Prolonged Battery Charging ~ Yes, I believe it is Safe - Galaxy S I9000 General

Prior to getting the Galaxy S, after I read what Samsung were saying in the manual of not to overcharge, I investigated the reasons and wrote in various topics on the battery and the differences between Li-Ion & Li-Pol battery types.
At that point with all the evidence found it made sense to believe that what Samsung were saying in not to overcharge was accurate.
Basically, at that time it was believed the phone used a Li-Pol, Li-Pol batteries are different in that they are 'wet cell' as opposed to Li-Ion which are 'dry cell' charged.
Li-Pol can be manufactured much thinner but can not be manufactured in different shapes.
This is to allow the wet cells whilst under charge which become hot to move around the battery freely. If a Li-Pol was manufactured in different shapes like Li-Ion it would create a 'hot-spot' in an area where the wet cell could not move fluidly around the remainder of the battery.
However, it has now come to light that this is not the case and that the batteries provided with the phone are indeed Li-Ion.
Anyway, moving on to the present.......
After now getting the phone and doing a bit of testing I have found the overcharging issue NOT to be an issue.
When you commence a charge on the phone the icon changes to a charge state.
However, once the battery has reached maximum charge capacity the battery icon automatically changes to a 'Non-Charge' state and then the phone simply runs off it's own battery. This is despite the phone is still connected to the charger.... It's just that the charger although still attached is no longer charging the battery.
As soon as the battery falls below a certain figure (I've had different figures ranging from 98% right down to 91% which is probably due to whatever the phone is doing at that particular time to wake the phone up from realizing "hey, you are still attached to a charger, now wake up and start charging again").
So to all of us who have been worried about overcharging, my personal advise is to NOT worry and charge as and when you feel the need.
Hope this helps.
Beards

Thanks for clear up, I was always been scared while charging that it may blow up.

Nice find!

However, it has now come to light that this is not the case and that the batteries provided with the phone are indeed Li-Ion.
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When you say "it has come to light", what do you mean? Is it just your deduction from your battery tests, or did you see this info from Samsung?
From what I understood, the LI-Pol overcharging is an issue in theory, but in real life applications its not a problem as long as you use the charger that is designed with LiPol in mind, it will auto shutoff charging once it senses the battery is full.

I have just charged mine from bone empty to full. A notification came up stating that the battery was full and to disconnect the charger. Although the battery monitor app says it is not charging and the normal battery meter has gone solid.
I agree that it seems to stop the charging circuit. Although I thought we were getting LiPo not li ion for these as well it's definitely li ion though.

Morbo66 said:
When you say "it has come to light", what do you mean? Is it just your deduction from your battery tests, or did you see this info from Samsung?
From what I understood, the LI-Pol overcharging is an issue in theory, but in real life applications its not a problem as long as you use the charger that is designed with LiPol in mind, it will auto shutoff charging once it senses the battery is full.
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Take the battery out and turn it over. Now read the battery type and you will see it says Li-Ion.

if such, it will reduce the re-charge cycle....
i suggest, power off the phone and then keep charge overnight will be safe....
otherwise, if it is on and charges only full then disconnect it

hkfriends said:
if such, it will reduce the re-charge cycle....
i suggest, power off the phone and then keep charge overnight will be safe....
otherwise, if it is on and charges only full then disconnect it
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Click to collapse
Modern battery's don't have cycles where you loose power by continuously topping up the battery.
The practice I use is I charge whenever I get the chance, then after around 30 charges I run it right down and do a full charge.
As to powering off the phone to charge, this is not always convenient.
I need my phone on all the time in case I get an emergency call-out and I'm sure there are others who need their phones on overnight to use as a morning alarm.
Finally, I'm not sure if the practice you mention in powering off the phone and charging overnight would have the same effect in being able to re-charge when the battery level drops.
I think doing it in your method the charger would continuously hit the battery regardless as to whether or not it is fully charged ~ which in effect is what Samsung are saying in not to overcharge.

Beards said:
...once the battery has reached maximum charge capacity the battery icon automatically changes to a 'Non-Charge' state and then the phone simply runs off it's own battery. This is despite the phone is still connected to the charger.... It's just that the charger although still attached is no longer charging the battery.
As soon as the battery falls below a certain figure (I've had different figures ranging from 98% right down to 91% which is probably due to whatever the phone is doing at that particular time to wake the phone up from realizing "hey, you are still attached to a charger, now wake up and start charging again").
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Click to collapse
To me it seems like the phone will NOT use the battery as long as it is plugged in. On my phone the battery meter never drops under 100 % when connected.

Beards said:
Modern battery's don't have cycles where you loose power by continuously topping up the battery.
The practice I use is I charge whenever I get the chance, then after around 30 charges I run it right down and do a full charge.
As to powering off the phone to charge, this is not always convenient.
I need my phone on all the time in case I get an emergency call-out and I'm sure there are others who need their phones on overnight to use as a morning alarm.
Finally, I'm not sure if the practice you mention in powering off the phone and charging overnight would have the same effect in being able to re-charge when the battery level drops.
I think doing it in your method the charger would continuously hit the battery regardless as to whether or not it is fully charged ~ which in effect is what Samsung are saying in not to overcharge.
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AFAIK, the reason to fully deplete the battery is to properly calibrate the % remaining in your battery. Running your battery down to empty causes more stress to the phone than running it down 50%. I happened to get a free battery with my device, but I would've bought a spare if I didn't get a free one, so I can easily go 3-5 days depending on usage, during this time I have my house and work to do charges. However, let's say I were to be expecting to have less frequent charges, such as taking a vacation, prior to that I would be fully depleting the battery to 0% to calibrate because then the battery level is more important to me. The trade off of long-term life vs short term accuracy is a very easy decision for me to make due to my situation.
In older batteries you had to "use the cells or lose them" situation where it was better, to at least occasionally, completely run down the device rather than doing partial cycles. These days, charging @ 50% 2 times is equivalent to 1 cycle of 100% with less long-term "stress" to the battery.
borchgrevink said:
To me it seems like the phone will NOT use the battery as long as it is plugged in. On my phone the battery meter never drops under 100 % when connected.
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Same for me.

The reason it tells you to unplug the charger when done charging has nothing to do with battery. It is to save power. Battery chargers still draw some power just because they are plugged in. And in these green times it is ofcourse very popular to have warnings everywhere so you can claim to a green company. And every lithium ion and polymer battery contains electronics designed to protect them from abuse. Including over charging. So that will never be a problem on any phone unless you have a defective battery.

Is there a way to disable the message telling you to unplug the charger? I charge my phone overnight and use it as a clock, but when I wake up in the morning and try to see the time there's this huge popup in the middle of the screen telling me my battery has charged.

Joans said:
Is there a way to disable the message telling you to unplug the charger? I charge my phone overnight and use it as a clock, but when I wake up in the morning and try to see the time there's this huge popup in the middle of the screen telling me my battery has charged.
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I think I read that the newest, or maybe just a random middle since something has superseded it, firmware fixed this.

interesting topic thx Beards for sharing your insights.

Overcharging - read the manual
Guys, if you will read the manual that came with your SGS, it says there that "DO NOT OVERCHARGE YOUR BATTERY FOR MORE THAN TWO WEEKS". It obviously means that the battery can be overcharged for more than a day as long as it is not more than 2 weeks ( I doubt if someone will be able to do that). So that confirms also that we can recharge anytime and not necessarily have it done to zero before charging. Hope this helps also

i've pretty much quit worrying about the overcharge after the first month of usage
i was following the auto pop up message, just because i wanted to conserve battery
but having 3 spare battery made me though it's futile
and it was extreme annoying to wakeup in the middle of the night, just to unplug it
it was awesome the day i found that patch on the forum to disable the annoying pop up alert that your battery is full.
now i can sleep the whole night without the alert coming online, and rest at ease knowing if the phone actually alerts me, it'll be a phone call or something important, not some annoying "unplug me plz!" message

Related

This is why your battery drops 10-15% in the first 20 minutes.

