Database Users

I need pros/cons for buying a Touch Dual

I am going to swap cellular carriers and want to buy a Touch Dual. I already have a CDMA Touch and know its features well, but what are the main differences betwenn the touch and the touch dual. I know the dual has a slide out keyboard and a smaller screen, but what else is different. What are your like and dislikes?

I suppose you can easily find out about most of the good/bad features simply by reading one of many reviews available via Google search. So, perhaps I'll try to point out some things that are often left out of reviews.
Touchflo - This is over-hyped. The default Touchcube is quite useless because of the unintuitive choice of shortcuts. Prepare to have to mess around with registry and image files to get the Touchcube the way you want it. Grab-to-scroll is great, but it's nothing exciting nowadays.
The new photo viewer - Also over-hyped. The gestures take time to get used to. Performance is slow if your photo collection gets large. Most importantly, it doesn't allow you to organize your photos in directories. I've since ditched this for Resco's Photo Viewer.
The HTC Home plug-in - Arguably the best Today screen plug-in available.
WM6 - Will offer you limitless customization options if you are willing to take risks with registry and ROM files.
The camera - Almost unusable. Blurry photos unless you steady your hand against a solid object. This is either caused by an extremely slow shutter speed or it's a driver issue. The consensus is that it's the latter. Fortunately, HTC will be releasing proper drivers soon.
Internet Explorer - The default browser is useless. There's a bug that makes viewing large pages painful. The more you scroll away from the top, the more lag you experience with scrolling. Fortunately, there a fix for that here in this forum. Also, you will need to add PIE+ if you want any functionality out of the browser.
HTC Audio Manager - This is quite nice to use personally. Don't understand why some prefer WMP. But I suppose this is a personal preference thing. The sound skips every few minutes. But it's not a big deal.
As a phone, the Touch Dual is a dream come true. There are so many ways to dial. You can use your quick contacts. You can scroll through the contacts list. Or you can simply begin typing your contact's name or number and it will search through your contact list in real-time. This is simply great. Writing SMS and emails are great either with the touch screen or the keypad. Absolutely flawless as a phone.

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=368144
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=361548
is it that hard to perform a search?

Stay away from the latest HTC phones until they've fixed that driver issue (www.htcclassaction.org).

DaVince said:
Stay away from the latest HTC phones until they've fixed that driver issue (www.htcclassaction.org).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's your choice, I like the Dual and feel that is as fast as I need.

bydandie said:
That's your choice, I like the Dual and feel that is as fast as I need.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. It has it's flaws. But it is still a sweet device. After some tweaks, I'd it is a joy to use. And if HTC is going to release drivers as speculated, then it's just going to be that much better.

DaVince said:
Stay away from the latest HTC phones until they've fixed that driver issue (www.htcclassaction.org).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its only an issue if you're a serious gamer though. And a serious gamer would be more likely to use a different device?

Unfortunately, it's not just with games and video. It's the entire GUI itself. You can't even scroll without getting agitated! Imagine running your PC in safe mode.. Or running your PC with the default VGA drivers.
For those who insist on getting a Niki. Go ahead. you're the one getting screwed anyways.

ahhh!! cant deal with this phone! help!

man im having a hard time with my HD, im coming from an iphone and this is my first day with it, ive been messing with it all day but its just so much different than an iphone. the screen just wants too much push its getting to me, the iphone you just flick your finger or lightly tap and it recognizes so easily. right now my biggest issue is i cant get the phone data package to work, ive got the iphone plan still but i put my sim in my friend hd and it worked fine so im wondering what i can do to get my att data working. another issue im having is using wifi at home to search web pages moving around the page is a pain and they pages always require me to scroll to the sides. is there a way for me to display the whole page horizontally so i dont have to move sideways along with up and down. this are just a few of my problems, but i can see myself going back to the iphone this thing is just too much trouble, and you cant beat that app store or jailbreaking with customs themes. i was willing to take the loss of 3g for the sharper screen but this issue with having to press against the screen has got me nuts.
does anyone know how i can sync my contacts from my windows contact list on my pc?? this is where my iphone has stored all its contacts.

I have the Touch HD, and my roommate has the iPhone... so I have used them both, and have compared them as well.
To be honest, the Touch HD is MUCH better. Also keep in mind that the two have different display screens, the iPhone's REQUIRES heat (from your finger)... so you can never use a stylus or other similar item to control it. While it does have its advantages (such as multi touch) -- it still lacks in that on the HD, you can use the stylus, or pretty much anything.
Try looking at your settings. Try re-aligning the screen. Also there is a setting to turn on noise feedback (clicking) when you are touching the screen - which might help you when you are scrolling.
Lastly - while the iPhone and jailbreaking have a lot of items... I would say that the HD [Windows Mobile] has 10 times more items and way to customize.
Any way just my two cents. Hope it helps a bit.
Keith

are there any sites you can recommend for free software cause i want to like and keep this thing for the camera but it loads apps prett slow and the media is not as easy to reach as it is on the iphone. im really just looking for sports scores updates and aim and some games for this phone

