(Yes, I looked for discussion, but didn't find; if this has been hashed out, please (courteously) link me there or suggest better search terms; thanks.)
OK, I suppose it's as much an ethics question as anything else, but I've been planning to switch to T-Mobile for a good Android phone and to support their Even More Plus philosophy.
Now that the G2 is being offered for $49, I can actually save money by contracting and immediately terminating. ($500 cash for device, or $49 for device +$200 for ETF.)
This seems really wrong... but it's the deal they're knowingly offering. Yow.
(What if I want to stay with T-Mobile; can I just call them up and say "thanks; please terminate my contract and charge the ETF but maintain my service under EMPlus"?)
(Unless I've completely goofed, it's cheaper to terminate any time in the first year:
Code:
Month EM EMP ETF cash contract exit better (worse) to contract
500 50
1 79 59 200 559 129 329 230
2 79 59 200 618 208 408 210
3 79 59 200 677 287 487 190
4 79 59 200 736 366 566 170
5 79 59 200 795 445 645 150
6 79 59 200 854 524 724 130
7 79 59 200 913 603 803 110
8 79 59 200 972 682 882 90
9 79 59 200 1031 761 961 70
10 79 59 200 1090 840 1040 50
11 79 59 200 1149 919 1119 30
12 79 59 200 1208 998 1198 10
13 79 59 200 1267 1077 1277 -10
14 79 59 200 1326 1156 1356 -30
15 79 59 200 1385 1235 1435 -50
16 79 59 200 1444 1314 1514 -70
17 79 59 200 1503 1393 1593 -90
18 79 59 150 1562 1472 1622 -60
19 79 59 150 1621 1551 1701 -80
20 79 59 150 1680 1630 1780 -100
21 79 59 150 1739 1709 1859 -120
22 79 59 150 1798 1788 1938 -140
23 79 59 50 1857 1867 1917 -60
24 79 59 0 1916 1946 1946 -30
25 79 59 0 1975 2025 2025 -50
)
Practical advice? Ethical advice?
Some technical details:
- If you cancel in the buyer's remorse window time frame they expect the phone back or they'll actually charge you the full price - (yes, you'll pay more than the ETF in that window, but only if you don't return the phone).
- Once that window is gone then the ETF is your penalty and it may be cheaper, but you'll also have to leave T-Mobile service. There is no "cancel my contract, but keep my plan". If you cancel they say "goodbye" and unless you've unlocked your phone (which you can't do until you've been a customer for 90 days) then you now have an expensive paperweight (albeit less expensive than if you paid full price for the paperweight) and be shopping around for more expensive service (hello AT&T and using my new G2 with Edge speeds).
- Your chart compares contract to non-contract and so the savings may take a while for the non-contract plans to win, but you didn't look at "total money given to them to walk away with the phone" where they break even sooner than your year time frame. Since your "cancel my contract and keep my plan" was a fantasy, the only way to measure this is "when can I walk away with a cheap phone?" and that story isn't as exciting.
- For example if you wait to unlock the phone and cancel after 90 days then the total amount of money you've given them (out the door price, ETF, 3 months of service) is probably close to the retail cost and easily more than their costs to sell you the phone so they haven't lost money, but you've gone through a few hoops to try to take advantage of their terms.
So, maybe you could end up with an unlocked G2 after 3 months of service for cheaper than someone who paid full price and stayed for 3 months, but most people are in it for the longer run and the non-contract plans win in the long run. If you are just looking to scam the phone out of T-Mobile you will have to work hard to shave the price down and get it unlocked, but T-Mobile will probably make enough that they don't care about the work you've done to get there.
I understand the desire to run without a contract. The reason I stay on contract is because I'm already paying only $50/month, and T-Mo gave me a free G2. I like T-Mo, so I have no reason to switch carriers, and if I want a new phone down the road, I'll just sell the G2 and get another one.
It's just my version of a cheap scenario. I know everyone is different, but in my situation, I'm getting out pretty well.
dude we can sim unlock our phones without tmo
flarbear said:
- Once that window is gone then the ETF is your penalty and it may be cheaper, but you'll also have to leave T-Mobile service. There is no "cancel my contract, but keep my plan". If you cancel they say "goodbye" and unless you've unlocked your phone (which you can't do until you've been a customer for 90 days) then you now have an expensive paperweight (albeit less expensive than if you paid full price for the paperweight) and be shopping around for more expensive service (hello AT&T and using my new G2 with Edge speeds).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can "cancel" and pay the ETF by switching to an Even More Plus plan. If I were to do that right now I would end up with 2 G2s for about $650 total and my plan would be cheaper. If I decide we can get by with fewer minutes, I may be able to recover the ETF for both lines in less than a year. The only cost would be that I may not be able to get subsidized phone prices from T-Mobile ever again (though they are supposedly looking at allowing people to switch back to contract plans).
flarbear said:
Some technical details:
- If you cancel in the buyer's remorse window time frame they expect the phone back or they'll actually charge you the full price - (yes, you'll pay more than the ETF in that window, but only if you don't return the phone).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course.
flarbear said:
- Once that window is gone then the ETF is your penalty and it may be cheaper, but you'll also have to leave T-Mobile service. There is no "cancel my contract, but keep my plan". If you cancel they say "goodbye" and unless you've unlocked your phone (which you can't do until you've been a customer for 90 days) then you now have an expensive paperweight (albeit less expensive than if you paid full price for the paperweight) and be shopping around for more expensive service (hello AT&T and using my new G2 with Edge speeds).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
One could root and unlock, but you're right that it would be preferred to stay magenta. But you're saying you can't choose to pay the ETF and just convert from EM to EMP?
flarbear said:
- Your chart compares contract to non-contract and so the savings may take a while for the non-contract plans to win, but you didn't look at "total money given to them to walk away with the phone" where they break even sooner than your year time frame. Since your "cancel my contract and keep my plan" was a fantasy, the only way to measure this is "when can I walk away with a cheap phone?" and that story isn't as exciting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's what the "exit" column was meant to capture -- total dollars given to TM to be obligation-free as of that date, by converting from EM to EMP and staying with TM.
