Hi guys,
I've been a HTC and Windows Mobile user a little while now. I previously had a Trinity (HTC 3600) and now I have the Touch HD. It has come to my attention that I really need to figure out what the data terminology really means.
I have noticed that when using my phone, data connections are automatically initiated when I perform/launch specific applications that are obviously using a data connection, such as:
- Google Maps
- Tom Tom Traffic
- Internet (opera/internet explorer)
- Manilla 3D Weather
- Manilla Photo uploading
- etc.
I have found it annoying at times that data connections have started without informing me, and then to make things worse, the connection doesnt cancel at the end of its task, it needs a manual disconnect.
I've gradually gone through the settings of most programs, turning off any form of "automatic update" setting. So im happier knowing that most of the time my phone shouldnt be unexpectidly in the middle of a data connection.
But on occasions I look at my phone, and see that its had a data connection open for over an hour (although my guess is that hardly any data has been transfered on these occasions).
So firstly, could anyone reccomend any programs that can monitor my data connections or usage and even force me to give authorisation whenever a data connection is requested?
Secondly, I find that if I have my wifi connection connected, all apps that try to use a data connection use this to channel their data through, this is perfectly fine and is the behaviour I expect, but when I'm using Windows Messenger on my phone, while on wifi, for some unknown reason, it feels it can establish another data connection (regardless of the wifi being connected and operating) - and that is very annoying.
Most of my concerns stem from the fact that I only have off-peak free data time on the web with my provider (Orange).
Lastly, could someone help explain the differences between:
GPRS
3G
HSDPA
I think GPRS is what sat nav apps use for geographical positioning using satelites, and its free. But im not sure about the others, are there others that I am unaware of too. I think 3G and HSDPA are data connections, but what makes one different from the other, and why is it only sometimes 3G is used, and another time HSDPA is used?
Im in London, UK, and I notice on my phones signal bar, that it can often change to show a "G" or a "H" or a "3G" and there could be others. This is all so confusing, and my main concern is about paying for data connections etc.
Oh... and whats the difference, or whats the point of telling the phone to use "Work" or "The Internet", this also confuses me.
Although this is a bit of a long winded post, I'll appriciate any bits of help and advice given.
Thanks in advanced,
WizzKidd
Ok, i've been doing some reading, and for the sake of those who "search" these forums in the future, this post will at least have an answer (even if im kinda answering it myself).
My understanding is as follows:
The 4 data channels are: GSM / GPRS / 3G / EDGE
In order of their age (oldest to newest)...
GSM: (Global System for Mobile communications)
- The European standard for the majority of handsets.
- Primary usage is voice.
- Tri-band GSM allow Europe to operate these phones and Quad-band GSM allows some Far East to operate.
- Can be used with the GPRS core network for data.
GPRS:
- One of the first widely used data channels
- Can transmit data of up to 60 KBits/sec
- is battery friendly
EDGE: (Exchanged Data rates for GSM Evolution)
- based on GPRS
- Can transmit up to 473.6 KB/its per second
- ideal for heavy webpages, and downloading email attachments etc
3G:
- Originally for video data calls but also efficient for web/email, im and voip
- very popular channel, most UK and some European networks now have 3G networks and with speeds similar to EDGE
- not battery friendly when searching for new 3G connections
HSDPA: (High speed Downlink Packet Access)
- Based on 3G technology
- Supports speeds of up to 7.2 MBits/sec (but in reality you usually get 3Mb/s)
- very good for high bandwidth usage like video streaming
So, what ive gathered from all this is that the phone can switch its data channel depending on how demanding the application is for bandwidth and also what data channels are available in the area.
Please correct me if i am wrong, assumtions and corrections is the best way to learn.
Thanks,
Wizzkidd
PS. I still dont see the point of Windows Mobile asking me if this network is connected to "Work" or "The Internet".
Isn't HSDPA also called 3G+ ?
GPRS
Hai Wizzkidd
What you can do is: put gprs off. Go to settings-> connections-> connections. On the tab tasks you wil see: my isp. Open de link modify and select your isp. Hold it down and remove settings.
You will still be able to make phonecalls and sms. You will have to get your updates etc... through wifi or sync.
me to, Orange/(3G) - are they the same ?????
wizzkidd said:
Hi guys,
I have found it annoying at times that data connections have started without informing me, and then to make things worse, the connection doesnt cancel at the end of its task, it needs a manual disconnect.
I've gradually gone through the settings of most programs, turning off any form of "automatic update" setting. So im happier knowing that most of the time my phone shouldnt be unexpectidly in the middle of a data connection.
But on occasions I look at my phone, and see that its had a data connection open for over an hour (although my guess is that hardly any data has been transfered on these occasions).
