I have had my 3G iphone for about 6-7 months now, and have in that time tried several new phones, namely Nokia E71, Diamond (horrible), X1 (lasted less than 1 day!) and I also own a Trinity.
Anyway, the HD arrived via www.devicewire.co.uk in the UK (doh) on Thursday last week, and I powered it up right away. It was £522 delivered.
I think in the UK, people are better off ordering online, since you have the 7 day DSR (Distance Sellings Regs) to fall back on in the event of dislike, dead pixels etc.
With the HD, I am surprised how much I like it..........put it this way, it came Thursday, and Friday it was a case of "yes, this is good, but nothing much better than the iPhone, so I can not justify the cost, so back it goes".....read on for what happened next
I even have the return code from devicewire (very good aftersales, even when you are returning stuff!!)
I can not say the HD screen blew me away, since the screen on the iPhone is a truly, truly lovely screen anyway, and I had been using this everyday for the aforemention 6-7 months.....but, for anyone who has not been using an iPhone, the screen is gonna make you do a double take. It is clear, big, bright and the fonts look amazing.
First thing I did was switch off the ambient sensor (yes, it does have one!), and put brightness up to full, I love contrast as my eyesight is not so good these days.
Now, this is why the iPhone has been so good for me, (although I guess most of you lot here will be younger with perfect vision), I find it has good large fonts, and great contrast.
Compare this to the default text size on the Diamond, or indeed the latest Sony X1, its tiny, and yes, I do know you can altertext size, but on a small screen, it just means you get less on a sreen and have to be scrolling all the time.
The HD is just perfect for me, nice big fonts, so smooth, and perfectly usable with either a finger, (even with a glove on, something that is not possible on iPhone), or a stylus, which as it turns the HD on, is handy to have.
So, the screen is as good as the iPhone, with better resolution, and as I just read in the Slashgear review, the actual touching of the two screens is very close indeed. Even coming from several hours use of the iPhone eveyday, I do feel that I will get on with the HD screen very nicely.
But hang on, I am not keeping this am I, I already have the return code and devicewire are expecting it back......well, I doubt it now.......I had put it all away very carefully on Friday, but it sat there looking at me, and I kept reading about it on here........it was all too much, got up this morning and thought "lets take it to work, Sunday is quiet usually, I can have a play".
Well, the breakthrough for me was to turn off Touchflo and install PocketPlus, a great piece of software I have used on many devices. Oh, that and TomTom 6 running in landscape on the trip to work
As for GPS lag, it is only about 10 miles to my workplace, but there is little or no lag present in TomTom 6.
TomTom is a big deal for me, I find nothing touches it, and it is a great disapointment that there is still no TomTom (or anything else!) for the iPhone, when you recall the stories that TomTom already had it running back at the 3G launch, it must be Apple who are blocking its release.....
I think Touchflo is just too "black" for me, not sure if it will run with a brighter skin or not, but I like the way PocketPlus makes a device look, much brighter.
Now, a lot has been written about WM 6.1 being hard to use without D-Pad? The only issue (apart from games which I confess is of zero concern to me) is for selecting little drop down (roll out) menus, and that is sorted with AEBPlus http://ae.inc.ru/aebplus.php which allows you to assign the volume up and down keys to act as Arrow Up and Arrow Down, and this sorts it and works well.
I can confirm the UK HD comes with the little soft case (its quite nice actually), but a word of warning, do NOT assume all iPhone cases will work, my one, and nice Marware slip case is too tight, and the HD is a smidgen wider that the iPhone. Anyway, I like the softcase. It was also nice to get the 8gb Micro SD card. I have not installed the screen protector yet, can never really get on with those anyway.
Keyboard use on the iPhone is pretty good, and I was very doubtful that HTC could get anywhere near it, but they have basically cracked it IMV. The buttons are the same size as iPhone and easy to use. I am making less mistakes in a few hours than I do after 6 months on iPhone.
Web browsing is not in my opinion as good as the iPhone, well, let me qualify that. If you just use fingers, the iPhone wins, but if you use fingers and the stylus, I think the HD then just shades it.
One very welcome side effect of returning to WM is the multitasking, this is one massive issue for us geeks on the iPhone, combined with the lack of cut n paste, it really shows the two devices quite far apart in usability.
