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I'm really tired of all the complaining and bickering going on in this forum lately.
It's getting out of hand.
Especially from **** heads that didn't show their faces until after the hard work was done. Those that don't show up when the forum needs something but only show up when they need something.
Where were you when we were collecting money?
Instead of complaining, did you ever think to ask some of the leaders in the forum, what you could do to give back?
Where were you when we were testing? All we needed was $5 from a few people but all I see is more cheap bastards that want free stuff and expect it to be PERFECT. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN! Think of it this way...if you bricked your device after 20 other people have successfully "patched" it, then something else is wrong. Work with people in the forum to figure out what. Keep a cool head. We know how tough it is to spend high dollar on a device then have it not work...but you use solutions here at your own risk so it's not the developers fault IT IS YOUR FAULT. Learn to post based on other postings. Don't yell and start complaining. I'm not a developer myself but contribute in other ways. If I was a developer I would leave this forum because of the verbal abuse. STOP COMPLAINING ALREADY!
Read the forum. Most of the **** has already been done. I'm not upset because people are asking questions due to not understanding something along your research. Don't get me wrong, the forum is here to help people and it's helped me a lot. I'm upset because of all the bashing going on lately. It's getting out of hand. I'm also upset because many of you that are actually benefitting from these solutions didn't show your faces until all the hard work was done. Don't tell me you couldn't afford a measly $5 or to contribute your time in some way or ask the people involved...what can I do to give back to the community I leech from.....you get my point.
Note, I'm not going to respond to ANYONE regarding this thread. Just chill the out and let's work together. If your device breaks, READ and try to educate yourself first instead of blaming the developer who took time to contribute their knowledge and provided us with a solution we needed or wanted. If you don't like how things are going....GET INVOLVED WHEN YOU NEED TO...DON'T COMPLAIN BECAUSE YOU'RE USING A SOLUTION SOMEONE WROTE ON THEIR FREE TIME TO HELP YOU OUT! MY GOD PEOPLE!
If you think you might get upset, mess your phone up, or otherwise...JUST DON'T USE THE SOLUTIONS POSTED ON THIS FORUM PERIOD.
If the above doesn't make sense...oh well. Needed to get that off my chest. I'm not a writer either so if it's all mashed together, oh well. If you're smart enough you'll get my point. If not, then just ignore the thread and go on.
Well Said ltxda. If only people would listen could curb their emotions a bit and apply logic sometimes....but then we are emotional beings.
Well I agree anyway. Everything is done at your own risk in these forums...and while we are at it...you know complaining about complainers and so forth...
..has anyone actually bricked their device (rendered it 'dead' or incapable of being restored somehow)...you know killed it?
I don't recall anyone having had that experience since... say...Olipro's unlocker. Point being...it's safe for all...and that was the intention of the SPL patch in the first place..whether simple to use or not.
C'mon friends...let's close the divide eat some humble pie together and get back to the business of progress and development...I'll leave that last bit to the devs.lol
If it helps I'll go first...Sorry if I offended anyone of late.
I meant that BTW. If it it's not good enough..sorry the offense ran so deep...sorry again.
OK...back to business
Developer Midget_1990 should be getting his X7500 within the next few days hopefully. We wanted different variants of the Athena to ensure there any and all solutions would definitely work across the board.
Custom ROMs coming soon.
Why don't we put our heads together to finalize/agree on the wish list of software that should be incorporated into the ROM/Vanilla ROM?
Has anyone found any VGA converted files for the Kaiser plug-in .cabs? That would be nice.
well said lt.. well said...
Agree with all these comments and want to add my take on the situation. All of us were newbies at some point (except for Oli I guess), and we have all been there. I remember sweating the first time I made a registry change.
1. We need to be a little patient with newbies. We want them to become a part of the community, not drive them away.
2. Saying "Just use search" or "See the Wiki" isn't always helpful. Sometimes relevant threads are 20+ pages, hard to sift through all that and figure out what is really the **** and what is some lame-ass crap from some poor soul who is as clueless as me. And have you actually looked at the Athena Wiki lately. Not much there. I would feel more sympathetic to the dismissive tone if the Wiki were more up to date. (I know, that's me too!)
** Tip for newbies, go to Advanced Search, select just the Athena forum, and search by post not thread. That may help narrow things down.
ON THE OTHER HAND:
3. I'm pretty cautious in making major changes. Flashed my Wizard ROM probably 4 times in over a year... and still waiting to flash my Advantage. I appreciate the brave souls who will flash weekly or more, I learn a lot from you guys. But I don't have the time to constantly set things back up over and over, so I wait for an upgrade that I feel confident will do what I want. Plus I know my limitations, if something really terrible happens I'm not smart enough to quickly recover. I read everything there is to read before doing anything major.
SO WHY IS IT THAT SOME PEOPLE TAKE HOME A NEW DEVICE AND FLASH AWAY WITHOUT READING A DAMN THING? Then cry that they bricked their phone? (probably not) How can we get the message of BE CAREFUL across? Look before you leap, etc. Maybe there needs to be a sticky at the very top explaining who should be messing with what. Maybe every link to a ROM should have a warning label. Something.
Sorry to go on. I really appreciate the expertise on this forum and enjoy being able to contribute in some small ways. But we need a more civil tone. I hate to see things deteriorate.
"I was once like you are now, and I know that its not easy,
To be calm when youve found something going on.
But take your time, think a lot,
Why, think of everything youve got.
For you will still be here tomorrow, but your dreams may not...."
Cat Stevens...