So firstly, could anyone reccomend any programs that can monitor my data connections or usage and even force me to give authorisation whenever a data connection is requested?
Secondly, I find that if I have my wifi connection connected, all apps that try to use a data connection use this to channel their data through, this is perfectly fine and is the behaviour I expect, but when I'm using Windows Messenger on my phone, while on wifi, for some unknown reason, it feels it can establish another data connection (regardless of the wifi being connected and operating) - and that is very annoying.
Most of my concerns stem from the fact that I only have off-peak free data time on the web with my provider (Orange).
Lastly, could someone help explain the differences between:
GPRS
3G
HSDPA
I think GPRS is what sat nav apps use for geographical positioning using satelites, and its free. But im not sure about the others, are there others that I am unaware of too. I think 3G and HSDPA are data connections, but what makes one different from the other, and why is it only sometimes 3G is used, and another time HSDPA is used?
Im in London, UK, and I notice on my phones signal bar, that it can often change to show a "G" or a "H" or a "3G" and there could be others. This is all so confusing, and my main concern is about paying for data connections etc.
Oh... and whats the difference, or whats the point of telling the phone to use "Work" or "The Internet", this also confuses me.
Although this is a bit of a long winded post, I'll appriciate any bits of help and advice given.
Thanks in advanced,
WizzKidd
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
firstly = http://www.modaco.com/content/pocket-pc-software/246171/new-free-utility-nodata/ - not TESTED on my ELF { http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=318414&page=4 }
secondly = I had to 'make do' with a 'modem', for a bit. A '3' ZTE MF622 USB modem, it uses hdspa/3G. network3's website, classes this modem as a phone/sim - was PAYG, though (mythree. . . . ) - - - - THE HDSPA downloaded, "" faster at times than virgin-cabled Bband did !!! "" - watch [task mgr]->[network]
thirdly = NICE ONE !!! 9.75/10 for the (101/explaination's of the connections) and the check Ur not updating Ur Apps, all/some of the time.
shame the [comm mgr]->[phone]="wake on lan"/(x)
still under usb, i cannot Ms Direct push / Data connect
only LIVE via usb - NO WIFI (connected, but ...)
networks
Hi,
I think your question about preventing automatic connection has been explained.
As for GPRS, 3G and HSDPA,
They are all cellular data connections but will vary in speed and stability.
GPRS and EDGE (can provide what each stand for but i am sure google would do the work for me)
They are the packet data networks when using the 2G networks. GPRS (2.5G f you will) has downlink speeds of around 28kb/s and EDGE (2.75G) 100kb/s.
3G (UMTS) max's out around 384kb/s and officially HSDPA (3.5G) can is commercially available at 7.2mbps. All the speeds above are network dependant as all can be capped.
Most operators are now testing HSDPA and HSUPA (3.75G - same downlink speed as HSDPA but faster uplink, the speed however escapes me ) on speeds greater than 7.2mbps.
You will not be charged differently for each network type and each will come out of a data plan at the same rate.
The 2G networks are more stable but slower and the 3G networks are faster but due to congestion issues the connections have been known to drop as i am sure some other users will agree.
The thing sat nav software uses for positioning is GPS (Global positioning system) and not GPRS (general packet radio service). GPS is a handset feature like wifi or bluetooth and nothing to do with the network.
Hope that helps.
Cheers
Ross
HSDPA
Hey guys, I just wana know if any of you know how to make your phone connect using hsdpa only. Because this is realy fast compared to other connections, and its annoying when the device switches to gprs or some other type of connection which makes the net super slow.
Ok GSM is a wireless technology like CDMA it has very little to do with actual data use.
GPRS(2G), EDGE(2.5G), UMTS(3G), HSDPA (also 3G), HSUPA(3G yet again), HSPA+(3.5G) All of these, are technologies that allow internet connectivity or data transfer, at different speeds. Depending on the tech your service provider uses your speeds will vary, that being said, you, don't pay extra when your connection switches.
GPRS: General Packet Radio Service...
Pipsqueak approved this message
Hey guys, it seems that you can simply select WCDMA only option in your setting to connect using only HSDPA.
Related
Are there any networking applications that would allow seamless switches between Wifi and GPRS/Edge?
It would be nice to be able to have a GPRS connection on the way into work, perahps streaming internet radio and then to have the network connection detect the Wifi and then switch. I suppose you would have to preconfigure your device with a list of access points, but considering that most of us use our devices at work and home, that should be easy to setup.
Or am I asking for something technically difficult to do?
YEs, Yes you can, but it maybe more trouble than its worth..
