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I'm trying to buy an Android phone that would support AT&T's 3G in North America, but for some reason they all only support T-Mobile's 3G frequencies. What's up?
So pretty much every smartphone nowadays is quad-band, GSM 850/900/1800/1900, and works pretty much anywhere in the world.
Why don't phones also support international 3G frequencies: 850/1900 as well as 900, 1700 and 2100 Mhz?
That should be a rule in all modern devices
100% all communication in all the world!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quad-band#3G
if you look at the population in the various places
and add the extra cost it seems to currently offer
feature you request it would most likely
not be worth it for htc and other manufacturers
but maybe in time as first we had dualband phones then triband and now quadband 2g
of cause with 4g starting to take off some places maybe it will be absolute before
universal 3g chips get cheap enough
How do the current business travelers manage?
orb3000 said:
That should be a rule in all modern devices
100% all communication in all the world!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The area lot of business people who travel all over the world. How do they manage data access? Do they carry more than one phone all the time?
but as I state the only large user groups of 850 3g is in america
like CDMA is also only supported there
it all comes down to if the inc in cost is enough to justify the inc in
revenue
business people from the rest of the world don't have those issues
people here have also been requesting htc phones which does both cmda and gsm
it' all about GREED!
do you know how many channels your radio or TV receives?
those HTC fools just discriminate against USA users! (my opinion)
Q
I would really like to know how much "more" its going to cost to make a quadband, and 5 band UMTS phone. . . . .
think only qualcomm can answer that question
Rudegar said:
think only qualcomm can answer that question
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it doesnt matter how much! i'm sure qualcomm 1G snapdragon cpu is more expensive than 528mzh cpu, that doesnt stop toshiba or Acer from using it!
it' all about GREED!
htc wants to make it with the cheapst parts, and sell it at the highest price possible! (my opinion)
well yes
even if greed is a negative word for the general capitalism which drive all these company's
it's not like htc are the only ones on that ship :S
Quad band UMTS are rare indeed. Blackberry and Apple have them. Nokia has a quint band unit coming out in about 3 weeks, N8-00 (I have one on pre-order).
The Galaxy S Captivate is a tri band unit that will work in most of the world. It is missing the 900 MHz band. I can't recommend it because GPS is broken while awaiting a software patch and AT&T refuses to unlock the sim for 10 months. There is no known way to unlock the phone at the present time.
netnerd said:
it doesnt matter how much! i'm sure qualcomm 1G snapdragon cpu is more expensive than 528mzh cpu, that doesnt stop toshiba or Acer from using it!
it' all about GREED!
htc wants to make it with the cheapst parts, and sell it at the highest price possible! (my opinion)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't be so hard on the manufacturers (please, note that HTC isn't the only phone manufacturer in the world...) AT&T only just started selling Android phones. Why would Android phone manufacturers make a phone that supports AT&T bands if AT&T won't support them in return? With the delays in so many phone shipments, I'm sure the companies don't need that much more business than they already have. Now that AT&T has decided to play ball, however, I'm sure there'll be a reciprocal increase in the number of Android phones with AT&T 3G bands
ua549 said:
Quad band UMTS are rare indeed. Blackberry and Apple have them. Nokia has a quint band unit coming out in about 3 weeks, N8-00 (I have one on pre-order).
The Galaxy S Captivate is a tri band unit that will work in most of the world. It is missing the 900 MHz band. I can't recommend it because GPS is broken while awaiting a software patch and AT&T refuses to unlock the sim for 10 months. There is no known way to unlock the phone at the present time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can buy an unlock code for like $25 .
Hello see all the nice wonderful phones around the world and her in the US we are more or less locked out to a few by the fu.... Provider supplied models month later.
Locked around and saw there are 98% HTC Magic and Hero with UMTS 900/2100 mhz. Also a few with a UMTS 850/1900 for the ATT slaves. It is for me not realistic that HTS build a whole new model for each little US player.
I'm sure there is a quadband UMTS but do to FCC regulation and business restriction for the US market HTC jsut block those frequency.
This would be a more or less usefull patch to make those MOdels from the rest of the world also useable in the USA/Canada.