I think XDA-DEV is the best forum I ever seen about HTC devices. So many
thoroughbred horses here, and everybody involved in management knows how hard is to keep them working together ... Forget Customer Relationship Management
Keep this discussion clean (language, flaming et.al.). I understand the frustration, but bickering in the forum (or anywhere) is pointless.
jwzg said:
Keep this discussion clean (language, flaming et.al.). I understand the frustration, but bickering in the forum (or anywhere) is pointless.
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Agreed. Sorry I lost it again.
thx for cleaning up the unlocker threat.
It took a while before the Hermes forum to start getting crazy. I don't have my device for a week yet and there is already a lot sh*t among members already. For the Athena, I thought this would not happen until WM7. Anyway, let's get along people.
Bickering and namecalling
I think some of the newer guys should also look in the historie of things. The hermes forum had simmilar issues with jasjamming. For lot of the developers it not just someone asking a question, but another one asking the same thing. It's can be very frustrating, and some handle it better than others. I think it's safe to say that Olipro doesn't hadle it very well, and vents his frustration at the one asking the question. Wether i agree with him or not i do understand him.
As for the people asking questions. First search if your question hasn't been asked before... If you can't find it search again.
Give as much information as you can. Be specific about versions you use. Give the output of the software you get.If you're aked to give information you have given before, just give it again. Remember you are the one wanting help, so make it easy to help you, don't make the other one search for information.
And remember one thing: Free software is often provided "as is". No guarantees and no support. Assume that if it goes wrong, that you are on your own. Any support given is a bonus. Having said that, you'll find that there are enough people willing to help as long as you are patient and polite (or at least civil).
Oh good lord, look what we have here. You're inexperienced and you need help. Before this guide starts the most important thing to remember is; You're only a Noob if you say you are Look, I could tell you what you want to know but the truth of the matter is your thread that you are about to post is going to get bumped and piss people off because you will more than likley post it in the wrong category so here's some information that will help all you noobs in the long run.
Rule #1: "Hello XDA" <- At this point people already know or assume you are a noob and your chances of getting help are slim to none. If you're lucky someone will tell you to go check the qna which to me is the same as someone telling you to "Go F*** Yourself!" Don't sound stupid! Be confident and get right to the point!
Note: At the end of your comment, just end it with a "thanks" as this is more acceptable and prone to getting a better response than someone who is over-appreciative for a request for help when they haven't even gotten the answer their looking for.
Rule #2: "i've tried did work," Always use capitalization and proper punctuation. You come off as a person who lacks self-esteem and with little confidence. At this point you've gone from noob status to a knowledge-less noob which makes your chances for getting help even slimmer than they already are... Secondly, what you're saying makes no sense, no offense but use your head and edit your work, the edit button is there for a reason so use it when necessary and no one will notice or bust your balls.
Rule #3: Be confident in what you say and do. Be direct in what you're saying and get to the point. You don't need to sound like a dumb blond b**** who's drunk and helpless. It's mostly a nasty world out there but there are good people that will help you! Don't ever give up or in, keep trying until you get what you're looking for.
Rule #4: There are people who will put you down. Remember, there is no such thing as a stupid question There are people who will go out of their way to put you down because it makes them feel good about themselves. The truth of the matter is those individuals will have questions to things they don't know about which makes them hypocrites and therefore they deserve no respect.
Rule #5: If you are attacked by someone on XDA or in life, be defensive. Make the antagonist feel vulnerable, stupid and guilty for even trying to put you down at all costs. If your "foundation" is crippled and you do not defend yourself it is like walking around with a label "NOOB" stapled to your forehead and people will assume you are incompetent and therefore no help will be given!
Rule #6: Be resourceful, broaden your horizons, post in multiple places. Help is not limited to XDA... I am by no means a know-it-all but when I was in your shoes I made a lot of mistakes. Trial and error is a good thing, it is a very effective way of learning in actuality. I have used places like Youtube and searched and I found what I was looking for, helpful information. There are video tutorials that have been very helpful to me, just search and you will get help from multiple sources.
Rule #7: Be persistent! Never take no for an answer. Never give up and never surrender, empower yourself! If you are attacked, stand up for yourself and if you have trouble use comedy and make jokes, just be careful because people on here can be sensitive and you could get booted for awhile...
Well, that's my noob guide just don't take it too personally, I wrote it to be helpful and so that you can get what you're looking for the easiest way. Most people won't go out of their way to tell you this stuff but I can tell you from experience as a motivational speaker my guidelines are far more effective than when I see someone post a thread: "HELP! nOOb here" or" Noob Needs HELP NOW PLLLLLLEAAASSEE!!!" or "Phone crasHED what DO I DO!?!?!?"
Poeple are not only not willing to help but they will probably laugh at a thread with a title like that and it will probably give them enough of a kick to make their day while you still have a severe issue that is not humorous by any means.
Good luck.
Note: To all non-noobs you may now laugh your ass off if you haven't already.
Can I just say this is the wrong forum But it is kinda funny.
Ive been lurking here for a while quietly helping through PM and congratulating great work.
Over the years the members have become like the fan boys at apple. Foaming at the mouth waiting to flame a new member for not finding the answer in search or posting a relevant topic in the wrong section.
Seriously?
When the G1 came out we were all noobs. This Samsung is no different. There are alot of people new to android who picked up this device and I love it when the community grows.
FYI. XDA isn't the Bentley of android forums... we are a community of people looking to help eachother. Can we please keep the flaming to a minimum? You are wasting bandwidth.
