Fully working JIT - Fascinate General

I know this has been discussed but will samsung or google ever do this? I believe that it isn't a hardware limitation because up until 2.2 the hummingbird was faster and all native benchmarks show the same. Who needs another phone if they get this working our phone would perform as well as a tegra 2 imho.
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I lol'ed at this one

JIT isn't that magical...is it?
Sent from my Fascinate with CM7 Gingerbread

No its not but with some overclocking and the great devs here I'm sure it would pick up considerably. Sgs 2linpacks at 47 or so stock. Second gen snapdragons are pretty fast. Also I don't think outside of emulators there will be anything that will really push the hummingbirds gpu for a while yet.
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You can't compare us to snapdragons. Linpack doesn t like hummingbirds. Your logic is that's because they have a high number we are worse? Well buddy does your phone seem 1/8 times slower then other phones? Mine doesn't.
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No it doesn't but it's just a shame that it isn't optimized for our phones. All cpu benchmarks tell the same story when it comes to cpu performance. The reason we don't score over 3000 in quadrant or as high as other phones in productivity in smartbench it's because of the jit. Take.everyone back to 2.1 and see who's on top. My hope is with the nexus phone having a hummingbird sooner or later this will happen.
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I dont give a Jit
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stephenj37826 said:
No it doesn't but it's just a shame that it isn't optimized for our phones. All cpu benchmarks tell the same story when it comes to cpu performance. The reason we don't score over 3000 in quadrant or as high as other phones in productivity in smartbench it's because of the jit. Take.everyone back to 2.1 and see who's on top. My hope is with the nexus phone having a hummingbird sooner or later this will happen.
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The Nexus S has JIT with Gingerbread doesn't it? I thought JIT scored higher on snapdragons because it was first developed on the Nexus One.
Sent from my Fascinate with CM7 Gingerbread

ya seriously, like the hummingbird processes over 90 million triangles a second, thats freakin ridiculous, and i feel like the phone is underperforming, especially when other phones can do only around 22 million a second.. like wtf yo

This OP is a moron. Has no idea what the [email protected]$! he is talking about. We have JIT, we have a hummingbird cpu, we have a fast freaking phone. A number means ****. Can we get a mod close this?

You're a moron if you think we have a compiler built for the hummingbird processor. I guess you well never buy another phone seeing how this one is as fast as you'll ever need. Righhhhhhttttt LoL. It would help everything including battery life. The more time the cpu stays at higher clock speeds the more battery it uses. If you don't have something constructive to say just shut up. Also if you don't like the topic why the hell did you even click on it? And he calls me a moron lmao.
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I <3 flaming. Can't wait till ashasaur gets his computer back up.
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TheSonicEmerald said:
The Nexus S has JIT with Gingerbread doesn't it? I thought JIT scored higher on snapdragons because it was first developed on the Nexus One.
Sent from my Fascinate with CM7 Gingerbread
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No. Linpack is a pipeline test. This is where Snapdragons excel, because, they have a deeper, 128 bit pipeline, versus the 64 bit pipeline of all the other Cortex A8 CPUs. The Hummingbird excels in "integer" performance, and the Snapdragon excels in "float point operations." In normal use, the difference in performance between a Hummingbird and 2nd gen Snapdragon is nonexistent. You really only notice under specific circumstances, such as benchmarks. And the OMAP3 is just slow and doesn't excel in anything.

GoogleAndroid said:
No. Linpack is a pipeline test. This is where Snapdragons excel, because, they have a deeper, 128 bit pipeline, versus the 64 bit pipeline of all the other Cortex A8 CPUs. The Hummingbird excels in "integer" performance, and the Snapdragon excels in "float point operations." In normal use, the difference in performance between a Hummingbird and 2nd gen Snapdragon is nonexistent. You really only notice under specific circumstances, such as benchmarks. And the OMAP3 is just slow and doesn't excel in anything.
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Ah ok, thanks. I learn something everyday
Sent from my Fascinate with CM7 Gingerbread

GoogleAndroid said:
No. Linpack is a pipeline test. This is where Snapdragons excel, because, they have a deeper, 128 bit pipeline, versus the 64 bit pipeline of all the other Cortex A8 CPUs. The Hummingbird excels in "integer" performance, and the Snapdragon excels in "float point operations." In normal use, the difference in performance between a Hummingbird and 2nd gen Snapdragon is nonexistent. You really only notice under specific circumstances, such as benchmarks. And the OMAP3 is just slow and doesn't excel in anything.
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Thanks for the useful information.
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nevermind.
Sent from my brain on channel 64!

