Related
This is for all those people that think auto-killer is the be all and end all of android.
Auto-Killer Does:
Kill Apps to free up RAM
Auto-Killer Does NOT:
Speed up your phone
Here is why!
The way RAM works is - it temporarily stores the files needed to run an application so that the CPU can access them quicker than from ROM/SD-Card.
RAM does NOT slow down when it has more information stored within it, therefore having 20 MB of free ram or 120 MB will make NO difference to the speed of your phone.
Ironically, having more free RAM may even slow down your app loading times because:
If you wish to launch an app and you have 120 MB of free ram with no apps loaded it will have to load the app from your ROM/SD into the RAM and then access it from there.
On the other hand if you have the app already loaded into the RAM, with only 20 MB of free ram, it will load quicker because it doesn't have to check the ROM/SD first!
Therefore, having less RAM free means that more apps will load quicker. In addition to that, Android already has a built in task killer which is designed to kills apps which haven't been used in a long time when you get to a very low ram figure.
btdag said:
This is for all those people that think auto-killer is the be all and end all of android.
Auto-Killer Does:
Kill Apps to free up RAM
Auto-Killer Does NOT:
Speed up your phone
Here is why!
The way RAM works is - it temporarily stores the files needed to run an application so that the CPU can access them quicker than from ROM/SD-Card.
RAM does NOT slow down when it has more information stored within it, therefore having 20 MB of free ram or 120 MB will make NO difference to the speed of your phone.
Ironically, having more free RAM may even slow down your app loading times because:
If you wish to launch an app and you have 120 MB of free ram with no apps loaded it will have to load the app from your ROM/SD into the RAM and then access it from there.
On the other hand if you have the app already loaded into the RAM, with only 20 MB of free ram, it will load quicker because it doesn't have to check the ROM/SD first!
Therefore, having less RAM free means that more apps will load quicker. In addition to that, Android already has a built in task killer which is designed to kills apps which haven't been used in a long time when you get to a very low ram figure.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude, you're talking to deaf ears.
n00bs doesn't care about memory management and schedulers and such stuff... so they do what they always did on their WinMo devices...
I can only hope some listen.
what about task killer is that the same ?
LOL JK
Hmm at about 26 meg left, my phone gets buggy, and slow moving.
'I dont believe appkiller makes my phone is faster, BUT It does´nt get slow...(26meg and lower)
So Autokiller will help my phone having more ram, and the phone is running fine
About the 120 meg free ram, I agree, just use a lower setting
BR.
MKrogh
btdag said:
having 20 MB of free ram or 120 MB will make NO difference to the speed of your phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry but experience says it does.
case0 said:
I'm sorry but experience says it does.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I love the way peoples minds work. Tricks of the mind buddy, tricks of the mind...
Sure, task killers will not speed up your phone, but they will end apps that drain your battery (i.e. facebook, etc.).
I hear what you say and understand what you mean but if that is the case can you explain to me why, after a day or so my phone slows to a crawl and clearing out the memory speeds it up again?
Betty_Swallocks said:
I hear what you say and understand what you mean but if that is the case can you explain to me why, after a day or so my phone slows to a crawl and clearing out the memory speeds it up again?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Buggy apps wich leaks memory?
I know technically you are right but my Hero get s laggy once the RAM gets low probably due to to many background tasks running at the same time so `freeing up memory`ie killing background tasks definitely removes the lag and speeds things up again
I have to agree with kilsally here. What you have to think its that the more tasks that is open in the background in memory or not the phone will slow down due to the amount of processors running. Just like a PC the more running the slow that gets. One way to improve this is to increase system memory. In the phones case memory is not upgradable (but would be great if it could be!).
When you end tasks using task killer, it's like ending tasks on a computer and WILL speed it back up again (as there is no/very little processors running to slow it down).
Catch my drift?
its great that theres information out there stating how task killers and android shouldnt play together, but when it comes down to it, advanced task killer pro realllllllyyyyy helps keep my phone speedy. around 20 mb is where my phone gets clammy, around 65 mb is where it grows wings. at the end of the day, if i works for you do it. if not dont. THAT'S the beauty of open source <3
Well thats not really true. Although having 20mb or 120mb RAM free itself will not speed up the phone, when using a task killer to clean up running apps you see the speed increase through the lesser toll on the CPU.
When you close and app in android it very rarely closes (the developer will have to force the phone to close the process thread - its very messy), it goes to 'sleep' this often a good thing as it makes opening the app up again much quicker. however most apps leave background processes running all eating away at a chunk of CPU. using a task killer should providing there are a fair amount of apps running to start with boost the phones performance generally
</rant>
Wez.
Wezternator said:
Well thats not really true. Although having 20mb or 120mb RAM free itself will not speed up the phone, when using a task killer to clean up running apps you see the speed increase through the lesser toll on the CPU.
When you close and app in android it very rarely closes (the developer will have to force the phone to close the process thread - its very messy), it goes to 'sleep' this often a good thing as it makes opening the app up again much quicker. however most apps leave background processes running all eating away at a chunk of CPU. using a task killer should providing there are a fair amount of apps running to start with boost the phones performance generally
</rant>
Wez.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
exactly! background apps doesn't only use your ram. many apps uses the cpu aswell and there for slowing down the phone
Wezternator said:
Well thats not really true. Although having 20mb or 120mb RAM free itself will not speed up the phone, when using a task killer to clean up running apps you see the speed increase through the lesser toll on the CPU.