My two cents. (now watch the number of people who tell me I'm in the wrong section.)
Sent from the best phone from TMO... Vibrant
I agree for the most part. But it does get old if there is a similar thread on the 1st page of the section. This is not a matter of being a noob to android but a noob to forum etiquette.
There are no stupid questions, but not attempting to find the answer first is a bit lazy.
I don't think its the fact that people are noobs. Its the fact that they have poor forum etiquette. Senior Members and New Members are both guilty of it. I think most people are more than willing to help or give advice. People just need to think before they post.
I hear ya on this one. Even as an android user from day 1, I, myself am guilty of becoming pompous member at times.
Back when the sh*t fest started in the G1 forum (during the Haykuro and CM C&D letter) I created a thread that was added into the "Informative links" sticky.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=568011
While I feel it mostly feel on deaf ears and blind eyes, if you think a revision of this would help, I dont mind spending some time on updating it before we post here in Vibrant forums.
Sorry OP, im not trying to hi-jack the thread, but do you mind if use this thread as a start point? maybe we can have some ppl chime in to get this updated and more in line with Vibrant forum. I already see some things I would need to change, but anymore technical info and thoughts would be appreciated.
xda-developers.com displays textbook… narcissism...
Agreed.
What about a FAQ page related to specific phone That includes the most asked questions. Specific to flashing, apk, odin, a step by step guid.
30Glock said:
What about a FAQ page related to specific phone That includes the most asked questions. Specific to flashing, apk, odin, a step by step guid.
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Well the problem is we have that yet people don't read it. So people post the same thing over and over again and the older members get mad and take it out on the person.
The street goes both ways. New members need to put a little effort and older members need to be a little more forgiving.
I've worked very hard on the Sticky. If someone asks the same questions I've answered over and over, I have little patience.
No we just need more aggressive moderation and banhammers. We also need English as a second language, because places like Mobile-Review.com forums are far more tame and nicer, even though no one goes there. And that's probably the main reason, since XDA is the go to place for a lot of people when it comes to smartphones, whether they are concerned about modding or not. Popularity has its downsides. And there's another stereotype that may or may not be true, but people who want to hack their phone and be on the cutting edge are also *usually foul-mouthed brats living in their mother's basement with no social life or sensibilities to speak of. Normal people don't really care about any of this. Or maybe that's geeks in general, real nasty on the net but pansies in real life.
I've done my fair share of forum moderating and admining. I have the same thought process on every on.
1.Everybody is new day one.
2. Its the senior members job to point them in the correct direction.
3. Todays newbie is tomorrows expert.
Scare new members away and who knows what they would of contributed later. Senior members if you get tired of the same old questions either be helpful and answer it or don't say anything at all. Being rude just scares away members and honestly that is not a good practice.
Hijack away I dont mind I just got tired of reading flaming posts. Its good to know im not the only one who felt that way.
I think a forum ettiquette post would be great
Sent from the best phone from TMO... Vibrant
kizer said:
I've done my fair share of forum moderating and admining. I have the same thought process on every on.
1.Everybody is new day one.
2. Its the senior members job to point them in the correct direction.
3. Todays newbie is tomorrows expert.
Scare new members away and who knows what they would of contributed later. Senior members if you get tired of the same old questions either be helpful and answer it or don't say anything at all. Being rude just scares away members and honestly that is not a good practice.
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Plus 1. Thats wat I was trying to say. Perfectly worded sir.
Sent from the best phone from TMO... Vibrant
Yeah I go through and
Read many forums and the search option is not the greatest. Sometimes it'll point me to a line someone said on a thread with over 100 pages. Honestly although I try sometimes it's too much to read and a lot of bs to skim through about people arguing over who knows more. And sometimes I just get lost reading the technical stuff.
But because of some members attitudes here i am OFTEN reluctant to ask questions. They either get overlooked or people get upset. I understand a lot of times a lot of things are repeated but sometimes it's not clear the first time or someone else puts it in a different light.
I appreciate all the work done here but I wish sometimes people would just relax and have fun doing this. If someone asked a question that was already answered then YOU don't have to respond. Someone else is willing to help.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
I've been reading internet forums since the dawn of USENET. Guess what? People asking questions that are in the FAQ has always happened and always will. Yeah, it gets annoying to the long-time readers/contributers, but you have to look at it from the point of view of the new user. Believe it or not, some of them just don't know better. They don't know to read the sticky. They don't know where the search button is, or they don't know what to search for. There are a multitude of reasons, but the bottom line is, they are all individual, unique people who come here seaking an answer to a problem. They have no knowledge of the 10, 100, 1000+ people that have asked the very same question. So when you get upset about reading the same question for the eleventeenth time, you are getting mad at a person for asking one question. Not a person who has asked the same question a bunch of times.
If you look carefully, you will see that after a person comes here (and any forum for that matter) and asks a question that has been asked before, and when that person is replied to with respect and helpfulness, generally that person will not ask any other questions that have been asked before. In fact, that person very likely may become a contributer, helping other newbies a long the way.
My wife teaches college and without fail, when it gets to the last two weeks of the semester, she starts getting floods of emails "What can I do for extra credit?" "What is the policy for late work?" etc. Guess what. All of the questions are in her course syllabus that she hands out on the first day. It drives her nuts too. I try to calm her down there too.
Have you ever gone to some public service desk (DMV, taxes, hunting license, anything like that) and received very rude service for just asking a question? Because that person is fed up for answering the same question over and over again, even though there is a sign on the door that you somehow missed reading on the way in. Remember how you felt? Was it really YOUR fault?
