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NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its on its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
I'm keeping mine. The 'faults' are mostly little niggling things that can usually be gotten round by various hacks/tweaks people have made. And yeah it's a bit big, but you do get used to it
Positives:
- It's like having a little laptop.
- Connectivity wise it truly has it all - 3G, WI-FI, BT, video calling, SDIO, IRDA, etc. No other device has all of this.
- The WM5 OS makes it very easy to write programs/hacks for, so we will see a lot of these over the coming months.
- The VGA screen has a massive "wow" factor!
- Mini-USB connector and charger are very convenient indeed.
- Full-size headphone/speaker socket.
- Built in terminal services client is VERY useful!
- Awesome little keyboard with very good looking backlights.
- Persistant flash-based storage.
- Battery life is very good, lasts for many days on one charge.
- 4 (FOUR) speakers, and 2 (TWO) cameras! Flash is a nice gimmick too.
Basically for me, the huge amount of positives outweigh the small amount of negatives. Best "phone" I have ever owned.
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
vapor said:
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bought it at Mad Monkey Boy's Gadgets for 930 USD [qtek 9000]...and 20 USD for shipping to her address...
That makes it a total of 950USD....in comparison to 1350 USD here in India!!!
San
@sl9, I can only manage one day of use from my Exec's battery. I have been very careful with it from new. My Nokia 9500 with similar use can give me twice the life of the Exec battery. With the Exec if you use BT and forget to shutdown PIE you could run out of battery while you think the unit is "off/standby".
dreamtheater39 said:
vapor said:
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bought it at Mad Monkey Boy's Gadgets for 930 USD [qtek 9000]...and 20 USD for shipping to her address...
That makes it a total of 950USD....in comparison to 1350 USD here in India!!!
San
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wow thats crazy man. but thanks for the heads up
I echo everything sl9 has said. The most important positives for me are:
- persistent storage
- WM5 means I never have to use my stylus, except for 3rd-party apps that haven't caught up yet
- full keyboard makes SMS a breeze
- some very useful touches in the software, like the easy switch on/off of BT and WiFi using just a couple of keyboard presses
- flexible and automatic speaker usage depending on the machine's orientation
- the way the thing feels in your hands (cool/cold, solid, 'tight'): it's nice to hold
- the VGA screen for browsing, Excel, calendar, contacts, ListPro and Today screen (I'm in proper VGA mode)
- battery lasts days for me, but I'm probably a lighter user than y'all and now (because most are awful on WM5) have no 3rd-party apps except PocketZenPhone, TomTom and ListPro (per day: 8 hrs Bluetooth, 1 hr phone, 10 SMS, 1 hr general use, 30 mins WiFi browsing)
- stability: Haven't done a reset in a week or so. I never force-close apps, but rely on WM5 to handle it. I have no idea how much program memory I have free, and I don't care: it just works
- Microsoft's contacts app is very good for keyboard-only use: makes dialling a contact easy
- there are some neat improvements in the UI, such as the way BT comes on automatically when you choose 'ActiveSync over Bluetooth', and headset mode is always on automatically if BT is on and the machine has found your headset to pair with
Negatives for me:
- WiFi reception is very poor
- OEM-supplied voice dial is poor. I hate having to record voice tags, and it's not 100% reliable with detection. This could be my HBH-65 headset though. Sometimes the voice dial prompt cuts in when I'm trying to answer a call on the headset :evil:
- Microsoft's calendar app is very very weak, as is PocketIE, and PocketOutlook for emails
- the phone app should scale to VGA properly and it should have a built-in T9 contact finder (the O2-supplied 'Smart Dialler' doesn't take advantage of the hardware keyboard, so is pointless)
- speaking of which, O2's bundled software is pointless and unhelpful
Umm....
- oh yeah: the cameras are still very weak and useful only for taking emergency pictures, such as recording car accidents that you have and newsworthy moments
- the camera flash is useless as a camera flash, but very good as a torch, if only the machine had an easy way of using this feature
- the hardware application buttons aren't as programmable or flexible as they could/should be. I wish we could program each button through the OS for both Press and Press-'n-Hold
Of course a big negative ATM is the lack of 3rd-party apps that are truly compatible with WM5, but this is hardly the fault of HTC or the mobile operators.