When you close and app in android it very rarely closes (the developer will have to force the phone to close the process thread - its very messy), it goes to 'sleep' this often a good thing as it makes opening the app up again much quicker. however most apps leave background processes running all eating away at a chunk of CPU. using a task killer should providing there are a fair amount of apps running to start with boost the phones performance generally
</rant>
Wez.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
which is exactly why when i have around 20mbs of ram left, killing apps makes my phone faster. people are thinking tooooooo technical about it. its not about memory being used, but whats in the memory (app) isnt slowing things down, but the fact that that app is causing cpu strain is!
It depends what you information you want to have 'pushed' to your phone. If you require it to be 'pushed' the app must run in memory to allow this to happen. Task Killer can kill apps that you don't require 'push' information.
I thought android paused cpu threads that wernt in use?
Also, doesnt matter if you have 20MB of free ram or 2TeraByte of free ram.
I've tried with and without task killers,far less problems without, and i felt it was faster without.
this kinda smells like RAM / registry cleaners for Windows, bull**** aimed at non-technical noobies.
SherlockHolmz said:
this kinda smells like RAM / registry cleaners for Windows, bull**** aimed at non-technical noobies.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly my thoughts.
tierra said:
Sure, task killers will not speed up your phone, but they will end apps that drain your battery (i.e. facebook, etc.).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How does facebook drain your battery? I run the app from time to time, never changes bettery life. Also the people talking about CPU hogs - most apps go to sleep in the background and do not take up cpu to continue to run (or at least a minimal amount) - if you're running apps which have memory leaks etc then i think you should choose a different app to use instead of relying on a task killer to kill the task every time it goes wrong.
SherlockHolmz said:
I thought android paused cpu threads that wernt in use?
this kinda smells like RAM / registry cleaners for Windows, bull**** aimed at non-technical noobies.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Programs that aren't in use do get 'paused' however nearly any program running needs to maintain some CPU activity to stop it from crashing, and some register services that run in the background aiding the program doing what ever it does, these often don't get stopped.
Reg cleaners on PC's are incredibly useful for older PC's, ones what have had a lot of stuff installed and un-installed, and ones with slower HDD's. Because programs don't always remove any reg entries they put in when installed the registry can become massive, with slower/older PC's that can reduce performance quite a lot because it takes longer to find the things that are required, obviously this won't be a problem on newish PC's (ones with sata or solid state, or even fairly new IDE etc) but ones with old 5400rpm IDE (old laptop drives) drives may struggle a little.
again, </rant>
Wez
I have rooted my Asus TF, Put on the H 3.1 os, used Clemsyn Blades kernel, running very nicely. I have rooted it, and uninstalled crap like facebook, books, splashtop etc...lot of useless bloatware is out...However here is the problem........LOW MEMORY....This machine has ram of 1GB, and only 800mb shows, so almost 200 for the GI, and out of that 800, about 400mb is always used, despite using various app killers, I think we should be able to get it to about 200mb used? anyone know where so much of ram is bieng eaten
My question to you great knowledgeable friends is;
1) how to get rid of more useless apps eating memory
2) does using a different launcher reduce ram eating?
3) is it possible to achieve about 200-300mb consistent ram?
This is an awsome machine, I think more tweks we can make is super. I have a Samsung GS2, I have removed most of the stock stuff on it and set up my ownlauncher etc. It runs with amazing memory, 500mb free, and awsome graphics interface. Less nonsense.
MasterfullDON said:
I have rooted my Asus TF, Put on the H 3.1 os, used Clemsyn Blades kernel, running very nicely. I have rooted it, and uninstalled crap like facebook, books, splashtop etc...lot of useless bloatware is out...However here is the problem........LOW MEMORY....This machine has ram of 1GB, and only 800mb shows, so almost 200 for the GI, and out of that 800, about 400mb is always used, despite using various app killers, I think we should be able to get it to about 200mb used? anyone know where so much of ram is bieng eaten
My question to you great knowledgeable friends is;
1) how to get rid of more useless apps eating memory
2) does using a different launcher reduce ram eating?
3) is it possible to achieve about 200-300mb consistent ram?
This is an awsome machine, I think more tweks we can make is super. I have a Samsung GS2, I have removed most of the stock stuff on it and set up my ownlauncher etc. It runs with amazing memory, 500mb free, and awsome graphics interface. Less nonsense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you haven't done so already you could use Titanium Backup to remove more stuff (including system apps) since you're rooted. I would advise caution however in case you remove the wrong thing. Perhaps someone else can post regarding which particular system apps are safe to remove, as I haven't expreimented with this myself.
jonitfcfan said:
If you haven't done so already you could use Titanium Backup to remove more stuff (including system apps) since you're rooted. I would advise caution however in case you remove the wrong thing. Perhaps someone else can post regarding which particular system apps are safe to remove, as I haven't expreimented with this myself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ive done that and removed about 10 items. Its running well at 1.4GHz but only problem too much ram usage.
jonitfcfan said:
If you haven't done so already you could use Titanium Backup to remove more stuff (including system apps) since you're rooted. I would advise caution however in case you remove the wrong thing. Perhaps someone else can post regarding which particular system apps are safe to remove, as I haven't expreimented with this myself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He could just freeze them first and play with the tf a couple of days and if there are no problems, delete them.