Some of them are truly lazy and want to ask even though they truly know better and for some crazy reason they think they will get a faster response by asking rather than searching.
Bottom line is, if you are the kind of person who gets really, visibly annoyed over things like this, then internet forums may not be the best place for you to hang out. If it just annoys you a little reading the same question over and over again, then congratulations--you are human. You can either choose to respond or not respond. And if you do respond, personally, I think it is better to try to keep a positive, helpful attitude.
I agree with the OP.
I have been using forums since it was first called UseNet, as a matter of fact, I still call them "newsgroups".
XDA nowadays reminds of the reasons why I left the Media Center forums back in 2005, after having earned 2 MVPs for my help there. Those who were once newbies themselves and asked stupid questions at first became arrogant and elitist and spent more time flaming and calling names those who asked questions like they once asked, than pointing them in the right direction.
Using the search is not always the answer. There are many ways to frame or word one issue or question. What for one person is a lag, for another one is slowness, delay, performance, etc. Words can be misspelled, shortened, euphemisms can be used, etc. For many English is not even their first language.
Posts by people well acquainted with the technologies at hand can be daunting not only for newbies, but for many who are not experts. References to CM6, Odin, Clockwork, Recovery mode, etc, in the same sentence can be intimidating, when you know that a simple misunderstanding can brick your $600 phone.
Like someone else well said before, today's newbies are tomorrows experts.
I understand that seeing the same question (not necessarily stupid) for which an answer has been provided before may bother some people (not me), but instead of spending valuable time and bandwidth criticizing and frequently offending others saying things that probably wouldn't be said in person, wouldn't it be better to answer the question, or at least point the person in the right direction and then humbly instruct them how to find the answers by themselves?
The anonymity of nicknames sometimes lead people to act in a less civilized way than what they would do otherwise.
Luis
I quickly browsed through this thread to read others thoughts. Here are my own:
Yes, this forum in particular does have it's share of rude members. What I'm noticing is that a lot of people will chime in and immediately chastise the OP, or call someone an outright liar about their particular experience. What I really hate is when someone with a particularly bad attitude posts something like "Well I really don't care about...." and then proceed to go on a diatribe about how they don't care about something or how someone else is wrong or stupid. They obviously care if they opened the thread, took the time to read the thread, and then took the time to respond.
Look, we are all here to share our knowledge on something in particular that we know, and to also gain knowledge from someone else on things that we don't. My hope is that this forum becomes more helpful to the people seeking it. For instance, I never found a clear-cut answer to the question if you root the phone and apply the lag fix and whatnot, if you will still get the OTA updates that are forthcoming. Some people say yes, others say absolutely not. I didn't get the feeling that anyone who answered that question knew exactly what they were talking about. Yet, if I made a post asking, I would get slammed because it's "been answered before you stupid noob".
orells said:
Ive been lurking here for a while quietly helping through PM and congratulating great work.
Over the years the members have become like the fan boys at apple. Foaming at the mouth waiting to flame a new member for not finding the answer in search or posting a relevant topic in the wrong section.
Seriously?
When the G1 came out we were all noobs. This Samsung is no different. There are alot of people new to android who picked up this device and I love it when the community grows.
FYI. XDA isn't the Bentley of android forums... we are a community of people looking to help eachother. Can we please keep the flaming to a minimum? You are wasting bandwidth.
My two cents. (now watch the number of people who tell me I'm in the wrong section.)
Sent from the best phone from TMO... Vibrant
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\
I think it has to do with age. I've come to the realization that this board is full of 14 year old wanking little boys, so what else to do you expect? I don't care what their birth certificate says, maturity wise, the majority of the board is all of 14. It's disgusting and if I didn't need mod info, I sure as h*ll wouldnt be here.
1. A FAQ listed on each section. I know we have Wiki, but its usually outdated and hard to navigate. There really is no need for gigantic lists, but simple things like how to root, use odin, use clockwork, install roms/themes, etc... can be put there along with a warning on asking questions which have already been posted on the FAQ.
2. More Mods! I think just one or two more mods can help the forums a lot and clean things up.
3. Warnings for people who post questions that have already been answered on the front page of a thread or faq followed by a temp ban if they continue.
I'm really tired of the cycle of
- Dumb question posted
- Followed by "read the damn thread or use the damn search button"
- Followed by "Hey you were a noob once and theres no harm in answering the question you ass along with lengthy answer on the question that will inevitable be asked 10 more times in the near future"
- Continue flame war that now has nothing to do with the thread anymore
You enable people by holding their hands. Don't be an enabler. If you managed to find out how to do all this crap on your own, they can too. At most you should point them to the right thread and let them read up on it on their own so they can further their own education.
4. Don't PM the Devs for requests. They have enough work on their hands and don't need to be flooded. Remember the rule of think before you speak? Try thinking before you PM.
Anyhoo, there was a bunch more, but I'm sure you guys/gals have other ideas.
riceknight said:
1. A FAQ listed on each section. I know we have Wiki, but its usually outdated and hard to navigate. There really is no need for gigantic lists, but simple things like how to root, use odin, use clockwork, install roms/themes, etc... can be put there along with a warning on asking questions which have already been posted on the FAQ.
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I don't understand why the "[How To] Return to Stock / Fix Bricked Epic" thread is not sticked.
If someone posts they bricked their phone and needs help you post the link to that thread and lock it.
