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Has anyone else noticed a lot of heat near the bottom buttons front and back?
Lieutenant_Dan said:
Has anyone else noticed a lot of heat near the bottom buttons front and back?
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Yep. I can feel it
Not any more so than on my Captivate.
Can you check and post your battery's temperature? (you can have it using System Panel or many other system apps). Had a Galaxy S (Canadian version - i9000M) before and the battery was sometimes as high as 50-55 Celsius, which may or may not have had something to do with the internal SD card dying on many models. Hopefully the big Atrix battery doesn't have this problem.
yea this thing is kinda hot
I agree. It is noticeably warm.
I think we'll generally see some extra warmth because of the h/w, but we also got to remember, we're playing none stop with these suckers since they're new! Most of my phones got warm often the first few days...
Between h/w breaking in , battery breaking in, and users breaking in... i'm thinking its a non-issue (hoping its a non-issue!!)
kenyu73 said:
I think we'll generally see some extra warmth because of the h/w, but we also got to remember, we're playing none stop with these suckers since they're new! Most of my phones got warm often the first few days...
Between h/w breaking in , battery breaking in, and users breaking in... i'm thinking its a non-issue (hoping its a non-issue!!)
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Yeah im thinking the same
I'd still like something a *little* more scientific, like battery temp...
I've noticed the same thing, it's noticeably warm on the bottom. If it was the battery temp itself, you'd expect that to make the upper center warm, where the battery sits.
My battery is running at 32 deg C...I'll have to crank up some apps and see if that changes drastically in proportion to the bottom of the phone heat. Right now it's sitting mostly idle and doesn't feel as warm as I have noticed when playing around with it for a while.
It's most likely where the heatsink is dispersing most of the heat from the processors and other components. Keep in mind this thing has a dual core processor. This isn't your TI-83 graphing calculator from high school.
novaIS350 said:
It's most likely where the heatsink is dispersing most of the heat from the processors and other components. Keep in mind this thing has a dual core processor. This isn't your TI-83 graphing calculator from high school.
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I don't think there is a "heat sink" http://tegradeveloper.nvidia.com/tegra/forum/heatsink-needed
ARM processors don't heat much, it has to be the battery that's causing this. Didn't know where the battery was, but it is kind of weird if the battery is near the top and the heat is near the bottom. Still sounds like a possible issue to me (I'm a heavy user - I *WILL* use it a lot every day, so it has to be able to "stand the heat"...)
I ran speedtest about 15 times in a row to get the phone to warm up. The battery is up to 37 deg c, the bottom of the phone is noticeably warmer than any spot on the battery.
the bottom edge of the battery is a good 1.5 inches away from the center of the "hot spot"on the bottom. I haven't seen a hardware tear down, but I'd guess there's nothing to worry about -It's not "hot", it's just warmer than the rest of the phone.
35c
my battery is running at 35c right now but is not where the heat i am feeling is located. This head is at the base of the phone near the bottom speaker.
Ok, well 30-something C seems fine to me. Could it be the LEDs used to light the buttons?
My nexus one got just about as warm if I played with it as much. So I don't find any issue with it.
http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Motorola-Atrix-4G-Teardown/4964/1
Damn near everything in the phone that can generate heat is located in the bottom third of the form factor. This should explain why we can feel it.
The battery is in upper back of the phone.
I think it should be the baseband chip or the Tegra2 that making heat.
When I use the phone its warm just like my Captivate although everyday on my 30 minutes drive to work the phone gets really hot. I have tried it with and without the charger in it and its just hot regardless. Anyone else have the same experience while using the GPS for extended periods of time.
sadly i don't have one of these elite-atrix which can stand massive overclocking without at some point reboot because of too much heat.
so i decided to do something against overheating.
what i did was tearing apart the atrix and removing the aluminium part covering the tegra II chip (and no this piece doesnt have any contact to the chip so it doesnt serve as heatspreader).
now i took some spare aftermarket ram cooler and grinded it down to the exact size of the chip.
next step was quite easy: just cut out some part of the inner plastic frame to have some space for the new built "cooler".
last but not least i just put a small drop of thermal paste onto that chip and pressed the new cooler on top. (sidenote: you shouldnt have to glue it. it will keep sticking there because of adhesion)
no i'm going to try wheather this has any effect at all gonna flash some 1.5/1.6 kernel and see if my atrix can handle the speed now
pictures and results follow soon (partly done)
btw any good app to log temps?
Here you go with some pictures (more to come):
Really cool. You are a brave one....
I might have to try it.
Thanks for the info.
Even running at stock speeds the heat management on this phone is horrendous. I actually think the overheating caused my digitizer problems.
Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF300T using XDA Premium HD app
Interesting, I hope you took some pictures. (and are willing to share!)
Hahaha, that's epic. Finally a real hardware mod for the atrix, please upload a picture!
Sent from my Atrix
I cant wait to see the pictures! XD
sorry mates, had no pc around and posting the first 10 times via tablet/smartphone is a pain in the ***
So the results are not that overwhelming but i'll surely try to figure out how to optimize all of this.
Results so far at stresstest
Clockspeed ..................................... Before ....................................... After
1000mhz max....................................working........................................ working
1300mhz max .........................reboot after some minutes..................... working
1450mhz max..........................reboot & bootloop soon.....................reboot after some minutes ... sometimes bootloop
as you can see there already is some slight increase of stability with overclocking, but i think that there can be done even more. just got to find a way how to squeeze even more heatsink into that little case without having to cut out any more will try with aluminium tape and also with some leftover copper heatsink soon
Copper should be better and maybe some holes in battery cover.
I hope that you're not going to try water cooling
no but got some copper heatpipes lying around XD
yes some holes in the cover would be better, but i really want to keep the outside stock.
well i also could also varnish some copper-plate into the backcover having contact to the heatsink on the cpu. so there would be a much bigger surface and of course allover masses. but i suppose if you hold this ting in your hand it would be too freaking hot. holding my finger down on that little heatsink while stresstesting can already be painfull. here i'm glad i got that plastic cover in between.
my plans are now to extend the heatsink over msdcard and simcard, since there is some good space left. maybe next days when i'll get home again
Actually copper plate into the backcover is great idea! Don't worry about heat because bigger surface and you still have plastic between heatsink and fingers
I did similar thing long time ago with zx spectrum
well then i need a really thin copper plate wich will not have that good effect on cooling, or i replace some area of the backcover with copper. then there would be heat issue (and aesthetic, too)
Try to find copper foil or easier aluminum foil. Just be careful to avoid electrical short circuit
Are you testing with or without the cover on?
