Need opinions for this new tablet :D - Nexus 7 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting

Need opinions for this new tablet :D - Nexus 7 Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting

So... I need everyone's opinion on this. As this has been going on in my mind for weeks I'm considering of buying a budget tablet since it is becoming a necessity for us medicine students for reading our ebooks and medicine apps. Months ago I was considering buying iPad 2 since it can now be bought under my budget Then came the google nexus 7; I was so amazed by its price for its specs. So here are my pros and cons. I'll be gauging largely on the gadget's academic use for school
Ipad 2
Pros
+++++9.7" screen (large screen estate for ebooks)
+huge array of apps
+brand name (durability guaranteed)
Cons
--Apple iOS (needs to be jailbroken to be of good use, as I'm a med student, I have no time to jailbreak it myself )
--low res
-Can't send files over bluetooth to other non-apple devices
-a bit pricey compared to nexus 7
-heavy
Google Nexus 7
Pros
+++considering its specs, it has an AMAZING price tag
++high res
++light
+Android OS
+can easily communicate with other devices, I have my trusty SGS2 so I can transfer my files seamlessly between devices
Cons
----Screen size is a mere 7" only
--Apple iOS has many medical apps compared to Android (ex. Netter's Atlas of Human's Anatomy and Visible Body)
-ASUS brand is not that known here as a tablet manufacturer here in the Philippines (I don't even know where their service center here is. lol :laugh
The most major factors here are the screen sizes and the resolutions of the devices. Is a 7" tablet enough for heavy ebook reading? Thanks guys for the help!

IN many peoples opinions 7" is actually BETTER for reading than the 9" the device is much lighter and easier to hold in one hand making for a easier experience. Theres a reason all the ebook readers are around 7" it's just the best size for reading.
Nothing really you can do about the lost apps, though there is the Google Body app, though i doubt it'll be enough for you being a med student. and there may be some other alternatives.
as far as ebooks go, the ipad may have the larger screen size, but the 7" form factor is generally considered much easier to use for reading.

Jailbreaking literally takes about a 2 minutes to do. Doubleclick, and the rest is done automatically.
I have been happy with ebooks on a 7". PDF's of magazines can be a bit more difficult to read.

Related

[Q] Motorola Xoom vs iPad 2, and Honeycomb Apps

I'm on fence on whether to buy a Motorola Xoom (32GB WiFi EU) or an iPad 2. In terms of price, here in Malta the Xoom seems more worth it as I can get it for 498 euro whilst the iPad 2 Wifi 32GB is at 609.
My main concerns are regarding software, and more importantly, apps availability. Now, before you bash my question, I've read a lot of reviews for both devices, and I've gone through lists for Honeycomb apps, but I'd like input from actual Xoom owners that are using it day to day.
Thanks in advance,
Emmanuel

well email and surfing is alot more fun and productive on a Xoom compare to an Ipad2 because of the integrated email and the flash enabled full size browser experience
but if you look at the build quality of them it sure looks like the Ipad2 went thought a lot more intensive QA then the Xoom since on the back of the xoom you kind of able to push in the plastic a bit.... thats makes me a sad panda
anyway comparing xoom vs ipad 2... there is only one logical answer
android =widgets
IOS = no widgets
and with widgets you get your information a lot faster like news, socks and twitter on one page... so yeah and i do use that alot
productivity = xoom
build quality = ipad2
that said i still think the ipad2 really rocks since it's a finished product but it does not have the widgets

I've owned an iPad and now I own a XOOM. For me personally, the ipad doesn't come close - the OS is far too restrictive and the dependency on iTunes was a killer for me (I use linux on all of my home machines, forcing me to run a windows virtual machine just to activate the damned thing).
With that said, the XOOM, or rather, Honeycomb doesn't even come close with regards to app availability. Even if you take the huge headstart that apple have (1 year+), the ipad has simply always been better marketed and there are a lot more apps available. Let's not even get started on the android market place; it's dire. The worst. And for some reason, it's even worse on honeycomb than it is on phones; no ability to rate apps, plenty of bugs (some of which have been addressed in 3.1), no ability to view only tablet apps, terrible filtering and search in general, etc. Apple's app store is how it should be done, the android market place has a long way to come.
The situation is improving for honeycomb and I personally wouldn't dream of going back to the ipad, but for friends and family who couldn't care less about the restrictive nature of iOS and the other things that I dislike, I would recommend the ipad.
With all that said, it looks really weird to see me almost recommending Apple, because I personally can't stand the software. Oh well...

Well, I've never owned an I pad but I have just purchased the xoom and I LOVE it!!!
Most comparisions regard the xoom better, but with the I pad having loads more apps - to some people, this is the deal breaker.
However, if you want a true tablet experience and not just an oversized iPod touch, then go for the xoom.
The xoom has better OS, greater browser and keyboard, better cameras and support flash, it is also not tied down to any PC software such as iTunes and includes more customization options such as widgits. (Android includes a free turn by turn navigation system too)
Oh and the maps and YouTube apps are better on the xoom and have more features (Google property pays off)
I made my decision and I'm happy with my xoom - but the choice is yours.
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk

I have to disagree. I think the xoom build quality is top notch and better than the iPad. It's just when I hold the iPad I feel like it will break... to thin for my liking.
Now applications look better in my opinion on the iPad. Like it was mentioned here the Apple eco system keeps me away.
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

I have owned an iPad, and will likely own an iPad 2 when the current shortage lets up. There is very little left to say about the iPad (either version) that hasn't been said already. They are exceptional devices, gamechangers, perfectly designed to introduce mobile technology to mainstream users. Almost anyone can be up and running in 15 minutes with an iPad, even with no experience and iOS rewards those who embrace its deliberate limitations.
My first experience with Android was with an Archos 5 tablet, and then an Archos 101. I bought both as relatively inexpensive ways to get acquainted with Android. and both were very frustrating experiences in different ways. They really made me begin to view Android as a very niche market.
However, when I needed a new phone and decided that I couldn't wait for a Windows Phone 7 device to be offered here, and refused to get an iPhone, I opted for the Galaxy s and a whole world opened up to me...which then led me to my new Xoom.
I have been playing with it for about half a day now after doing a great deal of reading...I unlocked it, tried to root it and ran into the "stuck on the red M" problem, spent about 2 hours reading and sorting out how to get myself out of the trap via adb, rooted it at last, installed CWM then flashed the Tiamat kernel and finally began loading up my apps. Loved every moment of it. The build quality of the device, in my opinion, is excellent. It feels much better and more substantial in my hands than the iPad. The screen is top notch and I really like the honeycomb environment for work and play.
Most of all, I like the fact that Android is a living, breathing OS. SO much to explore and learn and investigate.
The iPad, for all it's many good points, as I said before rewards those who embrace its limitations. The Xoom rewards those who refuse limitations, who are willing to spend the time and effort to learn how it works and discover ways to do it better.
The iPad is the USS Enterprise...sleek and beautiful but cold and a bit sterile for all its power. What you see is what you get.
The Xoom is the Tardis...a hodgepodge of history and possibility, all wrapped in a shell of sweet wonder....and it is bigger on the inside.

With a Xoom I could have never ever owned a PC and set it up and get it working. It does not require you to hook it up to itunes first. With the iPad... yea I dont know about 15 minutes but after you hook it up to your computer to unlock it (lol) you can finally use it. In my house we have both, I like the Xoom better

you said
"The iPad, for all it's many good points, as I said before rewards those who embrace its limitations. The Xoom rewards those who refuse limitations, who are willing to spend the time and effort to learn how it works and discover ways to do it better."
I couldn't have said it better. The Xoom is my third Android tablet, my second Tegra2 tab, and the most hands-on and most rewarding and fun to own. I have never liked the Apple zeitgeist and have always avoided that product. I prefer the freedom to mess around, get into scrapes and come back from the brink with a better tab and a lot more knowledge. I think that as an open source, Android will continue to grow and evolve in wonderful ways and I want to be along for the ride.
Also, this thing is built like a tank.

rschenck said:
The iPad is the USS Enterprise...sleek and beautiful but cold and a bit sterile for all its power. What you see is what you get.
The Xoom is the Tardis...a hodgepodge of history and possibility, all wrapped in a shell of sweet wonder....and it is bigger on the inside.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That made me giggle . But I think the ipad are like the dalek. Cold personality and desire only perfection. seek only to dominate the world!
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

inspiron41 said:
That made me giggle . But I think the ipad are like the dalek. Cold personality and desire only perfection. seek only to dominate the world!
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Steve Jobs as Davros ...*shudder*
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA Premium App

i'll keep this short as can be...
iPad/iOs = Checkers.
Xoom/Honeycomb = Chess.

