Related
I've written up a full review of the GPS:
http://briefmobile.com/samsung-epic-4g-gps-test
YouTube Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7PBst2OBCw&feature=player_embedded
I tested the GPS with Google Navigation, Maps, and My Tracks applications.
Observations overall:
- Accuracy was slightly off (as shown by My Tracks... worked perfectly in Google Navigation)
- Worked reliably over hours of navigating to and from destinations --- NEVER lost my car
- Compass seems off in My Tracks, shows correctly in Google Navigation
Check out my article for more details. Overall... thumbs up. GPS works well. Always worked with navigation perfectly.
Glad to see it works but still concerned about the lack of accuracy. The Evo my wife has seems to have a much more accurate lock than what was shown in the video.
kennethpenn said:
I've written up a full review of the GPS:
http://briefmobile.com/samsung-epic-4g-gps-test
YouTube Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7PBst2OBCw&feature=player_embedded
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) Thanks for this test. So far I see no results that would appear to be a hard stop. But in the other thread, you mentioned that your Epic GPS accuracy was not as good as your G1. So I am still concerned. I think performance on this new, expensive, high-end Android should be at least as good as the performance of the oldest Android model.
Also, driving is the least demanding test of the low-level GPS, and there are many applications for it besides vehicular navigation. On other Galaxy S platforms, the GPS tracks seem to get smoothed or interpolated, which in driving tests seems okay most of the time because the motion of the vehicle ovewhelms the underlying errrors in the smoothing algorithm. The result is that the GPS seems great while moving pretty straight, but can veer off-course on turns, corners and stops. You did mention similar symptoms. (And then navigation programs mask errors further by snap-to behavior layered onto the smoothed GPS output.)
I know it must seem that I am never satisfied, but I am always interested in more rigorous testing. Often a better My Tracks test is over a walking course, preferably along with a benchmark device such as the G1. And the whole track -- not just isolated snapshots -- then can be shared with us via upload to Google.
For example, look at my own tests of the Vibrant vs G1 here.
(If you are worried about your own privacy, just test in some location other than your home. I went to an apartment complex in my neighborhood.)
2) Another set of GPS-bug symptoms reported on other Galaxy S platforms is the failure to use and lock on to enough satellites. That is best seen not through tracking or navigation apps, but by utilities that read and report the detailed performance of the GPS from the Android system. The two most popular utilities for this testing are GPS Test and GPS Status. Among other things, they will tell you how many satellites the GPS thinks it sees, their signal strength as SNR, and how many are actually being used for a fix. Could you try those utilites and report the results?
3) You haven't told us exactly how your test unit came into your hands. But we do know from other intelligence that at least some pre-sales demo units were selectively shipped before the latest Samsung software was installed. So it is useful to know the build date of your unit, as shown by internal file date stamps. (Perhaps this can clear up some confusion about other reported tests.)
4) From the latest build dumps we have seen, it appears that the Epic -- uniquely among Samsung S variants -- has a system utility called GpsSetup. Can you see any evidence that this utility is installed on your unit? If so, what does it do? Are there configurable settings? If so, what are the default settings, and what settings are you using?
Thanks again for your work.
Regarding the compass ...
From the review:
My Tracks Observations:
... Compass pointer totally off. ...
Google Navigation Observations:
... Compass points the right way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think this simply means that the compass sensor -- and/or the low-level software that drives it -- remain bad on the tested Epic unit. In My Tracks, the compass is driven by the on-board magnetometer of the phone and is supposed to move when the phone's physical orientation changes. In Google Navigation, the compass is fixed relative to the maps streamed from the app's servers.
The FUBAR compass on Samsung S phones is sort of related to the GPS bugs, because some apps read both sensors. So users often perceive them as the same problem. But they are two separate issues.
Looks like it's the defective compass spoils the accuracy.
I know it's not going to prove much, but here is a video with another user saying the GPS is fine on the Epic:
http://androidandme.com/2010/08/news/sprint-epic-4g-qa-part-1/
6 minutes in.
It's also a good video worth watching if you'd just like to see the phone in action some more. I'll post this in the reviews thread as well I suppose.
hydralisk said:
I know it's not going to prove much, but here is a video with another user saying the GPS is fine on the Epic:
http://androidandme.com/2010/08/news/sprint-epic-4g-qa-part-1/
6 minutes in.
It's also a good video worth watching if you'd just like to see the phone in action some more. I'll post this in the reviews thread as well I suppose.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With the correct gps settings no sgs phone has issues standing still. You wont see anything wrong with the gps until you use it while driving. Everyone with a sgs phone should know this. If I had a sgs phone & a epic the first thing I would do would test the gps while driving and post a video. I think its weird how no one will do this. I am getting a epic first thing tues am and will post video of speed of the epic vs sgs phone with lag fix, gps test while driving & video\pic quality. Since these are the main things in question.
shep211 said:
With the correct gps settings no sgs phone has issues standing still. You wont see anything wrong with the gps until you use it while driving. Everyone with a sgs phone should know this. If I had a sgs phone & a epic the first thing I would do would test the gps while driving and post a video..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, in my experience the opposite tends to be true about SGS phones. Driving tests tend to obscure the accuracy problems. Standing still and walking tracks are tougher tests of accuracy. And videos are not as detailed as actual My Tracks output uploaded to Google, where we can all zoom in an explore ther results in detail on a map or satellite background. Some problems that can show up driving are the cases where the GPS track veers off-road on turns and stops.
I have seen plenty of driving "reviews" and "tests" of the GPS in other variants of the phone that erroneously report everything is fine (which is why I still take the OP's results with a grain of salt, no offense). My own testing with Vibrants showed relatively decent tracking while driving, but very poor accuracy when stopped or moving as a pedestrian.
EDIT: I finally found and watched the newly linked Youtube video here, and was totally unimpressed by this reviewer. He was cluelessly misinformed about the status of the GPS problems on other platforms, and his andecdotal report of using the GPS on the Epic through Google Navigate app proved nothing at all.
BTW, for a good summary of the GPS problems on Samsung Galaxy S phones generally, see this post at the international I9000 forum. These issues are much more complex than superficial reviews engage.
boomerbubba said:
Actually, in my experience the opposite tends to be true about SGS phones. Driving tests tend to obscure the accuracy problems. Standing still and walking tracks are tougher tests of accuracy. And videos are not as detailed as actual My Tracks output uploaded to Google, where we can all zoom in an explore ther results in detail on a map or satellite background. Some problems that can show up driving are the cases where the GPS track veers off-road on turns and stops.
I have seen plenty of driving "reviews" and "tests" of the GPS in other variants of the phone that erroneously report everything is fine (which is why I still take the OP's results with a grain of salt, no offense). My own testing with Vibrants showed relatively decent tracking while driving, but very poor accuracy when stopped or moving as a pedestrian.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand what you are saying. Going over 60 mph the gps performs better then when going slow and making turns or tracking a run. But standing still I have never had it not lock and work. The only videos of the epic are of standing still lock times.
shep211 said:
I understand what you are saying. Going over 60 mph the gps performs better then when going slow and making turns or tracking a run. But standing still I have never had it not lock and work. The only videos of the epic are of standing still lock times.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not talking about an apparent locking problem. I'm talking about the other symptom of the GPS bug: lack of accuracy.
There are many reports -- and I have experienced this myself on Vibrants -- where the satellite signal appears to lock. But the accuracy of the lat/lon coordinates being reported is all over the place. And they can be outside the theoretical range of accuracy being reported. For example, GPS Test or GPS Status --reading the ouptut of the Android listeners, which in turn are reading the onboard GPS chip -- may say the fix is supposed to bee accurate within 20 feet. But the coordinates are a couple hundred feet away from the actual location, and meandering over time.
boomerbubba said:
Actually, in my experience the opposite tends to be true about SGS phones. Driving tests tend to obscure the accuracy problems.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with this. Driving programs "snap" to streets obscuring lateral positioning inaccuracy.
boomerbubba said:
EDIT: I finally found and watched the newly linked Youtube video here, and was totally unimpressed by this reviewer. He was cluelessly misinformed about the status of the GPS problems on other platforms, and his andecdotal report of using the GPS on the Epic through Google Navigate app proved nothing at all.
