Linux Computer Replacement with Tab?

Linux Computer Replacement with Tab? - Galaxy Tab General

Friends,
Since the Galaxy Tab source code has been released, would we expect to have a solid base of Linux tools available via a custom ROM eventually? Having rooted the Tab and installed Busybox I still seem to be lacking many normal Linux tools.
It would be great to use the Galaxy Tab as a "complete Linux workstation" from the command-line (the Android GUI is nice, but the command-line seems to be greatly lacking in comparison to a true Linux workstation). Imagine the power of a complete desktop experience (save for the GUI) on the Tab. I saw on YouTube someone installed Ubuntu on the Tab and was able to access it via a loop-back VNC session, but the mouse control seemed unstable (we don't really need the desktop environment anyway since the Android GUI is nice, but it's the underlying Linux power that seems to be missing?) This is my first Android device so maybe my expectations are rather high?
Any thoughts on how to make the Tab into a true Linux workstation are more than welcomed, thank you.

Related

Ubuntu on DZ

hi,
i just found this interesting thread in the dhd development section:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1546629
i´m wondering if this will work on dz?
it seems to be related to this one:
http://www.ubuntu.com/devices/android
...and that looks great
EDIT: it´s another version of chroot and not based on ubuntu for android.

Not exactly
That seems more related to linux installer, which you can look for in the market... it's basically a linux distro running chroot on your system. You can enter it from a terminal and start a VNC session from within it and then use android-VNC to connect to the "desktop".
It's not exactly the same thing as ubuntu on android. Although the team behind Linux Installer is also considering having X on it. THAT on the other hand is far closer to ubuntu on android, from what I can understand anyway. Ubuntu on android is meant to be used with a docking station though, so you can plug in an external monitor, keyboard and mouse if you want.
I have Debian on my Desire Z on a chroot environment as well and have the VNC setup, but... haven't used it like at all, the screen is so damn small, the amount of precision it takes to hit the "Close window" button, the little "X"... not fun. If you could get X to work and then be able to plug a display into the DZ, as well as other input devices, then there could be some real use. DZ running the actual Ubuntu for android project, I don't think is possible. If the VNC setup tickles your pickle, though, then you have a winner. You can still do everything like in a linux distro, but you won't be able to have a desktop, atleast not in the same fully functional way you have on your computer.

yes, i know what you are talking about. i already had ubuntu as chroot on my desire z and it was completly useless...

[Q] Ubuntu Touch on Ouya

I had maybe a naive expectation of the ouya. My dream was to install all my server stack on it (mailserver, owncloud, xbmc) and plug it to a tv. Sometimes i would play on it, but most of the time it would be just a private, secure, home server. Ok the whole playing stuff is kind of working, (after adding fake credit card) but installing any server related software on android just sucks. But that i ran into ubuntu touch and i looked a bit closer to it.
- lxc (linux containers) better seperation between android and ubuntu
- android is not the mayor system anymore (container flip)
- almost complete debian/ ubuntu stack (apt-get install nginx zsh # and all that useful server stuff)
- X through vnc # if someone need that
- all drivers are running because of android
So is someone trying, willing to port it on ouya? Actually i never did something like that but with the porting guide it seams feasible
wiki(dot)ubuntu(dot)com/Touch/Install

Ubuntu or Debian in general would be nice to use the ouya as a kind of multimedia pc with native support of ntfs and other formats of external harddrives. Also you don't have to argue with browserplugins like flash or problems with not landscaped apps like spotify and the mouse and keyboard support within applications would be much nicer.
The OS doesn't have to have touchenviroment because it's useless on ouya but ubuntu touch should provide a good base system because of many tegra 3 devices supported right now. Maybe it's possible with slight modifications of those bootloaders they're using right now.
https:// wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices (not allowed to post outside links so just remove the spaces)

It will be extreamly cool to have Linux on OUYA.
My choose is Linux Ultimate Edition for OUYA

Hopefully someone answers here.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2382395

Anyone tried this Linux installer yet? I've never really tried it out before.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.zpwebsites.linuxonandroid
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

It's just an virtual machine and the performance is not somwhere near what the ouya should be capable off

Not Ubuntu Touch but Debian seems to to be near to run natively on the OUYA
http://tuomas.kulve.fi/blog/2013/08/11/debian-on-ouya/
i'm waiting until the mayor issues are fixed but im looking forward to use all the software compatible with arm on linux.
finally ouya could become the free platform i was waiting for :fingers-crossed:

