Database Users

Windows Phone 7 with full "multitouch" on our HD2´s

Hey xda´s!
Today I´m getting my own HD2 from england and I can´t wait to hold it in my hands
But I have some questions about the phone.
The first one is...Will the HD2 be upgradeable to Wiindows Phone 7 or if it will not be official upgradeable will the xda´s can do it? I know its early to ask about WM7 because there are not really many specs out about it yet but I would like to know what you think about that
And my second question is...Will the HD2 with it´s capacitive screen have full "multitouch" aahh sorry "pinch to zoom" support on WM7?
...or will the xda´s enable more multitouch gestures in the next weeks or months?

There have been tons of queries about this subject, please use the search before posting. It's probably safe to say that HTC won't be giving us WinMo7 the official way, but I'm sure the XDA community will find a way getting it to our beloved HD2 "the other way"

it will be possible congrats for ur new mob you'll love it

Yep! Thats right! If not Officially, you can bet that Win Mo 7 will be made available on the HD2 by the talented devs here. And not just that, we might even get Android to run on it!
Congrats on your purchase!

Tanmay® said:
..., we might even get Android to run on it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats a point i never got...
Why do people want to port Android on Wimo Phones? I you like Andorid, why don't you directly buy an Android phone which was designed for the operating system. I guess thats better than having a bad ported version running on a phone desigend for windows mobile.

actually this subject is non sense.

LordK said:
Thats a point i never got...
Why do people want to port Android on Wimo Phones? I you like Andorid, why don't you directly buy an Android phone which was designed for the operating system.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
People do it because, in the case of the HTC Leo/HD2, there's not one piece of hardware quite like it being sold with Android installed.
I guess smartphones are quickly becoming the new PCs & Laptops of the age. Some people buy a PC with an OS installed as default, they like the hardware but not the OS (usually Windows, maybe OSx) so they just format the HDD and install say Ubuntu etc etc.

jagnet said:
People do it because, in the case of the HTC Leo/HD2, there's not one piece of hardware quite like it being sold with Android installed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah but you will never get a well-performing port until an OEM makes a device with the same hardware. Who's going to make the drivers for you?

vangrieg said:
Yeah but you will never get a well-performing port until an OEM makes a device with the same hardware. Who's going to make the drivers for you?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's true. Though the Acer A1 and Xperia X3 both use snapdragon so drivers (or partial drivers) will undoubtedly make their way to the porting project.

Yes but then you will have Android devices with the same level of hardware as HD2! So the initial question remains - why not buy them instead of coping with inevitable problems with ports?
It's not like drivers instantly start working when you copy them from one device to another, even with the same hardware platform - check out the video drivers thread to see what I mean. You're doomed to have problems like battery drain or calls dropping or poor performance in some areas or what not.
Then there will be some problems with applications - I don't know about the new devices, but all the current Android ones have low-res screens.
In addition to that, you really want 2.0 with Sense, and there's no port of that available AFAIK. Plain Android is just dull, it's nothing to fret about, IMO.
I understand the fun of porting and making things work, but using that as your primary device? It's guaranteed to be worse than what you have now.

Neither of those devices have 4.3 inch touchscreens. Also The HD2 has a look and feel all of its own.
The only thing spoiling it for me is Windows Mobile and the terrible onscreen keyboard so if we could port Android to this device I would be elated as it has a much better marketplace (Windows Marketplace is really a sack over overpriced crap), less cludge and better built in apps - the Youtube app for example supports user subscriptions and favourites viewing, and I'm a big online video fan.
The fact that Android was built from the ground up for capacitive touchscreen devices rather than being a patched up ropey old operating system with a shell interface on top makes me drool at the idea of it being on the HD2, and YES we could buy an Android device of similar specification BUT where's the fun in that??? Check the name of this site.........................

Well, I'm not on the Google/Android hype bandwagon, I do admit that the UI out of the box there is much more finger friendly and the notifications are implemented in the best way among all the mobile phone OSes, but otherwise Android's greatness is blown out of all reasonable proportion. An Android crippled by driver incompatibilities/incomplete implementation is something that totally misses the concept of attractive in my terms...
That said, I'm sure I'll install it myself one day (via haret or otherwise) just out of curiosity, that would certainly serve to satisfying the geek in me. But to expect that your experience from using the device would improve is somewhat unrealistic.

I am happy with the HD2 and figured I would decide what platform to go with at the time of my next phone purchase. This report should mean I can try out Windows Mobile 7 on the HD2 and take that into consideration as well.
http://msmobiles.com/news.php/8793.html

CAH000 said:
I am happy with the HD2 and figured I would decide what platform to go with at the time of my next phone purchase. This report should mean I can try out Windows Mobile 7 on the HD2 and take that into consideration as well.
http://msmobiles.com/news.php/8793.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nice, i can't wait

MSmobiles is full of **** as usual. They post BS to get hits every once in a while.

Honeycomb?

http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2011/01/android-30-platform-preview-and-updated.html

v0kal said:
http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2011/01/android-30-platform-preview-and-updated.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As of now this is all I would be interested in from 3.0 . Hope cyanogen can pull this into CM7
New types of connectivity: New APIs for Bluetooth A2DP and HSP let applications offer audio streaming and headset control. Support for Bluetooth insecure socket connection lets applications connect to simple devices that may not have a user interface.