BTW, for a good summary of the GPS problems on Samsung Galaxy S phones generally, see this post at the international I9000 forum. These issues are much more complex than superficial reviews engage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I absolutely agree. Where are the important tests????:
TTFF (time to first fix) from RTN (factory start) with several different devices, eg touch Pro 2, Evo, etc in same location.
TTFF from cold, warm and hot starts with competing models in same place. IE how well is assistance and cache working
Number of birds and SNR, ie how good is actual autonomous gps hardware "
HDOP, VDOP PDOP ""
I am seeing multiple poorly done youtubes that could easily be tower triangulation which under good conditions will get you >30' standing still but blow once you start moving. These guys are not just not reporting SNR, they are not even reporting number of sats and HDOP!
The ops tests (and thank you) are not too bad, but there is no data. For example he says: "Also, the GPS occasionally took more than 10 seconds to “lock on” with a cold start." That is the average for top smartphones for an actual cold start. a cold start is no current Ephemeris or almanac stored. starting up a data connection and pulling assistance data (almanac and ephemeris) of visible birds is a agps "cold start" and typically takes at least ten seconds (a few minutes in standalone gps)./
New '98 feet' bug on Epic GPS
Now that the Epic is out, we are starting to see the usual confusing mix of anecdotal impressions of GPS performance.
Over on another forum, one interesting fact is emerging: There seems to be a new bug, unique to the Epic's implementation of GPS: The imputed accuracy is being reported by several different testers in different scenarios, always at 98 feet! It is as if this number is hard-coded into the GPS firmware.
See Testing the GPS Satellite usage on your new Epic, the right way. Have "use wireless networks" off and Epic GPS - does yours work or not?
boomerbubba said:
Now that the Epic is out, we are starting to see the usual confusing mix of anecdotal impressions of GPS performance.
Over on another forum, one interesting fact is emerging: There seems to be a new bug, unique to the Epic's implementation of GPS: The imputed accuracy is being reported by several different testers in different scenarious, always at 98 feet! It is as if this number is hard-coded into the GPS firmware.
See Testing the GPS Satellite usage on your new Epic, the right way. Have "use wireless networks" off and Epic GPS - does yours work or not?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The gps has most of the same issues the others have but the epic doesn't lag when it does work.
Some gps videos I made while working Tuesday. Epic gps worked 1\3.
epic gps fail 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7HUQAKg6Lc
epic gps fail 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UV1Na51Dy5A
A 'known issue' with Epic GPS?
FYI, a user on another forum is reporting that Sprint tech support acknowledged a "known issue" with the GPS.
boomerbubba said:
FYI, a user on another forum is reporting that Sprint tech support acknowledged a "known issue" with the GPS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for the link. I have had the same issue where it wont lock and takes over 5 mins then when it does lock it takes 3-5 mins for it to get your correct location. It looks like the only thing they improved was agps but gps still needs the new driver coming out in September. I really hope Samsung fixes the gps issues.
boomerbubba said:
Now that the Epic is out, we are starting to see the usual confusing mix of anecdotal impressions of GPS performance.
Over on another forum, one interesting fact is emerging: There seems to be a new bug, unique to the Epic's implementation of GPS: The imputed accuracy is being reported by several different testers in different scenarios, always at 98 feet! It is as if this number is hard-coded into the GPS firmware.
See Testing the GPS Satellite usage on your new Epic, the right way. Have "use wireless networks" off and Epic GPS - does yours work or not?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I went into my local sprint store that had 2 epics on display with my wife. We were there to decide if they're worth almost $800(waiting for price drop). So I loaded gps status on both demo epics, accuracy 98ft, they also displayed 1-2 less sats than my g1 which had @20-60ft accuracy sitting on the counter 10" lower and directly between the epics. I know this is a static test and doesn't mean much, when I asked the sales people if I could drive around....just kidding.
I talked to a sprint district manager at work today and he confirmed the epics have a gps issue and button issue.. He said a fix is coming out for the gps issue, but the buttton issue is only on some first batch of epics and to take mine back..
kgold708 said:
I went into my local sprint store that had 2 epics on display with my wife. We were there to decide if they're worth almost $800(waiting for price drop). So I loaded gps status on both demo epics, accuracy 98ft, they also displayed 1-2 less sats than my g1 which had @20-60ft accuracy sitting on the counter 10" lower and directly between the epics. I know this is a static test and doesn't mean much, when I asked the sales people if I could drive around....just kidding.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yet another confrirmation of the new '98 feet' bug!
kgold708 said:
I went into my local sprint store that had 2 epics on display with my wife. We were there to decide if they're worth almost $800(waiting for price drop). So I loaded gps status on both demo epics, accuracy 98ft, they also displayed 1-2 less sats than my g1 which had @20-60ft accuracy sitting on the counter 10" lower and directly between the epics. I know this is a static test and doesn't mean much, when I asked the sales people if I could drive around....just kidding.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I got my captivate for $50 from amazon. Im sure the epic will drop to $50-100 with in 1 month on amazon. Its at $200 now with free activation.
http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Epic-..._1_4?ie=UTF8&s=wireless&qid=1283358779&sr=8-4
What I am finding is poor Signal to Noise, on average about 10db lower on average for the same birds than Touch Pro2 and Treo Pro are showing while keeping them all in the same spot. For example one satellite is showing me as very healthy 41 on Treo Pro (HTC made Palm), 39 on Touch Pro 2, and same bird is 27 on Epic. It also seems to jump to usage of some of the really bad snr birds.
I am also wondering about what is going on with trigger of almanac and ephemeris population over 3g. I am getting inconsistent results on that.
There is a third problem which is that with 4 >17 SNR birds in view, which should be adequate and give hdop of <2, position still seems to jump and be incorrect by an average of 30' to 60'
Can anyone tell me what your SNR values are? best would be compared to other known good gps smartphones in same location.
I bought my Galaxy S few weeks ago and I could barely use the GPS. It took way too long to get it working and still it was inaccurate.
Few days ago I flashed JM2 firmware and installed app called TrackerBooster (can be found in the Android Market). Now the GPS works perfectly, takes only few seconds to get it connected (outdoors). I have used it now like 15 times and max. time I had to wait was 20 seconds.
I'm not sure does TrackerBooster app need to be installed, might work well without it, haven't tested.
I hope this helps those who have problems with GPS but this is just my experience, I would wait for other comments before flashing new a firmware.
It's called new firmware flashing syndrom for GPS. Basically, if you flash to any new firmware, your GPS will work for a few days.
As Foxbat said, a full flash/reset cycle improves results on the pathetic, schizophrenic and overall random SGS GPS implementation. But I am not going to be a smart ass and insinuate you don't know what you're talking about.
Instead I'll just ignore all the previous "the GPS issue is fixed" claims by many users who prematurely yelled "fixed" and just cowardly quote one of my favourite authors..."Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan
Plus we shall also ignore the previous 308 users who have "cried Wolf"^-1. Please refer to your favorite fable author for proper reference.
Its occurred so many times, it actually has it's own syndrome!! FFS
Beowulf_pt said:
As Foxbat said, a full flash/reset cycle improves results on the pathetic, schizophrenic and overall random SGS GPS implementation. But I am not going to be a smart ass and insinuate you don't know what you're talking about.