Email is very good on the iPhone, and if you only have the one account (gmail for example) it takes some beating for simplicity. However, the HD also does a great job, and with a little wireless keyboard (impossible on iPhone), I think it will make a good laptop replacement)
RSS is OK on the iPhone, but much easier on the HD, with the built in RSS Hub program, which downloads all feeds, including video feeds. I like to watch Cali Lewis on Geekbrief www.geekbrief.tv everyday, and you have to jailbreak the iPhone to be able to do that (yes, I do know its coming in 2.2 software, but with a limit of 10mb over cellular, which renders it useless for video podcasts, and anyway, its a pain in the arse to upgrade iPhone and then have to jailbreak each time.
We are good at making our decisions fit the case, so the iPhone user is always going to say "oh, I don't really miss cut n paste", when in fact, you quickly forget how often it is useful.
I think for me, it comes down to this, the HTC Touch HD can do everything the iPhone can do and lots more, but the the iPhone can not do several things the HD can do. Does that make sense?
I hope this view (not a review IMHO), helps some of you, and just like the chap in the other thread, please feel free to ask any specific questions about useabilty, although please don't ask me to run x test on y video, using xx program while standing in a bucket of water, as I probably can not be bothered
A couple of program I will miss if I sell the iPhone are TV Plus, a great APP which gives a 7 day EPG and more inportantly, links to Sky Plus (UK only) and lets you setup recordings.
I will also greatly miss Remote, an Apple APP which controls iTunes on my main desktop PC, although I should be getting up off my butt to change charge anyway.
So, who wants to buy an iPhone ;-)
Kev
So font size was your only problem with the Xperia? I'm trying to decide between the Xperia (had it for about 5 days now) and the HD.
BTW, my other phone is an iPhone 2G and I do like the screen.
Whoops, forgot that bit.
No, I got the X1 in the UK at Vodafone (if anyone is interested they are £500 are are not locked to Voda.....well, my one was not anyway)
The fonts were always gonna be too small for me, but I hated the keyboard, the keys barely protrude over the case, very little feedback.
But the killer and reason for return within a few hours for refund was a horribly wobbly screen, but I accept this could have been my one.
Also, given that you would have to use on screen keypad to dial people, it was too fiddly, too small. That 3" screen is very narrow you know.
Sorry.
Kev
I bet there's a program on WinMo that let's you control not only your iTunes but your whole PC. On my current 4 years old Nokia, there's System Freak, that lets you do that...
Thanks for that post KevWright.
Like VeloAudio, I'm deciding between the Touch HD and X1. I still have some niggling concerns about the Touch HD but I am assuming the X1 has the same 'problems' or 'complications' so am leaning towards the former.
Your post bolsters the case.
Great post!
Can you delve a little bit deeper into the screen responsiveness please? Just a few more sentences on how it compares to the iPhone's would be great.
Also, this is probably unbelievably subjective, but which phone do you find sexier? For instance, you are on the bus and you take out your iPhone and you take out your HD, which feels sexier?
Thanks.
kevwright said:
A couple of program I will miss if I sell the iPhone are TV Plus, a great APP which gives a 7 day EPG and more inportantly, links to Sky Plus (UK only) and lets you setup recordings.
So, who wants to buy an iPhone ;-)
Kev
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You might be interested in a SlingBox, which allows you to stream and your own Sat/IPTV etc. over the web to your laptop or your WM device. It comes with software to control the IR on your video sources. I stream Bluewin IPTV and Sky to the SlingMobile software on my Trinity and intend to do the same with the HD tomorrow when it arrives. I hope it runs on the HD. I will report back later on that.
Matterhorn said:
You might be interested in a SlingBox, which allows you to stream and your own Sat/IPTV etc. over the web to your laptop or your WM device. It comes with software to control the IR on your video sources. I stream Bluewin IPTV and Sky to the SlingMobile software on my Trinity and intend to do the same with the HD tomorrow when it arrives. I hope it runs on the HD. I will report back later on that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From what I've read elsewhere, the Touch HD doesn't have an IR port, so you won't be able to use the IR functionality of Slingbox unless you mean the "box" itself attached to a TV?
kevwright said:
Oh, that and TomTom 6 running in landscape on the trip to work
As for GPS lag, it is only about 10 miles to my workplace, but there is little or no lag present in TomTom 6.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What version did you install, and will it work in full WVGA or are their black bars on the screen?
Thanks in advance
nu_D said:
Great post!
Can you delve a little bit deeper into the screen responsiveness please? Just a few more sentences on how it compares to the iPhone's would be great.
Also, this is probably unbelievably subjective, but which phone do you find sexier? For instance, you are on the bus and you take out your iPhone and you take out your HD, which feels sexier?