IS there someone who can confirm that HTC built just for this few US guys a total different hardware or my theories with the blocked Feature deep in the hardware.
Thanks
They dont have to build an entire phone to operate in diferent bands...so i guess its hardware related(just the modem i think) with proper software(radio protocol) to go with it.
If it was just software related or some kind of block in the hardware it would already been bypassed by someone in here...my guess.
Hi guys, I don't know if this is a basic question but I have to ask it since I haven't find an answer yet...
Can I modify the HSDPA/UMTS band via ROM or SPL update?
I bougth a HTC T-mobile myTouch (1700/2100 MHz bands, UMTS/HSDPA) but later I realized that here in CHILE my provider uses the 850/1900 band for 3g .
So, can I do somethig to make it work here or is it a matter of hardware?
Thanks
birutilla said:
Hi guys, I don't know if this is a basic question but I have to ask it since I haven't find an answer yet...
Can I modify the HSDPA/UMTS band via ROM or SPL update?
I bougth a HTC T-mobile myTouch (1700/2100 MHz bands, UMTS/HSDPA) but later I realized that here in CHILE my provider uses the 850/1900 band for 3g .
So, can I do somethig to make it work here or is it a matter of hardware?
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No you cant change ur radio bands with software, its a hardware issue and im afraid your stuck with what you got, even flashing a new radio wont change things . . . sorry
it's too different versions of the qualcomm cpu's which makes the band difference
it's hardcoded inside the cpu
You should have bought the Canadian/Rogers version of the phone.
Fvcking HTC builds 3 versions of the phone (mytouch, rest of world, Canada) and people like you and me get fvcked. We have to pay an extra $150 to get the canadian version.
Let it be a lesson: do NOT buy HTC! Acer, Dell, Apple ... they all build phones that work everywhere. NOT HTC.
Rudegar said:
it's too different versions of the qualcomm cpu's which makes the band difference
it's hardcoded inside the cpu
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually the CPU (Qualcomm MSM7201a) is capable of supporting five different UMTS frequency bands, however only three at once. Those bands again are indeed preset by the built-in RF chips, so there is no chance of changing frequencies.
Here's the datasheet of the MSM7200 (identical to the MSM7201a in terms of RF support) with an overview of possible RF chip configurations at the bottom of page 3: http://www.ent.eet-china.com/PDF/2007FEB/DTCOL_2007FEB15_AVDE_RFR_AN_01.pdf
inquisitor said:
Actually the CPU (Qualcomm MSM7201a) is capable of supporting five different UMTS frequency bands, however only three at once. Those bands again are indeed preset by the built-in RF chips, so there is no chance of changing frequencies.
Here's the datasheet of the MSM7200 (identical to the MSM7201a in terms of RF support) with an overview of possible RF chip configurations at the bottom of page 3: http://www.ent.eet-china.com/PDF/2007FEB/DTCOL_2007FEB15_AVDE_RFR_AN_01.pdf
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Whether a specific band is supported or not in a particular RF topology also depends on the type of RF amplifiers coupled with the baseband IC. Traditionally HTC has been using universal amplifiers for 2G/2.5G hence all recent phones support GSM/GPRS/EDGE on any frequencies. Due to Qualcomm vs. Broadcomm patent lawsuits, they had to stop using universal amplifiers for 3G around 2006, hence most modern phones only support WCDMA/UMTS frequencies that they have individual amplifiers for.
I think it's not HTC specific, any vendors using Qualcomm MSM basebands are doing this as well. So the bottomline is - in most cases it's a hardware issue. In some rare cases (when universal or multi-frequency WCDMA amplifier is installed) frequencies are disabled in software. I can't recall any HTC device that would have this kind of software only limitation.
Wow Very informational posts
Thanks Guys!!!
Hey I'm an old (ancient pre-Intel <BG>) micro hacker
but fairly new to phones. I'm currently very happy with
my cooked AT&T Pure/TopAz with the Tess Leo 1 Rom
I've had most every model of HP IpAQ upto the 4700s
So the PPC side is pretty comfortable for me.