I have played around with both Ipad and Xoom. I currently own a Xoom. Ipad is probably fine if you want something simple with few options(not talking about apps).
The Xoom is pretty cool, and even cooler after unlock & root. The downside is app / game availability, but it's getting better every day.
The killer for me between the two is multitasking. The xoom has it, the ipad not so much.
And also, no itunes. The xoom works out of the box.
The Ipad on the other hand has more accessories, wee..

Keep in mind that these sorts of issues are ultimately a matter of taste, so the things I don't like the iPad may not bother you at all.
I bought an iPad2 and returned it within 48 hours. I really can't explain my utter contempt for that device, but I just hated everything about it. I'm not an Apple hater, mind you; I owned every iPhone through the 3GS and was one of those dorks standing in line on launch days. I really, really wanted to like the iPad 2, but after having owned two Android handsets (and being a big gadget whore) I couldn't stomach going back to an iOS product.
What I hated about the iPad 2:
-Screen resolution sucks
-Too thin and flimsy feeling
-Stock keyboard is HORRIBLE and there's no way to change it
-No widgets
-No UI customization, period
-Cameras suck
-"Notification system" is sort of a joke
-"Multi-tasking" is also sort of a joke
-Far higher cost for iPad apps vs. iPhone/iPod apps, developers nickel & dime you for every little thing (subscriptions, in-app purchases, etc) - seriously, the whole ecosystem was like a giant money sucking vacuum
-QA on my particular unit was terrible - massive light leaks around the edges of the screen and 3 stuck pixels within 1 day of use (and this is not an isolated issue, though Apple is replacing defective units but making sure to blame their supplier)
iOS is getting long in the tooth, and this is hugely magnified in tablet form, especially with the crappy-looking display. I felt like I was using old technology, despite the awesome internal specs. The best comparison I can come up with between Honeycomb and iOS on a tablet is something like Windows 7 compared to Windows 3.1.

hello,
i'm maltese too, on a xoom us wifi .. from amazon.com
worked out to 508 eu including hsbc's 'conversion charge' of 8 eu or so.
ipad vs xoom.. depends on what you need.
if you want a platform to play stuff from itunes.. ipad
if yiu want a portable computer you can meddle with.... xoom of course.
build quality, screen and battery life are excellent too.
cheers

btw where is that price from?
when i bought mine it was closer to 600eu for wifi eu
which is why i got the us one..

While I will state now I am no expert on iOS or the Ipad1/2 I will say this:
My Xoom has me constantly entertained and I've NEVER felt I needed an app that I didnt have at least 4 decent choices of. I have also never left limited on my Xoom for any tasks I wish to undertake, I stream all my media from my computer (via WiFi OR 3G) so everywhere I am I have access to all my media (and now thanks to Google Music moreso) and with Remote Desktop I have access to my Linux and Windows machines no matter where I am. The Xoom constantly feeds me information without having to do anything but look at my homescreens.
I have played with friends Ipad1/2's and while for the most part things seemed smooth and work well I always had this feeling of being lost when looking through the app screens, its like all the icons look the same (same size, many of them same colors) just felt very sterile and un-enjoyable and you get ZERO information without going from one app to another just felt like so much work for simple basic information readily available on my Xoom.
I've never been a fan of iOS or Apple's strategy towards their customers but I really tried to look at my 2 options without bias before choosing my Xoom. As several others are stated you really dont have any choices with Apple products, you take what your given and if you dont like your options you dont have any more to look at.
Android (despite its fragmentation in some areas and flaws, hiccups in others) is the best choice if you like options and a desire to learn more and have real options with your chosen device. If you want something simple that tells you what you want then Apple products are for you. If you dont mind a hiccup with something here and there and having the ultimate say in the apps and add-on parts for your device then I say without a doubt Android is the way to go. Widgets are the best thing to happen to phones/tablets as it gives you so much information without having to do anything to get it and you can always enter into that app for a more detailed look and more options.
As for the comment on Apple App Store having more options, maybe it does but judging by the amount the Android Market has grown over 1 year I highly doubt Apple will be able to say the same thing next year. More and more developers either jump ship from Apples restrictions in apps or choose to release their products on both Android and iOS platforms which means in many cases the Apple App Store is slowing down and stagnating in some areas due to the open nature of app development for Android OS, its infinitely easier to write and sell and app for Android than iOS.
As a side note a friend of mine and I compared apps, we both had some niche apps and some common ones... my total cost was about $40 (like I said I have some apps that cost about $15, my phone apps only had a grand total of like $10) but all in all his total for all similar (sometimes the same app) was about $200, that alone pushed my decision for another android device with the Xoom vs Ipad2.

If your cheap and want to hack get the Xoom. If you want to easily be able get VIDEOS to play fluently for rent or TV episodes get iPad. I got the ipad because it was so gay to get Videos on the thing. Having to convert then drag to device verse iTunes makes iTunes seem easier. Especially is JB.
Xoom =iPad none is clear winner
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

jamaicansolja said:
If your cheap and want to hack get the Xoom. If you want to easily be able get VIDEOS to play fluently for rent or TV episodes get iPad. I got the ipad because it was so gay to get Videos on the thing. Having to convert then drag to device verse iTunes makes iTunes seem easier. Especially is JB.
Xoom =iPad none is clear winner
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am not sure I would call the Xoom cheap (not in build quality and certainly not in price) and I don't see what the sexual orientation of the iPad has to do with the issue.
I feel the video converting question is a non issue. For me, converting via iTunes or by a third party app is just as big a pain, and the iPad's native video app is even more limited codec-wise than the Android stock Video. Anyway, just use a player like MoboPlayer or VPlayer which can show pretty much anything, and you are golden.
However I agree that there is no real BEST TABLET...it is just a matter of personal preference.

jamaicansolja said:
If your cheap and want to hack get the Xoom. If you want to easily be able get VIDEOS to play fluently for rent or TV episodes get iPad. I got the ipad because it was so gay to get Videos on the thing. Having to convert then drag to device verse iTunes makes iTunes seem easier. Especially is JB.
Xoom =iPad none is clear winner
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So spend more money for the more restrictive device? Also, you don't have to hack the xoom. The Xoom has more option out of the box than the ipad.
You didn't manage to get gay videos on the Xoom?

Croolis said:
btw where is that price from?
when i bought mine it was closer to 600eu for wifi eu
which is why i got the us one..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's on www.expansys.com.mt, excluding VAT.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App

[Q] UK Users

I'm an iPhone 4 user who was going to buy an iPad but came across the Xoom. I want to buy it but have never used Android and am concerned about updates to the UK where I live. I would be interested in hearing from fellow UK or European users of the Xoom regarding whether its worth buying it against the benefits of an iPad 2. Cheers.

In my personal opinion, I advisebyou to buy an ipad2.
I consider myself an advanced user and had numerous smartphones with all three main OSs, I had the Xoom since launched in the UK, honestly, put aside all issues with Xoom and all 'promised' advantagrs, the screen display remains the main gactor in prefering the ipad2 over all honeycomb tablets, until you compare them head to head and if you only read/watch reviews, you might be still convinced that there is no big difference, but in reality, there is a huge difference, the ipad2 display is 10x better than the Xoom. Another najor factor is the weight and size, Xoom is much heavier and thicker. At the end of the day I believe at least in the UK, you can do with your ipad2 all what you can do with Xoom as sd and usb functionalities are not working yet and by the time they are enabled, the next generation of android tablets will be out and the next major update for ipad2 is out as well.

zoum79 said:
In my personal opinion, I advisebyou to buy an ipad2.
I consider myself an advanced user and had numerous smartphones with all three main OSs, I had the Xoom since launched in the UK, honestly, put aside all issues with Xoom and all 'promised' advantagrs, the screen display remains the main gactor in prefering the ipad2 over all honeycomb tablets, until you compare them head to head and if you only read/watch reviews, you might be still convinced that there is no big difference, but in reality, there is a huge difference, the ipad2 display is 10x better than the Xoom. Another najor factor is the weight and size, Xoom is much heavier and thicker. At the end of the day I believe at least in the UK, you can do with your ipad2 all what you can do with Xoom as sd and usb functionalities are not working yet and by the time they are enabled, the next generation of android tablets will be out and the next major update for ipad2 is out as well.
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Click to collapse
Thanks, thats really helpful. I've seen a few head to head reviews and now looked at the Android apps on the market many of which seem the same as what I've already purchased for the iphone. To be honest, I do want something different as I'm not keen on a large iphone, however, I agree, that from what I've read, the Xoom may not be worth my while in the UK. I should wait for the next generation of tablets but want something now!!

