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Hi,
I wonder if we could have advanced battery charging management on Android in order to minimize wear. The basic idea is to avoid micro-cycles, i.e. don't start charging every time the power supply is plugged in. I find myself plugging in my Nexus several times a day, so I get several charge cycles every day. Instead, the Nexus should draw its power over USB, but not start charging.
The thinkpad_smapi module implements this for IBM/Lenovo laptops. There are two thresholds, start_charge_thresh and stop_charge_thresh. Setting the start threshold to e.g. 40 will not start charging unless the remaining capacity is below 40 %, and stop_charge_thresh will probably (I don't use it) stop charging early. I use a start threshold of 25 % on my Thinkpad, so I always have at least around 1 hour left, which is enough for me. I understand if people want a full battery all the time and rather buy a new battery every now and then. However, my first Thinkpad battery died after 1.5 years (~500 cycles). The second battery is 2 years old and still charges to 77 % of the original capacity (50 Wh of 64 Wh), so this simple measure has a significant effect.
There's a lot to know about LiPo/LiIon-batteries, way more than I know, but the bottom line is that keeping the battery between 40 % and 95 % minimizes chemical wear.
Maybe someone came across battery-related stuff while digging through the kernel sources and can comment on this. Charging is probably not handled in the kernel, but in the radio or by a dedicated circuit, but maybe there's an interface exposed to the kernel that can be used to set those threshold values. That's how it's done on Thinkpads.
Some changes to how charge management (which is done in the kernel in the ds2784_battery driver) is handled in full and near-full situations are under way. Look for them in the .32-test1 kernel sources in the near future. We're not planning on being quite as aggressive as you propose (wait until 40% to begin charging, etc), but reducing discharge/recharge cycling once the battery is full is planned.
swetland said:
Some changes to how charge management (which is done in the kernel in the ds2784_battery driver) is handled in full and near-full situations are under way. Look for them in the .32-test1 kernel sources in the near future. We're not planning on being quite as aggressive as you propose (wait until 40% to begin charging, etc), but reducing discharge/recharge cycling once the battery is full is planned.
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i found some unusual battery behavior on the nexus one. i'll charge to 100% when on. then ill delete the batterystats.bin and power off. when off, the light is still orange. takes about a full 5 minutes later then turns green. when i do this and power on, with heavy usage it stays on 100% for 15-35 min, then slowly drops. but without doing this, it just slowly drops from 100%.
100% is not quite the same as fully charged (yes this is a little confusing). If you yank power immediately upon hitting 100% you will typically have a less full battery than if you let it sit until it stops charging. The "power off charge mode" doesn't indicate 100% with the green light -- it indicates "charge complete".
The battery log at /d/battery_log gives a bit more detail as to what's going on (as well as the chatter from the battery driver in the dmesg log).
swetland said:
100% is not quite the same as fully charged (yes this is a little confusing). If you yank power immediately upon hitting 100% you will typically have a less full battery than if you let it sit until it stops charging. The "power off charge mode" doesn't indicate 100% with the green light -- it indicates "charge complete".
The battery log at /d/battery_log gives a bit more detail as to what's going on (as well as the chatter from the battery driver in the dmesg log).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thanks for the response! i learned something new today
I've used the Battery University to guide me on Li-Ion batteries:
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/parttwo-34.htm
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-12.htm
(scroll down on either page to see some guidelines).
The first page says that multiple partial recharges are healthier for the battery than fewer deeper discharge/recharges due to less heat buildup. Personally I have never fretted about just plugging in my Macbooks or phones whenever I wanted and the batteries have all lasted quite well.
I also use a slightly weaker charger for my G1 and N1 than the supplied chargers (500 to 700mA Blackberry chargers) and they don't get as hot when I charge them, yet charge to full capacity quickly enough for my needs. The second page recommends a 0.5C charge current (1C == 1400mAmps, 0.5C == 700mAmps) for better life.
I've been playing w the 32 test kernel and looks like this commit has implemented the battery management.
I've now noticed that if the battery level is higher than 90%, plugging in the charger will not charge the phone. Once the battery drops below 90, the battery will start getting charged.
http://r.android.com/#change,13342
is this .32 kernel going to be released as an OTA soon? or is it still in dev stages?
*push*
1.8 years later...
Is it finally implemented in Gingerbread? Are there any mods that provide a frontend to that settings?
Okie dokie, ive had a wee look about and whilst there are several posts on battery issues i dont see much on this one ive come across.