One step closer to a "hackable" ouya
Klindworth said:
Not Ubuntu Touch but Debian seems to to be near to run natively on the OUYA
http : // tuomas.kulve.fi/blog/2013/08/11/debian-on-ouya/
i'm waiting until the mayor issues are fixed but im looking forward to use all the software compatible with arm on linux.
finally ouya could become the free platform i was waiting for :fingers-crossed:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
One step closer to a "hackable" ouya. https : // github.com/ouya/ouya_1_1-kernel/commit/4a4389d10e15e7b04221987381f696441ef26701

Arm Linux OS's with Linux Deploy

If you don't understand what ssh or vnc is, please don't attempt this.
I am able to run Kali Linux armhf on the 13.3.1 by following this guide. It can run other distros too.
I can confirm it is working 100% and runs very smooth. Here is a link to the Linux Deploy app. You need a vnc app or a ssh app to interface with it. I recommend Real VNC Viewer. Instead of connecting to your private ip, just connect using your loopback 127.0.0.1 It is faster.
I hope this could be of some use towards cracking the bootloader. Comments, questions, discussion wanted.

Nice idea but what can you really do on Kali that you can't do via adb shell?
PS putty ftw!
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Spec-Chum said:
Nice idea but what can you really do on Kali that you can't do via adb shell?
PS putty ftw!
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Install linux native applications, light server, supports many linux distros like gentoo arch debian ubuntu fedora. Aircrack-ng, reaver, sslstrip, metasploit. The fun stuff.

Faznx92 said:
Install linux native applications, light server, supports many linux distros like gentoo arch debian ubuntu fedora. Aircrack-ng, reaver, sslstrip, metasploit. The fun stuff.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice, I'm sold

Repurpose a device
I would really like to get a different OS on my device or even do a GRUB bootloader kind of thing which will allow Android or another OS. I want to repurpose a tablet for my car project and I don't want to use Android.
I have done the VNC thing in the past with Ubuntu and it was horribly slow. Anything emulating on top of an OS will be less than optimal. I have used VMPlayer and VirtualBox before on a regular desktop and they seem ok. But still I'd like another OS that will be fast on boot up and ready to go in the shortest amount of time.
chris

This is very interesting. Has anyone managed to get Mer working through Linux Deploy? Having Plasma Active running like that would be pretty awesome. Other DEs aren't really optimised for touch the way Plasma Active is.
EDIT: Actually, it might be possible to get Plasma Active running via Gentoo, as they have an overlay for it. Still experimental, but then what isn't experimental at this point

GreatEmerald said:
This is very interesting. Has anyone managed to get Mer working through Linux Deploy? Having Plasma Active running like that would be pretty awesome. Other DEs aren't really optimised for touch the way Plasma Active is.
EDIT: Actually, it might be possible to get Plasma Active running via Gentoo, as they have an overlay for it. Still experimental, but then what isn't experimental at this point
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You use a vnc app on loobback address(127.0.0.1) to connect. It is the fastest emulation I ever had running on any device. This is perfect for me if i can get a keyboard working. If you lower the resolution of the linux guest with a ui like lxde it is very easy to use it as a touch interface.

Mr_Ada said:
I would really like to get a different OS on my device or even do a GRUB bootloader kind of thing which will allow Android or another OS. I want to repurpose a tablet for my car project and I don't want to use Android.
I have done the VNC thing in the past with Ubuntu and it was horribly slow. Anything emulating on top of an OS will be less than optimal. I have used VMPlayer and VirtualBox before on a regular desktop and they seem ok. But still I'd like another OS that will be fast on boot up and ready to go in the shortest amount of time.
chris
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try it out on the loopback address 127.0.0.1 It is blazing fast with ui like lxde or xfce. Fastest I ever seen on a tablet/android.

Faznx92 said:
You use a vnc app on loobback address(127.0.0.1) to connect. It is the fastest emulation I ever had running on any device. This is perfect for me if i can get a keyboard working. If you lower the resolution of the linux guest with a ui like lxde it is very easy to use it as a touch interface.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea, thanks. I'll read a bit more on Linux Deploy to see how it works. And I'm very familiar with Gentoo (have three Gentoo devices here), so setting it up shouldn't be a problem. I also asked on their IRC, and they said Plasma Active should theoretically compile on Gentoo ARM, but nobody ever tested it. Sounds like a good opportunity to do just that!