Yep seems to be a preview SDK for 3.0 with a final SDK in coming weeks. Simply prep for Honeycomb tablets.

"A built-in GL renderer lets developers request hardware-acceleration of common 2D rendering operations in their apps, across the entire app or only in specific activities or views."
So it seems that 2.3 isn't hardware accelerated...now I want 3.0 on my desire . But here's another quote:
"Android 3.0 (Honeycomb) is a new version of the Android platform that is designed from the ground up for devices with larger screen sizes, particularly tablets."
So Honycomb isn't for phones? I really hope Google can clear things up a bit because I remember Andy rubben saying the Honycomb can adapt to phones & tablets.
Any thoughts or theories?

Weren't there enough thoughts and theories about it?

Jack_R1 said:
Weren't there enough thoughts and theories about it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes there was a lot of theories, but now we have something official to discuss rather than hearsay. Anyway, don't discuss if you don't feel like it.

How about the 2.4? really don't know what Goolge is thinking about. Just want a stable version and improve it by other works. Not so much version and make people confuse. It seems that N1 may not flash it~~

mr.r9 said:
Yes there was a lot of theories, but now we have something official to discuss rather than hearsay. Anyway, don't discuss if you don't feel like it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looking at the new preview SDK, it only big screens by default. And reading through the platform highlights really only mentions tablets. However, a couple Android devs have already stated its for all platforms. Seems to me that they don't want to reveal that its for phones yet, so that they can advertise that it is made for tablets.
The main criticism the iPad got was being a giant iPhone. I think they want to avoid that by having people believe that it isn't the same Android that is on phones.
I guess when they release the full SDK we'll know for sure.

Interesting...the beat goes on!

Honeycomb is also for phones, but we all knew that right?
From the documentation:
Publishing your app for tablet-type devices only
Additionally, you should decide whether your application is for only tablet devices (specifically, xlarge devices) or for devices of all sizes that may run Android 3.0.
If your application is only for tablets (xlarge screens; not for mobile devices/phones), then you should include the <supports-screens> element in your manifest with all sizes except for xlarge declared false.
With this declaration, you indicate that your application does not support any screen size except extra large. External services such as Android Market may use this to filter your application from devices that do not have an extra large screen.
Otherwise, if you want your application to be available to both small devices (phones) and large devices (tablets), do not include the <supports-screens> element.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, all clear then! The future of Android looks neat!

Nice find
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

spamlucal said:
Honeycomb is also for phones, but we all knew that right?
From the documentation:
Well, all clear then! The future of Android looks neat!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmmmm...good find! Android is getting really interesting visually, which is IMO a milestone it needed to reach a while ago
Anyway, can't wait for an alpha sdk image on my phone to play with if that's possible currently

Forget Ginga and Honeycomb. Havent you all hear of whats ahead of honeycomb? Its called " Chicken Soup". Yup, ik... Weird name. But its only for dual core over 2ghz. So phones arent ready. Its suppose to be completely holographic 3d without glasses. Pretty neat. And requires horsepower of xbox 360 or more. Anything less and its a no go. Its suppose to be the next gen OS and quantum leap from even honeycomb. Remember the name "chicken soup". Its comming next year by christman. Cant wait!
Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk

SINNN said:
Forget Ginga and Honeycomb. Havent you all hear of whats ahead of honeycomb? Its called " Chicken Soup". Yup, ik... Weird name. But its only for dual core over 2ghz. So phones arent ready. Its suppose to be completely holographic 3d without glasses. Pretty neat. And requires horsepower of xbox 360 or more. Anything less and its a no go. Its suppose to be the next gen OS and quantum leap from even honeycomb. Remember the name "chicken soup". Its comming next year by christman. Cant wait!
Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This was a horrible and incredibly illogical troll/joke attempt

spamlucal said:
Honeycomb is also for phones, but we all knew that right?
From the documentation:
Well, all clear then! The future of Android looks neat!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It actually does not mean much.
Android application could always define different layouts for different resolutions, orientations, themes or screen sizes. So, it is just one additional form factor, one of many. And the way to say to the market which layouts are supported and which are not.
It also does not mean, that "honeycomb for phones" would be the same as honeycomb for tablets "just smaller".
They only said, that phone version will move in similar direction. Which can mean pretty much anything.
In fact I expect, that honeycomb for phones will be seriously different, since a lot of new honeycomb for tablets features on smaller screens do not make any sense.

My theory:
Honeycomb is currently, Tablets only.
We are going to see a division in Android for Phones and Android for Tablets.
Tablets will be at 3.0 starting off.
Phones are currently at 2.3, and will continue 2.4 being Gingerbread as well with updates that should have happened with 2.3. (Like 2.0 and 2.1 being Eclair)
Once phones have the ability to run such a resource hungry operating system(3.0) the Phone and Tablet versions of Android will merge into one.