I'm an old programmer with EE background
But really ready to try and get my teeth into the radio side
of phones just trying to understand enough to make some
resonable qualitative and quantitative benchmarks on some these radios
Maybe more to the point is understand if so and so's great looking nice
new task bar should and is properly displaying "3G" or "H" or ?)
But its been hard sorting the Euro vs US and GSM vs CMRS
Phone info.
Can anyone suggest a good "newbie guide" ? or any source of info
(I kinda hate the term "for dummies" but.... )
to the radio end, signal strength, band, networks etc ?
Sorry if this has been asked a million times or its only "two posts" away
but the amount of info here is great! but the s/n is NOT so great <BG>
Thanks Alot
Kenn Lynch
Hey is there a spell checker in this xda forum?
my apologies
I love my phone
if you are on a pc most internet browsers these days got their own spellchecker
Spell check thanks
You know its amazing what some people consider "most" Web Browsers
I was thinking "largest" web browser (Internet Explorer 8.XX on XP)
Spell checking is not natively included, so all my checking has been with
local docs or remotely using the web pages own checker for web based mail and forums.
So I started thinking no wonder this guys name starts with "Rude"
But I looked around and there is a free plug-in for IE called ieSpell.
I seldom bother with the other browsers so I can't say if
spell checking is included right "out of the box" in them either.
but I just installed ieSpell here and it hyphenated "plug-in" nice and easy
Thanks
when you are right you are right
Guess you can teach and old dog <BG>
KJL
Ok. Im a little new for all the different terms with a cell phone radio and all that. But theres something that i just cant seem to get a grip on. The US HD2 supports only the 1700/2100mhz for UMTS. Which means all of us ATT users cant have the use of 3g and i believe it hinders the use of the HD2 here on ATT. Theres a few things I cant seem to understand and some things I need technical expertise on:
Ive been reading about the hd2 and i found that the cellular modem is built inside the snapdragon processor. (found that from qualcomm and on pdadb.net)
If the processor is the same for both models why cant it accept the umts850 and 1900 mhz bands?
Answer to that: Im told its hard-coded on the 3g chips and cant be changed.
Question to that answer: Why is there a ROM update for the Dopod HD2 that in fact ADDS support for the UMTS900 MHZ band? If its hard-coded on the chip then why is there a software update for it? Can that update be somehow modified to add umts 850/1900/etc band support. its just some of the specs and things ive found online (mostly here at XDA) just dont seem to add up.
My overall summary:
Processors are both the QSD8250 which supports ALL GSM types (by that i dont mean all freq. bands.) So the cellular modem inside the phones are the same.
Different basebands on the different models when its "hard-coded" on the phones themselves.
Why a software update adding support for another baseband freq?
Someone please elighten me. I just think that theres more to this whole baseband thing than we know since we seem to believe one thing, but theres other official work that disproves those claims.
I use:
TMO HD2 (HardSPL'd and unlocked to AT&T)
WM ROM: Omega XT V14
Android ROM: Mdeejay's Froyo Sense 3.1
Radio: 50.4 version.
The reason the Dopod HD2 got that software update is because that band was always there, but WinMo couldn't utilize it. What you have read about the processor being locked to band X/X is completely correct. The T-Mobile US HD2 will only ever support 1700/2100 because thats what revision of Snapdragon it's using. The Dopod model is using a different revision and always had support for the 900 band. The only way the US HD2 will ever get 3G on ATT is if ATT switches to the 1700 band, or if the processor is upgraded. If you really wan't 3G that bad, I would look into getting an international HD2 as some of them do indeed support ATT 3G.
Ok but if all 3 (us,Telstra,and dopod) use the qsd8250b then wouldnt they all be able to add support for other frequencies that the 3g chip can use or is it that there's different antenna types for different regions or somethin?
