Sorry if this has been posted before, I've serached to no avail. I'm trying to better understand the whole ROM/RAM thing, and have a few questions that will clarify whats going on
a) Without having an SD card, if I copy a file to, say, the "My Documents" folder on the phone, does this get stored on the ROM, or the RAM?
b) I've recently done a hard-reset to restore back to factory settings, but afterwards found some folders on the phone that aren't "factory" (Swype for instance). I thought a hard-reset wiped out all data and replaced it, no?
c) If I were to somehow completely wipe the storage area of my phone (Program files / Windows / ConnMgr folders for instance), would a hard-reset be enough to restore functionality? If so, where would the system files come from?
d) Is the 448Mb RAM used solely for CPU execution, and is wiped by soft-reset or removing the battery?
Sorry if these questions are real basic, but necessary in order to further understand whats going on
Richard_Bushby said:
Sorry if this has been posted before, I've serached to no avail. I'm trying to better understand the whole ROM/RAM thing, and have a few questions that will clarify whats going on
a) Without having an SD card, if I copy a file to, say, the "My Documents" folder on the phone, does this get stored on the ROM, or the RAM?
b) I've recently done a hard-reset to restore back to factory settings, but afterwards found some folders on the phone that aren't "factory" (Swype for instance). I thought a hard-reset wiped out all data and replaced it, no?
c) If I were to somehow completely wipe the storage area of my phone (Program files / Windows / ConnMgr folders for instance), would a hard-reset be enough to restore functionality? If so, where would the system files come from?
d) Is the 448Mb RAM used solely for CPU execution, and is wiped by soft-reset or removing the battery?
Sorry if these questions are real basic, but necessary in order to further understand whats going on
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
a) ram on the HD2 is just like the ram of your home computer... it's not for storage, but for program runtime memory
b) may be weird, unless you had a swype folder that came with your stock rom in the first place and you didn't know anyway the plain hard reset doesn't properly format your internal storage memory, that's why tools like task29 exist; it may be possible that folder "survived" the hard reset, even if I find it strange
c) those files would come from the "ROM" after a hard reset the internal storage memory is 512MB, there are "partitions" in it, for radio, rom image, and user files, when you delete system files on your device you are not really deleting the files from the rom image, so they will just be restored after hard reset. Someone please correct me if I'm writing wrong pieces of information
d)yes, again it's just like your pc's ram. Back in the times, old pda's had a pool of "ram" that was used practically for everything, and was in fact shared between program runtime excecution,and files storage, while their "rom" wasn't user writeable, and reserved for just the OS image (thinking about my very first WinCE device now, casio cassiopeia, quite some years have passed!), so if you removed the battery and your backup battery ran out, you would lose your files. HD2 instead has his persistent memory chip, the 512MB/1024MB rom chip, so you won't lose any data without power, but surely your ram chips will.
Thanks for your reply! Just to make sure I've got this right:
The HD2 has:
448MB RAM - volatile / battery dependant memory that is used for program
execution just like in a PC
512MB "storage memory" - non-volatile memory where the windows system
files, program files, music files and "my documents" are stored. Kind of like
the HDD in a PC
512MB ROM - stores the operating system and factory files that are copied
to the "storage memory" in the event of a hard reset. These files can only
be changed by flashing a new ROM image.
A Hard Reset wont format the "storage memory", it will just replace certain
files and folders from the ROM image.
A smaller, or lite ROM image will result in more "storage memory" after a
hard reset
Have I got this basically correct?
If so, one last quick question:
Task29 formats the "storage memory" correct? So I should be able to Task
29 and then a hard reset will get things back up and running without
having to do any flashing of the ROM?
Many thanks in advance
Can anyone confirm the above post?
Richard_Bushby said:
Thanks for your reply! Just to make sure I've got this right:
The HD2 has:
448MB RAM - volatile / battery dependant memory that is used for program
execution just like in a PC
512MB "storage memory" - non-volatile memory where the windows system
files, program files, music files and "my documents" are stored. Kind of like
the HDD in a PC
512MB ROM - stores the operating system and factory files that are copied
to the "storage memory" in the event of a hard reset. These files can only
be changed by flashing a new ROM image.
A Hard Reset wont format the "storage memory", it will just replace certain
files and folders from the ROM image.
A smaller, or lite ROM image will result in more "storage memory" after a
hard reset
Have I got this basically correct?
If so, one last quick question:
Task29 formats the "storage memory" correct? So I should be able to Task
29 and then a hard reset will get things back up and running without
having to do any flashing of the ROM?
Many thanks in advance
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The ROM is the storage memory. There is only RAM and ROM... that is it. The ROM is partitioned into sections for radio, OS image, etc. Running Task29 will format the ROM, but will erase the OS image, so you will need to flash a rom after doing task29.