The Iphone and the HD are two very good devices for their market, generally speaking however, depending what you use it for will determin which device is for you.
There are ways of adjusting the sensativity of the HD, i wouldnt recomend this, what you are expeiencing is simply the change between the Iphone and the HD, had you never used the Iphone you would have thought the HD touch screen was amazing. Which is better? Both have their advantages, but i for one keep my fingers nice and warm in the bitter cold wind and can still use the thing, whilst my Iphone brothers are freezing their fingers off!
Your data package is a mystery, i dont really understand what you mean by its not working, stick your SIM in, then go to system settings, network, then network wizard, that will take care of any little network settings issues that may be stopping you from getting it to work.
Assuming you are using Opera you just tilt the device on its side whilst facing you, that will flip the screen to wide mode, you can just read a full website without the need for zooming in this mode. If your using IE then give up, its old and doesnt work yet, new versions will fix this. Moving the page about is very easy in Opera.
To be honest, i think your being very nieve to think this phone is "simply" better than the Iphone, you cant just jump from one device to another and directly compare them, they are two very different devices, you have gotten used to the Iphone, that is why you like it so much, I have used both and i can tell you that for what i use this thing for the Touch HD is by far the most amazing device i have ever used, hell yeah, Id go as far as saying i love my HD!
I do have some issues with it, but ill live with it for now, hopefully someone will fix them soon. They would all be about the camera. Not overly chuffed with it in its current state.

get winterboard from vito software....google it....lot like the iphone interface

Get HDTweak installed so you can the screen more sensitive.

dazza9075 said:
The Iphone and the HD are two very good devices for their market, generally speaking however, depending what you use it for will determin which device is for you.
There are ways of adjusting the sensativity of the HD, i wouldnt recomend this, what you are expeiencing is simply the change between the Iphone and the HD, had you never used the Iphone you would have thought the HD touch screen was amazing. Which is better? Both have their advantages, but i for one keep my fingers nice and warm in the bitter cold wind and can still use the thing, whilst my Iphone brothers are freezing their fingers off!
Your data package is a mystery, i dont really understand what you mean by its not working, stick your SIM in, then go to system settings, network, then network wizard, that will take care of any little network settings issues that may be stopping you from getting it to work.
Assuming you are using Opera you just tilt the device on its side whilst facing you, that will flip the screen to wide mode, you can just read a full website without the need for zooming in this mode. If your using IE then give up, its old and doesnt work yet, new versions will fix this. Moving the page about is very easy in Opera.
To be honest, i think your being very nieve to think this phone is "simply" better than the Iphone, you cant just jump from one device to another and directly compare them, they are two very different devices, you have gotten used to the Iphone, that is why you like it so much, I have used both and i can tell you that for what i use this thing for the Touch HD is by far the most amazing device i have ever used, hell yeah, Id go as far as saying i love my HD!
I do have some issues with it, but ill live with it for now, hopefully someone will fix them soon. They would all be about the camera. Not overly chuffed with it in its current state.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
everyone whos got an hd says this to me but i dont understand, what are you guys doing with your phone that im not, the only capability the phone has that im aware of is things like word and excel, otherwise its supposed to be a pda phone and surfing the web on this thing is near impossible(i reset the phone and got the Edge working but it feels so slow coming from 3g). zooming in and out is much more difficult than the iphone. i almost wish there were some kind of package to give this phone all the same features the iphone has for zooming and scrolling pages(occasionally ill select something while trying to scroll because ill have to press down too hard). is it ok to post links to programs on this forum, i guess thats another issue with most of these expensive windows mobile phones, everyone and their moms has an iphone so theres a lot of attention paid in terms of modding and customizing. im trying to find the G sensor that lets you rotate any program some kind of mobile messenger and sports score updater. also does anyone know how i can take my windows contacts and export them to the HD.

Loss of 3G? What are you talking about!? The Touch HD is 3.5G! Just as fast as the iPhone 3G, (depending on network coverage, of course). Plus it has even newer technologies.

thatg said:
everyone whos got an hd says this to me but i dont understand, what are you guys doing with your phone that im not, the only capability the phone has that im aware of is things like word and excel, otherwise its supposed to be a pda phone and surfing the web on this thing is near impossible(i reset the phone and got the Edge working but it feels so slow coming from 3g). zooming in and out is much more difficult than the iphone. i almost wish there were some kind of package to give this phone all the same features the iphone has for zooming and scrolling pages(occasionally ill select something while trying to scroll because ill have to press down too hard). is it ok to post links to programs on this forum, i guess thats another issue with most of these expensive windows mobile phones, everyone and their moms has an iphone so theres a lot of attention paid in terms of modding and customizing. im trying to find the G sensor that lets you rotate any program some kind of mobile messenger and sports score updater. also does anyone know how i can take my windows contacts and export them to the HD.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There's a reason why as you said "everyone and their mom's has an iphone". This reason might also apply to you. You are obviously in uncharted territory. If you just want to web search/email/play music then stick to your iphone. A pda phone is designed for much more than that.
Dont blame the HD for your poor network connection.The HD can handle everything from 2G to EDGE, 3G and HSDPA. The phone will connect to whatever EDGE if it cant find a stable 3G (or even better HSDPA) connection. For browsing try opera mobile. And read the manual for the phone. You can adjust the screen sensitivity to your liking.You can also download a cab file here (HD Tweak) to help you with that. Any more complaints?