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, it is hard to say that much more, I have them both here and am playing now. Not sure if you know the iPhone, but on 2.1 software (jailbroken), when you press the button for say SMS, there is about a 2 sec delay while it loads up, now on the HD, its about the same, but on the HD if you leave messaging running in the background (which I suspect you can do with these better memory equipped models?) it is instant, with the iPhone you always get the delay cos nothing (well except the music player) is allowed to stay in background.
OK, using book reading software, I would say they are almost equal.........maybe the iPhone is fractionally better, or it could be I am more used to it.
As to your second point, I can't help mate, for one, I only have a vague idea of what a "bus" is, and the day I find either the iPhone or the HD "sexy", that is the day I go back to my Nokia 6310 )
OK, I think they look so similar mate, there is nothing in it.
Kev
kevwright said:
But the killer and reason for return within a few hours for refund was a horribly wobbly screen, but I accept this could have been my one.
Kev
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you saying they are all wobbly or it is just yours. You going to replace it I guess?
luckyuser said:
What version did you install, and will it work in full WVGA or are their black bars on the screen?
Thanks in advance
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, I can not find a version number I am afraid.
It looks great in portrait, but bloody fantastic in widescreen, I have it on a manual rotate screen, and there are NO bars in any view.
Kev
exe said:
Are you saying they are all wobbly or it is just yours. You going to replace it I guess?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would have no idea beyond my one mate. It was that bad that I could never live with it.
I have replaced it....with the HD )
I will not be getting another X1, fonts were too small, and after this screen, there is no going back.
Kev
Matterhorn said:
You might be interested in a SlingBox, which allows you to stream and your own Sat/IPTV etc. over the web to your laptop or your WM device. It comes with software to control the IR on your video sources. I stream Bluewin IPTV and Sky to the SlingMobile software on my Trinity and intend to do the same with the HD tomorrow when it arrives. I hope it runs on the HD. I will report back later on that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, I do have Slingbox, and have even register Slingplayer, but I just have never had good perfomance on it to be honest. I am not realy fussed about watching TV on my HD, just this little app was great to tell my Sky box to record something, mainly cos it enabled you to do it even without turning the TV and Sky box on.
I am hoping there is something for WinMo
Kev
nokia e71 vs. htc touch diamond
hi kevwright,
after a bad experience with an htc diamond (very poor battery and many ROM updates), I've decided to go for nokia e71. Now I'm considering an htc touch hd, but I'm very curios about it's battery life. how the touch hd compare to the e71 in terms of battery life and general?
in call recording
Hi alll - I have posted a separate thread on this issue, but alas, I thought i would also ask it here from those that already have an HD.
in call recording feature - anyone tried it out? some are reporting that it doesn't work...even though HTC calls it out in their specs online.
can anyone kindly shed some real world experience w/this feature on teh HD?
Thanks in advance.
Someone tell this guy how paragraphs work...
Great post.. I allready bought Touch HD, and I have the same view as you!
Cheers!
Thanks for the insight, kev. Great post.
dragosel80 said:
hi kevwright,
after a bad experience with an htc diamond (very poor battery and many ROM updates), I've decided to go for nokia e71. Now I'm considering an htc touch hd, but I'm very curios about it's battery life. how the touch hd compare to the e71 in terms of battery life and general?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Battery life looks like it will be quite good, but not as good as an E71 (screen is tiny!).
Had it only a day really, so I will update this in a few days.
Kev
Related
hi everyone,
I'm a Die Hard fan of Blackstone/Touch HD , and im waiting for it for a long time !
but after reading about it, watching movies, following discussions, I feel its nothing but a HUGE and tempting display .
we're all WM users and we didnt experienced any large-display phones with such size, and thats why we're trying to believe this is BEST !
since theres no TV-OUT capability , hard one handed usage , no D-PAD ( C'mon , its not iphone that fingers could do anything with any pressure ) and weird camera lens box!
is it really we wanted or its just another "I WANT TO BELIEVE?"
I do see where you're coming from... To me, I'll be honest, it's the Diamond in a REALLY nice case. One that's familiar to a long-term Elf user. The touchy-feely case, no desire to use the D-Pad... But when all's said and done: It's a huge display and has a 5MP camera. It's the best ever HTC, but it will be easy to top...
Now I feel bad... Thanks...
Hi,
Interesting point of view. ... and I agree most of it.
To be honest, the only thing I am interested in Touch HD is the huge 3.8" screen.
I like browsing the internet using Opera Mini (and Opera 9 of course) and I have no problem with my current HTC Kaiser.