Wisefire said:
My theory:
Honeycomb is currently, Tablets only.
We are going to see a division in Android for Phones and Android for Tablets.
Tablets will be at 3.0 starting off.
Phones are currently at 2.3, and will continue 2.4 being Gingerbread as well with updates that should have happened with 2.3. (Like 2.0 and 2.1 being Eclair)
Once phones have the ability to run such a resource hungry operating system(3.0) the Phone and Tablet versions of Android will merge into one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But the hardware of the new tablets is the same Tegra 2 of the new phones, so I think the problem is the adaptability of the OS to smaller screens in a way it is usable for our fingers.
Anyone here used the leaked "honeycomb music player"? It has all the new characteristics we saw on the xoom tablet but worked very nice on my Nexus One with 2.2.1.
I think when honeycomb's source code come out we will get working builds.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

I heard Ice cream is going to be only for refrigerators. You know cause of the thermostat API that very few phones support.

marlonbr said:
But the hardware of the new tablets is the same Tegra 2 of the new phones, so I think the problem is the adaptability of the OS to smaller screens in a way it is usable for our fingers.
Anyone here used the leaked "honeycomb music player"? It has all the new characteristics we saw on the xoom tablet but worked very nice on my Nexus One with 2.2.1.
I think when honeycomb's source code come out we will get working builds.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe you are absolutely right. I tried making an AVD for Honeycomb with the screen resolution of my Nexus One. The launcher force closed continuously but you could see that the standard pull down notification bar was there. So I take that to mean that Honeycomb is for all devices and just changes its layout based on screen size.

draugaz said:
It actually does not mean much.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A little bit of context: The text I copy-pasted is in a section called "Upgrade or Develop a New App for Tablets and Similar Devices"
In it, is says:
If you want to develop something truly for tablet-type devices running Android 3.0, then you need to use new APIs available in Android 3.0. This section introduces some of the new features that you should use.
The first thing to do when you create a project with the Android 3.0 preview is set the <uses-sdk> element to use "Honeycomb" for the android:minSdkVersion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What does this mean? it means this app won't work on anything other lower than honeycomb. So, the "choose your screen size" text I pasted yesterday applies to honeycomb-only apps.
The documentation in the SDK is a nice read actually

Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1 or iPad 2?

I want to buy a tablet and I'm hesitant between the 10.1 and the iPad 2. I'm no expert and they both seem somehow identical to me, in your opinion what are the main differences and your recommendations. Thanks in advance!

Asus Transformer Prime
I'm just a junior member here, too, so I'm hoping not to get flamed on this one, but...
the biggest difference between the SG Tab 10.1 and the iPad2 is going to be the OS. Android vs iOS, the age-old debate.
I personally prefer Android, due to the possibility to delve into the innermost workings make adjustments, tweaks and change stuff to the way I like it. iOS is a bit cleaner, and faster, but without some serious hacking you can't change very much of the inner workings. Its like buying a Lambo or an old muscle car (a GTO for example), they're both going to be fast...but chances are, if you want to modify or adjust something, its going to be a hell of a lot easier on the muscle car (Android). Whereas when you open the Lambo's (iOS) hood, you only see plastic housing which hides all of the real machinery.
Sure, the hardware specs are also going to vary a bit, but that's misleading because Apple products can do a lot with a lot less. But they're both going to be fast tablets, that basically have the computing power of an average notebook (excluding enterprise or gaming laptop).
But the reason I wanted to reply, is to suggest that you wait a month (or a couple of weeks) and check out the Asus Transformer Prime. The hardware specs are sic, and (again, on paper) dwarf the SGTab and the iPad. Don't get me wrong, I wanted a SGTab until about 2 weeks ago, too. But the Asus will beat them both, if my assumptions are correct.
The biggest advantage of the Asus...quad-core processing (with an alternate 5th) and the latest version of the Android OS. Ice Cream Sandwich. (disclaimer: you could probably load ICS onto the SGTab, but in doing so you might void a warranty)
My advice, hold out a few more weeks and investigate all options (read: Asus Transformer Prime).

Not sure why you would come to a Samsumg Tab forum to see if people would recommend the iPad... But seriously, there may be other places on the web where you would get a balanced view. I love the Samsung.
Jim

When people ask me for a recommendation the first questions I ask are, "Do you have a Smartphone and what OS is it, iOS or Android? How invested (paid apps) in your OS are you?" and, "Exactly what are you planning to use the tablet for?"
Once they answer those questions then I can give them an honest opinion.
Me? I was looking for something to replace my 11.6" netbook for travel and general email/internet use. My 10.1 is perfect for my needs. Spent a week in NYC with my Tab and didn't miss the netbook once. (plus getting it for $100 off at Staples didn't hurt either)

Please google the following, it might give you some help on your research:
Tech supremacy blogspot (Why Android)
It just talk about Android OS and Apple's iOS and it applies on both Phones and Tablets.
Regards
Sent from my GT-P7500 using xda premium

sean is here.
I have checked the Asus on GSM Arena and the specs are great but does not make much difference to me compared to the SG Tab 10.1 and the iPad 2.
Jay Evans
I have a Samsung Galaxy Ace phone with Gingerbread. I have very few paid apps on my phone. I plan to use the tablet for entertainment and simply being online; emailing, Facebook... etc
So, what do you recommend?

tommydorsey
I just trust the forum here, and I thought many who had already purchased the SG Tab 10.1 and considered the iPad 2 as well, and would have some good pointers.
Willy318is
I read the article, it's helpful, thanks man!