I like the sentiment of this thread but fear it might be taken the wrong way. Whosdaman is really a wonderful guy and has been very helpful to me but it seems like he is very busy (and who can blame him for dealing with things outside of the interwebs?) so I support this I would also like to issue a blanket "Thank you for your hard work" to Whosdaman.
Seeing as this is a collection of developers I don't see why we don't customize the forum itself.
I don't see any reason we can't flag the development and Q/A threads for every phone. Then, if "is this a question" is set to yes, automatically put it in that phone's Q/A forum. On top of which we could add a "You are posting in the development forum, this is reserved for people developing for [insert phone]. Please check the box below to confirm that you are developing something you wish to share." anytime people posted in the development forum.
Obviously people can still screw it up, if nothing else on purpose, but we can expect people who have never been on the forums to know how the forums are laid out, usually by reading the rules, which never happens, to sort their own, or we can make it as self sorting as possible.
Sounds like whosedaman just needs some support. Perhaps another mod added to help out. We all have to keep in mind that these guys don't get paid for this and real life always trumps forums life. Just my thought on this.
Sent from my Epic while i should be working
I was wondering why there was so much confusion in this forum, as I really liked the forums I used for the month I had a Moment before the Epic dropped. Was there ever a forum on here for the moment??? I couldnt find one, so I checked sdx, which I remember lurking back then and found my answer. Why can't Xda have 'child forums', with descriptions of where and why to post things?? They have a 'market' forum section for ROMs, etc, which we here are using development exclusively. I understand why, but it seems its this way here because of limited tools for organizing, can this sites software not do that? It is completely logical and intuitive to post questions directly regarding development or roms in the development section if you are new... I would have expected a sub-forum for roms only, or at least some direction other than after the fact... usually unless its horribly out of order, whosdaman is pretty polite about it, and given the feelings regarding this device, things get silly in here. Anyways, yes, at least sticky all roms and things 'coolguy' or whatever dont warrant flaming, and then politely notify the new people that questions regarding development actually get booted over to general, where intuitively people would assume GENERAL questions like 'do you like gmail or the stock app better?'.
More mods? Better structure? Who has control over this? Are there any experienced volunteers that can help whosdaman out with his daunting task?
We need to expect more 'joined in Dec 2010' and later members as every idiot with a blog and engadget included seem to think this site and forum are the authority, even over Sprint and Samsung (if XDA says 2.2 is dropping, it must be true, head over there and complain about it). NOTHING against new members, just that there is little direction other than the 'rules' that most people think are just 'dont flame, no kiddie porn... etc...' Dont get all elitist because people couldnt figure out your simple, non-intuitive structure because its their first 5 mins here.
Love this forum, but its like people are baited into getting flamed by assuming this forum runs like most any other... I thought I saw the end of this when I refused to go to another BBC chat... guess not.
If you feel that you must deputize yourself, please, copy the link to the wiki, rules, etc and paste them in misplaced, repeat threads and leave it at that.
since this is a fluff post, BigJim, whats the 1488 stand for??? Just curious...
ungovernable1977 said:
since this is a fluff post, BigJim, whats the 1488 stand for??? Just curious...
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Pardon? I'm not sure I understand what you mean by 'a fluff post'. I sincerely hope Whosdaman reads this thread and takes into account that there are some of us who would genuinely like to help him make our forums a more manageable place to browse and share ideas/roms/themes/etc. I am in no way asking for myself to be made a mod but rather I believe there are people here who would make good mods and I hope that WDM sees that we support him and want to help him make our community more accessible!
I'm willing to be a mod here I have experience and would know and how to handle things here...
Admins or mods pm me
sent from my Epic 4G
riceknight said:
1. A FAQ listed on each section. I know we have Wiki, but its usually outdated and hard to navigate. There really is no need for gigantic lists, but simple things like how to root, use odin, use clockwork, install roms/themes, etc... can be put there along with a warning on asking questions which have already been posted on the FAQ.
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Did you do a search before posting this? There's already a thread on it, learn how to use the search.
Ok, that was my attempt at humor
ungovernable1977 said:
since this is a fluff post, BigJim, whats the 1488 stand for??? Just curious...
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I don't think this is fluff at all and whosdaman does deserve to be thanked for his, well, thankless work.
1488 is a race thing. They usually won't tell you what the ideology of it is in public. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteen_Words
Although I don't agree with the sentiment of the belief structure, I support their right to peacefully observe their beliefs.
Yeah I know that meaning its generally a tattooed target, was just hoping it was just some retarded interweb speak. Sorry to hear. Almost forgot what it was though... not many Boneheads around here, not anymore.
BTW, I respect Lady Gaga's work, although I dont like it, therefore I see no reason to put it in my username.... its ok, you have a right to be a Nazi in this country...
Regrettably, I do read almost every thread in this forum, and forums I maintain...
<--------- Look here, I have 8 forums to maintain full time, but 6 are dead lol
Yeah I do have a life outside this for sure. Not only am I a senior in High School, I am on the Mock Trial team, the Robotics Team, a Sales Representative for Sprint, and a Writer for BriefMobile.com
So yeah I would say I'm busy, but I look over the entire forum as much as I can. Shep211 has been extremely busy in his personal life, that's why I started helping.
It is a thankless job, it's a volunteer job. All free, I don't get paid. The only thanks comes from the owner of the site when I say "if you fix this the site will be better."
Besides all that I can single handedly control this entire forum. I know it sometimes looks cluttered and in a mess, but then again...the Development section is spotless, which is truely the only thing that matters. The General section is meant to be a mess because it's where everyone posts their questions and complaints.
