Related
Hi, thank you very much bestialbud , for your contribution now enjoy factory firmware and all functions work perfectly in A7. and also I have the Market.
thanks for the positive confirmation.
i'll try and throw out some more stuff for you the a7 users this weekend to accompany the gapps fix; some build prop improvements to get you access to more apps.
i'll try and throw out some more stuff for the rom chefs to kick up the activity in rom and mod development for the a7; map out all the files, permissions and uid/gid's, and then MAYBE if i have the time this weekend go experimental and package the factory rom into what i consider a normal update zip; zipped up rom instead of a system image w/ a script that sets all the roms permissions, symbolic links and busybox install. once its in a more manageable format like that you'll get more would be chef's and themer's contributing.
been thinkin' about it all week, i just don't have a tablet of my own (i'm the misses android fixit tech), so my works restricted to weekend mornings.
would be great, that within your improvements we have an ad-hoc connection to work properly.
the market does not have all the permissions, but wiht the permissions you indicate the fix the problem.
I'm anxious to see your improvements. Thanks again.
i'm sorry my english.
genialor; yeah, i never had any success w the adhoc wifi fixes myself. adhoc limitations are pretty common for mobile devices, not just android. i actually picked up a dsl connection due to this limitation, quite reluctantly i might add.
there is some 25 other similar tegra tablets. a portable solution could still present itself. i wouldnt count on any manufacturer adding adhoc connectity if they didnt provide it in the initial release.
i can say the usual passion finger, or release keys added to the stock one didnt make any difference. but im only using skyfire for an app name to search.
if folks could list other apps they dont see, it may help to make some gradual steps.
otherwise as far as savey folks looking at direct manipulation; the fingerprint that the market app reads after being copied from build prop is stored in /data/data/com.android.vending along w the characteristics your device supports. im a compare the tabs to my phone for fun to see if i can manipulate the data, because fingerprint replacement, w this gapps package in the rom isnt working. if that works, i can post instructions for the savvy, and MAYBE dig up some way to creatively automate adding those details.
Sent from my X10a using Tapatalk
Thanks buddy install UPDATE04-16 market + google apps and it works perfectly.
Bestialbud excellent job. Full Market yes, yes, yes ...
What is the latest market app, on Dexter mod I am running 2.3.6..
if folks could list other apps they dont see, it may help to make some gradual steps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey, Tested your update and it seems to work fine except for some game apps. These aren't crucial but may indicate some permission issues: "crazy snowboards" seems to have a orientation problem.( only work in portrait mode.) "mau mau"intermittent FC.
*** note these apps worked in Dexter's latest mode ***
Otherwise Good Job!!
I find the installation notes for gapps mod in original thread extremely confusing.
I just installed official firmware (BTW the installation notes on official site were crystal clear). What should I do now?
A video of the entire process would be great.
P.S: NP, I just did not understand that to navigate between recovery menu items I must use "back" button.
Looks like gapps works now
sorry, i didnt provide step by step details for recovery use. i wont update that information either, as recovery is likely to change soon w lightly different instructions..
Sent from my X10i using Tapatalk
Some market applications can't see sdcard...
Looks like it is mounted as /storage/sdcard-disk0 while these apps expect it to be at /sdcard. Also /sdcard is mounted somewhere on internal memory, same place as /storage actually . Is there any way to change it?
Some market applications can't see sdcard...
Looks like it is mounted as /storage/sdcard-disk0 while these apps expect it to be at /sdcard. Also /sdcard is mounted somewhere on internal memory, same place as /storage actually . Is there any way to change it?
Ummm, there's so much information on this...please do a search in these threads on SD card and you will understand why no one wants to answer that question............
okantomi said:
Some market applications can't see sdcard...
Ummm, there's so much information on this...please do a search in these threads on SD card and you will understand why no one wants to answer that question............
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did search and could not find any comprehensible information.
I didn't say it would be comprehensible.
The external sd card is mounted as /storage/sdcard-disk0. The A7 can read from it but not write apps to it, or at least the market doesn't and I don't think you can run apps from it, just install from it. There is an internal sd card 4GB total, but with 1+GB available for apps, and we can also add our own sd card (up to 32GB) stuffed with our music, videos, jpgs, documents, etc....that way we can access them through gallery and media players, etc, without having to download a bunch of junk onto our internal memory.
1GB is a huge amount of internal space for the kind of apps that I suspect most of us are using. Sorry if I'm not clear, but in truth this topic has been done to death.
Maybe our intrepid developers can find a way to rewrite the way this thing works now that they have the kernel source but maybe not.
there are ways and roms that may change the sdcard mount location. the apps may com thru the google market, but their ability to run is another function of the rom.
this is only a google apps addon.
you'll have to wait a lil bit longer til you see a rom from me. i'm interested in recovery and themeing for this device right now..
Sent from my X10i using Tapatalk
muxecoid said:
Some market applications can't see sdcard...
Looks like it is mounted as /storage/sdcard-disk0 while these apps expect it to be at /sdcard. Also /sdcard is mounted somewhere on internal memory, same place as /storage actually . Is there any way to change it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is an on going problem with the sd card and the way its mounted by elocity's implementation of Android 2.2. To male a long story short, Elocity's android version is 2.2 compatible not a true implementation of Android 2.2. As far as I know no one has been able to work around this problem. Dexter tried starting with mod 1.3 but people started having problems with sd and usb detection. I'm waiting for Stream Tv to finally decide to fix this problem.
rphilippe777 said:
This is an on going problem with the sd card and the way its mounted by elocity's implementation of Android 2.2. To male a long story short, Elocity's android version is 2.2 compatible not a true implementation of Android 2.2. As far as I know no one has been able to work around this problem. Dexter tried starting with mod 1.3 but people started having problems with sd and usb detection. I'm waiting for Stream Tv to finally decide to fix this problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Drugs are bad mm'kay
Why on earth do people feel the need to disseminate misinformation on here on such a regular basis.
Go back and re-read Dexter's posts on the subject. There is a reason, a real reason, not made up like "its not true android 2.2". This is not a phone, it has larger internal storage and thus relies less on the external media. To have it the way you people want it (like a monstrous phone) the external storage would end up being the default, making it difficult to use the internal storage, and also REQUIRING that you have a decent size microSD just to make the tablet usable.
BTW, I am still laughing that I am apparently using an Android knock off lolololol
netstat_EVO said:
Drugs are bad mm'kay
Why on earth do people feel the need to disseminate misinformation on here on such a regular basis.
Go back and re-read Dexter's posts on the subject. There is a reason, a real reason, not made up like "its not true android 2.2".
This is not a phone, it has larger internal storage and thus relies less on the external media. To have it the way you people want it (like a monstrous phone) the external storage would end up being the default, making it difficult to use the internal storage, and also REQUIRING that you have a decent size microSD just to make the tablet usable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
BTW, I am still laughing that I am apparently using an Android knock off lolololol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't understand your response. I read Dexter's post on the subject. You need to re-read it. OS's in general have standards. If I run a windows, linux or mac system to name a few, you expect your hardware and software to run a certain way. For example, when you to read, write or print a file, any software you run for that OS should allow you to this on any computer that you run that particular OS on the same way. This isn't rocket science for a typical consumer. If you want to prove to me that I don't know what I'm talking about or worse yet that I
"disseminate misinformation on here on such a regular basis
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
. , please show specifically where what I said concerning Android 2.2 is wrong other then that you may have read dexter's post.
