for me to upgrade to. In the end it always just seems like nothing is really so much better that I really want to buy it, though.
In particular, page refreshes and overall responsiveness, which are the main things I'd like to be better, still just haven't improved enough on affordable e-readers, in my opinion. A backlight would be kinda cool, but hardly seems like a big deal since personally I'm still pretty used to reading real books, which obviously don't have built in lighting either. I guess a higher density screen might be nice, but I can't say I really notice it on my NST. Newer Android? Maybe, though I've really always been able to find an app that does what I need and works on the NST even with Android 2.1, so I'm not sure what the advantage would be.
I'm a pretty light user of my Nook, though, I guess. Most of the time I'm just reading epubs or sometimes pdfs (scientific papers, which are usually published as double columns, so they work just fine on the NST screen), plus the occasional word games or round of picross here and there. Someday I'm sure I'll upgrade to a new reader, but I think it's gonna be a while at the rate the technology has been improving.
You have stated all valid points here. I understand them and agree to most. Maybe I should explain in more details my points.
I use NST as is. Still restrictions imposed on user by B&N are frustrating sometimes. I mentioned upgrading Android on the device only because its own base is abandoning 2.1 and cutting of access to application made for this version. I have nothing against sideloading apps but if the source to such apps is going to dry out it might be a time for a change. Theoretically with slight upgrade of Linux kernel on it upgrade to gingerbread/honeycomb looks doable. Is it worth the effort is a valid question and that is exactly what I am asking for opinion here.
I am mostly using an OS from that Redmond firm. Although I want to learn and use Linux more I am certainly not looking into using it on e-reader despite it is possible to do on Kobo. Point of dual boot would be to leave B&N stuff as is and do on Linux what you like. At least on Linux you would not be that easily cutoff from apps you want/need. Again looks doable but I am not sure if it is recommendable. Reason for me to considering this is that more and more I read about trying to write/rewrite an apps for this device. Even I have started something similar to porting Linux program to Android and being frustrated by next to nill progress so far started to wonder am I doing it backward and should I run Linux on NST and program in the environment it was written for.
I am surprised Renate is not for whole new OS because the way I see the things she is already halfway there with all the apps she wrote for NST. . I know OS is another matter but let's face it it was half baked product to begin with. I mean Phone.apk really? On a device without sound support! And that app control volume? Man B&N really had shoestring budget for software developer and had us use port of some phone OS instead writing dedicated stuff.
I find multiple profile least advised on such low power device but I could see its merit here and there. I have a cousin which would be happy if she had kids profile on its phone as that would prevent paying triple digit roaming charges. NST most likely do not have the power to pull of multiple profiles although in theory something like that could be made even for Eclare in some crumbly way.
NST have resolution just above low printing and we love it. If some device could achieve 300dpi and have larger screen A4 size preferably with A5 being minimum that would be awesome. There are few device on market Remarkable and Sony with 10 and 13.3 inch screen but they cost still an arm and a leg. Although they shifted concept more toward notebook/sketchbook I have no problem with that but e-book support is next to nothing PDF only if I remember well. I am old and I like to use "pen" on "paper". I will look about other device mentioned. Aura H2O did caught my eye once to be honest.
Now I hope you can see my points more clearly. I find this discussion fruitful. Even if we do nothing we at least have fresh input from others to tickle little gray cells.
As far as upgrades go, upgrading to anything less than Lollipop (5.0) is pretty pointless.
That's already five years old as it is.
As bloat is a given, you're always going to need more memory and a faster processor.
If you want to learn about Linux a Raspberry Pi is certainly an economical solution.
For ~$15 you can get a Raspberry Pi ZeroW.
Android *nix deviates a lot from Linux but mostly in system and startup issues.
You can cross-compile C programs on your Windows box using the the Android NDK and run them in the command line on your Nook.
You won't have direct access to the screen unless you want to write to /dev/graphics/fb0 yourself.
If you don't want the Android layer running at that time you can just turn it on and off with "stop" and "start".
You might try to get into writing regular Java (or Kotlin, but don't get me going on that) applications.