I know a guy who sent the xoom back and got an ipad2 in the UK.
i think if you have an iphone and are happy with that already you probably should get an ipad instead of an android tablet.
it's also a little sad with updates for anyone outside the US for the xoom - transformer has better update-policy it seems
to get around that you can flash the US image on (for wifi) - 3g ones take a bit more effort from what I read

Yeah I've read on the forums about flashing or rooting, which I'm assuming is another method of jailbreaking but to be honest I just want to take it out of the box and be able to receive the same as USA customers. I like the thought of being able to attach an external hard drive as I assume, this would make it easier to transfer video over as aside from comics, I want to take it on holiday in case the hotel room tv is rubbish! I'm not keen on having to convert or watch films in apples preferred format as all of my stuff is in avi.
Ive seen the Xoom online for just under £400 for 32gb and I assume the future option of a 32gb SD capability so really tempting but think I will order an ipad today or tomorrow and guess when its time to change in a few years the market will have matured a little. Thanks for your help all.

I have a nexus s so went for a xoom tablet, since you have an iPhone I would suggest you stick with an apple tablet.

Essentially the Xoom is a nice device which takes a bit of dicking about to make work the way it should. Once you've completed that process, it's probably more capable than the iPad 2, but for consumers who want something that works out the box the iPad is the better product. Android for tablets is currently where Android for phones was back in the 2.0 days.

I've got an iphone 4 and love it for being a phone.
I do love my xoom but my two biggest bug bears are 1 the screen, not so much the overall quality but the reflection from light and it just attracts finger smudges.
The second is the lack of MS Exchange support. There is nothing that comes close to the apple and microsoft usability for email and calendars. Ive tried almost every app and nothing works in the way exchange is designed to work.
Yes i love my xoom, the apps are being developed and improved daily, android is very customisable over IOS even without rooting, the tablet is great and works well with rdp apps, few good games and great fr browsing the net. The fact that someone somewhere has probably created an app for what you need (with the exception of exchange, although some of the apps may work for you). If you are looking at replicating iphone apps then you may be disappointed with some, even well known apps may have slight variations, logmein is one that has greater functionality on IOS, the ipad version is far better than the android versions.
The ipad works much better for video, like steve jobs said, why would you want to waste time re-encode video, click click and your done with ipad.
Standby battery is far better with ipad as well but constant use is on par with ipad. Find myself charging xoom every two or three days, when u was using an ipad 1 i got a week of use with breif browsing and receipt of 60 to 80 emails per day via exchange.
Need to work out what you want from the tablet. Post your uses and we can advise.
Sent from my MZ601 using XDA Premium App

ukc101 said:
I've got an iphone 4 and love it for being a phone.
I do love my xoom but my two biggest bug bears are 1 the screen, not so much the overall quality but the reflection from light and it just attracts finger smudges.
The second is the lack of MS Exchange support. There is nothing that comes close to the apple and microsoft usability for email and calendars. Ive tried almost every app and nothing works in the way exchange is designed to work.
Yes i love my xoom, the apps are being developed and improved daily, android is very customisable over IOS even without rooting, the tablet is great and works well with rdp apps, few good games and great fr browsing the net. The fact that someone somewhere has probably created an app for what you need (with the exception of exchange, although some of the apps may work for you). If you are looking at replicating iphone apps then you may be disappointed with some, even well known apps may have slight variations, logmein is one that has greater functionality on IOS, the ipad version is far better than the android versions.
The ipad works much better for video, like steve jobs said, why would you want to waste time re-encode video, click click and your done with ipad.
Standby battery is far better with ipad as well but constant use is on par with ipad. Find myself charging xoom every two or three days, when u was using an ipad 1 i got a week of use with breif browsing and receipt of 60 to 80 emails per day via exchange.
Need to work out what you want from the tablet. Post your uses and we can advise.
Sent from my MZ601 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. I think my mind is sort of made up now. I originally wanted an ipad 2 for comic reading and possibly the odd video to watch as my iphone covers off lots of stuff for apps. My brother suggested looking at alternatives as the ipad is an expensive bit of kit for what I want. To be honest, I know that whatev er I buy, I want restrict it just to comics etc and will end up using it for all and sundry.
After some research, I feel that the Xoom is the best alternative at the moment but I mistakenly thought 'other' tablets are like mini laptops but some of the base principles such as apps are the same as the ipad format although appreciate I'm being simplistic.
It feels after lots of reading what others think, that the Android market is very exciting and certainly something that I want to get into but I think the next releases will have less challenges. One thing that has interested me after reading over the last few days is the apparent 'animosity' between some Android and Apple users. I dont get it?? As someone in his early 40's I think all of this technology is exciting and I think most of what is on sale is just a matter of preference without many major differences. I think the iphone is the best phone ever, however, I'm sure if I had picked up an Android first, I would have thought otherwise!

Comparing HC devices to the ipad2

Has anyone else noticed the number of complaints about light bleeds, freezing, and glitches about the ipad 2?
I regularly run into ipad and ipad2 users and their universal attitude seems to be "my tablet is better than yours".
Isn't the ipad 2 suppose to be the perfect hardware and software integrated product?

goodintentions said:
Has anyone else noticed the number of complaints about light bleeds, freezing, and glitches about the ipad 2?
I regularly run into ipad and ipad2 users and their universal attitude seems to be "my tablet is better than yours".
Isn't the ipad 2 suppose to be the perfect hardware and software integrated product?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No idea what you're talking about, seriously. I had an iPad and now iPad 2 as well as the Iconia and love em both for their separate strengths. We have 3 ipad2's in our house and due to my job, they are stuffed to the gills with all kinds of apps and none have frozen, needed to be restarted or crashed. There have been an occasion app that has refused to load, but nothing like you are gleefully mentioning.
As for your rumor regarding screen issues, I posted something about this earlier today- http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1188841 - the iPads have consistently been the screen by which all others are compared and reports of light bleed, from what I've read, have been a rare defect.
I'm also loving my Android devices now that my Infuse is rooted (ROM is next) and my Iconia has HC3.1. There are days when I only use something running iOS for phone calls (my iPhone still has my main number). But Android it still doesn't have the polish iOS does (/ducks to avoid flames and large stones... ) which I blame more on the OEM's than the software. Android, again IMO, also doesn't have as many quality apps- game, productivity, multimedia, graphics, etc. But this is just a matter of time.
Is iOS the "perfect" blend of hardware and software? Maybe not, but IMHO, it's the closest to it for an "out of the box" experience at the moment. I'm sure with enough tweaks, ROMs and hacks, an experienced owner could create a near perfect tablet experience and while the ability to do all that is the beauty of Android, you can't expect your average user to do anything close to that.
So I don't know if your post was a troll shot and I got suckered into replying, but I guess I'm replying as an iPad and Android owner that doesn't feel like I have to boast about one product to denigrate another. Other than stating how a particular OS suits their expectations more than the other, I've never been around any iPad owners chanting about how superior their tab is, that's just ridiculous... of course all the iPad owners I know other than my son are adults...

goodintentions said:
Has anyone else noticed the number of complaints about light bleeds, freezing, and glitches about the ipad 2?
I regularly run into ipad and ipad2 users and their universal attitude seems to be "my tablet is better than yours".
Isn't the ipad 2 suppose to be the perfect hardware and software integrated product?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think some Apple folks suffer from the Dunning-Kruger effect as well as some cognitive dissonance - caused by the ADF (Apple Distortion Field).
Any and all Apple products, therefore - as superior to any competing product. Any and all Apple strategies are superior to any competing brands strategies.
Any and all Apple "stuff" is superior to any competing "stuff".
Once you understand and agree to compromise (shut yo mouth, foo!), you'll get along with them.
Now, these statements are a mixture of jokes and certain feelings I may possibly really believe .
Either way, the truth of the matter is the iPad and iPad 2 are great products. I think they are extremely thoughtfully made for better or for worse. I think they choose processes that make them great looking and 'easy'. I also think they are terrigreedy, holding back tech. and restricting certain features in order to squeeze money from customers. But give any company a chance and they'd do this - don't think it's just Apple. They are simply getting away with it, and that upsets folks.
I haven't seen many products which touch Apple quality in terms of materials they use and such. Apple's been shipping laptops with backlit keyboards for a while, look how long it took PC makers to do the same? (Granted, Apple notebooks are at a more than 70% premium, but still...nice, right?).
The light bleed may be an issue for some but think about it, most Apple users aren't doing anything to accentuate it. We're hard on our stuff! We really are. We penalize our hardware harshly, they don't (for the most part) and those that do are probably not Apple fans.
We turn lights off and make our screens pitch black in order to check for problems we wouldn't notice unless/until we search for them, they don't...they use and enjoy their stuff. While I do not agree that the iPad 2 is a BETTER device than even the A500, I do think it contains some parts that may be considered superior. That doesn't mean the competition (A500, Tab 10.1, TF) doesn't beat the pants off of the iPad 2, they in general do in terms of playing movies, games and such - but it means that a TYPICAL user will probably get 1. less heartache and 2. more enjoyment out of the iPad 2, while there's sort of a small learning curve for Android Tablets.
I hope this makes sense.
I'm a little biased, you can tell...but I'm objective enough to know good technology when I see/use it.

tazm0n said:
So I don't know if your post was a troll shot and I got suckered into replying, but I guess I'm replying as an iPad and Android owner that doesn't feel like I have to boast about one product to denigrate another.
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Click to collapse
Actually, no, it's not a troll shot. I take the train everyday to work, so I encounter quite a few ipad users on a daily basis. Even at work I run into them. There's something about the ipad that makes people want to look down on everyone who uses something else.

