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Hi all you experienced WM programmers.
I'm new to windows mobile, but program other environments for a living(micro controllers, embedded linux, win32 etc)
I was wondering what the development tool of choice is for WM ?
I know that on Win32 .net development sucks blocks...yes I develop extreme low latency process control stuff and the abstraction from hardware in .net makes it unusable for such programming as you totally lose control over memory allocation etc.
Being as the WM is such a limited devices I presume the same issues are found there as well. So what are you guys using to develop? strictly embedded c/c++ or is there something else out there that is useful?
Thanks in advance for any suggestions
You defiantly want embedded!
You can use the free eVC or the expansive VS 2005, but if you want quick native code programs or to write system components like today plugins and keyboards this is the only way to go.
If you think .NET is bad on a PC just wait till you see it in WM. Because of the limited resources of these devices its a sluggish nightmare!
levenum said:
You defiantly want embedded!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y.com/
Other Developer environments.
Have you considered the PPL programing environment.
Provided is an IDE environment both for the PC and PPC. This means that applications can be developed and run on both platforms. Not sure about latency, however you can create .exe files from you're code and interface to external DDL's.
There web site is http://www.arianesoft.ca/page.php?1 and a trail version can be downloaded. The trail gives basic functionality with a 15 day full function registration option.
The Developer is quite open to questions and the forums are also quite active.
Not sure how deep you wish to access the OS/HW however it may be worth considering.
Cheers.
burkay said:
http://www.d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y.com/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea, that one slipped by me even with the spell checker.
Excuses:
1) I was tired.
2) English is not my native language.
I'll just leave it there because its pretty funny. And hey, using native code instead of .NET is in defiance of Bill's wishes!
Hey Folks,
I was wondering if anyone knew if it was possible to use Jython instead of plane Java for android development? I don't know much about Java development but I'm with Python. I was figuring that this might ease me into it better. Any thoughts?
Thanks,
-=GB=-
Have you had a look at the Android scripting environment?
http://code.google.com/p/android-scripting/
http://google-opensource.blogspot.com/2009/06/introducing-android-scripting.html
http://code.google.com/p/android-scripting/wiki/PythonAndroidAPI
Regards,
Akshay
Thanks aksd,
I don't know how I didn't find that before. Perhaps I should have just searched for Python and Android as opposed to just Jython and androind.
Anyway, this is very cool for prototyping and simple scripting. However, the main thing I was hoping for was writing apps in Python (via Jython) that could then be distributed on the Marketplace. It's kind of to bad. It doesn't look like anyone is really trying to port Jython to Android because ASE is sort of Google's official response to the whole thing. On the whole, a really great thing for people who just want to script Android but not really for App development.
In all of this searching I did find some interesting information about how to link in C libs so you could code some of the hardcore speed sucking elements in C (like a game engine) and then make calls into it via Java. I didn't know that was even possible so... Pretty cool stuff.
Hey ngrava,
I'm not much into scripts, so dont really follow whats happening with scripting and Android.
If you wanted a bit of a performance gain you can use the NDK and call the JNI to execute native libraries or code. been there for awhile but few use them. Java is just so much easier than C .
Theres a lot of interesting stuff going on on the Android platform, Mono being ported to Android, Scala being ported to Android, I'm actually currently working on profiling the performance of scala code on android.
Regards,
Akshay
On the Google DevFest on Argentina, Google´s ingeneers afirmed that they are working to make more languages availeable on Gingerbread, they specifically mentioned Ruby. We just have to wait to see if this is true and if we are going to be able to ship apps of other languages to the market, and I´m not sure if they will be backwards compatible with earlier versions of android as well.
PD: Oops, sorry for reviving this old post, I just realised i clicked last page instead of next
Hi all,
Finally I've my HD2 and I must say, I'm very happy with it!
I'm no noob in informatics, I program in VB and VBA and I'm DBA in Oracle and SQL Server. But to be honest, I don't now how to start.
I tried searching the forum here, but couldn't find a thread: how to start programming on a WMO-device.
Thanks already for the info!
Koen
PS for example I would like to program this:
keyboard layout French (AZERTY)
T9 language Dutch
Koen D said:
how to start programming on a WMO-device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You start programming for WM the same way you do it for Win32. Just download mobile SDK from Microsoft and you're good to go. You use the same IDE, Visual Studio, for mobile programming, and coding experience is the same, in addition to the fact that a lot of code using WinAPI will just work. There are differences of course with regard to memory management or power management etc., but those are either documented on msdn or are discussed at length everywhere on the web.
VB and .Net won't be good for your purpose though, you'd need native C++ code for things like rewriting a T9 engine I think.
Hey hey!