Instead I'll just ignore all the previous "the GPS issue is fixed" claims by many users who prematurely yelled "fixed" and just cowardly quote one of my favourite authors..."Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan
Plus we shall also ignore the previous 308 users who have "cried Wolf"^-1. Please refer to your favorite fable author for proper reference.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So you still trolling the forums about your GPS problem even after you sold your Samsung if you ever had one from the beginning. I have never had serious problem as many others and if only 308 of millions have had a problem it must certainly be a really good GPS. Stop trolling you only because look like an ignorant user who really do not want to make the phone better but want to promote NOKIA.
For sure, milsjg. You can add me too as ignorant, 309th user who's GPS sucks d*ck hard.
I wish my GPS sucked d**k... that would at least make it useful! ) 310th user here noticing GPS issues... that said while I was on JM7, I managed to record a very very close to perfect track using mytracks... for the walking section of my test it went perfectly even showing where I retraced my steps to go to poo bins! But when I got on to driving it went a bit mental and I apparently drove through the fire station, the wrong way round roundabouts and demolished a few streets worth of houses, but occationally it did show me going down the right side of the road!
You forget that before he even got it, he was complaining that he was reluctant to buy the phone because of reports about lag and GPS (and then, proceeded to buy it anyway).
The main problem is that people have different quality of acceptance for GPS. Some people expect a signal which compares with a fitness GPS (accurate within 2 or 3 meters generally), and some of us don't care if it drifts off by 20m.
Any technology which doesn't have a definitive state will get various opinions...
andrewluecke said:
You forget that before he even got it, he was complaining that he was reluctant to buy the phone because of reports about lag and GPS (and then, proceeded to buy it anyway).
The main problem is that people have different quality of acceptance for GPS. Some people expect a signal which compares with a fitness GPS (accurate within 2 or 3 meters generally), and some of us don't care if it drifts off by 20m.
Any technology which doesn't have a definitive state will get various opinions...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But then when it comes to navigation (arguably the principal purpose of having GPS in these devices) things go totally haywire! ) Personally I wonder whether GPS was installed purely for marketing purposes, to allow app developers (and of course google!) to snoop as to where their users are and how they are using their devices. For that there's no need for close tracking! )
not sure why you would fault beowulf for buying, if as you indicate he had some concerns - the damn phone is drop dead gorgous. If any product could stimulate optimism or optimistic hope, even in a skeptic, this phone would. And that's what makes it so frustrating.
I'm going to hate sending it back (i negotiated an extended buyer remorse return period) but if GPS isn't corrected by mid sept, this phone is history
samsung having released it w/o working gps is maybe forgiveable, but then even assuming they didn't know about the issue before release, it's been over 90 days since the asian release, and it's still not working.
Lay on top of that that samsung announced the GPS had been "validated" in the EPIC 4G, and it turns out it isn't. That did nothing but strengthen my doubts on samsung delivering a solution.
Tried this tracker booster app, makes no difference, gps still horrendous. If some people think that a 20m accuracy variation is acceptable for a gps lock they are a bloody fool.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Bynar010 said:
Tried this tracker booster app, makes no difference, gps still horrendous. If some people think that a 20m accuracy variation is acceptable for a gps lock they are a bloody fool.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then it must be the firmware I flashed. There's a big difference with JM2 and the previous FW I had, if I remember right it was JF3.
The accuracy is good, for example Endomondo regonizes few meter changes. (like changing side of the road).
Sorry to offend you but Beowulf_pt has no SGS and still he is lurking around complaining. If you think about it ,there must be some reasons that I and several others have a perfectly normal (no correction) GPS on our SGS. Why is it working so different for different persons? Some logical alternatives would be error in a batch of phones (switch it), or operator programming has messed it up (get new operator), or just overload caused by program running in background, memory and task mangers etc ( educate yourself or wait for a proper kernel - see below) or in some cases just plain trolling of some non SGS owners (see my last reply).
The GPS chip is new and according to the web only recently the code for efficient low level drivers, for the linux kernel, has started to appear on internet (23 august). It will take some weeks before they are implemented so I would bet that they have fixed it by the end of September. You know, bad driver = slow, no calender etc. You will notice it specially when you use program that uses lots of resources (Maps and My tracker). It is much more efficient with Cardiotrainer for example or GPS test. (see my third conclusion above). I have noticed that (at least for me) it takes 5 - 10 sec to get a first lock in GPS test but half a minute at least in Maps or My Tracks.
Another tip is to run for example GPS test for one minute or so before My Track so the GPS gets some satellite data downloaded (calenders). The time also helps the GPS to calculate the exact position to use as a start point. You normally need a minute or so if the calenders are to old or you moved to get the right positions.
Iphone 4 has a good GPS (3 is crap according to some owners and it is not fixed. Do you hear any complaints?). The chip is one generation older than SGS and Apple do not need to wait for the kernel to be changed in there Iphone. They do it them self and by the way Iphone 4 is not really multitasking which means that GPS programs can easily be prioritized.
Well this is a short version. The net is filled with facts and if you start read a little you can start puzzle together what the cause is for your faulty GPS (nearly nobody believes its hardware any more).
By the way, I am not ignorant and I know rather much about GPS and how to evaluate tracking (I have written several scientific papers on tracking of wildlife where at least one was on the subject - evaluation of ARGOS tracking devices using GPS as reference). I have owned several mobiles and GPSes, programmed and built fish tracking devices, and did my thesis on wildlife tracking. I stating this not to try to end the GPS discussion but to make it a little bit more "scientific" and not so emotional like the comments on my last reply. There still nobody that knows how many that has a problem with the GPS. We only know that a few of millions have complained and a few of millions have said there satisfied with it.
Bynar010 said:
Tried this tracker booster app, makes no difference, gps still horrendous. If some people think that a 20m accuracy variation is acceptable for a gps lock they are a bloody fool.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On the contrar my friend, 5 - 15 meters is what you can expect and that means that the fix has 95 % certainty to be in that interval. 20 is a little bit above what you can expect but not much. In good dedicated trackers or a good phones you can get 5 meters (which I often get after 30 sec outside) and 2,5 for some fixes but not constant. A mobile is not a dedicated GPS and with the suspected driver problem 20 would not be bad. Try with GPS test, under open sky, and holding it at the bottom of the phone. Before you start you should turn off and on the GPS and close all task managers and started programs. You know that home means often that you leave the program running in the background but using back shuts it down. And wait for 30 - 60 seconds. If you get 10 be satisfied it,s a phone and not a dedicated GPS.
My touch hd would actually follow the f$$king road. Not too much to ask that a brand new smart phone would do the same is it? Its nothing short of pathetic. Even my old tytn2 was superb as a gps device for navigation, this thing cannot be trusted.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
I for one am getting SICK of installing fw's hoping for a fix for GPS.
They put a good hardware-wise device out.. But its kinda shoddy the fw development isn't equally as good. I have flashed nearly ALL the fw's to no real avail..
I am started to get frustrated after all this patience..
FWIW
Running 2.2 with no lag, fix no root, no apps to help. Google Nav and Co-Pilot work flawlessly. Mytracks follows me walking down the pavement at the correct position and on the correct side of the road with very few deviations.
I really cannot see what all the fuss is ablout here.
Tehpriest said:
FWIW
Running 2.2 with no lag, fix no root, no apps to help. Google Nav and Co-Pilot work flawlessly. Mytracks follows me walking down the pavement at the correct position and on the correct side of the road with very few deviations.
I really cannot see what all the fuss is ablout here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well try it in a car and get supprised...
praun said:
well try it in a car and get supprised...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is where I use both Co-Pilot and Google Nav.....
Beowulf_pt said:
..y quote one of my favourite authors..."Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I rather stick with Popper. Extraordinary evidence or support isn't that hard to get (look at the paranormal claims etc). What is more difficult and more fruitful to come by is some clever tests that eventually will or can refute a claim. If a theory will pass those tests it is actually more trustworthy then when it gets "extraordinary" evidence.