What are you using to conduct the stress test?
I know you want to keep it stock, but an extended battery cover would give you lots of extra room and many have vents. Might even be able to squeeze a fan in there for active cooling!
atm i'm testing with back cover on. having stable oc only with back cover taken off doesnt make any sense since its unusable as daily driver.
i got some aluminium foil at home and some some fine copper plates.i'm sure i'll be able to work something out.
atm I'm using cm 7.2/miui hybrid with faux's 1450ghz 027b5 kernel. slightly undervolted.
mainly stresstesting with "StabilityTest". after about 10 mins of stresstesting i wouldn't get temps over 65°C still tweaking a bit, then i'll give some benchmarks a go and will see if i can get 1.6 ghz kernel running
still looking for some good tool for logging cpu temps or at least showing on screen/status baar. atm got to switch to setcpu and open cpu info tab to get some readouts.
I'm curious to see how 1.45Ghz kernel and tweaked stock rom will do in webtop-mode. hopefully this will be also run stable since webtop-charging also produces some extra heat. we'll see when i get my lapdock back from motorola ^^
extended back cover would be an option for space as long as i dont want to dock it to lapdock oder cardock, which i do multiple times a day. so no option for me.
i have also thought about adding a fan, but when i think about it, it's way to big, makes noise and drains even more juice. so this is a no-go.
if you would want to do extreme overclocking just for benchmarking this would be an option again. but then we would need a kernel with even higher clocks to get something groundbreaking...
so who starts with a LN2-cooled smartphone ?
Lol, fan is going to drain battery really fast. Only for extreme overclocking. Bigger heatsink, some holes or extended battery cover should be enough.
At the end he's going to overclock with liquid azote
Edit: system tuner pro could log data. Try it.
stresstesting @1450 faux kernel 027b5
while connected to a 1.6A charger and static 100% cpu-load i get temps of 86°C with the phone freezing.
got to play with some profiles here and maybe even more uv.
thanks for the tip with system tuner pro, looks promising. now i can get more accurate values and also log and see when the device crashes/reboots/freezes, etc
86°C is too much! Be careful, don't burn your phone
Zeljko1234 said:
86°C is too much! Be careful, don't burn your phone
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lol Could fry some egg and bacon on it!
be sure that i know its way too hot. i set up some profiles in setcpu and undervoltet a bit more.
i'm trying to peek at even while powercharging 65° but for that i will have to improve the heatsink. atm i still get about 72 with limit of 1200 when over 65
Anyone thought about raising the ouya with a fanned base mount of some kind, and creating some vents in the top to make the case a little wind tunnel. I mean it's great the processor has a heat sink and fan, but all that heat still needs an escape. anyone already working on something like this, or have thoughts on it?
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
bwild said:
Anyone thought about raising the ouya with a fanned base mount of some kind, and creating some vents in the top to make the case a little wind tunnel. I mean it's great the processor has a heat sink and fan, but all that heat still needs an escape. anyone already working on something like this, or have thoughts on it?
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
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Hey bwild... I just received my Ouya a few days ago and this was one of the many initial issues which i've noticed, especially when you launch a game and leave it sitting at the title screen for about 15 minutes. It heats up pretty well and if the ambient temp is 25c or higher then the little thing struggles to cool itself.
After opening mine up, i can see several points which cause me concern heat wise, and obviously the long term issues are potentially reducing the lifespan of the device as a whole.
1. Due to the size of the device internally, and the amount of air that the small fan can shift per minute and the lack of escape points for heat, the device warms up pretty quick as essentially the small cooler is just reusing warm air internally to try and cool the heatsink. There is no heat shielding on the inside of the case to isolate the board from the surrounding case so the entire device heats up but the only effective cooling part is the small heatsink. Its a REALLY bad design.
2. The mobo inside is mounted on its side, this forces the fan and heatsink to fire out warm air towards the vents at the top and the bottom of the case, well at least im sure they are 'Vents' . Im quite sure that this kind of heat build up and pressure makes it almost impossible to draw any kind of reasonably cooler air from the outside, inside. Any air being drawn in is already warm before it even hits the cooler. My Ouya does get noticeably warmer underneath the device but i also believe that this is due to the 4 small metal weights which sit right at the bottom of the case heating up as warm air is expelled downward from the heatsink... I'm thinking of removing these as they are acting as a small heater with cool air trying to enter the underside of the case. But i can test and let you know if theres any difference.
3. The unique shape of the Ouya doesnt help either i believe... Warm air being expelled downwards towards the bottom of the case, will naturally try and rise and move up the curved side of the case internally and then get drawn in by the cooler again, im no expert when it comes to these types of things but im pretty sure thats whats happening.
4. I've replaced the standard 40mm fan with an Akasa 40mm fan with slightly higher airflow rating (and a little more noise), Not sure if this again helps much due to the design but it should help to at least cool the device a little quicker once your return to the Ouya dashboard.
5. Something else that i noticed was that the heatsink is actually spread across what looks like the GPU and (What looks like) Memory Modules, i cant confirm this as it was a side on look and havent removed the heatsink (Yet). Again i noticed that the GPU sits on one half of the heatsink (the side which is closed to the bottom of the case actually) so im wandering if this heatsink is doing anything at all I'll see about removing this at some point and probably putting a highly polished copper shim on it with some better heat compound, silver or ceramic and see if this helps.
6. The underside of the motherboard, has no cooling or anything on there despite a memory module being present on the back but i dont think that this will cause any issues.