However, I always envy with phone that has big screen, 3.5" like my friend's iPhone.
So, thats my sole reason to think about buying Touch HD.
However, I am holding back because there are couple of things that I need to convince myself:
1. TouchFlo 3D cannot show multiple appointments/tasks in its today screen.
This is rubish, I cannot understand why HTC does not implement this like the old HTC Home. And I have not found better solution for this.
Of course I can turn off TF3D (can I?) and use HTC Home or SpB Mobile Shell.
But ................ why???
2. No DPAD, can I live with it? Probably ...
But I have a dream to have a GAME DEVICE and PDA all in one.
I cannot do that with HTC Kaiser because of the graphics driver and bad performance. Really, I hate it.
3.8" is very nice for a game device. However, without DPAD, the game will be limited.
If I look the current Touch HD design, a DPAD is still possible in the center of those 4 buttons!
I know, I can buy Nintendo DS or PSP, but hey! I dont like carrying a lot of devices
5 MP camera is nothing ... the quality is still doubtful.
No TV-OUT like Raphael? Grrr!!!
Well, this is my personal opinion.
I dont know, probably I will buy it anyway ... or wait until I can hold and see it in real live ... and judge if the 3.8" screen is enough to convince myself to buy.
upcomming phones have almost same display size ( like ASUS Galaxy 7 ) and solved problems ...
but i want it from HTC .
I think it's yet another half-a***d swipe at the iPhone, without any real thought put into it. WM fans want to believe this is "the one" that's going to give them everything they (perhaps secretly) really like about the iPhone, while still wearing the Windows Mobile badge. In reality, it's just another WM phone with a bigger screen, and actually a few disadvantages over some other models (like that lack of a D-pad). In spite of the screen I really doubt the multimedia will be as slick as the iPhone, and for gaming it's a dead duck - unlike the iPhone where the appstore is brimming full of immersive games built around the iPhone's acceleromotor and multi-touch screen, the Touch HD only has the WM back catalogue to choose from, 99% of which will be written to run on non-accelerometor equipped phones with D-pads.
Meanwhile, underneath the Touchflo you still have an interface designed for a stylus, however big the display.
gogol said:
....1. TouchFlo 3D cannot show multiple appointments/tasks in its today screen.....
This is rubish, I cannot understand why HTC does not implement this like the old HTC Home. And I have not found better solution for this.
Of course I can turn off TF3D (can I?) and use HTC Home or SpB Mobile Shell.
But ................ why???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
Get your act together HTC
I still cannot decide which model to choose - X1 or HD - and now I am thinking more and more of getting an X1. I simply understand that the only thing about HD that I am going to really love and cream-my-pants because of is the 3.8" screen.
I think that HD is a perfect device for non-WM-addicts, for people who will use just TF3D-interface and Opera at most, without installing any tweaks/programs/registry-hacks/emulators/debuggers/consoles/younameit. Cause when you want to install one of them, you're in trouble - no hardware keys, no D-pad... Achtung!
One more thing I thought about.. Every phone has a kind of a "secret combination of keys", e g "turn-on-the-phone-holding-two-buttons-pressed-and-enter-diagnostics-mode". I wonder if the sensor buttons would do that?
If I am going to express my opinion I will rather say I am going for the large screen size to be honest, Window mobile did not change since, its still WM 6.1 and not much difference on software, yes is the look of the phone that impress me and the size of the screen, because I personally enjoy watching movies on move.
How can HTC put such a cheap, crappy-looking clock onto such a "high-end" device?
The analogue clock from the TF2D (as per the Touch 3G) just looks so much better.
I also agree with the comments about the Appointments - this is a very important point for me, and if not easily resolvable will make me look eleswhere.
So do I remove the TF3D and use Spb instead? If I were to do that, would I then lose the scrollability of the unit - is the finger-scrolling part of TF3D or part of WM6.1?
From a non techie user point-of-view, the more I am finding out about this, the less excited I am about it. Having just read through the manual, I realise it doesn't do any more than any other WM 6.1 pda, except for the bigger screen. And even the quality of films on that seems to be in question!
Maybe I should stop reading sites such as this - lol.
Look we all love the design factor, large screen, hi res etc. That makes it the best win mo phone. Don't let these posts turn you off. You fell in love with the phone for a reason. As for the minor problems (2 appointments etc), well... where there's a will there's a way... xda-developers. Just give them time to work their magic.
Anyway there is always Second Today to see appointents http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=O2MYv5ooIp0
Nothing...........