Benchmarks mean nothing between even the same model of device. They're only good for measuring changes with software or settings.
JIT either works or it doesn't. There is no "fully implemented" for JIT in Dalvik. It's either on or off.
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stephenj37826 said:
Thanks for the useful information.
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You're welcome. I was always curious as to why the Snapdragons scored so highly in Linpack, and so I looked into it, and that's what I found out.

found this here http://phandroid.com/2010/05/26/going-deeper-with-android-2-2s-jit-compiler/
Russell Troywest 1 comment collapsed Collapse Expand
@GODCYPH
Yes, you're right, the JIT would need to be coded to know the 'tricks' are there. I have absolutely no idea how the android JIT is designed (although if it's part of the open source package I might try and find some time to go find out). I suspect it doesn't do anything too clever, but it does need to know what processor it is compiling for to do its job so I guess the information is available to it...
Again, I'm not a JIT designer, I have enough knowledge of how they work to be dangerous and not much more
ALSO THIS
The whole idea of using a VM was that code could be run in virtually any instruction set (ie x86) without the need for recompiling. In essence, it compiles at runtime, basically the VM is an Interpreter. If a JIT is capable of utilizing a specific instruction set's "tricks", does that mean the JIT must be optimized for the processor it is running on? Wouldn't that mean a different JIT for every different processor/instruction set that would be made available?
Wouldn't a our processor be classified as different? Seeing as the nexus one is snapdragon.

Unless you're doing extreme HPC implementations where you absolutely need to squeeze every single bit of performance out of every possible configuration, you're not going to be coding, or even compiling for specific processors. You code for architectures and instruction sets.
Hummingbird and Snapdragon are both Arm Cortex v8 processors. When coding or compiling, you code for that.
The JVM, and a step further with the JIT take partially compiled code that is architecture agnostic and translate it to architecture-specific machine code at execution time. It's a step between scripting (JavaScript, PHP, perl, etc) and native compiled code (C, C++, etc).

Related

If froyo is optimized for snapdragon processors then why why samsung used humingbird