So, it all hinges on
- whether one can stay a subscriber and switch from EM to EMP by just agreeing to pay the ETF, and
- whether it's worth all the work.
easy
just open up a whole new line of service with t-mobile.
cancel after the first month
pay 50 + 200 etf + whatever first month of service is
take the phone, and put it onto your preexisting line with them.
done.
I was under a two-year family plan, with a Mytouch 3g and a Gravity 2 subsidized.
I switched to an even more plus plan approximately six months into my contract.
They informed me that I would still need to remain a customer of T-Mobile until the original contract term expired or I would be required to pay the ETF for the phone hardware.
n3rdftw said:
easy
just open up a whole new line of service with t-mobile.
cancel after the first month
pay 50 + 200 etf + whatever first month of service is
take the phone, and put it onto your preexisting line with them.
done.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup. This is exactly right. And as a bonus, if near a Costco store, you can buy there and get the activation fee waived. This is how to get the phone for the cheapest price. Now, keep in mind, opening a new line of service dings your credit score approx 5 points and stays with you for up to 2 years
jpasiczn said:
Yup. This is exactly right. And as a bonus, if near a Costco store, you can buy there and get the activation fee waived. This is how to get the phone for the cheapest price. Now, keep in mind, opening a new line of service dings your credit score approx 5 points and stays with you for up to 2 years
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think this is true for a new of service. If add a line, it should have no affect.
Tmobile is offering free g2 for adding a line for existing customers TODAY ONLY!
Good point, I wonder if you they do run a credit check for add a line. For the free G2 on add a line, it would be the cost of half a month of service and the ETF? Not too shabby.
Here's another alternative:
Open a new line and cancel it after a month for a grand total of $329. You can sim-unlock your phone using the tools here from xda, and take your phone to simple mobile. They're a third party vendor of tmobile service, and they have unlimited talk/text/web plans at $60/month. So you would still be getting the same service/signal/everything, you would just have more included for the price.
OR you could try getting one on ebay for maybe $30 more bucks and not damage your credit score lol.
http://www.mysimplemobile.com/Simple-Mobile-Plan.aspx
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
Tax on ETF
A lot of people forget that T mobile charges sales tax on $200 ETF and it is about $40. You may have to pay activation fee $35 also. With prorated charges for service and data plan and taxes the whole cost could be closer to $400. Orders over the phone can be canceled after 20 days(30 for cali) and at retail stores after 15 days (14 days at Walmart). In Cali you have to pay sales tax on retail value of the phone even when the phone is free.
I've never paid an ETF but I'm almost positive there's no sales tax on them; it's not an actual product or service, just a fee.
The only tax you 'should' be paying is whatever your phone line is taxed
ilikepu said:
dude we can sim unlock our phones without tmo
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With simplemobile you don't have to. Same service as said below.
mejorguille said:
Here's another alternative:
Open a new line and cancel it after a month for a grand total of $329. You can sim-unlock your phone using the tools here from xda, and take your phone to simple mobile. They're a third party vendor of tmobile service, and they have unlimited talk/text/web plans at $60/month. So you would still be getting the same service/signal/everything, you would just have more included for the price.
OR you could try getting one on ebay for maybe $30 more bucks and not damage your credit score lol.
http://www.mysimplemobile.com/Simple-Mobile-Plan.aspx
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am on simple and unlocked.
And yes, those bastards charge taxes on the ETF.
I am with simple mobile because the taxes and small fees are too much. 165 after all was said and done with me and the wife. Simplemobile is 110 straight, no tax. Do I want to save 55 a month for the same service, yes!
moSess said:
With simplemobile you don't have to. Same service as said below.
I am on simple and unlocked.
And yes, those bastards charge taxes on the ETF.
I am with simple mobile because the taxes and small fees are too much. 165 after all was said and done with me and the wife. Simplemobile is 110 straight, no tax. Do I want to save 55 a month for the same service, yes!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or you could do it the way I do - a few calls to retentions and a happy attitude = 2 free G2's and a monthly price of $85 after tax/insurance for 1500 minutes and unlimited text/data. I'll happily stick with that for another 2 years (at least)! And no activation fees, to boot!
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App
Ah, yes, I didn't notice that you were talking about switching to EMPlus. (The original post said something about "keep my service under EMPlus" which threw me off as I simply read it as "cancel me, but keep giving me service".) I think it is true that you can switch to EMPlus and pay the ETF, which changes your billing, but does not terminate your contract (you must still stay with them for the full time period even after the switch - not sure how they treat it if you switch and then leave) but your monthly bill does go down after paying the ETF. You would eventually make up the money to them through profit on your EMPlus account, so they won't strictly be losing anything, but they'll make a lot less profit that could go into improving their network. It may get you the phone cheaper, but as people pointed out, there is no returning to a contract plan so it would be a one shot deal.
With respect to the add-a-line, they might not take too kindly to a history of canceled contracts so that may be a one-shot deal as well.
And, finally, with respect to rooting and unlocking - good point, but it probably doesn't factor into the way they set up their policies to make sure that they've gotten a reasonable amount of money to cover their costs. Even then, I would imagine that the ETF fee alone might cover their real costs, so you might have gotten away with a deal they didn't want to offer, but I don't think they would have strictly lost money in the process. That's just speculation, though...
(* - BTW, in googling about this I found reports of people that were able to switch to EM+ without paying the ETF - I think they were all reports of people who did that when the plans were first made available (some even before they were announced), but that would make this idea even cheaper if it were true...?)
flarbear said:
Ah, yes, I didn't notice that you were talking about switching to EMPlus. (The original post said something about "keep my service under EMPlus" which threw me off as I simply read it as "cancel me, but keep giving me service".) I think it is true that you can switch to EMPlus and pay the ETF, which changes your billing, but does not terminate your contract (you must still stay with them for the full time period even after the switch - not sure how they treat it if you switch and then leave) but your monthly bill does go down after paying the ETF. You would eventually make up the money to them through profit on your EMPlus account, so they won't strictly be losing anything, but they'll make a lot less profit that could go into improving their network. It may get you the phone cheaper, but as people pointed out, there is no returning to a contract plan so it would be a one shot deal.