This is not a phone, it has larger internal storage and thus relies less on the external media. To have it the way you people want it (like a monstrous phone) the external storage would end up being the default, making it difficult to use the internal storage, and also REQUIRING that you have a decent size microSD just to make the tablet usable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
. That's irrelevant. The standard is not about what you want but the way it was decided that the OS should work plus I believe this is or will be addressed in Android 3.0. This constitutes and opinion rather than a fact. I didn't spend $299 on your opinion which BTW I don't agree with.
I understand XDA is developers site and you guys are use to thinking outside the box, which is fine by me, but we aren't all here for the same reasons and when I purchase something and it says I'm getting a certain thing, as a consumer, I expect the minimum of what if I'm purchasing. The box days "Android 2.2" not "Android 2.2 compatible" or "Android 2.2 features" or "Android 2.2 clone."
The question is:
- What is "Android 2.2"
- How does this relate to software and hardware issues with the A7?
- Is there a work around?
- Is there a firmware update?
and If your replying to a post, do can you contribute anything helpeful because telling me to search all of Dexter's post because you think you say a post concerning this already without reference that to that post is a waste of everyone time.
rphilippe777 said:
I don't understand your response. I read Dexter's post on the subject. You need to re-read it. OS's in general have standards. If I run a windows, linux or mac system to name a few, you expect your hardware and software to run a certain way. For example, when you to read, write or print a file, any software you run for that OS should allow you to this on any computer that you run that particular OS on the same way. This isn't rocket science for a typical consumer. If you want to prove to me that I don't know what I'm talking about or worse yet that I . , please show specifically where what I said concerning Android 2.2 is wrong other then that you may have read dexter's post. . That's irrelevant. The standard is not about what you want but the way it was decided that the OS should work plus I believe this is or will be addressed in Android 3.0. This constitutes and opinion rather than a fact. I didn't spend $299 on your opinion which BTW I don't agree with.
I understand XDA is developers site and you guys are use to thinking outside the box, which is fine by me, but we aren't all here for the same reasons and when I purchase something and it says I'm getting a certain thing, as a consumer, I expect the minimum of what if I'm purchasing. The box days "Android 2.2" not "Android 2.2 compatible" or "Android 2.2 features" or "Android 2.2 clone."
The question is:
- What is "Android 2.2"
- How does this relate to software and hardware issues with the A7?
- Is there a work around?
- Is there a firmware update?
and If your replying to a post, do can you contribute anything helpeful because telling me to search all of Dexter's post because you think you say a post concerning this already without reference that to that post is a waste of everyone time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
----------------------------------------------
Dexter_nlb said:
this is all a misunderstanding of how tablets are supposed to work, and caused by the fact that android 2.2 is made for a phone with external memory cards, and less to nothing of internal memory.
the current installation where apps are "moved" to internal storage is actually how vendors are trying to implement 2 types of storage.
comparing this to a mobile with just sdcard, and android 2.2 only supporting one storage type, the preferred storage becomes the "internal" and sdcard handling as you notice is now pointing to a location with the internal storage location.
the mountpoint at the internal storage location is planned based on the fact that users coming from an android based mobile knows alot about where to find data, which is in the storage location, so its put as mount at the storage so its easy to access, and not actually any bug at all.
so until better handling is presented (hopefully 3.0) people will continue to think that the handling is wrong or something is not wright here, but it is correct.
your internal storage of "just" 1.5GB is the preferred location, as tablets are not meant to have sdcards as preferred storage, if you chose not to put a sdcard into the tablet. so the choice was easy, use internal storage for android so ppl didnt need to buy additional cards.
but the lack of storage internally is a vendor decision, not a bug or not "the android way" a problem in any way..
imagine, those users without any sdcard, being unable to use the feature of android to a storage, and needed to use data storage for all files, that would look strange, if you didnt have the option available..
it could have been planned differently but vendors (all of the tegra2 vendors) has chosen this path, which could have been done differently but its all relate to apps and how they expect your device to work..
a long explanation, but remember 2.2 is not made for tablets, it made for small devices with external memory cards, which is long overdue and is followed up with the new android 3.0 which hopefully solves your problem.
conclusion,
Nvidia could have chosen a different way of using android, but they're still rather new to the platform and their design is not without problems yet (honeycomb will show that too), so if they used real planning and organized memory and sdcard handling like 2.2 was made for, you would have no problems at all. Remember Nvidia designed it this way, and they are the reason you have problems..Lack of knowledge of design and functionality, like BMW trying to make graphics card for a pc, coming from designing cars, their work would not be in a class like nvidia graphics, but probably ok..but far from good..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There was no button to make the important text blink and slap you in the face at the same time, so I hope bold and red will suffice.
Don't get pissy with me because you are putting out misinformation and got called on it. There are people who come on here to learn and someone might have actually believed your BS about "Android 2.2 compatible" or "Android 2.2 features" or "Android 2.2 clone."
I have contributed. You on the other hand have not. Spreading crap like this is merely tantamount to telling people the sky is purple.
Edit: by the way, the "on a regular basis" part was not directed at you or any other individual person. I was pointing out how often this happens, not keeping score of who has done it the most.
Another Edit: Of course it will be addressed in Android 3.0 ... 3.0 IS FOR TABLETS!
Yet Another Edit: No, you are right, you didn't spend $299 on my opinion. You spent $299 on a bottom of the line Android 2.2 tablet hoping for the best, just like the rest of us... And since you seem so hung up on what the box said, did your box say "Powered by Android 2.2" or did it say "Powered by some guy named Rob's opinion"? I am willing to bet it said the first. However if you decide that you are willing to pay for my "opinion", there happens to be a donate button right under my name on the left. Thanks for playing.
so, yeah. mount locations a rom issue.
'piss' somewhere else?
Sent from my X10i using Tapatalk
Okay--this might be a stupid question, but am I supposed to install this and Dexter's mod over the firmware?
If so, should I do them in a particular order?
Thanks for all that you guys do!
This is for all the developers out there. Let's see if anyone out there has the talent to get this done. I will pay money for something like this to a developer as well. Here is the goal:
To set up a platform on smartphones that basically comes with two separate partitions. Ideally what would be better would for manufacturers to manufacture a smartphone with two separate flash drives. Say a for a 32gb device they would use two 16gb flash drives and for a 64gb device they would use two 32 gb flash drives. The main objective here is security and privacy from all these invasion of privacy that all these applications on Google Play store require. Usually they require access to your call logs,pictures,files,memory card,SMS messages,contacts list/s,notes,calendars,videos,audio,etc...
What would be nice is for one to have an option to say download an application like Facebook which pretty much requires every permission you can think of to be downloaded on a separate flash drive to where it has pretty much access to nothing except for what you choose to install on that flash drive or that partition. Wechat recently pulled a dirty trick in one of its updates to where one can not completely uninstall the application after installing it on a HTC smartphone.