Got to run Gentoo, although it required a bit of effort. Since I want Plasma Active, I didn't choose any GUI (I need to set it up manually). However, the problem is that SSH wouldn't run, either, citing that OpenRC wasn't started itself, and that I had to execute touch /run/openrc/softlevel in order to get it to start. Which is nice and all, but it's a circular dependency: to create the file, I need to log in through ssh, and to log in through ssh I need to create the file. So I ended up doing this:
Create a bash script file with that line
Upload it to the device (I put it in the downloads directory)
Do a "chmod 777 /datamedia/media/0/Download/<myscriptfilename>.sh"
In Linux Deploy:
Enable Custom mount (leave the path default)
Enable Custom startup
Set Script file to "/mnt/0/Download/<myscriptfilename>.sh"
That allowed me to create that file and start sshd correctly. So now I can log in via ssh, yay!
It makes me wonder, though – is there a support forum for Linux Deploy in English? Their main forum seems to be Russian...

GreatEmerald said:
Got to run Gentoo, although it required a bit of effort. Since I want Plasma Active, I didn't choose any GUI (I need to set it up manually). However, the problem is that SSH wouldn't run, either, citing that OpenRC wasn't started itself, and that I had to execute touch /run/openrc/softlevel in order to get it to start. Which is nice and all, but it's a circular dependency: to create the file, I need to log in through ssh, and to log in through ssh I need to create the file. So I ended up doing this:
Create a bash script file with that line
Upload it to the device (I put it in the downloads directory)
Do a "chmod 777 /datamedia/media/0/Download/<myscriptfilename>.sh"
In Linux Deploy:
Enable Custom mount (leave the path default)
Enable Custom startup
Set Script file to "/mnt/0/Download/<myscriptfilename>.sh"
That allowed me to create that file and start sshd correctly. So now I can log in via ssh, yay!
It makes me wonder, though – is there a support forum for Linux Deploy in English? Their main forum seems to be Russian...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great job! It looks like the original dev was russian and their github is in russian but use google translate. Hope this helps.

Android Terminal Emulator
Faznx92 said:
Great job! It looks like the original dev was russian and their github is in russian but use google translate. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I actually took concepts from Linux Deploy and Complete(??) Linux Installer, and built a set of scripts to do all the chroot work without needing an Android app. Since I primarily use the terminal, running everything from the shell is much easier than using an app.
Using something like Android Terminal Emulator, you do not need ssh on the android side at all. You simply su to root and run a chroot command:
chroot <linux-mnt-pt> /bin/bash -i
or
chroot <linux-mnt-pt> /bin/su <user>
or
chroot <linux-mnt-pt> /bin/login <user>
The last option requires typing a password, but since it's a login, it sets up your environment correctly. The other two inherit your Android PATH (among other things), so you have to set PATH by hand or use an rc file which sets it from scratch.
Personally, I find even LXDE much too slow for regular use over vnc. Most of my interest revolves around emacs and gcc, which both work great in Android Terminal Emulator.
-Pie

Faznx92 said:
Great job! It looks like the original dev was russian and their github is in russian but use google translate. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, thanks for pointing that out. His issue list is in English, and that's exactly what I need!
I talked to people over at #systemd to see if it would be possible to have systemd launching things in a chroot, and unfortunately it seems to be impossible for the Kindle Fire HDX 7, because its kernel is not compiled with PID namespaces that systemd requires to function, and we don't have any means to compile custom kernels as far as I know. It's too bad, but I guess I can cope with OpenRC for now.
EatingPie said:
I actually took concepts from Linux Deploy and Complete(??) Linux Installer, and built a set of scripts to do all the chroot work without needing an Android app. Since I primarily use the terminal, running everything from the shell is much easier than using an app.
Using something like Android Terminal Emulator, you do not need ssh on the android side at all. You simply su to root and run a chroot command:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Interesting, although I do prefer an app (it's really quite convenient). Also, as far as ssh goes, I do prefer having that running over typing things into the terminal using the touchscreen.
Overall the experience of running Gentoo on ARM is interesting. The Snapdragon 800 is really quite a beast, but rather peculiar. There are often delays before my input starts to be processed, but once it does, it runs very fast, until it goes idle again. And the speed at which it compiles things is amazing. It's also nice that I can use all of those nice optimisations (I'm using -march=native and -mfpu=neon-vfpv4, with the neon USE flag enabled; I'd like to set -mcpu to something specific, but it doesn't seem to have Snapdragon as an option).