And yes, EDGE is slower than 3G but that depends on where you are (cell towers) and your network. If your cell provider has 3G or HSDPA signals coming off their cell towers then your HD would automatically choose the best and connect with it.

Good Lord Another Jesus Phone vs HD thread. Do we really need it It's like comparing a PS3 to a PC. One just has to learn the mysteries of WinMobile and that's what this board is all about

ha, see this is what im talking about, you guys keep telling me they are very diferent and winmobile can accomplish a lot more but leave out what. i just dont get what i'm missing. im in the U.S. so the the 3g doesnt work here as far as i know. im on AT&T. i've read somewhere that its got the correct hardware but needs some sort of firmware to possibly accomplish 3g use in the future. i just went to the htc website and put on the 4 hotfixes they had under the support section along with hd tweak 0.5.4 i found. one of the hotfixes solved an issue i was having with the slider to answer calls.
so i still have this problem with exporting contact to the phone from my pc if anyone has any tips
i'm very sorry to anyone who thinks i came on here to offend you guys, just trying to figure this thing and its capabilities out. also can someone tell me what these roms are and should i be cautious loading them, could they cause damage to my phone? i found one that looks like a package of different modifications to the phone

What is the problem with contacts from your PC to the HD ?
I assume you have PC with windows and the outlook application ? And, do you have activesync working between the PC and the HD ?

im using windows mobile device center with vista, and ive never actually set up outlook whenever i get to the email setup i start to stumble because i dont get this pop and map thing trying to setup my yahoo email

thatg said:
im using windows mobile device center with vista, and ive never actually set up outlook whenever i get to the email setup i start to stumble because i dont get this pop and map thing trying to setup my yahoo email
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should have an outlook cd-rom in the HD pack. I have set this up without access to email - I just ignored that in the setup.
I would suggest this is worthwhile as the sync from pc Outlook to HD is very simple.
I use the calendar feature and contacts in outlook on the PC and not the email.
Where are the contacts you want to sync with the HD ?

right now my contacts are in my windows address book, if i go to the start menu then contacts theyre all in there i got outlook running and did the same chose not to sync email but when i try to drag a contact into the outlook contacts outlook tells me its unable to find the WAB DLL. whatever that is

guy you really need to go and RTFM
this is xda dev, not "winmob for dummies"
sure we all have to start somewhere and i did, but i got my first winmob device and then read read read and read somemore. then played and tweaked and hardreset god knows how many times
sorry if you think im being arsey, but the questions you are asking and then solutions (where they exist) have been explored before
google is your friend, or to use the original phrase... "seek and you shall find"

For the heavyness of the touch, look on the forum. You can adjust how hard you have to push on it. Mine is set very light and you can just swipe over it with the lightest touch.
The plus side about a device like the HD is that you can adjust it as much as you want.
The reason why the iPhone is popular and liked by many imho is that its made to be easy for even the biggest idiot.
Just like game consoles are made to bring games to the masses, while a real gamer wouldn't touch a console with a 10 foot pole.

Coming from an iPhone to an HTC does take a little getting used to. I did find the extra screen pressure annoying at first as half my screen presses were ignored. Also, the iPhone is very user friendly, both out of the box and for installing new apps. With a WM device, you do need to do a little bit more to get the most out of it, but once you've got your sat nav installed, gyrator or other screen flip software, put your own skin on it, have voice dial set up and bluetoothed to everything else, and playing the video and audio formats of your choice, all in glorious 800x480, the iPhone will seem like a distant memory.
The threads to read are those pointing to the Wiki's on firmware updates, and basic tweaks (which makes a huge difference). Read the basics, and you'll find an army of people willing to help you get the most out of it. And they dont charge $9.99 for the latest firmware release!
I hope you stick with it.

TravUK said:
Coming from an iPhone to an HTC does take a little getting used to. I did find the extra screen pressure annoying at first as half my screen presses were ignored. Also, the iPhone is very user friendly, both out of the box and for installing new apps. With a WM device, you do need to do a little bit more to get the most out of it, but once you've got your sat nav installed, gyrator or other screen flip software, put your own skin on it, have voice dial set up and bluetoothed to everything else, and playing the video and audio formats of your choice, all in glorious 800x480, the iPhone will seem like a distant memory.
The threads to read are those pointing to the Wiki's on firmware updates, and basic tweaks (which makes a huge difference). Read the basics, and you'll find an army of people willing to help you get the most out of it. And they dont charge $9.99 for the latest firmware release!
I hope you stick with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thanks for the encouragement and help, most other people seem to want me to just turn back to the iphone, im not welcome ?
i just tried dling gyrator but it says i need .net framework compact so im looking for that now. can you point me in the right direction of the framework and maybe where to change the sensativity so i dont have to press as hard against the screen, or is that in the HD tweak. also what will the firmware update change.
still having this issue getting the contacts from my windows address book to the phone

What Makes Android Better Than Windows Mobile?