So you will basically just buy the tabled and use it as is.. you dont care about modding or anything like that.
I would recommend the ipad then.

sean is here. said:
I'm just a junior member here, too, so I'm hoping not to get flamed on this one, but...
the biggest difference between the SG Tab 10.1 and the iPad2 is going to be the OS. Android vs iOS, the age-old debate.
I personally prefer Android, due to the possibility to delve into the innermost workings make adjustments, tweaks and change stuff to the way I like it. iOS is a bit cleaner, and faster, but without some serious hacking you can't change very much of the inner workings. Its like buying a Lambo or an old muscle car (a GTO for example), they're both going to be fast...but chances are, if you want to modify or adjust something, its going to be a hell of a lot easier on the muscle car (Android). Whereas when you open the Lambo's (iOS) hood, you only see plastic housing which hides all of the real machinery.
Sure, the hardware specs are also going to vary a bit, but that's misleading because Apple products can do a lot with a lot less. But they're both going to be fast tablets, that basically have the computing power of an average notebook (excluding enterprise or gaming laptop).
But the reason I wanted to reply, is to suggest that you wait a month (or a couple of weeks) and check out the Asus Transformer Prime. The hardware specs are sic, and (again, on paper) dwarf the SGTab and the iPad. Don't get me wrong, I wanted a SGTab until about 2 weeks ago, too. But the Asus will beat them both, if my assumptions are correct.
The biggest advantage of the Asus...quad-core processing (with an alternate 5th) and the latest version of the Android OS. Ice Cream Sandwich. (disclaimer: you could probably load ICS onto the SGTab, but in doing so you might void a warranty)
My advice, hold out a few more weeks and investigate all options (read: Asus Transformer Prime).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The big question is what does that quad core get you. It is no easy task coding a thread efficient app. gods it took like 6 years before any core advantaged apps came out for the pc and those are still far n few to this day. Reality is most of your android apps in the next 2 years will be single threaded which means all things being equal frequency not core count is your performance driver. You might get some advantage in multitasking but that remains to be seen how the os takes advantage of the cores
Sent from my GT-P7510 using Tapatalk

I used to have an iPhone 3GS and a iPod Touch 3G 64GB. After moving to an Android device (phone), and later on getting the Samsung Galaxy 10.1" wifi model, I am extremely happy that I switched to Android. It's so much less locked down, and the flexibility is there to do just about anything.
* Manage the filesystem
* Live wallpapers
* Widgets
* Arbitrary device <--> device bluetooth transfers
* CPU overclocking
* Install custom ROMs with root access
* Custom recovery ROM (make full system images)
* etc.?
The only major complaint I have is User Interface (UI) performance, however I am confident that Ice Cream Sandwich will be solving much of that with GPU UI rendering. I really can't wait to get a solid build of ICS on my Galaxy 10.1 ... it's going to be incredible! The hardware is *perfect* except for the lack of a SD card slot -- either way, that doesn't bother me too much. I can store a full season of TV shows on the smaller 16GB size.
tl;dr Get the Samsung Galaxy 10.1"!

pcgeek86 said:
...the flexibility is there to do just about anything.
* Manage the filesystem
* Live wallpapers
* Widgets
* Arbitrary device <--> device bluetooth transfers
* CPU overclocking
* Install custom ROMs with root access
* Custom recovery ROM (make full system images)
* etc.?
tl;dr Get the Samsung Galaxy 10.1"!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats why I got the gtab 10.1
But from what M_Shaaban said he doesn't want to do any of that with his device. He just wants to read email.. facebook and browse the internet.
Dont you think the ipad will be a smoother experience for him ?

jfassad said:
Thats why I got the gtab 10.1
But from what M_Shaaban said he doesn't want to do any of that with his device. He just wants to read email.. facebook and browse the internet.
Dont you think the ipad will be a smoother experience for him ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For right now, probably yes. If you think longer term, once he gets a tablet, he may end up wanting to do more with it, once he realizes what it's capable of.

IMO, the iPad is nice and easy because Apple just blew up an iPod. With the same restrictions, the biggest is still having to rely on outside sources provided by apple. So if your on a plane you wont have access to documents and other such files that an iPod would not support.
Galaxy Tab using Android can run completely independant. And I think that's how people get confused. Trying to make it work like an old palm or apple device. ”How do I make it work with my computer”. My answer is always , I don't! Except to transfer large volumes of media or documents. Free music downloads? Yup. Torrenting? sure. Document viewing, editing and creation and stored locally? Done. If you want a cloud service you can choose from a variety of sources for that. And the best part for me? Using Gmail syncing, my tab, RAZR, and even my BlackBerry and N8 are in sync OTA (meaning cross platform abilities). My computer is literally for storage these days. Or flashing Odin or other hacker style stuff.

iPad vs SGTab
I didn't mean say that the quad core will make all the difference. Point well made, to multi-threaded apps. I've only been coding for about 3 years, and have only been recently introduced to multi-threading. I say 'introduced' because I've basically only seen it in a classroom environment as basically a proof of concept. We never got into the useful aspects of it. But I would think that multi-cores could dramatically improve multi-tasking. But again, I'm a layperson in these respects and not ashamed to admit that I'm in this conversation over my head.
I think the biggest advantage (aside from weight, dimensions, and aforementioned computing power) of the Asus over the SGTab is ICS. ICS does have some pretty cool features and although the Asus is being shipped with Honeycomb, its upgrade ready. This could be better for a novice user in that he could receive the upgrade without having to root brand new hardware.