Ubuntu os
Maybe sometime we would be able to get Ubuntu os on our tabs.

zhable said:
Maybe sometime we would be able to get Ubuntu os on our tabs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You already can, although it's limited to the desktop version (which isn't any good when it comes to touchscreens). Not sure if Ubuntu Touch will be available at some point. But eventually Ubuntu will ship Unity 8, which will be more touch-friendly.

This is all great news!

GreatEmerald said:
Overall the experience of running Gentoo on ARM is interesting. The Snapdragon 800 is really quite a beast, but rather peculiar. There are often delays before my input starts to be processed, but once it does, it runs very fast, until it goes idle again. And the speed at which it compiles things is amazing. It's also nice that I can use all of those nice optimisations (I'm using -march=native and -mfpu=neon-vfpv4, with the neon USE flag enabled; I'd like to set -mcpu to something specific, but it doesn't seem to have Snapdragon as an option).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think -march=native is doing anything there buddy.
GCC doesn't officially "support" Krait (yet), nearest I can see would be Cortex-A9 which uses the same scheduling model (albeit with 3 less pipeline stages) as a Krait. Interestingly, LLVM/Clang has just patched in a krait -mcpu target, if you can use that. To be honest you'll not be gaining too much as, IIRC, the main difference between a Krait and an A9, in compiler specific terms, is vfp4, but you're setting that with the -mfpu option anyway.
My point after spouting that gibberish is to not sweat it, lose -march, change -mcpu to cortex-a9 and you're golden. At least until a krait mcpu target for GCC...

Spec-Chum said:
I don't think -march=native is doing anything there buddy.
GCC doesn't officially "support" Krait (yet), nearest I can see would be Cortex-A9 which uses the same scheduling model (albeit with 3 less pipeline stages) as a Krait. Interestingly, LLVM/Clang has just patched in a krait -mcpu target, if you can use that. To be honest you'll not be gaining too much as, IIRC, the main difference between a Krait and an A9, in compiler specific terms, is vfp4, but you're setting that with the -mfpu option anyway.
My point after spouting that gibberish is to not sweat it, lose -march, change -mcpu to cortex-a9 and you're golden. At least until a krait mcpu target for GCC...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope, -march=native sets -march to armv7-a, which is close enough. The point in using it is that as soon as GCC gets better optimisations, -march=native will use the more optimised choice, without manual intervention.

too slow download
very slow retrieving of files from server i have a 2 mb/s line
any idea how should i retrive it offline
---------- Post added at 06:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:00 PM ----------
suit urself and paste any one link in mirror url in linux depoly settings for kali and other deployments
http://http.kali.org/README.mirrorlist
remove the readme when adding the url ... press thanks nd make me feel aprreciated

[POLL] What OS do you use?

Just curious to see exactly how many people actually use Linux or OSX a.k.a the only OSes you can build Android on which IMO all Android devs should be using

I'm running Manjaro, an Arch based distro
Sent from my ASUS_Z00AD using Tapatalk

Jhdoubleoseven said:
Just curious to see exactly how many people actually use Linux or OSX a.k.a the only OSes you can build Android on which IMO all Android devs should be using
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haha still on win 7...Waiting for win 10

Jhdoubleoseven said:
Just curious to see exactly how many people actually use Linux or OSX a.k.a the only OSes you can build Android on which IMO all Android devs should be using
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are virtualization options availible for Windows such as cygwin I've used in the past that can help.