Removing junk isn't a bad thing to do, but in my experience, app killers do more bad than good in android. Other than in windows, you don't need tons of free ram to run apps smoothly. Android has a great ram management that fills your ram with apps for fast access, and closes the least used/needed when another app requests more ram. So if you use an app killer, your tf will have more to do with restarting the apps you just closed and your performance will actually decrease. Google it and you'll know what I mean.
Regards
Qwer23
Sent from my rooted X10i using awesome custom roms
MasterfullDON said:
Ive done that and removed about 10 items. Its running well at 1.4GHz but only problem too much ram usage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As i said before, much ram usage isn't necessarily a bad thing. It only eats performance if a running app is badly coded and doesn't give its ram free when required. Then you better kill this specific app instead of autokilling stuff. Well coded apps won't eat your performance, no matter how much ram is used.
Sent from my rooted X10i using awesome custom roms
300Mb oof ram are dedicated to Nvidia Tegra 2. For this reason you read "only" 700Mb. Maybe in near future we will able to allocate more memory than 256Mb to our Tegra 2
memory usage doesn't mean too much now if the app/programe is properly coded, when needed, android should be able to release them on the fly......
same goes to my windows 7 machine, it's got 8 gig memory but the free memory always remains under 500M because the system is using them to cache most recently used applications.
Constantly clearing memory will not help too much, and believe or not, it worsens both the performance and the battery life..
but again, android is not as robust as windows in the terms of memory management, so it's not a bad idea to occasionally take a look at the actual memory usage but just don't go too excessive...
Screwing around with app-killers is never a good idea. Are you actually experiencing issues due to insufficient RAM? I've never had an issue with RAM on my Transformer. Android is much better at handling its memory than people are, let it do its thing.
And for the record, RAM is there to be used. It's the fastest memory a device has, so the more it makes use of, the better. If something else needs more RAM, Android will flush out something that doesn't need it.
I think app-killers are one of the biggest issues with Android, in that people seem to think they're necessary. Unless you actually have some app that's misbehaving or has a memory-leak or something, you shouldn't ever really need to manage your running applications. Just leave it all alone for a while and see how you go.
Midda said:
And for the record, RAM is there to be used. It's the fastest memory a device has, so the more it makes use of, the better. If something else needs more RAM, Android will flush out something that doesn't need it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Perfectly said. Don't mess your Transformer around with "Task Manager"-type apps.
Midda said:
Are you actually experiencing issues due to insufficient RAM? go.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
not at all. The machine is fast, its very quick and loads things quickly. The only time I had problem is using logmein, it crashed and said out of memory...I was a bit perplexed. I cleared a lot on my SGS2, and it was much faster.
Let me know any ideas, otherwise, as suggested, I will see how it goes
From my previous experience with Android devices, it's nearly impossible to increase the amount of free ram. I've tried, and only found one solution that I'll talk about later.
This isn't a bad thing. Ram is not CPU usage, and ram is going to use roughly the same amount of electricity regardless.
What android does is fill up the ram with programs that you will potentially use. That way when you want to use the program, it's already loaded in memory. When you load another program into memory, say a game, it will close apps to make room for the new app.
If you really want more memory, the closest thing is a swap file or partition. I use one on my phone, and it helps a good bit. Don't know if it would help the TF101, since it already has 1GB ram.
If you are still set on more free ram, try a program like auto memory manager (there is also another program very similar, has a blue fish for a logo but I forget the name). This doesn't kill apps in memory. Instead it changes the the when android closes programs in memory based on how much free memory is available and the priority of the program. I used it before on my phone with pretty good success, but now I use a swap file instead.
Right now I don't use a swap file or memory manager on my tf101, sine it runs great without it.
Thanks for all your responses.
I think this article should explain how Android 2.x operates. Even though the article is not about Honeycomb (Android 3.x), I doubt Google has changed how it manages memory in Honeycomb.
Article here: h**p://lifehacker.com/5650894/android-task-killers-explained-what-they-do-and-why-you-shouldnt-use-them
(Sorry, can't link due to XDA's 8+ post policy...)
I only have 55xMB memory shown in the application though.
154MB Used 398MB Free
It sounds like everyone would benefit from using this script, but there's no specific guidance for the MyTouch 4G. I assume option 8 or 9 would be best since the phone has 512MB of ram.
Are there some roms that we shouldn't be using V6 SuperCharger with?
Link to V6 SuperCharger: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=991276
You're wrong on 2 points (possibly more):
1) This script is just the same as Autokiller app, with a small addition - it can (or can't) keep launcher in memory. Nothing new and revolutionary. This app exists for a couple of years.
2) This phone has 768MB of RAM. It won't benefit from a low memory killer (or actually, different settings for an existing in OS lowmemkiller), because it has TONS of memory. I just took a look at my phone, ~100MB of memory free, and ~300MB of remaining memory is taken by CACHED apps. If you don't know what it means - please read up on Android memory management, and I'll give you the short version - it's the same as free memory, but better.
It states in the first post:
Also Note: Nothing else does what The V6 SuperCharger does!
................Not AutoKiller Memory Optimizer, Not Auto Memory Manager, Not Minfree Manager...