So, the hardware is excellent (with the exception of the cameras and WiFi reception) but the OS-bundled software is flawed. Hopefully we'll get ROM updates that will improve things, just like we did for earlier HTC machines.
jah said:
@sl9, I can only manage one day of use from my Exec's battery. I have been very careful with it from new. My Nokia 9500 with similar use can give me twice the life of the Exec battery. With the Exec if you use BT and forget to shutdown PIE you could run out of battery while you think the unit is "off/standby".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then I would say your battery may be faulty. Do you have wi-fi on?
With bluetooth on permenantly, my MDA PRO lasts for 3~ days on one charge. Without bluetooth, it lasts for 4-5 days.
I'm a fairly light user though, 1 short voice call a day on average, although I do open it up and turn on the screen about 10 times a day to check for reminders, text, notes etc.
Perhaps you are a much heavier user of it than I am? Even so, battery life on your device does seem unusually short
@sl9,
Without BT I get 3.5 hours of use with a combination of eBooks, PIM, email & web browsing (50% using 3G). With BT on that reduces to 3 hours. I use my Nokia in a similar was as a phone, ebook reader, PDA, etc. This is my second Universal as I had a JJ before the Exec and the JJ's battery life was a little worst. This level of use is not unusual for a business user who also travels a lot.
SiliconS said:
I echo everything sl9 has said. The most important positives for me are:
- persistent storage
- WM5 means I never have to use my stylus, except for 3rd-party apps that haven't caught up yet
- full keyboard makes SMS a breeze
- some very useful touches in the software, like the easy switch on/off of BT and WiFi using just a couple of keyboard presses
- flexible and automatic speaker usage depending on the machine's orientation
- the way the thing feels in your hands (cool/cold, solid, 'tight'): it's nice to hold
- the VGA screen for browsing, Excel, calendar, contacts, ListPro and Today screen (I'm in proper VGA mode)
- battery lasts days for me, but I'm probably a lighter user than y'all and now (because most are awful on WM5) have no 3rd-party apps except PocketZenPhone, TomTom and ListPro (per day: 8 hrs Bluetooth, 1 hr phone, 10 SMS, 1 hr general use, 30 mins WiFi browsing)
- stability: Haven't done a reset in a week or so. I never force-close apps, but rely on WM5 to handle it. I have no idea how much program memory I have free, and I don't care: it just works
- Microsoft's contacts app is very good for keyboard-only use: makes dialling a contact easy
- there are some neat improvements in the UI, such as the way BT comes on automatically when you choose 'ActiveSync over Bluetooth', and headset mode is always on automatically if BT is on and the machine has found your headset to pair with
Negatives for me:
- WiFi reception is very poor
- OEM-supplied voice dial is poor. I hate having to record voice tags, and it's not 100% reliable with detection. This could be my HBH-65 headset though. Sometimes the voice dial prompt cuts in when I'm trying to answer a call on the headset :evil:
- Microsoft's calendar app is very very weak, as is PocketIE, and PocketOutlook for emails
- the phone app should scale to VGA properly and it should have a built-in T9 contact finder (the O2-supplied 'Smart Dialler' doesn't take advantage of the hardware keyboard, so is pointless)
- speaking of which, O2's bundled software is pointless and unhelpful
Umm....
- oh yeah: the cameras are still very weak and useful only for taking emergency pictures, such as recording car accidents that you have and newsworthy moments
- the camera flash is useless as a camera flash, but very good as a torch, if only the machine had an easy way of using this feature
- the hardware application buttons aren't as programmable or flexible as they could/should be. I wish we could program each button through the OS for both Press and Press-'n-Hold
Of course a big negative ATM is the lack of 3rd-party apps that are truly compatible with WM5, but this is hardly the fault of HTC or the mobile operators.
So, the hardware is excellent (with the exception of the cameras and WiFi reception) but the OS-bundled software is flawed. Hopefully we'll get ROM updates that will improve things, just like we did for earlier HTC machines.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
woah! your negatives sure scares the daylights out of me!