Would like to have a secure and safe partition or separate flash drive preferably that would allow one to input contacts,photos,SMS messages,notes,calendars,call logs,etc.. That no application could have access to for our own privacy and safety along with security. Something like how one can ru two separate systems on a MacBook computer to where Windows can also run using Paralles?
Any geniuses here no how to do this or get this done?
This doesn't require a genius... This requires resources lol! Nobody can do it other than a manufacturer at all.
1. For 2 seperate NAND chips we would need to recreate it's PCB board, reconnect the ICs and chipsets which can't be done by household tools or by human hands
2. That would require full customization of the filesystem of android which would probably then be blocked by google because it won't follow their convention. Ask Madame Dianne Hackborn regarding this
desiregeek said:
Something like how one can ru two separate systems on a MacBook computer to where Windows can also run using Paralles?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes but when you do that, any Windows app or Mac app can still access anything on both partitions. How is that more secure? You cannot tell android to give app permission to photos on Partition1 but not to Partition2.
I suppose you could have 3 partitions, one that boots and lets you choose which of the other 2 to mount. Who is going to reboot their phone every time they want to switch between E-Mail and FaceBook though? ...if that's what you want, you can just use CWM and restore whichever backup you like, though that will take about 4-min of shutdown/restore/reboot everytime you switch.
What if you use users like in many 4.2.2 Roms. If you want an APP installed with to many access switch to a guest user
retschy said:
What if you use users like in many 4.2.2 Roms. If you want an APP installed with to many access switch to a guest user
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes this should be a great solution for dodgy apps. That way they won't have any access to the data located in another users account.
desiregeek said:
To set up a platform on smartphones that basically comes with two separate partitions. Ideally what would be better would for manufacturers to manufacture a smartphone with two separate flash drives. Say a for a 32gb device they would use two 16gb flash drives and for a 64gb device they would use two 32 gb flash drives. The main objective here is security and privacy from all these invasion of privacy that all these applications on Google Play store require. Usually they require access to your call logs,pictures,files,memory card,SMS messages,contacts list/s,notes,calendars,videos,audio,etc...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
edit: nevermind I thought the OP meant dualboot but he means a virtual machine, though I think this has been done as well on android before
godutch said:
edit: nevermind I thought the OP meant dualboot but he means a virtual machine, though I think this has been done as well on android before
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess it would basically be a virtual machine. There has to be a way to where one can separate things like two hard drives where in this case it would be on flash drives. Blackberry released something similar recently on their new OS.
Would be nice to be able to download all the basic applications which these days come with ridiculous permissions of which have access to everything on your smartphone. At times one does not wish to share their call log with Facebook or Whatsapp or Line Naver. One also may not to share their private SMS messages with those applications.
If we could choose where we want things installed it would be great.
rpmccormick said:
Yes but when you do that, any Windows app or Mac app can still access anything on both partitions. How is that more secure? You cannot tell android to give app permission to photos on Partition1 but not to Partition2.
I suppose you could have 3 partitions, one that boots and lets you choose which of the other 2 to mount. Who is going to reboot their phone every time they want to switch between E-Mail and FaceBook though? ...if that's what you want, you can just use CWM and restore whichever backup you like, though that will take about 4-min of shutdown/restore/reboot everytime you switch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What if the smartphone came with Operating Systems then on each Flash to where each was separate but you could switch back and forth between each like you can on a Macbook running Paralles. Being on separate Flash drives insures that one can get info from the other.
Seems like these days there is no way of blocking permissions without the application failing to load or run.
I have an HTC One and have Wechat on there. The other day I tried uninstalling it but I was unable to uninstall it as Wechat removed the uninstall option and gave us a downgrade option which leaves Wechat running. You can disable it though. Not sure how Google Play allows for such applications to be put up on Google Play that does not allow the user the ability to uninstall completely if they wanted to uninstall. This is why it would be nice to have a safety or dummy flash drive to separate private info and public info on a smartphone.
Again, what does choosing where something is installed have anything to do with permissions? Even if you swapped SD-Cards, then apps on one couldn't access apps on the other, but both could access everything on the system partition. The only way storing things in 2 different locations adds security, is if you can fully unmount all other locations, which would always require a reboot. Even a virtual-machine running on my PC can still access my PC and all of my network, and my PC along with all of the network can access the VM.
I don't think what you are trying to do (have 2 isolated drives) has anything to do with the goal of security. I don't think the actual security solution (having 2 isolated operating systems and needing to reboot to switch with no cross-access) is anything most people would want to deal with.
I think your best solution is to buy 2 phones.
rpmccormick said:
Even a virtual-machine running on my PC can still access my PC and all of my network, and my PC along with all of the network can access the VM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it can't the virtual machine can only access virtual hardware or the hardware the vm makes available to the os running on the vm
godutch said:
No it can't the virtual machine can only access virtual hardware or the hardware the vm makes available to the os running on the vm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There has to be a way. Just takes some Einstein to get it done right.
Like this basically..
http://www.gottabemobile.com/2013/04...efore-you-buy/
http://www.samsung.com/global/busine...ung-knox#con02
1. If Im running windows 7 64bit, can I upgrade to a windows 8 64bit right from windows 7 without having to format hard drive?
2. If so, can I create a restore point in windows 7 in case I want to go back once windows 8 is installed?
Any other suggestions would be appreciated.
For question 1, yes, this is what I did.
For question 2 I don't know.
SysAdmNj said:
1. If Im running windows 7 64bit, can I upgrade to a windows 8 64bit right from windows 7 without having to format hard drive?
2. If so, can I create a restore point in windows 7 in case I want to go back once windows 8 is installed?
Any other suggestions would be appreciated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes you can. the installer will give you options on what you want to keep
no. you must create a restore image on an external hard drive if you want to return back to windows 7
In-place upgrades are possible and are technically a supported scenario, but they are a *terrible* idea. They are, at best, going to save you a bit of time reinstalling apps (even though the install process itself takes vastly longer when doing an in-place upgrade, so I'm not sure it's a net positive even there). At worst, you'll end up with an unbootable system due to an unexpected driver incompatibility or something silly like that, lose all your data, and need to reformat and do a clean install anyhow. The usual result is somewhere in between; your system will be less stable than it should be, will take longer to boot up, some programs won't work after the upgrade and will need to be reinstalled anyhow, and at some point in the near-ish future (six months to two years) your systme will develop odd misbehaviors that will require you to effectively reinstall WIndows anyhow (that's what the refresh and reset operations in Win8 basically do, with or without preserving your files, respectively).
Also, if you opt for a clean install, you'll know you have a backup of all your data. That's pretty valuable. You can (and should; the bit about the upgrade failing and you losing access to your data was not a joke) make such a backup anyhow, of course.
As for being able to revert to Win7, the only way that'll happen is if you back up the whole system drive. Restore points don't work between major versions; if you do an in-place upgrade, you won't be able to downgrade it again short of restoring a backup or wiping the system and instally Win7 cleanly.
I did it
SysAdmNj said:
1. If Im running windows 7 64bit, can I upgrade to a windows 8 64bit right from windows 7 without having to format hard drive?
2. If so, can I create a restore point in windows 7 in case I want to go back once windows 8 is installed?
Any other suggestions would be appreciated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
After doing an in place Upgrade on my box i hope my story will help you.