Ok, first things first, battery usage seemed a bit high but nothing too major, still got me through a day, then it got worse, bit by bit it was lasting less and less time. so ive done a few wee tests with flashing other WM roms and WP7 and i think i have a good explination.
It seems if you leave it on charge all night it may not quite fill up, if you unplug it when the green light comes on then plug it back in it fills up propperly, if however you unplug it when the green light is on and isnt full, plug it back in again and then unplug it again before its full it reports on wp7 as being full, which it isnt, then it looks like your battery is draining like a comet falling out of the sky which of course it isnt, just just your battery isnt full to start with.
anyhow, it seems to get worse if you dont notice it not filling up, so if i fill it up to say 80%, then use it, and at some point during the day plug it in briefly but not enough to fill it up fully it then takes that level as the battery max, the next recharge doesnt fill it up until a restart.
So yes, thats all rather complicated and probably makes little sence to anyone but me but the point is this, for one reason or another WP will think the battery is full when it isnt, which makes it look like the battery usage is massive, which it isnt, it just appears that way because as far as WP is concerned, under the right circumstances your battery is perhaps half the size it really is
I'd support dazza9075 in his articulation of this undocumented 'feature'. Without having given it the same levels of consideration, I've had similar experiences where I have had a phone on the green light - I unplug it, take a short call, plug it back in and it stays on amber for another hour or more.
Elsewhere in similar threads there was a suggestion to soft reset at bedtime. I haven't done so rigorously, but the once or twice I have done, it does seem that there is more battery left in the morning.
Of course, in the absence of hard data from a battery percentage meter - assuming it is accurate - this is all subjective speculation anyway. But it is reasonably safe to say that WP7's battery reporting is immature at best.
Aye, not having propper access to battery stats is a bit of an oversight. Just to add to my ramblings just charged the phone, green light, unplug, icon suggests 100%, plug in an amber light pops on, unplug an Icon dropped to around 80%, plug in again and leave phone on standby it will charge, but as I type on here battery icon gone straight to full an green light on.
Lesson of the day, charge and don't use phone, keep repeating unplug an charge to get full charge back
Good stuff guys! Indeed; i noticed the same thing! Although when it says Low Battery i can assure you that the phone will still work for a day like mine.. i charged it yesterday morning; at night it said battery low and still now i am using it! Weird stuff but as we know WP7 is not meant to be on HD2! Someone here (member or dev) will fix the problem some day like Android OS... This is just the Beginning!
I can completely agree with the observations written above regarding the battery charging in our HD2s.
Just install the Battery Tool from the HTC test package found here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=896104&highlight=test
Then when you open the program, for fully (I mean really full battery) there must be the following lines there:
Code:
Weight: 1000
RARC: 1000
Voltage: 4196 (+/-, different, this is mine battery)
Current: 0
Full: 1230
ACR: 1230
Last one (ACR) and Weight (1000) are the most important, so that ACR == FULL. After that I can use the phone for 2 and half days with moderate usage.
When the usually charging appear, after the green light, when I open the application it says:
Code:
Weight: 686
RARC: 686
Voltage: 4196 (???)
Current: 30 (it appears still charging with small amount of amperage)
Full: 1230
ACR: 840
For me here the battery is 2/3 full, but is strange that it reports full voltage, although ACR << FULL. If I unplug the charger, then just right after some minutes I'm starting to see how the battery indicator decreases fast.
EDIT: It seems that after green light, If I unplug the charger and plug it again, the above settings change dramatically, as well as indicator, showing 2/3 full battery:
Code:
MS_Percent: 69
PA_Percent: 69
Weight: 686
RARC: 686
Voltage: 4196
Current: 75
Full: 1230
ACR: 845
Then after 2-3 minutes it's becoming green again and MS and PA pointing to 100, BUT Weight and RARC = 686.
The question is, is really battery 2/3 full or is just wrong determination of charging percents (battery indicator levels) as noted above?
ah, very good tool
I think that just proves what i suspected, the phone dosnt have a clue what its doing, to get a full charge, simply unplug when green light comes on, keep screen off on standby and replug-in,red light appears until it thinks its "full" repeat process until ACR is full. A reboot will have the same effect it seems
Failer to do so makes phone results in incorrect battery stats and can result in the phone appearing to have a much hight battery usage then it really does
hd2 wp7 battery tips
I struggled a lot initially then I did the following changes which made my battery last for 3 days, yes you heard it right.
1. Remove all live & Facebook (active) tiles from the home screen
2. Turn data/WiFi off when not in use.
yes, use the battery tool from htc to read and charge your battery to 100%...though it says 100%...charge until ACR reading and FULL reading are same or the battery current says zero....similar to current widget in android where the phone can be charged till the current is 0ma..meaning no current is passing between the phone and charger
Where do we get the battery tool from htc?