- bad wifi reception??? what seems to be the problem???! for me, this is going to be really important!
- bad camera quality? how bad is it??? I saw a few pictures taken from the universal on a couple review sites, and they looked pretty good! am i missing something? (damn i didnt play around enough with the camera when i had the device with me the last week )
S
Well, the WiFi is hard to measure, but the range is nowhere near as good as my HP laptop. I struggle to get a signal on my Exec if I'm not within about 4 metres of my Access Point in my house. (Standard modern house, thin internal wooden walls.) I can use my laptop anywhere in the house (up to 10 metres away) and in the garden too, but no chance with the Universal. I need to move the Access Point.
As for the camera, I guess it's subjective, but I wouldn't rely on it for decent photos. It's OK for times when you just have to record an image but you're not needing to print it out. Here's a comparison between my Universal and a 4 year-old 2 MPixel Canon Ixus300. Both photos without flash, because the Universal's flash has no effect on photos when the subject is more than a metre from the lens. Both photos are at 640x480 and at the same compression level (filesize 38KB). Neither camera is at its native resolution, to make it a realistic comparison.
Edit: moved photos to a new thread
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33960
Hmm. Not sure why they don't both appear as thumbnails. :roll:
Forgot to add: Universal was in 'Night' ambience mode.
Edit: Incidentally, when you take pictures at the Universal's native resolution (1280x1024) the quality is better, but the same problems are there: poor light sensitivity, poor light colouration, blurred focus, indistinct details etc.
It's better, but a long way from good.
And don't forget, the Canon camera is old now: 4 years. Just 2 MPixel - only twice that of the Universal.
Edit edit: Moved photos to a new thread so they don't break this one
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33960
@SiliconS
thats a nice comparison shot! ( still wondering if you took them both with similar lighting conditions!!! )
i did read that the universal is fairly bad with "colors" as such....guess we have to live with it!
with the wifi range issue....gosh!! 4metres??? tell me your joking please!
S
dreamtheater39 said:
thats a nice comparison shot! ( still wondering if you took them both with similar lighting conditions!!! )
i did read that the universal is fairly bad with "colors" as such....guess we have to live with it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same room. Same lighting. Photos just one minute apart.
It's not really much better than my XDA2. Just bigger resolution. Low-light shots are really not its strong point though. Only by comparison can you see how bad it really is.
dreamtheater39 said:
with the wifi range issue....gosh!! 4metres??? tell me your joking please!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry - I'm serious. Maybe others can confirm, or tell me that mine is worse than theirs. It's hard to measure objectively though.
You have to be kidding about the 4m WiFi range. I have the router placed in my bedroom and i can actually connect 2 rooms away which are in serial. Oh and there are 2 concrete walls in between.
I still get 2 bars inspite of all this. If you call this weak, then i dont know what to say.
Regarding the camera, its oodles better than the xda2 or the xda2s. It is also much better than the JAM, but then again these are not very good standards to compare to. Yes, it is not as good as Nokia or SE but if the camera is the reason one decides not to buy this device, then this device is clearly not for you.
Yeah, the camera sucks. Who cares? The rest of what's on the Uni - the critical stuff - works great. Quality in a cell phone camera is few years off ...
universaldoc said:
You have to be kidding about the 4m WiFi range. I have the router placed in my bedroom and i can actually connect 2 rooms away which are in serial. Oh and there are 2 concrete walls in between.
I still get 2 bars inspite of all this. If you call this weak, then i dont know what to say.
Regarding the camera, its oodles better than the xda2 or the xda2s. It is also much better than the JAM, but then again these are not very good standards to compare to. Yes, it is not as good as Nokia or SE but if the camera is the reason one decides not to buy this device, then this device is clearly not for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi universaldoc!
i currently have an xda2 running on wm5! So when i junk my device and buy a new one, i'd first of all see what are the pluses i get by making such a decision.....
heres what i can count -
1. Awesome keyboard (i really love it!)
2. VGA screen (finally!)
3. Built in Wifi
4. Better Camera
5. 3G support (currently useless to me....but its still good!)