I simply couldn't resist the offer MS made 'til 28 Feb 2013 so i downloaded Windows 8 64 Bit to my Laptop and after the Upgrade Assistant gave me a green light and promised except for the ATI drivers everything should work out i started the upgrade. After roughly 4 h the Upgrade process was done and windows 8 ready. Even the mentioned ATI driver was not a big problem because after the initial upgrade windows 8 asked if i would care to update it and did so.
Windows 8 is creating a Backup of your current installation so there is a restore point you can use. I did not try it out and after 2 weeks i deleted the restore Point.
So far so good. The installation wasn't that complicated. Unfortunately after that i could no longer install any Program or update. The reason behind it was that the upgrade process is exchanging something in the users Registry and after that the security checks simply denied me access to the file System. Even booting in recovery mode did not help (just like my Android GBook tablet at the moment ) . Only way to cope this was to create a new User with Admin Rights as a replacement. Doing so one of my document Folders got lost in transition. I still have no Idea what happened but after moving a Folder from MyDocuments user old to MyDocouments user new the Move process suddenly died and the files where gone. I did have a Backup so luckily it was just annoying but still gave me a rough time figuring out what happened.
You will probably be bothered to reinstall some applications (MS Apps will work) and the new interface is something to get used to for a Lot of Developers.
My System turned quiet a bit slower because of the ever running index service etc. Indexing is even denying write access to newly created files quite regularly and you will have to wait for it to finish before file operations are possible. You definitively have to tune system services if you want a system that is not slowing you down.
My final advice after 2 Month using Win8?
Don't do an in place upgrade it if you don't have to. Windows 7 was working perfectly for me. After 15 years of IT Support under my belly (even thou most of it doing Back-office Servers) Win7 felt like an OS that wasn't in the way and did a great Job. Windows 8 will get in your way via slowing down your Box and making steps that were natural in win7 more cumbersome.
Especially System settings are more or less hidden (because the average "dummy" user needs to be protected from it :silly: ) and are hard to find. Turning every entry in your Start menu into an Metro Icon does not Help either. It's just messing up your start screen. Be Prepared to switch between metro and "normal Desktop" quite often if you are still using "older" programs. Even if you don't want to your Program will decide for you .
I think a fresh install helps in that category because it might make it easier to "switch your mind" to the new environment. It will also be a chance to clean your System of old and rarely used programs.
If you still want your Upgrade make sure your Backups are up to date and Working!
Hope this is helping you out.
Cheers
Lanman99
Thanks for enlightening us on the new screw-ups and mishaps of Win8 upgrades. The availability of the downgrade restore point is a new and welcome change, but the rest sounds about right for an upgrade.
Four hours to upgrade (when a clean install takes 15 minutes): check
Permissions messed up afterward: check
Performace actually decreased (even though a clean install of Win8 performs better than a clean install of Win7 on the same hardware): check
Data loss (your Documents folder): check
As for your points re: Win8 itself: first of all, if your only experience with it is based on that abomination of an in-place upgraded system, assume everything you "know" about the OS from that experience is wrong. I've been running Win8 for ~1.5 years now (counting betas) and have never had the problem with indexing service (which runs low-priority and doesn't take system resources that you're trying to use for anything else), data loss from library or folder movement, or any of the other problems you mention. I did try an upgrade install during the betas, but the result was trash - a bunch of features didn't work afterward, and the performance was worse than it should be - and the response when I reported the issues was "do a clean install". Upgrade installs are only *technically* supported; even MS thinks they're a bad idea.
Judging on OS based on an upgrade install is like judging a car model based on taking that car's interior and body, but replacing the engine, transmission, suspension, electronics, wheels, brakes, lights, and wipers with random junk you pulled out of a wrecking yard (without checking the original model) and beat into shape with a hammer and a hacksaw. Sure, it *looks* like it's easier (cheaper than making the needed money to buy the actual model) than buying a new car, and if you're really careful and moderately lucky, it will actually run pretty well and not strand you in the middle of nowhere or burst into flame or something awkward like that. It's going to be a complete pain in the ass to maintain though, you'll end up having spent a ton of time hacking it together in the first place and then keeping it running until you quickly pass the point where it would have been easier to just get the new car, and in the meantime it will never perform as well as it "should" have. Putting a bunch of junk car parts in a BMW body does not mean you're driving a BMW.
By the way, those problems that I didn't have? That even includes the "switching back and forth" thing, because I found it was a lot better to just not use Metro at all. I treat the Start screen the same way I treat the Start menu on older NT6.x versions: an irrelevant graphical thing that pops up for the half second where I type the name of a program I want, in between when I hit the Windows key and when I hit Enter. I pinned my most-used apps to the taskbar. My typical admin stuff is on the Win+X (or right-click the Start button - yes, there is one, it's just hidden until you hover over it) menu. Outlook is a better mail client than Mail, and better scheduling tool than Calendar. Pidgin is better than Messenger. If for some reason I want to log into Facebook, I have this thing called a "web browser" (which runs in a window, with all its features instead of a crippled subset of them, thank you very much).
Metro Skype is good enough I do use it sometimes, although I snap it to one edge of my (very wide) screen so it doesn't get in the way; I've considered going back to desktop Skype anyhow. Desktop SkyDrive is much better than the Metro one. Same for desktop OneNote vs. the Metro version. The only Metro apps I actually use much are games, and frankly I don't use Metro games that often on my main (desktop) Win8 box; why would I, when I could play Eve Online or Civilization / Alpha Centauri instead?
I only had the problem of a few games and visual studio needing a reinstall on my upgraded system. Not one of the other issues mentioned.
Oh, also had an issue where before the update it said my GPU drivers wouldn't work post upgrade, they did and as soon as I upgraded I was able to obtain native windows 8 drivers anyway. My integrated GPU was fine.
GoodDayToDie said:
Thanks for enlightening us on the new screw-ups and mishaps of Win8 upgrades. The availability of the downgrade restore point is a new and welcome change, but the rest sounds about right for an upgrade....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Abomination is probably a bit harsh (i'm still working on that monster )
Don't get me wrong. I don't wan't to bash windows 8 for the sake of it. I just don't see a urgent reason to advise SysAdmNj to upgrade. Especially not an in-place upgrade. And i definitely agree that a clean install is the first choice to move to any new OS.
BUT surprisingly i pulled the same stunt growing from Vista to win7 on my Dell Studio 17 which went great. I had 1 issue with the on-board camera but other than that my notebook was running better, faster and more stable afterward and that was the primary reason why i tried it again with win7 to win8 on my lenovo. Still i got it working and at least it gave me valuable support experience and it's a dirty job but somebody...
Reason to try Metro is also based on my Idea to stay ahead of my Users. I think Metrostyle systems will be heading in our direction if we want it or not. It is to tempting for the marketing branches of our major OS vendors so i keep tinkering with it.
That "Back and Forth" simply lies in the program designs. It will just take me some time to get used to it, sorry but i'm old ).
Some of my apps (namely Hotmail which became Outlook) are seamlessly integrated and as you already mentioned much better than before most others are still written for WinXP/Vista/7 and will bring you back to familiar havens. Internet is done by a heavily customized FF portable, so carefree covered.