So will all of that in mind... i've set of to find a suitable cooler of some kind that wont require ear plugs or make the device levitate 2 inches from the surface its supposed to be sitting on.... Space is a real killer inside this so i think we are going to be limited to what can can do however i'll need to see if theres any way that i can change the airflow in the device to allow for cool air being drawn from underneath and the warm air being expelled from the top. Sounds simple but i dont think its going to be anything easy... Just by looking at the Ouya, i had the crazy idea of trying to mount a 80mm fan (Low Profile if such a thing exists) which has a low rpm which sits between the top of the case and the top lid where the power button is. There may be much pressure between the fan and top lid though so there would need to be some mods and see if i can get enough power.....
All of this sounds extreme for what it is but i hate warm devices
I came across this : http://www.ninjalane.com/reviews/motherboards/rampage3extreme/page4.aspx : which shows a small chipset cooler. This would allow you to mount is side ways with the fan obviously pointing towards the top of the case and flip the fan over so its draws air from underneath and out through the top. Its either something like that, or we start a watercooling ouya project LOL :highfive:
Well thats my 2c
I think the outside only gets warm because it metal if it were plastic no one would know.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
Ok.... Quick test there after work.
Removed the lid, played Shadowgun for about 30 minutes. Fan kicked in a couple of times, but when the fan kicked in for a 3rd time, I exited back to the dashboard and the fan stopped immediately.
Console was slightly cold to touch and the heatsink was roughly a little warmer to the touch so I'd say between 40 and 45c at the most. :thumbup:
Compared to last nights epic slaughter session on Shadow gun, the fan remained on for approximately 10 minutes with no system usage, just sitting at the dashboard as it tried to desperately cool itself.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
It's running a mobile cpu... won't it just throttle itself if it actually gets up to a dangerous temperature??
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
I agree mate yes... however i'm not sure if it does actually throttle itself? On an enclosed mobile i can see why thats required, on an open, air cooled device (albeit poorly) there wouldnt really be a requirement for throttling, unless they know it couldnt cool itself properly there any way we know for sure?
That aside though, the device will still take some time to cool down even when throttled as it will still generate heat
Personally if i am playing a game at 1080p, i'd rather not have to suffer from reduced quality when the device throttles due to poor design!
I did notice as well initially when i had a really good session on Shadowgun, that the frame rate on a 1080 monitor was dropping below 30fps and the textures didnt quite look as crisp, so maybe it does throttle. If thats the case, i'll play it with the lid off until i can stop it from overheating and lowering the core frequencies :good: I'll make this a little project and see how cold i can get it to run.
If i make any changes that i think are working, i'll post a few pics :highfive:
Im going to picking up a mini-itx case so i can not only rectify the cooling issue when running my roms , but also to permanantly install a usb hub and hard drive internally. I am growing accustomed to using this for media too, so a hard drive is a must. I will post some pictures and video as I move along with it.
Ramzes13 said:
Im going to picking up a mini-itx case so i can not only rectify the cooling issue when running my roms , but also to permanantly install a usb hub and hard drive internally. I am growing accustomed to using this for media too, so a hard drive is a must. I will post some pictures and video as I move along with it.
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played through shadow gun and the left over and the system stayed cool to the touch the fan did come on a few times
I stripped mine down again tonight and had a closer look at the PCB. Looks like the heatsink, which is soldered on, isnt flush. It rises slightly at the end where the CPU/GPU is so that's maybe why mines is a little warm. I can apply a little pressure to the high end and it does drop 1 maybe 2mm. So maybe my heatsink isn't as effective as it should be.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
Here is the simple rigging I came up with.
A 60mm case fan with some allen bolts for legs. Plugged into the ouya usb (I still need to split it so I don't loose a slot.)
The fan blows up through the bottom vents, I do intend to cut a couple extra slits in the top too.
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
Thingiverse has the plans for the ouya and others have likely moded it for better air flow if you have a 3D printer.
Sent from my DROID4 using xda app-developers app
The Old One said:
Thingiverse has the plans for the ouya and others have likely moded it for better air flow if you have a 3D printer.
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Click to collapse
This is what I'd ultimately want to do I have a design in my head for incorporating the fan inside the bottom of the case raising the board by the equivalent height and adding in just a spacer with additional venting, between the case and top cover.
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
bwild said:
Here is the simple rigging I came up with.
A 60mm case fan with some allen bolts for legs. Plugged into the ouya usb (I still need to split it so I don't loose a slot.)
The fan blows up through the bottom vents, I do intend to cut a couple extra slits in the top too.
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
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That's awesome mate!! :good: Do you get a noticeable difference with that fan?
it is noticeably cooler to the touch. I'll try to measure it somehow and update when I get a chance.
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium
So I picked up a dead sega dream cast at the flea market, got it home, gutted it, cleaned, and got most of it done. I was able to convert the sega push button power switch to a momentary and soldered the leads to the ouya main board. I hot glued the connection afterwords so it will stay (the power pins are tiny). I added two USB ports to the front and rear using a USB hub. I also mounted an hdmi coupler and m type power connector on the rear. I made a jumper cable to hook up power internally. I'm also looking into wiring up the stock dream cast cooling fan to use as side exhaust. I will update when i get the cooling sorted out. The point of doing this was to increase airflow in the case and make a more compact package for all of devices.
Ramzes13 said:
So I picked up a dead sega dream cast at the flea market, got it home, gutted it, cleaned, and got most of it done. I was able to convert the sega push button power switch to a momentary and soldered the leads to the ouya main board. I hot glued the connection afterwords so it will stay (the power pins are tiny). I added two USB ports to the front and rear using a USB hub. I also mounted an hdmi coupler and m type power connector on the rear. I made a jumper cable to hook up power internally. I'm also looking into wiring up the stock dream cast cooling fan to use as side exhaust. I will update when i get the cooling sorted out. The point of doing this was to increase airflow in the case and make a more compact package for all of devices.
View attachment 2098033View attachment 2098034View attachment 2098035View attachment 2098036View attachment 2098039
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Pretty cool, I considered doing this as well with a dreamcast, but won't have a chance till I buy another OUYA specifically to mod. Looking at it, I have 2 concerns. Your USB hub is almost wasted, isn't it? I mean the majority of USB ports are inside the case, or am I missing something? What about heat? With the OUYA in the middle, close to the top, wont it cause more heat? or do you think the second fan will fix that?
Have you thought about anything to do with the lid/cd area?