Neoprimal said:
I haven't seen many products which touch Apple quality in terms of materials they use and such. Apple's been shipping laptops with backlit keyboards for a while, look how long it took PC makers to do the same? (Granted, Apple notebooks are at a more than 70% premium, but still...nice, right?).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I mean, no, not really. I HAVE a macbook, and don't care about, nor will look for a backlit kb on my next laptop... The mofo has also developed an annoying problem where it seems to see phantom touchpad presses and repositions my cursor at random.

I've the Iconia and the original iPad.
If I didn't have 'weird' requirements from a tablet, which are:
Connect a KB/Mouse for RDP
Use Bittorrent client (for legit purposes of course!!!)
... I would use the ipad every single time.
IMO, it's just a much much much nicer experience to use. Now, don't bother contradicting me on that. It's MY opinion and it's MY experience.
It's just smoother, nicer, better apps and the tablet itself is nicer (esp the iPad 2 which I have access to at work).
I've been thinking recently tho.. what I really want is a 13.3" Windows 8 tablet with Tegra 3, full size USB/HDMI, and something like a retina display and be same weight/thickness as iPad2.
Then I can ditch my laptop which I really only use to play Windows only games.
I also want 13.3" cos 10" is too small to work on all day long and I hate my work desk cluttered by a big fat clunky external screen. Just waiting for those transparent displays like u get in Avatar.
Windows 8 so I can install Diablo 3 on it when it comes out. Or OSX or whatever since I guess D3 will be out on Mac as well.
All I want is one all-encompassing device (and by the time D3 comes out, that shouldn't be too hard....)

MrBoingy said:
... I would use the ipad every single time.
IMO, it's just a much much much nicer experience to use. Now, don't bother contradicting me on that. It's MY opinion and it's MY experience.
It's just smoother, nicer, better apps and the tablet itself is nicer (esp the iPad 2 which I have access to at work).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not trying to argue against you, but thought I'd just offer my personal view on that too, since I have experience on both devices too. I have an Ipad and the Iconia in my home as well, my wife has the iPad2 and I have this tab. Before I got the tab, she used to have the original iPad, and I used it quite a bit...she upgraded to the 2 around the time when I got my toy, after which I've barely touched the iPad2.
Now, I really like the iPad - I really do. When we just had that, I used it all the time (too much according to my wife ). It's snappy, clear to use, simple...nice device, I really like it for very basic stuff.
However, when that was the only tablet thing we had, I had to use my laptop/desktop much more than I do now, I felt like it was "too basic" for my needs. I didn't use to think I go to many flash sites, but I guess I do...there were plenty of things that just didn't work with the Safari, unfortunately. Plus the whole media experience is completely different, with the iPad I never watched anything since I just couldn't...it supported absolutely nothing of my current video collection, nothing works, everything should've been re-encoded and somehow (itunes I guess) brought into the iPad, which I didn't want to bother with - I have my setup and there are plenty of standards to go with how I access my stuff (DLNA, SMB, etc.), I didn't want to bend over backwards to redo everything. And now, with my Iconia, I can stream vidoes of whatever format from my home server, copy files by plugging in the USB or using samba etc. all sorts of options for that. So to me, the Iconia / HC tabs are clearly more useful than the iPad, the Android tablet is more of a computer in that way, it works with my existing network, just plugs into it. So yeah, I prefer it. Greatly. And even physically, I have to say I prefer the Iconia now...the 4:3 aspect ration on the iPad just looks wrong now.
But anyway, not trying to argue, just offering my views on the two devices. Like you, I see good points in both, but I'd say I strongly prefer the Android tablets for the more "computer-like" power they have and the way they interact with the existing setup I have.

What to buy: New ipad vs tab 7.7

Hey guys i m in a big trouble.I cant decide what to buy
After searching the whole market according to me the two best tablets are tab 7.7 and new ipad.And the below points are my liking,
NEW ipad:
1.Retina display
2.5mp camera
3.ios
tab 7.7:
1.superamoled plus(I am crazy about this display)
2.form factor
Its a kind of battle between my brain vs my heart.My brain keeps on saying to me that new ipad is the one u need but my heart opposes that and says that u cant live without that gorgeous samoled plus screen
I am not starting a war between the ios vs android, but i found the ios better suited for me, YES i love the customisation,multitasking,widgets,live wallpapers in short the freedom of android but i love more the fluidity of ios despite i hate that itunes
According to me everything goes against the tab 7.7 except that gorgeous screen but that too is faulty.I know about those horrible burn in issues of samoled screen.After searching xda,even i found more issues like dark circles,uneven brightness etc.
On other hands,the new ipad has a retina display which is not better than samoled plus IMO but its still better than the others display,a slim body(though a bit bigger than ipad2),butter smooth ios,twice apps than android that too optimised for tablet's big screen and a better camera too! !
One more thing is this that i love bigger screen ,because according to me a tablet is fully enjoyable only when its around 10inch IMO,agin on ipad side.
From my chilhood i have been listening to my heart most of the time, so here are my options:
1.Buy galaxy tab 7.7 and live with that small faulty but gorgeous screen
2.buy a new ipad with large retina display and a galaxy note too(because i cant live without samoled plus), which will obviously tends to be a big hole in my pocket.
So guys plz put some light on my problem,
thanks in advance . . . . . .

My suggestion; if you own a lot of ios devices, buy the Ipad. If not, and you enjoy android and the form factor of the 7.7, buy that. I have an ios device in a sea of android devices and its a pain to make the ios device work with the others. Personally, I regret buying apple, but that is no reason for you to base a decision on.
Sent from my GT-P6810 using Tapatalk

if your gonna use the device for gaming go for ipad the ios really has more games but if your into viewing movies or reading comics or ebooks go for the 7.7 tab nothing as i have seen on a phone or a tablet can beat the screen
and ios really is crappy when playing videos not encoded thru itunes XD and android has a full arsenal of video players ranging from sw or hw decoding to suite your taste it also plays mkv with subtitles
another note also really hate how you always need itunes to sync files and the tab has a microsd card and can use flashdrive if you use the connection kit another + for android

geogetski666 said:
and ios really is crappy when playing videos not encoded thru itunes XD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not true, AVplayerHD works great on iOS and has played all of my MKV's so far with out issues, no need to re-encode anything unless you really want to save on file size.

Reading your pros/cons, there is no "real" reason for you to buy a Tab7.7.
I previously hated the Tab7.7, but configuring it a bit and using another launcher, I now love it! I won't compare these two anyways. It's a totally different use case. iPad has nearly twice the size and weight. Yes, iOS is more solid/fluid and has more optimized software, but Android is developing fast and there is sooo much more freedom and possibilities with it that I personally won't buy an iPad.
If you are a user and just want to use it, go for an iPad. If you want to "play" with it, go for the Tab. If it just depends on screen size, there are a lot more 10.1 tablets out there (the Asus Prime is great and a new HD version is also coming soon). So, yes, it is a decision between Android and iOS, not only hardware. And accoding to Amoled - it is great for viewing videos, but personally I don't like the oversaturated colors...

the tab is a beautiful device from the build quality to the super amoled screen but i cant live without both of them, android and ios work harmoniously in my ecosystem.
But every time i need to browse the web it's always the ipad i'm grabbing even if it does't have the flash capability html5 is almost everywhere now .