Again, no theory will stand till the end of time, how extra-ordinary our evidences may be.
Lol, back to the gps.
Do these things have a gps issue? I just came from an Evo, and gps reception on these sucks compared to Evo.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
herzzreh said:
Do these things have a gps issue? I just came from an Evo, and gps reception on these sucks compared to Evo.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bwahahahaha!! The answer to your question is that all the Galaxy S variants have GPS issues!
Some people claim they have trouble
On my epic google maps takes a long time to lock
But on google navigator and sprint navteq it locks on no more than 20 seconds it usually locks on in 5 to 10 seconds
What's weird ,is that to use google navigator. You have to use google maps to get to google navigator
Open google maps type place or address then hit drive directions then it switches on to google navigator then instantly gps locks on
If you just open google maps and turn the gps on and hit my location the gps takes a while to lock....but not when u start google nav.
I have no problem since when i use google maps, I never use my location.
I look up address and for driving directions via google navigator.
The problem with the GPS is that the cache doesn't update unless you reboot the phone. The longer the phone has been on the worse it gets. If you follow the instructions below it cause the GPS to update the cache over 3G whenever you fire up a GPS App. It only takes a few seconds to do this and then you get a fast lock after that. The only problem is if you are in an area with no signal and try to use the GPS. If that is going to be the case then follow the instructions again and change it to Warm Boot. Here are the instructions:
Enter GPS debug/settings application by typing *#1472365#
click "Setup" tab
click "position mode"
Click "starting mode
Enable "Cold Start"
Back out.
Ah... well, my problem wasn't the lock-on. That was normal. It's the accuracy and ability to hold signal. Again, comparing it to the Evo... this phone had that huge circle of inaccuracy while driving and Evo did not at the same time. Slightest obstruction and this would lose the signal while the other phone would not. Very frustrating.
herzzreh said:
Ah... well, my problem wasn't the lock-on. That was normal. It's the accuracy and ability to hold signal. Again, comparing it to the Evo... this phone had that huge circle of inaccuracy while driving and Evo did not at the same time. Slightest obstruction and this would lose the signal while the other phone would not. Very frustrating.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
for lockon issues, which due to a bug in the cache system and will affect all users who don't cycle the phones cache, use the cold start as indicated above.
For accuracy issues it is important to remember to make sure to leave "use wireless networking" off.
aero1 said:
for lockon issues, which due to a bug in the cache system and will affect all users who don't cycle the phones cache, use the cold start as indicated above.
For accuracy issues it is important to remember to make sure to leave "use wireless networking" off.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought we were supposed to leave that on.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk
acegolfer said:
I thought we were supposed to leave that on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That advice is disinformation from Sprint customer service. They are trying to cover up the fact that the GPS has problems, so they advise users to enable the non-GPS location by cell towers, which is not as accurate.
aero1 said:
For accuracy issues it is important to remember to make sure to leave "use wireless networking" off.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I tried that, still not too accurate compared to the other phone. What I noticed is that it IS accurate right after a hard reset, but then half an hour later it goes back to showing the circle.
herzzreh said:
I tried that, still not too accurate compared to the other phone. What I noticed is that it IS accurate right after a hard reset, but then half an hour later it goes back to showing the circle.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All the Galaxy S variants have a problem with SNR. Basically, the antenna has issues getting a strong GPS signal and some are worse then others; some can't even achieve a lock! Low signal = bad accuracy....
As for a fix, I'm not sure if Samsung can really fix it, if it's a design issue. On the Galaxy Forum, there was a guy that said it was possible to fix a low signal hardware flaw with software. Me, I'm highly doubtful it can be done where a Galaxy S GPS will ever be as good as the other Android phones currently on the market. I think they will eventually get it to the point where Nav will work most of the time, but not to where others are using there Android phones for Geo caching.
Didn't they fix it on fascinate?
sent from my epic 4g with no 4g
churro7 said:
Didn't they fix it on fascinate?
sent from my epic 4g with no 4g
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope... Just do a search on the Fascinate forum and you'll find it's got GPS problems too.
Rogers in Canada said their version of the Galaxy S (Captivate) will have the GPS fixed, but we'll know when it hits the market in a few days. It might take a couple weeks before we start seeing the reports roll in.... If they truly have a Galaxy S phone with a working GPS, I'd like to see the mainboard. If it's the same as other versions of the Galaxy S, then maybe they were able to fix it with software. If it's a hardware design change .... Well, then the rest of the Galaxy S owners may be SOL.
GPS on Epic = Epic FAIL
Shame on Samsung for releasing the Epic with a half assed implementation of a GPS.
It is just one of those "what were they thinking" situations.
I mean didn t they release a patch
sent from my epic 4g with no 4g
crabjoe said:
Nope... Just do a search on the Fascinate forum and you'll find it's got GPS problems too.
Rogers in Canada said their version of the Galaxy S (Captivate) will have the GPS fixed, but we'll know when it hits the market in a few days. It might take a couple weeks before we start seeing the reports roll in.... If they truly have a Galaxy S phone with a working GPS, I'd like to see the mainboard. If it's the same as other versions of the Galaxy S, then maybe they were able to fix it with software. If it's a hardware design change .... Well, then the rest of the Galaxy S owners may be SOL.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The GSM versions of the Galaxy S, which includes the Captivate, Vibrant and International I9000, have one GPS chip -- the relatively new Broadcom BCM4751. The CDMA versions, the Epic and the Fascinate , use another -- the multipurpose Qualcomm QSC6085 radio that has been in use for three years. As far as the GPS is concerned, these are really two different devices: Different hardware. Different firmware. Different bugs. Different symptoms. (I have owned Vibrants and an Epic, and have tested the GPS rigorously on both. They behave very differently. The GPS bugs on the Epic are unique to the Epic as far as I know, although it is difficult to tell about the Fascinate from anecdotal reports and Verizon slapped a confusing user interface on the settings for location services and GPS.)
The only thing the two general designs have in common is general incompetence. Samsung managed to foul up two different GPS designs in two different ways.
But it is folly to try to make inferential comparisons between the two types.
churro7 said:
I mean didn t they release a patch
sent from my epic 4g with no 4g
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but it didn't work.
boomerbubba said:
The GSM versions of the Galaxy S, which includes the Captivate, Vibrant and International I9000, have one GPS chip -- the relatively new Broadcom BCM4751. The CDMA versions, the Epic and the Fascinate , use another -- the multipurpose Qualcomm QSC6085 radio that has been in use for three years. As far as the GPS is concerned, these are really two different devices: Different hardware. Different firmware. Different bugs. Different symptoms. (I have owned Vibrants and an Epic, and have tested the GPS rigorously on both. They behave very differently. The GPS bugs on the Epic are unique to the Epic as far as I know, although it is difficult to tell about the Fascinate from anecdotal reports and Verizon slapped a confusing user interface on the settings for location services and GPS.)
The only thing the two general designs have in common is general incompetence. Samsung managed to foul up two different GPS designs in two different ways.
But it is folly to try to make inferential comparisons between the two types.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're correct that the GPS hardware is different and personally, I don't think either GPS chips are the problem. I think the problem is hardware design, as in placement or size of the GPS antenna.
It's like in the old days before cable was popular and everyone had rabbit ears on tops of the TV. Regardless of how good or bad the TV tuner was, the type or placement of the antenna made a huge difference. I remember putting tin foil on the antennas to try and get a better signal. I also remember my dad telling me to stand in a funny position or place, with the antenna in my hand, so he could watch his football. LOL...