Richard_Bushby said:
Thanks for your reply! Just to make sure I've got this right:
The HD2 has:
448MB RAM - volatile / battery dependant memory that is used for program
execution just like in a PC
512MB "storage memory" - non-volatile memory where the windows system
files, program files, music files and "my documents" are stored. Kind of like
the HDD in a PC
512MB ROM - stores the operating system and factory files that are copied
to the "storage memory" in the event of a hard reset. These files can only
be changed by flashing a new ROM image.
A Hard Reset wont format the "storage memory", it will just replace certain
files and folders from the ROM image.
A smaller, or lite ROM image will result in more "storage memory" after a
hard reset
Have I got this basically correct?
If so, one last quick question:
Task29 formats the "storage memory" correct? So I should be able to Task
29 and then a hard reset will get things back up and running without
having to do any flashing of the ROM?
Many thanks in advance
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Usually this is what I do. Run Task29. Then after it shows 100%, I hold the VOL DOWN button. Flash the ROM (I flash custom ROMS, you can flash Stock ROMS if you like) with the CPU +USB. After the ROM finishes and shows 100%, hold VOL UP+DOWN to do a hard reset.
Let the first round of ROM fully setup. Then do another hard reset after that. This fully wipes everything off for me and return me to a clean slate that is MUCH more cleaner than ever before.
This is the equivalent of a secure erase on an SSD using the Secure Erase from UCSD's magnetic research facility. It wipes out everything so clean, the police wont be able to trace it if they tried.
zarathustrax said:
The ROM is the storage memory. There is only RAM and ROM... that is it. The ROM is partitioned into sections for radio, OS image, etc. Running Task29 will format the ROM, but will erase the OS image, so you will need to flash a rom after doing task29.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So from what you're saying... if I copy a file into the My Documents folder, this effectively gets stored on ROM, right?
Richard_Bushby said:
So from what you're saying... if I copy a file into the My Documents folder, this effectively gets stored on ROM, right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Correct. All your internal storage is on the rom.
Related
Hello,
I was wondering: What exactly happens to the Wizard when you perform a reset?
Are all the files on the Wizard deleted except for the operating system?
or
Are all the files on the Wizard deleted except for the operating system and the Extended_Rom folder?
or
Are all the files on the Wizard restored to their original state from some sort of image? So you lose all information but if you previously deleted a file in the Extended_Rom folder it comes back after a hard reset?
Also, what happens when the battery drains? Do you also lose your files as you did with the Magician, or are all your files still on the device? (persistant storage).
all files in the "user storage" area of the rom are deleted (formated)
this in essance forces WM2005 to start afresh.
this user storage area is in the same memory as the operating system so isnt affected by anything, only hard reset (format user storage area).
Hi, i am very new here and ilack some of the basic info. so i have couples of questions. thanks very much for your answers.
1. what is the internal memory of the htc hd2? and when you partition your sd to fat32 and ext3, will the internal memory be the sum of the ext3 and the phone internal storage?
2. when you want to flash your hd2 with a new rom. do you need to format both partitions of your sd card (fat32 and ext3)
3. when i tried the latest ultimate droid rom, i saw the author posted the rom and another thing called the layout (3.0.2.4_magldr_150M_partitionLayout_30M_cache). what does this do?
4. how do you make the phone to move or install apps in the ext3. and how do you back up those data and apps in the ext3?
and again, thanks guys for helping me out.
1 internal memory, do you mean what's available after a flash? 260 Meg or so with the small cm7 roms (typhoon for example)
No, the internal memory wont show the sum of internal plus ext BUT it will work as if it is. Say you install a 20meg program, internal mem goes down 20 but back up 20 after a restart.
2 no, when you perform the wipes through cwm it takes care of the ext partition and the .android folder on the fat32 for you.
Some apps may put data on the fat32, in which case you can delete those if you want or if you have isues.
3 the layout (clockworkmod, or cwm) sets up the various partitions on your nand (internal) memory, boot, system,cache,data. Without the layout there would be nowhere for the rom to flash into.
The main point of interest in cwm is the system partition size, big roms need big system partitions, sense roms for ex. need 250meg or more, typhoon needs 130. Flash a big rom to small layout fails, small rom on big layout wasted space.
4 you don't, if the rom says ap2sd enabled or words to that effect, it does it automatically. You can test this by loading up some apps then browsing the SD card on a Linux PC
When you run backups and such, it just does it, the phone has no idea that some of the info is on the SD, it treats it as internal.
samsamuel said:
Say you install a 20meg program, internal mem goes down 20 but back up 20 after a restart.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i dont understand why is that? so if the rom is apps2sd supported, it will automatically install apps to ext3. then it makes sense to me that the mem goes down, but then why it goes back up???
Example, 250meg internal plus 1gig ext partition.
internal memory shows as 250meg,, install 20 Meg app which goes to ext partition BUT the system displays internal mem as 230, , you reboot the phone and check again and internal memory shows as 250 again.
oh, thanks alot, i get it. but which backup solution is the best? and how does backup using clockworldmod work? does it make a backup file to sd card?
ljaypham said:
oh, thanks alot, i get it. but which backup solution is the best? and how does backup using clockworldmod work? does it make a backup file to sd card?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi,
It depends what you want to back up.CWM backup will take a snapshot of your entire ROM system,data,settings,everything.A bit like a ghost image of a drive on your PC.