With respect to the add-a-line, they might not take too kindly to a history of canceled contracts so that may be a one-shot deal as well.
And, finally, with respect to rooting and unlocking - good point, but it probably doesn't factor into the way they set up their policies to make sure that they've gotten a reasonable amount of money to cover their costs. Even then, I would imagine that the ETF fee alone might cover their real costs, so you might have gotten away with a deal they didn't want to offer, but I don't think they would have strictly lost money in the process. That's just speculation, though...
(* - BTW, in googling about this I found reports of people that were able to switch to EM+ without paying the ETF - I think they were all reports of people who did that when the plans were first made available (some even before they were announced), but that would make this idea even cheaper if it were true...?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seriously, this is what I said many posts ago.
Get whatever phones you want, switch over to Even More Plus. As long as you're staying a customer of TMO for the remainder of your old contract term you'll get the benefit of the reduced prices AND you'll get to keep your existing phone(s).
There's no down side.
flarbear said:
(* - BTW, in googling about this I found reports of people that were able to switch to EM+ without paying the ETF - I think they were all reports of people who did that when the plans were first made available (some even before they were announced), but that would make this idea even cheaper if it were true...?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On the T-Mobile website it says that if you switch to Even More Plus in the first year of a two year contract, you pay an ETF and have no further commitment. If you switch during the second year, you pay no ETF upfront, only an activation fee, but you still have to complete your two year commitment. If you then cancel you have to pay an ETF (possibly prorated).
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
You can probably do that under different terms through retentions, but when you move to EMP I don't think you can move back to a regular plan.
Related
I just switched to EM+ Family plan and recently came off of EM. I still have until September for my contract that I extended when I got the G1 back in Thanksgiving of 08.
I figured that I'd go to EM+ and use the "Subsidizing" ability to cover the $530 cost. This will not work for the unseen future due to some "duh" moments.
EM+ works this way: If T-Mobile is selling the phone on their site, you can use EM+ to purchase it and subsidize it over a maximum of 20 months. They charge you separate from your bill, and you can choose how much to pay additional each month for the phone. (Not sure if there is a minimum payment per month. I'm guessing you have to at LEAST pay 1/20th of the phone's cost).
This won't work with the N1 because Google has exclusive selling rights for the phone.
So, like a moron, I finally came to the conclusion that there are only two ways to buy the phone, and they are the ways Google has already plain-as-day outlined.
Until there is a new game in town and Google relinquishes their exclusivity and T-Mobile picks up the Nexus One of their own accord, my only option is to buy the phone outright because the EM+ plan is not compatible with the purchasing options on the Nexus One. This is because the nature of EM+ does not make the "extension" option a viable choice due to the non-contractual nature of EM+.
It is also the highest plan possible, and - aside from the $35 fee - possibly the best plan T-Mobile offers because it's packages are cheaper than EM. However, once on it, there is no backing out.
Start saving those pennies, XDA family.
wait so does that mean that i cant buy the n1 unlocked & unsub through google, then go to tmobile and get a EM+ plan?
All we can do is either pay the $530, or $180 if your line is eligible for an upgrade (contract or upgrading to EM in the first place).
TMo always lets you upgrade to EM+ if your line isn't on it, but the $35 upgrade fee applies, and you are still obligated to the contract time you signed up for before switching to EM+. IE, I still have till the end of September for the extension I signed up for at the End of November 2008 when I got my G1, even though my account will switch to EM+ on the 8th of January.
Of course, we could always do the $180 and pay the $350 cancellation fee, but that costs a total of $530 -_-
Blueman101 said:
wait so does that mean that i cant buy the n1 unlocked & unsub through google, then go to tmobile and get a EM+ plan?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can do that. He's talking about upgrading and getting the 180 price instead of the full 530 price.
I have tried to talk Tmobile in waiving the ETF on one of my lines if I buy the N1 and add an aditional line but they won't do that either. Its either 530 or nothing for me. (don't want to pay 110+ dollars a month for two lines)
engagedtosmile said:
You can do that. He's talking about upgrading and getting the 180 price instead of the full 530 price.
I have tried to talk Tmobile in waiving the ETF on one of my lines if I buy the N1 and add an aditional line but they won't do that either. Its either 530 or nothing for me. (don't want to pay 110+ dollars a month for two lines)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thanks
*phew* I was worried that my ordering of the n1 was for nothing
-Cheers
errr tmobile
I saved my upgrade for this but their plan totally sucks for the Nexus one.
500 minutes???!!!! for 79$ [email protected]#%@%
I just bought it unlocked im going to just put my sim in it.
Lol, good job. I am in agreement with that.
This stuff is to fin complicated, they should have thought this out more. All this what works what doesnt stuff you know.
I bought my Nexus One for $530 then just went over to T-mobile and changed my G1 plan to an Even More Plus 1000 minute unlimited text/web $69.99 a month. Unlocked phone and no contract, can't beat that. I think they charged me $35 to change plans but I still think that is great deal. Oh, and all the T-mobile employees in the store were going nuts loving my phone since they had never seen it before.
Im planning to sign up for t-mobile contract and pay 179 for the N1. Once I get the phone, i will cancel the contract on the first day and pay $150 to google. T-mobile should charge me anything because I cancel within the 14 days period. My total cost to obtain the phone is only 329 compared to 529. Anyone see a flaw in this strategy?
Yeah...
If you sign up with T-mo the phone comes locked to T-mo.
PLEASE DO IT!!!!!!!!
Than search google and find this site >>> http://gizmodo.com/5446146/canceling-a-nexus-one-contract-costs-more-than-a-nexus-one
And on another google search (use it, its very useful)
You'll have to pay an Early Termination Fee to both your carrier, and Google.
While your carrier's ETF may vary ($200 for T-Mobile), Google's is equal to the full price of the Nexus One, minus the service plan and the $180 you paid upon signing up. This ETF only applies if you cancel your line within the first 120 days of service. It appears to be set up to make the idea of scamming carriers for cheap phones even less attractive.