The Nook Color has 512 MB of ram and people have noticed a big difference using this script on Cyanogenmod.
but since the Glacier has 768MB of ram, you won't notice much change.
saranhai said:
but since the Glacier has 768MB of ram, you won't notice much change.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have found it useful on ports and ROMs that aren't tweaked specifically for this phone. For instance, if TDJ made the ROM, V6 is useless. In fact, it will only hurt.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App
I use this script on my evo and its great so I just rooted this phone and flashed the mik runny ROM, I was using it for a day and only stayed at about 100mb of RAM so I decided to use v6 with option 8 and now it stays around 200mb and is running super smooth.
IDK if that helps any but I always loved v6 and know a few people that use it on a few different phones and it always works for the better.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App
Why do people that know nothing or close to nothing about OS internals, decide that they have better knowledge of memory management should be, then OS and phone designers? The same people who don't know the difference between cached and active apps, and the only number they understand is the (useless) amount of free memory? I see it all over the forums, and it amazes me each time. How do people actually try to judge if something works well or not, without getting at least some basic understanding of how the things work?
Oh well, here it comes again:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=678205
Read this. Maybe you will understand something.
Few, if any, 512MB phones and no 768MB phones need this script, or any kind of tweaking for lowmemkiller values, especially not since Gingerbread and when not running Sense (which retains the ability to cache apps, removed in Gingerbread mostly to ease running the OS on older devices). The only thing it does, is to make garbage collector work harder and kick in earlier. It doesn't make your phone "smoother", and whoever think it does - should check the meaning of the word "placebo" in the nearest dictionary. The number that stands for "free memory" means something between "close to nothing" and "absolutely nothing".
I know I shouldn't be surprised, people always tend to have strong opinions on everything, even things they sometimes don't know a thing about. But still, it's XDA-Developers, not XDA-Phone-users, so at least something should be done about it. Even if the education attempts will fail, like they mostly do.
Jack_R1 said:
Why do people that know nothing or close to nothing about OS internals, decide that they have better knowledge of memory management should be, then OS and phone designers? The same people who don't know the difference between cached and active apps, and the only number they understand is the (useless) amount of free memory? I see it all over the forums, and it amazes me each time. How do people actually try to judge if something works well or not, without getting at least some basic understanding of how the things work?
Oh well, here it comes again:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=678205
Read this. Maybe you will understand something.
Few, if any, 512MB phones and no 768MB phones need this script, or any kind of tweaking for lowmemkiller values, especially not since Gingerbread and when not running Sense (which retains the ability to cache apps, removed in Gingerbread mostly to ease running the OS on older devices). The only thing it does, is to make garbage collector work harder and kick in earlier. It doesn't make your phone "smoother", and whoever think it does - should check the meaning of the word "placebo" in the nearest dictionary. The number that stands for "free memory" means something between "close to nothing" and "absolutely nothing".
I know I shouldn't be surprised, people always tend to have strong opinions on everything, even things they sometimes don't know a thing about. But still, it's XDA-Developers, not XDA-Phone-users, so at least something should be done about it. Even if the education attempts will fail, like they mostly do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do understand that in some cases you don't need a memory manager like if your running a stock ROM or an aosp ROM that doesn't take up as much memory.
Now I haven't had this phone long enough to say if this script is all that good for this phone but I know on the evo running a sense 3.0-3.5 ROM that wasn't meant for the phone and hugs up every little bit of memory that the phone has to offer, this scrip makes those ROMs usable.
Without it or something like it the phone can't handle doing simple tasks like using an app without fc something else like the launcher.
So you could say what you want and yes maybe this phone doesn't need it since it has more RAM and ROM but I'll still try things like this to try and see if it will better the phones performance.
Sorry if that doesn't make sense I'm still half asleep.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App
The instances where i have noticed that this works is while doing benchmarking with quadrant. It has shown increased framerates for me after running the script and I also get higher scores on quadrant, about 500-1k more than without. I dont know if its usefull for much other than benchmarking though. I think the phone runs fine without it though.
What you have to understand is performance is not measured via syntactic benchmarks (ex: Quadrant). The biggest issue with people is that they don't know enough to know that they don't know, so they compare it with silly numbers (ex: score) they can't comprehend what they see, much less put numbers behind real life activities that's not applicable in controlled environment.
Now far as V6-SC script goes its almost obsolete now due to few things. 1) Hardware advancement where now minimum spec requirements for "SmartPhone" are 1ghz single core proc with 512mb ram. But so called "SuperPhone" now has dual core 1ghz-1.5ghz with 768mb-1gb ram. So it make no sense as we don't use 256-566mhz proc with 64-256mb ram because we are more then enough hardware adequate for heavy daily usage. 2) OS development which elements most of it as hardware is more and more powerful. But on software level mostly all custom base rom (ex: CyanogenMod) is highly optimized and tweaked to run on optimal performance.
Now is it all placebo effect? Mostly, but not all. But does it mean it can't be tweaked any further? (Rhetorical) No. How do I know? We (scope outside of XDA) tweaked it to the next level. How you ask?
1) Optimized ext4fs: reduced r/w rate (healthy NAND lifespan), improved journaling (corrupted data writeback integrity) = Which improves the IOPs and performance access rate.
2) HC3.x fugu binaries, patched sqlite libraries, mSD read ahead buffer fix.