BOWO...
Ipad 3 is better on all aspects on my opinion BUT ONE! The size-factor!
If you want it to be mobile go with the 7.7... the best 7"er there is atm.
I take my tablet anywhere... I actually put it in my pocket and use it as my mobile phone as well... I usually wear jeans or some trousers so... It does get a lot of attention when I put it to my ear as I get a phone call... but ohh well...
That's just my 2 dimes

I've owned 3 ipads and now have the iPad2. I recently looked at tab 7.7 and I fell in love. I have an android phone. I love android os and love my iPad. If you don't have an iPad you would probably get more with it than the tab, but don't settle get both. I know I am
Sent from my ADR6400L using xda premium

One more killer feature, for some, is the tab is a pretty good if ridiculous phone. Unlike the 7.7, which was only a speaker phone, it had a speaker and microphone in the normal position.
I would also argue that Swype makes the tab more productive, in a pinch. I'm not saying you'll want to write power point presentations with it but you can. I have and it wasn't the worst experience.
Sent from my GT-P6800 using Tapatalk

EarlZ said:
Not true, AVplayerHD works great on iOS and has played all of my MKV's so far with out issues, no need to re-encode anything unless you really want to save on file size.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
my bad i didn't know that ios has those layers now it has been years since i last touched an ios product hehe
before i was watching mkv already on my nexus and the ipad and ipod touch still has those crappy players that won't even load mkv files hehe
but i still hate apple for not including a microsd slot and the connectivity kit that phones now are having also that horrid itunes sync XD

Please, let the apple be
Even if there is the same hardware, ios and android are completely incompatible..... it is not about hardware but about philosophy
If you like democracy and want to adjust your tablet, buy android
If you like to be led by anyone and don't need to adjust your tablet and look stylish than buy ios. And of course if you dont want to have widgets, buy ios.
But really I really can't imagine to live without widgets....there is year 2012, not time for windows desktop from 1995

My experience
I had the iPad 2 and loved it but found myself allways bringing my laptop with me aswell becouse there is a lot of things in relation to work where i often felt iOS is way to restricted (unless you JB it and uses a lot of ninja tricks all the time)
Now i have the 7.7 and in the beginning i was a little disapointed with the lacking and smoothesness in the OS but after having used a litte time getting to know it and configuring it for my needs and wants i absolutely love it.
Everyday I encounter new things i can just do rigth away instead of having to breake or get around a restriction first.
The formfactor, size and screen is just another thing that makes it so much more handy and right for me.
My biggest advice is that you give it at real chance if you should choose to try the 7.7

GadgetMe said:
The formfactor, size and screen is just another thing that makes it so much more handy and right for me.[emphasis added]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I feel that this really captures the essence of the issue. What's right for you? The differences have already been highlighted, which I review in order of importance to me:
1. iOS vs. Android: no religious wars, please, we all understand this one
2. 9.7" vs 7.7": do you want more real estate or more portability?
3. High-res IPS LCD vs. SAMOLED+: do you prefer more resolution and mature technology, or do you prefer black blacks, more saturated colors, and faster response time?
It's just a matter of weighing those three points. I do think it's unfortunate that if you prefer the larger form factor but the beauty of OLED, there is no option for that. Personally I am squarely in the 7.7 camp for all three points, but obviously this is something everyone needs to evaluate for themselves.

Apple devices are great. They have the best build quality (I mean the body is actually CNC machined out of a slab of billet aluminum, not a plastic body with a thin piece of aluminum sheet metal glued on). The apps are the best on Apple, after all App is the first part of their name! Where it all falls apart are no memory cards for expansion, little to no control over the GUI, no direct drag and drop, and the worst of all you MUST install and use iTunes for everything.... Grr. For some that may not be a big deal but for me it was so annoying that I finally dumped the ipad. I am not sure why but I loathed itunes with the heat of a thousand suns.

Buy both and be happy... I just got the new iPad and browsing is so pleasurable with the text being so clear.
The 7.7 is awesome In its own accord being so portable and android.
The new iPad is cool in its own rights.
Sent from my New iPad

copualt3 said:
Buy both and be happy... I just got the new iPad and browsing is so pleasurable with the text being so clear.
The 7.7 is awesome In its own accord being so portable and android.
The new iPad is cool in its own rights.
Sent from my New iPad
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1, really depends on what you want/need, both products are geat!

i've owned the touchpad and the 7.7 and really it comes purely down to form factor, what you use it for, and the OS.
i personally find 10.1 and 9.7 form factor too big to be hauling around.
one thing that a lot of people don't mention is that the super amoled screens absorb a lot of reflectivity. One thing i cant stand about almost every tablet out there is that i can see myself in the screen almost constantly. if you are going to get a device for video watching, i would say go with the 7.7 without a doubt...as soon as that screen lights up, most reflections dissipate.

I think the biggest consideration between new Ipad and 7.7 is a phone feature.. if you wanna has call function go with 7.7 because Ipad cant do unless skype and also size i found 7.7 is compact and easy to carry maximum portability while you got tablet sized + Micro SD expansion & USB FD
for me between iOS and Android i prefer android because you can made it custom for your need even you can remove original "junk" apps, if you still doubt better go to the shop and try the demo for each tablet see which better for you

Got both and i'm happy I'm a proud android and iOS fanboy !

I had the original iPad for two years, and just chose the Tab 7.7 over the new iPad. For me the screen wasn't the clincher (both are great), but instead it is all about two things:
1. Screen size -- the Tab's screen is the perfect size for me. I read a lot on my tablet and the iPad is too big for an ebook reader.
2. The Tab is also a phone. Get the 3G model and you have an all in one device. Instead of carrying around a tablet and a phone, now I just carry the tab and a Bluetooth headset.
These two differences are BIG.
Chris

Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 vs Window based Tablet experience

I have been a pen/tablet enthusiastic for many years and have owned (and still own) loads of tablet over the years. I currently own and use 4 window based pen-tablets (2 XP, 1 Vista, and 1 Window 7), 2 iPads, 2 iPod touch, Apple Macbook Pro (2009), Apple Macbook Air 13" (2012), Samsung Galaxy Note 5.3, and then the latest Galaxy Note 10.1. I also used to own loads of Window powered PDAs, palm, casio, etc.
As you can see for the list above, I have been looking for the perfect computing experience, especially the pen/tablet experience. I bought the Note 10.1 because of my Note 5.3. IMHO, the Note 10.1 is a decent pen-tablet, and it had made vast improvement over the Ntoe 5.3 in terms of hardware. However, it is the software where I feel is limiting the Note 10.1 from being a perfect pen-tablet machine.
People have already disregard the window based PC as being a serious tablet and they are rightfully so. The XP, Vista, and Window 7 while can be used to run as a tablet, have never been designed for tablet. So my experience with them have always been frustrating. HOWEVER, it was a pleasant surprise to me when I loaded the release preview of Window 8 few weeks ago onto 3 of my old Window tablets.
I have a Samsung Q1UP (6 year old, XP, w/resistive pen, 2GB ram, 64GB SSD), a HP 2710P (4 years old, w/Wavcom pen, 1GB ram, 80GB HDD), an ACER W500 (2 year old, w/touch pen, 2GB ram, 32GB SDD), and when loaded with the Window 8, all 3 machines even though are old have given me a VERY good pen/tablet experience. All 3 tablets now run much faster and very very smooth. The surprise comes when all these tablets are now running more like an Andriod/IOS instead of a typical window os. You can smoothly scroll, zoom, etc just like an iPad or Galaxy Note. The battery life seems to have improved in all these machines, and the time from sleep to logon screen is about 2-3 seconds. Loading programs used to take forever under the old OS, but now I can load excel, word, one-note, etc from cold in about 2 seconds.
Now to the most important part, the pen use with Window 8. The handwriting recognition is much better and faster than the Note 10.1 (for all 3 devices with the resistive pen, wavcom pen, and touch pen). The S-Note in the Note 10.1 is just a tiny program, but the One-Note is a full blown application with seamless integration with Office and Sky Drive, etc.
With the new tablets coming designed specifically with Window 8 in mind, I think Microsoft has risen the par on tablet competition. As the upcoming Samsung Series 5 hybrid tablet, for example, is coming with a $650 based price, 11 hrs battery life (with the optional keyboard), 750g weight, and can run all window software. Even though I have not seen, touch or used one of these new machines, the fact that Window 8 has turned my 6 years old tablet into a brand new machine is exciting for me.
Please don't get me wrong. I think the Samsung Note 10.1 is a decent machine which I will definitely keep. I bought it because I can carry it all day and not worry about battery, and I hardly need to run any PC applications these days when I am out. More importantly if I plan to use the PC all day, I probably need to bring the charger with me which will bring the weight up to 1kg or more. Since I carry my camera with me all day, the Note 10.1 is a better choice for me.
However, if you are looking into serious note taking and also need to run pc applications, I think the Window 8 tablets may be a good alternative. We will all know if this is true when the machines are officially announced in late Oct.
PS: I am in absolutely no way affiliated with any of the companies mentioned about, I am just giving my take on using all these devices over the years.