If froyo is optimized for snapdragon processors then why samsung used humingbird processor
Why do you assume this? The two cpu's share much in common.
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jaysins said:
Why do you assume this? The two cpu's share much in common.
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benchmarks and system speed
dadyal said:
benchmarks and system speed
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Why would Samsung make their own chip? Put simply, because they can. Samsung has the facilities and expertise needed to make their own chip, and by so doing they avoid the need of purchasing chips from another vendor (in this case, their competition: Qualcomm).
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http://pocketnow.com/hardware-1/snapdragon-versus-hummingbird
dadyal said:
If froyo is optimized for snapdragon processors then why samsung used humingbird processor
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because they didn't want to use the ****ty gpu that comes with the original snapdragon (the newer snapdragon like in the dhd has a good gpu).
Because hummingbird is vastly superior in real world scenarios
Quadrant and linpack as well as most CPU benchmarks that rely on math being done by FPU run much quicker on the snapdragon because of its 128 bit register vs hummingbirds 64. I believe the snapdragons can turn half of it off to save power too. This explains part of the benchmarks but the hummingbird has optimizations snapdragon doesn't, and vise versa,but is suppose to be faster in most real world scenarios as Samsung claims and judging by browser load time comparisons I've seen and how well it runs android 2.1 I'd be inclined to agree. It keeps up with a nexus running 2.2 which is very reassuring so I'd worry less on benchmarks if I were you unless you really feel the need to show your friends how fast your phone can calculate pi to nth degree.
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@ darkimmortal, Is it really? Then why does my n1 with its "crap" snapdragon CPU run everything faster?
On paper yes hummingbird is better, but in the real world as you put it, its only as good as the software that runs on it, and I've not found anything yet that runs faster thanks to having a hummingbird than it would on say an n1 or desire.
The sgs is crippled by rfs, no processor can make up for that. In 3d games the sgs out performs any snapdragon based phones
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jaysins said:
It keeps up with a nexus running 2.2 which is very reassuring so I'd worry less on benchmarks if I were you unless you really feel the need to show your friends how fast your phone can calculate pi to nth degree.
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No disrespect but a well setup nexus on 2.2 is noticeably faster than even the most streamlined lag fixed sgs. The sgs wins the quadrant benchmark but in actual use the nexus is a fair bit faster.
tameracingdriver said:
@ darkimmortal, Is it really? Then why does my n1 with its "crap" snapdragon CPU run everything faster?
On paper yes hummingbird is better, but in the real world as you put it, its only as good as the software that runs on it, and I've not found anything yet that runs faster thanks to having a hummingbird than it would on say an n1 or desire.
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You take into consideration just the CPU, N1 and SGS's file systems are different resulting in SGS to be bottlenecked; SGS's main plus is the GPU power, try running those types of GPU heavy items on N1 and they will not run as well. That's the main benefit of Hummingbird compared to Snap but don't just rely on comparing CPU's, there are more things at work here.
tameracingdriver said:
No disrespect but a well setup nexus on 2.2 is noticeably faster than even the most streamlined lag fixed sgs. The sgs wins the quadrant benchmark but in actual use the nexus is a fair bit faster.
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Quadrant doesn't mean much, placebo effect at work here. Just a benchmark and doesn't translate (much) into real-world performance. Remember that Google also developed 2.2 almost specifically with Nexus One in mind resulting in more benefits on a N1 than a lot of phones.
lokhor said:
In 3d games the sgs out performs any snapdragon based phone
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Admittedly I've not tried them all, and I admit the sgs runs the graphics benchmarks in quadrant noticeably faster, but the games I've tried all run about the same, so what good is that super powerful gpu if nothing takes advantage of it?
Try some gameloft games like asphalt 5, the sgs is a lot smoother
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Ill give it a try. Games are nice but not my main use, the ones I've tried so far including some 3d ones have been fine on the n1 so far.
Hummingbird is the processor of choice for the two most famous smartphones in the world at the moment. Our best among the rest Galaxy and the Iphone 4. So it's the winners choice.
tameracingdriver said:
Ill give it a try. Games are nice but not my main use, the ones I've tried so far including some 3d ones have been fine on the n1 so far.
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You could try using a GPU benchmark rather than a system wide benchmark to determine GPU power. Neocore for example is strictly GPU and SGS outperforms N1 almost two-fold.
Again, that is a benchmark and you just have to try out different apps and games to test out GPU's for yourself.
Well for what its worth I've just tried asphalt 5, on the n1 and honestly its just as smooth as on the sgs, so in the end I still say there seems no real advantage in the real world.
dnsp said:
Hummingbird is the processor of choice for the two most famous smartphones in the world at the moment. Our best among the rest Galaxy and the Iphone 4. So it's the winners choice.
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makes me wonder, if only Samsung could put iOS4 into Galaxy. we would have the fastest phone for sure,
unfortunately they builded Apple hardware and loaded crapy Android,
tameracingdriver said:
Well for what its worth I've just tried asphalt 5, on the n1 and honestly its just as smooth as on the sgs, so in the end I still say there seems no real advantage in the real world.
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Sorry mate but I have to disagree. Having owned a Nexus One, a HTC Desire and a SGS, I can tell you that the Nexus One was the fastest for opening apps, market, etc. The SGS fell between the nexus and the desire. I think each processor has been optimised for different things.
There is a HUGE difference in the graphics department. Asphalt, especially the old hardware accelerated versions (the new ones are dumbed down so they work on the snapdragon phones) were extremely laggy on the nexus and desire. on the SGS theyre very smooth and dont have the annoying multitouch bug.
Try the other gameloft games (sandstorm), polarbit (toon warz), pretty much all of the (few) 3d intensive apps. Very noticeable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WNt1EQYheQ
the difference in performance was the reason I switched, esp the annoying multi touch, and welcomed my way into a world of sgs lag issues and a non working gps
Im not a big gamer but I do occasionally pull out a title. The differences in the processors is also apparent if you use rockplayer to watch videos.
imho, I preferred the hardware and AOSP feel of the nexus but wish the hummingbird processor+gpu had been used instead of the snaprdragon (or alternatively the snapdragon with a better gpu).
sonci said:
makes me wonder, if only Samsung could put iOS4 into Galaxy. we would have the fastest phone for sure,
unfortunately they builded Apple hardware and loaded crapy Android,
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I hope you're kidding on this one!
iOS is a closed system with a closed mind. Apps have to go trough intensive aprouval for the AllMighty and AllKnowing apple before hitting the market and, for small idiotic mistake, like a logo to close to the one of the AllMighty, it won't be aprouved.
And not to talk about all the iTune that you have to install just to get it to sync/update... you think Kies is crappy, try iTune on windows...you'll get a couple of services in the background in bonus with the resource hog app!
And, on another note, you should all take in consideration all the GPU intessive task in android, Gaming is only part of it... don't forget browsing, gallery, video playback (you can record a 720p video and watch it back full fluid).
Frankly, I don't realy get all the fuss about the so called "lag" on SGS... I don't realy get any at all and I'm still on the original (no lag fix) rom...