I just Ordered mine from pdashop.nl 1 minute ago... And i don't need any negation right now. for 629 Euro. ....It better impress
Nothing is gonna take that joy from me..
You can fall in love with a phone for the wrong reasons! I really do think expectations are too high for this device, and people are right to question and rethink this now, before they've paid their money... IMO it's a flawed design, WinMo needs some kind of d-pad, it's not finger friendly enough even on this size screen to get by without it. If losing the hardware controls is a necessity of that larger screen, then they need to replace the UI completely, and use some other OS.
...
Are you guys serious?
Let's see the complaints that make this device "just another WM phone."
1. TV-OUT Capability
Why do I need this? WHEN will I need this? If I am at home, I will use my laptop to connect my HDTV via HDMI. Using a phone at home for it's TV-Out capability is well, useless. If you can afford this device, and are tech-savvy enough to know about it, then odds are you have an HDMI capable computer and TV.
The ONLY scenario where I could see this feature be useful is if I wanted to output video on a random TV, maybe at a bar:
"Hey bartender, hook up my HTC TOUCH HD to the TV please."
LOL
Come on!
2. Hard one handed usage? This coming from people who love QWERTY keyboards. I find this hilarious. What's so hard about it? Move your thumb around and you're good to go.
3. OMG! Weird camera lens box!! WTF is weird about it? Now, if you want to tell me no flash, alright I can agree with that. But to nag about the camera lens box? I think it looks good. I mean, I honestly don't care what it looks like as long as it's not pink with rainbows.
What are some other complaints?
No directional pad. Well, you have a 3.8in TOUCH screen and you want a d-pad? Is this a joke? If you want a d-pad, don't buy a TOUCH screen.
No games. Who plays games on their phone? Seriously. If you want to play games, go and buy a PSP or DS.
Home screen only shows a couple of appointments. This is a SLIGHT issue, but something tells me it will be fixed in no time by the heads roaming these forums.
-------------------------------------------------------
Now, let's compare these issues with the iPhone, since there were about 101 insinuations that we are desperate WM fan boys.
No TV-out:
iPhone doesn't have TV out either. OOOOOOOO.
Weird camera lens box:
iPhone has a useless 2megapixel camera without recording or focus features.
One handed usage:
Anyone notice that you have to slide SIDEWAYS just to unlock the iPhone? Explain to me how you are going to do that with ONE hand. At least HTC had the foresight to allow you to use the phone primarily with your thumb with up and down gestures.
The HTC Touch HD is NOT like any other WM phone or ANY phone for that matter. It's sensitivity is far superior, beautiful screen, FAST, and can do anything you can throw at it besides useless things such as outputting video at a bar.
Oh, and please don't get me started on the lack of iPhone features. How about the ability to CUT and PASTE? Want to talk to me about the iPhone marketplace? There are programmers all over the net with custom programs for WM that allows us to do basically ANYTHING, even emulate the iPhone.
Give me a break. This is a GREAT device and as far as I can tell, the only thing missing is flash.
And if you want to really be douche about it, most phones nowadays have a phone, video/music player, and a camera! So I guess we should all just get ourselves a Nokia 7610 and cluck.
So, could I use Second Today to run something like the Spb Today screen (because I am used to and love its flexible Appointments display), or am I mixing up technologies?
And just how safe /easy is it for a non-techie to install Second Today, and to change the button functions (and does this require a registry change, because now I'm starting to talk a new language?)
And, whilst I'm in a writing mood, the other issues raised were video playback quality, and suspected lag in GPS navigation.
Can anyone confirm the current situation with these. Is the playback quality acceptable without dropped frames, and has it been absolutely confirmed by a real test that there is no GPS lag?
Boinng said:
I think it's yet another half-a***d swipe at the iPhone, without any real thought put into it. WM fans want to believe this is "the one" that's going to give them everything they (perhaps secretly) really like about the iPhone, while still wearing the Windows Mobile badge. In reality, it's just another WM phone with a bigger screen, and actually a few disadvantages over some other models (like that lack of a D-pad). In spite of the screen I really doubt the multimedia will be as slick as the iPhone, and for gaming it's a dead duck - unlike the iPhone where the appstore is brimming full of immersive games built around the iPhone's acceleromotor and multi-touch screen, the Touch HD only has the WM back catalogue to choose from, 99% of which will be written to run on non-accelerometor equipped phones with D-pads.