You can find many interesting postings and topics here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=522
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=260
There are much more. Please look for the "stiky" posts. There are often very usefull informations. Sure, the moderators open some stikys "just-for-fun"... ... but many topics are realy interesting.
Some external sites can help you, too:
http://developer.windowsphone.com/Default.aspx (of course)
and
http://www.smartphonedn.com/
you can became a part of the msdn (winmo special) here:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/windowsmobile/default.aspx
When you became a good dev. You should look for 3rd party stuff like:
http://www.resco.net/developer/default.aspx
For the beginning it should be enough.
regards
You can also program in mobile java, which will make your app portable to more devices.
http://java.sun.com/javame/index.jsp
Do you want to be a ROM chef, or programmer?
Or both ?
To just program for the Windows Mobile OS, you can
grab a (free) version of Microsoft Visual Studio 2010/2008
and download the WIndows Mobile development resource kit
from them.
Then you can blast away in C#, C or .NET
If you just want to cook ROM's then look at the kitchen thread.
Look at that thread anyway
Try Visual Studio, VB.NET and the Windows Mobile SDK there it is s
Hi mates, want to ask which is the best programming language for WM? C, C++, C#, VB.Net or something else. I did use C# a lot and can do little thing with SQL Compact. But, it seems lot of the current applications are not require .Net Framework installed on WM. Are they using C++?
Also, is there anything need to be considered for WM Web Programming (such as JavaScript, CSS support)?
siamchen said:
Hi mates, want to ask which is the best programming language for WM? C, C++, C#, VB.Net or something else. I did use C# a lot and can do little thing with SQL Compact. But, it seems lot of the current applications are not require .Net Framework installed on WM. Are they using C++?
Also, is there anything need to be considered for WM Web Programming (such as JavaScript, CSS support)?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yep. most WM apps use C++, but even the C# apps will run as most of the ROMs contain the .NET fw by default
I have a question as well, are there any free-for-freeware frameworks for touch-friendly applications? Is there a Sense SDK?
bayowar said:
I have a question as well, are there any free-for-freeware frameworks for touch-friendly applications? Is there a Sense SDK?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Microsoft has an SDK for 6.5's gesture support. I've not got around to using it yet though, so can't comment on it's quality or breadth of support.
Is there something I cant build using C only in this phones?
I mean can I build a complete rom, applications and such using only C?
thats the only lang I know so...
mr_Ray said:
Microsoft has an SDK for 6.5's gesture support. I've not got around to using it yet though, so can't comment on it's quality or breadth of support.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've seen that, what about buttons, sliders, tabs, flickable lists and all this stuff though. I've never developed for a mobile platform and I'd imagine starting from scratch with all UI elements steepens the learning curve quite a bit.
siamchen said:
Hi mates, want to ask which is the best programming language for WM? C, C++, C#, VB.Net or something else. I did use C# a lot and can do little thing with SQL Compact. But, it seems lot of the current applications are not require .Net Framework installed on WM. Are they using C++?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are pros and cons to using managed code (C#/VB), and the same holds true about native code (C++). The former is much easier for high-level tasks, but you get less control and it may get a bit tricky when you need to access WinAPI not included in .Net CF (although there are usually ways to do it via Platform Invoke). .Net applications start slower, which may be an issue for certain tasks. Native code is (should be) faster, but a bit more complex and you don't have things like automatic garbage collection and so on. Sometimes you need a couple of lines of code in C# instead of two dozen in C++. Sometimes not. On the other hand, writing something like a graphics-heavy game in C# would be a strange endeavor. Some things are outright impossible like writing a system service, AFAIK. All in all, the pros and cons are described at length everywhere, and it's up to you to decide.
bayowar said:
I have a question as well, are there any free-for-freeware frameworks for touch-friendly applications? Is there a Sense SDK?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In the Development and Hacking section you'll find a C# GUI framework (it's called Manila UI Framework or something like that) made by a fellow XDAer.
bayowar said:
I've seen that, what about buttons, sliders, tabs, flickable lists and all this stuff though. I've never developed for a mobile platform and I'd imagine starting from scratch with all UI elements steepens the learning curve quite a bit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you want non-standard UI elements it can get tricky. For standard UI it's a no-brainer. There are some third-party libraries available. In addition to the C# framework I mentioned earlier, there's Qt (a cross-platform UI framework used by Opera for all their desktop (Linux, Win and Mac) and mobile (WM and Symbian) and embedded platforms including TV set-top boxes) incarnations, Airplay SDK that's a cross-platform framework for Android, WM and iPhone, some others I can't recall right away. They may or may not be free however.
Thanks for the reply, good to know about Qt. I'm vaguely familiar with that, had now idea it found it's way to Windows Mobile.