Anyway the hummingbird will catch up to g2 processor

I know we have gotten to as high as 1.3 ghz but can our processors reach 1.4 or 1.5 ghz I know battery life would suck...but sometimes its cool to not have these other phones kick the crap out of us...haha
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Aye aye aye....
Unless the G2 was running Android 2.1 (which it never has been) it's virtually impossible to compare the two. Ghz mean nothing...
Wait until the Epic is running Froyo and see who needs to catchup to whom.
xusxmarinesx said:
I know we have gotten to as high as 1.3 ghz but can our processors reach 1.4 or 1.5 ghz I know battery life would suck...but sometimes its cool to not have these other phones kick the crap out of us...haha
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There was a 1.4ghz kernel but it want very stable. The extra 1ghz ain't much and is not needed unless your worried about how big your phones **** is
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Lol that was a good one.
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Not to mention that not all g2s can even handle over 1ghz, they've got a much weaker gpu and the hummingbird has been successfully rooted up to 1.6ghz, but its nowhere near ready for prime time
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The hummingbird can be clocked to 1.6hz and the gpu can achieve 75+fps on both neocore and nenamark (after having the fps cap removed.)
Is this not enough for you? We are still in 2010...
Team Whiskey has put out a Vibrant kernel (alpha) than can hit 1.6Ghz, and they're working on 1.8 and 2.0. Once they release the code (which should be soon), it shouldn't take long for an Epic version to surface.
Is stability not a problem with these high overclocks? I don't understand how someone can just put out a Xghz kernel for everyone to use. Aren't there hardware limits, ones that will be arbitrary device to device?
AndrewZorn said:
Is stability not a problem with these high overclocks? I don't understand how someone can just put out a Xghz kernel for everyone to use. Aren't there hardware limits, ones that will be arbitrary device to device?
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Pretty much. Not everyone's phone can overclock. Just the luck of the draw.
Kubernetes said:
Pretty much. Not everyone's phone can overclock. Just the luck of the draw.
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Not unlike desktop CPU overclocking then.
Well yes and no...every one can be overclocked...it boils down to how much..and how well of an over-clocker a chip is..then obviously it boils down to manufacture quality aka luck of the draw.
For example...the 1st gen snapdragon is a sub par overclocker...while the 550mhz chip in the original droid is an awesome overclocker....
It kinda boils down to the manufacturer limiting the frequency to a certain amount..sometimes for stability..but often times to charge you extra for more mhz...Intel has been doing it for years selling the same chip in 3 different clocks when in reality it is exactly the same chip.
I mean if samsung wanted to they could have easily released it at 1.3ghz..they just had no reason to...
just wait till the Epic is running 2.2 and u will see who the real winner is
the biggest issues for smartphone ocing are heat n battery, cuz unlike a desktop were u can keep uping the volts n if it gets to hot just add more cooling, a smartphone is all passive so you cant go much above stock voltage or it'll melt, plus wht good is 2ghz if u can only run it for an hour b4 ur battery dies
So then why is it such a big deal to make a ROM capable of a high clock? Someone could make a 5ghz ROM, but it would never work. If Hummingbird CAN go to 1.8ghz, I don't see why the current overclocked kernel's don't already reflect that.
In other words, I think we shouldn't hope for much over 1.2ghz, which is already pretty good.
Any stability testing programs for Android? Or is everyone saying "no crash = must be stable"?

Tegra 2 overclocking?