Plain and simple: When the Evo is fully charged, it begins running off its battery until you plug it back in. It DOES NOT trickle charge whatsoever after it reaches 100%. When you're using your Evo on the charger, and it's showing full 100% charge, it is running off the battery, not the AC plug. And then when you unplug it, well, we all know what happens next. The battery meter drops insanely fast to the actual charge of the battery, which could be very low, depending on how long it's been sitting idle at 100% on your charger.
So all those times you've charged your Evo overnight, only to take it to work the next day and be at 80% within an hour? Your Evo was running off its battery for what I'm guessing was most of the night. It takes my Evo about an hour to two hours to fully charge back to 100%. Let's say you put your Evo on the charger at 11PM, it'll reach full charge by 1AM at the latest, and then run off its battery until whenever you take it off the charger in the morning.
Workarounds?
1) Turn your Evo off while it's charging.
2) If you must leave it on for an alarm clock, put it in airplane mode and end all CPU intensive tasks to minimize battery drain.
3) When you wake up, unplug it for 10-20 minutes (still experimenting with this number), and then plug it back in to top it off. Once it reaches 100%, take it off the charger, and go about your day.
Try it out for yourself. When your Evo is 100% charged, take it off the charger immediately, and I highly doubt you will lose the 10%-15% within minutes. Please share your findings.
Er... Point of note, mine does it even if I pull it off the charger right when it turns green.
Post some technical schematic or other type of proof that shows that this circuitry isn't available in the EVO. That will prove beyond a doubt if what your saying is true.
That being said, only a group of the most retarded electrical engineers would design a charging system as you've described. It is INSANELY easy to build Li-Polymer charging circuitry that does the following (and it pretty much has to do these):
1. Detects battery temperature, and disables charging as a protective measure. In an emergency case it should shut off the device it's powering to allow the battery to cool down. This is a design requirement, or else your house burns down as you dump water on a Lithium fire thinking it's going to put it out. If you have a HERO, you can easily test this. Running the wireless tethering, GPS/Navigation, and Music with the screen running heats up the phone a ton. You'll notice the status light blink green once, then red a couple of times. This means that it's plugged in but not charging. Cool the phone down and it turns solid red again (charging).
2. Disable charging cycle when battery reaches a certain voltage. VERY SIMPLE voltage detection circuitry! The designer can of course adjust a gap to have charging turn back on when it dips below a certain voltage. Usually since this circuitry can be made with a decent amount of precision, that "turn back on" voltage ends up being roughly when the battery discharges to maybe 99.5%. That's just a guess, I admit but there's no harm in having the circuit switch on and off, even if it's often.
There are also a few other circuits that prevent the cell from blowing up in your pocket, like a current sensor to prevent an overcurrent. There's also some stuff that prevents you from being able to discharge the cell below it's avalanche voltage. In case you don't know what that is, when a Li-Ion battery discharges to a certain voltage, it avalanches to 0 (quickly falls). If it hits that point, you've pretty much ruined the battery and it will never charge the same again.
Anyway, this is stuff they taught and had design labs on back in college. While I have no actual proof that the phone wasn't designed as the OP describes, I find it highly unlikely. If this is the behavior that the circuitry exhibits, I would find it easier to believe that it's a design flaw, probably because some idiot didn't compile the correct bill of materials.
I haven't got any schematics or any sort of technical information on the subject. All I know is, it works wonders for me. When I take my Evo off the charger in the morning, it literally drops to ~90% within minutes. Once it does that, if I place it back on the charger for ~20 minutes, it charges back to 100% and stays there for 45 minutes to an hour.
I'd urge anybody who is noticing the immediate 10% to 15% drop in battery to give this a shot.
I would turn it off while I'm charging it overnight, but I use it as my alarm clock
Me Too
I am seeing the exact same behavior as the OP. This is really lame. Because of this, most people will end up losing 10% of their battery every day. Pretty lame.
I charge my phone overnight every night. Never noticed a problem and I just checked my battery and its at 88% and has been off the charger for 2.5hours so I'm not seeing the rapid discharge issue some people are seeing.
I don't think so man, I leave my screen on full brightness while it's charging, and if what you said was true it would go dead on the charger.
I think it's more likely the cells haven’t charged equally, so you get a big initial drop.
Grims said:
I don't think so man, I leave my screen on full brightness while it's charging, and if what you said was true it would go dead on the charger.
I think it's more likely the cells haven’t charged equally, so you get a big initial drop.
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I'm beginning to think that once the battery reaches 100% full, it runs off the battery until it reaches some arbitrary percentage. At which point it starts charging until it reaches 100% again, and then continues this cycle.
I'm testing a few other things right now. Part of me is convinced it reports 100% charge when it's actually below that level.
Krynj said:
I haven't got any schematics or any sort of technical information on the subject. All I know is, it works wonders for me. When I take my Evo off the charger in the morning, it literally drops to ~90% within minutes. Once it does that, if I place it back on the charger for ~20 minutes, it charges back to 100% and stays there for 45 minutes to an hour.
I'd urge anybody who is noticing the immediate 10% to 15% drop in battery to give this a shot.
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I'll try this out to see if I can get the same kind of behavior. I guess I honestly haven't looked to see if the phone drops 10-15% after pulling it off.
Krynj said:
I'm beginning to think that once the battery reaches 100% full, it runs off the battery until it reaches some arbitrary percentage. At which point it starts charging until it reaches 100% again, and then continues this cycle.
I'm testing a few other things right now. Part of me is convinced it reports 100% charge when it's actually below that level.
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This is what should be happening I believe, but I'd be surprised if it was set to such a huge swing like 10-15%
Grims said:
I don't think so man, I leave my screen on full brightness while it's charging, and if what you said was true it would go dead on the charger.
I think it's more likely the cells haven’t charged equally, so you get a big initial drop.
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Click to collapse
This is an interesting theory. I do know that when you have multiple Li-Ion cells in a battery pack, if they discharge unevenly, you have to go off of the lowest charged cell. Again, if a cell were to drop below the avalanche voltage, you'd ruin the pack all together. On the other hand, the circuitry should let ALL cells charge to 100% so it's even again. Maybe they screwed this up, that design isn't so easy! Perhaps it detects one cell as 100% and shuts off the charge. Therefore, one could surmise that if you started with an unevenly charged battery pack, you'd have an immediate decrease in charge to the rating of the lowest charged cell. The good news (maybe) is that this is sometimes implemented with software. That means that HTC could release a bug fix for this, or if we have a savvy dev, they could try to fix it. We just need to prove the theory though.
This is all just a guess, keep that in mind. If I notice something like this with my phone today, maybe I can tear apart the battery and measure the voltage on each cell (if it even has multiple cells). I have a spare, so maybe I'd be up for this. Krynj (or anyone), if you have the HTC Hero, try charging your battery pack with it, see if it exhibits the same behavior on the Hero itself. If it doesn't, then try putting it back into the EVO and see if after a night of charging, it still drops 10-15% after disconnecting it from the AC.
The reason why the battery dies so fast has something to do with the memory card. Charge your phone and take the SD card out and watch it stay at 100% for a long as time. Then do it again with the SD card in and watch it dip down fast.
Apple laptops don't charge unless battery is below 90%. If you plug in the AC and the battery is above 90%, it will just run off AC power but I don't think the battery drains any then.
My battery life has been less than stellar, but I didn't notice it dropping 10-15% instantly off the charger. I did notice that it'd drop about 10% after driving to work with xiialive streaming, which was unusual to me. The battery would start running out after about 9 hours at work. I'd be in the yellow by the time I got home, and the battery would be complaining for a charge in the evening. So that's roughly 12 hours I would be getting out of the phone after normal use.
Since I'm suspecting an issue with the charging circuitry, I just recently tried charging my battery with the Hero. After it was fully charged, I put it back into my EVO last night and haven't charged it since. It's been running 13 hours, and is still nearly full green. The charge is at about 70%. I've been trying to graph the discharge all day too. It only dropped to 87% over night, dropped to 80% when I drove to work (xiialive), and then down to 74% after I spent some time setting up icons and modifying my home screen. This is...hands down a butt ton better than the past week.
I'm not using 4G.
WiFi is off.
3G is on.
GPS is on.
Not running a live wallpaper.
Sync is running at default settings.
Widgets that could be updating constantly:
I have the Clock/Weather HTC widget running.
I have the Dictionary.com "word of the day" widget.
I have the Friendstream Widget running.
Craigslist Craignotifica app is running, set to notify me with search results.
The results are inconclusive though. Yesterday, I wiped and re-flashed DamageControl 3.2.x from scratch (backed up all apps with Ti-Backup, this means Android Market won't be notifying me if there are app updates -grumble-). So, somewhere between re-flashing and also charging my battery with the Hero caused this turn around.
apollooff320 said:
The reason why the battery dies so fast has something to do with the memory card. Charge your phone and take the SD card out and watch it stay at 100% for a long as time. Then do it again with the SD card in and watch it dip down fast.
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Interesting.....Will have to give a try. Will report back later.
I'm waiting for some definitive results with the "use another charging device or battery" method. It seems that the EVO just sucks at recharging the battery since people who have used another phone or a separate charger seem to report better results.
I leave my phone off at night and charge it - when I turn it on in the morning it still drops 5-10% in the first 20 minutes. But during the day it drops REALLY slow, so I still can get about 13-16 hours before 15% easily.
I have manual account sync, 3g only, wifi at home, usually gps is off, auto backlight settings for screen, and I don't run too many apps in the background, I just use them when I need them.
Has anybody found a solution to this? It's really starting to bother me. I've noticed that I don't seem to have the issue if I charge -> recovery -> wipe battery stats -> reboot. That kind of leads me to believe that something is inaccurate about the battery stats and the phone instead uses the actual raw value provided by the battery instead of whatever it is that it does with the battery stats.
I can tell you this, I bought two of the cheap battery chargers off of ebay and I have two OEM evo batteries. I don't even plug my phone in anymore. I get an hour of standby at 100% from those chargers and it falls instantly when charging from the phone. I just run them down then swap them out. I couldn't be happier and they are only like 10 bucks each with 2 batteries each.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
jnewkirk10 said:
I can tell you this, I bought two of the cheap battery chargers off of ebay and I have two OEM evo batteries. I don't even plug my phone in anymore. I get an hour of standby at 100% from those chargers and it falls instantly when charging from the phone. I just run them down then swap them out. I couldn't be happier and they are only like 10 bucks each with 2 batteries each.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
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can you post a link or ebay or where ever u bought it from?
Try this I'm doing it from the phone
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250641711190&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT#ht_1991wt_913
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
apollooff320 said:
The reason why the battery dies so fast has something to do with the memory card. Charge your phone and take the SD card out and watch it stay at 100% for a long as time. Then do it again with the SD card in and watch it dip down fast.
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Click to collapse
If you have apps on your sd card that are running then yes that could be the case. SD cards need power to work but I dont know how much they draw..