Meanwhile, underneath the Touchflo you still have an interface designed for a stylus, however big the display.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
haha opinions from Apple Fan Boys dont count. All opinions on gaming (based on nothing), no dpad (which i love), Poor multimedia (not from the videos ive seen), App store stinks because hacked apps for iphone way better and FREE,
I owned an Iphone for a month and couldnt get rid of it fast enough because WM offers so much more functionality for business and "hackability"
dont get wrong ! iphone is NO WAY competitor, its just a fancy phone! not more not less !
im going to buy this beast, but i really want to know is this really a big deal ?
i dont think so !
but we all know the form factor and the screen size is undeniable ! thats why im going for HD .
nu_D said:
...
1. TV-OUT Capability
Why do I need this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you are on holiday? At the hotel, in a country where you dont understand local language ... you end up with CNN
So, TV-Out is nice to have! Hook it up to the hotel TV and play movie from your PDA.
Why some users complained about this TV-Out? Because the "previous" device has that, HTC Raphael. Why dont they include it in the next iteration?
Of course, probably there are some other reasons, like PRICE etc. But I see this TV-Out as a valid point.
nu_D said:
2. Hard one handed usage? This coming from people who love QWERTY keyboards. I find this hilarious. What's so hard about it? Move your thumb around and you're good to go.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not always like that. The OS (WinMo 6.1) is not specifically designed for touch screen only.
People like me, prefer to use DPAD to move around the UI, much faster, efficient and less-thumb-hurt
You may disagree, but thats you!
nu_D said:
No games. Who plays games on their phone? Seriously. If you want to play games, go and buy a PSP or DS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Woohoo ... Gaming is also part of the mobile world.
If you dont play game in your PDA, then (again) it's your choice.
You should not dictate that, because the mobile gaming market is THERE.
nu_D said:
Want to talk to me about the iPhone marketplace? There are programmers all over the net with custom programs for WM that allows us to do basically ANYTHING, even emulate the iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Righty ... Please dont compare iPhone apps with WinMo apps
nu_D said:
Give me a break. This is a GREAT device and as far as I can tell, the only thing missing is flash.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, it is a great device. But how great is this? Depends ...
manuelcalavera said:
dont get wrong ! iphone is NO WAY competitor, its just a fancy phone! not more not less !
im going to buy this beast, but i really want to know is this really a big deal ?
i dont think so !
but we all know the form factor and the screen size is undeniable ! thats why im going for HD .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and my apologies for not answer the question lol. Is it a big deal, nah, not when you look at all the other technology worldwide as a whole. Its nice but there is really no "phone" that is a big deal in my humble opinion.
nu_D said:
...
Now, let's compare these issues with the iPhone, since there were about 101 insinuations that we are desperate WM fan boys.
No TV-out:
iPhone doesn't have TV out either. OOOOOOOO.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually yes, it does. Bad start.
Weird camera lens box:
iPhone has a useless 2megapixel camera without recording or focus features.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Absolutely. For the record, I have no idea why anyone's complaining about the "weird camera lens box" on the HD. It's just a lens.
The iPhone's camera is just a camera, and makes no pretence to be anything more - if you want a better camera, buy one (or a different phone).
One handed usage:
Anyone notice that you have to slide SIDEWAYS just to unlock the iPhone? Explain to me how you are going to do that with ONE hand.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Easily and quickly about a million times a day. Seriously, you're just demonstrating you've never been near one, and are desperately trying to think up things which might be wrong with it, on the strength of a few screenshots you've seen. The "slide to unlock/answer" is an excellent feature that's completely natural to use one handed - it works so well that even HTC have tried to imitate it with a similar "slide to answer" feature on the, ahem, Touch HD.
At least HTC had the foresight to allow you to use the phone primarily with your thumb with up and down gestures.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You mean TouchFlo scrolling? The first feature that HTC copied from the iPhone, last year? Ah yes, such foresight!
The HTC Touch HD is NOT like any other WM phone or ANY phone for that matter. It's sensitivity is far superior, beautiful screen, FAST, and can do anything you can throw at it besides useless things such as outputting video at a bar.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wake up and smell yesterday's coffee. It's like like every other WM phone, runs the same software as every other WM phone, it even has the same processor and internal spec as most other current WM phones. The screen is new, as is the inconvenient lack of d-pad - everything else is the same old same old.
Oh, and please don't get me started on the lack of iPhone features. How about the ability to CUT and PASTE?
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Oh, yeah, it doesn't do that. You knew about that? I thought it was a secret?
Want to talk to me about the iPhone marketplace?