3) Modified VM: OOM (Out Of Memory), LMK (Low Memory Killer), VM heap (Virtual Machine), DRA (Dirty Ratio), DBR (Dirty Background Ratio), DWC (Dirty Writeback Centisecs), DEC (Dirty Expired Centisecs), SWP (Swap), VCP (VFS Cache Pressure).
4) Increased minfree value: Background, Foreground, Empty, Hidden, Visible, Secondary, Content.
5) Optimized cache: File and Drop cache, Forced cache (resident loop).
6) Custom kernel: OC/UC, UV/SVS/VDD, BFS/CFS, RSU/VR/SP supported.
7) Custom ROM: Optimized Rom script and props (ex: CyanogenMod).
I bet my superior MT4G can own your inferior MT4G. Cuz you can't touch this as its tweaked to THE next level. I'll stick with AOSP2.3.7GB until ICS4.X is more stable and we understand more as most memory grouping and adjustments might be changed.
Sent from my HTC Glacier
Jack_R1 said:
You're wrong on 2 points (possibly more):
1) This script is just the same as Autokiller app, with a small addition - it can (or can't) keep launcher in memory. Nothing new and revolutionary. This app exists for a couple of years.
2) This phone has 768MB of RAM. It won't benefit from a low memory killer (or actually, different settings for an existing in OS lowmemkiller), because it has TONS of memory. I just took a look at my phone, ~100MB of memory free, and ~300MB of remaining memory is taken by CACHED apps. If you don't know what it means - please read up on Android memory management, and I'll give you the short version - it's the same as free memory, but better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Obviously, you never tried it lol
Here... you may learn something new...
http://www.rt-embedded.com/blog/archives/linux-memory-consumption/
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=20163493&postcount=6695
Below a certain threshold of free ram (ie. not enough cached), the device WILL gag...
Hundreds if not thousands of users with 1 GB ram devices use it (Atrix, SGSII, etc.) and I know your phone stutters from time to time with a slight delay when pressing buttons from time to time since that's what my friend's Atrix does.
In fact, the biggest difference he notices is in the use of google maps... never a stutter.
So you're missing out.
zeppelinrox said:
[1] Obviously, you never tried it lol
[2] I know your phone stutters from time to time with a slight delay when pressing buttons from time to time since that's what my friend's Atrix does.
[3] So you're missing out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First of all as dev of V6-SC you would be very defensive but at same times your not charging money to normal folks for it is a good thing, so thank you. Which I can say less about other folks editing same value claiming it new. Now I don't know about Jack but let's be clear on few points.
1) I did try your so called script and didn't like the whole script manger + busybox cast AFTER the OS startup. Which normally you can achieve via daemon or init.d script after kernel is initialized by declaring and using native shell. So no need for force apply afterwards as it was utilized before it was initiated via script manager. Also V6-SC couldn't keep the selected category minfree value which changed. But in short I didn't notice anything revolutionary as it was fully optimized long before I randomly landed on Android General section and saw your post claiming it maximize the devices performance. Which I was spectacle about as from your post you did seem to have basic knowledge hopefully not from wiki/google but *nix usr exp before landing on to Android.
2) Like I said I don't know about Jacky Boy but I can GRANTEE you I have NEVER had this so called "button delay" you specified. But I did modify the sampling rate and pressure density accommodated by tweaking transition speed. But now I run min:368mhz/max:1027mhz/gov:SmartAssV2. But even when I was battery conscience before I had MP1650mAh I ran on min:230mhz/max:768mhz/gov:SmartAssV1 with custom -75 to -100 VDD using ~14mA idle and ~60-90mA active per unit scale. I never had lag with 200mb used RAM running at least 18-20pcs and 14-15svc. So what your friend is running (Atrix) is irrelevant also isolated.
3) O-RLY am I really missing out? I think ill stick to my own. But don't take this post personal as it was ment for it to be argumentative. Difference is I actually know what I'm talking about as I have strong backgrounds on...
Sent from my HTC Glacier
zeppelinrox said:
Obviously, you never tried it lol
Here... you may learn something new...
http://www.rt-embedded.com/blog/archives/linux-memory-consumption/
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=20163493&postcount=6695
Below a certain threshold of free ram (ie. not enough cached), the device WILL gag...
Hundreds if not thousands of users with 1 GB ram devices use it (Atrix, SGSII, etc.) and I know your phone stutters from time to time with a slight delay when pressing buttons from time to time since that's what my friend's Atrix does.
In fact, the biggest difference he notices is in the use of google maps... never a stutter.
So you're missing out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't need to try it to know. I tried Autokiller, I played with lowmemkiller settings and watched the results, and I did it on Nexus One with 512MB of memory. It never needed anything since Gingerbread, and unless I made the settings super-aggressive, Autokiller actually failed to make any difference whatsoever - the apps were killed based on their age and never dropped by replacing apps.
In the current system, I have 100MB free + 250MB cached apps (which is just the same as free - theoretically and practically). The main difference you're not accounting for is - Android isn't a Linux distro, it's a Linux-derived OS, with many changes for mobile activity, especially on the kernel level, especially in the memory management area. "Linux memory consumption" isn't Android memory consumption, since they manage things differently. Linux isn't build to kill running apps, its lowmemkiller can't do it. Linux doesn't have concurrent garbage collector. Many Linux examples are irrelevant. Cached apps in Android aren't cached pages in Linux, freeing cached pages in Linux isn't killing cached apps in Android, and the most important - "performance degradation" doesn't exist in Android, since you ALWAYS have enough memory for any size of task (the largest loading task requires 50MB of memory, and there's 100MB free on my phone), and concurrent garbage collection is ALWAYS present in the system, the only thing you're doing - is calling it earlier, making it actually work more and getting the system more laggy than it could be.