Good post.
What's your take on the new slate 5 vs surface pro?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Well you are comparing apples and oranges and also making the logical fallacy that just because you like something others will as well. Based upon your large collection of tablets, price is not a big issue for you. You just want the best tablet experience, period. Thats all good, but the majority of buyers don't share your enthusiasm.
Keep in mind that most people think of their tablets as an accessory and not a primary computing device. As soon as you get much above the $500 price point you are getting into primary computing device territory. But with an 11.6 inch screen, tablets do not offer enough real estate to be an ultrabook replacement, especially for a business person running larger format legacy corporate software. I would go blind trying to read my company's database forms on an 11.6 inch HD screen - they cant just be resized as a Word document can be.
Also, will most business people think touch and pen input are worth trading in their 15 inch ultrabook screens for? I have been using Office for 20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen. Office needs two things - lots of screens space and a mouse, a W8 Tablet offers neither.
Samsung makes a good profit on the SGN10.1. They could easily drop the price another $50 and still make money. In addition, one would assume that Samsung will be updating the SGN10.1 to the Note 2.0 software which is far far superior. Whereas W8 is a bit of a lumbering behemoth that will take years to see any major upgrades, Android can change and improve quickly. Also Android is far more customizable. Dont forget that word on the street is Windows 8 as a true desktop OS sucks and wont see broad corporate acceptance.
So you have to ask yourself, will the market as a whole be ready to pay 30% more for a device that does a lot of things (touch and pen) on a Windows device they may not need? Don't forget that we are already competing with very good 7 inch tablets that cost less than a third the price of the new W8 tablets.
Windows 8 tablets will be stuck in the middle. Too expensive for the casual user and too small for the serious user. When it comes to tablets most people want one that costs the least and does the job well enough. Think of it like cars. They sell a lot more Ford Focuses than Porsche 911's. The Porsche is a better car but the Ford just does the job for less. SGN10.1 will continue to be the cheapest usable pen input large format tablet on the market for the foreseeable future. It may not work quite as well as the W8 tablet but it works well enough for 1/3 less.
The good news is the competition will force Android to be better but no, I think Android has got little to worry about from Windows 8.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2

My point is that pound for pound, at least with the Samsung units, you will pay signficantly more for the same level of tablet, even the RT. As a matter of fact the W8 RT offering from Samsung will be slightly worse than the SGN10.1 since the screen is larger with roughly the same resolution. If you dont like the SGN10.1 screen youll hate the W8 RT screen.
For me at least, the primary benefit of Windows over Android is Office programs like Access. Word and Excel are emulated on Android just fine. I dont believe W8 RT will even run Access and if it does I believe the screen is too small to use it effectively with forms designed for a larger screen.
Again, what is the benefit to the consumer of using touch with Office? There is none. So you are trading in a big screen that you do need for touch that you dont.
Tablets are not laptop replacements and if you price them like one you are going to have a problem. They need to be priced like an accessory. Right now at least, Android does that better at the SGN10.1 price. Even $500 is close to being too high.
My conclusion is that W8 Tablets will be too much for a tablet and do too little to replace a laptop. Just my opinion. It may sell gangbusters but I dont think so. We'll have to wait and see. Nevertheless, its presence in the marketpalce will make Android products better
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2

mitchellvii said:
Well you are comparing apples and oranges and also making the logical fallacy that just because you like something others will as well. Based upon your large collection of tablets, price is not a big issue for you. You just want the best tablet experience, period. Thats all good, but the majority of buyers don't share your enthusiasm.
Keep in mind that most people think of their tablets as an accessory and not a primary computing device. As soon as you get much above the $500 price point you are getting into primary computing device territory. But with an 11.6 inch screen, tablets do not offer enough real estate to be an ultrabook replacement, especially for a business person running larger format legacy corporate software. I would go blind trying to read my company's database forms on an 11.6 inch HD screen - they cant just be resized as a Word document can be.
Also, will most business people think touch and pen input are worth trading in their 15 inch ultrabook screens for? I have been using Office for 20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen. Office needs two things - lots of screens space and a mouse, a W8 Tablet offers neither.
Samsung makes a good profit on the SGN10.1. They could easily drop the price another $50 and still make money. In addition, one would assume that Samsung will be updating the SGN10.1 to the Note 2.0 software which is far far superior. Whereas W8 is a bit of a lumbering behemoth that will take years to see any major upgrades, Android can change and improve quickly. Also Android is far more customizable. Dont forget that word on the street is Windows 8 as a true desktop OS sucks and wont see broad corporate acceptance.
So you have to ask yourself, will the market as a whole be ready to pay 30% more for a device that does a lot of things (touch and pen) on a Windows device they may not need? Don't forget that we are already competing with very good 7 inch tablets that cost less than a third the price of the new W8 tablets.
Windows 8 tablets will be stuck in the middle. Too expensive for the casual user and too small for the serious user. When it comes to tablets most people want one that costs the least and does the job well enough. Think of it like cars. They sell a lot more Ford Focuses than Porsche 911's. The Porsche is a better car but the Ford just does the job for less. SGN10.1 will continue to be the cheapest usable pen input large format tablet on the market for the foreseeable future. It may not work quite as well as the W8 tablet but it works well enough for 1/3 less.
The good news is the competition will force Android to be better but no, I think Android has got little to worry about from Windows 8.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WOW!! I wished someone had warned me about troll living here and that no comments other than good Note 10.1 comments are allowed in this forum. This will be my last post in the forum, leaving you alone to harass other people.
The observation in my original post is based on actual experience. Yours seemed to be based on pure speculations and imaginations. I truly doubt you have similar experience before making your comments. I welcome you to try them first and proof me wrong, or stop making illogical fallacy.
1. I read many of the owners who bought the Note 10.1 because of the S-Pen. Some owners even suggested potential buyers to look elsewhere if they are purely looking for an Android tablet as there are better alternatives out there. At present, only the Note 10.1 and Window tablets offer pens experience, so I don’t understand why you think it is an apple to orange comparison.
2. When I composed the list of devices I own, I was hoping to give some background on the wide variety of devices/OS I have used, so that I can make my points. But you turned it into a show-off list.
3. You mentioned “…20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen”, then you went to buy the Note 10.1 and other touch devices, interesting!
4. The ACER W500 Win 7 tablet I bought 2 years ago brand new was $550 then (the Note 10.1 is about the same price range). The hardware was mediocre at the time, and it sucked with Win 7. I was amused how Window 8 has turned it into a very respectable tablet, with very fast and accurate hand writing recognition, and good note experience with One-Note, then further suggested today’s hardware could only do better. You turned it into a Ford and Porsche comparison. I bet you had never owned a Porsche before, so it is a mood point arguing with you here.
5. You must be the CFO of Samsung as you knew how much profit they are making on the SGN10.1, and can easily drop the price by another $50. BTW, Samsung also makes the upcoming Window 8 tablet with MSRP of $649 and respectable hardware (S-PEN, 11.6” , 1366 x 768, 2GB Ram, 9 hrs battery life, 750g, and 64GB SSD http://www.engadget.com/2012/08/29/samsung-announces-series-5-slate-series-7-slate/). Based on your insider knowledge, Samsung could also easily drop the price by another $50 for the Window tablet. Then there are other tablets makers that produce cheaper devices.
6. I had never once suggested Window 8 will take over Android or even compete with it, so I think you are making your comments based on illusion.
Best wishes!