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Not really, but I'll tell about the Appstore - bloody brilliant. Thousands of quality apps, many of them free, all the paid ones generally much, much cheaper than their WinMo equivalents, and all there to be browsed and downloaded right on the device, updates alerted and downloaded in the same way.. yep, it's a fantastic system. Is that what you wanted to know?
There are programmers all over the net with custom programs for WM that allows us to do basically ANYTHING, even emulate the iPhone.
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Now why would you want to emulate a rubbish old iPhone?
For the record, I used a Tytn II for the past year, I've never owned a Mac, and I've never been a "fanboy" of any damn thing, but if you think the iPhone's a soft target for a bit of WinMo frustration, you're mistaken.
OK at the risk of starting a flame war I want to ask for some objective feedback on the HD. I tried the HD in a shop today for about 20 minutes and I was quite disappointed. (I have a HTC tytn so I used my experience over the last 18 months with that as a reference.). My brief conclusions
(a) The screen is big with a lot of detail as everyone says but its not as bright as the iPhone, G1 or blackberry Storm. Also the blacks are a bit murky so the constrast is not as good as the iPhone, G1 or the Storm.
(b) The interface felt very "laggy" with lots of freezing. (I've subsequently found a thread here on XDA-Developers where there are many compaints of freezes for several seconds - the unit I tried in the shop belonged to the Sales guy and had been up and running in less than 1 day with nothing extra installed on it - I ended up showing the sales guy how to do some things ! ) Certainly TF3D was no way as "slick" as the iPhone or the G1. When trying to browse the web the HD I perfered the G1 when if on the HD I could see more !
(c) One of my requirements is basic operations should be possible with one hand. The lack of hardware buttons and a D-pad / trackball or scroller seems to make that difficult? For example, it was difficult to take a decent close up picture of someone as you have to press the screen which moves the HD and so causes a loss of focus. On the third attempt I gave up trying to take a decent picture.
(d) For such a big screen TF3D makes inefficient use of the screen. I was particularly disappointed with the music player. I got the impression that rather than focus on functionality HTC really wanted to make things look good.
Overall I was dissappointed. I really want to get rid of my Wm5 based Tytn but it looks like I might have to look at something else
Please convince me otherwise !
Can those of you who've had real experience (I.e. for than a couple of days - where you are in the honeymoon period) provide some feedback on the HD?
not going to convince you to change. i suggest you stick with the Tytn and you'll save yourself a lot of second guessing and heart ache. based on a-d above, the HD is not for you.
I played with the iPhone for 20 minutes and hated it... But when I tried the HD for about 20 minutes I loved it.
What the hek every now and then someone comes and start his own comparison of HD to Iphone!!!!
IPHONE for many of us is Cr***ap ...
You have already started the thread by painting such as prefect picture of iPhone. If your requirements are better met by that, just go get yourself an iPhone. Everyone person's requirements are different. For me, iPhone does not meet my need and HD does. If you want to know why, go to this thread and read every post there by myself.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=443900
No point in flaming him (I have an Hermes as well and have a lot of questions about HD vs Touch Pro for instance)
It is really interesting to read people's opinion, may it be positive or negative to help many potential users chose with all cards in hand
Stick with your TyTn .... and wait for the next year 2009 devices.
For sure HD broughr fresh blood to the WinMo device, but thats not enough.
I am pretty sure, 2009 will be very interesting for mobile device (WinMo 6.5, Tegra?)
I have N95 for 15 Months and i thought i would never change phone again till iPhone 3G came out so i decided to upgrade.
At the same time my brother just bought Touch Diamond and I have to admit that I really hate the Diamond since the first few mins of playing with it. Laggy.. Sloppy.. Jerky.. Slowly.. Whatever u called it, Diamond has it all.
But now my brother decide to get a Touch HD, hoping that it will lift up our feeling some way some how, and he is right.
He got a phone last week and i have to say.. "It is in a different league with the iPhone"
Now i have to order another one for myself. Hope it will arrive soon ^^
Sorry but you are not right
By the way - the iPhone is indeed better because of the better OS
But also the HF Screen has not such a good contrast and has moires from different view angles ...
when you work for some days with the HD the iPhone screen shows pixels.
The HD screnn with th perfect resolution is much smoother
The HTC Touchflow SW is after a long time on devices quite fast ans very good ( not as good as iPhone OS ) - the only lag is that many functions are missing and HTC does not offer updates regularly to older devices.
annoying & ridiculous...
sorry ... BUT it really IS annoying to read so many threads where people are just complaining that the HD 'doesnt meet this and that and...' - whats the use in it ?! Everyone needs different things in a device, you wouldn't want my kind of shoes or trousers or car or whatever!!