I see a lot of threads about Android.
I've never tried converting or even seen it in action but have a question.
How is Android better than Windows Mobile Professional?
Also how is it worse?
Or is it just different?

All I can say is 'try it to believe it.'
I can talk about it on and on, but you are not going to realize what you can get until you try it.

sshark said:
All I can say is 'try it to believe it.'
I can talk about it on and on, but you are not going to realize what you can get until you try it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
second that. easy enough to dump on your sdcard without even touching your current winmo setup, so try it out and see.

jimt007 said:
I see a lot of threads about Android.
I've never tried converting or even seen it in action but have a question.
How is Android better than Windows Mobile Professional?
Also how is it worse?
Or is it just different?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its just better. Really.

Main thing for me, besides that its totally better, is that its finger based. No more silly stylus....

+1.
I just recently went all the way back to the stock sprint 6.1 rom just to see if I could ever live like that again. After spending an hour or so gathering cabs and tweaking everything just to get it to a comfortable state, I realized that all of the things I was trying to do are pretty much already done in even the most basic android builds.
It does come down to preference I suppose, but for me, just signing into my account upon booting android beats digging around for a WMMarketplace cab on a crippled IE browser, cumbersome setups for things like Windows Live, setting up and scheduling active sync, installing replacements for almost every default part of WM.
I really did love windows mobile for a long time. It's certainly one of -if not- the most customizable platforms. If you don't necessarily like how something works in WM, chances are you can do something about it. But that can take time. I was never really that interested in scripting out one of those huge uc files way back when.
The way everything works so well together in android without getting in your way is fantastic, but stop reading this and just trying it!

If you want to get your feet wet:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/58383/android.exe
A self-extracting zip file I made to get a friend running Android. It's a all-in-one Haret of zenulator's 1.6 Donut. Just extract the Android folder it contains to your Secure Digital card, then run Haret.exe in Windows Mobile File Explorer. Then hit Run.
For porting contacts from WinMobile to Android, check this:
http://www.google.com/support/mobile/bin/answer.py?answer=138636&topic=14299

You know what? I'm going to quote myself, from another thread:
Pandemic187 said:
Personally, I like Android better than Windows Mobile because:
1. It's significantly faster for me
2. There's more freedom in terms of tweaking it
3. I think it has a MUCH better notification system than WinMo
4. I like the integration with GMail (better than WinMo's Exchange support) and other Google services
5. It has an app market!
These are pretty self explanatory, but I just love the notification system of Android. I was pleasantly surprised to see a weather alert appear in my notification bar after I downloaded the Weather.com app the other day. Everything appears there - including your appointments on your Google Calendar, texts, e-mails - everything. I think it's just great how it's all unified.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

jnadke said:
If you want to get your feet wet:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/58383/android.exe
A self-extracting zip file I made to get a friend running Android. It's a all-in-one Haret of zenulator's 1.6 Donut. Just extract the Android folder it contains to your Secure Digital card, then run Haret.exe in Windows Mobile File Explorer. Then hit Run.
For porting contacts from WinMobile to Android, check this:
http://www.google.com/support/mobile/bin/answer.py?answer=138636&topic=14299
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks.
I installed it without any problems. Nice looking. Very clean interface.
But.... EVERY program that I tried, opened but had no way to back out. I had to soft reset each time. I tried 3 or 4 different things, and nothing let me go back to the main menu. Phone hard keys didn't do what they are supposed to do. After all it is a phone, the hard keys make it easy to call and hang up.
I guess I'm not patient enough to continue to experiment so I just deleted the file and am back to using Windows Mobile Pro 6.1.

jimt007 said:
Thanks.
I installed it without any problems. Nice looking. Very clean interface.
But.... EVERY program that I tried, opened but had no way to back out. I had to soft reset each time. I tried 3 or 4 different things, and nothing let me go back to the main menu. Phone hard keys didn't do what they are supposed to do. After all it is a phone, the hard keys make it easy to call and hang up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Power Button = Menu Button
Camera Button = Back Button
Hang-Up Button (long press) = Silence, Airplane, Shutdown
Those should work on every Vogue.

cybik said:
Power Button = Menu Button
Camera Button = Back Button
Hang-Up Button (long press) = Silence, Airplane, Shutdown
Those should work on every Vogue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd like to give a friend the package above, but he is on a Touch Pro. Would this be good for him to try? or is there something else better?

TheKartus said:
Main thing for me, besides that its totally better, is that its finger based. No more silly stylus....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol..huh? I have used Windows Mobile forever and cannot remember the last time I used the stylus...in fact, the only time I use it, is to reset the phone through the little hole.

jimt007 said:
Thanks.
I installed it without any problems. Nice looking. Very clean interface.
But.... EVERY program that I tried, opened but had no way to back out. I had to soft reset each time. I tried 3 or 4 different things, and nothing let me go back to the main menu. Phone hard keys didn't do what they are supposed to do. After all it is a phone, the hard keys make it easy to call and hang up.
I guess I'm not patient enough to continue to experiment so I just deleted the file and am back to using Windows Mobile Pro 6.1.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well..........after reading some of the replies I reinstalled Android.
Not to belabor the point but I still don't like it as much as Windows Mobile Pro 6.1.
I would be losing to many things I'm very pleased with for a change to a different operating system.
It's back off again, I'm staying with Windows Mobile Pro 6.1.
If I ever want Android I'll buy an Android phone.