Should of told him it was a great idea...
zizoty said:
Im planning to sign up for t-mobile contract and pay 179 for the N1. Once I get the phone, i will cancel the contract on the first day and pay $150 to google. T-mobile should charge me anything because I cancel within the 14 days period. My total cost to obtain the phone is only 329 compared to 529. Anyone see a flaw in this strategy?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is more to it than that. If you cancel inside the grace period, you just send back the N1 and pay for days used.
If you do what you want, keep the phone, you also pay T-Mobile a handset recovery fee of $200. So, you would end up paying 529, plus tax, plus proration and your N1 would be locked to T-Mobile.
Sounds like a very flawed logic.
Yeah I was tempted lol
This would work because tmo wont charge an etf if you cancel within 14 days and google will only charge $150 if you keep the nexus.
I was under the assumption that the T-Mobile ETF is only charged after the 14 days?
alex7619 said:
This would work because tmo wont charge an etf if you cancel within 14 days and google will only charge $150 if you keep the nexus.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly. I thought google only charge you 150 for ETF instead of 350. Didnt goodle change the EFT from 350 to 150 couple weeks ago?
zizoty said:
Exactly. I thought google only charge you 150 for ETF instead of 350. Didnt goodle change the EFT from 350 to 150 couple weeks ago?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Even so, that puts you at $530 (which seems logical but your not gonna make anything and have a lot of extra work)
How did you get 530?. You pay $179 for the phone and 150 for google ETF. Unless t-mobile charge you 200 for ETF but this wouldnt happen because you cancel it within 14days period.
zizoty said:
How did you get 530?. You pay $179 for the phone and 150 for google ETF. Unless t-mobile charge you 200 for ETF but this wouldnt happen because you cancel it within 14days period.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry I put the whole T-Mobile etf...so it comes out too $380 with the $50 T-Mobile etf
You people think found found a loophole in a collaboration between two mega corporations?
T-mobile requires notification from Google that you send the phone back if you wish to cancel your contract.
this is the internet, the land where your good idea was somebody else's idea weeks or months ago...
You guys don't seem to understand...
If you keep the phone after canceling you pay:
$180: Phone
$150: Google ETF
$200: T-Mobile un-returned equipment fee
$?: Prorated usage
Add that up, you get $530, plus the proration, and you have a locked Nexus One.
Now, if you decide you don't like the phone and take advantage of the 14 day return/cancel window and return the phone you pay:
$?: Proration
You don't get any ETF's, or equipment charges(assuming the phone is in like new condition). But you also don't get to keep the phone, and google can charge you a restocking fee (which I think they do, but am not certain, if they do that is another $45 for testing out the phone for a couple days)
Big surprise, Google and T-Mobile are smart enough to prevent you from gaming them. Crazy thought, I know!
veive said:
If you sign up with T-mo the phone comes locked to T-mo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually all of the nexus one's are unlocked. You can put any sim card in it.
No there not my buddy has one subsidized took his sim out put his ATT sim in no luck
Don't forget that they can blacklist the IMEI. Doh!
pjcforpres said:
You guys don't seem to understand...
If you keep the phone after canceling you pay:
$180: Phone
$150: Google ETF
$200: T-Mobile un-returned equipment fee
$?: Prorated usage
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't know T-Mobile charged any "un-returned equipment fee". Not that I would try to do anything like this anyway but why would they charge "un-returned equipment fee" if you didn't buy equipment from them? Seems about as shady as somebody buying a subsidized phone just to cancel.
For my 3000 post, I figured I would do something special for those of us fresh into TMOUSA's crappy 2 year contract (and for those thinking about it).
We all drooled and drooled consistently until TMOUSA came out with the HD2. There is a catch though, it is through TMOUSA. Many people have reported crappy service (cell-wise) and flat spots for data coverage (3G areas turning into Edge, turning into GPRS, into no-data). On top of that paying $450 for a device is not exactly appealing either ($199 sounds like a much better deal after all). I have been thinking about it long and hard and I came up with the perfect mathematical solution for getting a cheaper HD2, sticking to TMOUSA cheaper plans (or leave TMOUSA altogether), and not paying for such crappy data plan/coverage. If you are like me, you are surrounded by an accessible Wifi signal about 70-80% of your waking day, so being forced to pay $30 per month is borderline stupid.
[highlight]Edit: My method is only for brand new devices. A lot of you are suggesting cheaper solutions by buying them off eBay or craiglist, which will come with the added risk of device malfunctions or scams. If you feel adventurous enough to go down these paths... by all means. It usually works out better in the end anyways. But this method ensures a brand new device, that you will get on the spot.[/highlight]
Without Further Ado, I give you the "Scr3w You Very Much, TMOUSA" Method...
Getting HD2 without contract from the store:
$450
Cheapest Unlimited voice only plan from TMO: $49.99 (without contract)
Cost over two years: $49.99 * 24 months = $1199.76
Getting HD2 with contract from the store:
$199
Cheapest Unlimited voice + Data (they will force you into this) plan from TMO: $89.99 (2 year contract)
Cost over two years: $89.99 * 24 months = $2159.76
Cost to get out of the contract (option available only after 15 days from establishing a contract - aka remorse period): $200
Difference in phone price (with and without contract difference):
$450 - $199 = $251
Cost of breaking Contract and Keeping New Phone: $199 + $200 = $399
so we are saving $50 right off the bat (remember that the no contract price is $450, so $450 - $399 = $51)
Plan Cost:
$2159.76 - $1199.76 = $960 savings over two years
Total Savings over 2 years ($960 plan cost savings - $200 early cancellation fee + $50 for savings versus purchasing HD2 @ full price)= $810
You may think "but I still need internet" on the road... simple answer to that too:
Internet package from non contract plan = $25
Internet package from contract plan = $30
Savings over 24 months contract = $120
May not seem like much, but when you add that to the $240 from the unlimited voice plan difference (49.99 w/o contract vs $59.99 w contract), it adds to $360 for the life of the contract, plus you can leave them dry at any point you want...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope this is useful into deciding if you are getting a HD2 but don't want TMOUSA as your carrier or simply don't feel like paying a lot to them.
Good to know for us tmobile users my friend.. i'll stick it as requested.
But there are those of us who actually need more than the basic services.