There is something to be said for having your own app that runs on both your phone and your Nook.
There's a lot of convenience in having whatever you're looking for on whatever device you have at the moment.
I always though that backlights were pointless, but I've learned to love them.
If you have copier paper a lot of it is 92% reflective.
The white in eInk is a lot grayer than that.
I always keep my backlight on, but only to the point that it makes up for the gray tint to make it white.
Looking at it you really don't get the impression that it is glowing.
I have stumbled on web page of a project to port some 4+ Android version on NST which pretty much surprised me. Can not remember was it ICS or JB and hell Kitkat would be awesome for device that old. I believe that for that they must abandon B&N stuff almost completely unless they somehow ported it back from Glow versions? And counting in size expected I bet that they reformatted partitions on the device to make it happen. Now will that stick together or fall apart spontaneously is another question. I remember that on xda that somewhere was a thread about disabling OTA from B&N that could brake such upgrade but since they no longer support NST we should not worry about this. I wonder why did you said Lollipop as minimum choice? Do you consider it as minimum acceptable Android version or maximum that NST could possibly run?
As far as Linux go nah I will just play with old laptop instead. Although I caught myself looking to buy present for nephews in electronic realm. Arduino or Pie? aye there is the rub...
I didn't program anything reasonable for a long time. Therefore I am more than rusty in that field. Although I believesome Python or lua script I could manage if enough effort is put on my side.Julia look to me as a programming language that shows some promise to the future from old man perspective. Certainly none of those are useful to porting anything to Android and NST. For the moment I cut my appetite back and will look into how I can backup NST and make virtual image out of it to run it in Virtual box. There I hope to try to learn how things work on Android an play/apply changes in the sand boxed environment. If I break something no harm done just delete virtual drive and start again. I don't want to brick my only NST. Maybe I should buy used one for latter to as I see lot of UK used one have hit the market after B&N closed in UK.
I hate Java from reasons unwilling to disclose or as you said let's not start about that. Idea behind it is fine. Sadly it is lot to be desired on the implementation side. I totally understand that Java might give some benefits especially if we count in the already existing base of programs written on Java. Have a friend who learn and use Java but I personally never manage to overcome my personal detest of it.
Regarding backlight... I never saw Glow. Is there true backlight in like shining through panel? Or did they made something in line of those book lights for real books? I think that could work for capacitive screen but not so much so for IR like NST have. That should not glow much I think and could be regulated in illumination and colour.
The NST has 256M RAM, the Glow2/3 has 512M, the Glow4 has 1G, my $40 phone has 2G.
The $60 Kobo I have has only 256M, but it just runs Linux.
I couldn't be bothered to update my NST even if you handed me an image on a platter.
ebay has the Glow4 (open box) for $130.
I wouldn't even try to update that to a newer version, too much work.
Since this thread started the Boox Poke3 6" reader has come out.
It has Android 10, 8 CPUs, 2G RAM, Bluetooth and lists for $190.
That's a heck of a lot more of a device than the Glow3 for $120.
It also doesn't have the ugly styling of the Poke2.
https://www.boox.com/poke3/
Hmm, currently not in the US warehouse.
I'm a big fan of Arduino and RPi, but it gets complicated.
An adult friend bought an Arduino, hooked up an LCD and a thermometer, loaded the sketch.
It worked. They got bored. End of the story.
I don't know what the solution is. You make it too easy, they get bored. You make it too hard, they get frustrated.
I'm not a fan of the whole Arduino infrastructure and the Processing language. I prefer just AVR8. But I am "old skool".
I use RPi a lot, but I've only seen the desktop version about once.
I use headless and also digital signage without X Windows or desktop.
The Glow2 has single color edge lit backlight, The Glow3/4 uses dual color (blending) edge lit backlight.
If you hold them sighting down the face of the screen at a very low angle you can tell there are discreet LEDs.
(It's nothing you could ever see in normal usage.)