I agree with you about Android, it's not something I would use, but that's just me.
I wouldn't go back to 6.1 though, I'll stay with 6.5.x, it's a lot more finger friendly. The UI graphics on Android is decade behind everybody else. I would need a microscope to see what's on there. That's why HTC developed its own UI. Knowing Google, they probably can make up that decade in a week, but for now its Winmo.
PS you might want to try one of the port/build with SenseUI.

stopthebus said:
I agree with you about Android, it's not something I would use, but that's just me.
I wouldn't go back to 6.1 though, I'll stay with 6.5.x, it's a lot more finger friendly. The UI graphics on Android is decade behind everybody else. I would need a microscope to see what's on there. That's why HTC developed its own UI. Knowing Google, they probably can make up that decade in a week, but for now its Winmo.
PS you might want to try one of the port/build with SenseUI.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To each their own I suppose - but it really sounds like your config is off or you're using some odd build if you "need a microscope to see what's on there".

plemen said:
To each their own I suppose - but it really sounds like your config is off or you're using some odd build if you "need a microscope to see what's on there".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would love to be able to increase the font size on Android. I've play around with both 120 and 160 and different resolutions, but unable to increase the font size to something usable. Any help would be appreciated. I've been scouring the net reading up on Android and trying different builds (last one was eclair 2.0.1) because I was offered the Droid for Xmas. After all the readings and research, I turn down the offer in favor of the trusty old Vogue (being made by Motorola is another reason; every Motorola phones I got, I had to open them up and super glued everything down).
I do appreciate some pointers on increasing the font/widgets size on these test builds.

crobs808 said:
lol..huh? I have used Windows Mobile forever and cannot remember the last time I used the stylus...in fact, the only time I use it, is to reset the phone through the little hole.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I often got annoyed with certain apps I put in, certain games, or menus and just brought out the stylus.

Well, one thing you always have to keep in mind running Android on the Vogue, is that it is not native to the Vogue. So, there is always going to be little imperfections. I was so impressed by Android on the Vogue, that I bought a G1. So now I run WM6.5 on the Vogue, and Cyanogen's ROMs on my G1. I really will never go back to WM. The only reason I use it now is because I have a contract with Verizon that somebody else pay for. If you really want to be blown away by Android, go to a store and play with a native Android phone. I find content is way more accessible for Android. For an OS that has been out for a very small fraction of the time that WM has been out, it's incredible. Lol, I'm rambling now, point is, try a native Android phone if the Vogue port doesn't suit you. Don't give up on it too easily.

Hello
I am using NFSFAN latest rom on my vogue.Have not tried any android as yet.Honestly,I have not followed it atall.So I am a complete noob to android platform.
So can anybody point me where I can get all the guidanceThanks.

Wow! I don’t mean to sound patronizing but I am genuinely impressed by the quality of responses to this question. Someone actually dared to ask a question about comparing WM vs. Android and there wasn’t any of the typical flame war style responses. Thanks guys! Just one more reason why I like the XDA forums.
I have been looking for a clear and concise answer (or partial answer) on this exact topic myself. I was hoping to get a quantifiable “here’s why I like Android” or “here’s why I like WM” response and I finally found something in this discussion.
I find that a certain anti-Microsoft sentiment often clouds these discussions to the point where they are not useful.
I have been using WM for *years* and develop applications for it. I am also supporting over 50+ Windows Mobile-based devices in the enterprise (warehouse & sales force automation apps). So when people come out and say stuff like “WM is slow, bloated and buggy” I find it an unhelpful response. I just have to chalk their comments up to anti-Microsoft sentiment that is so popular these days.
From this discussion I have a partial conclusion. It seems that the main difference between WM and Android are from a “user experience” perspective. Both of them seem to be reliable robust platforms from an OS perspective. The problem is that the WM interface is dated and heavily stylus oriented. Microsoft’s response to this is to make things “bigger” but not to radically rethink the user interface.
Windows Mobile in its present form bears an uncanny resemblance to Pocket PC 2002. This was designed to compete (and win) against the then popular PalmOS.
Android represents a complete rethink from a user interface perspective. On top of that companies like HTC add their own stuff like SenseUI (on Android) and TouchFLO (on WM) that change the user experience some more. So sometimes that makes the discussion more about the phone manufacturer (HTC vs. Samsung for example) then about the platform itself.
Microsoft is in a tough spot with WM right now. There is a huge install base of mobile business apps running on industrialized PDA’s (stuff like the MC75, MC55, Intermec CN50, etc, etc). The Purolator guys use WM for proof-of-delivery. These types of apps are often custom developed, expensive and have long life cycles. They are not sexy but they get work done.
Radically rethinking the WM user interface would likely break a lot of these types of applications. Everyone knows when switching to Android that their existing WM apps will not run. But everyone expects their existing WM apps from 1998 to run unmodified on the latest version of WM (and surprisingly they often do).
So how does Microsoft keep WM dominant in the business sector while at the same time making it “exciting and sexy” in the rapidly changing consumer marketplace?
Tough spot indeed. I wonder what they will do. I do love the competition from Android (and iPhone) and expect to see cool stuff from WM in the future. I just hope it doesn’t break too many of my 10+ year old apps ;-)
Regards,
The Fish