JLCollier2005 said:
Pretty cool, I considered doing this as well with a dreamcast, but won't have a chance till I buy another OUYA specifically to mod. Looking at it, I have 2 concerns. Your USB hub is almost wasted, isn't it? I mean the majority of USB ports are inside the case, or am I missing something? What about heat? With the OUYA in the middle, close to the top, wont it cause more heat? or do you think the second fan will fix that?
Have you thought about anything to do with the lid/cd area?
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I wanted the majority of the USB ports internal for use with the front USB ports and to add internal storage. You are correct about the pcb location and I'm going to make small vents above the fan inside the cd area for air intake. As it sits now heat isn't in issue yet. I mounted the pcb near the stock fan location so once I have that working it can pull air out more efficiently. Using a dream cast was great, I wish I did this in my spare Nintendo 64, but I didn't have the security tool yet (ordered last night). The n64 cartridge slot makes an amazing air intake, I will more than likely do it when I pick up another ouya ?.
So I got around to wiring up the stock dream cast fan to maximize air flow and moved the led from the pcb to the lid of the console so now the light can be seen.
The first picture is with the cd tray open to show the vents I had to create since the CPU fan sits below. In both pics you can see the light now works. I ordered right angle USB adapters last night and will update when they are installed.
...and so nothing falls into the system or the fan ...
I currently have a galaxy S2, I have a case on it pretty much 24/7. I want the Z3 compact as it is the best phone for people who want small phones. I love being able to do everything and reach all parts of my S2 with my hand, I cant do the same with these large 5inch + phones.
Anyway I am hearing reports of cracking on the back,front or even both sides of the phone. Am really scared, because I don't want to just splash out £350 and it breaks after a week. People have been getting cracks while having cases on it even, some people say it cracks while it is in the pocket just randomly.
Basically I really want this phone but I am worried about how easy it is to crack.
I've dropped mine from waist height twice now and had it fall in the crevices of my car seats. No screen protector, phone is still mint.
Sent from my D5803
HellzHere said:
I currently have a galaxy S2, I have a case on it pretty much 24/7. I want the Z3 compact as it is the best phone for people who want small phones. I love being able to do everything and reach all parts of my S2 with my hand, I cant do the same with these large 5inch + phones.
Anyway I am hearing reports of cracking on the back,front or even both sides of the phone. Am really scared, because I don't want to just splash out £350 and it breaks after a week. People have been getting cracks while having cases on it even, some people say it cracks while it is in the pocket just randomly.
Basically I really want this phone but I am worried about how easy it is to crack.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjDE8z-_bHU&noredirect=1
http://forums.androidcentral.com/samsung-galaxy-s3/193035-galaxy-s3-cracked-screen-defective-not-dropped.html
http://forums.androidcentral.com/samsung-galaxy-s-ii/132590-galaxy-s2-cracked-screen-normal.html
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1257090
http://bobmckay.com/life/case-samsung-galaxy-s4-screen-crack
http://support.t-mobile.com/thread/38170?tstart=0
Never buy another smartphone then since they all "have screens break for no reason".
Statistically the chance that yours will crack spontaneously is still very very small. These communities are really very misleading in trying to get a global image of how common a problem is. As I mentioned in another topic, if you were to walk into a hosptal, and make your conclusion about the human species purely based on what you saw in the hospital, you would conclude humans are very sick and crippled species. But once you leave the hospital, you see only healthy people everywhere you look.
My suggestion (also what I am planning on doing)... Wait until after November 3rd, for everyone to get their American Z3 Compact. check this forum a week after to see if the topics about the screen sporadically cracking jump substantially in activity.
If not, I will order by 11.10.14.
HellzHere said:
I currently have a galaxy S2, I have a case on it pretty much 24/7. I want the Z3 compact as it is the best phone for people who want small phones. I love being able to do everything and reach all parts of my S2 with my hand, I cant do the same with these large 5inch + phones.
Anyway I am hearing reports of cracking on the back,front or even both sides of the phone. Am really scared, because I don't want to just splash out £350 and it breaks after a week. People have been getting cracks while having cases on it even, some people say it cracks while it is in the pocket just randomly.
Basically I really want this phone but I am worried about how easy it is to crack.
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Click to collapse
Not true and do not believe everything you hear and read about this subject. The handling of these machines have to be prudent. If you drop a laptop on the floor for sure nonitor breaks.right.
dropped mine once
been a month approx. no crack nothing. im pretty careful tho..most of the time.
also, no case.
Just a suggestion, can everyone with such issues (or worry, like here) post in one of the dozen threads that already exist on that topic?
Guess that would help to keep the forum somewhat cleaner, thus more readable...
Our forum is a bit "undermoderated"
I'd say the chance of getting a spontaneous crack is about 1:1000 or even less. That would assume 0.1% of phones have the issue. That a far less chance than you going to prison this year (1:200) so I'd say don't worry about it.
HellzHere said:
I currently have a galaxy S2, I have a case on it pretty much 24/7. I want the Z3 compact as it is the best phone for people who want small phones. I love being able to do everything and reach all parts of my S2 with my hand, I cant do the same with these large 5inch + phones.
Anyway I am hearing reports of cracking on the back,front or even both sides of the phone. Am really scared, because I don't want to just splash out £350 and it breaks after a week. People have been getting cracks while having cases on it even, some people say it cracks while it is in the pocket just randomly.
Basically I really want this phone but I am worried about how easy it is to crack.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@HellzHere
Hi Hellz
Sorry but I've got a z3 compact and simply can't recommend it. That's a lot to like about it on paper but after mine experienced a modest fall onto carpet, which resulted in the back of the case cracking, I don't want others to suffer the upset that I have. The design is flawed IMO. The choice of materials are inappropriate for typical everyday usage.
Most of the high end xperias seem to use glass front and back . To me, this is insane. It creates a nice aesthetic but is significantly at the cost of practicality. The z3 compact doesn't use dragontail or gorilla glass... or at least Sony do not specify the materials used on their website beyond "tempered glass".
My previous phone was an HTC desire (yes the original one) and this has been dropped on occasion, onto pavements, etc, and one occasion in a carpark (for no other reason than it slipped out of my hand during use). I did not use a case with it and the worst that happened was a crack across one corner of the screen.