I checked Boox first time you mentioned it. Impressive progress I must say. Paradox is that as I understand newer Android versions are more optimized to be run even on underpowered devices but I agree that NST is both old and underpowered. Still even you mentioned that Kobo has same low memory but still running successfully Linux only environment. That speaks a lot in Linux favor regarding resource management and use. Yes there are slim chances someone cook something up for NST and even then people will just buy new device that is several times better. You wouldn't believe but B&N readers are hard to find here. I had to ask a friend to bring me the one from Middle East because it was available there so go figure.
Thanks for the opinion about Arduino vs RPi. I think you might be right. Kids nowadays will be interested to program more than to assemble something and experiment. Its a shame because I think they could learn more about physics by fiddling with Arduino.
Thanks for explaining me or rather confirming how light on Glow device is made. I am curious how they sorted out possible interference of lighting with IR touchscreen but I guess they somehow used non overlapping LEDs for those two separate things or passthrough IR only filters on IR detector side. In theory even some simple software calibration could work for that but I am also an "old skool" and wouldn't choose that as my way had I have gotten the task to build something of this kind. I might rig me some "lights" for old fashioned hardcopy books. Not that I can't buy it online but I want to engage my fingers a little.
If you haven't played with it yet, the Touch-1.0.apk (in the sig) works on the NST and will show you how/where the beams of IR go.
It can be helpful to see where dirt or distortion of the bezel is making it difficult for touches to be registered correctly.
Since the party seems to be going into a topic of what next best e-reader should be maybe we could exchange opinions about certain things available as in are they necessary or good enough at this moment. For example Boox is offering a model that can show ebooks as black and white or I presume as 4 color "print". As B&W it present it as 300dpi which is on par with printed books and man can not ask for more in my opinion. Alas when it present 4 color "print" it is meager 100dpi that could mean even NST just blows it out of scene. So my vote on color e-reader is still no. If it ever reach 150dpi it will become a thing to consider but right now it is still under acceptable performance from mine point of view.
Do you consider making notes on a device important? I am asking because I have mentioned ReMarkable and Sony DPT (which is gone now). Sony again made good device only to withdraw from the market at the end. While I understand that in the e-reader case as Amazon blow them out securing the better library this time I am afraid it is Sony's own fault. There exist few rebranded models of hardware Sony used with seemingly better software Fujitsu Quadreno and Mooink Pro. Mooink support PDF, epub, docs and text and offers a software for file conversion and DRM management. There are few annoying things. Almost none have microSD card option now. It is replaced with cloud storage or printing. And I personally like having pen but I find being robbed when they sell it separately and with replaceable tips because they made those to wear out. Cost is way to high despite larger screen.
I'm not clear on what you mean with "4 color".
The only thing that I can see on the website is a way to save your scribbles to an external file where you can set the color saved (but not viewed) on the device.
If you've ever seen a store white/red/black eInk shelf label update you'll know that that's only useful for things that change once a day.
I don't look too closely at the reader software itself since I'll probably just use my own.
I hate the sort of pictograph selection of small, medium, large font.
What if I want 5% larger than medium?
There's always a bit of conflict between SD card and waterproof.
I figure 32 GB fixed storage is large enough for me.
There's always a big tossup what is the correct mix of devices, phone, ereader, tablet, tablet with pen, tablet with keyboard, laptop, desktop?
I've never owned a personal laptop, never seen the sense (for me).
Rarely do I use a tablet or a phone with a BT keyboard when I want to do some sort of bulk inputting or fleshing out an idea or transcribing lyrics.
I kind of like digitizers, but never found a way that the utility exceeds the space they take.
Onyx Boox Poke 2 Color is for example device able to reproduce color. Yet is it worth buying?
Yes I understand your choice to use custom reader software. File support seems to have always been a problem and it just went worse from there.
Yes waterproof device shouldn't have SD card. I have mean more in a sense of having the ability to root, backup and thinker with the device.
SJT75 said:
Onyx Boox Poke 2 Color is for example device able to reproduce color.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The product selection of Onyx or Boox or Onyx Boox has always confused the heck out of me.
Currently on https://www.boox.com/allproducts/ there is no indication of anything color.
Moreover, the "About Us" speaks of "We focus on E Ink ( ePaper) devices only. "
But I do remember seeing something previously on the website that spoke of color.