PC Gaming Master Race (Windows). Proud. xD

8.1 on one xubuntu 15.04 on another
Sent from my ASUS_Z00AD using XDA Free mobile app

Jhdoubleoseven said:
Just curious to see exactly how many people actually use Linux or OSX a.k.a the only OSes you can build Android on which IMO all Android devs should be using
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm using fedora but why should all android devs use linux? I think you should use whatever you're comfortable with

Niropa said:
I'm using fedora but why should all android devs use linux? I think you should use whatever you're comfortable with
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because:
1) Android is a Linux system so if you wanna develop it it's best to know Linux up close and personal
2) Building Android things (like ROMs) on Linux is much more straightforward
3) Linux systems are much more secure and generally more stable (not related to Android, just in general)
4) Microsoft is a corporate evil that restricts the freedom of its users and encourages the use of proprietary software
OSX is also guilty of the same evils as Windows with the exception that OSX is a Unix system and therefore enjoys many of the same benefits as Linux

I've been a linux user since 1998, I'm comfortable building programs from scratch, used to build my own kernel (prior to 3.x) and have modified kernel modules to add support for some devices.
Having said that, I tried to build a kernel and system for an Android device some long time ago, did have the source tree for the device, but it always failed because some blob was missing or some source file had incorrect references to other files. I just tossed the towel, mainly because compilation took forever just to fail at the end. Besides I had to download like 40GB to set up the build environment.
Having previous linux experience did not help me much, as Android was different enough to what I knew. This was at the time gingerbread was the latest version ( Android 3 devices existed, but that's another story).
Hopefully things have changed, if so I might give it a try again.
Sent from my ASUS_Z00AD using Tapatalk

Niropa said:
3) now that's a very silly point, Linux is only more secure because its more obscure then other operating systems and saying it is generally more stable is just wrong. With windows I had rarely any problems. With any Linux distribution I get very bad screen tearing, audio stops working after a reboot, many packages (steam for example) don't work without hours of troubleshooting and file transfers to my phone or music player make at least one song on every album sound like it got thrown in a blender and got chopped up before being transfered. There are many more problems which don't help my android development. When iI could be updating my ROMs I can't because I'm busy troubleshooting why my distribution decided not to pass grub.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I work for a major IT company. All system administrators- Window, Unix, Mainframe, or DBA have to use Linux as their OS because it is more secure than MS Windows. The base multi-user model of Unix makes it more secure, then add things like SELinux, and becomes very hard to compromise.
Your garbled songs sounds like you are disconnecting your device before all the files have finished transferring. Your screen tearing sounds like you are using a software or frame buffer driver instead of the accelerated driver for your video chipset. Sound can be a pita at times. A newer distro solved my issues (meaning updated kernel drivers) with sound. For Steam, I think I had to enable a repo, then just 'yum install steam'. It is not so much Linux is difficult as it is different from what you are used to.

alose said:
I work for a major IT company. All system administrators- Window, Unix, Mainframe, or DBA have to use Linux as their OS because it is more secure than MS Windows. The base multi-user model of Unix makes it more secure, then add things like SELinux, and becomes very hard to compromise.
Your garbled songs sounds like you are disconnecting your device before all the files have finished transferring. Your screen tearing sounds like you are using a software or frame buffer driver instead of the accelerated driver for your video chipset. Sound can be a pita at times. A newer distro solved my issues (meaning updated kernel drivers) with sound. For Steam, I think I had to enable a repo, then just 'yum install steam'. It is not so much Linux is difficult as it is different from what you are used to.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol nice assumptions but no. I can assure you I'm not disconnecting it before its finished transferring, my only guess is it has something to do with libmtp and the way it handles file transfers which must be different then other operating systems. I use the open source amd drivers which give me screen tearing. I noticed proprietary drivers fixed it but then when I reboot its just a blank screen that iI cant be bothered to troubleshoot. I have steams repo enabled and it iinstalls fine with dnf but I can't figure out how to get it to actually open. Opening with the command line doesn't give me any errors to work with either sadly. Also as I stated in an earlier post I use fedora and am much more experienced with Linux then any other OS. I'm also on the latest kernel released (4.0.6 I think? I'll have to double check) and I still get issues with pulseaudio.
With all that being said I'm not trying to bash Linux and say windows is better,(like i said i use fedora myself and have been using other various distros for the past several years)my point was that you should use whatever works best for you and won't get in your way.

All runing linux
Jhdoubleoseven said:
Just curious to see exactly how many people actually use Linux or OSX a.k.a the only OSes you can build Android on which IMO all Android devs should be using
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
2 laptop, raspberrypi, game pc, media pc, kib pc, all running flavor of Linux.:good:

Windows ME.
Posted using my phone.