My business requires me to have unlimited minutes, texts, and e-mail access at all times.
So, over all, T-Mobile is cheaper than At&T or Verizon.
But I do see your point.
$30 a month for 3G internet service does seem a bit too much, when I pay the same amount for 4G (Clear Wireless) at home.
I would much rather opt out of TMOUS 2 year contract and jump ship to AT&T/Verizon/Sprint...
TMOUS has the absolute WORST service...
I guess you forgot the %35 Bing cash back when you shop online and pay full price! $300 with no contract is the best deal
Funkyrocemz said:
I would much rather opt out of TMOUS 2 year contract and jump ship to AT&T/Verizon/Sprint...
TMOUS has the absolute WORST service...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Depends on where you are...they work quite fine in many major areas.
This does make sense. But then again it doesnt. Think about it!
Tmobile sells it on a 2 year contract for $199.
Walmart sells the samething (online) for $99 plus theres many coupons foe $25 off. So thats $75 on a new 2 year contract. Walmart also pays taxes.
Thats $75 vs. $450+ tax.
Now let me get to the point. If you want data+text+500 minutes. Its 59.99 on even more plus. Vs. $79.99 on contract.
So thats $20 more a month.
Heres the catch. If you cancel your contract after 6 months. The fee goes from $200 to $100 per line.
So lets add this up.
Buy the phone for $75. Add ($20 extra a month for 6 months= $120). And then add another $100 for the contract cancellation. Thats a total of $295.
So $295 vs. $450+ tax. Which sounds like a better deal?
After you cancel the contract. Just sign up for even more plus..
As an alternative (I did that personally), buy one get one free from T-Mobile promotion ... and pay $200 + tax for TWO HD2 phones. Activation waived.
So you pay $214 (in FL) for 2 phones.
Then you pay for 2 weeks of cheapest service (around $70) and cancellation fees of $400 for 2 phones
Total loss: $684
And you eBay your 2nd HD2 for $500 (around 450 after all fees)
You get your new shiny HD2 for $234 and you did not even extended your contract yet
Don't Forget HTC has extended the turn in a old phone and get 50.00 on top of that with teh purchase of a HD2, G1, etc... I think till May 19th
recyclerebates.com/htcWebQuote.do;jsessionid=B386A281A1471313D8E724CBA74DD8B4
joshkoss said:
Good to know for us tmobile users my friend.. i'll stick it as requested.
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Click to collapse
Thanks a lot josh!
Always a pleasure hearing from you, my friend!
rickyoon.vegas said:
But there are those of us who actually need more than the basic services.
My business requires me to have unlimited minutes, texts, and e-mail access at all times.
So, over all, T-Mobile is cheaper than At&T or Verizon.
But I do see your point.
$30 a month for 3G internet service does seem a bit too much, when I pay the same amount for 4G (Clear Wireless) at home.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You may think "but I still need internet" on the road... simple answer to that too:
Internet package from non contract plan = $25
Internet package from contract plan = $30
Savings over 24 months contract = $120
May not seem like much, but when you add that to the $240 from the unlimited voice plan difference (49.99 w/o contract vs $59.99 w contract), it adds to $360 for the life of the contract, plus you can leave them dry at any point you want...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Internet with the cheaper plans is cheaper ($5 a month cheaper to be more precise)
alefsin said:
I guess you forgot the %35 Bing cash back when you shop online and pay full price! $300 with no contract is the best deal
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It isn't as much as I forgot, but rather I had no idea about it (then, again, I have never used Bing)
joefx13 said:
This does make sense. But then again it doesnt. Think about it!
Tmobile sells it on a 2 year contract for $199.
Walmart sells the samething (online) for $99 plus theres many coupons foe $25 off. So thats $75 on a new 2 year contract. Walmart also pays taxes.
Thats $75 vs. $450+ tax.
Now let me get to the point. If you want data+text+500 minutes. Its 59.99 on even more plus. Vs. $79.99 on contract.
So thats $20 more a month.
Heres the catch. If you cancel your contract after 6 months. The fee goes from $200 to $100 per line.
So lets add this up.
Buy the phone for $75. Add ($20 extra a month for 6 months= $120). And then add another $100 for the contract cancellation. Thats a total of $295.
So $295 vs. $450+ tax. Which sounds like a better deal?
After you cancel the contract. Just sign up for even more plus..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow! I had no idea Walmart sold these... I bought mine at Best Buy (had a $70 coupon from Rewards)
I was looking at this option and it is done through "Let's Talk"... and they do have their own set of rules (apart from TMOUSA)
$200 LetsTalk instant discount
Purchase select T-Mobile phones online or through our customer service department and receive a $200.00 instant discount when you activate new T-Mobile service on a plan of $59.99 per month or higher and in conjunction with any feature or bundle or any other plan option at least $30.00 per month or greater. This exclusive offer is limited to select online retailers and is not available in any stores. Certain rate plans may not apply. This promotion applies only to individual plans or line 1 to line 2 of a family plan and requires a (2) two-year service agreement.
Offer Qualifications and Restrictions:
Cancellation of this purchase option within the first 61 days of activation will result in a $100 penalty charge.
Customers who add a qualifying feature after their service has been activated by LetsTalk.com are NOT eligible unless the feature is activated by LetsTalk.com directly.
If the customer receives their phone and the qualifying data feature is not active, the customer must contact LetsTalk.com directly to have the feature added in order to avoid a chargeback.
If the customer receives their phone and wishes to add the qualifying feature to take advantage of the offer, the customer must contact LetsTalk.com's Customer Service center and LetsTalk.com must add the qualifying feature through their activation system.
Customers who contact T-Mobile directly to have the qualifying feature added to their accounts post activation will not be eligible for this offer.
The customer may not change the feature activated by LetsTalk.com through T-Mobile's website, call center retail stores or any other T-Mobile agents or representatives and must maintain the same qualifying feature selected at the time of purchase for 61 days in order to avoid a deactivation chargeback.
If the customer wishes to change to a different qualifying feature they must contact LetsTalk.com directly and LetsTalk.com must change the data feature directly otherwise the customer may be liable for a chargeback.