There is no way that the z3 compact could tolerate similar drops or falls. I do not consider myself to be careless with stuff but this new phone is a pain in the butt. For example, It WILL slip off surfaces, due to the low friction / high gloss nature of the handset.
If you are determined to get one, you MUST get a case for it.
I waited two years before a handset came on the market with the specifications that I was looking for. I am utterly gutted that mine is now broken, after only having it for a fortnight and it only being subjected to a very modest level of external stress. I did not even drop the phone - it slipped off a surface.
Then there is the issue of self-cracking. This is reasonably well documented and doesn't just apply to the z3 and z3 compact. Sony would have us believe that this only occurs in a small number of cases. I don't think it's common-place but it's happened to enough people for Sony to quietly repair stuff for free, under certain circumstances. Admittedly, Sony only really started doing this after two high profile UK consumer rights organisations / programmes got involved in the matter (watchdog and Which). The impression I get (from anecdotal evidence) is Sony does it grudgingly.
All I'll say is have a look at this xda-dev survey thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/z3-compact/general/sony-xperia-z3-z3-compact-glass-survey-t2900149
What I found interesting is that out of the 439 surveys, 26% reported back of case cracks, compared to 18% of the front screen.
However, of that 26%, over two thirds reported NO impact cracking i.e. there seems to be vastly more people who've experienced self-cracking than drop or fall damage.
Reviews also comment on the phone heating up A LOT during some forms of usage i.e. a possible reason for self-cracking.
Finally, from my personal experience, the camera sounds good on paper but underperforms. Some images look great yet I got pixellation on 20mb images in high light level conditions. I wasn't impressed. I also struggled to get the flash to illuminate a short distance, low light situation properly as well. More annoyingly, my friend had a galaxy S4 and her flash was virtually blindingly bright in the same situation. Then there's the issue about losing camera performance if you decide to root (apparently some of the low light level camera algorithms are DRM protected and the DRM keys get wiped when you root).
I just wouldn't go for a sony handset again - the phone design simply can't handle real-world stresses.
Just to be fair though, the screen's pretty good (in terms of brightness - you really can use it at minimal levels inside, which I'm sure helps massively with battery drain - I'm not commenting on resolution / PPI). I've found the battery performance to be simply great (probably the best feature for me). However, I'm realistic about usage (i.e. I don't have GPS, wireless and data on unless I need it, I typically pop phone into airplane mode overnight, etc - for me the biggest drains on batteries come from the display and the cellular radio). I got 4 days out of it, with approximately 40 mins worth of charging (because of wired syncing with my desktop). Admittedly for the last 30% of battery I put it onto stamina mode. Note this wasn't high level usage, just phonecalls, texts, some browsing, twitter, some facebook / youtube... but definitely not constant, screen-active usage.
The CPU's pretty strong too. Transitions between homescreens is super slick. I've not had slow down at any point. I haven't tried playing games with it though, beyond low-graphically taxing apps. Not too much bloatware and you can disable certainly some of it. Charging is good on it. I've got copilot as my satnav on it and a 1A car charger still produced a net positive charge rate (even though the sony charger is 1.5A). Charging from empty to full, with phone switched off is around 2.5 hours.
I hope this helps you a bit.
Cheers,
Gary
gazzawazza said:
@HellzHere
Hi Hellz
Sorry but I've got a z3 compact and simply can't recommend it. That's a lot to like about it on paper but after mine experienced a modest fall onto carpet, which resulted in the back of the case cracking, I don't want others to suffer the upset that I have. The design is flawed IMO. The choice of materials are inappropriate for typical everyday usage.
Most of the high end xperias seem to use glass front and back . To me, this is insane. It creates a nice aesthetic but is significantly at the cost of practicality. The z3 compact doesn't use dragontail or gorilla glass... or at least Sony do not specify the materials used on their website beyond "tempered glass".
My previous phone was an HTC desire (yes the original one) and this has been dropped on occasion, onto pavements, etc, and one occasion in a carpark (for no other reason than it slipped out of my hand during use). I did not use a case with it and the worst that happened was a crack across one corner of the screen.
There is no way that the z3 compact could tolerate similar drops or falls. I do not consider myself to be careless with stuff but this new phone is a pain in the butt. For example, It WILL slip off surfaces, due to the low friction / high gloss nature of the handset.
If you are determined to get one, you MUST get a case for it.
I waited two years before a handset came on the market with the specifications that I was looking for. I am utterly gutted that mine is now broken, after only having it for a fortnight and it only being subjected to a very modest level of external stress. I did not even drop the phone - it slipped off a surface.
Then there is the issue of self-cracking. This is reasonably well documented and doesn't just apply to the z3 and z3 compact. Sony would have us believe that this only occurs in a small number of cases. I don't think it's common-place but it's happened to enough people for Sony to quietly repair stuff for free, under certain circumstances. Admittedly, Sony only really started doing this after two high profile UK consumer rights organisations / programmes got involved in the matter (watchdog and Which). The impression I get (from anecdotal evidence) is Sony does it grudgingly.
All I'll say is have a look at this xda-dev survey thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/z3-compact/general/sony-xperia-z3-z3-compact-glass-survey-t2900149
What I found interesting is that out of the 439 surveys, 26% reported back of case cracks, compared to 18% of the front screen.
However, of that 26%, over two thirds reported NO impact cracking i.e. there seems to be vastly more people who've experienced self-cracking than drop or fall damage.
Reviews also comment on the phone heating up A LOT during some forms of usage i.e. a possible reason for self-cracking.
Finally, from my personal experience, the camera sounds good on paper but underperforms. Some images look great yet I got pixellation on 20mb images in high light level conditions. I wasn't impressed. I also struggled to get the flash to illuminate a short distance, low light situation properly as well. More annoyingly, my friend had a galaxy S4 and her flash was virtually blindingly bright in the same situation. Then there's the issue about losing camera performance if you decide to root (apparently some of the low light level camera algorithms are DRM protected and the DRM keys get wiped when you root).
I just wouldn't go for a sony handset again - the phone design simply can't handle real-world stresses.