Its possible, Im not sure how "seemless" the transistion is going to be. First, you need to turn your Wifi slider to Performance so wifi radio stays on and scans while the PDA is sleeping. Then you need to add the SSID's (and WEP keys if applicable) of all the access points you intend to switch between. Having done this, you're going to need a huge battery, because leaving wifi on on this mode usually only yields about 3 - 3.5 hours of battery life. In addition, your GPRS radio is running so your battery life will be consumed slighly faster. With this configuration I have my work private network access points (3 for the different departments). My home wifi AP, and a few hotspots that I frequent in the evenings. When wifi is on, I can walk between any of these locations and the pda will automatically connect me to the present network. The downside to this is that every time I pass another visisble hotspot, the Universal chimes and wakes up to alert me to the new connection options. I also recommend doing the 802.11G hack for more compatibility (no speed improvement). Hope this helps.
Really seamless handover between GPRS and WIFI is not really possible without some firmware/radio stack changes. As long as you can put up with a second or two of data interruption there might be an 'seamless enough' solution in software (i haven't found one though).
There are some new phones which can do this handover for the voice channel (so called 'UMA' phones) but even then I have only seen the handover work seamlessly one way (wifi-to-gsm) in practice.
I can't see MS adding UMA support for some time (Motorola and Nokia have some phones that do this already). It nay be that a 3rd party adds UMA support but it won't be great as it needs to be embedded in the OS for best usability.
Google "UMA mobile phones" for more info.
It is possible to have seamless handover between GPRS and WIFI without firmware/radio stack changes ! The technigue is Mobile IP. But the provider would support/provide it or you have your own Home Agent server ( like proxy server)
You have only one IP address and your connection session is never abrupt during WIFI <-> UMTS Handover.
The other problem is GPRS/UMTS connection-hooking on MS Windows CE !
best regards,
Hello out there...
since a few days i have noticed that during a voice call no data connection is available, in short when connection is acitve it goes offline...
i belief that was not always so... is there any patch in ext. rom available or whre is the error???
steve
AFAIK No error, you just can't use your carriers data connection and the phone line at the same time.
on umts/hsdpa you can do both at once
on edge/gprs you can only do one or the other. on umts/hsdpa you can surf and talk at the same time. 3g rocks.
hi
How can i monitor how much data i've used (not wifi)
I've got 500mb a month, and while i'm sure i wont use this, i want to keep tabs and reset each month
is this functionality built in?
cheers
m.r.davies said:
hi
How can i monitor how much data i've used (not wifi)
I've got 500mb a month, and while i'm sure i wont use this, i want to keep tabs and reset each month
is this functionality built in?
cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I managed to rack up over £100 of data charges before I realised that my network settings (buried away down start->connections->connections->advanced->select networks .... obviously !) were set to use the cellphone connection by default. It was therefore using HSDPA even when wifi was connected. I proved this by downloading an app called GPRS Traffic Monitor. It's very basic but it monitors your GPRS/HSDPA traffic. I've now switched the default connection to be "My Work Network" instead of "Contract Internet" and traffic monitor now shows no increased data usage while the wifi is connected.
I've also noticed (although not scientifically tested) that if an application gets a connection via HSPDA before the wifi connection is established then it continues to use HSPDA and doesn't switch over.
Maybe everyone else knows all this but it was all news (and very expensive) to me.
Cheers,
David
link for gprs traffic moniter
dcoales said:
I managed to rack up over £100 of data charges before I realised that my network settings (buried away down start->connections->connections->advanced->select networks .... obviously !) were set to use the cellphone connection by default. It was therefore using HSDPA even when wifi was connected. I proved this by downloading an app called GPRS Traffic Monitor. It's very basic but it monitors your GPRS/HSDPA traffic. I've now switched the default connection to be "My Work Network" instead of "Contract Internet" and traffic monitor now shows no increased data usage while the wifi is connected.
I've also noticed (although not scientifically tested) that if an application gets a connection via HSPDA before the wifi connection is established then it continues to use HSPDA and doesn't switch over.
Maybe everyone else knows all this but it was all news (and very expensive) to me.
Cheers,
David
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hie have you got a link for gprs traffic moniter, either freeware or paid thanks
www.efficasoft.com. Costs about $10. BTW this is just the first one I found and there may be better ones out there if you have the time to do some google searching. However, this one does seem to work and a couple of other I looked at were fine with monitoring GPRS but couldn't seem to handle HSDPA - this one seems to work fine though.
At the moment I'm still trialling it and if nothing better turns up in the next couple of days I'll register.
Which version did you select?
I can't get the efficasoft cab to install (it keeps reporting back as installation unsuccessful).
Any clues?