My main critique boils down to System settings Metro style. A lot of settings, tools and tweaks which grew into supporters hands look castrated to fit the average users need. That really is annoying. It looks i have to brush up on system scripting skills to support my colleagues. Thought i could get away with less typing these days :crying:.
...and yes switching a self patched '74 Beetle engine in a 2013 Beamer won't make a Racing machine but it looks funny trying to get away with it .
Right click the start icon on the desktop and there is a control panel link. Just the same as win7
SixSixSevenSeven said:
Right click the start icon on the desktop and there is a control panel link. Just the same as win7
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes if you are on your desktop. Starting up Metro won't give you that. You have to switch to your Desktop first. Or activate "All Apps" and sidescroll to Systemsettings. Besides it is not integrated which leads you again to your Desktop.
So System Settings = getting around Metro. The Settings Metro offers are still limited. Which IMHO is not a good way to do it. Yes it sounds nitpicking but if MS decides to get completely rid of our beloved Desktop, Metro is all you get.
But as i said, maybe just getting old...
On the metro start screen if you start typing it automatically fires up search. Type control and usually control panel is right there in front of you. Very quick and metro based.
But I agree, we could do with a native metro control panel.
SixSixSevenSeven said:
On the metro start screen if you start typing it automatically fires up search. Type control and usually control panel is right there in front of you. Very quick and metro based.
But I agree, we could do with a native metro control panel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In windows 8.2, there is supposed to be the Pc settings with more options like power options in it. This will not get rid of the desktop control panel though
Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2
Maybe I should have created a poll. Should I stay on windows 7 or upgrade?
I dont know now. I'm not crazy about windows 8. I'm fine on windows 7. Thing is most laptops come with windows 8 so I thought I might as well start familiarizing myself more. Although to be honest I think even if I was to buy a new laptop with windows 8, I would just clone that image and just restore a windows 7 image with all my apps etc. That or just change the hdd with mines
But thanks for all the insights.
Win8 does perform better, and has some cool new features (built-in ISO mounting, for example, is long overdue). If you do what I do, and mostly treat it as Win7 that has one more slot on the Taskbar than normal, it's a great OS. There are some things that mildly bug me, like the removal of window border transparency, but that's hardly a big deal.
The Win+X menu (or right-click on Start) can be done from anywhere; you don't have to be on the Desktop already. Selecting the Control Panel from that menu will open up the Desktop-mode Control Panel whether you're in the Desktop, the Start screen, or some Metro app.
I actually prefer the lack of border transparency and the flat colours etc, guess that's just personal preference though.
If you have a spare box--techies should always have a spare box--pop Win8 onto it to play around. If you're happy with Win7, I'd stick with that for your production box(es).
It's OK to skip Win8 (and 8.1). It's a transition rev, and biz won't migrate to it. There'll be more changes when Win9 rolls out next year, so even if you're set on sticking with Win, you can save half the work by jumping on Win9 then, because sure as heck you won't stay with 8.x when 9 is out.
Basically, if it's fun, then do it. If it's work, then don't.
There hasn't even been so much as a hint from Microsoft that there will be a windows 9 any time soon. I think we're in for a few more years of updates yet, windows 8 can still be "fixed".
Microsft stated - over a year ago, I think - that Windows was moving to an annual, smaller-releases cycle. Win8 and WP8 were the first OSed released after that announcement, with "Blue" for Windows and Windows Phone expected later this year (about one year after the W*8 releases). WP9-related job postings, referencing that OS by name/number, have already been posted on LinkedIn as well.
At least with windows 7.x you could switch ROMs and side load useful apps, with this safeboot thing and Microsoft's lame attitude to give us more of the features and apps that we want it's no wonder why Windows Phone 8 fourms and blogs are so boring. Way to go Microsoft.
Agreed. I used to come here every day but, now it's once a week (kind of how it was on PPCgeeks.com). No roms, No interop unlocks, no unlocks period.
If you want more discussion about WP8, I suggest going to WPcentral.com...It's pretty active over there...
I really wish a hack of some type would hit, this is getting old. I just want my custom colors back (like I have with WP7).... Advanced Config I miss you !!!
Nobody has been able to find an exploit yet , but I don't really mind lack of activity in forms though as long as cobwebs don't settle upon the entire ecosystem itself we'll be fine
DavidinCT said:
Agreed. I used to come here every day but, now it's once a week (kind of how it was on PPCgeeks.com). No roms, No interop unlocks, no unlocks period.
If you want more discussion about WP8, I suggest going to WPcentral.com...It's pretty active over there...
I really wish a hack of some type would hit, this is getting old. I just want my custom colors back (like I have with WP7).... Advanced Config I miss you !!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea I agree that WP Central has lost more action going on but it's all the same stuff; I mean how many reviews of itsdagram, Facebook, Angry Birds and Skype can one handle before they get bored.
I always use to wonder why XDA turned into Android forum almost over night; now I know why its thanks to Microsoft. I feel sorry for Nokia though they took a big risk and now MS is being stubborn.
sinister1 said:
Yea I agree that WP Central has lost more action going on but it's all the same stuff; I mean how many reviews of itsdagram, Facebook, Angry Birds and Skype can one handle before they get bored.
I always use to wonder why XDA turned into Android forum almost over night; now I know why its thanks to Microsoft. I feel sorry for Nokia though they took a big risk and now MS is being stubborn.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed, it's the same *****ing over there sometimes. Don't get me wrong, it's a good site if you want new and useful Windows Phone news. This site used to be a WM haven, just like PPCgeeks was. As that is all there was at the time, we had WM and BB...they were all mainly used by business people or hackers like ourselves.
WP7.x was pretty hackable after a while (with custom roms for most phones and interop unlock for about 90% of the models) so it was pretty active but, now with everyone moving to WP8 (ex WP7 users and converts) and No hacks yet, it's slowed down to almost nothing.
Android is mostly hackable and most phones have or NEED a custom rom, so this became a haven for Android users. And for now, as long as they are not going in this area and trolling, there is no issue with it or at least, I don't have an issue with it.
I do think it's a matter of time, they will find a exploit in WP8. I know why MS locked it down, once WP7 was hacked, it opened the doors for the pirates and some people took advantage if it. Sure there was some cool underground apps but, it just opened the system for the pirates. They wanted to lock down WP8 to make the higher end DEVs come and create the apps and games people want, to grow the system.
Nokia was paid pretty well to make a change to WP and over all they are doing very well with it...and their market is growing.
I'm stil deciding if I am going to pick up the Lumia 928 or stick with my HTC 8X(full price, Not giving up my unlimited data)....Hmmmmm... I just wish I could use Advanced Config to get my custom tile colors back
^stick with 8x at least till Nokia world sometime in September because surprises are on its way
Personally I like the very secure nature of my windows phone, I have rimmed more than my share of devices over the years, so its kind of refreshing to k ow this nuts hard to crack. Nokia did take a big risk but I think its been good for both companies. Nokia has done well with exclusive apps in a starved market and there devices are aimed well at a growing group of android overloaded users. With apps like tumble, netflix, Hulu and others coming over the devices are getting more main stream support and with time that will pay good dividends too. All in all I have found little reason to "root" this device other than for the hell of it. They come pretty lean on apps out of box. The biggest thing people seem to be trying to do is get tethering to work without paying out to a carrier for it. Personally if that's basically the reason your wanting to rom so bad, go back to android its far easier get going. I ramble now though, to sum up phone runs great unrommed, clean eco system and very secure setup makes for an all around pleasant device. I think special rimming is more or less unneeded for these devices. Been running unrommed windows mobile 7 and 8 now for about two years collectively. Have android tablets all rommed and a s3 rommed as a backup device.