Sent from my HTC HD2
What I mean is that, when they are makeing the processors for each board revision, IE the US and EU boards, they enable or disable the frequencies at a hardware level. You can't just flip a switch and have that feature turned on, its not that simple. The processor type is the QSD8205B, but there are many different internal revisions. The antenna's for GSM networks are more or less the same, no matter what the frequency.
ahh see thats what i was thinking... (darn it got my hopes up for nothin) I do wanna get the international but i dont have 500+ to spend and i doubt i can trade in this hd2 for the telstra one, but boy would it be nice (we have a 3g microcell and id like to be inside my house to be able to make a call, even though inside i have 2 bars sometimes and it wont call at all)
Dang it ATT. You and your messed up networks.....
Mourer09 said:
i doubt i can trade in this hd2 for the telstra one, but boy would it be nice (we have a 3g microcell and id like to be inside my house to be able to make a call, even though inside i have 2 bars sometimes and it wont call at all)
Dang it ATT. You and your messed up networks.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You would be surprised. People might trade due to the fact that the US version has double the internal memory..
Well if anyone would trade please pm me I could throw in like 50-100 cash if you have something worth it please.
crisisinthecity said:
You would be surprised. People might trade due to the fact that the US version has double the internal memory..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you know how much this slows down the speed / performance of the T-Mo HD2?
I got an HD2 specifically to move away from the lag so many winmo devices have and never looked back since. I'm on ATT and it would definately be nice to have 3G.
okay so i reacently read on engadget that att bought qualcomms 700mhz band or soemthign like that. would that mean we get 3g or soemthing liek that?
Most likely 4g. (Why would they want a second 3g network) And if thats the case, there is NO hd2 anywhere which can handle 700mhz,
FIT4C said:
Do you know how much this slows down the speed / performance of the T-Mo HD2?
I got an HD2 specifically to move away from the lag so many winmo devices have and never looked back since. I'm on ATT and it would definately be nice to have 3G.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Buy yourself a HTC HD2 T8585, this is supported on ATT 3G network.
I got 1690 down / 2201 up
with my TMO HD2 on ATT
I got 70 up / 226 down
YMMV
qqdawg said:
Buy yourself a HTC HD2 T8585, this is supported on ATT 3G network.
I got 1690 down / 2201 up
with my TMO HD2 on ATT
I got 70 up / 226 down
YMMV
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would love to get my hands on a T8585, however don't have the $500+ extra available funds for one. Sometime this year I will track one down. It's a great backup phone to my Dell Streak, especially since now we can boot to Android directly.
qqdawg said:
Buy yourself a HTC HD2 T8585, this is supported on ATT 3G network.
I got 1690 down / 2201 up
with my TMO HD2 on ATT
I got 70 up / 226 down
YMMV
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The T8585 is the model that TmoUS sells. It definitely does NOT support 3g on AT&T!
hitekredneck said:
The T8585 is the model that TmoUS sells. It definitely does NOT support 3g on AT&T!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it is not, the T8585 is the Euro version of the HD2 (512 LEO)
From SamSamuel on XDA
T9193 is the telstra and uses
GSM 850/900/1800/1900, WCDMA 850/2100MHz
T8585 is the regular HD2 and uses
GSM 850/900/1800/1900, UMTS 900/2100MHz
Not sure what the model number of the tmous is (PB81120 is the model ID) and it works on
GSM850/900/1800/1900, UMTS: Band I (2100);UMTS: Band IV (AWS);UMTS: Band IV (1700/2100)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
European/Asian/TmoUS HD2 (aka T8585) = NO workie on AT&T 3G
Telstra HD2 (aka T9193) = YES workie on AT&T 3G
There, hopefully that's better for the everyone who are still confuse of which is which.
lude219 said:
European/Asian/TmoUS HD2 (aka T8585) = NO workie on AT&T 3G
Telstra HD2 (aka T9193) = YES workie on AT&T 3G
There, hopefully that's better for the everyone who are still confuse of which is which.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and T 9193 is for Australia with 512rom
coldest~~~ said:
and T 9193 is for Australia with 512rom
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only the TmoUS HD2 has 1024 ROM. The rest has 512, yes.
I have a hd2 tmobile usa version, i need a At&t friendly Nand rom. Whats the best rom out there for At&t????
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App
as far as I know any NAND Android ROM should work on AT&T as it is not the ROM that controls this but a combination of you sim card, APN settings, and you having your HD2 sim unlocked. Wait for more replies though as I do not use AT&T and it might actually be a ROM out there that has certain things adjusted for AT&T, but what that might be I do not know.