I understand that you want to protect your creation, but in this case, you're wrong, sorry. You won't convince me.
And yes, I don't know what "button lag" are you talking about.
HTC Glacier said:
First of all as dev of V6-SC you would be very defensive but at same times your not charging money to normal folks for it is a good thing, so thank you. Which I can say less about other folks editing same value claiming it new. Now I don't know about Jack but let's be clear on few points.
1) I did try your so called script and didn't like the whole script manger + busybox cast AFTER the OS startup. Which normally you can achieve via daemon or init.d script after kernel is initialized by declaring and using native shell. So no need for force apply afterwards as it was utilized before it was initiated via script manager. Also V6-SC couldn't keep the selected category minfree value which changed. But in short I didn't notice anything revolutionary as it was fully optimized long before I randomly landed on Android General section and saw your post claiming it maximize the devices performance. Which I was spectacle about as from your post you did seem to have basic knowledge hopefully not from wiki/google but *nix usr exp before landing on to Android.
2) Like I said I don't know about Jacky Boy but I can GRANTEE you I have NEVER had this so called "button delay" you specified. But I did modify the sampling rate and pressure density accommodated by tweaking transition speed. But now I run min:368mhz/max:1027mhz/gov:SmartAssV2. But even when I was battery conscience before I had MP1650mAh I ran on min:230mhz/max:768mhz/gov:SmartAssV1 with custom -75 to -100 VDD using ~14mA idle and ~60-90mA active per unit scale. I never had lag with 200mb used RAM running at least 18-20pcs and 14-15svc. So what your friend is running (Atrix) is irrelevant also isolated.
3) O-RLY am I really missing out? I think ill stick to my own. But don't take this post personal as it was ment for it to be argumentative. Difference is I actually know what I'm talking about as I have strong backgrounds on...
Sent from my HTC Glacier
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds like you never got it working properly.
Also, if you have init.d support no need to run anything on boot with script manager.
Maybe the rom's kernel was applying settings late.
And no my friends atrix is not isolated there is a rather big thread in the atrix forums.
SGSII users see benefits too so seems there is always room for improvement.
Jack_R1 said:
I didn't need to try it to know. I tried Autokiller, I played with lowmemkiller settings and watched the results, and I did it on Nexus One with 512MB of memory. It never needed anything since Gingerbread, and unless I made the settings super-aggressive, Autokiller actually failed to make any difference whatsoever - the apps were killed based on their age and never dropped by replacing apps.
In the current system, I have 100MB free + 250MB cached apps (which is just the same as free - theoretically and practically). The main difference you're not accounting for is - Android isn't a Linux distro, it's a Linux-derived OS, with many changes for mobile activity, especially on the kernel level, especially in the memory management area. "Linux memory consumption" isn't Android memory consumption, since they manage things differently. Linux isn't build to kill running apps, its lowmemkiller can't do it. Linux doesn't have concurrent garbage collector. Many Linux examples are irrelevant. Cached apps in Android aren't cached pages in Linux, freeing cached pages in Linux isn't killing cached apps in Android, and the most important - "performance degradation" doesn't exist in Android, since you ALWAYS have enough memory for any size of task (the largest loading task requires 50MB of memory, and there's 100MB free on my phone), and concurrent garbage collection is ALWAYS present in the system, the only thing you're doing - is calling it earlier, making it actually work more and getting the system more laggy than it could be.
I understand that you want to protect your creation, but in this case, you're wrong, sorry. You won't convince me.
And yes, I don't know what "button lag" are you talking about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was tempted to stop reading when you admit to not even using it.
If it did the same as AKMO or Auto Memory Manager why on earth would anybody bother.
I sure as hell wouldn't bother writing a 4500+ line script lol.
I totally agree that Android memory is not the same as linux (see my sig) but the similarities are there and the article I posted applies 100%.
Its not about free ram.
Its about the right balance.
In fact, many report LESS free ram, ie. better multitasking, along with better performance and smoother performance.
Because I don't think Android memory should work the same as linux memory either.
Also, you tried AKMO because you felt there could be improvement and it didn't work.
THAT'S why I wrote a 4500+ line script that blows anything else out of the water
zeppelinrox said:
Sounds like you never got it working properly.
Also, if you have init.d support no need to run anything on boot with script manager.
Maybe the rom's kernel was applying settings late.
And no my friends atrix is not isolated there is a rather big thread in the atrix forums.
SGSII users see benefits too so seems there is always room for improvement.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well my highly optimized as is but I am aware of V6 and others using it but personally I would stick to my.
Sent from my HTC Glacier
I recently purchased Nexus 7 16 Gb version. Haven't rooted it yet, will do it soon.
But I noticed that the moment I booted up the Nexus for the first time, I checked the App Settings and found out that around 500mb of RAM is being used. I calculated all the processes running and it only adds up to around 150mb. So why the extra 350mb?
Please help me. I tried factory reset several times yet no joy at all.
Dear god not another one of these threads. :crying:
Grrr most asked android question.