There are applications to become a moderator here on XDA, you have to meet certain requirements to be considered and then be approved. No one of this forum knows my experience as a moderator unless you used GameBattles.com for PS3.
If you want to help me out the most, please please please, use the "Report Post" feature. Every reported post goes straight to my inbox, and I see every single one. Normally RP's get extra attention as they obviously have bothered someone enough to have it reported. 90% of the RP's are either Ghost or Kenvan.
The search feature would do alot of people good, it's nice to tell people to do something, but Report the post/thread and I'll take care of it. You clutter up the forum and threads by posting in threads saying to post in General, just report it. That's all.
Sure, I wish everyone searched because there are at least 5 can't root threads. I would rather merge them all but it too much work to find them. Like I said, let the noobs make their mistake. The members report the post, don't tell them they were wrong. I'll move it, shoot them a PM, and then post in their thread telling them where they should have posted. Then hopefully they will learn.
Thanks again,
WDM
kenvan19 said:
Pardon? I'm not sure I understand what you mean by 'a fluff post'. I sincerely hope Whosdaman reads this thread and takes into account that there are some of us who would genuinely like to help him make our forums a more manageable place to browse and share ideas/roms/themes/etc. I am in no way asking for myself to be made a mod but rather I believe there are people here who would make good mods and I hope that WDM sees that we support him and want to help him make our community more accessible!
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Sorry, fluff may have been a wrong choice of words, I was implying that as this has been talked about before, and ignored by the powers that be, I saw it was going to end up an off topic post eventually, or at least until the elitist post Nazis (no offense bigjim) came in and said how we are cluttering their precious first page of posts, because as most have trouble with the AMAZING search function, a lot here have a lot of trouble with 'next page', you dont even have to pick which page, it takes you right to the next one!
Sorry, this is just getting really retarded around here, oh and BigJim,apologies, last comment on your beliefs, if off topic, but being an anarcho-punk, its hard not to at least ask if that is REALLY what you are talking about.
hehe *blush* I've tried to resort to reporting posts lately as opposed to trying to deal with problems on my own. Hope its not too much of a burden.
THANK YOU whosdaman! that is a very simple way to deal with the clutter issue... didnt even realise what the report button was till i looked around for it. I agree that not replying, positive or negative is good, if its easier for you to redirect them (you could probably easily make a form letter, just sub in 'froyo', 'GPS', or 'search' and the rest is pretty much the same!)
So what of the ability to make sub forums??? to be able to have a section under Dev that is for general DEV RELATED questions would be cool... most people assume that General is for stock, non rooted phone discussion, and Development is for anything to do with development. I think I remember one called 'all things root'?? Idunno, but you get the idea. So what is the plausability of this?? not possible with site software? Too much work??? Just curious, I have asked in similar threads and I think you were too busy with other stuff... I tend to avoid PM especially if it is something someone else may be able to answer, as we all know, mods are busy, especially in this forum. Thanks for all your hard work!
I certainly appreciate all the hard work Whosdaman has been doing with these forums, but unless he enjoys handling all this, wouldn't an extra mod or two be helpful?
My biggest thing is the FAQ post. Someone asks questions, you can point and say you should have read that first. Like I said before, the Wiki is great, but its a little cluttered and outdated as well as being hard to edit. Having one person willing to just moderate that one thread would be so helpful.
It bugs me when the whole community seems to be represented by the lazy people who just spam post. There are plenty of helpful, polite and very well informed that get lost among the clutter. In fact, they probably outnumber the newbies but don't feel the need to post nonsense. For every idiot that asks a dumb question, there are probably 10 that actually do research and figure it out for themselves.
kenvan19 said:
hehe *blush* I've tried to resort to reporting posts lately as opposed to trying to deal with problems on my own. Hope its not too much of a burden.
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Nope, I love you and ghost for reporting post. I always look forward to waking up and seeing 10 new PMs lol
ungovernable1977 said:
THANK YOU whosdaman! that is a very simple way to deal with the clutter issue... didnt even realise what the report button was till i looked around for it. I agree that not replying, positive or negative is good, if its easier for you to redirect them (you could probably easily make a form letter, just sub in 'froyo', 'GPS', or 'search' and the rest is pretty much the same!)
So what of the ability to make sub forums??? to be able to have a section under Dev that is for general DEV RELATED questions would be cool... most people assume that General is for stock, non rooted phone discussion, and Development is for anything to do with development. I think I remember one called 'all things root'?? Idunno, but you get the idea. So what is the plausability of this?? not possible with site software? Too much work??? Just curious, I have asked in similar threads and I think you were too busy with other stuff... I tend to avoid PM especially if it is something someone else may be able to answer, as we all know, mods are busy, especially in this forum. Thanks for all your hard work!
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I have no control over sub-forums. And right now it is only me working on the entire Epic forum. Like I said shep211 is gone atm.
svetius is in charge of the entire site, and I've talked to him about improvements that can be made. I wouldn't bother him too much or he'll just ignore ya. Most of the time the only things he is interested is fixing errors with the site itself. Right now I don't think we are in the area of reorganizing the entire site.
ok, so adding a subforum is not possible? Or is it a decision to make the structure uniform across the whole site? Just thinking, because this forum is like maximum security, different from the rest... or so it would seem...
I'm not so sure making more areas, and thus more chances to be wrong, is a good way to combat posting in the wrong area.
If you have a rom question, ask it in the rom thread. All that would happen if there were subforums for things in development, and discussion of things in development is we'd have 37 threads about how "I just discovered ___ doesn't work in [rom]" instead of 50 posts about it in the rom thread.