Just to be fair though, the screen's pretty good (in terms of brightness - you really can use it at minimal levels inside, which I'm sure helps massively with battery drain - I'm not commenting on resolution / PPI). I've found the battery performance to be simply great (probably the best feature for me). However, I'm realistic about usage (i.e. I don't have GPS, wireless and data on unless I need it, I typically pop phone into airplane mode overnight, etc - for me the biggest drains on batteries come from the display and the cellular radio). I got 4 days out of it, with approximately 40 mins worth of charging (because of wired syncing with my desktop). Admittedly for the last 30% of battery I put it onto stamina mode. Note this wasn't high level usage, just phonecalls, texts, some browsing, twitter, some facebook / youtube... but definitely not constant, screen-active usage.
The CPU's pretty strong too. Transitions between homescreens is super slick. I've not had slow down at any point. I haven't tried playing games with it though, beyond low-graphically taxing apps. Not too much bloatware and you can disable certainly some of it. Charging is good on it. I've got copilot as my satnav on it and a 1A car charger still produced a net positive charge rate (even though the sony charger is 1.5A). Charging from empty to full, with phone switched off is around 2.5 hours.
I hope this helps you a bit.
Cheers,
Gary
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When drawing conclusions from that survey, you should not ignore that fact that people are far more likely to post about their dissatisfaction than about their satisfaction, meaning that people who are having issues with their device are far more widely respresented on the internet than people who are not having any issues. So if, in that survey, only 17 % of participants had their front glass crack, and 27% had their back glass crack, then the real-world percentages are likely FAR lower than those in the survey and it's all because people with faulty devices are FAR more likely to find the survey than people with devices that don't have any faults.
I've had this phone for a month now and still nothing has cracked. The phone hasn't overheated either. It does feel warm at times, maybe even more than most other phones but that is because glass conducts heat to your skin much faster than plastic does.
I doubt that the design is bad; a faulty batch of glass is a much more likely explanation.
degraaff said:
When drawing conclusions from that survey, you should not ignore that fact that people are far more likely to post about their dissatisfaction than about their satisfaction, meaning that people who are having issues with their device are far more widely respresented on the internet than people who are not having any issues. So if, in that survey, only 17 % of participants had their front glass crack, and 27% had their back glass crack, then the real-world percentages are likely FAR lower than those in the survey and it's all because people with faulty devices are FAR more likely to find the survey than people with devices that don't have any faults.
I've had this phone for a month now and still nothing has cracked. The phone hasn't overheated either. It does feel warm at times, maybe even more than most other phones but that is because glass conducts heat to your skin much faster than plastic does.
I doubt that the design is bad; a faulty batch of glass is a much more likely explanation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the response @degraaff
Regarding the survey - I get your point but the survey responses did surprise me with the number of users NOT reporting problems. I felt that made the survey far more realistic that, say, typical forum posts, where complaints and problems are more likely to be documented than positive experiences .
My personal experience regarding heat is that the phone has been pretty cool for the vast majority of the time but did experience some noticeable localised heat last night, for no apparent reason - phone had powered up but I had no additional elements active (i.e. wireless, GPS, data, etc, weren't active). I'd expect a relationship between component activity and heat generated. Also, it was noticeable because I'd not noticed it previously.
Regarding the design, I'm sorry but using thin glass on something that is likely to experience impact damage is bad or at very least highly unrealistic design. There's no need to use glass on the rear of a phone, certainly not for visual requirements (i.e. it's not a display). It's an aesthetics and presumably weight decision. I guess it would help radio performance (although I don't know where the antenna is). I believe metal typically attenuates radio signals, so glass would be a good alternative. I guess it comes down to how much priority one gives to the durability of a phone though.
I rang Sony about an hour ago and they gave me a ballpark figure of £40 for repairing the back. This was based on the rep's experience with the cost of replacing a Z2 rear panel. Still a very costly lesson and I think Sony or resellers need to warn customers about the benefits of case protection, given the materials used in construction. I know I'll get flak for saying this (ridiculously unrealistic) but I'd like to think that a retailer (or Sony, if they had the balls to do this) saying "for god's sake, get a protective case for this phone as it's literally made of glass" would lead to more customers respecting them. After all, Sony chose to use glass in the main panel construction. They could even charge a wee bit more and just bundle a case in with the phone. That would potentially cover them and give end-users a choice about protecting their phone from first use.
Cheers,
Gary
gazzawazza said:
It's an aesthetics and presumably weight decision. I guess it would help radio performance (although I don't know where the antenna is). I believe metal typically attenuates radio signals, so glass would be a good alternative. I guess it comes down to how much priority one gives to the durability of a phone though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sony puts an Apple-esqe priority on industrial design, so one shouldn't be surprised to see them trading ruggedness for aesthetics. Without moving the antennas to the phone body (which is encumbered by several patents), you need a non-metallic back for good RF performance. In addition to looks/feel, glass is vastly superior to plastic for it's thermal properties. It conducts heat 5 - 10 times better than most structural plastics. In a design as compact as the Z3C that is actually a significant technical advantage. That also means that users will notice short duration heat spikes (typically due to the radios having to drive RF power way up to cut through temporary interference) much more than with a plastic housed phone.
The reports of rear glass breakage do appear to be statistically significant, even after you factor in the self-selecting aspect of the survey. But this seems more like an issue with material or production quality, or perhaps insufficient design margin for CTE (coefficient of thermal expansion) mismatches. My Nexus 4 with a glass back has survived two years of use and a half dozen drops with nothing more than the standard Google bumper for protection. So glass can be used effectively. It will be interesting to see if later production Z3Cs (Sony US is expected to start shipping phones next week) fare better than early production.
kopsis said:
Sony puts an Apple-esqe priority on industrial design, so one shouldn't be surprised to see them trading ruggedness for aesthetics. Without moving the antennas to the phone body (which is encumbered by several patents), you need a non-metallic back for good RF performance. In addition to looks/feel, glass is vastly superior to plastic for it's thermal properties. It conducts heat 5 - 10 times better than most structural plastics. In a design as compact as the Z3C that is actually a significant technical advantage. That also means that users will notice short duration heat spikes (typically due to the radios having to drive RF power way up to cut through temporary interference) much more than with a plastic housed phone.