The Manila framework is called Manila Interface SDK, at least that's the only match I found.
bayowar said:
I've seen that, what about buttons, sliders, tabs, flickable lists and all this stuff though. I've never developed for a mobile platform and I'd imagine starting from scratch with all UI elements steepens the learning curve quite a bit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually it is not the UI but the SDK that has a steep learning curve. Besides the usual loops and if then else.. you need to know exactly which library does what and there is the confusion as there are a couple of them doing similiar things eg Messaging API. At least that is what I encountered when I first started and I agree that C++ has a huge advantage over C# or VB.net as it can interact directly with the hardware api instead going over in a big circle and sometimes, some functions can't even be achieved using vb.net!
Just install vs.net and catch up on OO by diving into vb.net.
You'll be fine coding in either C# or VB.NET, the BCL for Ce is leaner than that for full blown windows but still very usable. After installing vs2008 don't forget to update the default install to wm6.5 sdk.
siamchen said:
Hi mates, want to ask which is the best programming language for WM? C, C++, C#, VB.Net or something else. I did use C# a lot and can do little thing with SQL Compact. But, it seems lot of the current applications are not require .Net Framework installed on WM. Are they using C++?
Also, is there anything need to be considered for WM Web Programming (such as JavaScript, CSS support)?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi mate,
I reckon c++ so u dont need to redisttibute the framework and your app will run fast, but if u want to write apps with db access net framework is the easy way, I'm in Sydney and I do c++ so PM if u need some help,
cheers,
Hlov
BTW is there some good app for programming in my HD2? taking my work on the go? something like visual studio mobile version?
I am wondering if there is any type of library or environment where I could run a program written exclusively for WinMo 6. I can't post the app here due to copyright issues, but is this possible?
It seems you need something similar to wine for linux, i'm just thinking why do that with all the android apps we have
I can think of lots of programs that are not available for the android. I don't think the android has a large enough base for many outfits to utilize the wonderful potential of the android. For now the vast number of apps to me are cute little things operating in a insular little bubble.
Hope things change but for now I keep my HTC Wmo phone around
Regards, PK
ezangrando said:
It seems you need something similar to wine for linux, i'm just thinking why do that with all the android apps we have
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oziexplorer, there's nothing so powerful for off road navigation in android.
No. You cannot.
Android = Dalvik/Java
Winmobile = C/C++ and/or DotNet
Pretty much all of the significant apps have been made from scratch for android. If you want a specific app, the best way to go about it is to bug the developer of that app. It is a good guess that they may be already working on a version for android and/or thinking about it. Your request might be the only thing they need.
Hey guys im considering porting/recoding an app from VB.net to work on android, but i havent got a clue what language is used in android, could someone tell me its name or some sort of website with this information?
Finally if someone is experienced in programming apps for android, i would like to chat about a few capabilities of the language.
Thanks in advance!
Android is Java-ish based.
i would recommend you checking out the program Eclipse.
The main applayer is java based with some xml thrown in. But there is a native development kit that you can compile c c++ and many other languages to run on an android phone. But since java is virtual machine based an app written in java will run on all phones*(some caveats like os version) while the app in ndk will work on only hardware that it was designed for
Also, is Google not working? A simple search for "Android programming language" would answer this question
From something awesome
killersnowman said:
The main applayer is java based with some xml thrown in. But there is a native development kit that you can compile c c++ and many other languages to run on an android phone. But since java is virtual machine based an app written in java will run on all phones*(some caveats like os version) while the app in ndk will work on only hardware that it was designed for
From something awesome
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmmm, yes there is google but not what im exactly asking, and that makes me ask this:
You talk about c & c++ and other languages compilations to run on android phone, is vb.net a part of that list?
Could you show me a website or something that says more about that dev kit? im basically trying to port my apps from vb 2010 express (windows forms based) to android and if that thing is not possible should i use java to code it all over again?
Thanks in advance!
http://developer.android.com/sdk/ndk/ this is for the ndk but it is not as simple as just compiling your code with the ndk. You will need to rewrite some of it to actuallytie into the android apis
You should really just use the java sdk. You will reach more people and be able to find more help and info
And I stand corrected, while there are projects trying to bring other languages to the ndk it is at this point just C and C++
From something awesome
killersnowman said:
http://developer.android.com/sdk/ndk/ this is for the ndk but it is not as simple as just compiling your code with the ndk. You will need to rewrite some of it to actuallytie into the android apis
You should really just use the java sdk. You will reach more people and be able to find more help and info
And I stand corrected, while there are projects trying to bring other languages to the ndk it is at this point just C and C++
From something awesome
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
oh well in that case i will need to learn java.... thanks mate, i think its easier to just rewrite the whole thing really i like proper optimizations and ports most of the times lack them.
Thanks for the information thats all i needed.