(Not to mention you'd then be blurring the line of when it is or isn't ok to post in the DEV forum, where as now, if the person bothers to read, there's a pretty clear cut "If you aren't about to post about the thing you just developed, GTFO" rule.)
Originally Posted by dude64
I love xda as it is such a great resource and adds and improves upon the functionality the devices for so many users. Thanks to all the people who put in hard work. But, I hate the attitude of the senior members and the more seasoned users towards those of us who are relatively inexperienced. I requested to point me to the relative thread/forum. What do you mean by topic list? Under general or development or this thread itself? Thanks.
I have been on this forum for quit a while and as a SENIOR I also do not like the attitude of some of the people. Not all of us give noobs a hard time. I do think pointing a person in the right direction is OK and also letting them know that reading is fundimental is OK, but I see some members going around and doing nothing but telling people how many times this has already been answered and if they would only take 5 seconds to read. You are correct, some people do need to read some before chiming in, but there is no reason to be an ASS. This is a great resource, but people will shy away if members continue to act this way. This forum was created to help out the users of new devices and a place to develop the hardware and make it better for all, so lets get back to that!
XDA also has rules, here's the very first one.
Search before posting.
Use one of our search functions before posting, whether you have a question or something new to share, it's very likely someone already asked that question or shared that news.
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FloatingFatMan said:
XDA also has rules, here's the very first one.
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I know the rules. I see no problem with you pointing out the rules, but to go trolling the threads and just telling the new guys that this has been already answered does no one any good. You can use a little more tact and still be helpful. Isn't that the main reason for this forum?
dalepl said:
I know the rules. I see no problem with you pointing out the rules, but to go trolling the threads and just telling the new guys that this has been already answered does no one any good. You can use a little more tact and still be helpful. Isn't that the main reason for this forum?
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I do, but after a dozen repetitions of the same question, it DOES become time to tell people to search for themselves.
When I first came here, that's EXACTLY what I did. I took my time, I read the reads, I used search. I didn't ask a SINGLE question until I was sure the answer wasn't already there, and in doing so I learned.
Helping people is fine; changing their diapers for them, isn't.
FloatingFatMan said:
I do, but after a dozen repetitions of the same question, it DOES become time to tell people to search for themselves.
When I first came here, that's EXACTLY what I did. I took my time, I read the reads, I used search. I didn't ask a SINGLE question until I was sure the answer wasn't already there, and in doing so I learned.
Helping people is fine; changing their diapers for them, isn't.
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I do totally agree with you. I am just saying right now, you are coming accross as hostile. Try backing off. I see no problem with telling a noob to search and read first before asking a question, but I see no reason to tell them how dumb they are being on the first question. Now, if they continue, all bets are off. You can do as you want with them.
I really like this site and feel it is a great resource for people. Especially since you can not expect this from the companies, but I really do not want people to not ask a question in fear of getting beratted by someone because they did not read. Point out thier mistake and with any hope, they will comply.
As a fairly new member, but a fairly active one, I gotta say that sometimes the attitude on here reminds me of my local Staples...which is to say pretty ****ty. I know that its a pain to have to answer the same question over and over again, but you can't fault someone for not knowing. Realizing that sometimes you just want to grab someone and shake them, while screaming "just use the damn search feature!" but even so, a little more temperance and a little less condescension would be a good thing.
agree with op
I think thisnis exactly correct.I notice its not always the same person over and over asking things discusses or solved.I have also noticed that the majority of the repeated questions come from those who are not. Great with English.
The truth is its easier to yell and degrade someone then politely just ask them to search.I also believe the post telling someone they are a moron or other not so nice things are more against the rules here then the unnecessary post and adds to the drama.if you don't like it you dont have to answer.
It all comes down to respect everyone deserves it.even the lame people like myself as I have been called on here
I go back to my corner and shup as I should have not posted here to begin with
dalepl said:
.... but I really do not want people to not ask a question in fear of getting beratted by someone because they did not read.
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This is the internet. No matter how nasty you are or how nice you are, the same questions will be asked time and time again. There's nothing anyone can do about it.
It doesn't matter if someone reads the rules or not, it doesn't matter if someone searched or not - if they have a question they'll ask it - regardless.
You can have the answer in bright, bold, flashing letters on the main page and the question will still be asked. See it isn't about whether the answer is available or not, its that every person who asks does so with their own rationale and the belief that 'their question isn't exactly the same' and the answer they want isn't one they've found (even if its the impossible answer).
It's up to the individual whether they answer them, (positively or negatively isn't the point) or walk away.
So what, if some people choose to chew out other people. If that's how they want to interact with the community then so be it. The community will decide if that is acceptable or not and, in time, they'll either stop, or leave because they're frustrated with the none-Utopian forum they thought they could control.
dalepl said:
Originally Posted by dude64
I love xda as it is such a great resource and adds and improves upon the functionality the devices for so many users. Thanks to all the people who put in hard work. But, I hate the attitude of the senior members and the more seasoned users towards those of us who are relatively inexperienced. I requested to point me to the relative thread/forum. What do you mean by topic list? Under general or development or this thread itself? Thanks.
I have been on this forum for quit a while and as a SENIOR I also do not like the attitude of some of the people. Not all of us give noobs a hard time. I do think pointing a person in the right direction is OK and also letting them know that reading is fundimental is OK, but I see some members going around and doing nothing but telling people how many times this has already been answered and if they would only take 5 seconds to read. You are correct, some people do need to read some before chiming in, but there is no reason to be an ASS. This is a great resource, but people will shy away if members continue to act this way. This forum was created to help out the users of new devices and a place to develop the hardware and make it better for all, so lets get back to that!