Cradle use and battery health

At the office I leave my phone in a cradle. When I get calls I remove the phone to answer and then return it to the cradle when done. My battery goes from 100% down to somewhere in the 90's then charges back to 100% in the cradle. Does this repeated process harm the battery in any way? I've read that these batteries don't suffer from the memory effect, but I'm still not sure if this counts as a charging cycle.
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You should always let the battery run down completely some times maybe once a week.
Really? I've read on this forum that there is no need to do that with the new Lithium Ion batteries. I've even read that this could have a negative effect and you should try not to let the battery drain completly.
I don't understand why there isn't a proper battery care section in the manual. Its as if its some kind of voodoo science.
Perhaps not Once a week. But Once a "while"
The reason is that, Phone software uses approximation to calculate the charge left in the Battery. So over time, battery ages and software may not be calibrated to match with the battery's storage capacity. So draining the battery entirely and charging them fully gives the phone's software to assess the battery's health and recalibrate.
It's a lithium battery mate. The only way you can really damage it is by a complete discharge. So long as you don't switch the phone back on once it switches itself off due to low battery you needn't worry about anything else.
Also in theory the lithium batteries have a lifespan of say about a 1000 charges for example and everytime you charge it has one charging less left. This ofcourse isn't exactly how it is in practice but charging the battery alot wears it down. It isn't good either to keep it in the charger for a longer time after it's reached a 100%.
Hi,
this is only partly correct:
Suppose the battery can make 1000 (which I don't believe) charge cycles,
it means that you can charge 1000 times from empty to full.
If you just charge 1000 times from 50% empty to full it counts for 500 cycles!
So,
don't worry, let it stay in the cradle if you like
There are 500 opinions about that but believe, as I wrote is correct.
Theo
Yes, what I said wasn't exact science and I used 1000 cycles as an example, but from what I've read it is better to let the battery drain to less than 50% and then charge it full rather than charge 5% at a time. My previous post was meant to illustrate this.
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geenome said:
You should always let the battery run down completely some times maybe once a week.
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Click to collapse
That's a load of crap, no offense... Lithium batteries have no memory effect and have absolutely no need to be completely discharged, that's a ancient thing from the time of nickel-metal hybrid batteries. The only actual reason for full charge cycles is to calibrate the device for that exact battery.
Keeping a lithium-ion battery in a charger most of the time will wear the battery down faster than getting it drain more and then charging it. Keeping the battery almost fully loaded/in a constant loading state wears the battery capacity by approximately 20% a year (can't recall the source/study just now)(EDIT: and my personal experience is that the battery capacity will wear that much anyway, no matter how you use it). The life-cycle of phones these days are roughly two years nowadays so IMO you can keep it in a cradle with no worries, if you wish. And lets face it, a new battery after a year of usage won't be that big an investment after all.
To add to the above post, running down a lithium battery completely does more damage than benefit. This is almost impossible though with normal use as the phone shuts down long before the battery is completely empty