Lol, i guess your definition of "troll"is anyone who disagrees with you? You come to the SGN10.1 Forum announcing that our tablet is "just ok" while the W8 tablets will be the Second Coming and you don't expect any pushback?
I made the argument that the W8 tablets will have a difficult time finding their place in a competitive market. Many pundits online agree with me. Too expensive for a tablet, too small for a laptop. You imply that I said you were bragging about all your tablets. I simply said that you were concerned more about performance than price. How did you get from that that i said you were bragging?
As far as knowing the Samsung can cut the price of the SGN10.1 and still make money that is a well established fact. Google is your friend.
Oh well, if you must leave I am sorry. Im sure there is someone in here that will miss you praising the W8 tablets and putting down the SGN10.1.
P.S. Actually I am a BMW man myself. The center console on Porsche is too wide and presses against my shin because I am tall. The Ford/Porsche comparison was an attempt to compare a tool which can do the job at a lower cost vs one that offers good things but perhaps things that cost conscious people dont need.
Touch with Office is a perfect example of this. Why does anyone need touch with Office? Id rather have a 15 inch screen.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2
---------- Post added at 10:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:34 AM ----------
For those who feel, as the OP does, that I am pulling my concerns about W8 Tablets from my backside, here is a quote from PCWorld Magazine:
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscent..._8_tablets_have_what_it_takes_to_succeed.html
There are a number of issues that could make Windows 8 tablets dead on arrival, or at least a very tough sell. Two of the biggest will be price, and confusion over differences between Windows on ARM (WOA) tablets, and x86/x64 architecture tablets.
ARM-based devices will probably be better tablets than their x86/x64 counterparts. WOA tablets will most likely be lighter, cooler, have longer battery life, and--most importantly--be cheaper. ARM-based tablets will be more on par with the competing tablets already in the market like the iPad, Motorola Xoom, Samsung Galaxy Tab, and others.
That all sounds great, but WOA tablets also come with significant handicaps that nullify most of what makes a Windows 8 tablet appealing. For example, WOA tablets can’t run traditional Windows software--they require apps written for the Metro UI.
Wes Miller from GetWired.com and Directions on Microsoft poses the question, “For enterprises who will have to rewrite their (non-Web) applications in Metro for WOA anyway, the question comes up, "why wouldn't I rewrite it for iOS instead?", since there is no way to run non-Microsoft Win32 apps on WOA.”
The bigger issue for WOA tablets is that Microsoft has revealed they are intended for “unmanaged environments”. What that translates to is that WOA tablets will not be able to connect to Windows domains and be managed like x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets, and other Windows systems.
Amobi says that there are arguments to be made for and against WOA tablets, and it’s still too early for a final verdict. But, he stresses, “If they cant join domains--game over.”
No worries. We still have x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets to fall back on, right? True, but there are some caveats.
An x86/x64 tablet is just squeezing a notebook or desktop into a touchscreen, flat-panel form factor. That has advantages, but we also know that running Windows takes a fair amount of processing horsepower and memory. While it may be possible to run Windows 8 with less RAM, 4GB is probably the minimum for acceptable performance. That is four times what most ARM tablets use.
When you build a tablet on x86/x64 architecture, and try to beef up the RAM to deliver adequate performance, the tablet starts to face other issues. As previously mentioned, users want tablets that are thin, light, and have endurance to last all day on a single charge. It is unlikely that x86/x64 tablets can truly compete with ARM-based rivals in these areas.
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As I have stated, W8 Tablets will be stuck in the middle. RT too underpowered to run true Windows software and Pro too small to run true Windows software properly.
DOA.
Hopefully these facts have taken some of the emotion out of this argument.

What the heck OP, please respond to my original question!
New slate 5 vs surface pro. Based on your experience, should we (consumers) wait for the SP release before purchasing.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

mitchellvii, you are assuming too much and treating your "opinion" as the gospel truth.
Have you used OneNote on a tablet computer? S-Note is the extremely light version of OneNote when it comes to note-taking (not doodling or sketching, etc). It is certain that it will get better over time, but the current/first generation is a good introduction to what it can do in the future.
From drawing and sketching point of view, I can make the same argument that you are making for Office and touch. Note 10.1 most likely won't replace anyone's Wacom tablet to produce art on a 10.1" screen. With the same perspective as yours, this falls right in the middle: not enough for professionals and little more than people who aren't into drawing/sketching necessarily.
Just like the OP, I'm not putting down the Note 10.1; I'm actually waiting for the UPS truck to bring a 32GB version today. However, you don't have to blindly defend it when an alternative view is presented. Just embrace the fact that for every device with additional features (e.g., being able to run OneNote and a full OS on a tablet), there's a segment out there. If you are outside of that segment or find some of those features not very useful for your way of using a tablet, it's perfectly fine, as long as you realize the advantages and disadvantages of each device with an open mind.

tenderidol said:
mitchellvii, you are assuming too much and treating your "opinion" as the gospel truth.
Have you used OneNote on a tablet computer? S-Note is the extremely light version of OneNote when it comes to note-taking (not doodling or sketching, etc). It is certain that it will get better over time, but the current/first generation is a good introduction to what it can do in the future.
From drawing and sketching point of view, I can make the same argument that you are making for Office and touch. Note 10.1 most likely won't replace anyone's Wacom tablet to produce art on a 10.1" screen. With the same perspective as yours, this falls right in the middle: not enough for professionals and little more than people who aren't into drawing/sketching necessarily.
Just like the OP, I'm not putting down the Note 10.1; I'm actually waiting for the UPS truck to bring a 32GB version today. However, you don't have to blindly defend it when an alternative view is presented. Just embrace the fact that for every device with additional features (e.g., being able to run OneNote and a full OS on a tablet), there's a segment out there. If you are outside of that segment or find some of those features not very useful for your way of using a tablet, it's perfectly fine, as long as you realize the advantages and disadvantages of each device with an open mind.
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The OP said:
"Please don't get me wrong. I think the Samsung Note 10.1 is a decent machine which I will definitely keep."
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Nice of him to let us know our SGN10.1 is "a decent machine" (compared to the glowing oracle of W8). I consider that a put-down.
"Blindly defending"? As in, just making up stuff you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.

mitchellvii said:
The OP said:
Nice of him to let us know our SGN10.1 is "a decent machine" (compared to the glowing oracle of W8). I consider that a put-down.
"Blindly defending"? As in, "just making up stuff" you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
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You really must love the Note 10.1 like your significant other. Calling it a "decent machine" is an insult? As I mentioned above, keep an open mind, and you'll be able to see the strengths and the weaknesses of each device.

mitchellvii said:
The OP said:
Nice of him to let us know our SGN10.1 is "a decent machine" (compared to the glowing oracle of W8). I consider that a put-down.
"Blindly defending"? As in, just making up stuff you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
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Yes you are. You posted an article filled with opinions from Mar and think that these are facts. They are not.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app

mitchellvii said:
"Blindly defending"? As in, just making up stuff you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
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So, stating someone else's opinion is a fact, now? Got it! Let me find that Verge review and link it here as the "fact" about Note 10.1.
Again... I purchased the damn thing and will be using it to its full potential. However, unlike you, I'll keep an open mind and try the Samsung Smart PC offerings (specifically the Series 5). If it performs well, it'll replace the Note 10.1 (or I may keep both, since they serve different functions); if not, I'll continue to use it happily.

tenderidol said:
Have you used OneNote on a tablet computer? S-Note is the extremely light version of OneNote when it comes to note-taking (not doodling or sketching, etc). It is certain that it will get better over time, but the current/first generation is a good introduction to what it can do in the future.
From drawing and sketching point of view, I can make the same argument that you are making for Office and touch. Note 10.1 most likely won't replace anyone's Wacom tablet to produce art on a 10.1" screen. With the same perspective as yours, this falls right in the middle: not enough for professionals and little more than people who aren't into drawing/sketching necessarily.
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Three things are missing from this conversation to make it worthwhile.
1) Everyone uses their tablets differently. A gamer, heavy productivity user, graphic artist, reader, and someone who uses it primarily for consumption all have different needs. And someone's personal weighting of those things determine which product is "best" for them. I could easily see someone needing OneNote (and MS Office in general) jumping on W8 just for that. Same thing for a graphic artist who wants access to desktop versions of tools they typically use. How many of them there are and how well W8 tablets do more pedestrian things will determine their success, not our discussion.
2) We're comparing something that doesn't exist to something that does. Unless you all intend to go out and buy an Acer W500 with 4 hours of battery life and that weighs two pounds this is at best a theoretical conversation until actual W8 tablets are in people's hands and can be evaluated in real-world use. And don't forget the Pro tablets come with all the stuff we love about Windows: 1) driver incompatibilities, 2) control panel, and 3) multiple menus, clicks, and "enters," to launch or access something. The UI formally known as Metro doesn't hide the fact that there's a huge resource intensive hulk of an OS to be tamed running in the background. How many general-use iPad candidates do you think will find that acceptable? And they’re MS’s bogie, not the 20% of the tablet market that’s using Android.
3) Until the complete feature set is known for both RT and Pro tablets and what apps will be available to them initially you can't have a price-value conversation. I highly doubt entry-level consumer targeted RT tablets will do some of things being discussed. Similarly if a loaded Pro tablet is $1K that changes the conversation when comparing it to a $500 Android tablet.
I'll check back in with you guys once the tablets are in people's hands for a while and then we can have a legitimate conversation of the pros and cons of each.
BTW, here's an excerpt of a review of the HP TouchPad when it was first released. Just because a monolithic company launches something its success isn't guaranteed. It’s too early to say whether W8 tablets will be a Zune or an XBox 360 for MS and no one here can do anything but proffer an opinion as to which way it will go.
"You would almost think that webOS had been designed for tablets from the very beginning. It feels more native to tablets than any other software on any other tablet, despite being an almost exact translation of the phone interface (minus almost all of the bezel gestures). Multitasking on anything else feels almost stupid compared to Cards. An open app is a card. You can stack them, sort them, re-arrange them, and when you're done, close them. Juggling a bunch makes you feel like you're getting stuff done. Palm's big tablet adaptation, panes, is a straight riff on the iPad Twitter UI. So in email and other complex apps, you slide layers—inboxes, message lists, actual messages—back and forth to move between them. Notifications, which pop down from the top of the scree, let you flip through the pile, one at a time, without ever opening the app-handy if you get IMs from five different people. They're great ideas."