I really think Samsung designers goofed, just like Apple did, on the antenna. Bad antenna = bad signal.
crabjoe said:
You're correct that the GPS hardware is different and personally, I don't think either GPS chips are the problem. I think the problem is hardware design, as in placement or size of the GPS antenna.
It's like in the old days before cable was popular and everyone had rabbit ears on tops of the TV. Regardless of how good or bad the TV tuner was, the type or placement of the antenna made a huge difference. I remember putting tin foil on the antennas to try and get a better signal. I also remember my dad telling me to stand in a funny position or place, with the antenna in my hand, so he could watch his football. LOL...
I really think Samsung designers goofed, just like Apple did, on the antenna. Bad antenna = bad signal.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I must say that I have zero accuracy issues whatsoever. I *do* have stale ephemeris data problems like nobody's business - cold-start mode won't help either if I'm connected to WiFi or 4G (though 4G seems to have better luck.) The software-reported accuracy issues are a hard-coded datum, which in the Captivate has now been removed.
If I don't exclusively sit on 3G, then either Hot-start or Cold-start are unreliable. If I *am* on 3G, then Hot-start pinpoints me exactly, and almost instantly. With cold-start, it takes a bit to narrow in, though the *initial* lock is often faster. Other times, I'll see (in GPS Status) that it has found all 10 satellites, but not locked - the ephemeris bug all over again. Disappointing to say the least. BTW, this is not fixed on Captivate - it cannot get a lock while on WiFi. This has got to be a software problem. Neither my Epic nor Captivate have any issues actually sticking to the satellites. If this were software, then the GPS itself would be unreliable *during* operation; not just initial lock.
crabjoe said:
You're correct that the GPS hardware is different and personally, I don't think either GPS chips are the problem. I think the problem is hardware design, as in placement or size of the GPS antenna.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The SNR levels on the Epic do seem moderately lower than what other phones report. Theroretically this could be due to antenna design. The SNR level itself is a complex estimate by the GPS chip, not an objective reality being metered. So another possible explanation is that the SNR calculation is buggy. The estimated accuracy calculation is obviously buggy, always reported at 30.0 meters as if it is hard-coded. So there could also be a bug in the calculation of SNR, too. As for antenna design, I don't even assume that the Epic has the same antenna design as other Galaxy S phones, because its form factor is completely different.
In any case, signal sensitivity cannot explain the locking behavior, which has been isolated by user testing to be caused by bad handling of the cache of GPS almanac and ephemeris data. This is a bug.
Poor signal sensitivity could explain problems with actual accuracy. But like APOLAUF, I don't think there is a problem with actual actual accuracy on the Epic. The way to test that empirically is by plotting the recorded tracks in software such as My Tracks. If have done that with my Epic, for both driving and walking tracks, simultaneously with benchmark tracks captured by a known good device. I used my venerable G1, which has excellent GPS performance. The actual accuracy of the Epic is just as good.
The other GSM-based Galaxy S devices have had problems with actual accuracy, verified by many tests with My Tracks. But they are wholly different devices.
It is hard to tell from anecdotal reports in forums how accurate GPS performance is. Some reports of poor accuracy can be explained by poor locking. Some can be explained by pilot error. It takes controlled testing to get at the facts. Unfortunately, most commenters in forums, including this one, haven't a clue how to test the GPS rigorously.
IMO
First I have a co-worker who has been working with a developer and can get a GPS lock on his captivate super quick. To aide he is using the cell towers to get him a list of applicable satellites to his approximate location and gets a massive list of responding sats.
The next point is that I think that there is likely an issue with the Antenna . . but I do not think that is exclusively the issue. If this were strictly a HW issue then the issue would not be alleviated after a restart of the phone. There are multiple accounts that this is what is occurring.
Personally (and perhaps because this is my first true GPS phone) it is a minor inconvenience and doesnt bother me too much. . . . but is annoying and something that I would expect Sammy to go after. . . or at least acknowledge
Just flashed one of my Epics. I am under the distinct impression that the main bug is not fixed. I am getting less locks on froyo epic than on two other epics held in same place with cold start workaround. The fact that it took four minutes to get first fix means that even on the first attempt it did not properly fill the almanac/ephemeris cache! That first fix should have taken about 5 to 10 seconds!
Will report some additional testing over the next few days.
aero1 said:
Just flashed one of my Epics. I am under the distinct impression that the main bug is not fixed. Will report some additional testing over the next few days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Keep in mind that this is a leak, a beta at best - it's still using the DI18 modem.bin.
aero1 said:
Just flashed one of my Epics. I am under the distinct impression that the main bug is not fixed. Will report some additional testing over the next few days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
we don't know yet...cause most likely the fix will be in modem not the rom and the devs don't have the modem yet....The rom just helped out the accuracy...
Why dont we wait for Froyo to actually be released before we say things dont work.
I agree, that people should not post thread titles that suggest they are part of the official source or internal testing unless they actually are.
My gps locks within 10 seconds on froyo and eclair. No mod needed.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
joefx13 said:
My gps locks within 10 seconds on froyo and eclair. No mod needed.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you had any idea as to how the bug presents you would know why it will sicne you just flashed your phone.
Jedi2155 said:
I agree, that people should not post thread titles that suggest they are part of the official source or internal testing unless they actually are.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Welcome to XDA. I have spoken to ADS doing the testing.
aero1 said:
Just flashed one of my Epics. I am under the distinct impression that the main bug is not fixed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a given! The official Froyo on the International SGS's GPS didn't get fixed, so why would they fix it on the Epic?
Personally, I say the problem is hardware and Samsung will brush this under the run. Really, it's not like the phone isn't selling and they're getting ready to put out a new Flagship phone. Why would they invest time and money into fixing something that going to be replaced soon and is still selling well?
I think the only way they will fix it is if there is a lawsuit and they are forced into it. Outside of that, all Galaxy S variant owners, that don't have a working GPS, is SOL.
If it's not fixed I'll have to let go of samsung. There's no reason something like this should be ignored. It was annoying on the moment, and now it's annoying on the epic. My evo and hero never had a problem.
How is it that I have never had an issue with the GPS? It works flawlessly for me. It isn't very accurate, but it locks on near instantly every time as long as I am outside. Doesn't seem like there is a bug at all to me, other than the accuracy of the lock.
Might just be something you guys are doing or some setting you changed.
muyoso said:
How is it that I have never had an issue with the GPS? It works flawlessly for me. It isn't very accurate, but it locks on near instantly every time as long as I am outside. Doesn't seem like there is a bug at all to me, other than the accuracy of the lock.
Might just be something you guys are doing or some setting you changed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If it was something people were doing, you'd see GPS issues on all phones that have GPS. Currently, no phones seem to have an issue with GPS except for Samsung Galaxy S phones.
What might cause different issues (some have decent GPS, others can't even get a lock, some in the middle) is the antenna may be marginal. A marginal antenna might work or have issues based on just how well it's soldered in. Too much solder, not enough, or it got soldered in at just a slight angle... Who knows other then Samsung, and their not saying or fixing it. If it was just a software problem, I'll bet they would have had it fixed by now and you wouldn't see such a wide variety of problems.
muyoso said:
How is it that I have never had an issue with the GPS? It works flawlessly for me. It isn't very accurate, but it locks on near instantly every time as long as I am outside. Doesn't seem like there is a bug at all to me, other than the accuracy of the lock.
Might just be something you guys are doing or some setting you changed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you running the leaked Froyo release? (That is what this thread is about.)
The general property of the GPS locking bug is that it does not occur under all conditions. It's root cause is buggy handling of the GPS cache after it becomes stale. There are many things that can cause the time-dependent cache to be cleared or refreshed, including frequent use of the GPS or rebooting.