Sent from my RM-878_nam_usa_100 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Meh... I considered WP7 without hacks to be nigh-unusable, even though I stuck with a stock ROM. No way to have apps open files automatically, for example (but I could manually add the registry entries, and could write apps that knew how to handle them). No way to access the filesystem (but I could sideload Kindle ebooks using homebrew file managers). No way back up app data or messages (except with homebrew). Minimal control of theming (as a class, this was one of the biggest homebrew categories). No real control over multitasking (I like that the default behavior is so conserving of battery life, but sometimes I don't *want* Puzzle Quest 2 or Fruit Ninja to have to go through its entire launch process just because I switched tasks or let the phone sleep for a bit!). Severe limit on sideloaded apps (I have over 30 of them, counting small utilities that that I developed, and not counting outdated versions, redundent apps, or anything else I removed). No listener sockets (though this didn't require a very fancy hack). No C++ code reuse (same as the server sockets). No way to tell how much space each app was using (but there's a homebrew for that).
WP8 fixes many of the worst problems. We can now register filetype handlers (though Kindle still doesn't register .MOBI or .PRC, so no more sideloading my ebooks for now...), use native code (with restrictions, but it's better than the default on WP7), and theme our phones (well, a litttttle bit more than before; still not enough). They added some much-requested features (SMS backup, variable text size, ability to control the browser app bar at least a bit, WiFi on while sleeping, Skype integration) and of course the change in OS brought many other improvements (multi-core, removable SD cards, higher resolutions, etc.). However, it still has some big problems of its own. True multitasking is still very limited. Data backup is still iffy. Still no filesystem access (or ability to do anything outside an app sandbox except the official Settings tools). Still very limited sideloading.
I promise you, though, people are working on it. I'm one of them, and several of the other names you know from WP7 hacking are as well.
People like GoodDayToDie & netham45 make the windows forums so much fun to follow
nikufellow said:
^stick with 8x at least till Nokia world sometime in September because surprises are on its way
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea but, I am on Verizon....After a release of a model it will take 6 months for Verizon to get a phone that is almost outdated on release.
The 8X is so limited on space that it's driving me nuts, If I find app or game I want to try, I have to uninstall a Paid app to install it. It's getting too old. 8X on format is 11.5gb and the Lumia 928 is 23.5gb, a little over double the space might be worth it, depending on what I can get it for, of course.
The blogs are dead because places like XDA that centralize around modding your phone to improve performance isn't necessary when WP8 software already performs flawlessly. Go to blogs like WPCentral and the Windows Phone community is alive and well swapping out our black Lumia shells for yellow and talking about games and apps. Pretty much doing what we should be doing on a phone, not repairing phones that came broken.
Flawlessly? Ahahahahaha
Still no app data backup machanism.
Still no custom themes.
Still no way to sideload XAP files (unless they are "company apps") without a PC.
Still no filesystem access.
Still no way to control the permissions an app has (what if I want to use the app, but don't want to give it access to my camera?)
Still no way remove "Settings" apps.
Still no way to do true multitasking (not the restricted and often crippled things that the official APIs call multitasking).
Still no way to overwrite file associations (you can choose them when opening a file that multiple apps claim to support, but that's it).
Still no way to change the default browser or email client or dialer.
Still no way to install apps to the SD card.
Still have only limited access to Bluetooth.
Still no way to browse, much less edit, the registry.
Still no way to sideload large numbers of (non-"company") apps.
...
Seriously, go look at the list of things that are possible with WP7 homebrew (never mind WinMo or Android or iOS), and then see how many of them are possible with WP8 right now. It's a joke. MS added some (much needed) features, but also took away some things that I think are vitally important, and took away our ability to re-create them for the new OS... unless and until we break it as we have broken OSes in the past.
You imply that WP8 didn't come "broken" and therefore doesn't need modding? Bull.
I've been wanting to root/unlock my Lumia for one purpose only, sideloading my own developed apps. It's gruesome to try an app in the emulator all the time, but in a month that will be fixed with an AppHub account. And after that my real purpose for rooting/unlocking is gone.
Always fun to see what's possible on the unlocked device though, code-wise.
Sent from my Lumia 920 using Board Express
GoodDayToDie said:
Flawlessly? Ahahahahaha
Still no app data backup machanism.
Still no custom themes.
Still no way to sideload XAP files (unless they are "company apps") without a PC.
Still no filesystem access.
Still no way to control the permissions an app has (what if I want to use the app, but don't want to give it access to my camera?)
Still no way remove "Settings" apps.
Still no way to do true multitasking (not the restricted and often crippled things that the official APIs call multitasking).
Still no way to overwrite file associations (you can choose them when opening a file that multiple apps claim to support, but that's it).
Still no way to change the default browser or email client or dialer.
Still no way to install apps to the SD card.
Still have only limited access to Bluetooth.
Still no way to browse, much less edit, the registry.
Still no way to sideload large numbers of (non-"company") apps.
...
Seriously, go look at the list of things that are possible with WP7 homebrew (never mind WinMo or Android or iOS), and then see how many of them are possible with WP8 right now. It's a joke. MS added some (much needed) features, but also took away some things that I think are vitally important, and took away our ability to re-create them for the new OS... unless and until we break it as we have broken OSes in the past.
You imply that WP8 didn't come "broken" and therefore doesn't need modding? Bull.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If there is one thing I do not understand about the new SDK APIs, is why on earth an app can not register itself to open file formats reserved by the system. IMO thats the most retarded idea ever implemented in the history of computing. And to make the retarded thing completely retarded, they made it so most common files are handled by system apps, so you can not override the file association.
I am really wondering what is microsoft going to do about these things. If they really want a marketplace full of games, facebook, youtube and instagram apps, then they should stick to their current plan. WP will never get useful in a broad sense.
I hope the update this fall brings new stuff, otherwise the platform will die soon.
GoodDayToDie said:
Flawlessly? ... You imply that WP8 didn't come "broken" and therefore doesn't need modding? Bull.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Although I don't agree with much of his bill-of-particulars, I have to agree with GDTD's sentiment.
Probably, modders need to correct deficiencies. I'm down with MS or anybody else who steps up. I'm in no hurry to crack my OS open right now, though.
I am especially offended at Microsoft's pitiful PDF reader attempt. And some of the apps in the store make me squint. I want to see the author "Google" emblazoned on my YouTube app, not a third party dev. I sure hope MS is putting these apps under a microscope.
The joy of homebrew (and of a developer forum, like this one) is, even if your goals are different from mine, it's possible for you to make your own changes to the device. It's yours; you control it. That's what security *means*, or at least what it's supposed to mean: you (the owner) are in control of what happens.