Android is a user interface running on a Linux kernel.. They do NOT manage ram like windows.They do not discard things and let ram sit empty. This takes more cpu cycles to reopen the app . Android memory management keeps things idle in ram . Things you use Most. So the next time you want it all it does it start it back up. It can do this without loading it back into ram. This is much more less taxing on the devices resources including battery life then having to run at full speed to open a app again that you run often..Also much of that ram is set aside for video function. If you get low on ram resources the Android os will toss out of memory the least used app to allow for what it needs.
DO NOT USE APP KILLERS. Do not use memory managers. Android does good job with this..
Also sometimes you can have rogue apps that constantly use the above to there benefit. If you start feeling your device gets very sluggish just watch what apps are at the top of the list. If you have one constantly there and never use it.. Its likely to be misbehaving and not following the devices memory rules. Remove that app and report it to the developer.
The above is a very QUICK Version and leaves much out but it will give you the basic understanding..
OHH and GOOGLE Can be your friend. this is THE MOST ASKED QUESTION ON ANDROID.. www.google.com/androidrammanagement
Sorry
Thanks for helping and I did search, probably searched incorrectly. All it came up was about memory space, not RAM. Again thanks for the help.
A reboot now and then helps. I was playing with a fixed demo setup of a Note 2 @ Tesco and it was incredibly laggy due to all the rug rats playing on it. Who knows how many days, or weeks that thing must have been running
Doesn't matter what Rom I'm on, cleanrom, aokp, stock, even after I close all apps and services all task managers tell me I am using at least 1gb
ALWAYS
Is this normal?
Use the search function on these forums
I'd try 4.2.2 stock, I have around 400-500MB usage idle. On 4.2.1 (stock and custom) I had way higher usage though (700MB-1GB).
On 4.2.2 though I seem to have only 1.2GB of usable RAM whereas 4.2.1 had 1.6GB
I'm no pro, but if RAM 'disappeared' maybe it got reserved as GPU memory? And the GPU using it's own pool now would explain why you have less used up in general.
bee55 said:
I'm no pro, but if RAM 'disappeared' maybe it got reserved as GPU memory? And the GPU using it's own pool now would explain why you have less used up in general.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well the N10 is advertised to have 2GB of RAM. Prior to 4.2.2, we had 1.6GB usable, with the other 400MB or so (from what I hear) reserved for the GPU already. Now after 4.2.2, there's 1.2GB usable.
May as well just sold it as a 1GB device at this point... lol
espionage724 said:
Well the N10 is advertised to have 2GB of RAM. Prior to 4.2.2, we had 1.6GB usable, with the other 400MB or so (from what I hear) reserved for the GPU already. Now after 4.2.2, there's 1.2GB usable.
May as well just sold it as a 1GB device at this point... lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol but almost all devices usable memory for the user is about half of the advertised amount
As you can see my 1gb ram HTC amaze only has about half usable
Sent from my Amaze 4G using xda app-developers app
filthygoat223996 said:
Lol but almost all devices usable memory for the user is about half of the advertised amount
As you can see my 1gb ram HTC amaze only has about half usable
Sent from my Amaze 4G using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm, the only other device that comes close to this behavior that I've seen is the Galaxy Tab 2 7.0 (stated 1GB, has around 600MB usable). The display isn't nearly HD on that (1024x600 I think) so I really can't think of an actual reason for the 400MB loss there.
A Galaxy Prevail I have shows about 235MB usable, with 384MB stated.
Can't recall numbers on the Nexus 7 or Galaxy Tab 7 though, but I really don't recall memory usage/free being of a concern.
espionage724 said:
Well the N10 is advertised to have 2GB of RAM. Prior to 4.2.2, we had 1.6GB usable, with the other 400MB or so (from what I hear) reserved for the GPU already. Now after 4.2.2, there's 1.2GB usable.
May as well just sold it as a 1GB device at this point... lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And the device does have 2gb RAM. You should know by now that the RAM in phones and tablets is versatile and used for more than just user space.
One could easily argue the counterpoint of yours, which is that 2gb of RAM means more for the GPU while still keeping a respectable amount for the user. But obviously, you need to do your research when buying.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using xda premium
With some simple init.d and sysctl.conf tweaks you can have complete control over how the RAM is used. Search is your friend. Or at least it should be. LOL
It has to share ram with the GPU. This is monster resolution screen... Did you think it would have as much ram usable as a 720p screen? There's a lot going on at all times with this hardware because of the screen. Remember that ram is worthless if its not being used.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda premium
They just released the updated kernel source for 4.2.2 for the N10 and there is a change where they up the ram reserved for the GPU by 384mb. The comment says they did this as otherwise when the GPU needed more ram it would cause fragmentation of the user space ram.
Geoff
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
Sounds reasonable enough.
...uhm...
styckx said:
Sounds reasonable enough.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
After having upgraded to 4.2.2... I have the same behaviour ....ram decreased to 1.3...in total before with 4.2.1 was 1.6...something strange, if the extra ram has been allocated for gpu....why with 4.2.1 wasn't like now?...in my opinion...they didn't free up the ram after upgrading..it's just locked...
I don't see notable differences between 4.2.2 and 4.2.1.... So that strange...could it be a bug?
borgy said:
After having upgraded to 4.2.2... I have the same behaviour ....ram decreased to 1.3...in total before with 4.2.1 was 1.6...something strange, if the extra ram has been allocated for gpu....why with 4.2.1 wasn't like now?...in my opinion...they didn't free up the ram after upgrading..it's just locked...