How do you even know that you have a good GPS lock if the fix is inaccurate? Do you use a utility such as GPS Test to show how many satellites are being used? Since the actual accuracy of the GPS, when it does get a multi-bird lock, is pretty good, my bet is that you don't have a good satellite lock at all. In any case, if the bottom-line accuracy is poor, it cannot be said that your GPS "works flawlessly."
muyoso said:
How is it that I have never had an issue with the GPS? It works flawlessly for me. It isn't very accurate, but it locks on near instantly every time as long as I am outside. Doesn't seem like there is a bug at all to me, other than the accuracy of the lock.
Might just be something you guys are doing or some setting you changed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are threads everywhere on how to replicate this problem. Enable WiFi or 4G, wait 4 hours, then try to get a lock. Your phone won't. It is unable to get assistance data over anything other than Ev-DO/1x-RTT.
I have seen anecdotal reports on the main DJ29 thread in which users first experienced good GPS performance, but later the GPS locking failures started. This is completely consistent with the buggy behavior of the stock Epic. (There also is a lot of noise from naive cowboy "testers" proclaiming that their GPS works fine with the new ROM. Their GPS units would work just as fine -- temporarily -- if they only did a factory reset of a stock Epic. They have no clue how to test for this GPS bug.)
Meanwhile, there are skimpy reports that there is a later Froyo version, DK05, which also includes an updated modem.bin module. Unfortunately, that version is not generally available for testing.
I am CONSTANTLY AMAZED at people saying they have no gps problem AND THEN they follow it up with "I mean it's off by 100 to 300 feet, but I have no gps problem"
If the gps doesn't show EXACTLY what room you are sitting in - in your house, YOU HAVE A PROBLEM.
I for one use the phone exactly like a normal person does - I walk in and out of wifi zones all day, I use it to talk, I hardly turn it off and power cycle it
AND in that situation, even with cold start enabled THE EPIC GPS IS USELESS!!!
If it's not fixed in the next release, I'm selling it, even though I love it and I will NEVER buy another Samsung product again.
There have been MULTIPLE times the GPS lets me down, across ALL different APPS. It's purely PATHETIC on Sprint and Samsungs part.
J3ff said:
I am CONSTANTLY AMAZED at people saying they have no gps problem AND THEN they follow it up with "I mean it's off by 100 to 300 feet, but I have no gps problem"
If the gps doesn't show EXACTLY what room you are sitting in - in your house, YOU HAVE A PROBLEM.
I for one use the phone exactly like a normal person does - I walk in and out of wifi zones all day, I use it to talk, I hardly turn it off and power cycle it
AND in that situation, even with cold start enabled THE EPIC GPS IS USELESS!!!
If it's not fixed in the next release, I'm selling it, even though I love it and I will NEVER buy another Samsung product again.
There have been MULTIPLE times the GPS lets me down, across ALL different APPS. It's purely PATHETIC on Sprint and Samsungs part.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Worked perfectly for me with cold start on DI18. Room to room and driving. Locked on within 1 minute. I updated to Froyo. Now I have never gotten a lock.
J3ff said:
I am CONSTANTLY AMAZED at people saying they have no gps problem AND THEN they follow it up with "I mean it's off by 100 to 300 feet, but I have no gps problem"
If the gps doesn't show EXACTLY what room you are sitting in - in your house, YOU HAVE A PROBLEM.
I for one use the phone exactly like a normal person does - I walk in and out of wifi zones all day, I use it to talk, I hardly turn it off and power cycle it
AND in that situation, even with cold start enabled THE EPIC GPS IS USELESS!!!
If it's not fixed in the next release, I'm selling it, even though I love it and I will NEVER buy another Samsung product again.
There have been MULTIPLE times the GPS lets me down, across ALL different APPS. It's purely PATHETIC on Sprint and Samsungs part.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont know how you can call something useless that works well for driving navigation. Sure, it is not accurate. It can only pinpoint your location to a circle with a diameter of 98ft. Obviously we would all love to see this fixed. But to say that it is useless is just dumb. It might be useless for certain applications, but for the most used application it is usable. Not great, but useable.
Also, the main complaint I have heard from people is that the GPS simply wouldn't lock, not that it wasn't accurate. As a response to that, I am perfectly comfortable saying that mine is working perfectly, because my GPS locks within 5 seconds consistantly. Sure, it doesn't lock onto 9 satellites and the location data it is providing isnt super accurate, but it can reliably pinpoint my location on this massive planet to within 100ft within 5 seconds of me asking it to.
Don't mistake this response for me defending any of its shortcomings. It is not as accurate as any of my previous phones, which is ridiculous. My only defense of it is that it locks near instantly.
you are not set to have it only work on GPS.
98 feet is not accurate. Sorry but where I live there are LOTS of roads within 98 feet of me.
Actually, i was at a bar about an hour ago and a girl asked me to find directions from where we were, to her car........ it was aabout 600 feet inaccurate. We were sitting in a bar, and it was showing us sitting on I95.
yea that as impressive for a top of the line phone.
NOT
J3ff said:
I am CONSTANTLY AMAZED at people saying they have no gps problem AND THEN they follow it up with "I mean it's off by 100 to 300 feet, but I have no gps problem"
If the gps doesn't show EXACTLY what room you are sitting in - in your house, YOU HAVE A PROBLEM.
I for one use the phone exactly like a normal person does - I walk in and out of wifi zones all day, I use it to talk, I hardly turn it off and power cycle it
AND in that situation, even with cold start enabled THE EPIC GPS IS USELESS!!!
If it's not fixed in the next release, I'm selling it, even though I love it and I will NEVER buy another Samsung product again.
There have been MULTIPLE times the GPS lets me down, across ALL different APPS. It's purely PATHETIC on Sprint and Samsungs part.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so sell it? whats stopping you.. you are going to get another phone with better GPS but its going to suck at everything else the Epic does very well. I for one am willing to take ****ty gps vs a ****ty phone
J3ff said:
I am CONSTANTLY AMAZED at people saying they have no gps problem AND THEN they follow it up with "I mean it's off by 100 to 300 feet, but I have no gps problem"
If the gps doesn't show EXACTLY what room you are sitting in - in your house, YOU HAVE A PROBLEM.
I for one use the phone exactly like a normal person does - I walk in and out of wifi zones all day, I use it to talk, I hardly turn it off and power cycle it
AND in that situation, even with cold start enabled THE EPIC GPS IS USELESS!!!
If it's not fixed in the next release, I'm selling it, even though I love it and I will NEVER buy another Samsung product again.
There have been MULTIPLE times the GPS lets me down, across ALL different APPS. It's purely PATHETIC on Sprint and Samsungs part.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) Phone works for driving nav, the only reason I need a GPS chip in the phone. I don't care if Twitter knows I'm at a mistress' house while I tweet, in fact, I would hope that it wouldn't know.
2) Unlike my former Hero, I have never been portrayed on the map on a biway. The Hero did it all the time and it used to piss me off to no end. Who cares if the phone can tell you what address you're at, but can't tell if you're in the bathroom or in bed? You do realize that building materials can affect this issue (and since I live in Florida where houses are mandated to not fall down during a hurricane, pretty thick material).
Does AGPS actually work on the Acer A500, or android tablets in general? Programs like GPS Test and GPS Status can both clear and download AGPS data, but it does not seem to affect (improve) performance at all. I have tested this MANY times and it just seems useless. My third A500 (3.01 still) seems to have weak GPS pickup and usually cannot fix or even see any sats in my house.
Rob
For me, yes it does work - I have wifi location off and can get multiple fixes indoors after some 10-25 seconds.
You may just be unlucky and still have a bad one (I've read that sometimes the gps antenna comes loose and fall behind things, interfering with the signal)
It works, at least in my case. I have had situations where it locks in a minute or 2. I have had situations where it takes 10m to lock. I have had situations where it locks on in my home, and situations where it absolutely refuses to.