Ever since the iPhone, though, the trend has been twoards more and more lockdown, taking control away from the device owner and branding this as "security". I don't like it, so I aim to break it. Ideally, we break it in ways that only work with a local attack; I don't want somebody else able to control my device (that really would be the opposite of security)... but I do want to control it myself!
Part of the problem is that there have been no updates in recent months. Portico came out, Nokia dropped some new firmwares last month. But largely, nothing has changed in WP8 since launch. Personally, I find that boring. Maybe I should have an Android phone on the side to keep me entertained with updates, but I find Windows Phone much more usable day-to-day.
It has been more than 6 months since the WP8 launch, and GDR1 didn't really add much. Microsoft should have planned to have GDR2 out by now, even if it meant postponing some features for GDR3. I think most of us would rather have small quarterly updates to WP8, rather than a massive upgrade once a year. It's starting to feel like WP7 and the Mango anticipation all over again, now that it sounds like WP8.1 might be delayed into 2014. Hopefully they come through with their vaporware enthusiast program to keep our attention in the meantime.
I agree with the OP. Cobwebs on this side of the section totally. A thread in a week may be? But there is something I often read on many forums. People who are happy (I know it's a very wide term) with their devices, I.e don't run into problems with their devices, see no need to lurk around. So actually, it is a good sign. It shows how well-thought after a WP device is.
And GoodDayToDie, even though I agree with everything u've noted down, I don't quite believe WP needs all of that.
Still no app data backup machanism. - Umm...Data Sense?
Still no custom themes. - Fair Enough, but again, WP IS NOT meant to be themed to the T
Still no way to sideload XAP files (unless they are "company apps") without a PC. - I believe this is for security reasons.
Still no filesystem access. - Why do you even want that when the system is running flawless, (yes the same word u scorned at.)
Still no way to control the permissions an app has (what if I want to use the app, but don't want to give it access to my camera?) - LOL! You gotta be kidding me right?
Android has the worst permission management I have ever seen in my adult life. Android gives wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy more information out than any OS out there.
Still no way remove "Settings" apps. Umm..u sure u want that?
Still no way to do true multitasking (not the restricted and often crippled things that the official APIs call multitasking). Multi-tasking is really good with WP8.
Still no way to overwrite file associations (you can choose them when opening a file that multiple apps claim to support, but that's it). - Fair enough, but not a deal breaker either.
Still no way to change the default browser or email client or dialer. - I believe you are again entering the territory of themeing, already replied above. Every OS comes with it's own email client. I don't see the point here.
Still no way to install apps to the SD card. - Fair enough. By far the best point in your list.
Still have only limited access to Bluetooth. - In what way?
Still no way to browse, much less edit, the registry. - Again, WHY? WHy mend it when it's not broken.
Still no way to sideload large numbers of (non-"company") apps - U can download the app(paid or otherwise) from the App store on your computer, put it on the SD card and say install from the Store App on the phone. Simple?
DataSense has nothing even remotely to do with backing up (and restoring) app data; where'd you get that idea? Vital feature that homebrew eventually made avaialble in WP7 but is missing in WP8.
"IS NOT meant" nothing! Somewhere under all that sandboxing and locked-down UI is a general-purpose OS running on top of highly capable hardware. It's "meant" to be whatever the owner fo the device *wants* it to be, including (in the case of many, many people if the popularity of WP7 homebrew apps is any sign) theming. Stop being an apologist for Microsoft; it's one thing to say "extensive theming wasn't implemented because other features were higher priority" but when you start trying to tell me that I'm not supposed to theme it, you seriously need to put down the Kool-Ade. Besides, the very claim is ludicrous to the point of disingenious; have you *seen* the WP8 ads? They all stress the customizability of the Start screen. To the point of suggesting you can "meet" a person simply through how they have their phone set up... those ads freaking scream "customize me!" Then you discover there's only a handful of pre-set colors, two background styles, and the ability to mess with the tiles; nothing else.
No, it is quite absolutely *not* for "security" reasons. Security means the owner of the device controlling the device's behavior. If somebody else (like, for example, the manufacturer of the device) is controlling its behavior, that is not security; it's lockdown. The sideloading restriction can only be called security if it's not your device but actually belongs to Microsft. Screw that. Besides, that argument makes no sense anyhow; if I can pay my $99 and sideload with a PC, why can't I sideload without one (or without paying)? The marketplace has DRM to mitigate piracy and that's a darn weak excuse to cripple a device anyhow.
When I can load my Puzzle Quest 2 savegames and other game progress and high scores, copy my PGP keychain, sideload my Kindle ebooks into the Kindle app (yes, this is possible on WP7), extract or replace the built-in audio files, and delete the junk which accumulates in the OS and uses up storage space (without hard resetting the device), then I will stop considering the level of filesystem access a problem. Until then, "running flawless" is quite worthy of scorn indeed.
Wow, I seriously question your reading comprehension. I never mentioned Android in this point, or anywhere else (except to point out that it has a lot of homebrew). But, for your information, the default permissions / capabilities handling in Android is just as broken as in WP8. The difference is that with Android, it is possible (CyanogenMOD did this, for example) to install apps without actually granting them all the permissions they ask for. On WP7, this wasn't properly possible yet, but I was working on a system to do it that hooked the app install process and allowed people to uncheck app capabilities they didn't want to permit.
Um yes, I'd like to remove the non-functioning Samsung apps (until they are fixed) that are taking up space on my phone's storage and making the Settings list longer. I can always re-install them if needed. Every other carrier or OEM app is removable; why should these get special treatment just because they have a field in their app manifest that says "install me in the Settings hub"?
Multitasking - true multitasking, where multiple apps can run at once - is nigh-nonexistent on WP8. Aside from things like audio background agents and once-every-30-minutes-you-get-a-few-seconds-of-CPU-time scheduled tasks, there basically isn't any multitasking (of third-party apps) at all. Fast app switching is *not* multitasking; every app aside from the main one is suspended, unable to do amything until brought into the foreground.
Changing file associations obviusly isn't a deal-breaker, or I wouldn't be using the phone... but definitely a problem. Windows has offered the ability to control file associations since at least Win95, and I think it was possible in 3.1 as well...
Changing the default browser and email client and calendar and dialer aren't "theming" by any conventional definition, but the point made above about theming stands anyhow: it's a matter of personalization. It can also be a matter of functionality (for example, the built-in email client can't handle S/MIME encrypted email at all and has no PGP integration). Or a matter of usability (I use folders a lot; it's a pain needing to expand a menu to get to them)! Or something else... the important point is that it should be possible. Every OS comes with an email client, but every OS except iOS (and WP) allows you to change the default email client, too. This isn't even hard to implement (the relevant registry keys were present on WP7, at least; carrying over the API to control them wouldn't have been hard at all); it's once again a case of Microsoft intentionally restricting what you can do with your phone. If I wanted a mobile OS designed by a control freak, I'd buy an iPhone...
Nothing more really needs to be said here, except that with filesystem access (create a symlink or junction in the apps folder, for example) this would be possible...
Many BT profiles, such as HID devices (for mice and keyboards), are missing from WP8. So far as I know, apps can't use the Headset profile either; the pseudo-turn-by-turn navigation on WP7 would give its instructions via the car's BT if possible, but Nokia/Here Drive must use the phone's speakerphone speaker instead.