Battery Calibration process

Is this the definitive way to do it?
http://hemorrdroids.net/battery-calibration/
Those steps came from here, xda devs.
1. Run the device down until it turns itself off.
2. Turn it back on and wait for it to turn itself off again.
3. Remove the battery for 10 seconds.
4. Replace the battery, but leave the device off.
5. Charge the device until full and then for another hour.
6 **Root users only** Using a Terminal Emulator, type “su” enter, followed by “rm /data/system/batterystats.bin”
7. Run the device’s battery down until it turns itself off.
8 .Turn the device on and charge for at least 8 hours.
9. Unplug the device, turn off, then charge for another hour.
10. Unplug the device, turn on, wait 2 minutes.
11.Turn off again and charge for another hour.
12. Restart and use as normal.
Quite a performance! Does it preserve battery lifespan, or is it more to do with slowing down battery drain and does it really work?
He mentions 2 interesting things:
"Generally charge them before they get lower than 50%". I didn't know that, so it's actually better to charge more often and not let it drain down?
"USB charging is actually better for the battery and you may get up to 1 hours more standby time." So you gain an hour standby but it takes twice as long to charge the phone.
Nice manual
Will try it
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Some will say that its complete nonsense .
Overcharge for 8 hours ??? how does the battery not turn charging off at 100%
Recharge 50% the accepted figure is not to go below 20% to often .
They may be right or wrong their are so many contrasting views on battery charging .
jje
Discharging battery and then reloading it fully, it's the normal procedure for battery calibration for almost all the devices in the world (including computers, etc.).
Step 8 to 11 seems quite a bit strange however.
hm, just seen a different way to calibrate the battery. basically, you drain the battery, take it out for a couple of minutes, put back in, then try to turn it on to make sure it's completely flat.
then you charge it fully, then boot to recovery and wipe battery stats then drain and fully charge. so... which one is more likely to be the better?
that guy also advises to repeat that 12 step, 1-2 day long tedious procedure "every month or so".
it is lunacy honestly speaking
does it work? did he died ?
LOL I dont understand .... I just read in another day that NEVER LET BATTERY GO LOWER THAN 15% and know I read "drain drain drain" Oh welll ...
I also thought that at 100% the charging process stops.
Although this thread is about battery calibration, these questions about battery charging always pop up.
Battery calibration is the process by which you set your device with your battery data.
Every single battery is slightly different. Although there are minimum stantards to every spec of the battery, each battery is different.
Calibrating your battery is nothing more than setting your phone to the real specs of your own battery (since the phone comes configured with the battery factory standards). For example, your phone may be set to use a battery which maximum charge is 1650 mAh, but your battery has a maximum charge of 1625 mAh. That may be within the acceptable factory standard, meaning you have a normal battery, but that also means that your phone will never indicate a 100% charge after you unplug the charger.
If you calibrate that hypothetical battery, you will "tell" your phone that its maximum charge capacity is actually 1625 mAh, meaning from that on your phone's battery indicator will be more accurate.
For that reason, it is necessary to fully discharge and fully recharge your battery for the calibration process, since your device must read the actual specs (minimum charge, maximum charge, charging current, etc) of the installed battery.
I don't know about how many times this full cicle (discharging and recharging) must be performed, but that is the reason why it must be performed for the calibration to succed.
A DIFFERENT THING is the normal discharging and charging process during normal use of the phone.
In this case, you should NEVER let your battery go under 20% and, what few people know, it also should never go over 95%. This stresses the battery and diminish its life time.
Also, and there's a lot of doubts about this, the lower the charging voltage, the slower the charging process, but the longer the battery life.
High charging voltages (like the one used by the charger sold with the phone, which is around 5V) stress the battery, diminishing considerably its life time.
That is true for all lithium-ion batteries!
Therefore it is better to charge your phone through USB (which uses around 4,3V) than to do it using the charger provided with the phone.
You may be asking "If the charging voltage of the charger provided by the manufacturer stresses the battery, why does the manufacturer provide such charger?"
For purely commercial reasons! Higher voltages mean shorter charging cycles, which please the consummer. Moreover, the battery capacity loss with the factory provided charger is around 15-20% a year (considering "normal" to "heavy" use). That is to say that after a year your battery will only reach 80-85% of the maximum charge it used to reach when it was new. And by that time your manufacturer expects you to consider buying a new phone, with more features.
Summing it up:
- calibration is just the process by which you "tell" your phone what the real specs of your battery;
- in normal use, charging your phone through USB is better than doing it with the manufacturer provided charger;
- try not to let your battery charge go under 20% nor above 95%;
- if you're interested, read more about it at batteryuniversity.com
Spin three times in clockwise direction with left middle finger on your nose while blinking your eyes with the phone plugged in.
Jump in the air 3 times.
Unplug phone.
Thats some messed up instructions.
Do you have any idea what kind of strain you're putting on the battery while doing all that?
All you're gonna get is some extra minutes, maybe an hour but is it really worth it because you're just reducing overall battery lifespan by doing that procedure over and over.
Specially when you constantly keep the battery at 4200mV (full charge) for a long time. You're practically killing it by overcharging.
Transmitted from a Galaxy far far away via XDA telepathy.
m2smoe said:
Spin three times in clockwise direction with left middle finger on your nose while blinking your eyes with the phone plugged in.
Jump in the air 3 times.
Unplug phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that made me chuckle
Never done a calibration on a battery and most of the time i even didn't let battery to discarge very much and then load it again. Never had a problem with battery life it last how long it should last every time and i've used that battery for years. So the battery "calibration" are kinda useless.
Matriak31 said:
that made me chuckle
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Click to collapse
Well then, my job here is done
m2smoe said:
Well then, my job here is done
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Click to collapse
it is indeed...i should follow you just to have more laughs like that cheers
RenatoN said:
Although this thread is about battery calibration, these questions about battery charging always pop up.
Battery calibration is the process by which you set your device with your battery data.
Every single battery is slightly different. Although there are minimum stantards to every spec of the battery, each battery is different.
Calibrating your battery is nothing more than setting your phone to the real specs of your own battery (since the phone comes configured with the battery factory standards). For example, your phone may be set to use a battery which maximum charge is 1650 mAh, but your battery has a maximum charge of 1625 mAh. That may be within the acceptable factory standard, meaning you have a normal battery, but that also means that your phone will never indicate a 100% charge after you unplug the charger.
If you calibrate that hypothetical battery, you will "tell" your phone that its maximum charge capacity is actually 1625 mAh, meaning from that on your phone's battery indicator will be more accurate.
For that reason, it is necessary to fully discharge and fully recharge your battery for the calibration process, since your device must read the actual specs (minimum charge, maximum charge, charging current, etc) of the installed battery.
I don't know about how many times this full cicle (discharging and recharging) must be performed, but that is the reason why it must be performed for the calibration to succed.
A DIFFERENT THING is the normal discharging and charging process during normal use of the phone.
In this case, you should NEVER let your battery go under 20% and, what few people know, it also should never go over 95%. This stresses the battery and diminish its life time.
Also, and there's a lot of doubts about this, the lower the charging voltage, the slower the charging process, but the longer the battery life.
High charging voltages (like the one used by the charger sold with the phone, which is around 5V) stress the battery, diminishing considerably its life time.
That is true for all lithium-ion batteries!
Therefore it is better to charge your phone through USB (which uses around 4,3V) than to do it using the charger provided with the phone.
You may be asking "If the charging voltage of the charger provided by the manufacturer stresses the battery, why does the manufacturer provide such charger?"
For purely commercial reasons! Higher voltages mean shorter charging cycles, which please the consummer. Moreover, the battery capacity loss with the factory provided charger is around 15-20% a year (considering "normal" to "heavy" use). That is to say that after a year your battery will only reach 80-85% of the maximum charge it used to reach when it was new. And by that time your manufacturer expects you to consider buying a new phone, with more features.
Summing it up:
- calibration is just the process by which you "tell" your phone what the real specs of your battery;
- in normal use, charging your phone through USB is better than doing it with the manufacturer provided charger;
- try not to let your battery charge go under 20% nor above 95%;
- if you're interested, read more about it at batteryuniversity.com
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should post the source for your info, cause I am seeing a lot of incorrect information in here.
If you guys want to learn about your battery, visit the site Battery University
The OEM replacement battery is worth about $10.
Save yourself the stress....use it...charge it when you need to...if the battery ever fails cough up $10.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
The way I would calibrate my batteries is a bit different. Lithium ion batteries don't need to be drained then charged to full AFAIK, and I even remember reading somewhere that draining it is actually only for NiCad batteries. It used to be relevant when phones were using NiCad but not anymore.
Read: http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
As such I have read that the universal way to 'calibrate' batteries is by charging to full, using for a couple of mins and charging again.
What I have been doing is:
1. Charge to full when phone is switched off (doesn't matter if it's from 0% or 99%).
2. Switch on the phone, use for 5 mins.
3. Switch off then charge until full.
4. Repeat step 2 once more
That's it! It seems pretty simple but it seems to have worked for me.
The way i do it is different. Firstly i have the battery calibration app from the market by Nema..then i fully charge my phone and when it says its fully charge i go into the app. There it gives me the instructions on how to calibrate...First i wait till i charge the phone without any interruptions. then click on the app and wait til the battery goes to 4200MV and then i press the calibrate button and then the app does it for me. Then i drain the battery again without any interuptions or breaks during that time and then charge it again once battery dies down and thats it.
there are so many ways being touted on the forums you really dont know which one to go for...but whatever works for each person then who are we to tell someone different just thought i share that
If my battery dies, or gets significally lower capacity after 1 or 2 years of usage, I'll just buy a new one if I plan to keep the phone longer.. Going through these rituals and painstakenly monitor my battery % so that it never goes below 20 % or above 95 % is just not worth it.. Doesn't increase the life THAT much anyway.. I use the phone until I hear the beep for low batt, and from there until I have a charger available.. Most of the time it's before it reaches 10 %, thats good enough for me.. Once in a while it might even go so far that it dies.. Then I charge it till it says 100 %.. Most of the times I plug it when going to bed, and let it charge over night.. This is normal usage and what the battery should be designed to handle, and so far it does..