I think I downloaded GPRSMonitor_PPC12.cab - I'll check tomorrow and repost if different - I'm just going out now.
dcoales said:
I managed to rack up over £100 of data charges before I realised that my network settings (buried away down start->connections->connections->advanced->select networks .... obviously !) were set to use the cellphone connection by default. It was therefore using HSDPA even when wifi was connected. I proved this by downloading an app called GPRS Traffic Monitor. It's very basic but it monitors your GPRS/HSDPA traffic. I've now switched the default connection to be "My Work Network" instead of "Contract Internet" and traffic monitor now shows no increased data usage while the wifi is connected.
I've also noticed (although not scientifically tested) that if an application gets a connection via HSPDA before the wifi connection is established then it continues to use HSPDA and doesn't switch over.
Maybe everyone else knows all this but it was all news (and very expensive) to me.
Cheers,
David
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you sure that you don't have some other setting wrong?
I have cellular network selected here but have issues with it dialing with wifi or activesync connected.
In the Comm Manager, I try to switch Data Connection (HSDPA for me on Orange UK) off, but it keeps coming on.
I don't want it on!
Is there a better way to keep it switched off until I request it to be re-enabled?
Should only come on when an app requests data access. Have you got something running in the background? Quickgps perhaps?
i can't turn mine off via the Comm Manager unless i put the phone in GSM only. fyi, the HD 3G bands don't work in the US.
Windows Live Messenger is running in the background but that should be sorted by the WiFi which is on.
I go into the Proxy Settings for Orange Internet and untick the box that says that "this connects to the internet". But then it automatically ticks itself again and connects!
Perhaps it's an Orange problem?
Don't think so - I'm on Orange too and it doesn't happen. Anyway, it's the phone's choice to connect to HSDPA, it has to actively make the connection.
My best guess is your phone is losing connection with your wifi for short periods, and thus resorting to the backup hsdpa.
I think I've found a solution:
http://www.1800pocketpc.com/2008/11...nternet-hspda-gprs-3g-edge-off.html#more-1863
Download here:
http://www.modaco.com/content/pocket-pc-software/246171/new-free-utility-nodata/
EDIT or here:
http://www.4shared.com/file/34306709/f45622d6/NoData.html?start=
Aren't you confusing 2 icons ?
The big plain H only means that SSDPA is available on the network. This doesn't mean you arer *using* HSDPA at this time.
The icon to look at is the one just on the right of the big H. When you are using HSDPA, it shows a little H with 2 arrows below. If it shows an antenna with the signal level bar below, you are not using HSDPA, but only GSM.
At least it's the way it works on mine. As soon as I need data transmission (like for weather forecast), it uses HSDPA since it is available. Otherwise, it uses GSM. Therefore,
mine turns itself on when i recieve a mms....could you be recieving one?
Close all applications using it!
Sometimes I forget to close Opera after using it, and it happens to me too!
The issue I have is that I live in an area with minimal mobile coverage so have to rely on wi-fi connection when at home. Just today my HD2 has started acting up with an issue that I have experienced previously. When I try to update weather, stocks and other apps that require connectivity I get the error message about the dial-up modem being disconnected - the cause is fine as I have no signal but I don't understand why these apps are not swapping to the wi-fi connection. Browsing the internet is fine as is the YouTube app but all others (including email) are failing as they are trying to dial-up.
I have done some experimenting with mixed results:
1) If the phone radio is off (aerial followed by an x) - then the phone will fallback to wi-fi and applications that require connectivity seem to work.
2) If the phone radio is on and it is trying to find a signal (aerial with 3 dots cycling) then it will not issue the dial-up disconnected error - instead it will try to connect but then either time out (for apps like Omarket and Sky Mobile) or will work with mixed results (stocks and weather - although it only updates locations other than my location).
3) If the phone radio is on but there is no signal (aerial followed by exclamation mark) - then I get the dial-up disconnected error on apps that require connectivity (with the exception of Opera and YouTube).
Does anyone have any thoughts on what causes these inconsistencies and if there is a way to resolve them? When I had this issue before I did a hard reset which seemed to do the trick although with hindsight I am not entirely convinced whether it made any difference - especially if Apple's excuse for their iphone4 signal issue is to be believed (i.e. at times I could have a signal even though the phone is indicating that I do not have one).
I presume in the real world i.e. one where one has decent mobile coverage - this issue is unlikely to occur or certainly less obvious to spot
Hey,
If you set up your dial-up connection as part of your WiFi connection ( ISP or Work) and then set "programs that automatically connect to the internet" to the WiFi connection the automatic program will no longer try and connect if you are connected by WiFi.
go to settings-menu-all settings-connections-connections and add a new modem connection to your Work network. You need to get the settings from your service provider or copy them from the existing data connection.
once done, got to advanced and select networks and choose the work connection for programs that automatically connect.
that should help
m.
So in short I would have a single config that contains both the wifi and mobile settings as opposed to the two separate configs that I have at present. I will give that a crack and see what happens.
Thanks