The reports of rear glass breakage do appear to be statistically significant, even after you factor in the self-selecting aspect of the survey. But this seems more like an issue with material or production quality, or perhaps insufficient design margin for CTE (coefficient of thermal expansion) mismatches. My Nexus 4 with a glass back has survived two years of use and a half dozen drops with nothing more than the standard Google bumper for protection. So glass can be used effectively. It will be interesting to see if later production Z3Cs (Sony US is expected to start shipping phones next week) fare better than early production.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey @kopsis
thanks for the input mate.
Just for assistance to others, my manufacture was 14w37 (might have mentioned that earlier) but just for reference.
Not sure that early production comment makes me feel better #labrat :crying: Obviously understand what you mean though.
Have to say z3 compact does feel good in the hand. Really like the way Sony have somehow made the edges (not sides) grippy without being sharp. Pretty easy to hold phone and I reckon the size is just right for one-handed use, although I do have to re-grip with hand to reach farthest corner (top left, as I'm right handed) of screen.
Out of curiosity, when you say bumper, is that just side protection or back too?
Cheers,
Gary
gazzawazza said:
the survey responses did surprise me with the number of users NOT reporting problems. I felt that made the survey far more realistic
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a flawed argumentum a contrario.
gazzawazza said:
Out of curiosity, when you say bumper, is that just side protection or back too?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The original N4 bumper was sides only, though the lip extended a millimeter or two beyond the glass in front and back so the glass wouldn't make contact in a low drop to a smooth flat surface. https://play.google.com/store/devices/details/Nexus_4_Bumper_Black?id=nexus_4_bumper_black&hl=en
It does beg the question, if you're going to sell a phone with glass on both sides, why not have something like this available at launch for the cautious buyers? Even the design purists at Apple made a bumper available upon release of their first front/back glass design (iPhone 4). It doesn't even have to be a great design (leave the aftermarket room to innovate) as long as it gives buyer's a usable option while waiting for something better. Hey, Sony -- PM me if you'd like me to come lead your mobile products division
Iruwen said:
That's a flawed argumentum a contrario.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
is this really relevant?
I simply felt that rather than having a survey chock full of negativity, the fact that we had a strong majority of responses which DIDN'T cite problems was indicative that perhaps the survey was more rounded than one might have anticipated.
I would accept on reflection that we don't know whether the distribution of answers is a true reflection of total owners' experiences. Obviously a bigger sample would make the stats more credible.
---------- Post added at 11:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:42 PM ----------
kopsis said:
The original N4 bumper was sides only, though the lip extended a millimeter or two beyond the glass in front and back so the glass wouldn't make contact in a low drop to a smooth flat surface. https://play.google.com/store/devices/details/Nexus_4_Bumper_Black?id=nexus_4_bumper_black&hl=en
It does beg the question, if you're going to sell a phone with glass on both sides, why not have something like this available at launch for the cautious buyers? Even the design purists at Apple made a bumper available upon release of their first front/back glass design (iPhone 4). It doesn't even have to be a great design (leave the aftermarket room to innovate) as long as it gives buyer's a usable option while waiting for something better. Hey, Sony -- PM me if you'd like me to come lead your mobile products division
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
agreed. Btw Mr VP Sony Mobile division, perhaps encourage your designers to NOT use glass too Ty very much
HellzHere said:
I currently have a galaxy S2, I have a case on it pretty much 24/7. I want the Z3 compact as it is the best phone for people who want small phones. I love being able to do everything and reach all parts of my S2 with my hand, I cant do the same with these large 5inch + phones.
Anyway I am hearing reports of cracking on the back,front or even both sides of the phone. Am really scared, because I don't want to just splash out £350 and it breaks after a week. People have been getting cracks while having cases on it even, some people say it cracks while it is in the pocket just randomly.
Basically I really want this phone but I am worried about how easy it is to crack.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We have same question... and still investigate from many Forum Post... I hope I got better answer to pick this phone or not...
worry not dear friends, apparently the guys at another thread has managed to get the people at evolutive labs to make the rhino shield crash guard bumper for the xperia z3 compact!
evolutive labs did one for iphone previously and it got so many backers/pledgers for it....hopefully we can do the same for this one..so come and join in the fun peeps! they need to get 1400 pre-orders before they can start production of this wonderful thing
(sorry you have to edit the link as i could not post url)
Rhino Shield Crash Guard Bumper for iPhone: https www kickstarter.com/projects/1081571316/rhinosheild-crash-guard-slim-impact-bumper-for-iph
PRE-ORDER HERE:
Rhino Shield Crash Guard Bumper for Z3 Compact: http www evolutivelabs.com/pages/crashguard-sony-z3-compact
Found while researching the 5X bootloop of DEATH.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV8_hsua4vo
Maybe too much paste and looks like in translation .8mm copper plate was used.
Any comments regarding this relatively simple mod.
omgdwong said:
Found while researching the 5X bootloop of DEATH.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV8_hsua4vo
Maybe too much paste and looks like in translation .8mm copper plate was used.
Any comments regarding this relatively simple mod.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the square cover you used, is the same as the cutter cutter?
Enviado desde mi Nexus 5X mediante Tapatalk
I bought these copper shims: http://www.ebay.com/itm/261704004472
15mmx15mmx0.3-5-8-1, think I'm going to try just putting a 0.5mm shim on the CPU with some paste, none on the screen side, I don't want the area of the screen there getting too hot - the copper itself should act as a good heatsink
Why? The only thing this device needs is 4 gb RAM mod. Nothing else.
Sinistersky said:
Why? The only thing this device needs is 4 gb RAM mod. Nothing else.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
because putting a copper chim on the back of the CPU that overheats is a good temporary fix until I can organize shipping my phone to china? I'm talking to [email protected] in PM about it but it's hard because his english isn't very good. he says $200 without shipping for 128gb internal storage upgrade and 2gb-4gb ram upgrade.
paradoxiumwind said:
because putting a copper chim on the back of the CPU that overheats is a good temporary fix until I can organize shipping my phone to china? I'm talking to [email protected] in PM about it but it's hard because his english isn't very good. he says $200 without shipping for 128gb internal storage upgrade and 2gb-4gb ram upgrade.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let me know how that goes, as I would be very interested. I love the 5x, but there are a number of limitations that are starting to peek out.