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+1
Some people are irrationally and intentionally harsh and seem to exist solely to deride others consistently. I too think pointing people in the right direction is a good thing to do, but that's under the assumption that they genuinely didn't know to use the search. Some even mention using the search and still get less than stellar remarks as a response. It's of my opinion that if it's not constructive somehow, don't bother responding. Let someone with a bit more patience either answer or point them to the right place.
I agree with the OP as far as members of the forum go. The forum itself is actually very nice in that it will pop up a list of possible solutions based on your subject line. Whether or not new people or even older members use it is another matter.
it isn't something you can blame on XDA. i have been on the forums for years and while it does happen in every device subforum, The acer iconia section is just bad. I went from HTC tilt to touch HD to 2 X touch HD2 then an inspire and never saw the nastiness to the extent the acer forum has.
People just need to realize questions will always be asked even if the answer is in the post above the question. Instead of adding to the thread length with the go reads or quit being a noob or the has been answered x times, just don't reply to them unless you are willing to help. This way threads are shorter and if you do search you are more likely to find the answer then finding people *****ing about said question.
I think people just need to calm down and quit trying to be moderators, unless of course you are one. I help when i can and have been helped by many people on here. Without help these noobs will always be noobs. With some help they may become the next developer that the community pushes away with the over anxious "when's my next update coming"
I totally agree that people need to just calm down before responding. Answering the question, and TOTALLY reading the question, is far more helpful than responding to just do a search.
P.S. searching on here is VERY vague. The search at the top should default to the forum you are in, not the whole of XDA.
There's a lot of tears flowing here.
People will always be people...
agreed with the OP...
Im a long time member with very few posts, love the forums but prefer to stay away from the people.
wow
The internet tears are flowing...
Asked quite a few stupid questions when I was new, the responses from senior members taught me to solve my problems for myself and not create new threads when my issue had already been solved.
If you cannot handle a little bit of sarcasm when annoying thousands of members with questions that are already clearly answered, perhaps xda is not the place for you.
As for me, I am running CWM and the latest 3.1 thanks to the efforts of this community. I have learned more about Android and have refreshed some basic Linux knowledge, and have converted my cheapo Virgin Mobile Samsung Intercept into a reliable hotspot for my Acer a500.
Instead of getting upset and creating a new thread about how mean everyone is here; perhaps you should take a step back, emotionally distance yourself, learn how to use advanced search (pro tip: you *can* search just for threads about one device, learn to use advanced search) - and realize with the tools the community has provided for you here you are able to do pretty much anything you want with your Acer a500?
Or you can continue down the path of accusing everyone here of being rude. If you have any specific questions about the a500 - I am willing to help, as are many others.
Don't expect anyone to jump to the response if your question had already been answered, however. This community relies on your ability to learn how to use the search function.
I feel like sometimes the
"use search" is an answer to people who doesn't know as well...
A reply as
Use search , you will find : link to post related to
should be a better answer, at least if you waste your time to reply "use search" why not waste time in a complete reply...
It's true that is boring to see same topic, and have to give same reply (but in every weboard a MERGE function exist... moderator and administrator could if they got time of course, merge topics together... don't miss understand me, I do not say moderator and admin do not do good job)
Sometimes also a noob doesn't know how to search properly as well... IT'S A NOOB!
some are lazy, some are not.
I have been on this site for roughly 3 years and I do have to say there has been some increased crankiness. I also would say the amount of members and people with smart phones has increased substantially since then.
Would be cool if you could flag a duplicate topic for review by moderator so they can be easier to identify and merged appropriately
Well I have to say a little something on this.
I noticed the attitude on this forum and I tend to just read and learn.I type very little as I don't really want to draw attention to myself like now.
I am in the computer repair business and have seen this same attitude with customers from my peers.
And although I want to tell some people to leave me alone when they call I still keep civil with them. But I do appreciate all the learning I have gleaned on this forum.
Ya Cant Change Society
+1 to use the search.
However If I do reply to someone who is asking a question which has been answered time and time again.. I will post the search results that relate to the persons Question.
Not searching is probably my #1 Forum Pet peeve. People complain Ohh well there's like a 1000 Different posts on XYZ topic.. Well their wouldn't be if someone would of searched the first time rather than clogging the search pipes with another post of the same question that has been answered several times.
However Times are changing.. Generations are getting Lazier ... And still lots of people are unfamiliar with Forum etiquette.. Or are just wanting a instant answer now.. Not much any one person can do about any of that.
So if you feel sarcasm... Dont like how someone responds.. are not happy with the site / People .. I say to you... Move on... off to google.com with you to search out several other sites similar to this one to get your golden answer. Its the Internet you have the freedom to go elsewhere. but I'll tell you this your never gonna find a "tech" forum where the attitudes are much different.
Although I will admit there are issues here at XDA, they are working on them.. You cant change how people act around here.. Just as the new folks coming in will never use the search or read the rules.. BTW "technically" this entire thread is breaking the rules.. The thread is entirely in the wrong forum. And I hope the Moderator will see this and move it to its appropriate area.
just my 2 cents on it all.. its probably not even worth that.
"You Cant Change society as a whole, but Society can change an individual"
Ill say that one thing people need to take into account is that alot of members don't speak English as their first language. So they might not even know how to correctly search for an answer with the right words, per se.
The rules do say "use English", lol.
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