For your requirements of facebook, email and internet, I recommended an iPad 2. It's simple, easy to use, and pretty much works out of the box. No tinkering required (or allowed). It has a better GPU, too, if you decide to do a little mobile gaming.
If eventually, you decide you want more out of tablet than what iOS can offer, you can always sell it and get an android tablet. Apple products are easy to sell and have, generally, a higher resale value compared to android devices.
As for me, I'm immensely enjoying my Galaxy Tab 10.1. I thought about waiting for the Transformer Prime, but I realized that for my needs, the Galaxy tab is more than capable. Email, internet, books, comics, movies and the occasional wind-up knight.

M_Shaaban said:
I want to buy a tablet and I'm hesitant between the 10.1 and the iPad 2. I'm no expert and they both seem somehow identical to me, in your opinion what are the main differences and your recommendations. Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To help you understand more about two tablets I would suggest that you give the community a bit more information on what you gonna do with the tablet?
Is it just for basic stuff? (Internet,Email,Videos)
Or are you going to use it more for gaming?
Pretty sure that once you clarified that, people would start helping you properly.

I needed a tablet, to write, surf, multimedia device, etc. As I also needed a new phone I wanted them to link easily.
I purchased the GT 10.1 3G 16GB for about USD 650/- and added to it Samsung Galaxy Y for about USD 125. The screen resolution of the phone is not the greatest, but I don't care as I carry normally in any case the tablet.
For less then USD 800, I got an in my opinion excellent phone and a great tablet, which do everything I need. Had no problems with Norton rings, or any light leakage worth mentioning. Market is great. Even Adobe Touch applications came earlier on Android market then the Apple App store. This maybe tells something about what the future holds.
Apple is known for selling outdated tech for outrageous prices. So, if you are not a diehard apple fan, I would think thrice, before I dump my money into something which is not only expensive for the tech offered, but also limits my choice for the simple reason, that the former CEO of Apple, believed that all customers are complete idiots who can not make a choice for themselves.

Ipad is so limited, no Widgets, no flash support, even email is limited to attach photos only unless you use a third party application to send a document file for example, if you received a wmv file by email for example you cannot play it because it's not supported by apple...
Android is simple to use and you can do everything you need.
Sent from my GT-P7500 using Tapatalk

I appreciate all the valuable input. I need to ask about gaming, how about the graphics and available games? Does the Galaxy Tab 10.1 offer a good gaming experience and HD games?

If you like being told what to do, go for the iPad.
If you like being in control of what your device does, go for the GT10.1.

I'm done with all Android phones and tablets not released from Google.

FYI: This is a venting post, written spur of the moment. Probably rambling from point to point without proofreading or organizing thoughts. Don't even know if it will make sense to anyone.
In my haste to, you know, have the newest version of Android running on my Transformer, I totally destroyed it and cannot get it to be recognized in any USB form on my computer. There are tons of great ROMs built by the awesome development community, but I'm just sick of having to try out multiple ROMs just to find one that works without issues. IMO, the fault is split between Google and the hardware manufacturers. Google should force manufacturers to ship phones and tablets with stock Android. It is Google's system and they should have the control to do that. The manufacturers should be ashamed of themselves for not being able to release an update to the latest OS within a few weeks of the release, jellybean, and on a tablet that was only launched in the US in April 2011. Google should be ashamed for letting these manufacturers get away with running an outdated version on a device that is completely cabable of running the newest iteration. Had an official means of updating to Jellybean been available I would not have spent so much of my time rooting and testing ROMs to make sure I have a consistent user experience.
I look at Apple; the structure and consistency they have in regards to software updates. The first gen iPad received updates until iOS 5 for two years. Then you devices that are put out by Android manufacturers, new models are frequent and in the furry to try and saturate the market with tablets, they forget about the one that came out the day before. Too many screen sizes, different processors, causes developers to shy away. For example, there has yet to be a legitimate Spotify (which I use daily), twitter, Facebook tablet app. Even the official apps they do have for "tablets" are weak in the user interface compared to iPad apps.
I know the general public will probably never care that their phone/tablet doesn't receive the newest Android update, they call their phones "droids". That's because they don't know what they are missing since the manufacturers do not care about updating the firmware and they are running terrible skinned versions of the OS. I enjoy using my Galaxy Nexus on Verizon, but even that does not get updated from Google. Google needs to reassess how they distribute the OS and to who. Maybe it needs to be a little closed and vertical. It could help.

You have a very good point on it, I couldn't agree more with it.
But regarding the distribution of Android, I think that if the OS had to be the same on every phone/tablet, there wouldn't have a reason to exist so many different devices, it would be like Apple's iOS and its devices.
What makes the platform interesting is the fact that anyone can use it and alter some elements of it, a thing that you don't have in the strict control that Apple has on iOS.
Sent from my MB525 using xda app-developers app