LetsTalk.com imposes this chargeback solely to recoup plan feature commissions deducted by T-Mobile.
Phones Eligible for this Promotion:
Samsung Behold II (T-Mobile), HTC HD2 (T-Mobile)
Qualifying Plan Features for this promotion:
Android Unlimited Web, Android Unlimited Web for Flexpay, myTouch Unlimited Web, myTouch Unlimited Web for Flexpay, BlackBerry Unlimited Web, BlackBerry Unlimited Web for Flexpay, BlackBerry Unlimited Web w/Enterprise Email, BlackBerry Unlimited Web w/Enterprise Email for Flexpay, Sidekick Unlimited Web, Sidekick Unlimited Web for Flexpay, SmartPhone Unlimited Web, SmartPhone Unlimited Web for Flexpay
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But you are absolutely correct about everything you are saying... There will be various methods for doing this (which result in different savings) based on personal usage of the features of the plan. In my case, (as I explained in the first post) I don't really need internet 24/7 on my device since most of my waking time, I am in areas where wireless is available, so for me this translates into at least saving $30 per month (without accounting the fact that the unlimited voice is $10 cheaper as well), and here is the thing why I posted this. Remember that having internet when you are in a contract is not an option, it is a requirement... there is no way out of it unless you break your contract or pay full price for the phone. I figured this way to be cheaper for my usage type.
Maybe I will change the title of this thread to "Ways of Getting a Cheaper Device and No Contract" or something like that. I appreciate your input on this
bogdatov said:
As an alternative (I did that personally), buy one get one free from T-Mobile promotion ... and pay $200 + tax for TWO HD2 phones. Activation waived.
So you pay $214 (in FL) for 2 phones.
Then you pay for 2 weeks of cheapest service (around $70) and cancellation fees of $400 for 2 phones
Total loss: $684
And you eBay your 2nd HD2 for $500 (around 450 after all fees)
You get your new shiny HD2 for $234 and you did not even extended your contract yet
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not bad, but why would someone pay $500 for a device on eBay (assuming shipping is included), when they can buy it brand new, from the store, no contract needed for $450?
alooohaboy said:
Don't Forget HTC has extended the turn in a old phone and get 50.00 on top of that with teh purchase of a HD2, G1, etc... I think till May 19th
recyclerebates.com/htcWebQuote.do;jsessionid=B386A281A1471313D8E724CBA74DD8B4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just checked it out and in order to do this, you have to have proof of purchase (receipt or UPC box label). I have a 7 year old Wallaby bought in eBay, a 5 year old Blue Angel, 2 0.5 year old Vogues (soon to be 4), soon to have a Tytn, and a Wizard (which I sold, but for the sake of argument, I will throw it in as well).... I cannot use any of these devices for that since I have no way of providing them with proof of purchase (and this happens to be the case for a lot of htc device owners around here).
It is a good resource to have though. Thanks for sharing.
Just spoke to LetsTalk customer support. aka Walmart $99 purchase.
They'll give you the phone for $99 but if you break the contract within 6 months, you'll have to pay $250 disconnect fee to LetsTalk in addition to the $200 charged by T-Mobile.
I went to a Sams Club last week and they had it for $142 + tax. The guy there said I can keep my existing plan (family plan and $25 android data plan).
So my plan is to buy the phone from Sams Club. If I like it, I'll stay on the new 2 yr contract and if I don't I'll break the contract after 30 days and sell it on craigslist (ebay charges a lot of fees).
I've been waiting for a good android phone for a long time (my contract on the G1 got over more than a year ago. But since T-Mobile is not getting any good androind phones, I'll try WM 6.5. Microsoft wins and Google loses. The last WM device I used was an MPX200. I would have bought the Nexus One if they allowed me to add it to my family plan with a discounted rate.
before u go getting phones at contract discount and canceling. you may want to read this http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php?t=1634784
basically says tmobile will start blcking IMEI's of phones from canceled contracts. I dont know if its legit but i just bought a HD2 from ebay and now im paranoid anyone heard of this?
Edit seller assured me thats not the case for me but still thats kinda scary.
kcaj32 said:
Just spoke to LetsTalk customer support. aka Walmart $99 purchase.
They'll give you the phone for $99 but if you break the contract within 6 months, you'll have to pay $250 disconnect fee to LetsTalk in addition to the $200 charged by T-Mobile.
I went to a Sams Club last week and they had it for $142 + tax. The guy there said I can keep my existing plan (family plan and $25 android data plan).
So my plan is to buy the phone from Sams Club. If I like it, I'll stay on the new 2 yr contract and if I don't I'll break the contract after 30 days and sell it on craigslist (ebay charges a lot of fees).
I've been waiting for a good android phone for a long time (my contract on the G1 got over more than a year ago. But since T-Mobile is not getting any good androind phones, I'll try WM 6.5. Microsoft wins and Google loses. The last WM device I used was an MPX200. I would have bought the Nexus One if they allowed me to add it to my family plan with a discounted rate.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is true!
But if you plan on keeping the phone for atleast 181 days, then lets talk will remove the fee (plus tmobile will only charge $100 per line). This would be the best decision for someone looking to keep the phone and not sell it anytime soon.
mrbox23 said:
before u go getting phones at contract discount and canceling. you may want to read this http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php?t=1634784
basically says tmobile will start blcking IMEI's of phones from canceled contracts. I dont know if its legit but i just bought a HD2 from ebay and now im paranoid anyone heard of this?
Edit seller assured me thats not the case for me but still thats kinda scary.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess this would apply more to being careful about buying the phone from 3rd party (places like ebay, craiglist, etc)
joefx13 said:
This is true!
But if you plan on keeping the phone for atleast 181 days, then lets talk will remove the fee (plus tmobile will only charge $100 per line). This would be the best decision for someone looking to keep the phone and not sell it anytime soon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I spoke to T-Mobile too. Their policy for canceling 2 years contract is:
If you have more than 180 days from the end of the contract, you pay $200.
If you have more than 90 days but less than 180 before contract ends, its $50, and less than 90 days for contract to end, you pay $25.
But yes, I agree that someone who plans on keeping the phone for 2 years, its a good deal.