6. The cool factor???
7. 10MB more device root space??
8. I'm running out of points!!!
Having said that....I still have bought my universal (but i'm waiting for it get here :evil: ) only because, i'm a god damned gadget freak and wouldnt mind trading away my spare kidney for one!
I'm just reconfirming my buy....the "reality hits" phase....you know???!!
San
I totally agree with all the positives already mentioned. As far as negatives are concerned, I have none. I love my O2 XDA Exec!
One point I'd like to mention though. My XDA Exec has GREAT WiFi. When I was setting-up my MSN Messenger, my Exec detected 4 different access points including my own. I happen to notice my neighbors' access point which I helped her setup included in the list. Now, she lives about 3 apartments down, so you can just imagine the lenght and obstacles my Exec has to traverse.
I don't have wi-fi yet though hoping to get it sorted in the next month or so. Though on the odd occasion I've switched the Exec's on, I've picked up stuff that must be about 30 - 40 metres away. I know for sure I picked up my cousin's network from around 20 metres outside his house the other week - and he lives in a converted barn with thick interior / exterior walls!
Regarding everyone else's positives and negatives, I agree with most. The camera is a LOT better, and is better than the 2.0MP one we had up to a few months ago. However, it's certainly not the main reason for buying a phone and certainly not in a feature-rich device such as the Exec. The pose factor alone is worth it, especially when sat in laptop mode in the car :wink:
It's 3G. It's an awesome looking bit of kit. One or two niggles in the software that will be ironed out. It's inspired 3 of my colleagues and bosses at work to get one. Less kit to carry around between home and work (no cradle, just a lead). VGA screen - which I STILL look at in awe sometimes. I didn't think I'd get to like landscape mode, but now I LOVE it.
Best XDA by far for me, and I've had most :wink:
Cheers
Ant
if else is positive, the main negative would be the response to incoming phone calls especially thru BT headset :evil: ... you would be lucky to take it from the 1st time ... usually it takes 2-3 sec which is more than enough for the caller to hang up :evil:
Believe it or not ... I use the Universal now only for data activities (e-mail, net, ...) and I have to carry my old i-mate for phone things ... nice scene ... huh ? :x
I can't wait to see a real update for the Radio ROM
ohh ... and a one hell missing feature ... a secondary LCD on the cover to avoid opening the screen just to see who's calling ... a very simple idea you find on almost all flapping mobile phones!!!!
can anyone make such app - or - anyone any clue were to get a compass for our win mobiles http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlKvW89Q7Z8
As a wm power user, you should know that a compass is hardware, not software
Fitz said:
As a wm power user, you should know that a compass is hardware, not software
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yea i thought about the gsensor aint that enough for te hardware part
Gsensors don't always point north...
well if u no of any compass's i can try via gps send me the site but would be beter if we got one like the assphone
Most higher end GPS units have "electronic" compasses. It is not just something that can be enabled through software, there needs to be a hardware component as well.
As a side note, my garmin vista Hcx has an electronic compass and it makes geocaching so nice
Like this?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=524294
Go to the link in the first post.
you may like this
http://htcdriver.com/index.php?page=richesse-GPS
and i also have such feature on my mapking GPS app
Any GPS app for windows mobile has a "Compass" by seeing which way you are moving and comparing that to north. A real compass can be stationary and point north more accurately. This is a hardware feature that no WM phones have. Maybe the Touch Pro 3 will have it.
Yeah, buy a real compass buddy. Its more accurately and never run out of battery and you never fear of losing GPS signal.
Oh, btw, I do have a real compass. and never use it.
Tomtom, GPS cycle, any navigation software would have a compass.
If that doesn't satisfy can always use the good old, sun rises in the east and sets in the west strategy. or go watch a few eps of Man vs Wild or survivor man and they'll show you how to find the direction.
rungvang said:
Oh, btw, I do have a real compass. and never use it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly my thoughts. Who needs yet ANOTHER gimmicky app that has no real purpose? In my time on this Earth I have never needed a compass or ever even thought '**** I wish I had a compass for X task'. So why would we need a digital one in our pockets ?