PS: rep added
if you know vb.net well you'll have no real problem with java.. it just adds brackets and semicolons essentially lol. I learned java in college and then was thrown into the .net framework using c# and i love the .net framework.. its so hard for me to go from using Visual Studios to Eclipse to make an android application because Visual Studios (which im assuming you use, is so powerful).. But yes android is java code behind and html (preferred) GUI. You can make your GUI using java but trust me its terrible!
jr10000 said:
But yes android is java code behind and html (preferred) GUI. You can make your GUI using java but trust me its terrible!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Html? You mean xml?
Also try Intellij instead of Eclipse. Eclipse is way too bloated and IntellJ has some amazing autocomplete features. Its better in my opinion
From something awesome
jr10000 said:
if you know vb.net well you'll have no real problem with java.. it just adds brackets and semicolons essentially lol. I learned java in college and then was thrown into the .net framework using c# and i love the .net framework.. its so hard for me to go from using Visual Studios to Eclipse to make an android application because Visual Studios (which im assuming you use, is so powerful).. But yes android is java code behind and html (preferred) GUI. You can make your GUI using java but trust me its terrible!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what?? i really need a proper GUI ugh... yes im using visual studio, and indeed is amazing, the app i have and i want to port to android is windows form based, the most essential thing i would need about it is the calendar control :\
You can use Javascript+HTML5 (it's complicated to express here but the whole things is pretty much native).
Python aswell, use SL4x or Kivy (Kivy is pretty good but it's still too new).
Sorry, being hate Java too much.
Funnnny said:
You can use Javascript+HTML5 (it's complicated to express here but the whole things is pretty much native).
Python aswell, use SL4x or Kivy (Kivy is pretty good but it's still too new).
Sorry, being hate Java too much.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok np, so to doublecheck this: to have an application with graphical interface i will need javascript and html5?
TheWarKeeper said:
ok np, so to doublecheck this: to have an application with graphical interface i will need javascript and html5?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont know why people spread extremely non standard practices to people getting started...
No you dont need javascript or html5.
Android has a ui layout system based in xml. Its just there to arrange objects that you can access from the java code. So a little xml and java is all you need
From something awesome
TheWarKeeper said:
ok np, so to doublecheck this: to have an application with graphical interface i will need javascript and html5?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The right way to do GUI is with Java, with the official SDK from Google.
Some non-standard way to do this is with Javascript (just a GUI wrapper from Javascript to Java) and Python (again wrapper to Python).
You can choose which way you want, many people I know didn't like Java, and they choose to use a web application, and then they want to embed this to a native Android application, so they go with Titanium Mobile or some others framework like that. It's not as good as Java, but it's some other way to start with your application (Web app first and then Native app)
Funnnny said:
The right way to do GUI is with Java, with the official SDK from Google.
Some non-standard way to do this is with Javascript (just a GUI wrapper from Javascript to Java) and Python (again wrapper to Python).
You can choose which way you want, many people I know didn't like Java, and they choose to use a web application, and then they want to embed this to a native Android application, so they go with Titanium Mobile or some others framework like that. It's not as good as Java, but it's some other way to start with your application (Web app first and then Native app)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i feel like i should probably stick with java, i want it to be quick and fast and have alot of stuff to code, the program should run in background so it must not affect performance at all, will use timers with a basic code ticking every second while on background and thats it really
TheWarKeeper said:
i feel like i should probably stick with java, i want it to be quick and fast and have alot of stuff to code, the program should run in background so it must not affect performance at all, will use timers with a basic code ticking every second while on background and thats it really
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then use java bro, it's an awesome programming language, I don't know why some people don't like it, each programmer should learn to get used to each language.
Anyway, for likes.. colors
Cheers, D4.
D4rKn3sSyS said:
Then use java bro, it's an awesome programming language, I don't know why some people don't like it, each programmer should learn to get used to each language.
Anyway, for likes.. colors
Cheers, D4.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well ive been learning vb and i will admit that im still on intermediate level, even though i know all the basic stuff such as messing with its own functions, etc i still havent used any of the apis for it, the main problem with programming is that if u learn a language you would waste your time learning that one or else if u go learn to many languages you will end up not knowing none of them at all.
Ill see if i can mess with java, some people say syntax is a bit similar to c & c++
EDIT: btw, im not saying i dont find java good, a programming language that will basically run on any machine independently of the OS makes the language itself possibly the best and most versatile around.
I'm learning Android and I use Java and XML. I'm still a beginner though.
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I am just curious, software like Titanium Backup, or Angry Birds, which programming language do they use? Could this stuff be programmed with Eclipse in Java?
killersnowman said:
Html? You mean xml?
Also try Intellij instead of Eclipse. Eclipse is way too bloated and IntellJ has some amazing autocomplete features. Its better in my opinion
From something awesome
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Hey, do you know how to use intellij idea fire Android development?
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