16GB storage
2GB ram
CPU is fast enough for me, but overheats and throttles
Battery lasts ~4 hours SOT
If I could upgrade to 128GB, 4GB, cool the CPU with a copper shim and some modding, and then swap my old battery for an LG G2 3,000 mah one, I could see myself using this phone for several more years!
Or at least until Android P comes out, and I get upgrade envy.
I just finished this in the morning. Initially I got the idea from here: youtu.be/mV8_hsua4vo.
Used a 1mm thick, 15 x 15 mm copper pad that I bought locally, I couldn't get a 0.8mm one and waiting for an order from Aliexpress for such a tiny item is not my thing since our national post is a mess and it adds up like a week to an already huge delivery time.
So I sanded down the 1mm one to about probably 0.8, just enough so the board is not floating on it and the contacts for the ear piece are fine.
Removed the factory yellow pad, cut the thin foil off of the metal shield, slammed some DeepCool thermal compound that I had laying around and pieced it back together.
All I can tell you is that I can't get the CPU temp past 52°C. Tried all the trending benchmarks on the PlayStore, max brightness, streaming Play Music over bluetooth to my headphones, you name it.
That 52 is peak, doesn't stay there, at idle it ends up around 30 to 32 and some casual browsing with mid brightness goes up to around 40.
So the most is runs at when gaming or doing heavy tasks is between 40 and 50. Which is a massive improvement over stock temperatures and even better than the thermal config that I used to run (see bellow).
Worth mentioning that I'm running the extremeV4 thermal config, throttling temp at 51, EX Kernel with Heimdall_5x_v4 profile for the interactive governor.
The screen is NOT getting too hot, in fact it used to get hotter before, without the copper pad.
Sorry I don't have any photos, but I don't have another camera, just an old GoPro H3+B - useless.
Tried this too. Didn't seem to do much though.. Tried this test and CPU didn't reach even close to 40 degrees Celsius. Weird thing was that the two faster cores quickly went offline after starting the test though..
EDIT: I used a 1 mm thick thermal pad but now notice a blue spot around the cpu. I can also see a curvature in the screen under the right lighting. Maybe the thermal pad is too thick? I figured a 1 mm pad could be squished down to 0.8 mm if it would be too thick..
I just saved mine via fastboot with a modified img but having two disabled cores bothers me. I thought about replacing the motherboard or upgrading/replacing the two cores to a new one with 4gb ram and then adding the heat sink. Do you guys think it's worth it or should I just leave it be
Hi,
i made the mod a few days ago. i used a 0,8mm 15 x 15 mm copper pad.
It works great.
But today i used gps the first time since the mod and got a big problem. I was driving with maps und a had a few seconds gps then searching for gps then a few seconds gps and searching again.
Anyone alse noticed some problems with gps after this mod?
Or any ideas what could happend?
I had the same issue with GPS, seems like only done encounter the issue. I just had to get a new thermal pad. Found some Arctic thermal pad that is .5mm thick and used that.
Here is a post of mine in another thread
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=75586886&postcount=26
the_desaster said:
Hi,
i made the mod a few days ago. i used a 0,8mm 15 x 15 mm copper pad.
It works great.
But today i used gps the first time since the mod and got a big problem. I was driving with maps und a had a few seconds gps then searching for gps then a few seconds gps and searching again.
Anyone alse noticed some problems with gps after this mod?
Or any ideas what could happend?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
octavioromo said:
I had the same issue with GPS, seems like only done encounter the issue. I just had to get a new thermal pad. Found some Arctic thermal pad that is .5mm thick and used that.
Here is a post of mine in another thread
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=75586886&postcount=26
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok thank you. seems like not everyone got this problem.
i will try to press the backcover a bit on the mainboard next time.
if that doesnt help i try with the thermal pad or maybe a thinner copper pad.
are your temps better with the pad than original?
I couldn't use the copper pad at all, and it wasn't a clearance issue. I tried a thinner shim and I had the same issue. Send like there is some sensor or something that gets blocked by using a metal shim. I used CPU throttling test and it said performance improved by about 10 percent or so. But in real world it's a bit better but essentially couldn't use the copper pad.
octavioromo said:
I couldn't use the copper pad at all, and it wasn't a clearance issue. I tried a thinner shim and I had the same issue. Send like there is some sensor or something that gets blocked by using a metal shim. I used CPU throttling test and it said performance improved by about 10 percent or so. But in real world it's a bit better but essentially couldn't use the copper pad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have the copper pad in there and I use Strava and Google Maps almost every day but never had a GPS problem.
I still believe you are encountering a problem with the antennas' pins not making contact with the board.
There just can't be any shielding or any problem from the copper pad, since the whole back of the display is a big chunk of aluminum that would mess the GPS even more if that would be the problem.
RO.maniac said:
There just can't be any shielding or any problem from the copper pad, since the whole back of the display is a big chunk of aluminum that would mess the GPS even more if that would be the problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
makes sense... but than an 0.8mm copper shim seems to be to thick.
i dont used to much thermal paste...
do you know which of the pins on the backcover are for gps-antenna?
maybe i can try to improve the contact.
if that doenst work i will try an thermal pad.
Desaster
This only works with the stock rom?
Rojas2018 said:
This only works with the stock rom?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WTF this is a simple mod to improve cooler, hardware is not changed so it work with any rom
[GS] said:
WTF this is a simple mod to improve cooler, hardware is not changed so it work with any rom
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cool!
Paste
Is it necessary to use thermal paste, or can I use glue?
I just took out the copper pad because I lost all gps signal and after troubleshooting every other possible cause, I went with the "rumour" that the pad is causing interference. And oh man, it does!
I have no idea how my gps worked for like 8 months, since I got the mod in. Still, Strava was losing signal here and there, generating zig-zag lines, but I blamed it on the app.
Now everything is fine, I get signal from at least 6 fixed satellites and Strava is super stable.
I guess I'm back in line to get the bootloop now, the SoC is back running in the 70s and 80s C.
So I think you can forget about this mod unless you don't care about proper gps signal.