The sun sets in the west and rises in the east. There's your compass.
Don't you guys sleep facing the north? After the sun has set, how do you align your salt and pepper accurately? The hardware component is a magnetometer, pigeons have them, get a pigeon!
No sorry guys, a compass can be usefuill for a lot of Apps like navigation or Games, and the IPhone ist the most powerfull mobile divice ever build compared with a stabil and smooth operating system and a gigantic and cheap Appstore with 50.000 Apps.
And half of the Apps here are just wannabe iphone-Apps.
Thats fact, and sorry that i must tell you the truth : Windows Mobile is ulgy, slow and not state of the Art.
this is a littel preview to demonstrate you the Power of the "old" iPhone 3G (the brandnew 3Gs is getting much bette/faster and has a graphics chipset similar to xBox)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWDDPAmZd5k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3TeX4OCfLc
dickenz said:
Exactly my thoughts. Who needs yet ANOTHER gimmicky app that has no real purpose? In my time on this Earth I have never needed a compass or ever even thought '**** I wish I had a compass for X task'. So why would we need a digital one in our pockets ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think lot's of people, of which you are probably one of them, don't have a clue to the purpose of the compass feature several new phones have. Apple clearly wouldn't emphasize on this feature if it were only useful to tell you where north and south are relatively to your location.
More and more apps are becoming available, which give you a view through the camera of your device, overlaying certain information, such as where the nearest ATM is, where you can find a particular shop, etc. (this technique is called Augmented Reality and it really doesn't work as good without a compass, as with a compass). There are a dozen apps available for Android at the moment using the build-in compass. That's where you need such a piece of hardware for.
Yes,
While going hunting I always take my compass, cell phone, gps, SUV, remington gun and a small atomic device...
You only need a compass if you are in the army. For night time LEARN the sky and if you get lost in the woods???during the day and need to go north??? for some reason than an application on a cellphone is the least of your problems
dickenz said:
Exactly my thoughts. Who needs yet ANOTHER gimmicky app that has no real purpose? In my time on this Earth I have never needed a compass or ever even thought '**** I wish I had a compass for X task'. So why would we need a digital one in our pockets ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Obviously you weren't geocaching yet . In the forest it can be quite difficult to say where the sun is (especially if the weather isn't that good), so a "real" compass could be really helpful. There are also a lot of other things a "real" compass is good for.
As far as I know the HTC Magic (running Android) has got one, hasn't it?
And please stop this "Iphone vs. WM" talk, I think it was covered so many times in so many threads already ...
I don't understand these people claiming that their Iphone is so much better, but actually they are using a WM device and using forums for WM devices. That's quite strange, isn't it?. My suggestion: Get an Iphone and let us enjoy our WM devices please!
I bought my Galaxy S few weeks ago and I could barely use the GPS. It took way too long to get it working and still it was inaccurate.
Few days ago I flashed JM2 firmware and installed app called TrackerBooster (can be found in the Android Market). Now the GPS works perfectly, takes only few seconds to get it connected (outdoors). I have used it now like 15 times and max. time I had to wait was 20 seconds.
I'm not sure does TrackerBooster app need to be installed, might work well without it, haven't tested.
I hope this helps those who have problems with GPS but this is just my experience, I would wait for other comments before flashing new a firmware.
It's called new firmware flashing syndrom for GPS. Basically, if you flash to any new firmware, your GPS will work for a few days.
As Foxbat said, a full flash/reset cycle improves results on the pathetic, schizophrenic and overall random SGS GPS implementation. But I am not going to be a smart ass and insinuate you don't know what you're talking about.
Instead I'll just ignore all the previous "the GPS issue is fixed" claims by many users who prematurely yelled "fixed" and just cowardly quote one of my favourite authors..."Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan
Plus we shall also ignore the previous 308 users who have "cried Wolf"^-1. Please refer to your favorite fable author for proper reference.