Any info out there about this baby overclocked? Will standard overclocking tools work or does new software need to be devloped?
To overclock the cpu I think you'd need a custom kernel that allows it first. But if the bootloader is locked then custom kernels can't be flashed.
You won't have to worry about performance issues with tegra 2 for while though .
As if you needed to run Crysis on it?
Tough crowd this morning!
This site is here for getting the most out of devices. Rooting and removing bloatware increases performance. Customized ROMS increase perfomance and user experience. I merely asked about another tool for optimizing a device.
bee55 said:
To overclock the cpu I think you'd need a custom kernel that allows it first. But if the bootloader is locked then custom kernels can't be flashed.
You won't have to worry about performance issues with tegra 2 for while though .
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Haha,don't underestimate the people who hang out at XDA and other dev sites, we find ways to work these phones to the bone. I know for myself I will have probably 100 apps downloaded and installed in the first 24 hours, and will be testing its limits.
You have the best cpu in a phone ever and you want to over clock. Wow. Why?
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snapdragon was the best @ one time and most roms had overclock built in!
Snapdragon is the worst CPU for 1ghz. Even the TI OMAP is better than Qualcomm. The main reason wont buy anymore HTC phones is because of Qualcomm and there ****ty performance in phone in comparison to Samsung, TI, and now Nvidia.
Recon Freak said:
snapdragon was the best @ one time and most roms had overclock built in!
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Hence why he said 'at one time'.
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AllTheWay said:
Snapdragon is the worst CPU for 1ghz. Even the TI OMAP is better than Qualcomm. The main reason wont buy anymore HTC phones is because of Qualcomm and there ****ty performance in phone in comparison to Samsung, TI, and now Nvidia.
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Snapdragon is far from being the worst CPU, clock for clock. First of all, Snapdragon is not a CPU, is a SoC (System on a Chip), and the CPU core inside Snapdragon is called Scorpion. Scorpion is neither a standard ARM Cortex A8 nor A9 core unlike the CPU core inside the Hummingbird/TI OMAP/Nvidia Tegra. But it can be thought of as among the same class as Cortex A8 CPUs. The Scorpion has some big advantage over standard Cortex A8 core in some areas (e.g. floating point). The reason why many found the first generation (in Nexus One and HTC Desire) to be "slow" was that they look only at composite benchmark like Quadrant and/or 3D games. The first generation of Snapdragon has a rather dated GPU (Adreno 200) in it, and Adreno 200's 3D performance is honestly, bad. The second generation Snapdragon (Desire Z/G2, Desire HD) uses a much faster GPU, Adreno 205, making the Snapdragon 3D performance on par with Hummingbird and other current generation SoC.
So before you go again saying Snapdragon is the slowest "CPU", go do some reading, and think, before saying. Here is some good reading for you:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4144/...gra-2-review-the-first-dual-core-smartphone/4
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4165/the-motorola-atrix-4g-preview/5
AllTheWay said:
Snapdragon is the worst CPU for 1ghz. Even the TI OMAP is better than Qualcomm. The main reason wont buy anymore HTC phones is because of Qualcomm and there ****ty performance in phone in comparison to Samsung, TI, and now Nvidia.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using Tapatalk
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if you blindly trust benchmarks the Scorpion CPU in the 2nd gen snapdragons are quite fast... my G2 benchmarks at...
Quadrant: 2,700ish
Linpack: 52.69
Sunspider:2,257
Neocore:57
infact, all of those benchmarks either match, or surpass the Atrix 4G.
No problems here with my snapdragon 1Ghz. linpacks constant 42+
Now that the phone is rooted can we use setCPU to underclock it so to save battery.
Or does setcpu not support dual core.
Also is what I said above true. if we have root we can underclock without putting custom kernels.
The nvidia tegra 2 kernel does not have a simple method to modify the CPU freq table. The dev working on the gtablet kernel would be a good resource to ask, his name is Pershoot. From my understanding he would have to backport the original ARM scaling which is not trivial in the least.
Maybe someone can figure out another way.
tsekh501 said:
As if you needed to run Crysis on it?
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Actually yeah, and who wouldn't? That's probably enough to get you instantly laid in some countries.
Arkasai said:
Actually yeah, and who wouldn't? That's probably enough to get you instantly laid in some countries.
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Serious bragging rights right there.
Guy 1: "Damnit, I just got Crysis 2, and I can't even run Crysis 1 on my computer."
Guy 2: "Yeah well I can run it on my cell phone...look."
Guy 1's Girlfriend: "Take me, now, Guy 2!."
You get the picture.
Sorry to go off-topic there. But I do have a question. Isn't the Tegra 2 ARM9 based? And there's nothing wrong with wanting to push a device to it's limits. Overclocking is fun.
dandmcd said:
Haha,don't underestimate the people who hang out at XDA and other dev sites, we find ways to work these phones to the bone. I know for myself I will have probably 100 apps downloaded and installed in the first 24 hours, and will be testing its limits.
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lol same here. I have about 45 installed on my Galaxy Tab and all of them will be installed on the Atrix immediately and tested. I plan on testing every single game I can find on the market lol biggest being Dungeon Defenders for now...runs a bit slow on the Galaxy Tab and I've heard on Tegra2 it runs *GREAT*.
AllTheWay said:
You have the best cpu in a phone ever and you want to over clock. Wow. Why?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using Tapatalk
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Because you can make it better. Why settle for less? My captivate is fast and does everything I need it to do at 1ghz but I have it at 1.3 now; and under volted.
Why? Because it is better.
Captivate 2.2.1 Paragon
Is there a simple way to backup all the apps installed on my phone so I can just dump them instantly into a new phone? Preferably without having to hit "install" for every app on the market.
wow, its a dual core processor and you want OC... ugh, get out... lol

Discovery(Can I call it so?) about Sensation's and Galaxy S 2's CPUs' performance