New s7 battery conditioning

Hey guys, I recieve my s7 edge today, whats the best way to condition the new phones battery? Some use what it has until its low to recharge until 100 others leave phone off and charge to 100 at start, whats the best result for a good healthy battery?,
Thanks
Lithium ion batteries have come a long way. There is no "memory effect" and conditioning is probably not really all that necessary. If I were you I'd just give it a charge to 100 and use as normal. Might have high drain for the first few days/charge cycles.
Remember that with Li-Ion batteries a "charge cycle" is one complete cycle from 0% to 100%. So by charging when it's at 50% you're only using up one half of a "rated charge cycle" - Battery conditioning shouldn't really be required with modern lithium ion batteries.
Battery conditioning isn't necessary but charging fully and depleting fully will help the phones software learn the battery capacity and give the most accurate percentage remaining reading. I'd say do this a couple times after you first get the phone
gaff15 said:
Battery conditioning isn't necessary but charging fully and depleting fully will help the phones software learn the battery capacity and give the most accurate percentage remaining reading. I'd say do this a couple times after you first get the phone
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Click to collapse
This makes sense I guess. But wouldn't the battery percentage remaining be based on the voltage in the battery at a given moment? I wouldn't think the phone would need to "learn" that.
Afaik. It's actually bad to discharge li-ion and li-po batteries down low. I think it's better for battery health to recharge around 50% for instance than waiting until 0%.
Xileforce said:
Afaik. It's actually bad to discharge li-ion and li-po batteries down low. I think it's better for battery health to recharge around 50% for instance than waiting until 0%.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The 50% mark is an old(and still good) rule of thumb primarily for lead acid batteries.
Leaving these batteries in a discharged state can be bad for them, but in normal usage even a discharge to 0% is fine if followed shortly by a charge cycle. These devices have a low voltage cutoff which is what shuts the phone down and protects the battery from over discharge and damage. Bottom line is use and charge it however you like, the only thing that may change is the time it takes the software to learn your discharge profile and show accurate stats.
Ashevar said:
The 50% mark is an old(and still good) rule of thumb primarily for lead acid batteries.
Leaving these batteries in a discharged state can be bad for them, but in normal usage even a discharge to 0% is fine if followed shortly by a charge cycle. These devices have a low voltage cutoff which is what shuts the phone down and protects the battery from over discharge and damage. Bottom line is use and charge it however you like, the only thing that may change is the time it takes the software to learn your discharge profile and show accurate stats.
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Click to collapse
This makes sense. The article I read awhile back was likely referring to non smart charging systems, such as a battery pack. It makes sense that an integrated solution such as a phone would regulate that to maintain battery health.
There are three things that are very bad for Li batteries. 1: overcharging. 2: completely draining. 3: overheating. Li batteries are happiest, and will last the longest, if never cycled above 75% or below 25%. Cars like the Tesla actually show 100% charge when the battery pack is only about 75% charged, and show the battery as depleted well above 0% charge. Then again, the battery pack for a Tesla costs a lot more than a phone.
#1 shouldn't be a problem in any modern device. The circuitry in the battery will tell the phone when to shut down charging to prevent overcharge. #3 can be a problem. If you're charging the battery simultaneously with high battery draining phone usage (e.g., GPS and Nav) phones can get very hot. In fact, I've had my phone stop charging and display a warning when I was navigating and charging the phone wirelessly at the same time. If you're using GPS on a long trip, you almost have to charge it while in use, but might want to avoid wireless or fast chargers. Wireless chargers and fast chargers generate more heat.
#2 is up to you. Repeatedly discharging the battery to single digits will reduce it's lifespan. I try to recharge before 25% but if I get into a situation where I can't I don't obsess over it. I don't worry too much about charging to 100%. I suspect that, like Tesla, 100% is probably not really 100%. The battery manufacturers are likely to leave a little safety margin in there to ensure batteries can't overheat and catch fire.
meyerweb said:
There are three things that are very bad for Li batteries. 1: overcharging. 2: completely draining. 3: overheating. Li batteries are happiest, and will last the longest, if never cycled above 75% or below 25%. Cars like the Tesla actually show 100% charge when the battery pack is only about 75% charged, and show the battery as depleted well above 0% charge. Then again, the battery pack for a Tesla costs a lot more than a phone.
#1 shouldn't be a problem in any modern device. The circuitry in the battery will tell the phone when to shut down charging to prevent overcharge. #3 can be a problem. If you're charging the battery simultaneously with high battery draining phone usage (e.g., GPS and Nav) phones can get very hot. In fact, I've had my phone stop charging and display a warning when I was navigating and charging the phone wirelessly at the same time. If you're using GPS on a long trip, you almost have to charge it while in use, but might want to avoid wireless or fast chargers. Wireless chargers and fast chargers generate more heat.
#2 is up to you. Repeatedly discharging the battery to single digits will reduce it's lifespan. I try to recharge before 25% but if I get into a situation where I can't I don't obsess over it. I don't worry too much about charging to 100%. I suspect that, like Tesla, 100% is probably not really 100%. The battery manufacturers are likely to leave a little safety margin in there to ensure batteries can't overheat and catch fire.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
#1 -> Could be a problem. Manufacturers can set the 100% mark at higher voltage to make it look like it has more capacity while sacrificing longevity, just enough to get through the 1 year warranty period. (Lot of powerbanks do this!) Users have no control of this ceiling. Charging to 80% and letting it cycle below that probably keeps the battery much healthier than keeping it plugged overnight at 100%.
There's an app called AccuBattery on playstore that people might want to check out. It's basically an alarm that turns on when the battery is at desired % level. It also cites real research papers so I would trust what they are doing.
I used to have a long post with a detailed technical explanation but lost it.
Anyway the gist is, basically, batteries work by ion movement, and like a machine, these ions wear out over time due to use. And similar to machines, heavy use wears them out more. You're more likely to break an engine by running it for 1 day at max rev, than running it over a month at half capacity. The smaller the depth of discharge, the lower the wear. Lab tests have concluded that when you constantly discharge from 100 to 0, it allows you betwrrn 300-500 charge cycles before it starts to break down and not hold charges. More specifically, when you reach that magic number your battery can only hold 75% of it's original charge. That's typically 1-2 years of use if you charge once a day. And heavy abusers charge more than once a day, so that decreases the time span to however many weeks it takes them to reach 500 charge cycles. Now, the increase in charge cycles is exponential, not arithmetical. So a depth of discharge to 50 before recharging will not give you 600-1000 charges. Rather it will give you 1200-1500 charge cycles. Mathematically, draining a 3600mah to zero for 300 charges gives you 1080000mah to burn through however short your battery life will be. On the other hand, using only 50% of the battery before recharging gives you 2160000mah to burn through before it expires after at least 1200 charge cycles. In other words, it stored twice more power for you to use. If you say, charge once every 24hrs, going always from 100 to 0 gives you at least 300 days. Recharging twice a day at 50% gives your battery at least 600 days of use before battery capacity deteriorates noticeably. Discharging to 75% before recharging actually gives you 2000-2500 charge cycles, making it even longer. Basically the point is, always plug the phone in when given the chance. Don't wait for 50%, or whatever. 40% is an arbitrary number actually, not sure why it's chosen. Also, this is why one of the choices to auto activate power saving in the S7 is at 50%, so that it keeps the battery up as close to 50% as possible when you get the chance to plug in.
As for charging to 80%, this is because partial charge is better than full charge for lithium ion batteries. The ions are placed on stress to hold charges. Maximum stress is at 100% charge. And like everything else, stuff tends to break more. So not running it to 100% all the time will reduce overall stress experienced and increase the time before deterioration occurs. Personally I charge to 90%, and discharge to 40% or above. That's a 50% depth of charge, so that's good for up to 1500 charge cycles, plus whatever number of cycles the decrease in max stress gives me.
However, note that environmental temperatures also play a role in battery longevity.
Sent from my Galaxy S7 Edge Duos via Tapatalk
just use the dang phone...
cri[LIST=1 said:
[/LIST]s_epic;65635276]Hey guys, I recieve my s7 edge today, whats the best way to condition the new phones battery? Some use what it has until its low to recharge until 100 others leave phone off and charge to 100 at start, whats the best result for a good healthy battery?,
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's actually a perfect way to ruin your battery on purpose!
Just do these things and Don't worry a lot. And remember, when it does die it's not your fault, it's kind of a problem with Lion batteries!
1. Try to keep the battery between 40-80% or 20-40%. But don't worry if tou can't. Saying this in case you're staying at home all day.
2.Keep the heat away from it!!! This one is important
3. Try to discharge it at a lower rate but don't let that get in the way of you enjoying your device.
4. Try not to discharge below 8% at all. But try to not discharge it below 15-20% unless you have important things to do.
5. don't keep it topped of for a long time (like constant going 90-100%, this is damaging) and don't keep it at 100% for long! (For example turning it off and stop using it for a week, or keeping it plugged for a few days)
If you're storing it keep it at 40% (3.8-3.75V) and try to drain it once in a while. (Unlikely to happen with a phone specially one without a removable battery )
I really do hope someone invents a new type of battery. Lipos are anoyying
Simple you don't need too lol
Sent from my SM-G935F using XDA-Developers mobile app