Niropa said:
Lol nice assumptions but no. I can assure you I'm not disconnecting it before its finished transferring, my only guess is it has something to do with libmtp and the way it handles file transfers which must be different then other operating systems. I use the open source amd drivers which give me screen tearing. I noticed proprietary drivers fixed it but then when I reboot its just a blank screen that iI cant be bothered to troubleshoot. I have steams repo enabled and it iinstalls fine with dnf but I can't figure out how to get it to actually open. Opening with the command line doesn't give me any errors to work with either sadly. Also as I stated in an earlier post I use fedora and am much more experienced with Linux then any other OS. I'm also on the latest kernel released (4.0.6 I think? I'll have to double check) and I still get issues with pulseaudio.
With all that being said I'm not trying to bash Linux and say windows is better,(like i said i use fedora myself and have been using other various distros for the past several years)my point was that you should use whatever works best for you and won't get in your way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I definitely see your point. I guess it really depends on what you hardware you use Linux on; I run Arch on my old HP G71 from 2011 with an Intel Core 2 Duo and everything runs amazingly. The only issues I've ever had is pulseaudio (which magically fixed itself after some time) and a few crashes due to me using a custom kernel (linux-ck). In fact, the only problems I've ever had are completely due to a mistake on my part.
With the Microsoft it was mild sarcasm with a big point: pretty much everything in Windows is closed source. Pretty much everything in Linux is open source (depending on what distro you use, of course). I'm not afraid of proprietary; I run Plex Media Server and Google Chrome. But I made that choice to run those programs. Just like I made the choice of what window manager to run; how to log in to my system (I go through startx now); how to play music (mpd); how to interface with my network. All of these were choices I made in building my system from the ground up -- even with distros like Ubunutu you can still replace basically whatever you want. That's what I meant when I said that Windows takes away your freedom.

Mint 17 on C720 i3 Chromebook here!

Jhdoubleoseven said:
Because:
1) Android is a Linux system so if you wanna develop it it's best to know Linux up close and personal
2) Building Android things (like ROMs) on Linux is much more straightforward
3) Linux systems are much more secure and generally more stable (not related to Android, just in general)
4) Microsoft is a corporate evil that restricts the freedom of its users and encourages the use of proprietary software
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) Tools to build apps for Android are cross-platformed. Using Eclipse IDE under Windows i compile every my app and don't see any restrictions making me want to migrate to Linux.
2) VirtualBox + Ubuntu solve this problem completely.
3) Not more secure and definitely not more stable. You can setup Linux to be less secure and setup Windows to be more secure. And if you compare how many side (i mean apps not included in distro) apps you use in Windows and in Linux, you will find the answer about security. Even light usage of Linux (mostly for kernel compilation and some AOSP code) produces different services/apps crash. So, if i would use Linux as i'm using Windows, there will be even more crashes.
What i really hate in Linux is how much time it requires to be prepared for some non-generic environment. If somehow happen distro doesn't provide required package (even from dedicated support server), or more worse if package version is different from required, then be prepared for "sex" with Linux. You can spend a lot of time to compile and most likely to fix incompatibilities in source code. Sometimes such preparation takes several days. And then when you are prepared, you can compile that code in 5 minutes. Nope.. Such productivity isn't for me. In most cases i even don't expect compilation because i simply want to use some utility. And then i find that pre-compiled version doesn't work. Because there is very low compatibility between different versions of Linux. Even binary compiled for Linux release couple years ago may not work in more modern Linux (unless it statically linked, but even in this case there is no warranty). And if it doesn't work, see my description about preparation to compile it
Btw, both VirtualBox and VMWare require special drivers for guest Linux to properly support folder sharing and VM window handling. And these drivers have to be recompiled with every minor kernel version update. This is IMHO very lame for Linux. Even after some kernel update (through standard distro package manager, so it's very minor update) VMWare stop to compile its drivers. So i have to find why and then patch the source code. And i often ask myself "Why i have to do this crap again and again?"
In Windows, i can take binary compiled for Windows XP, and use it in Windows 10. Interoperability of binaries between versions of Linux is a big red sign for me.
I was trying to migrate to Linux several times already in the past 10 years. And every time i find my self spending most of time for side tasks than my main projects.
Another thing i don't like in Linux is GUI. Not the design. It's OK for me to adapt to new interface. KDE or XFCE are fine. What i don't like in Linux GUI is how it works. Sometimes it lives its own life. Some windows appear when i don't expect, or i forgot about it already. It looks like GUI threads are running not in sync (or in very weak sync) with main code. I prefer MS Windows behavior when app tries to open the window, i cannot do anything. So, i know, something will happen soon. On Linux it's always a guess game "will some new window appear or app simply ignores my input."
4) From other side, you can see standardization of APIs and stable for many years SDK in Windows. As a software developer i care about it very much. There is no restriction for Open Source projects.
Absence (or nearly absence) binary compatibility between Linux versions, very flexible and often changing APIs can be considered as an additional security mechanism, but I'm against such methods.
---------- Post added at 06:01 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:36 AM ----------
P.S: About "Android is a Linux": it's completely wrong.
Android is an OS with high level of abstraction when it comes to devices.
To make this abstraction, Linux kernel is used. Nothing to do with Desktop Linux here.
Generally speaking, any kernel could be used to make this abstraction. It could be OpenBSD and even Windows kernel. Android wouldn't be different. Google choose Linux kernel to be free from other software developers - that's the only reason.