Edit: Foud the link in the above posts .... Thanx
Not exactly related but I have the same problem with charging, if I plug into my laptop it starts orange and turns green when its 100% but what it looks like to me is that when it thinks its charged it turns off the charger and the light still stays green.
So my battery starts draining but still showing green, if I unplug and plug back it will go to 100% but the same happens again.
Getting annoyed with this I got one of these...
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/UK-USB-Desktop-Battery-Charger-HTC-HD2-LEO-T8585-UK-/260757456468?pt=UK_MobilePhones_MobilePhoneAccessories_MobilePhoneChargers&hash=item3cb65b0654
Its tedious taking my battery out but now I get over a full day without having to charge.
P.S. the battery tool is in this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=911309
I'm a huge fan of this particular little battery-related nugget. And I'll be a monkey's uncle: it works.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1041912
My personal habits call for a soft-reset at bedtime (while it's plugged in) and a little video camera shoot when I wake. This yields about 18 hours of battery life for me with constant 3G and/or WiFi usage. I average ~12,000 texts per month.
GameDr04 said:
I'm a huge fan of this particular little battery-related nugget. And I'll be a monkey's uncle: it works.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1041912
My personal habits call for a soft-reset at bedtime (while it's plugged in) and a little video camera shoot when I wake. This yields about 18 hours of battery life for me with constant 3G and/or WiFi usage. I average ~12,000 texts per month.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
which version of WP7 and radio rom are u using ? Presume its a EU HD2
Every time when I plug my A500 for recharging, after the power button turned to white (or a kind of light blue...) indicating the device is fully charged, when I take a look at the battery stat, it shows "99%".
So, I noticed I only got "100%" when I boot the device while charging...
Is that common? The boot time drains 1% of battery till start the system???
It's really just an estimate of charge and you can't really take the number at face value.
I don't recall if the stock battery information shows you the actual voltage RIGHT NOW, but that's a more relevant number than the percentage shown.
An example is on my phone where it will show a fully charged battery to be at 4.210V which usually corresponds to 100%. When it says 4.210V, I know it's completely topped off regardless of what the percentage says. So there's some correlation between the voltage and what it regards that as a percentage of possible charge.
So it's not really using 1% at boot up. That's just a margin of error you can ignore.
qhorque said:
It's really just an estimate of charge and you can't really take the number at face value.
I don't recall if the stock battery information shows you the actual voltage RIGHT NOW, but that's a more relevant number than the percentage shown.
An example is on my phone where it will show a fully charged battery to be at 4.210V which usually corresponds to 100%. When it says 4.210V, I know it's completely topped off regardless of what the percentage says. So there's some correlation between the voltage and what it regards that as a percentage of possible charge.
So it's not really using 1% at boot up. That's just a margin of error you can ignore.
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Click to collapse
Well... Ok, as long as it`s not an issue...
Sometimes mine says 100% at full charge, sometimes it says %99.
I wouldn't sweat it.
alexrb said:
Well... Ok, as long as it`s not an issue...
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Click to collapse
If you charged it for 6 hours and it said 60%, you'd have a real issue. But 1% is really within the realm of tolerance, margin of error, etc. Definitely ignore it.
So, I am using MIUI 2.1.12 with LorDModUE 8.6 CFS 2WCR kernel.
I have installed 4EXT Recovery Controller and CurrentWidget.
With CurrentWidget, I monitored the battery while charging until it reached 0mA (which means the battery is as full as it can get).
With 4EXT Recovery Controller I removed the batterystats.bin file.
I drained the phone until it shut itself down. Then I charged it (without powering it on) until it was full (LED was green).
I power on the phone... 99% battery.
I plug in the charger... it says 26mA (which means it would reach 0mA as in full charge in another 20-30 minutes).
WHAT THE HELL?!
This never happened while I was using the default CM kernel included in MIUI. Only happened with Tiamat and LordMod.
--
Seriously, guys, what is the best way to calibrate the battery?! Perhaps I should not have let it shut itself down, but plug the charger when the phone was at 1% (which lasted for another 20-30 minutes, by the way)?!
if I don't remember it wrong the LED turns green at 90%.
afair the battery doesn't get charged during booting. which means that you probably lost the 1% during boot.
I also used the same method and got it calibrated correctly
but is their any other way too ?
monki79 said:
if I don't remember it wrong the LED turns green at 90%.