I got mine for 108 customer loyalty discount .
i got mine for $0.00
:-D
$99 - Loyalty discount NM
NM
There is no message.
I paid $212.13 after tax. They did wave $18 upgrade fee.
However, this was my first smartphone. Where I won was them allowing me to reverse grandfather into the $30 unlimited plan. The last update to my data usage was 2457MB as of 6:27pm 11/14/10, 6.5 days after I got it.
I got mine for free, my wife's was 199.
There are only two ways to get the loyalty discount:
1. You paid too much each month (> $100).
or
2. You haven't upgraded for ages ( out of contract for over a year or two).
Either way, it's a chimp change for AT&T to give you a small discount out of the $$$ they made out of you every month
I pay only $95/mo for entire family account of 3 lines and upgrade every single year (can live with any phone for over a year). So, no discount for me. But also means I saved $$$ every year, more than $100 or $200 discount for sure.
foxbat121 said:
There are only two ways to get the loyalty discount:
1. You paid too much each month (> $100).
or
2. You haven't upgraded for ages ( out of contract for over a year or two).
Either way, it's a chimp change for AT&T to give you a small discount out of the $$$ they made out of you every month
I pay only $95/mo for entire family account of 3 lines and upgrade every single year (can live with any phone for over a year). So, no discount for me. But also means I saved $$$ every year, more than $100 or $200 discount for sure.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My thoughts exactly.
foxbat121 said:
There are only two ways to get the loyalty discount:
1. You paid too much each month (> $100).
or
2. You haven't upgraded for ages ( out of contract for over a year or two).
Either way, it's a chimp change for AT&T to give you a small discount out of the $$$ they made out of you every month
I pay only $95/mo for entire family account of 3 lines and upgrade every single year (can live with any phone for over a year). So, no discount for me. But also means I saved $$$ every year, more than $100 or $200 discount for sure.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or you have 4 smartphones...and associated data plans to go with them and unlimited messaging.
If I priced out 4 separate individual plans, I'd be paying through the nose. I think $150 for four smartphones with unlimited data (pre cap) and unlimited text/pix/vids etc. along with 2k mins is a pretty good deal
V DidDy 210 said:
Or you have 4 smartphones...and associated data plans to go with them and unlimited messaging.
If I priced out 4 separate individual plans, I'd be paying through the nose. I think $150 for four smartphones with unlimited data (pre cap) and unlimited text/pix/vids etc. along with 2k mins is a pretty good deal
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only the service charge on the primary line counts into loyalty discount. You can pay for 100 lines and your loyalty discount remains the same.
foxbat121 said:
Only the service charge on the primary line counts into loyalty discount. You can pay for 100 lines and your loyalty discount remains the same.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that's true but i'm not even talking about the discount. He's saying that people who pay way too much are the only one's eligible for loyalty discount.
but I'm arguing that I think that 150 for all that i get is a very good deal
I paid $499 and tax. And promptly returned it the next day. I'll wait to see if any holiday sales pop up before thinking about purchasing one again.
V DidDy 210 said:
that's true but i'm not even talking about the discount. He's saying that people who pay way too much are the only one's eligible for loyalty discount.
but I'm arguing that I think that 150 for all that i get is a very good deal
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, $150 is a good deal for 4 smartphones, but he's also right because you don't qualify for the loyalty discount since you don't pay "too much".
Right now Focus is AT&T store exclusive, as soon as Amazon or Newegg has it, it'll be $100 less at least. Surround was available for free with a new contract at Amazon and it's a damn good phone for free!
I paid $106 for the Focus(haven't upgraded in almost a year) and got the unlimited data for smartphones on AT&T.I used to have the unlimited data for iphone so no change in monthly bill.
rexian said:
Yes, $150 is a good deal for 4 smartphones, but he's also right because you don't qualify for the loyalty discount since you don't pay "too much".
Right now Focus is AT&T store exclusive, as soon as Amazon or Newegg has it, it'll be $100 less at least. Surround was available for free with a new contract at Amazon and it's a damn good phone for free!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Correct. What I refered to was monthly bill, not how much you paid for your phone. It's the monthly bill that matters dollar wise, not the one time phone cost. Assume you pay $30 extra per month than most others, it could add up to $720 extra in 2-year contract and for that you get $100 discount on the phone. No a greatest deal but if you could use all that features you paid for, good for you. But personally I don't see any point of this poll/thread.
i'm curious as to how you got 3 lines with unlimited data/messaging and minutes for 95...?
Revaric said:
i'm curious as to how you got 3 lines with unlimited data/messaging and minutes for 95...?
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Click to collapse
I didn't say that.
Someone over at Engadget tipped regarding a $100 off holiday coupon for select phones - the Focus was included. I called AT&T customer service and asked them to credit me for the $100 so I didn't have to go through the trouble of returning it to the store and buying it again online just to save. They credited me $105. So I ended up paying $145 for my Focus after tax.
Does that coupon work for the non contract price? A $499 Focus would then be $399?
I don't know. I suggest anyone thinking about the focus. Which is awesome pressure the sales associate for the customer loyalty discount. and then report back here.
bmstrong said:
Does that coupon work for the non contract price? A $499 Focus would then be $399?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The coupon specifically stated it was only valid with certain phones and a 2 year contract
I realize many people sign 2 year contracts because they see "free phone" and think the carrier subsidizing the phone somehow works out in their interest over the course of 2 years of paying $80-100 per month. But, considering the attractive prepaid/pay as you go/no contract options available now, why don't people take the time to do some simple math and realize paying $300 for an unlocked phone and $30-50 a month thereafter is much cheaper than getting a free phone and an expensive contract plan?
Thoughts? Personally, the notion of signing away your life for 2 years just to get phone service is absurd.