What I do know is that it works and works well when I'm outside, period.
GPS are best at grabbing their signals while outdoors, in the open. People here are using it from their homes or expect it to lock on in 2m flat. While it CAN be used this way, and can lock in that quickly, it needs more time to acquire a signal indoors and if it doesn't, that doesn't mean it's broken. That just means the signal can't get through the walls. If it works today and not tomorrow, consider the possibility that there may be more clouds in the sky or external interference.
I'm sure some people have gotten bad ones, but in most cases I believe people are just trying to get blood from wine ie: they are attempting to use and get the best performance outside of the intended parameters of use of the feature.
If you're outside and have been for 30m and it doesn't work, THEN you may have a problem. Until then, works as intended.
Mine works great also. I get a lock in about 10 seconds. Go outside, and lock is much faster if don't move. I use it as a car GPS. Just wait for it to lock and then it's working great.
mine works also, i have to go outside, but it works.
I to can confirm my GPS works very well.I use the new Co_pilot.I can get a lock in the house in about 2 minutes after a tab reboot.after it locked once. A restart of the app it can lock in as little as 5 to 20 seconds.it will keep the lock.However. I have not found the issue but once in a while it can tar it forever to get a fix.even thou its seeing 5 to 7 sat's.trying to get a fix while moving takes a few minutes as well.now Google navigation will lock rather fast if I start it before I leave my drive.guessing its still using my wifi to get a fix.because it will take forever otherwise.
Co pilot I thing does something tobthe configuration file to improve GPS.
This is only my openion if you think im wrong your welcome to that.don't bash mine thank you
Hardware failure is not out of the question. I had to return two tablets for this very issue. The third tablet I got was like night and day.
1st tablet never got more than one sat, and never locked, while outside on a clear day.
2nd tablet never saw one satellite in the whole 5 days I owned it.
3rd tablet gets 10+ satellites outside and about 4 inside. Locks in about 30 seconds outside and 2-5 minutes inside. Not perfect, but useable for navigation in my car (which is what its for).
The sales manager at the store said faulty GPS was the number one reason he got this pad returned, and he got quite a few of them. He said Acer was being very tight lipped about it. I suspect they know they have a problem and are hoping it flies under the radar long enough to get a working batch out there.
pacificwing said:
Hardware failure is not out of the question. I had to return two tablets for this very issue. The third tablet I got was like night and day.
1st tablet never got more than one sat, and never locked, while outside on a clear day.
2nd tablet never saw one satellite in the whole 5 days I owned it.
3rd tablet gets 10+ satellites outside and about 4 inside. Locks in about 30 seconds outside and 2-5 minutes inside. Not perfect, but useable for navigation in my car (which is what its for).
The sales manager at the store said faulty GPS was the number one reason he got this pad returned, and he got quite a few of them. He said Acer was being very tight lipped about it. I suspect they know they have a problem and are hoping it flies under the radar long enough to get a working batch out there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All I can say is, oh my god! I bought a Xoom today and the only thing I did was install GPS Test on it. Upstairs in my room, it sees and locks 8-10 satellites almost instantly. The acer, can barely see 1 satellite in my house, forget about getting a lock, maybe it you wait long enough and don't breathe on it. Also, the SNR numbers on the Xoom are substantially better indoors than the Acer gets outdoors! There is no doubt in my mind whatsoever now that this current Acer unit I have has a defective (or just poor quality) GPS.
I uploaded a quick video of the xoom, sorry about the grainy video, it was taken with my old hp camera... You'll get the point though. I wish the GPS on the Acer worked even half as good as this Xoom appears to (so far).
Vid should be available shortly.
http://vimeo.com/26498687
Rob
ps. I also have a new Samsung Galaxy Vibrant phone, the GPS on that is just as bad as the acer, probably a bit worse.
silverball.slayer said:
All I can say is, oh my god! I bought a Xoom today and the only thing I did was install GPS Test on it. Upstairs in my room, it sees and locks 8-10 satellites almost instantly. The acer, can barely see 1 satellite in my house, forget about getting a lock, maybe it you wait long enough and don't breathe on it. Also, the SNR numbers on the Xoom are substantially better indoors than the Acer gets outdoors! There is no doubt in my mind whatsoever now that this current Acer unit I have has a defective (or just poor quality) GPS.
I uploaded a quick video of the xoom, sorry about the grainy video, it was taken with my old hp camera... You'll get the point though. I wish the GPS on the Acer worked even half as good as this Xoom appears to (so far).
Vid should be available shortly.
http://vimeo.com/26498687
Rob
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can check out mine
Indoor... after an all day rain... locked under 20 seconds
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=15472832&postcount=37
UnicornKaz said:
You can check out mine
Indoor... after an all day rain... locked under 20 seconds
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=15472832&postcount=37
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have wifi assist turned off on my xoom, plus it does not have 3g either. Your acer looks not too bad, but the xoom still obliterates it speedwise with a gps fix. This is the third A500 I have had. The first was DOA and the second one had a bad microphone. This third one has been good except for the GPS. The second one had much better functioning GPS compared to this third one. I am tired of playing musical tablets though and I want one that just plain works. I could get another Acer, but who knows if the GPS will work properly on that one or not. Compared to the Xoom, the Acer GPS does not seem very good at all. Too bad, since it's an otherwise great unit.
edit: I did some searching and it seems the Xoom has a better hardware GPS implementation, but I have not found the exact details just yet.
Rob
I guess we know what happened to all those failed GPS A500's that got returned. A few of the big chains (futureshop) has just started selling a refurbished model for $100 cheaper than the new release ones.
That was a quick turn around.
pacificwing said:
I guess we know what happened to all those failed GPS A500's that got returned. A few of the big chains (futureshop) has just started selling a refurbished model for $100 cheaper than the new release ones.
That was a quick turn around.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I saw that too. I wonder what the return rate on these has been? Futureshop has quite a few A500 in stock and they don't seem to be selling. People are definitely interested in the tablets, but the average consumer is going to be confused with the current choices available. Acer doesn't exactly have a stellar reputation to live up to, but I think the A500 is a pretty good unit if it everything works like it should.
Rob
Try this and all your gps problems are over at least in the US
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1152318&highlight=gps
tomlogan1 said:
Try this and all your gps problems are over at least in the US
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1152318&highlight=gps
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no question that the aGPS software is not tuned ideally with new A500's. Unfortunately, for some, this is not the only issue. There IS a hardware aspect to this problem. This is evident by the fact that so many users can exchange their stock units for brand new units and get entirely different results.
The above fix will optimize your GPS locking, I'm sure; but only if your adapter actually works in the first place.
In regards to android tablets not selling, I suspect it's just marketing. Android is still the new kid on the block. Even out of the gate, most android tabs offer much more than an ipad at a much better price, but people walk right past them in order to get themselves a tablet that has the shiny white apple logo on the back. They want to be able to tell their friends that they got an IPAD.
Also, those who actually are in the know, might be a little hesitant about android at the moment. Every single android tablet currently on the market has had release problems. The ACER has its GPS and Wifi problems, the samsung has its screen issue, the Xoom has the fiasco with the SD card, the thrive has its sleep disorder. They are all minor, and they will undoubtedly get worked out. It just makes people second guess going with android.
Plus, Mac is playing the major patent troll card right now. They just hammered HTC pretty hard, and other android distributors are rightfully worried. This will no doubt affect the future of the platform as a whole.
IM am a little confussed here. why is everyone complaining because thier tabs dont gps lock indoors? most car gps's dont lock indoors. why would you even need to get a sat signal for gps in your living room? are you having trouuble finding the kitchen?
This is a great tablet and only complains i have heard from people about it is people tring to do silly things with it and then getting upset because it wont do the silly things.