I agree with you in certain points - as for update procedures in general.
I am still very annoyed by the update politics of the Transformer, since the officially offered upgrades caused so
many troubles for me, as random reboots and freezing ,......
On top of it, skilled people in this forum then manage to get nice kernels and ROMs done which are just
much better in performance and stability compared to stock, that you really do wonder who the heck ASUS is hiring
I found finally a stable combo for me based on ICS but failed so far for JB.
I am at the moment testing different JB EOS and kernel combos but experience still issues.
This can become indeed kind of boring....
Your view comparing the great support of Apple on the other hand I don't share completely. It is basically the same as for their Desktop/Laptops.
It is really so much easier to only support a handfulll of devices than thousands of different combinations. Sure, you have a point that
you benefit when you choose one of their devices. But bluntly I become afraid of the growing power of Apple, since I really embrace choice.
Their are always people who prefer a certain different device because it helps their needs ( look at all the different screen sizes for Android and
then check Apple), me I prefer e.g. HW keyboard for a mobile phone.
But then I prefer as well Linux and the choice to put together your preferred OS over a non-customizable MacOSX ...
BTW: I own as well Apple devices and this is not supposed to become a flame thread, please

At the end of the day its down to us as individuals what we buy.
The reviews are not always impartial but certainly a good starting point, but i find researching any product i buy before hand a must now a days.
Great example was when i had bought my gtab - if i had read about it properly i would have know Samsung are one of the worst for updates.....but then again none of the manufacturers promise any future upgrades - maybe again we are just expecting something that we were never told we were going to get??
Never had an issue with my TF but i agree you should not have to rely on a developers site to get "improved" versions of the software - but if i had an Ipad i would have no doubt jailbroken it to improve my ipad experience aswel, just like ive done in the past with ipod touches etc. Would i get another TF - yes - im looking to get the Infinity as i still feel that the Asus TF fits my needs and is still one of the best supported tablets out there.
So the moral of the story is nothings perfect, the infos out there......we just need to be a little more astute as individuals and put the time into looking at the pros and cons before we buy. We spend the money and make the choice - not Google, Asus or Apple.:good:

ultmontra08 said:
I totally destroyed it and cannot get it to be recognized in any USB form on my computer.
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That's more or less impossible unless you managed to corrupt the first few EMMC blocks that contain the apx mode code. Which you have to know what you're doing to wipe.
Boot into apx mode, install the naked apx driver, then use Easyflasher to flash back to stock

ultmontra08 said:
In my haste to, you know, have the newest version of Android running on my Transformer, I totally destroyed it and cannot get it to be recognized in any USB form on my computer. There are tons of great ROMs built by the awesome development community, but I'm just sick of having to try out multiple ROMs just to find one that works without issues
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ultmontra08 said:
I would not have spent so much of my time rooting and testing ROMs to make sure I have a consistent user experience.
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ultmontra08 said:
I know the general public will probably never care that their phone/tablet doesn't receive the newest Android update, they call their phones "droids". That's because they don't know what they are missing
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You don't need to update Android unless it's a big jump like going from Honeycomb to Ice Cream Sandwich going to all that trouble to Root, Install a custom Recovery, Install a custom ROM for a minor update like Jelly Bean is silly what could you possibly need from Jelly Bean that Ice Cream Sandwich can't already do I bet the only reason is "It's the latest" and Asus are officially going to release Jelly Bean for the Transformer.
ultmontra08 said:
There are tons of great ROMs built by the awesome development community, but I'm just sick of having to try out multiple ROMs just to find one that works without issues.
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Unfortunately if you want to use something other then the stock ROM it's a process of trial and error I tried Android Revolution HD ROM for example (popular ROM) and had problems with my Transformer not responding in sleep mode and random reboots I found that Cyanogenmod was stable for my device every device is different so the trial and error process is unavoidable.
ultmontra08 said:
IMO, the fault is split between Google and the hardware manufacturers. Google should force manufacturers to ship phones and tablets with stock Android. It is Google's system and they should have the control to do that.
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ultmontra08 said:
I enjoy using my Galaxy Nexus on Verizon, but even that does not get updated from Google. Google needs to reassess how they distribute the OS and to who. Maybe it needs to be a little closed and vertical. It could help.
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Google Android is licensed as an open source operating system so Google doesn't have any power to tell manufactures they can't make their own version of Android to sell with their hardware or when you receive updates that's all the manufacturer.
ultmontra08 said:
since the manufacturers do not care about updating the firmware.
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Asus have actually been great with Android updates for the Transformer just a bit slow.
ultmontra08 said:
The manufacturers should be ashamed of themselves for not being able to release an update to the latest OS within a few weeks of the release, jellybean, and on a tablet that was only launched in the US in April 2011.
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You don't understand that it takes time to develop and test a new operating system on a device the process isn't as simple as you think it is you wouldn't want to suddenly get an update from Asus and then be complaining that it's unstable would you?.
ultmontra08 said:
there has yet to be a legitimate twitter, Facebook tablet app
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If you are using a Tablet the screen is wide enough to be able to acceptably use a web browser for these tasks so you don't really need a specific App developed, it's really only necessary for Mobile due to small screens.
ultmontra08 said:
I look at Apple; the structure and consistency they have in regards to software updates. The first gen iPad received updates until iOS 5 for two years. Then you devices that are put out by Android manufacturers, new models are frequent and in the furry to try and saturate the market with tablets, they forget about the one that came out the day before. Too many screen sizes, different processors, causes developers to shy away.
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If you prefer Apple feel free to switch but while having a range of hardware options does have it's down falls it gives you and developers more freedom and choice where as Apple will always have a small limited choice range.

Just get a Windows Phone or Windows 8 tablet. I am too, one of those who are totally sick about Android.
You know, I bought Asus Transformer TF101 right on launch and YOU HAVE NO idea how excited I am. But things started to change after using it for a day, lags, crashes, limited apps.
I've been waiting and waiting for months before ICS came, but a lot of issues are still left unresolved. Asus firmware is very prone to crashes.
I've been flashing ROM after ROM and wasted so many days on this... No way I will ever get an Android again.