Not necessarily, I'm on contract for three years but I got my skyrocket for 200 new. My plan is only 50 tax in and has everything I need, including unlimited texting, 6 Gibson of data, 500 daytime, evenings & weekends after 6, call I'd, voicemail and unlimited network calling. Mind u, some people are paying more for less, but that doesn't mean that EVERYONE is paying 100 per month. Most people can't afford the 600 upfront for a good smartphone, and carriers know this
icenight89 said:
Not necessarily, I'm on contract for three years but I got my skyrocket for 200 new. My plan is only 50 tax in and has everything I need, including unlimited texting, 6 Gibson of data, 500 daytime, evenings & weekends after 6, call I'd, voicemail and unlimited network calling. Mind u, some people are paying more for less, but that doesn't mean that EVERYONE is paying 100 per month. Most people can't afford the 600 upfront for a good smartphone, and carriers know this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's not bad, really, but contract plans in the U.S. tend to be more expensive. Like, T-Mobile's standard 5GB contract plan with however many minutes and unlimited messaging is $80 a month, and you're throttled after 5GB down to dial up speeds, as far as I know.
I mean, you can find fairly new smartphones on the Internet (ebay, et al) for $200-400. Expensive, sure, but cheaper than a 2 year contract in most cases, even with a subsidized phone. Consider paying $200 or $250 for a subsidized phone, and you're still locked into a contract. Seems kind of out there, especially with the Draconian data usage policies all carriers here are implementing.
Pretty good deal, but I wouldn't commit to a carrier for 3 years (at least not in the states) because the landscape can change so much. I especially wouldn't commit to the same phone for 3 years now that they're releasing more powerful ones by the droves (sure, you can get an upgrade, but that leads to a contract extension anyway).
I just did it because the ''free'' HTC Desire HD when it was just released and I took an contract where I could change it after 3 months and that resulted that I right now pay € 22,79 before inflation correction this was € 22,50.
So for about € 600 I have unlimited mobile internet with a fup and € 20 credit each month which I can call 100 min with, but my contract is fishy, I take that € 20 to the next month if I not use it, but most time it will just get lost so my family often borrow my phone because I don't use much off those mins.
But when I took my contract the HTC Desire HD had still a new price between € 500 and € 550 so if we go calculate then I just pay about € 100 for the mobile internet and call mins.
So that would make € 4,16 for each month. That is really cheap as aslong i'm in my country i have internet, if i'm in another country I can use call and sms from within that € 20.
But in October 2012 my contract will end so I will not make it new but end it and then I will just use no sim card or a prepaid for being reachable. Because mobile contract are not cheap anymore in my country.
But this contract is my second where I have high end smartphone for free with and pay around € 600 after two years, my first was with iPhone 3G but that contract cost some more, but still in € 600 I guess something like € 650 maybe, but I forget it.
These contracts are so made that if you go over your bundle that you will pay much more, so that's why you get phone for free, but they will also charge you more if you send a text message to another country, for example, if I send a text message when I log on to a german network it cost me € 0,13 and goes off from my bundle, but if I send that same text message from my provider inside my country then it cost me € 0,39 and that is charged extra.
So i'm smart and whenever I send my gf a text message who is staying in another country, then I log my phone on the German network, it has saved me alot already.
This is almost like asking why do people go to mcdonalds?
I have both a postpaid contract account (standard 2yr in US) and a prepaid account with the same carrier. (TMOUS) (long story, don't ask)
I FEEL (note the caps phrase, please) that not only is customer service better on the postpaid account, but the data speeds are faster (comparing SIM to SIM not, device to device).....
Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk
radlink14 said:
This is almost like asking why do people go to mcdonalds?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, it is, considering the abundance of other options.
Probably because most carriers try their damndest to prevent people from getting on postpaid no-contract plans. I'm currently fighting with T-Mobile over this and have since left for AT&T which had no issue giving me a postpaid plan without a contract (since I bought my device outright).
Contract worked out cheaper for me.
synaesthetic said:
Probably because most carriers try their damndest to prevent people from getting on postpaid no-contract plans. I'm currently fighting with T-Mobile over this and have since left for AT&T which had no issue giving me a postpaid plan without a contract (since I bought my device outright).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh boy. I'm curious now--what'd T-Mobile do? I haven't heard many horror stories about their postpaid stuff, but to be honest I haven't heard much about T-Mobile lately at all.
pottedplant73 said:
Oh boy. I'm curious now--what'd T-Mobile do? I haven't heard many horror stories about their postpaid stuff, but to be honest I haven't heard much about T-Mobile lately at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I left T-Mobile for a month to go to Sprint because coverage was terrible at my home (I've since moved). Sprint wasn't much better, so I canceled during my 30-day trial and went back to T-Mobile.
In the intervening month I was with Sprint, T-Mobile had canceled their Even More Plus (postpaid no-contract) plans and brought their current plans instead. I told them specifically I didn't want a contract, that I had my own devices and didn't need subsidized or financed phones. The rep agreed to all of this and signed me back up on what should have been the closest approximation of what I had before (500 minutes, unlimited SMS, 5GB internets).
Except it wasn't. It was a two-year contract on both lines, even though I never got a subsidized device out of the deal. So I called them and complained about this and tried to get them to fix it. The only thing they were willing to do was to give me a cheaper option by condensing my two lines into a family plan. I was not happy but I saw little choice outside of paying two lines' worth of ETF fees.
After that I didn't really have many complaints. The service was great, speeds were wonderful and the price was pretty damn low. So I didn't press the issue of being set up on a contract without my initial consent.
But then in November, T-Mobile began to heavily compress all JPEG images on the internet when using mobile data.
I don't just mean minor compression to save a few bits here and there. This was major, significant compression where JPEG filesizes would be reduced by 350%. The end result was, of course, incredibly poor image quality all across the web--and even in the Android Market. The transparent image-compression proxy caused apps like Google+ to force-close when viewing pictures.
This looked awful on my old Nexus S 800x480 display. It looked far, far worse on my Galaxy Nexus's 1280x720 display. Naturally I called and complained. Long and loud. Nothing ever changed. Nobody ever even attempted to solve the issue--indeed, if it was even an issue and not just an underhanded way to try and conserve bandwidth.
After over a dozen calls to customer service and tech support spanning nearly ten hours of phone conversations, a huge number of factory resets done on both devices to placate their reps, and two SIM card replacements, I was done, fed up with the lot of them. Went to AT&T and transferred both lines over. Now T-Mobile's trying to charge me ETFs.