Hey guys,a long time ago in a galaxy far far away(well,it was only last week,but I gotta make it sound more dramatic ),I was watching video comparisons of the two phones on youtube and reading others like a maniac,trying to decide which is best.In every review that someone made a benchmark between the two and used Linpack to measure the CPU's power(believe me,there is nothing more reliable for the CPU),the end result was that the Sensation's CPU is better clock for clock marginally.
So there I was earlier today,trying to show myself how good my purchase was,and I was comparing my GS2 with my Desire HD.Before someone comes up and tries to defend the Sensation,bear in mind that:
1)The Sensation's dual-core CPU is actually two identical Scorpion cores,like the one found inside the Desire HD,just overclocked to 1.2GHz insted of 1GHz.
2)Linpack isn't able to properly benchmark dual-core CPUs,so the result you get is from one core.
Now,as most reviews showed,on 1.2GHz(yes,my DHD is rooted etc,check my sig) the scores of the Desire HD were slightly better than those of the GS2.Better...like 46MFLOPS against 45MFLOPS or so.
Then,the spirit of the overclocker took over my mind.So I grab both phones and overclock them all the way up to 1612MHz(usign Tegrak overclock ultimate on my GS2).The results are what I want to point out with this thread.
At that clock speed,the Desire HD struggled to get 60MFLOPS(In fact I don't think it ever reached that much,more like 58-59),while the GS2 was confidently between 63 and 65 MFLOPS.
Bottom line is that the GS2's performance increases in a more "linear" way than the Sensation's.I know most people won't overclock,but I am here to defend our phones!
In case you don't even care or find this thread pointless etc,you can pretty much press your back button and get out without flaming/trolling.Please?
Hey you went to all that effort so ill say good work, and having a positive thread about the gs2 is a good thing so double thumbs up.
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NIK516 said:
Hey you went to all that effort so ill say good work, and having a positive thread about the gs2 is a good thing so double thumbs up.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA Premium App
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Haha!Yep,I thought so!
Well,it's a nice find for me.At least I've proven that the Sensation doesn't have a better CPU as its users would like to believe and boast about!
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erm... aren't sensation and desire hd two different phones? also, you first say that linpack is the best cpu benchmark out there, but then you continue by saying that it cannot test dual core cpu?
i'm a bit confused.
andrej.marinic said:
erm... aren't sensation and desire hd two different phones? also, you first say that linpack is the best cpu benchmark out there, but then you continue by saying that it cannot test dual core cpu?
i'm a bit confused.
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Yep,one doesn't cancel the other.The only benchmarking tool that uses both cores is smartbench 2011 as of now.Others will probably follow.It's not a fault that Linpack doesn't benchmark both cores,the programmers haven't done the coding yet.Just that.
And yes,the Desire HD and the Sensation are different phones,albeit with the same CPU CORE,not the same CPU.
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tolis626 said:
Hey guys,a long time ago in a galaxy far far away(well,it was only last week,but I gotta make it sound more dramatic ),I was watching video comparisons of the two phones on youtube and reading others like a maniac,trying to decide which is best.In every review that someone made a benchmark between the two and used Linpack to measure the CPU's power(believe me,there is nothing more reliable for the CPU),the end result was that the Sensation's CPU is better clock for clock marginally.
So there I was earlier today,trying to show myself how good my purchase was,and I was comparing my GS2 with my Desire HD.Before someone comes up and tries to defend the Sensation,bear in mind that:
1)The Sensation's dual-core CPU is actually two identical Scorpion cores,like the one found inside the Desire HD,just overclocked to 1.2GHz insted of 1GHz.
2)Linpack isn't able to properly benchmark dual-core CPUs,so the result you get is from one core.
Now,as most reviews showed,on 1.2GHz(yes,my DHD is rooted etc,check my sig) the scores of the Desire HD were slightly better than those of the GS2.Better...like 46MFLOPS against 45MFLOPS or so.
Then,the spirit of the overclocker took over my mind.So I grab both phones and overclock them all the way up to 1612MHz(usign Tegrak overclock ultimate on my GS2).The results are what I want to point out with this thread.
At that clock speed,the Desire HD struggled to get 60MFLOPS(In fact I don't think it ever reached that much,more like 58-59),while the GS2 was confidently between 63 and 65 MFLOPS.
Bottom line is that the GS2's performance increases in a more "linear" way than the Sensation's.I know most people won't overclock,but I am here to defend our phones!
In case you don't even care or find this thread pointless etc,you can pretty much press your back button and get out without flaming/trolling.Please?
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In regards to the linpack, i think i've seen the same comparison review. I mentioned it in the same thread that i ran the test and also got near 47MFLOPS when i ran the test. Same thing goes for quadrant, i've hit as high as 3450ish on stock rom and then gotten as low as 2900. I've posted in the same website that their testing method is flawed because they don't run multiple tests
I hate the fact that in comparision reviews between GS2 and Sensation, reviews usually just say both of them use 1.2GHz dual-cores and fail to mention that the CPUs are not the same.
As tolis626 pointed out that the CPU's cores in the sensation are the old Scorpion CPU used in the DHD but have one more core. They are partially out of order, while the Cortex-A9 in GS2 are fully out of order which translate to a win for GS2.
On the Linpack benchmark, it measures floating point performance and Scorpion has a better implementation of floating point unit hence Scorpion is better than Cortex-A9 clock for clock in Linpack. But smartphone application is not bound by floating point performance, according to AnandTech, so we won't see that extra performance all the time.
well I got 48.208MFLOPS without any overclock on my SGS2
Like the majority of users, I'm a noob when it comes to overclocking/rooting/benchmarking, I just haven't gone near it (yet )
I watch others' videos on it. And basically, on the stock browser, on the stock ROM, the GSII always get significantly better than the Sensation....so I'm happy with my purchase. Seems soo pointless going for a "HTC" because it has the "HTC" logo, even though it's browser is poor and it's signal fails.
ok, the above is a stupid troll comment. But you get the point.
nhat2991 said:
I hate the fact that in comparision reviews between GS2 and Sensation, reviews usually just say both of them use 1.2GHz dual-cores and fail to mention that the CPUs are not the same.
As tolis626 pointed out that the CPU's cores in the sensation are the old Scorpion CPU used in the DHD but have one more core. They are partially out of order, while the Cortex-A9 in GS2 are fully out of order which translate to a win for GS2.
On the Linpack benchmark, it measures floating point performance and Scorpion has a better implementation of floating point unit hence Scorpion is better than Cortex-A9 clock for clock in Linpack. But smartphone application is not bound by floating point performance, according to AnandTech, so we won't see that extra performance all the time.
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What I was trying to get at is that the Sensation is NOT better clock for clock,it just gives better numbers at that frequency.It also kneels when underclocked and under terrible load,something the GS2 doesn't suffer from.
Don't be mistaken,the Scorpion CPU core is a really good one.And as far as I'm concerned it's by far better than the CPU of the Hummingbird inside the original GS.What plagues the Sensation is a terrible implementanion of the Scorpion core in a dual-core chipset.We should wait till some devs do their magic on that thing before we can call it worse.
Just my...5 cents,I wrote too much!
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tolis626 said:
And as far as I'm concerned it's [scorpion] by far better than the CPU of the Hummingbird inside the original GS.
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is this a subjective or an objective observation?
http://smartphonebenchmarks.com/for...-gen-snapdragon-processors-how-fast-are-they/
they both seem quite competitive
vizir said:
is this a subjective or an objective observation?
http://smartphonebenchmarks.com/for...-gen-snapdragon-processors-how-fast-are-they/
they both seem quite competitive
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Woah,I did state that ONLY the CPU is better on the QSD8255,not that the whole SoC is better than the Hummingbird.The latter was a beast in the graphics department(and still is),so it's more than competitive actually.
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Just get straight to the point!