This is true, the ROM does not control the radio. There are methods of flashing the radio to a different version, one that may work for the AT&T 3G bands. I am looking them up, but that is how you would flash the device to change the radio.
Hardware wise, the GSM module does support all world wide bands but what makes then different from one HD2 from one carrier ot another is the firmware version that is used in the phones that make them work on the network's bands. Correct me if i am wrong though.
TKETZ196 said:
This is true, the ROM does not control the radio. There are methods of flashing the radio to a different version, one that may work for the AT&T 3G bands. I am looking them up, but that is how you would flash the device to change the radio.
Hardware wise, the GSM module does support all world wide bands but what makes then different from one HD2 from one carrier ot another is the firmware version that is used in the phones that make them work on the network's bands. Correct me if i am wrong though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Untrue my friend, the T-Mobile HD2 only supports the bands used by T-Mobile for 3G. If you sim unlock the T-Mobile HD2 you can use the device with other carriers but you will only get Edge for a data signal as the hardware only supports the T-Mobile 3G bands. There is a model of the HD2 that supports a different 3G band the same ones AT&T uses in the US, it is the Australian model that Telstra a Australian cell carrier released as they use the same bands as AT&T. go to "Official HD2 T9193 (Telstra 850Mhz) Discussion Thread" and you can learn more about it. I also saw your other post in another thread about trying to help your friend out getting 3G on his HD2 using AT&T. Unless he is willing to buy a Telstra HTC HD2 T9193 or have his T-Mobile HTC HD2 T8585 worked on to switch out the hardware for the hardware in the T9193 then he will never getb 3G with AT&T.
Just to answer your question, every rom is an AT&T friendly ROM, meaning, they'll allow you to talk, text and surf the internet.
What you DONT have is AT&T 3G on your tmous HD2. You'll be stuck with EDGE speed.
Thank you all 4 your help,greatly apreciated!! I'm in puerto rico where tmobile is still on Edge. But for some reason tmobile is still alot faster when it comes to receiving & sending MMS than At&t on this phone. Currently using Coredroid 1.5
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App
its interesting they would use different hardware GSM modules for the slightly different models. I would think the radio firmware version woudl take care of that. Thanks for clarification. I assumed that all GSM modules would be built the same way.
Sadly they are not, this in my opinion is just cellular carriers trying to keep you locked to their networks cause the know most people don"t want to have to buy another device when changing carriers if they already have a good device. So they make it were branded devices can only utilize high speed data with it's intended carriers network. I think this is unfair to consumers, but again just my opinion.
T-Macgnolia said:
Sadly they are not, this in my opinion is just cellular carriers trying to keep you locked to their networks cause the know most people don"t want to have to buy another device when changing carriers if they already have a good device. So they make it were branded devices can only utilize high speed data with it's intended carriers network. I think this is unfair to consumers, but again just my opinion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think there is technical reason. The various carriers have very different technologies. Even AT&T uses a different 3G network than T-Mobile, despite the fact that both are GSM. Sprint and Verizon use non GSM technologies that are even more different. When a device manufacturer makes a certain model, there is only so much room inside, and unless one wants a really thick and heavy device, a choice has to be made as to which hardware goes into the phone.
I'm not saying that they don't want you to stay on their network - they do, which is why they have those 2 year contracts in exchange for buying a discounted phone. But I don't think that is why the hardware is different.
stevedebi said:
I think there is technical reason. The various carriers have very different technologies. Even AT&T uses a different 3G network than T-Mobile, despite the fact that both are GSM. Sprint and Verizon use non GSM technologies that are even more different. When a device manufacturer makes a certain model, there is only so much room inside, and unless one wants a really thick and heavy device, a choice has to be made as to which hardware goes into the phone.
I'm not saying that they don't want you to stay on their network - they do, which is why they have those 2 year contracts in exchange for buying a discounted phone. But I don't think that is why the hardware is different.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Point taken
I would go further with the discussion but I do not want to hijack this thread.