sorg said:
1) Tools to build apps for Android are cross-platformed. Using Eclipse IDE under Windows i compile every my app and don't see any restrictions making me want to migrate to Linux.
2) VirtualBox + Ubuntu solve this problem completely.
3) Not more secure and definitely not more stable. You can setup Linux to be less secure and setup Windows to be more secure. And if you compare how many side (i mean apps not included in distro) apps you use in Windows and in Linux, you will find the answer about security. Even light usage of Linux (mostly for kernel compilation and some AOSP code) produces different services/apps crash. So, if i would use Linux as i'm using Windows, there will be even more crashes.
What i really hate in Linux is how much time it requires to be prepared for some non-generic environment. If somehow happen distro doesn't provide required package (even from dedicated support server), or more worse if package version is different from required, then be prepared for "sex" with Linux. You can spend a lot of time to compile and most likely to fix incompatibilities in source code. Sometimes such preparation takes several days. And then when you are prepared, you can compile that code in 5 minutes. Nope.. Such productivity isn't for me. In most cases i even don't expect compilation because i simply want to use some utility. And then i find that pre-compiled version doesn't work. Because there is very low compatibility between different versions of Linux. Even binary compiled for Linux release couple years ago may not work in more modern Linux (unless it statically linked, but even in this case there is no warranty). And if it doesn't work, see my description about preparation to compile it
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Actually, every distro is binary compatible -- binaries are based on the processor, so every Linux x86-64 computer can run any binaries on my Arch Linux system. You're either referring to package compatibility, as different distros use different package managers, or just that you don't have all the dependencies (such as the libraries required to run).
Secondly, I'm surprised to hear how many crashes and issues you have with Linux... I easily get an uptime of 30 days+ without a single issue and then choose -- not get forced -- to reboot because my kernel is out of date. I've heard Ubuntu has given people issues but I use Arch which required me to know my hardware to install exactly what I need -- nothing more. Arch, being rolling release and up-to-date, is amazingly stable and also ensures you are in the driver's seat.
Thirdly, while you're right that you can have a secure Windows, the problem is how freely Windows gives out root permissions -- it's just asking for malware. Especially if you make youeself an admin, have fun running as root 24/7. Any *nix OS has an incredibly strong user system -- my system itself has over 20 users on it even though I am the only human who uses it. The other 19 users run programs and keep privileges separate. That and Linux is open source, so instead of like 1000 people looking through the source code you have over 10,000 eyes that may see any vulnerabilities. Windows "security through obscurity" is absolute crap; I will gladly use Windows once they go open source and I can get rid of that bloated UI and use something I have full control of.
Like you said, it really depends on a lot of things... however, as a power user I could never go back to Windows. I need freedom and transparency; Windows offers neither. Definitely don't think less of people who use Windows; some people want things to just work and don't care about anything else. I like things to work exactly like I want them to work and to be in control of what goes on with my computer. It's really just preference; my system is constantly changing and I configured everything myself. It's hard to describe, but when your OS becomes a project -- your project -- that you put time and effort in to get working like you want it's a really gratifying feeling

Jhdoubleoseven said:
or just that you don't have all the dependencies (such as the libraries required to run).
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Exactly. Sorry for wrong wording.