Right, I cannot make my mind up so I thought I would come on here, il make it short.
Which has better performance - Snapdragon 800 OR Exynos 5420
I don't give a flying f*** about 4G or 4K. Which one has better performance i.e which is faster?
hayat55 said:
Right, I cannot make my mind up so I thought I would come on here, il make it short.
Which has better performance - Snapdragon 800 OR Exynos 5420
I don't give a flying f*** about 4G or 4K. Which one has better performance i.e which is faster?
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I would say the Snapdragon 800 because more devs would get it= more roms, better clock speed, better battery life because of chipset enhancements, faster charging because of chipset enhancements. If none of those matter to you get the Exynos version.
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hayat55 said:
Right, I cannot make my mind up so I thought I would come on here, il make it short.
Which has better performance - Snapdragon 800 OR Exynos 5420
I don't give a flying f*** about 4G or 4K. Which one has better performance i.e which is faster?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Define performance.
Then we talk. My definition of performance is much different from that of my neighbour.
Dont you think you are showing too much attitude? How hard is it to say please? And snapdragon and exynos benchmarks are about the same
XDA HellHound said:
Dont you think you are showing too much attitude? How hard is it to say please? And snapdragon and exynos benchmarks are about the same
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To be technical, it seems that Exynos benchmarks are slightly higher. However, I believe that is without the HMP update. With that, scores will skyrocket.
I can't make my mind up whether to get snapdragon 800 version or exynos 5420. By performance i mean which can do more multitasking and which can run apps faster etc
From what I've seen the scores are indeed about the same on the benchmark front. They will both be good! I'm guessing the s800 will get more dev support and probably cm. It will all be your choice, do you want lte or not.
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Sammath said:
From what I've seen the scores are indeed about the same on the benchmark front. They will both be good! I'm guessing the s800 will get more dev support and probably cm. It will all be your choice, do you want lte or not.
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Click to collapse
One thing that pushes me towards the exynos is that it has 1866 ram speed whereas snapdragon only has 800
Which do you think will be better in the long run?
^^^ forgot to mention that because exynos has higher ram speed then that means quicker performance.
So, which one should I get? Will there really be any difference between the performance of exynos 5420 and snapdragon 800?
You really do seem to have an attitude in your posts. Anyways, the phone isn't out yet so all anybody has is benchmarks to go by. Not a lot of real world use reviews out there to compare the two.
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I guess the ram speed can be neglected in real life usage. The s4 with the s600 feels the same as the octa version to me. And that is while the octa s4 obliterated the s600 in Antutu and some other Benchmarks. Like I've said before, if you want lte and better rom support get the s800 one. If you're really spec whoring get a 8 core exynos.
Anyways, from what I've seen so far the s800 seems to be faster in Antutu but not that much so I guess they will be at the same level of performance.
I would get any device I could get which for me is the s800 since I'm from the Netherlands.
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S800
LTE
Better support
Benchmark mean absolutely nothing and are a terrible way if measuring a phone. I've seen plenty if phones have high numbers but real world experience sucked.
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Easy. Snapdragon since there will be much more support for it from developers.
Also, don't forget, the 8-core is a lie
You have your normal 4-cores with an additional 4 'smaller' cores to handle always running less intense things. I really don't see the advantage to this, you don't get more out of benchmarks because those 4 'smaller' cores won't be used, except by some obscure background task that wouldn't slow down the benchmark anyways. It also won't help with the battery life, no matter how you spin it a clock cycle is a clock cycle.
The only time you will see gains from small memory speed increases are in things like calculating pie, so again, useless for day-to-day stuff. As other have stated, support. Qualcomm based will get AOSP based roms without any problems.
If you are looking to flaunt your meaningless bigger numbers around, by all means, get the 8-core.
designgears said:
Also, don't forget, the 8-core is a lie
You have your normal 4-cores with an additional 4 'smaller' cores to handle always running less intense things. I really don't see the advantage to this, you don't get more out of benchmarks because those 4 'smaller' cores won't be used, except by some obscure background task that wouldn't slow down the benchmark anyways. It also won't help with the battery life, no matter how you spin it a clock cycle is a clock cycle.