Its occurred so many times, it actually has it's own syndrome!! FFS
Beowulf_pt said:
As Foxbat said, a full flash/reset cycle improves results on the pathetic, schizophrenic and overall random SGS GPS implementation. But I am not going to be a smart ass and insinuate you don't know what you're talking about.
Instead I'll just ignore all the previous "the GPS issue is fixed" claims by many users who prematurely yelled "fixed" and just cowardly quote one of my favourite authors..."Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan
Plus we shall also ignore the previous 308 users who have "cried Wolf"^-1. Please refer to your favorite fable author for proper reference.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So you still trolling the forums about your GPS problem even after you sold your Samsung if you ever had one from the beginning. I have never had serious problem as many others and if only 308 of millions have had a problem it must certainly be a really good GPS. Stop trolling you only because look like an ignorant user who really do not want to make the phone better but want to promote NOKIA.
For sure, milsjg. You can add me too as ignorant, 309th user who's GPS sucks d*ck hard.
I wish my GPS sucked d**k... that would at least make it useful! ) 310th user here noticing GPS issues... that said while I was on JM7, I managed to record a very very close to perfect track using mytracks... for the walking section of my test it went perfectly even showing where I retraced my steps to go to poo bins! But when I got on to driving it went a bit mental and I apparently drove through the fire station, the wrong way round roundabouts and demolished a few streets worth of houses, but occationally it did show me going down the right side of the road!
You forget that before he even got it, he was complaining that he was reluctant to buy the phone because of reports about lag and GPS (and then, proceeded to buy it anyway).
The main problem is that people have different quality of acceptance for GPS. Some people expect a signal which compares with a fitness GPS (accurate within 2 or 3 meters generally), and some of us don't care if it drifts off by 20m.
Any technology which doesn't have a definitive state will get various opinions...
andrewluecke said:
You forget that before he even got it, he was complaining that he was reluctant to buy the phone because of reports about lag and GPS (and then, proceeded to buy it anyway).
The main problem is that people have different quality of acceptance for GPS. Some people expect a signal which compares with a fitness GPS (accurate within 2 or 3 meters generally), and some of us don't care if it drifts off by 20m.
Any technology which doesn't have a definitive state will get various opinions...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But then when it comes to navigation (arguably the principal purpose of having GPS in these devices) things go totally haywire! ) Personally I wonder whether GPS was installed purely for marketing purposes, to allow app developers (and of course google!) to snoop as to where their users are and how they are using their devices. For that there's no need for close tracking! )
not sure why you would fault beowulf for buying, if as you indicate he had some concerns - the damn phone is drop dead gorgous. If any product could stimulate optimism or optimistic hope, even in a skeptic, this phone would. And that's what makes it so frustrating.
I'm going to hate sending it back (i negotiated an extended buyer remorse return period) but if GPS isn't corrected by mid sept, this phone is history
samsung having released it w/o working gps is maybe forgiveable, but then even assuming they didn't know about the issue before release, it's been over 90 days since the asian release, and it's still not working.
Lay on top of that that samsung announced the GPS had been "validated" in the EPIC 4G, and it turns out it isn't. That did nothing but strengthen my doubts on samsung delivering a solution.
Tried this tracker booster app, makes no difference, gps still horrendous. If some people think that a 20m accuracy variation is acceptable for a gps lock they are a bloody fool.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Bynar010 said:
Tried this tracker booster app, makes no difference, gps still horrendous. If some people think that a 20m accuracy variation is acceptable for a gps lock they are a bloody fool.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then it must be the firmware I flashed. There's a big difference with JM2 and the previous FW I had, if I remember right it was JF3.
The accuracy is good, for example Endomondo regonizes few meter changes. (like changing side of the road).
Sorry to offend you but Beowulf_pt has no SGS and still he is lurking around complaining. If you think about it ,there must be some reasons that I and several others have a perfectly normal (no correction) GPS on our SGS. Why is it working so different for different persons? Some logical alternatives would be error in a batch of phones (switch it), or operator programming has messed it up (get new operator), or just overload caused by program running in background, memory and task mangers etc ( educate yourself or wait for a proper kernel - see below) or in some cases just plain trolling of some non SGS owners (see my last reply).