>Zerolemon Proper Charging Instructions + Loss of Battery Power from Drop Fix!‹

When charging The ZeroLemon battery, you should always charge at the "Lowest Amperage" meaning Fast charge should "always" be turned OFF when charging any ZeroLemon batteries. Leaving the fast charge turned on will charge the battery faster, of course. However, it will "kill" the ZeroLemon battery over time, reducing it's charging life to a mere crappy timespan, and also reducing it's ability to distribute a charge for the device over the original intended time cycle. >This info is straight from ZeroLemon themselves. This is not just my opinion.<I have purchased many batteries from ZeroLemon, on my business account, and this is what they themselves, and their USA distributor instructed us to do for the absolute best performance of their battery.
Another thing to keep in mind is when charging the battery on the slow, non fast charge cycle. To always charge with the phone off. No, this isn't so the phone can charge the battery faster. It's so the battery will get the "Full Charge" it's intended to receive. What do I mean, you might ask? When charging the OEM factory battery, the software is programmed to look at the /data/system/batterystats.bin file to determine calculative information and statistical information about the battery itself. This information guides the system on where the battery is at its charge cycle along with various other related task.
Zerolemon clearly states: "Shut down, plug in the power supply and charge until full. (Preferably continuously charge overnight to ensure maximum power. Remember to not switch the phone on, until battery is fully charged.)"
So how do you know if this monster of a battery is fully charged? Well, there's a couple ways. You can look at the whitepapers or on the battery and get the full amperage/voltage cycle information, or you can simply use some simple math to determine what amount charge you're charging at and then determine the amount of hours it will take for a complete full charge.
Now, I can make this a little easy for you and help you out with this. If the battery is brand new, meaning it just literally arrived and you just opened it from the box. Charge for afull 12-18 hoursfor the first charge. Do this with the phone off. When you hit that time mark, you can turn the phone on for use. Now keep in mind I said 18-24 hours for the first charge. Since Zerolemon sends out the battery with some bit of a charge on it, it's impossible to get the exact amount of charge for sure. So when in doubt, charge it fully out. That means 18-24 hours. Yes, yes, that's one hell of a long charge. But let me tell you. I use my phone all day. Full screen brightness, everything turned on, Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, etc. Watch videos, games, hit the forums, obviously . And I always get 3 to 4 days of use. That's right baby. 3 to 4 days of use. The secret is the long slow charge. These batteries are not single cell, they are a tricell makeup. The slower and longer the charge, the longer the battery will last.
Now back to the charging cyle info. You've already charged the phone up completely for the first time. Now use that sucka! And I mean use it till it completely gets to 5% and the system forces you that crappy power save mode where it dims the display etc. Power the phone off. Remove just enough of the rubber TPU case to lift up the battery from the contacts. Count to 3, then replace the battery, TPU, etc. Don't be shocked when you power it back on and you've got 80% full battery again. Remember this is a tricell, so it doesn't report correctly what the exact amperage/voltage is to the android system. Now continue to use the battery and repeat until the battery is at 5% all the time when reinserting it again.
Now, the step above is where everyone messes up and just depletes the battery to 5% only "one time" and then goes to charge the battery again. Don't do it! You're cheating yourself out of precious battery life.Follow the above cycle exactly as I said and you'll be thanking me later, that I promise. If you've already had the battery for a while and been charging it incorrectly, don't worry. Deplete the battery as outlined above, then charge for 18-24 hours, remove battery, insert battery, repeat till stays continually at 5% then recharge.
OK. Now let's move on. Once you continually hit that 5%, Start the charge cycle over again by charging the phone with Fast Charge turned OFF, the full 18-24 hours. Then repeat the steps outlined above again.
>>IT'S EXTREMELY IMPERATIVE THAT YOU DO THIS 5 CYCLES.<< (Sorry for the caps, but really need to stress the importance of this.)
Once you have completed the five cycles, you're on your way to always leaving that blasted charger at home, and never again being thought of as a "Wall Hugger" if you've seen the commercials .
=> Don’t stop charging even it shows 100% charged. And if you're seeing this 100%, then you didn't turn off the phone during the charge as indicated above, lol. A true "Full Charge" is only performed when the battery has been charged for 18-24 hours.
Charging Scenario
When you are doing the first "5 Full charge and Deplete cycles", the phone must be powered "off" while charging. This is due to the android operating system and the Note 4 thinking the phone is fully charged when it reaches 100% even though in reality it's truly not. The Zerolemon battery may only be in reality at 30%, 40%, 50%, etc. Remember, the device believes it has the OEM factory battery in it, and not the massive Zerolemon battery. Unfortunately if you're not rooted with a Developers Edition Note 4, it cannot differentiate between the two batteries. So for the first 5 full charges, (this is referred to as the conditioning of the battery,) turn the phone off when charging.
Now after the 5 cycles have been completed, and the conditioning has been done. You can charge the battery with the phone on. However its important to remember that:
1. When your little battery icon shows full, or if you have the battery % on, & it shows 100%, don't stop charging. It thinks you have the Factory OEM battery in place. To ensure that you have a "True Full Charge" the total noninterrupted charge time must be no shorter than 18 hours and no more than 24, if the battery is truly fully depleted.
2. Properly charging a battery of this size works as follows. The battery has been charged 18-24 hours and is fully charged. You use the device depleting the battery over a period of a few days, while in the process, when it hits 5% you remove the battery and then reinsert as mentioned earlier, then continue to use the device till the battery is actually fully depleted. This means the phone won't power on anymore.
Now at this point, you'd start the charging process again, for 18-24 hours.
Do not charge at every day or every night just because the battery is a little low. (Because almost devices are powerful hungry and batteries depletion is very quick, people are in a habit of just throwing it on charge whenever and however.) Only charge when the device is completely and fully powerless.
Routinely charging the Zerolemon battery in different increments will cause a severe and nonreversible battery retention that will prevent the battery from not only being able to give full use, but prevent it from being able to be fully charged anymore.
TIPS:
Zerolemon batteries for the Note 4 are notorious for prematurely shutting down the phone by means of loss of power if the phone is dropped or in some cases even bumped. The reason this occurs is because their is a small discrepancy in the exact battery size where the contacts meet the pins on the phone. In layman's terms, the Zerolemon battery is just a bit short. No, it's not gonna fall out of the back of the TPU case or anything like that. However, if you drop the phone, or even in some reported cases, bump the phone, the Zerolemons battery loses connection with the gold contacts from the device from within the battery compartment.
Reports have been made to Zerolemon concerning the issue, however Zerolemon has failed still yet, to resolve the problem accordingly. Most likely because just a simple change of plan, would literally open the door for thousands of recalls, refunds, etc, not to mention cost thousands of dollars to remap the sizing and make the correction to future batteries.
Well with this said, all is not lost. I've found, if you remove the TPU case, leaving the battery in place, you can insert a small shim of paper at the proper place, and this will totally resolve and eliminate the problem 100%.
You can use paper, plastic, Thin gasket material etc. Whichever is most convenient for you at the time.
The proper placing of the paper is crucial. Because you don't want to cover up the path to the speaker phone compartment any more than it already is.
Here's the easiest way to fix it.
Power off your phone. Now remove the TPU case and lay the phone carefully screen down so the battery compartment is facing upwards. Position the phone where the bottom of the battery compartment is closest to you, and the camera is furthest from you. Now remove the battery. On the bottom right side of the battery compartment you will want to insert your paper, plastic, "fix" etc to the bottom right side of the compartment. The paper thickness I'd recommend would be the thickness of a regular matchbook cover, or about 2 sheets of construction paper. The dimensions I used was about 1/8 inch tall, by 1 inch long. Don't lay the paper flat inside the battery compartment, doing so will cause the battery to be a little "thicker" and not make connection. You will want to "Stand Up" the little piece if paper, or if you're feeling savy enough, permanently afix the paper to the housing. Now when you go to reinsert your Zerolemons battery, you'll notice that it not only actually first a little tighter and snugger, like it should have been on day 1. But it also doesn't let the battery wiggle a little like before. Replace your TPU case, and power on your phone.
I'll upload some pics for you to show you how I did mine. If you got any questions on any of this, just ask.