The only time you will see gains from small memory speed increases are in things like calculating pie, so again, useless for day-to-day stuff. As other have stated, support. Qualcomm based will get AOSP based roms without any problems.
If you are looking to flaunt your meaningless bigger numbers around, by all means, get the 8-core.
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Not true anymore. They are releasing an update to run all 8 cores at the same time to make it a true octacore
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kiter86 said:
Not true anymore. They are releasing an update to run all 8 cores at the same time to make it a true octacore
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk 4
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Click to collapse
Source? Cause idk about that....
kiter86 said:
Not true anymore. They are releasing an update to run all 8 cores at the same time to make it a true octacore
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk 4
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I thought they were. Wasn't it something like a Heterogeneous or HMP update.
SgtGoldy said:
Source? Cause idk about that....
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was news a few weeks ago.......
http://www.phonearena.com/news/Sams...-update-to-become-true-octa-core-chip_id47353
http://www.androidpolice.com/2013/0...a-software-new-hardware-not-needed-after-all/
kiter86 said:
Not true anymore. They are releasing an update to run all 8 cores at the same time to make it a true octacore
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk 4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It can't be a true 8-core. The extra 4 cores are far less powerful then the other 4.
designgears said:
It can't be a true 8-core. The extra 4 cores are far less powerful then the other 4.
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Click to collapse
Let me tell you some preludes:
The reason behind using 8 cores was to put in a pair of four aggressively powerful quad processors like the cortex A15 with another pair of less powerful yet more power efficient four quad processors like cortex A7.
This is the main intention behind putting all these 8 cores of ARM's big.little architecture. The purpose is to let the A15s handle power hungry tasks like web page opening, playing an asphalt 8 game etc while the a7s would handle "simple" tasks. This is more vividly demoed in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zwbeb08W27U
Now, the way you are saying it is not a true 8 core processor as if you are
1. demanding 8 cortex A15 processors using 28 nm technology.
Do you know/have any idea what could happen if they all be available online at the same time in this case?
or
2. you knew there was a "true" octa core processor in the world, to be (or already) implemented in another device. IF SO, point us to that device and also explain what is the ideal to call a processor true 8 core.
It was never an intention of ARM to put eight A15s (for example) available for heterogeneous multi-processing.
Go here. Again 64 bit A57s are to be paired with 32 bit A52s.
Even the S4 equipped with exynos 5410 is an octa core processor device. It is just that the bloody CCI (cache coherence interconnector, CCI400) was crippled to enable all the 8 cores available online. Once the 8 cores packed in a SoC like this it is an octa core processor device. Whether or not you like it to call true 8 core.
Samsung/ARM worked on this and released another SoC (in the form of upgraded exynos) which has a working CCI that is free from the above mentioned flaw(s) which will have Cluster Migration by default and will receive the update that is made from Linaro team to enable all the 8 cores available online and therefore will become a "TRULY WORKING" 8 core processor which is implemented in Note 3.
These are facts, these have been heavily discussed in the general section of Samsung Galaxy S4 forums.
Oh, another thing- just because all these 8 cores are made to be available online it does not mean all the 8 cores will be working Simultaneously regardless of what application is in the process. Depending on the needs of the app(s) all these 8 cores (ranging from 1 core to the extreme case- 8 cores) can be used. If an app needs 4 cores, they can be used. If it needs 6 cores then they can be used. If it needs 8 cores then they can be used.
I personally am curious to see how it be going when all the 8 cores were used for an app.
And to the OP who's demadning a straight answer, my thoughts:
we do not know anything atm how power efficient and cool it'd be to have the HMP doing all these tasks. This requires
real life buyers buy the device
start playing with it
see how hot the device becomes (compared to another exynos device like s4).
It actually depends on those stuffs. You demand the answer as if we all knew from the beginning how exynos 5420 gonna perform in real life.

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