Sat signals were never ment to penatrate roofs and walls thats why your direct tv dish and xm or sirius sat anntennas are OUTSIDE i think you guys are complaining about something it wasent ment to do, and why the nav program has wifi assist so that you can use the nav program at home to plan routes. then switch to the sat once you GO OUT SIDE.
But my main question still is why do you need a sat signal sitting in your living room and why are you complaining when you dont get one?
and also to the people just *****ing non stop about the charger cord really? its like your just looking to complain about something. agan the whole point of the tablet is to be portable not to be used while teathered to a wall socket. so what the cord is a little smaller then other peoples. what are you gonna do with a cord thats 2 foot longer that you cant do with this one?
This s a great tablet and all anyone is doing is complaining about stupid stuff.
well i am mad because the tablet didnt buy itself and walk to my house and set itself up for me. really sat signals arent suppose to work indoors who needs a sat signal indoors? and just because you do get one indoors dosent mean your suppose too. if your getting sat signals indoors i would be questioning the build quality of my house and not the tablet.
harlaquin said:
...if your getting sat signals indoors i would be questioning the build quality of my house and not the tablet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
... ...
harlaquin said:
IM am a little confussed here. why is everyone complaining because thier tabs dont gps lock indoors? most car gps's dont lock indoors. why would you even need to get a sat signal for gps in your living room? are you having trouuble finding the kitchen?
This is a great tablet and only complains i have heard from people about it is people tring to do silly things with it and then getting upset because it wont do the silly things.
Sat signals were never ment to penatrate roofs and walls thats why your direct tv dish and xm or sirius sat anntennas are OUTSIDE i think you guys are complaining about something it wasent ment to do, and why the nav program has wifi assist so that you can use the nav program at home to plan routes. then switch to the sat once you GO OUT SIDE.
But my main question still is why do you need a sat signal sitting in your living room and why are you complaining when you dont get one?
and also to the people just *****ing non stop about the charger cord really? its like your just looking to complain about something. agan the whole point of the tablet is to be portable not to be used while teathered to a wall socket. so what the cord is a little smaller then other peoples. what are you gonna do with a cord thats 2 foot longer that you cant do with this one?
This s a great tablet and all anyone is doing is complaining about stupid stuff.
well i am mad because the tablet didnt buy itself and walk to my house and set itself up for me. really sat signals arent suppose to work indoors who needs a sat signal indoors? and just because you do get one indoors dosent mean your suppose too. if your getting sat signals indoors i would be questioning the build quality of my house and not the tablet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please don't troll.
harlaquin said:
IM am a little confussed here. why is everyone complaining because thier tabs dont gps lock indoors? most car gps's dont lock indoors. why would you even need to get a sat signal for gps in your living room? are you having trouuble finding the kitchen?
This is a great tablet and only complains i have heard from people about it is people tring to do silly things with it and then getting upset because it wont do the silly things.
Sat signals were never ment to penatrate roofs and walls thats why your direct tv dish and xm or sirius sat anntennas are OUTSIDE i think you guys are complaining about something it wasent ment to do, and why the nav program has wifi assist so that you can use the nav program at home to plan routes. then switch to the sat once you GO OUT SIDE.
But my main question still is why do you need a sat signal sitting in your living room and why are you complaining when you dont get one?
and also to the people just *****ing non stop about the charger cord really? its like your just looking to complain about something. agan the whole point of the tablet is to be portable not to be used while teathered to a wall socket. so what the cord is a little smaller then other peoples. what are you gonna do with a cord thats 2 foot longer that you cant do with this one?
This s a great tablet and all anyone is doing is complaining about stupid stuff.
well i am mad because the tablet didnt buy itself and walk to my house and set itself up for me. really sat signals arent suppose to work indoors who needs a sat signal indoors? and just because you do get one indoors dosent mean your suppose too. if your getting sat signals indoors i would be questioning the build quality of my house and not the tablet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your comments are fair enough, I suppose. I'll assume you're not trolling. But I'd ask you to consider the following:
Some A500 owners (obviously, yourself included) have a working GPS module, and can use it as well as can be expected. Other A500 owners (obviously, yourself not included) have a broken GPS, and cannot use it as expected. In fact, it is broken so badly that they never get a signal under even the most ideal circumstances. There is no question that GPS performance seems to vary from unit to unit.
Considering that, your comments confuse me. Are you saying that these unfortunate A500 owners with malfunctioning GPS units have no right to complain? Are you saying they have no right to gather on a forum and try to troubleshoot the issue? Are you saying that they should not be allowed to test their units within the comfort of their own home? Are you saying they should not be allowed to communicate and compare results?
Assuming it's not too subtle, I'll leave you to detect the irony in my statement when I say that I'm deeply sorry if the strife of these less fortunate A500 owners offends you in some way.
Furthermore, I'm also sorry that you don't understand a persons desire to "play" with his or her new toy without leaving the house. Perhaps it doesn't make much logical sense, but a hobbyists enthusiasm rarely does. You can take solace in knowing that you are not required to understand it. Nor are you required to be offended by it.
Cheers,
-PW
No I am not trolling what ever that even means. Granted I may have been a bit harsh with my comments but, my point is that they are expecting thier tablet to do something tha is simply isnt ment to do. they are complainin that its broke because it is not doing something that again it was not ment to do.
gps sat signals are not ment to be recieved indoors period. go take you gps out of your car and see if it dosent lose signal indoors. it will does that mean its broken? no My point sinply was that gps sat signals were never ment to be recieved indoors on any device thats why sat tv dishes and xm radios attenas are mounted outside. because sat signals either dont penatrate buildings at all or not very well if they did then there would be no need for external attenas for t.v and sat radio.
This is why if you want to play with you nav on your tablet there is a wifi assit mode for INDOORS.
I was simply stating people are complaining about something that wasent ment to work the way they assume it should.
I am in no way putting down anyone who has a defective a500 and from what i have read the new updates have fixed most all issues. i was simply stating that not being able to get gps indoors in not a defect nothing gets gps signal or a good gps signal indoors. my comments were directed to those persons.
same as the people who are complaining because no usb charging. well if they would read they would know thier tab has two yes two 3620 mah batteries that have a greater power consumption then what usb provides and cant be recharged by usb that same as about 98% of all other tablets on the market but yet there is post after post of people complaining and saying its a defect when its not.
why is it if someone points out the truth they get accussed of being a troll? just tring to inform is all because if you go and return your iconia for something else and guess what its not gonna get gps indoors either or charge from usb because thats the nature of the beast. not a defect just trying to help sorry i worded like i did im just blunt.
Now if you want to descuse defects how about acers software? anyone else find thier clear.fi not working? Im having to use third party soft to be a client to my nas because all thiers does is show pictures but not any other files.
But nobody in this thread complained about not getting a fix indoors, you implied we were. I think we all know that indoors is obviously not the most ideal place for GPS signals. The third A500 I had to return (1st DOA, 2nd bad mic) because it performed poorly when it was in my vehicle and not much better when outside. It definitely performed worse than the one it replaced - which I would have kept except it had a bad microphone. I tested it A LOT outdoors and in my vehicle. It always seemed quite slow to find satellites, let alone get a fix. I also tested a Xoom indoors and posted a video of the results, just to show how well that unit worked even under less than ideal conditions. It may be an apples and oranges comparison though since the GPS hardware is probably different. So I returned the third A500 and I have a 4th one now. The microphone is good and guess what, the GPS seems to work quite well. Not as good as the Xoom still, but my fixes are now done in seconds as opposed to minutes. I have not tested it in the car yet, but inside the house it's maintaining a fix with pretty good SNR numbers.
If you get a chance, check out the thread I posted about the web browser 'find on page' feature being broken in the latest 3.1 update. It has worked about twice in the 20 times I have tried it.
Rob