Rhodium is a non supported device for Pandora

Well tired of the tiny buttons in even the modded versions of Pandora I took a minute to email them to let them know that I like their app but that its not really user friendly on the current generation of Dpadless devices and to ask them to work to fix that. I mean all I want is some bigger buttons for the touch screen. Here is the response I got.
Hi Richard,
Thanks for writing and for the suggestion. Unfortunately we don't support Pandora on this device. Every device is a bit different, even if it seems to have the same operating system, or even the same model number. Buttons, display sizes, internal hardware and capabilities, as well as support software functions can be completely different. The carriers configure these devices specifically for their networks and often install different software on them too.
We only offer Pandora as a downloadable application to devices that we have fully tested to ensure the application will work correctly and won't cause any problems with functions of the device. We are working on a lot of different devices. We are giving priority to the most popular "PDA" type devices that are currently available on the largest US carriers.
If you install a version of the Pandora application on an unsupported device it might work fine. But probably not. It could even cause the device to malfunction in some way.
Hope this is helpful. Thanks for listening!
Best,
Mike
Listener Support, Pandora
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What the heck? A phone, that is available worldwide, on every major carrier in the US and available in both CDMA and GSM versions and we get the brush off! Not to mention the ridiculous technical response. I'm so livid. I applaud them for their honesty but come on now, we aren't talking about bubba gumps phone co and devices here. If they want testers maybe they should ask. They would get plenty of volunteers here! Matter of fact thats exactly what I will suggest.

Windows Mobile has no buzz like the iPhone, the Droid (or all Android devices), or the BlackBerry line, or the Palm Pre/Pixi. It's no surprise that they aren't even developing a WinMo app anymore.

rahlquist said:
Well tired of the tiny buttons in even the modded versions of Pandora I took a minute to email them to let them know that I like their app but that its not really user friendly on the current generation of Dpadless devices and to ask them to work to fix that. I mean all I want is some bigger buttons for the touch screen. Here is the response I got.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this is the one i use. change the tcp side to 98304 in tweaks/network, copy and paste the pandora.exe in vga-pandora.zip to where ever you installed pandora. in case you dont have a pandora cab file. use the one attached, pandora.cab
i used another pandora before i found this and my god the old one had such small [email protected][email protected]%### words!! this one is legible now!!

gshadow325 said:
this is the one i use. change the tcp side to 98304 in tweaks/network, copy and paste the pandora.exe in vga-pandora.zip to where ever you installed pandora. in case you dont have a pandora cab file. use the one attached, pandora.cab
i used another pandora before i found this and my god the old one had such small [email protected][email protected]%### words!! this one is legible now!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for this I have been looking for way to use pandora on my TP2.

HD2 Windows Phone 7 Overview

If you're looking to hack your HD2 to get Windows Phone 7, be aware of this:
1. It's completely unsupported by Microsoft or HTC
2. It will erase all data on your phone and SD card in it
3. Unless you get a correct micro SD card, it will randomly reboot. A short term fix for this is to play an album in Zune and put the phone on vibrate.
4. It will greatly diminish your battery life. You will need an extended battery just to make it through a whole day.
5. You have to jailbreak it and install a certificate and move a file or two using third party app to download apps and then call up Microsoft in hopes they will give you the code.
6. There is a minor 3G problem; to fix it, try going into the settings, then tap on cellular, scroll down and click add apn, then in the APN field, type in internet2.voicestream.com and leave the user name and password fields blank. If that doesn't work, try typing in wap.voicestream.com or epc.tmobile.com. Make sure you turn roaming on. Note: Only works if you have T-Mobile.
I tried it but I put WP6.5 back on because it has a file explorer, you don't need Marketplace to install all of you apps you can just download them from the internet and install them, it has internet sharing, and for $25 I can get a personal hotspot. I also like the camera better because it is widescreen and takes panorama. I can do prettymuch anything with it!

I was JUST about to see what the fuss was about... And now I see its not worth it. Thanks! You saved me some headaches, lol
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA Premium App