Don't worry if you're a newby, a senior XDA member, or a Developer. You won't get any flaming or criticizing from me. Asking for help is always welcomed as far as I'm concerned.
The only dumb question is the question that's not asked.
Don't forget to hit the "Thanks Button!"
Your post was written on the same day that the Retail unlock was released, about maybe 6 hours earlier, and I'm just noticing this post this morning. First of all, I'm actually now on CM13. Secondly, I've disabled any automatic screen dimming at 5% and 15%. I still get warnings, which I do swipe away. My phone did reboot when it thought it got down to zero, only to find out that I was at 11%. I continued to drain again to 0%, tried to start up, no luck. It was drained. When I was fully charged, I did try deleting batterystats.bin as well, and apparently that did nothing. I'm about to try a mod for battery calibration. The difference between the time of your post and now, is that we're unlocked and rooted, so the mod would not have worked, then, but POSSIBLY, now. I guess I'll be a guinea pig, here.
JOSHSKORN said:
Your post was written on the same day that the Retail unlock was released, about maybe 6 hours earlier, and I'm just noticing this post this morning. First of all, I'm actually now on CM13. Secondly, I've disabled any automatic screen dimming at 5% and 15%. I still get warnings, which I do swipe away. My phone did reboot when it thought it got down to zero, only to find out that I was at 11%. I continued to drain again to 0%, tried to start up, no luck. It was drained. When I was fully charged, I did try deleting batterystats.bin as well, and apparently that did nothing. I'm about to try a mod for battery calibration. The difference between the time of your post and now, is that we're unlocked and rooted, so the mod would not have worked, then, but POSSIBLY, now. I guess I'll be a guinea pig, here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey, I saw that you mentioned in the other thread about someone had posted a beta file. I believe that you are absolutely correct. I'll do my best to dig around and see if I can find that file for us to test. I have tried depleting my battery literally till 0% is true. At that point I checked the mv on the battery and then fully charged using no fast charge cycle and also without turning the device. I have 5 converted DE's and now 6 true DE's. I'm going to test each device at the same time to get an average and also a very accurate account on the validation of the battery stats. Lol at the guinea pig that you mentioned. I've felt that way too. I'll start testing the devices at the same time in the morning about 8:00 am here in Hawaii. I'll report back what my findings are. Post back your findings and I'll do the same. Hopefully we can modify the file properly to meet the requirements for us Zero Lemon users.
Android.Ninja said:
Hey, I saw that you mentioned in the other thread about someone had posted a beta file. I believe that you are absolutely correct. I'll do my best to dig around and see if I can find that file for us to test. I have tried depleting my battery literally till 0% is true. At that point I checked the mv on the battery and then fully charged using no fast charge cycle and also without turning the device. I have 5 converted DE's and now 6 true DE's. I'm going to test each device at the same time to get an average and also a very accurate account on the validation of the battery stats. Lol at the guinea pig that you mentioned. I've felt that way too. I'll start testing the devices at the same time in the morning about 8:00 am here in Hawaii. I'll report back what my findings are. Post back your findings and I'll do the same. Hopefully we can modify the file properly to meet the requirements for us Zero Lemon users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know if this is significant or not but the manual states the capacity at 3.85V/3850mV. The Battery Calibration app I tried this morning said my battery was about 4380mV at 100%. I don't think that this was correct on the app's part. I could be wrong. What do you think? BTW, I'm at 58% right now after 9 hours of heavy use, I don't think that's right.
Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk
3850 from 4380, that is a good difference. What app did you use? I'll check using another app and we'll compare results. However also thinking about it, if I remember correctly, 3850mV should be correct. I was an original tester for ZeroLemon thats based out of china. They use BaxtelWireless as their Wholesaler / Distributor who is located in lower Texas, and I signed up as a tester / reviewer for them when they first started implementing the battery. BaxtelWireless contacted me later on to test out the battery. The only thing I really dislike, is the fact that it's a tri-cell battery and not single cell. if I remember correctly. They mentioned they were working on the possibility of making a single cell, however I'm positive the price would also increase of they do. After checking I think that 3850mV should be correct, but let me ask someone who works there to get a definite answer. I'll get back with you.
Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk
I got the 3850 figure from the manual
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---------- Post added at 08:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:45 PM ----------
Lookup Battery Calibration on the play store, it's by NeMa. That's what I used.
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@47%, 3924mV.
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Yup, that's what I'm seeing as well. 3850mV is what they say it should be.
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Have a look at this thread. This is the guy I was referring to that was trying to make a mod for this battery. I don't really understand what all he was doing but I don't think he's supported it in almost a year.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/not...nt/reserved-zerolemon-fuel-gauge-fix-t3131705
I feel like I've made some small progress, but honestly, I doubt it. Still seeing the 1% problem. I don't know if that will ever iron itself out or not.
First discharge:
my phone turned off at 0%
I turned it back on, it had 11% left over.
Both occasions, @1%, draining the battery seemed like an eternity.
Did not test battery pull
Tried using BatteryCalibration from the Play Store, it did nothing.
Second Discharge:
Battery drained down to 0% the first time through
Battery Pull did nothing. Turning off and on did nothing. Battery was in fact, dead.
Calibrated using Battery HD Pro. (I think you can do the same calibration with the free version but I'm not sure)
1% battery drain seemed like an eternity, again
I have my phone plugged in, now and I'm going to let it charge for about 21 hours before I turn it on, again. I'll check it when I get home from work in the evening.
Question: Would there be any difference in using the stock charger vs the charger that came with previous Note's with different voltages? I don't know enough about electricity to understand this or not.
thanks to OP for sharing!
i have an original samsung battery charger.
could i use it to charge my zerolemon 18-24hrs for those first 5 charges, while i use my phone with my old original 3220 mAh batteries in the meantime?
After the 5 cycles of 18-24 hrs of charging will I always charge this battery for 18hrs or more and do I always charge it with the fast charging off? After the 5 cycles will my note 4 % sign read true. Any help would be appreciated thanks.
Android.Ninja said:
When charging The ZeroLemon battery, you should always charge at the "Lowest Amperage" meaning Fast charge should "always" be turned OFF when charging any ZeroLemon batteries. Leaving the fast charge turned on will charge the battery faster, of course. However, it will "kill" the ZeroLemon battery over time, reducing it's charging life to a mere crappy timespan, and also reducing it's ability to distribute a charge for the device over the original intended time cycle. >This info is straight from ZeroLemon themselves. This is not just my opinion.<I have purchased many batteries from ZeroLemon, on my business account, and this is what they themselves, and their USA distributor instructed us to do for the absolute best performance of their battery.
Another thing to keep in mind is when charging the battery on the slow, non fast charge cycle. To always charge with the phone off. No, this isn't so the phone can charge the battery faster. It's so the battery will get the "Full Charge" it's intended to receive. What do I mean, you might ask? When charging the OEM factory battery, the software is programmed to look at the /data/system/batterystats.bin file to determine calculative information and statistical information about the battery itself. This information guides the system on where the battery is at its charge cycle along with various other related task.
Zerolemon clearly states: "Shut down, plug in the power supply and charge until full. (Preferably continuously charge overnight to ensure maximum power. Remember to not switch the phone on, until battery is fully charged.)"
So how do you know if this monster of a battery is fully charged? Well, there's a couple ways. You can look at the whitepapers or on the battery and get the full amperage/voltage cycle information, or you can simply use some simple math to determine what amount charge you're charging at and then determine the amount of hours it will take for a complete full charge.
Now, I can make this a little easy for you and help you out with this. If the battery is brand new, meaning it just literally arrived and you just opened it from the box. Charge for afull 12-18 hoursfor the first charge. Do this with the phone off. When you hit that time mark, you can turn the phone on for use. Now keep in mind I said 18-24 hours for the first charge. Since Zerolemon sends out the battery with some bit of a charge on it, it's impossible to get the exact amount of charge for sure. So when in doubt, charge it fully out. That means 18-24 hours. Yes, yes, that's one hell of a long charge. But let me tell you. I use my phone all day. Full screen brightness, everything turned on, Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, etc. Watch videos, games, hit the forums, obviously . And I always get 3 to 4 days of use. That's right baby. 3 to 4 days of use. The secret is the long slow charge. These batteries are not single cell, they are a tricell makeup. The slower and longer the charge, the longer the battery will last.