When I can change default browser and text editor, create my own themes, enable features that a ROM shipped disabled (have you seen the thread by the guy who can't get visual voicemail?), sideload high-privilege apps (without paying for the privilege), and remove root certificates of CAs that I don't trust (in WP7, these were stored in the registry), then I will stop considering the level of registry access to be a problem.
If they're from the store, they aren't really sideloaded, just downloaded on a different machine. I'm talking homebrew, stuff that the isn't yet, or never will be, or *can't* be (because it breaks some policy of Microsoft's, or requires high privileges to work) put in the store. Besides, many of the most popular WP8 models don't have an SD card slot at all.
GoodDayToDie said:
Flawlessly? Ahahahahaha
Still no app data backup machanism.
Still no custom themes.
Still no way to sideload XAP files (unless they are "company apps") without a PC.
Still no filesystem access.
Still no way to control the permissions an app has (what if I want to use the app, but don't want to give it access to my camera?)
Still no way remove "Settings" apps.
Still no way to do true multitasking (not the restricted and often crippled things that the official APIs call multitasking).
Still no way to overwrite file associations (you can choose them when opening a file that multiple apps claim to support, but that's it).
Still no way to change the default browser or email client or dialer.
Still no way to install apps to the SD card.
Still have only limited access to Bluetooth.
Still no way to browse, much less edit, the registry.
Still no way to sideload large numbers of (non-"company") apps.
...
Seriously, go look at the list of things that are possible with WP7 homebrew (never mind WinMo or Android or iOS), and then see how many of them are possible with WP8 right now. It's a joke. MS added some (much needed) features, but also took away some things that I think are vitally important, and took away our ability to re-create them for the new OS... unless and until we break it as we have broken OSes in the past.
You imply that WP8 didn't come "broken" and therefore doesn't need modding? Bull.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only thing I can agree with you on is the file system, bluetooth, and not being able to override the default apps associations (seriously, the default apps is the most retarded idea ever).
So, I am at work and I showed off Linux on Dex to some other Developers and Engineers here.
Impressed they were, but it's time to really dig in.
Here is what I love about it on first look:
Great to have a fleshed Linux experience on my phone
Great dev tools come with the image (IntelliJ and also Visual Studio Code and more)
Has plenty of apps to get you started and it's pretty thoughtful
Looks great at 1920x1080 as well as 2560x1440 resolutions on a monitor
Switching between Dex and Ubuntu is pretty snappy
Things I didn't like:
Just a LITTLE bit laggy sometimes
Need to either use ARM compiled apps or compile them yourself
The Default 10GB partition size was too small, so I would suggest using 15GB at least, after updates/upgrades (Ubuntu OS updates that is), you'll still have about 35% free space with 15GB disk
You cannot "install" this on the SDCard, only internal memory, so keep that in mind if you have the 128GB model and tons of apps
Once installed, you cannot delete the 3GB+ zip file you downloaded, so there is that wasted space as well (ok, I have not tried REALLY hard to delete it yet, but Google Files won't delete it, nor do I know the repercussions of deleting this file too)
I'm still trying to work out how to access the files on the device (outside the Linux container), not sure if it is possible, but I have not had a lot of time with it as of now
BONUS!!
When you are not in Dex mode (normal handset mode), you can still launch Linux on Dex, but you cannot get the full desktop experience.
Click on the Terminal icon under the RUN button and you can drop into the Ubuntu Shell and still use commands (like SSH-ing to servers using your certs and stuff).
Of course, the down side, small screen. Hey, in a pinch, when I am on the road and needs to SSH into an AWS instance and run a couple commands, I won't complain!!
All in all, I think this will be great for Dev's to play with, not sure how useful it REALLY will be, but I know from a DevOps/Architect/Engineer, it's nice to have as a backup to be able to actually take care of things without having to drag out the whole laptop.
All this, with a $20 adapter.
Any other thoughts for those that have used it?
Hello friend, I have mine installed on my 128gb Sdcard.
How did you get it on your SD Card?
Thanks!
Talderon said:
How did you get it on your SD Card?
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Move the file from LoD folder to the SD card and reassign the file location in the Linux on Dex app, it worked for me but moved it back to internal storage to ensure best performance .
My impression? They will poorly maintain it and I suspect it will be discontinued without any real notice. Registration was broken for well over a week before signups ended. You cannot get in contact with anyone from the team. Care doesn't even know it exists.
I am yet to find a use case that improves upon remote access to an Ubuntu 18.04 VM running on a cloud or at home, but I'm not a developer.
Perhaps if you are stuck somewhere without an Internet connection and feel like coding somewhere in the mountains or in the jungle.. But then you would need a handy monitor, keyboard, mouse and a power source..?
I think I can sum this up in one simple sentence - "Because I can..."
It's like having linux on a PS3, because it could.
Haven't had a chance to use it yet but looks promising. That doesn't mean it will be supported very well, time will tell.
Hardware wise it should work very well, and there is ALWAYS a good reason to have a handy (mostly) self-contained PC with you in case you CAN'T access the net...
Would be great to get an idea of some real life use cases..
Would be very happy to see this project pick up some community developer attention, the platform is only as good as the tools developed for it.
In the absence of an official LoD forum for developers perhaps that community should be developed here.
p33l05 said:
In the absence of an official LoD forum for developers perhaps that community should be developed here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
https://developer.samsung.com/forum/board/thread/list.do?boardName=SDK&searchSubId=0000000051
I got this installed on my 8GB Note 9 today. I didn't get registered for the beta, but download the app and the Ubuntu image and got it all up and running today. My only complaint so far is it won't run full screen on Dex. That may be because I'm running the Pie Beta. Not sure how it operates on Oreo Dex.
I'll play around with it more later. I basically just plugged into my monitor and opened it up today.
Well, here is a real-life use case that saved me a TON of time and effort.
I set up the Linux on Dex with many tools and configs I need to be able to do my work (Sr. DevOps Architect/Engineer) on my AWS servers. I had an instance that was having some issues and was notified via the monitoring platform and was able to get my phone out, run the Ubuntu Shell and SSH/Fix the issue without ever having to pull out the laptop and tether it while on the train headed home.
There ARE some use cases where this will come in handy, but I do agree that these are real "edge" cases too. No "normal" user will ever really find this helpful.
Mr. Orange 645 said:
I got this installed on my 8GB Note 9 today. I didn't get registered for the beta, but download the app and the Ubuntu image and got it all up and running today. My only complaint so far is it won't run full screen on Dex. That may be because I'm running the Pie Beta. Not sure how it operates on Oreo Dex.
I'll play around with it more later. I basically just plugged into my monitor and opened it up today.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Full screen on oreo.. Have you tried Dex max app?
planning to install LoD and curious if it can actually decompile and recompile apk's as a laptop would..?! mostly I'm interested in Themes for Samsung.. using few apk as templates to swap files, images and recompiling the apk, will it be able and will it properly sign it ?! and if so which way should I go?! do I need to install java, SDK, plugin I saw there ?!
any advice would be great.. thanx..
Can you use any Type c to HDMI or has to be an special cable?
darkriff said:
Can you use any Type c to HDMI or has to be an special cable?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you need powersupply as well in the adapter for it to work.