Ared777 said:
If you're looking to hack your HD2 to get Windows Phone 7, be aware of this:
1. It's completely unsupported by Microsoft or HTC - Who gives a hoot? If people are on XDA, they're not very likely to worry too much about that... They get all their support right here...
2. It will erase all data on your phone and SD card in it - True, but anyone thinking of going WP7 on their HD2 should already be aware of this and have purchased a decent card...
3. Unless you get a correct micro SD card, it will randomly reboot. A short term fix for this is to play an album in Zune and put the phone on vibrate. - True, but anyone thinking of going WP7 on their HD2 should already be aware of this and have purchased a decent card...
4. It will greatly diminish your battery life.- I have not found this to be the case... I find it drains about the same as the stock rom that was delivered with my phone... You will need an extended battery just to make it through a whole day.
5. You have to jailbreak it and install a certificate and move a file or two using third party app to download apps and then call up Microsoft in hopes they will give you the code. Crap, just get the code... I didn't have to jailbreak a thing...
6. There is a minor 3G problem; to fix it, try going into the settings, then tap on cellular, scroll down and click add apn, then in the APN field, type in internet2.voicestream.com and leave the user name and password fields blank. If that doesn't work, try typing in wap.voicestream.com or epc.tmobile.com. Make sure you turn roaming on. Note: Only works if you have T-Mobile. - T who?
I tried it but I put WP6.5 back on because it has a file explorer, you don't need Marketplace to install all of you apps you can just download them from the internet and install them, it has internet sharing, and for $25 I can get a personal hotspot. I also like the camera better because it is widescreen and takes panorama. I can do prettymuch anything with it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Without marketplace and xbox live the WP7 is pretty spartan, but when fully operational there's not an OS near it...
My view for anyone thinking of trying WP7 is, try it fully working and then make a decision... Have a stock WM rom ready if WP7 aint for you...

Im sorry but most of this is utter FUD!
There are a few things wrong with the HD2 running WP7 but given that it was never supposed to work with it anyway i think its amazing
WP7 has been on my HD2 for months, it works fantasticly, and i wont go back to Droid or WM for my main OS
Note i do sill use a WM6.5 device for some key software that i cant get on WP7 but other than 2 pieces of software its great!
SD cards are a big issue, its luck if you get one taht works, that is one of the things you have to pay to be able to use this OS on our Device, if you dont like it buy an HD7
APN settings are operator specific, use the HTC connection tool and it will sort it all out for you
you dont need to unlock the device if you intend to use LEGAL apps from the market place, if you wish to use dodgy apps or unsigned XAPs developed by users then you will need to unlock it. Normally ALL you have to do is phone MS or use the chat and get a code, and thats it, everything works
Of course its unsupported by MS, your using software on a device that it was never intened for, why would you think other wise? and it is exactly that thinking that would stop MS from allowing (but not supporting) the HD2 because people like you assume MS should help them! Why!? anyhow, thats why we have XDA-DEV
Battery life is much the same, and very good if you consider PUSH is working
of course it will format the card, i dont see the argument here?
Install linux on your windows computer (not VM), does it format anything? yes it does

GunBuri said:
I was JUST about to see what the fuss was about... And now I see its not worth it. Thanks! You saved me some headaches, lol
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
mate, talk to people on here that know what they are talking about before you make your mind up, of course the choice is yours but at least make an informed decision based on facts.

argentocruz said:
Without marketplace and xbox live the WP7 is pretty spartan, but when fully operational there's not an OS near it...
You forgot to mention facebook, but anyway those three things are what WP7 is targeted for. I got to play around with two native devices and to me they feel like a mobile gaming device that has the added advantage of making phonne calls and accessing the internet via a mobile network and not WiFi
My view for anyone thinking of trying WP7 is, try it fully working and then make a decision... Have a stock WM rom ready if WP7 aint for you...[/B]
I agree totally as WP7 as it is currently even in native WP7 devices is not for everyone. Maybe in the future it will improve but something tells me it will not as it is not geared to be a functional OS for a mobile device but just a gaming and social networking device OS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Blah, blah, blah, blah

I just had to reply to this.
I'm tech savvy, but not so when it comes to phones, so i spent weeks reading up on here. No way could I do what you guys do, but I read enough to not brick my phone.
I followed one of the guides, phone worked but was buggy.
Then followed another guide, installed a different ROM and phone is great. Activated via online chat with microsoft rep who was very patient and helpful as I originally entered code using caps, should all be lower case.
I now have a fully functional wp7 device, bing maps works very quick, hotmail contacts sync constantly, zune music sync is flawless, battery now actually lasts more than a full day (used to barely do that on wm6.5) and now I even have a full res camera too, nothing wrong at all with wp7 on my phone.
Every once in a while it stops accessing my apps, but to be honest my hd2 already had the occasional quirk. A quick reboot fixes that (and it is quick).
I bought a 16gb class 2 sandisk sd card from amazon for £16 as I read that is likely to work. Not had an issue with it.
If you read around and understand it takes a little work (though not that much) then having wp7 on an hd2 is really good.
The only thing I'm missing is turn by turn with voice satnav, but that's missing from wp7 itself and will hopefully be resolved legitimately soon.
Sorry for the long post, but I really felt like I needed to comment.
by the way, thanks to all you guys for the amazing work you've done, allowing me to post the above.

guys is there any way i can dual boot wp7 and android , either from nand or sd card ??

Absolutely, via SD card and MAGLDR.
There is a thread with full instructions on the Development forum - here

deleted by user

true........ but
argentocruz:
1. True dat
2. 16 gb micro sd card: $50, for that much, just extend your contract and get a refurb HD7, same price.
3. [Same]
4. Not in my experience
5. I live in the U.S. enough said.
You are still forgetting the internet sharing, which doesnt exist on WP7, which was one of the main reasons I bought the HD2. Also you have the file explorer, which was also very nice. I could be wrong, but I don't think you can download files directly from the internet, either in WP7; didn't have long enough to try it.
Bottom line: WP7 is just a glorified iPhone, Windows Mobile gives you true freedom.