I don't see notable differences between 4.2.2 and 4.2.1.... So that strange...could it be a bug?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The answer to why the total ram availible has decreased has been solved - Read gzub post.
Called it re-allocated, free'd up or locked, The GPU now has 800mb in 4.2.2 all to its self, where as before it had half that. So in running apps you will only see a total of around 1.2gb.
moving on...
I have a similar issue as the OP.
Sitting idle its running at around 400-500mb used but can, and often does, spike up to over a gb which causes it to not function correctly (Chrome especially seems to throw a massive wobbler and never stay open). I have nothing different installed than I have on my N7 or S3. I mainly use it for browsing, email. If I check running apps there is nothing else there above what was there when it was idling at around 400-500mb.
I have tried a factory reset and the issue still persists. Next step is to roll back to 4.2.1 to see if I can get the stability back as I didn't have these issues on 4.2.1.
VanCatRabbit said:
The answer to why the total ram availible has decreased has been solved - Read gzub post.
Called it re-allocated, free'd up or locked, The GPU now has 800mb in 4.2.2 all to its self, where as before it had half that. So in running apps you will only see a total of around 1.2gb.
moving on...
I have a similar issue as the OP.
Sitting idle its running at around 400-500mb used but can, and often does, spike up to over a gb which causes it to not function correctly (Chrome especially seems to throw a massive wobbler and never stay open). I have nothing different installed than I have on my N7 or S3. I mainly use it for browsing, email. If I check running apps there is nothing else there above what was there when it was idling at around 400-500mb.
I have tried a factory reset and the issue still persists. Next step is to roll back to 4.2.1 to see if I can get the stability back as I didn't have these issues on 4.2.1.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds you might be suffering from the same thing as I have since I got my N10.
I don't know how many have this or has noticed it but after a while the amount of free memory just starts disappearing and no matter what you do, you don't seem to be able to recover it unless you reboot. And when the memory gets low enough, the device soft reboots itself. I still haven't found the cause of this but I have finally found where all the memory is going. It turns out that it's the surfaceflinger process that hogs the memory. I started checking when I was running low on memory and surfaceflinger was at that point using over 400MB of it. My suspicion was confirmed when I rebooted and noticed that it went down to around 25MB and now after a while of usage, it has slowly climbed to 50MB.
It would be great if some developer could take a look at this in order to try to fix it.
CazeW said:
Sounds you might be suffering from the same thing as I have since I got my N10.
I don't know how many have this or has noticed it but after a while the amount of free memory just starts disappearing and no matter what you do, you don't seem to be able to recover it unless you reboot. And when the memory gets low enough, the device soft reboots itself. I still haven't found the cause of this but I have finally found where all the memory is going. It turns out that it's the surfaceflinger process that hogs the memory. I started checking when I was running low on memory and surfaceflinger was at that point using over 400MB of it. My suspicion was confirmed when I rebooted and noticed that it went down to around 25MB and now after a while of usage, it has slowly climbed to 50MB.
It would be great if some developer could take a look at this in order to try to fix it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry for my ignorance, but what is surfaceflinger? I don't see anything similarly named on my device.
I've just downloaded 'usage timelines free' to monitor memory usage in more detail on all my devices and compare.
I'll try to update if I see anything interesting.
VanCatRabbit said:
Sorry for my ignorance, but what is surfaceflinger? I don't see anything similarly named on my device.
I've just downloaded 'usage timelines free' to monitor memory usage in more detail on all my devices and compare.
I'll try to update if I see anything interesting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a system process out of /system/bin/. Check your app to see if it's hiding system processes. Most of the process viewing apps/loggers hide system processes by default.
SurfaceFlinger is Androids compositor: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5699107/android-surfaceflinger
SurfaceFlinger shouldn't stay open though. Everytime I've seen it in OS Monitor the process lasts less than a second and disappears. Something he's running, or the ROM he's using is keeping it open for whatever reason..
styckx said:
It's a system process out of /system/bin/. Check your app to see if it's hiding system processes. Most of the process viewing apps/loggers hide system processes by default.
SurfaceFlinger is Androids compositor: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5699107/android-surfaceflinger
SurfaceFlinger shouldn't stay open though. Everytime I've seen it in OS Monitor the process lasts less than a second and disappears. Something he's running, or the ROM he's using is keeping it open for whatever reason..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I noticed it with the "ps" terminal command. Currently I'm running Aokp but before that I was running stock. I'm suspecting the aosp browser or flash being the cause but I can't confirm it.
EDIT: surfaceflinger is shown in OS Monitor all the time but with ps I can see the amount of memory it is using.
After some monitoring I found nothing. I did a full refresh install of 4.2.2 from the factory image and have installed nothing on top other than applying updates for what comes as standard. After two days of browsing it started to slow down again and show as low memory. I installed a terminal and ran 'PS surfaceflinger', it was showing as using over 600mbs. Stupidly I didn't take a screen dump, but I imagine it will happen again.
Anyone able to shed any light on what's going on here?
Having the same issue
I too have seen surfaceflinger using almost 600MB of RAM. My used RAM was over 1GB and apps were running very sluggish. My SwiftKey keyboard constantly does a soft restart in the middle of typing when the tablet is in this state as well as other apps acting as others have described in this thread. Time for a fix Google!