Now back to the charging cyle info. You've already charged the phone up completely for the first time. Now use that sucka! And I mean use it till it completely gets to 5% and the system forces you that crappy power save mode where it dims the display etc. Power the phone off. Remove just enough of the rubber TPU case to lift up the battery from the contacts. Count to 3, then replace the battery, TPU, etc. Don't be shocked when you power it back on and you've got 80% full battery again. Remember this is a tricell, so it doesn't report correctly what the exact amperage/voltage is to the android system. Now continue to use the battery and repeat until the battery is at 5% all the time when reinserting it again.
Now, the step above is where everyone messes up and just depletes the battery to 5% only "one time" and then goes to charge the battery again. Don't do it! You're cheating yourself out of precious battery life.Follow the above cycle exactly as I said and you'll be thanking me later, that I promise. If you've already had the battery for a while and been charging it incorrectly, don't worry. Deplete the battery as outlined above, then charge for 18-24 hours, remove battery, insert battery, repeat till stays continually at 5% then recharge.
OK. Now let's move on. Once you continually hit that 5%, Start the charge cycle over again by charging the phone with Fast Charge turned OFF, the full 18-24 hours. Then repeat the steps outlined above again.
>>IT'S EXTREMELY IMPERATIVE THAT YOU DO THIS 5 CYCLES.<< (Sorry for the caps, but really need to stress the importance of this.)
Once you have completed the five cycles, you're on your way to always leaving that blasted charger at home, and never again being thought of as a "Wall Hugger" if you've seen the commercials .
=> Don’t stop charging even it shows 100% charged. And if you're seeing this 100%, then you didn't turn off the phone during the charge as indicated above, lol. A true "Full Charge" is only performed when the battery has been charged for 18-24 hours.
Charging Scenario
When you are doing the first "5 Full charge and Deplete cycles", the phone must be powered "off" while charging. This is due to the android operating system and the Note 4 thinking the phone is fully charged when it reaches 100% even though in reality it's truly not. The Zerolemon battery may only be in reality at 30%, 40%, 50%, etc. Remember, the device believes it has the OEM factory battery in it, and not the massive Zerolemon battery. Unfortunately if you're not rooted with a Developers Edition Note 4, it cannot differentiate between the two batteries. So for the first 5 full charges, (this is referred to as the conditioning of the battery,) turn the phone off when charging.
Now after the 5 cycles have been completed, and the conditioning has been done. You can charge the battery with the phone on. However its important to remember that:
1. When your little battery icon shows full, or if you have the battery % on, & it shows 100%, don't stop charging. It thinks you have the Factory OEM battery in place. To ensure that you have a "True Full Charge" the total noninterrupted charge time must be no shorter than 18 hours and no more than 24, if the battery is truly fully depleted.
2. Properly charging a battery of this size works as follows. The battery has been charged 18-24 hours and is fully charged. You use the device depleting the battery over a period of a few days, while in the process, when it hits 5% you remove the battery and then reinsert as mentioned earlier, then continue to use the device till the battery is actually fully depleted. This means the phone won't power on anymore.
Now at this point, you'd start the charging process again, for 18-24 hours.
Do not charge at every day or every night just because the battery is a little low. (Because almost devices are powerful hungry and batteries depletion is very quick, people are in a habit of just throwing it on charge whenever and however.) Only charge when the device is completely and fully powerless.
Routinely charging the Zerolemon battery in different increments will cause a severe and nonreversible battery retention that will prevent the battery from not only being able to give full use, but prevent it from being able to be fully charged anymore.
TIPS:
Zerolemon batteries for the Note 4 are notorious for prematurely shutting down the phone by means of loss of power if the phone is dropped or in some cases even bumped. The reason this occurs is because their is a small discrepancy in the exact battery size where the contacts meet the pins on the phone. In layman's terms, the Zerolemon battery is just a bit short. No, it's not gonna fall out of the back of the TPU case or anything like that. However, if you drop the phone, or even in some reported cases, bump the phone, the Zerolemons battery loses connection with the gold contacts from the device from within the battery compartment.
Reports have been made to Zerolemon concerning the issue, however Zerolemon has failed still yet, to resolve the problem accordingly. Most likely because just a simple change of plan, would literally open the door for thousands of recalls, refunds, etc, not to mention cost thousands of dollars to remap the sizing and make the correction to future batteries.
Well with this said, all is not lost. I've found, if you remove the TPU case, leaving the battery in place, you can insert a small shim of paper at the proper place, and this will totally resolve and eliminate the problem 100%.
You can use paper, plastic, Thin gasket material etc. Whichever is most convenient for you at the time.
The proper placing of the paper is crucial. Because you don't want to cover up the path to the speaker phone compartment any more than it already is.
Here's the easiest way to fix it.
Power off your phone. Now remove the TPU case and lay the phone carefully screen down so the battery compartment is facing upwards. Position the phone where the bottom of the battery compartment is closest to you, and the camera is furthest from you. Now remove the battery. On the bottom right side of the battery compartment you will want to insert your paper, plastic, "fix" etc to the bottom right side of the compartment. The paper thickness I'd recommend would be the thickness of a regular matchbook cover, or about 2 sheets of construction paper. The dimensions I used was about 1/8 inch tall, by 1 inch long. Don't lay the paper flat inside the battery compartment, doing so will cause the battery to be a little "thicker" and not make connection. You will want to "Stand Up" the little piece if paper, or if you're feeling savy enough, permanently afix the paper to the housing. Now when you go to reinsert your Zerolemons battery, you'll notice that it not only actually first a little tighter and snugger, like it should have been on day 1. But it also doesn't let the battery wiggle a little like before. Replace your TPU case, and power on your phone.
I'll upload some pics for you to show you how I did mine. If you got any questions on any of this, just ask.
Don't worry if you're a newby, a senior XDA member, or a Developer. You won't get any flaming or criticizing from me. Asking for help is always welcomed as far as I'm concerned.
The only dumb question is the question that's not asked.
Don't forget to hit the "Thanks Button!"
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18-24 hrs??? seriously???
---------- Post added at 06:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:47 AM ----------
IssacEsco said:
After the 5 cycles of 18-24 hrs of charging will I always charge this battery for 18hrs or more and do I always charge it with the fast charging off? After the 5 cycles will my note 4 % sign read true. Any help would be appreciated thanks.
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Definitely don't use the Samsung Adaptive Fast Charging adapter if you turn off the phone. Find another charger that is 2.0, otherwise, even if you have fast charging off in the settings...it will fast charge when the phone is charging when it's off and it will say it when you see the charging going on. Read that somewhere else on this forum and he was absolutely correct!
Correct me if I'm wrong here, but if your phone believes the battery is at 100% doesn't it stop charging the battery and only draws a trickle charge? what good is leaving your phone plugged in when your phone itself will not charge it fully? there must be a way we can physically charge the battery itself. I'm about to take apart an old charger and alligator it into a regulated power supply. someone stop me if they think that's a bad idea.
How can you turn off your phone and not use it for 12hr+? kind of ridiculous if your cell phone is your main source of contact.....
Hi, I've had my Zerolemon 10000 mAh Battery & case for just over a year. Using it in a Note 4. Not being tech savvy I initially charged it to 100%. and I have done the plug it in every night thing & had it on fast charge. Now, I have a question, since I have done all these things wrong on this battery the battery is running out of charge within 3 to 4 hours at least. Can I reprogram this battery or have I ruined it?
Beckyboombang. said:
Hi, I've had my Zerolemon 10000 mAh Battery & case for just over a year. Using it in a Note 4. Not being tech savvy I initially charged it to 100%. and I have done the plug it in every night thing & had it on fast charge. Now, I have a question, since I have done all these things wrong on this battery the battery is running out of charge within 3 to 4 hours at least. Can I reprogram this battery or have I ruined it?
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