LastBattle said:
Just get a Windows Phone ....
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Talk about limited apps...

Eh, the way I look at it, ill have this tablet forever and by the time its so scratched and old I can give it to my kids and I can get the latest and greatest NEXUS having learned my lesson buying non NEXUS.
Sent from my SCH-I510 using xda app-developers app

im on jb rom from team EOS, this is the only jb rom i use until now. using nova launcher makes it almost perfect buttery smooth (perfect without Widgets on the screen) .
it's easy to find good rom without having to try all of them. just read people's comment. go to last page and see how many complaints user's has.

Using the EOS build 74 with KAT 1.4 and nothing else yields a Transformer that works perfectly for me minus the GPS. I know that people with the dock have a different set of issues but honest, my TF with EOS and KAT runs better than any stock ROM. The difference is amazing. Web browsing is very very fast, I can play all my 720P videos via SMB streaming with BSplayer.
So after more than a year my TF works as I expected it to out of the box.

ultmontra08 said:
I totally destroyed it and cannot get it to be recognized in any USB form on my computer.
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Have you tried Wheelie?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1676845

Android Revolution HD and be done with it. Why the need for the latest and greatest when you can use what works? I used to be an HTC fanboy, until I got the mytouch 4g slide. I hated that phone so much. I love Sense, but just the phone was.... eh. I'm very happy with my Galaxy S3. I feel like I should have opted for the Nexus, but I'm happy with my purchase.
I still have a G1 sitting on my dresser with a charged battery just in case I feel like rockin it oldschool. I'm an OG Android user. Been using android ever since the release of the G1. I do love vanilla android, but what Samsung did with TouchWiz is just short of amazing. I used to run MIUI on my HTC Vision, I ran it for a few hours on my S3, and had to go back to TouchWiz!!
And what was posted earlier, why are you using apps on a tablet when the browser works perfectly for all those websites? Apps are more of a phone thing, screen sizes sub-5"

The update from Honeycomb to ICS was a huge one and we got it, it was not bug free but good enough to get developers working. JB is not that big update unless you need Google Now.

wow i dont know where to start. i really dont want to turn this into an ios vs android flame war. but youre completly out of your mind. first of all you have to look at it from the carriers, hardware manf, and googles point of veiw.
now hardware manuf. , and carriers have it in their best interest to not release updates for all the previous gen devices from a year or two ago, even if they are capable of running the new versions. this way the new devices look more attractive to current and potential customers.
another thing is that you cant really compare the updates from iphone-iphone3g-iphone3gs-iphone4-iphone4s-iphone5-and probably in a couple months the iphone5s that wont do anything more exciting than the last model did. same thing with the ipads. before you know it you have a drawer full of iphones that look the same and dont really do anything different.
then you have android. approx 800,000 new android devices are activated every day. EVERY EFFIN DAY. now thats insane.
how many devices that didnt originally come with ios can now run ios better than they ran their org stock os? for example there are tons of devices that came stock with windows mobile/symbian/webos etc etc and they can now run many different versions of android.
my htc HD, my htc HD2, my hp touchpad, and those are just the ones ive owned. theres tons of others that were given new life because of android and the dev community.
another thing that doesnt make sense is how you can blame google, and the hardware manufacturers and the carriers for 3rd party apps that they have no involvement in. there are millions of developers making millions of apps for millions of devices. its not googles job to make sure they run perfectly on every device. thats the deveolpers fault if facebook app works better on one device than it does on another.
you see iphone and ipad apps dont really have that problem because all the devices are exactly the same. screen size/resolution doesnt change very much at all, and new features are a bore. "oh yay the new iphone can make face time calls over a cell connection and isnt limited to wifi anymore" so what they should have been able to do that years ago.
its also not googles or the hardware manuf. fault if you knowingly go against their waranty terms and screw up your device. thats the risk you knew was there. and its part of the learning process. things like unlocking bootloaders, building custom roms, modifying hardware, cross compiling drivers and kernels, overclocking, and overall getting he most out of your device, is not for kids.
yes the typical ios fanboy just wants to get his facebook updates and be able to locate the nearest starbucks, or genius bar, just by asking siri.
but the android dev comunity and the devices they work on are doing it right. why should you be told what you can and cant do with your device? why should you pay more for a device that only does less. why should you sleep on the sidewalk for 7 days to be first in line to get the new lame updated iphone that costs double and doesnt do double.
the hp touchpad is a great example of an awesome device that was on sale for 99-150 dollars from hp. it currently runs ICS like a champ, and will be getting JB roms that rock. i also have a tf101 asus that runs JB eos like WHOA! overclocked on both cores, awesome tegra2 chip. expandable memory, AND A NORMAL HEADPHONE PORT AND USB PORT. even a nice little hdmi port. its an old device already and it still blows he doors off any current gen ipad.
then theres the newer mk802 devices and hackberry A10 boards that will do anything a high end smartphone will do for 50 bucks and hooks right up to your tv. LETS see apple tv or roku do that.
bottom line is that you dont understand how this really works, and youre getting frustrated and giving up instead of learning and becoming better and the tech.
YOU EITHER MASTER TECHNOLOGY OR TECHNOLOGY WILL MASTER YOU!! thats all for now.
---------- Post added at 10:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:30 PM ----------
redrol said:
Using the EOS build 74 with KAT 1.4 and nothing else yields a Transformer that works perfectly for me minus the GPS. I know that people with the dock have a different set of issues but honest, my TF with EOS and KAT runs better than any stock ROM. The difference is amazing. Web browsing is very very fast, I can play all my 720P videos via SMB streaming with BSplayer.
So after more than a year my TF works as I expected it to out of the box.
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Click to collapse
yeah i just updated with eos jb rom today and its so much faster than the stock asus ics rom. i was really surprise, because its still got a ways to go.
---------- Post added at 11:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:38 PM ----------
Then you devices that are put out by Android manufacturers, new models are frequent and in the furry to try and saturate the market with tablets, they forget about the one that came out the day before. Too many screen sizes, different processors, causes developers to shy away.
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just to clarify a couple of things. There's no such thing as Android Manufacturers. well i guess with the exception of googles devices that they release is as close as you could come to calling them and android manufacturer, but the rest are not Android manufacturers. and when you think about it the screen sizes are usually pretty consistent even across different hardware manuf. you had 2.8"/3.5"/3.8"/ 4.2's were common for a while. now youre seeing mini tablet/phones in the 4.7-5+ range. but there arent that many sizes to worry about development wise. same with tablets. 7"-8"-9.7"-10.1" etc etc. same with the cpu and gpu arcitecture. you got your arms, your tegras, your mali 400's, etc etc theres an android device for everyone for anything.
i also love how my buddies iphone 5 wont display netflix properly or pandora correctly on the new screen size/dimension. maybe the iphone5s ver. 2.1 will have fixed that. in a couple years.
I know the general public will probably never care that their phone/tablet doesn't receive the newest Android update, they call their phones "droids". That's because they don't know what they are missing since the manufacturers do not care about updating the firmware and they are running terrible skinned versions of the OS. I enjoy using my Galaxy Nexus on Verizon, but even that does not get updated from Google. Google needs to reassess how they distribute the OS and to who. Maybe it needs to be a little closed and vertical. It could help.
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Click to collapse
the general public doesnt care that their phones arent getting the newest rom/kernel versions although alot of them do. android seems to realease new versions as the hardware advances. they grow with the advancing power and abilities of devices. you wouldnt really expect a first generation tmobile g1 to run the latest jellybean version would you? its almost as if the hardware cannot really come out faster than the os to support it. everytime you hear of a new android version theres a whole new generation of way better spec'd devices that shortly follow. sorta opposite of apple, they release devices that are barely on par with devices that were released over 6 months ago or longer. if carriers dont want o update devices in order to entice customers to upgrade then i understand that. theyre in business to make a profit. i really dont see how restricting and limiting android would help in any way at all. thats the great thing about android. its just linux with a few things on top. and that is the nail in the coffin right there. unlimited customization and hackability.