Question Linux OS for a new user

Hello users,
This question may be offtopic here, but i need your kind suggestions. I am now going to reinstall an operating system in my computer.
I had Windows 10 earlier. Now I am thinking to use Linux. I have not used it before so I have a few doubts.
Will it be difficult to use and understand Linux?
Will Linux be faster than Winodows 10?
Thanks

Xubuntu is pretty fast, faster than windows on idle. About the same on heavy load

bkdroid13 said:
Will it be difficult to use and understand Linux?
Will Linux be faster than Windows 10?
Thanks
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Click to collapse
1) It will be different to use, difficulty depends on how easily you pick up new user interface paradigms. There is no standardized UI among distributions, so you should pick one the you think you'll enjoy. Since you'd be new to Linux, I would suggest Xubuntu, or Ubuntu-Mate, as both have familiar-enough interfaces for Windows users who have never run a Linux system before. Beware, you WILL need to relearn ideas if you're looking to use the CLI for any reason, DOS commands ARE NOT in the Linux shells, and there are several other conventions that are different. That said, you can easily get away with not using the CLI at all if you're looking for just using GUI applications.
2) This is subjective and depends on your workload. For instance, I installed Borderlands2 from Steam on both Windows and Ubuntu and noticed the game ran significantly better on Ubuntu than Windows, however other programs may not and YMMV. Honestly, it depends on what UI you pick, what you do with the system, and your system specs.

Linux OS for a new use
ShadowEO said:
1) It will be different to use, difficulty depends on how easily you pick up new user interface paradigms. There is no standardized UI among distributions, so you should pick one the you think you'll enjoy. Since you'd be new to Linux, I would suggest Xubuntu, or Ubuntu-Mate, as both have familiar-enough interfaces for Windows users who have never run a Linux system before. Beware, you WILL need to relearn ideas if you're looking to use the CLI for any reason, DOS commands ARE NOT in the Linux shells, and there are several other conventions that are different. That said, you can easily get away with not using the CLI at all if you're looking for just using GUI applications.
2) This is subjective and depends on your workload. For instance, I installed Borderlands2 from Steam on both Windows and Ubuntu and noticed the game ran significantly better on Ubuntu than Windows, however other programs may not and YMMV. Honestly, it depends on what UI you pick, what you do with the system, and your system specs.
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Thank you so much for your reply. I understand my point. Great

MINT and UBUNTU are good for new users. But If you have never had contact at the beginning will be a small haos but after a while it becomes great. The only drawback is the drivers sometimes with this problem. I use BackTrack and somehow it will stay longer. Has very useful tools )

I had forgotten to mention that if software packaging feels complex, you may wish to look into both Flatpak and AppImage, as both are alternative software packages that operate similarly to Windows executables (I guess a better parallel would be Apple's .app folder format).

Yes, Linux is faster
I will recommend you install Linux Mint or Ubuntu. Both are beginner friendly

In the world we're living in today, more and more alternatives to mainstream services should be used. Self-preservation should be a motto. Go with Ubuntu.

Good morning,
I am looking for a cheap laptop to start testing Linux, have any recommendations

bkdroid13 said:
Will it be difficult to use and understand Linux?
Will Linux be faster than Winodows 10?
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Click to collapse
linux is faster than windows, uses more CPU and less RAM. Linux mint is the easiest to start with. You can even run windows programs with wine software if you don't find any linux alternative. but not all hardware manufactures support linux so you might either miss some features or the connected device might not work at all.

I recomed using Linux Mint or Ubuntu if you never used linux before

Kali Linux in Kali undercover mode. It looks exactly like Windows 10 and it's Debian based so Ubuntu commands and resources will work

I was in a similar situation about a year ago. I had played around with all sorts of Linux distros in virtual machines just to get a taste of each one. Some looked more like Windows but didn't act the same. Some looked completely foreign to me but behaved well. I kept coming back to Linux Mint. It's Ubuntu-based, contains more applications you need than Windows comes with, the apt package management system is my choice because it seems to make the most sense, it has great hardware support, and it is actively maintained. I have older hardware so I chose the Mate desktop environment. It runs great on my old hardware, and doesn't get the fan kicking up the way Windows does.
It's different than Windows, so you'll be Googling how to do this and that until you get the hang of it, but it's not that hard and it gets easier all the time. You won't regret learning how a new OS works!

Database Users

welcome