This way, if you install a new ROM and there is a problem,or you don't like it,you can RESTORE your original ROM and everything is back the way it was before.
CWM backup saves to the sd card.
If you just want to backup data,use something like Titanium Backup.
Hi guys
I have recently installed android 2.2 on my hd2. I am absolutely loving it.
The problem I have though is that it seems to take quite a lot of memory up in my phone storage memory. I cannot move maps, Facebook etc to the storage card. What can you recommend I do? I have about 20mb of memory free on the phone. The other problem I have is that when I link my phone to my laptop I can only see the storage card and not the phone memory?
Any help would be very much appreciated.
thanks.
Well to your first question, there is always the option to do Apps2sd, most roms come with a TMOUS version and a EUR version. The latter usually is set up to move the data partition to the sdcard (usually set to 512mb-1024mb depending on what you prefer). I would suggest partitioning your card, re-flashing the rom you are using and then you should be golden.
Now as to browsing memory contents, you will only ever be able to see your sdcard. Android's file system is not viewable by a PC as far as I am aware, you can always use adb but that doesn't give you a full browsing experience.
You can always download a file explorer that gives root access, Root Explorer is my personal fave. This will let you browse your internal memory.
Its no good just saying "Android 2.2", that doesnt mean anything. When asking for help you need to give relevant info like which specific rom you are using.
For example if you have a EU HD2 which im guessing you do then 99% of EU roms will come with a option to use sd-ext which is a partition on your sd card. This partition will be used for all apps/app data etc instead of you nand.
Partition yoru card using CWR>Advanced. Set partition to 1GB and swap to 0mb, wipe data/factory reset, wipe caches and then flash rom again.
Sorry, its the DFT LEO Nand Rom.
thanks for your advice guys, I will that out.
I have a quick question if i may...
Back in the times of the WM5/6.x , we could hard-reset and windows mobile would be copied from "somewhere" into it's original status.
Now, my question is, where the hell was that WM Rom stored for hard resets? Are we using that space? Am i talking crap here??
(ok, 3 questions, i know... i know... )
I think I'm talking crap too, but if so, someone can correct me!
I'm assuming the original ROM is stored in ROM, e.g. Read Only Memory, and then any changes, tweaks, additions, installs etc are then stored in RAM/storage. If you do a "Clear Storage", everything in the storage is deleted and the phone thinks it's brand new again.
DISCLAIMER: This really could be complete b****cks
From what i understand of Android, the OS uses 3 partions. cache, system, data.
Cache is self explained.
System, is mounted read only, and it's where the majority of the OS itself (Linux) binaries/conf files are stored, as well as the Android framework and apps.
Data is where shared preferences are stored, as well as downloaded and updated apps.
Now, we might already be using the space that WM used to store it's restore-backup back in the day... i just wanted confirmation
Hi guys,
First I want to thank you all, I get my HD2 few days ago with a so old and boring windows 6.5, and i had a lot of fun upgrading it to Android.
I successfully installed the CM9 nexus rom with the nativeSD option (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1437463), i'm very impressed by the smoothness of the rom.
I have a small issue with space available for apps, i only have 914Mo of "internal space", 815Mo are aleady used (i guess for the system), meaning i only have 99Mo remaining to install my apps. As i use a lot of them, even if i move most of them to SD card, it is a too small space left.
Do you know how i can increase my "internal space", as i use a 16Go SD i have no problem re-partitioning my sd card, i just don't unsderstand how to do it (with MAGLDR? with CWM? manually with my parition manager?).
thanks a lot in advance for your anwers,
cimourdain said:
I have a small issue with space available for apps, i only have 914Mo of "internal space", 815Mo are aleady used (i guess for the system),
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
800+Mb?? that's HUGE that's not the system! system files take up usually 150 - 350mb depending on eth rom you flashed, nowhere near 800+
anyway, just backup your rom through recovery, and then use a partition manager via the pc, or the one in recovery, to make a bigger ext partition, say 2gb, and then restore your rom through recovery.
Yes 800MB is indeed a lot. IF you go to Settings->Storage which numbers do you see by Internal Storage?
If you backup your system, how big is the backup ZIP?
You can go through your file system with a tool like Root Explorer (paid) to find out where the big data of your system is. You have about 500MB too much.
Use MiniTool Partition Wizard Home Edition to partition your SD card. Make an EXT4 of about 2GB en default cluster size. The remaining part should be FAT32, 32k cluster size.
Thank you to both of you,
You were perfectly right about the fact that 800Mo+ is way to big. I opened my Ext4 partition with my Ubuntu, and "surprise", i found 2 folder remaining from previous (and failed) attempts of installing MIUI roms. After manually deleting those two, my internal storage went back to normal.
Thank you again for your help.