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Click to collapse
The LED turns green on AOSP ROMs at 90%, when the phone is ON, as far as I know. When it is OFF, it works fine (goes green at 100%).
I want to hear from the developers / those that know how these codes work and stuff... Cause I don't want to look at my phone how the percentage goes down so fast, then, when it reaches 10%, I can play Pocket Legends for another 20 full minutes -.-
Formhault said:
With CurrentWidget, I monitored the battery while charging until it reached 0mA (which means the battery is as full as it can get).
With 4EXT Recovery Controller I removed the batterystats.bin file.
I drained the phone until it shut itself down. Then I charged it (without powering it on) until it was full (LED was green).
I power on the phone... 99% battery.
I plug in the charger... it says 26mA (which means it would reach 0mA as in full charge in another 20-30 minutes).
WHAT THE HELL?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The battery doesn't charge to full capacity first time around. When I used to calibrate the battery I would charge until it was drawing 0mA, then reboot; it would be drawing about 26mA, so I'd charge to 0mA again and reboot; it would now be drawing about 15mA, so I'd carry on charging to 0mA, reboot, repeat, repeat and repeat until it eventually continued to draw 0mA after a reboot. Then I'd delete the batterystats.bin file.
As one of Google's engineers says, deleting your battery stats isn't going to improve your battery life. I haven't done any of that for a long time now and I've noticed precisely no difference (except for the extra time I've gained by not having to wait for it to finally charge up to full capacity).
hopscotchjunkie said:
The battery doesn't charge to full capacity first time around. When I used to calibrate the battery I would charge until it was drawing 0mA, then reboot; it would be drawing about 26mA, so I'd charge to 0mA again and reboot; it would now be drawing about 15mA, so I'd carry on charging to 0mA, reboot, repeat, repeat and repeat until it eventually continued to draw 0mA after a reboot. Then I'd delete the batterystats.bin file.
As one of Google's engineers says, deleting your battery stats isn't going to improve your battery life. I haven't done any of that for a long time now and I've noticed precisely no difference (except for the extra time I've gained by not having to wait for it to finally charge up to full capacity).
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Click to collapse
I know about Google's statement.
The battery would drain fast, then, when it reaches 1% or 5%, you would be able to use your phone like it had 30%. Just that it shows the values wrong. Calibrating the battery should fix that...
Anyway... I'm not going to struggle any further.
I'll tell what I've done;
- I have installed Battery Balibration app and CurrentWidget,
- Waited battery charging till reached 0ma,
- Removed battery stats and restarted,
- Then waited to drain battery and shut-down itself,
- I connected USB charger to PC and TURN ON THE PHONE !!
- Again waited battery to reach 0 ma,
- Then plugged off and monitored that current widget shows the range btw 3-10 !!
I don't know exactly if it helps but, maybe you should turn on your DHD while carging..
For further instructions you may qant to check this topic;
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1226016
Formhault said:
So, I am using MIUI 2.1.12 with LorDModUE 8.6 CFS 2WCR kernel.
I have installed 4EXT Recovery Controller and CurrentWidget.
With CurrentWidget, I monitored the battery while charging until it reached 0mA (which means the battery is as full as it can get).
With 4EXT Recovery Controller I removed the batterystats.bin file.
I drained the phone until it shut itself down. Then I charged it (without powering it on) until it was full (LED was green).
I power on the phone... 99% battery.
I plug in the charger... it says 26mA (which means it would reach 0mA as in full charge in another 20-30 minutes).
WHAT THE HELL?!
This never happened while I was using the default CM kernel included in MIUI. Only happened with Tiamat and LordMod.
--
Seriously, guys, what is the best way to calibrate the battery?! Perhaps I should not have let it shut itself down, but plug the charger when the phone was at 1% (which lasted for another 20-30 minutes, by the way)?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Theres a better alternative, use the battery calibration app in the market
https://market.android.com/details?id=com.nema.batterycalibration&hl=en
It's always worked a charm for me.
knp3385 said:
Theres a better alternative, use the battery calibration app in the market
https://market.android.com/details?id=com.nema.batterycalibration&hl=en
It's always worked a charm for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right, with Battery Calibration i have solved my problem with battery, now i can use all day without charging.
Sorry if my question is a silly one...
what's the point in calibrating your battery? I mean... except for the stats (and I guess, the percentage in the bar), do you improve your battery life by calibrating it?
Duwie_80 said:
Sorry if my question is a silly one...
what's the point in calibrating your battery? I mean... except for the stats (and I guess, the percentage in the bar), do you improve your battery life by calibrating it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Some says it's irrelevant, calibrating it's just an illusion
But did calibrate my battery and my battery life is improved too terrific !!