The GPS chip is new and according to the web only recently the code for efficient low level drivers, for the linux kernel, has started to appear on internet (23 august). It will take some weeks before they are implemented so I would bet that they have fixed it by the end of September. You know, bad driver = slow, no calender etc. You will notice it specially when you use program that uses lots of resources (Maps and My tracker). It is much more efficient with Cardiotrainer for example or GPS test. (see my third conclusion above). I have noticed that (at least for me) it takes 5 - 10 sec to get a first lock in GPS test but half a minute at least in Maps or My Tracks.
Another tip is to run for example GPS test for one minute or so before My Track so the GPS gets some satellite data downloaded (calenders). The time also helps the GPS to calculate the exact position to use as a start point. You normally need a minute or so if the calenders are to old or you moved to get the right positions.
Iphone 4 has a good GPS (3 is crap according to some owners and it is not fixed. Do you hear any complaints?). The chip is one generation older than SGS and Apple do not need to wait for the kernel to be changed in there Iphone. They do it them self and by the way Iphone 4 is not really multitasking which means that GPS programs can easily be prioritized.
Well this is a short version. The net is filled with facts and if you start read a little you can start puzzle together what the cause is for your faulty GPS (nearly nobody believes its hardware any more).
By the way, I am not ignorant and I know rather much about GPS and how to evaluate tracking (I have written several scientific papers on tracking of wildlife where at least one was on the subject - evaluation of ARGOS tracking devices using GPS as reference). I have owned several mobiles and GPSes, programmed and built fish tracking devices, and did my thesis on wildlife tracking. I stating this not to try to end the GPS discussion but to make it a little bit more "scientific" and not so emotional like the comments on my last reply. There still nobody that knows how many that has a problem with the GPS. We only know that a few of millions have complained and a few of millions have said there satisfied with it.
Bynar010 said:
Tried this tracker booster app, makes no difference, gps still horrendous. If some people think that a 20m accuracy variation is acceptable for a gps lock they are a bloody fool.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
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On the contrar my friend, 5 - 15 meters is what you can expect and that means that the fix has 95 % certainty to be in that interval. 20 is a little bit above what you can expect but not much. In good dedicated trackers or a good phones you can get 5 meters (which I often get after 30 sec outside) and 2,5 for some fixes but not constant. A mobile is not a dedicated GPS and with the suspected driver problem 20 would not be bad. Try with GPS test, under open sky, and holding it at the bottom of the phone. Before you start you should turn off and on the GPS and close all task managers and started programs. You know that home means often that you leave the program running in the background but using back shuts it down. And wait for 30 - 60 seconds. If you get 10 be satisfied it,s a phone and not a dedicated GPS.
My touch hd would actually follow the f$$king road. Not too much to ask that a brand new smart phone would do the same is it? Its nothing short of pathetic. Even my old tytn2 was superb as a gps device for navigation, this thing cannot be trusted.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
I for one am getting SICK of installing fw's hoping for a fix for GPS.
They put a good hardware-wise device out.. But its kinda shoddy the fw development isn't equally as good. I have flashed nearly ALL the fw's to no real avail..
I am started to get frustrated after all this patience..
FWIW
Running 2.2 with no lag, fix no root, no apps to help. Google Nav and Co-Pilot work flawlessly. Mytracks follows me walking down the pavement at the correct position and on the correct side of the road with very few deviations.
I really cannot see what all the fuss is ablout here.
Tehpriest said:
FWIW
Running 2.2 with no lag, fix no root, no apps to help. Google Nav and Co-Pilot work flawlessly. Mytracks follows me walking down the pavement at the correct position and on the correct side of the road with very few deviations.
I really cannot see what all the fuss is ablout here.
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well try it in a car and get supprised...
praun said:
well try it in a car and get supprised...
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That is where I use both Co-Pilot and Google Nav.....
Beowulf_pt said:
..y quote one of my favourite authors..."Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan
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Well I rather stick with Popper. Extraordinary evidence or support isn't that hard to get (look at the paranormal claims etc). What is more difficult and more fruitful to come by is some clever tests that eventually will or can refute a claim. If a theory will pass those tests it is actually more trustworthy then when it gets "extraordinary" evidence.