haxin said:
YOU EITHER MASTER TECHNOLOGY OR TECHNOLOGY WILL MASTER YOU!! thats all for now.
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AMEN!

Ability to remove skin soon to be unveiled from Google?

Hello
An interesting article I read today with regards to the skins OEM put on android devices (touchwiz) that leads to fragmentation.
Interesting quote from the article,
"I believe this Android update underscores Google’s new vision for OEMs has hardware producers only! Android 4.4 is a trojan horse of unification - it will give Google the tools it needs to completely wipe a skin from a device with a simple download from the Play Store."
If this turns out to be true it can have a major impact on the Galaxy Note products due to it being so reliant on touchwiz. Also I do not know how deeply integrated touchwiz is on Android so I guess time will tell.
http://techtainian.com/news/2013/10...l-reclaim-android-and-unify-holo-with-kennedy

Great article. Thanks for posting the link. I hate touchwizz and love simple vanilla android which you get on the nexus devices. Android needs to be simple to use and I find using touchwizz requires a another learning curve and it just irritates me. I think manufactures should use stock android and then install custom launchers and apps. Commercially google wants to retain the rains of android which will also be a business decision. I can see the advantages for Joe public who could just pick up any android device and know it works like any other device. I want the choice to pick either without having to root a device and install custom firmware.

andyzarins said:
Great article. Thanks for posting the link. I hate touchwizz and love simple vanilla android which you get on the nexus devices. Android needs to be simple to use and I find using touchwizz requires a another learning curve and it just irritates me.
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Vanilla is good but then you don't get S Pen and multi window. And nexus devices come without SD Support.

ddavtian said:
Vanilla is good but then you don't get S Pen and multi window. And nexus devices come without SD Support.
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These two things do not apply to one another whatsoever. Samsung could put S-Pen, SD, and multi-window support on their devices without the UI overhaul. The two are not in any way connected.

It makes perfect sense for them to put stock android in their tablets and make the S-Note, multi window etc available via the playstore.
Honestly, I don't know about Samsung's and Google relationship as it stands today but if Google does makes an app that allows the user to remove OEM skins than it might be the start of the downfall between the two companies.
On a side note there are rumours that the new Nexus 10 is Asus built not Samsung.

Not a rumour. Asus is building the new nexus 10. One the fence about buying the new 10.1 or waiting for the new nexus.