I absolutely love WP7 on my HD2. Sure there are a few....I mean VERY few things I miss from WinMo, but not enough to revert back or go to android (bleh). I actually have a phone that works now, lol! The main thing I miss from WinMo on HD2 is the camera. Other than that, I'm EXTREMELY happy with WP7. And getting the activation code & unlocking the phone are so easy, it wouldn't deter any real poweruser. Plus I love the challenge of learning/hacking a new OS, especially one that's a challenge.

Ared777 said:
argentocruz:
Bottom line: WP7 is just a glorified iPhone, Windows Mobile gives you true freedom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i agree that WM is an amazing OS, it was seriously hampered by the networks and very poor driver support though, IF we had the correct drivers for the graphics it would rival WP7 and Android.
However, that is not the case, so whilst WM remains a beast of an OS that can do almost anything its not got a good UI and its social intigration isnt as good.
which is exactly why i want to dual boot WM and WP7, at the moment i have to take my old Touch HD around if i wish to use WM which isnt ideal
To say WP7 is like an iPhone isnt completely correct, its similar yes, are targeted to the same demographic but after using an iphone and android for quite a long time, you wont find me moving back.
If they cant get WM to dual boot with WP7 i would love WP7 to have a sandboxed WM environment to allow me to run WM apps or even better as devices get more powerful with dual cores to have an Emulated WM OS
The potential for WP7 is massive, we can only hope they take WM and somehow shove its functionality in to WP7, sand boxed for course to maintain OS integrity, which unfortunatly is what WM failed at.
The carriers buggered it for WM, and MS got the blame for it, what people dont realise is that MS had little to do with what happened to MS, other than its inaction and sorting it out that is!

yeah
dazza9075 said:
i agree that WM is an amazing OS, it was seriously hampered by the networks and very poor driver support though, IF we had the correct drivers for the graphics it would rival WP7 and Android.
However, that is not the case, so whilst WM remains a beast of an OS that can do almost anything its not got a good UI and its social intigration isnt as good.
which is exactly why i want to dual boot WM and WP7, at the moment i have to take my old Touch HD around if i wish to use WM which isnt ideal
To say WP7 is like an iPhone isnt completely correct, its similar yes, are targeted to the same demographic but after using an iphone and android for quite a long time, you wont find me moving back.
If they cant get WM to dual boot with WP7 i would love WP7 to have a sandboxed WM environment to allow me to run WM apps or even better as devices get more powerful with dual cores to have an Emulated WM OS
The potential for WP7 is massive, we can only hope they take WM and somehow shove its functionality in to WP7, sand boxed for course to maintain OS integrity, which unfortunatly is what WM failed at.
The carriers buggered it for WM, and MS got the blame for it, what people dont realise is that MS had little to do with what happened to MS, other than its inaction and sorting it out that is!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^agreed. I'm waiting for someone to release (probably cotulla) to release WM6.5 or WP7 for an SD card and just boot into whichever system is necessary. WP7 would probably be my primary because it is less buggy, easier to use, and has much better apps. Also I agree with you that they should have put WM functionality into WP7, because WM was probably the closest mobile OS to an actual computer OS, because it had the file explorer, also you can install programs from anywhere, not just Marketplace. That was what really disappointed me about WP7, and also it didn't have internet sharing, which was such a great feature! All you had to do was tap the button, plug it into your computer, and click connect and within 2 minutes you were getting internet on your PC through your phone.

Actually, if properly installed WP7 runs better than its native WinMo 6.5, and much better than Android!
I have been using it for the last few months without glitches, bugs, etc.
It is simple, all your basics (texts, emails, contacts, IE) are easily accessible; typing on it is better than anything out there (including Iphone), very simple and intuitive graphics.
However, when you get into 'hubs' and apps WP7's sheer graphic beauty comes forward. And this is what makes it a great OS, simple for every day use (too many screens and widgets in Android come to mind as something I wish to avoid), and beautiful when you get deeper into it!
Also, it is very FAST and stable!
There is also something called Touch Explorer which is same as File Explorer in WM6.5.
You can also download Navigo for your navigational needs, and may I tell you it runs perfectly and is very accurate.
There is a plethora of apps here on XDA which you can download onto your unlocked HD2 (an advantage over native devices) just do some research and you will have everything you had on your old WM6.5.
Do you remember the Voice Commander on the old OS, you had to reinstall it every time you flashed a ROM, it was slow, and leggy. On WP7 is fast and very accurate.
My advice is to properly flash this OS, use it for a month and you will not revert to WM or Android.
Also, it would not hurt to see the upcoming Mango update (go to Youtube) to see in which direction this OS is moving.
Microsoft did not enter the mobile market with this OS to play, it came to kill.

mfrey0118 said:
deleted by user
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry for being off topic, but this guy's sig attracted me.
"Black HTC HD2" .. lol wut ?

I love the fluidity of the OS, but sometimes it is so simple and clean that it become annoying (Coming from Android NAND). I would still prefer android but you really can't beat WP7 on the HD2 since it has 720p recording. The HTC Hub application is pretty nice too.