Again, no theory will stand till the end of time, how extra-ordinary our evidences may be.
Lol, back to the gps.
I tried geocaching over the weekend with the Epic. I love the app (c:geo I think?), but the phone's GPS is spotty at best. Obviously, when geocaching, you're probably in an area with no signal, so I had to rely on whatever info the phone already had downloaded and being able to fix.
About 9/10 times, the phone would see no satellites at all. Not even yellow non-fixed ones. Randomly, it would suddenly see a bunch of them and lock on within 10 seconds. I had no cell signal the entire time so no AGPS here (except for the previous night making sure it had downloaded satellite data). GPS Status was useful in figuring out what was going on.
The accuracy was horrible compared to an old hand-held standalone device. My phone was easily 20-30 feet less accurate. Note that the shown 98 feet accuracy level is BS - i'ts definitely more accurate than that. But whereas a standalone GPS might be within 12 feet, mine would be about 30 feet.
So overall it's mixed. The app for geocaching is really great, but the hardware to run it on is pretty lacking on the Epic. I'll retest sometime if we ever get a GPS fix.
Did you have the Cold Start workaround applied or is this with stock?
I switched to warm. Cold would have sucked without the network. Hot seemed the most problematic from what I've read, but maybe I should have left it on hot?
To be clear my gps works awesome as long as I have a network.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
yes the only drawback to cold start, is if you are outside of network connection of some kind.
We are also not even absolutely confirmed that Epic has true standalone GPS. And if it does, it maybe pretty poor due to the low signal to noise, which may point to attenuation problems at a hardware level, or some other issue. (I am fooling around lately with the settings for SNR threshold rejection)
There is a lot to like about the Epic, and some GPS issues have been reduced by the cold start workaround, but it may not be the best choice of smartphones, notably compared to the EVo's excellent GPS, if you need or enjoy use of GPS.
On accuracy, you have to remember that the real world accuracy is negatively affected by not moving or moving slowly. It is counter-intuitive but this is the result of two factors affecting real and simulated accuracy respectively: Multipath is better rejected when moving as the algorithms to reject and compensate for multipath are facilitated by moment. Secondly, there are all those predictive forward and back axis compensators based on speed (and more recently argumented on smartphones by inertial data from the gsensors) , and road "snap" compensators for lateral movement that help in nav based programs.
Also keep in mind that elevation measurements are not as refined (with inbuilt compensation tables) as far as I know on Andorid as they are on WM applications. I believe there are some apps that will query online elevation tables -- present an data connection.
Thanks for your data on off connection results.
That's why I removed everything but the basics from my Hero and am using it solely as my geocaching GPSr!
Then I don't have to worry about ruining my Epic by getting it wet or dropping it or just getting it dirty!
jirafabo said:
That's why I removed everything but the basics from my Hero and am using it solely as my geocaching GPSr!
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Yea I have a Palm treo pro (designed and made by HTC) that has outstanding GPS, standalone on it is excellent. also it runs both a WM navigon and WM tomtom perfectly with no data connection. Works from Topeka to Timbuktu
I've seen entire reviews who don't even mention this important component: the GPS.
One might say that it rarely use it... but let me tell you that you might need it and if it lets you down it might be in the worst moment of all:
in the woods (my 'favorite' situation)
while in vacation, after a day spent on traveling, you reached your destination and you need to find that place you booked
trying to impress your friends with the fact that you just started jogging
The latter might seem the silliest of all, but when your recorded run looks like in the screenshot below (taken from my old ZE550KL), you know that you have a piece of junk worth 300 dollars in your hands and surely you can't rely on it in the woods or while exploring the world.
View attachment 3934820
So, yeah... please record a walk or run (any running app will do) with your new Zenfone 3 and share your results here. :highfive:
You just turned me off
You may need to check better or replace it. My GPS works very well, 2/3 seconds to catch the satellites and rock steady while using it, no matter what geo-localized app I use.
My GPS works very well too
My Z3 GPS works just fine, very responsive.