BarryH_GEG said:
Three things are missing from this conversation to make it worthwhile.
1) Everyone uses their tablets differently. A gamer, heavy productivity user, graphic artist, reader, and someone who uses it primarily for consumption all have different needs. And someone's personal weighting of those things determine which product is "best" for them. I could easily see someone needing OneNote (and MS Office in general) jumping on W8 just for that. Same thing for a graphic artist who wants access to desktop versions of tools they typically use. How many of them there are and how well W8 tablets do more pedestrian things will determine their success, not our discussion.
2) We're comparing something that doesn't exist to something that does. Unless you all intend to go out and buy an Acer W500 with 4 hours of battery life and that weighs two pounds this is at best a theoretical conversation until actual W8 tablets are in people's hands and can be evaluated in real-world use. And don't forget the Pro tablets come with all the stuff we love about Windows: 1) driver incompatibilities, 2) control panel, and 3) multiple menus, clicks, and "enters," to launch or access something. The UI formally known as Metro doesn't hide the fact that there's a huge resource intensive hulk of an OS to be tamed running in the background. How many general-use iPad candidates do you think will find that acceptable? And they’re MS’s bogie, not the 20% of the tablet market that’s using Android.
3) Until the complete feature set is known for both RT and Pro tablets and what apps will be available to them initially you can't have a price-value conversation. I highly doubt entry-level consumer targeted RT tablets will do some of things being discussed. Similarly if a loaded Pro tablet is $1K that changes the conversation when comparing it to a $500 Android tablet.
I'll check back in with you guys once the tablets are in people's hands for a while and then we can have a legitimate conversation of the pros and cons of each.
BTW, here's an excerpt of a review of the HP TouchPad when it was first released. Just because a monolithic company launches something its success isn't guaranteed. It’s too early to say whether W8 tablets will be a Zune or an XBox 360 for MS and no one here can do anything but proffer an opinion as to which way it will go.
"You would almost think that webOS had been designed for tablets from the very beginning. It feels more native to tablets than any other software on any other tablet, despite being an almost exact translation of the phone interface (minus almost all of the bezel gestures). Multitasking on anything else feels almost stupid compared to Cards. An open app is a card. You can stack them, sort them, re-arrange them, and when you're done, close them. Juggling a bunch makes you feel like you're getting stuff done. Palm's big tablet adaptation, panes, is a straight riff on the iPad Twitter UI. So in email and other complex apps, you slide layers—inboxes, message lists, actual messages—back and forth to move between them. Notifications, which pop down from the top of the scree, let you flip through the pile, one at a time, without ever opening the app-handy if you get IMs from five different people. They're great ideas."
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With the exception of one person, we are all on the same page here. Below is an excerpt from the OP. To me, it overlaps very well with your points and my argument. Somehow, this was turned into "How dare you put down Note10.1? Windows 8 tablets are DOA!" bickery.
With the new tablets coming designed specifically with Window 8 in mind, I think Microsoft has risen the par on tablet competition. As the upcoming Samsung Series 5 hybrid tablet, for example, is coming with a $650 based price, 11 hrs battery life (with the optional keyboard), 750g weight, and can run all window software. Even though I have not seen, touch or used one of these new machines, the fact that Window 8 has turned my 6 years old tablet into a brand new machine is exciting for me.
Please don't get me wrong. I think the Samsung Note 10.1 is a decent machine which I will definitely keep. I bought it because I can carry it all day and not worry about battery, and I hardly need to run any PC applications these days when I am out. More importantly if I plan to use the PC all day, I probably need to bring the charger with me which will bring the weight up to 1kg or more. Since I carry my camera with me all day, the Note 10.1 is a better choice for me.
However, if you are looking into serious note taking and also need to run pc applications, I think the Window 8 tablets may be a good alternative. We will all know if this is true when the machines are officially announced in late Oct.
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[email protected] said:
WOW!! I wished someone had warned me about troll living here and that no comments other than good Note 10.1 comments are allowed in this forum. This will be my last post in the forum, leaving you alone to harass other people.
Best wishes!
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[email protected], welcome. Sorry about the resident W8 Hater. I recommend to just ignore him.
Thank you for sharing your experience with your Note(s) and your tablets with Windows 8! My experience with my Note 10.1 is pretty much the same as yours. I am really looking forward to trying out a Surface Pro or one of the other new W8 tablets that are coming out. Your post has just seriously reinforced that!
When you use One Note on a tablet, does it give you inking features for drawing pictures and hand writing notes similar to what S-Note does? I have W8 and One Note, but no Ink-enabled device to put them on to play with it myself.

tenderidol said:
With the exception of one person, we are all on the same page here.
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Who are "we?" I have no idea what everyone here's needs are. I also have no idea what the "cons" are going to be that will without doubt go along with the rosy PR blurb “pros” being thrown out. I'm in marketing so perhaps I'm less susceptible to spin than some of you guys because I create it. MS lost their way and have a bunch of simultaneous "Hail Mary's" launching concurrently (Cloud, W8 the OS, and W8 the tablet). I wish them nothing but the best. But I'd like to see some traction gained before drinking their Kool-Aid and declaring their success. And that will take months to realize. I'm a heavy productivity user and use OneNote, MS Office, and SharePoint so therefore a candidate for a W8 tablet. Only I'm not as eager to throw out my fairly evolved Android device to experience V1 of the h/w and s/w of an alternative. Months from now I may own a W8 tablet. Based on my personal needs and usage there's absolutely no rush. You guys can go first and if the world's not flat I'll follow you.

BarryH_GEG said:
Who are "we?" I have no idea what everyone here's needs are. I also have no idea what the "cons" are going to be that will without doubt go along with the rosy PR blurb “pros” being thrown out. I'm in marketing so perhaps I'm less susceptible to spin than some of you guys because I create it. MS lost their way and have a bunch of simultaneous "Hail Mary's" launching concurrently (Cloud, W8 the OS, and W8 the tablet). I wish them nothing but the best. But I'd like to see some traction gained before drinking their Kool-Aid and declaring their success. And that will take months to realize. I'm a heavy productivity user and use OneNote, MS Office, and SharePoint so therefore a candidate for a W8 tablet. Only I'm not as eager to throw out my fairly evolved Android device to experience V1 of the h/w and s/w of an alternative. Months from now I may own a W8 tablet. Based on my personal needs and usage there's absolutely no rush. You guys can go first and if the world's not flat I'll follow you.
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"We" as in "people who currently own the Note 10.1 and wanted to try and see the potential of upcoming Windows 8 tablets without forming any assumptions based on others' opinions". As you can see, nobody is saying that this will be a huge success, it's going to be "superior" or will definitely trump other tablets, etc. Let's see if the potential of the device is met by the hardware and the software first. As I stated, I have my reservations for the Atom-based CPU and 2 GB RAM in the Series 5. If it can't handle the load, I won't be moving over to the Series 7, because it's too heavy and pricey for me. I thought this was the original discussion.

tenderidol said:
see the potential
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Promise and potential are very different from practice and reality. And sometimes when they collide it isn’t pretty. Since this entire conversation is theoretical there can never be a decisive conclusion. I really don't have an opinion and won't until I can personally play with a W8 tablet and see how well it does the things I need it to do. Even then, my conclusion will only apply to me and my individual needs.
Think about this. Here's the iPad demographic.
iPad ownership is skewed toward young customers, with 27% of owners between 25 and 34. The average iPad owner is affluent, with a median income of $85,000 a year. Most importantly, they are much more likely to be buying things.
Don't you think that audience is using MS Office and OneNote professionally to earn the higher median income they do? Apple's sold 100MM iPads with no native access to MS Office. Taking a broader view I don't think it's the "killer app" many of you believe it will be. Especially if it comes at the price of a less refined h/w and s/w experience. There's also a certain cache that comes from owning an iPad. Android tablet owners tend to be classified as rugged individualists and technology enthusiasts. What will W8 tablet owners be? People that need access to MS apps? Pretty low on the "cool" scale, no? There’s more to a product’s success than just functionality.
Just food for thought while we're discussing the potential mass-market (in other words, not us) success of W8 tablets.

BarryH_GEG said:
Just food for thought while we're discussing the potential mass-market (in other words, not us) success of W8 tablets.
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Which we weren't until some folks hijacked the thread and went totally OT from the OP...

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