Duwie_80 said:
Sorry if my question is a silly one...
what's the point in calibrating your battery? I mean... except for the stats (and I guess, the percentage in the bar), do you improve your battery life by calibrating it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
fremce said:
Some says it's irrelevant, calibrating it's just an illusion
But did calibrate my battery and my battery life is improved too terrific !!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't really know. It would be silly for the Android system to display the battery percentage (up there, in the status bar) by reading the batterystats.bin.
My phone's battery level drops somewhat fast, then, when it would reach 30% or so, it doesn't drop as fast. Also, at times, when I reach 10%, 5% or even 1%, I am still able to play an intensive game like Pocket Legends for an extended ammount of time (30 minutes, for example). Pocket Legends is CPU/GPU intensive and it also requires an active Internet connection, so I'd say it's pretty power hungry.
I don't really get the entire purpose of calibration. I have done it and I can't seem to notice any difference.
I'm going to do it again, now, because I switched to a Sense ROM (RunnyDrOiD). I'll monitor the battery with Battery Monitor Pro. When it reaches +0mA, I'll reboot and so forth so forth until it's drawing 0mA, although I doubt I'll resist that much time, so I'll just delete the batterystats.bin after a few reboots, when it reachs 0mA.
fremce said:
Some says it's irrelevant, calibrating it's just an illusion
But did calibrate my battery and my battery life is improved too terrific !!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If everybody knew the meaning of the word "calibration" then nobody would talk such nonsense.
Calibration improves the accuracy of the percentage shown!
The illusion is that you improve your battery life with it....
Dlog said:
If everybody knew the meaning of the word "calibration" then nobody would talk such nonsense.
Calibration improves the accuracy of the percentage shown!
The illusion is that you improve your battery life with it....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I said... calibrating the battery may fix the "problem" where once you reach 1% / 5% you can use your phone like it still had ~20%.
I'm gone test it too...
Hi there people, I didn't find any battery thread similar to what I'm going to say so I'll spam a little bit
I've just found as I was fooling around this: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/PowerSki...AU_MobilePhoneAccessories&hash=item20c1a1c8ad
It suppose to be a silicon case with a battery build in(1500mah ..not bad), I don't know the dimensions but I just someone might think it as a solution to our 1230mah small battery(with this you have a total of 1730mah which is plenty)
P.S. To mods.. feel free to delete my post, I just wanted to inform the people about a solution that might be handy
evronetwork said:
Hi there people, I didn't find any battery thread similar to what I'm going to say so I'll spam a little bit
I've just found as I was fooling around this: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/PowerSki...AU_MobilePhoneAccessories&hash=item20c1a1c8ad
It suppose to be a silicon case with a battery build in(1500mah ..not bad), I don't know the dimensions but I just someone might think it as a solution to our 1230mah small battery(with this you have a total of 1730mah which is plenty)
P.S. To mods.. feel free to delete my post, I just wanted to inform the people about a solution that might be handy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
https://www.google.com/search?q=xda+powerskin+desire+hd
first link....
So, i'm charging the phone to 100%, the "remove charger" message appears, and i remove it. But in about 10 minutes, the phone is at 95% already (with screen off). After 95% it goes down normally, 1% every few hours with screen off.
But, if i let the phone still charging for a couple of hours after it reaches 100%, the battery % goes down as it should. Another thing is that, while it is said that after reaching 100% the battery does not receive power (i read in this forum), using KTweaker charging option (from the kernel) i see that my battery keeps charging normally (or even at a higher mA compared to < 100% ).
I'm on Omega Rom v19 JB 4.3 TW with KToonsez Kernel.
Thank you!
The battery, over time, loses its ability to hold a charge effectively.
This happens gradually and slowly.
I've also read that it's not healthy for the battery to sit too long at 100%, which is why it drops fast to anything below that. I don't how how true this is though.
Also, if it the phone stops charging at 100%, then why does it stay at 100% for hours if left plugged in?
If it stops charging, it should drop to 99% after some time, at which point it would start charging again until it reaches 100% and stop again, right?
It's true what you are saying. I guess it could be because in 2 + years of usage the battery is starting to lose some properties. Maybe it's time for a new battery if it becomes an issue.
thank you!
Is an extended battery an option (mostly the extended ones with the same size as the original ... @ around 3500 mA)? Anyone has any experience with those?
I guess it will give you probably, almost, half a day more use time, since it gives you almost 50% more mAh.