So I don't give a s*** what anybody else has to say about the HD - I tested it for MYSELF, I found it to be excellent for me, I bought it two weeks ago, I do lots of flatrate-HSDPA'ing, business use 12 hours/day, permanent exchange sncy'ing, blablabla...my HD truely rocks. Simply said: theres nothing *I* miss - if you do, buy something you like.
First of all. Thanks for the feedback so far. I'm sorry that some of you seem to be overly defensive. What I am trying to get to the bottom of is that my short experience of the HD is at odds with the many many reviews of the HD on the web.
There are endless comparsions with the iPhone but I don't recall any mentioning the screen being not as bright or that the HD has a very "laggy" interface. The point is that the reviews hold up the iphone as the benchmark and generally give the impression that the HD is close in terms of touch sensitivity and better in terms of screen. I was therefore surprised when i got my hands on a unit to not get that impression in those areas. I am aware of the fact that the Iphone can't multi-task, has no FM radio, has locked down applications, video recording problems, poor support for MS office attachments etc etc. So I'm not that interested in it - its too restricted for me!
So what I'm trying to understand is why my, albeit, short experience is different.
So the questions remains guys.
Can you load a theme or change a setting to change the way the screen looks ?
(EagleSteve - I'm just reading that 49 page thread you refered to and I note the äuthor of the thread states - "I think Touchflo is just too "black" for me, not sure if it will run with a brighter skin or not, but I like the way PocketPlus makes a device look, much brighter" - So that suggests a possible fix to my concern of the screen being not as bright as I expected)
Is the lack of hardware buttons actually a problem or does the large touch screen make it a non issue in practice?
Do you have laggy behaviour ? Is there some App or setting which everyone loads to get rid of the "laggy" behaviour? For the me the real show-stopper is probably the laggy behaviour - I need to know how much of a problem it is in practice.
Thanks for the feedback
I don't know... my unit isn't laggy at all, tflo is flying, the only issue I have is about video playback. But this is going to be solved with the next CorePlayer release, I hope.
owen.cullum said:
[...]
Do you have laggy behaviour ? Is there some App or setting which everyone loads to get rid of the "laggy" behaviour? For the me the real show-stopper is probably the laggy behaviour - I need to know how much of a problem it is in practice.
Thanks for the feedback
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The laggy behaviour obviously depends on what ROM you have.
I for myself do not experience lags on my device.
EDIT: As for the themes. Giznetic has already made some. Check out this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=451731
I dont get it.
Is the lack of hardware buttons actually a problem or does the large touch screen make it a non issue in practice?
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U seems to like the iPhone so much but y u worry about this issue? It seems like u trying to point out that Touch HD lack of D-Pad and button so its useless.
What about iPhone? 1 lonely button is that enuff for u?
sigh..
Hi Owen,
Well I'm not a HD user, I actually have a raphael. but my experience with this device was similar to yours when I first got it. In my experience my device was very laggy to start with. I ended up downloading a ROM and the speed is beautiful, I'm sure the HD will have the same and when this device is around as long as the raphael you will have some amazing ROMs if you already don't. Although it does frustrate me that our performance issues have to be solve by personal developers (who by the way do a marvellous job). So if you are happy flashing a ROM you will certainly get to a point you are happy with in regards to performance. it may however take you some time to do so
In regards to the button aspect, which was going to be my primary focus, the raphael has a few more buttons and a scroll wheel device. Having the extra buttons is frustrating, I have only had minimal (if any) use for them and only feel like they take up room on the device. If you are happy to not have a keyboard I wouldn't be too concerned on the lack of buttons.
Cheers
TT
kids phone
there is nothing called iphone sorry buy its the kids phone, who said better os? if so why great apple went for exchnage ???gps but no application wow, 3g but u cant create 2 way video call so there is no compaison if u want to make u kids happy go for kids phone
owen.cullum said:
Please convince me otherwise !
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No thanks
I bought the HD because I was sure it was the right device to answer my needs. One month after I'm still convinced it was a good choice.
But I'm even more convinced that there's just no interest in trying to convince other users that my phone is the one they need.
A consequence is the following: I'm not interested in being convinced that the HD was not good enough for me
The Touch HD has a very bright screen. Did you alter the settings, to turn off automatic backlight?
I don't find my HD laggy at all especially with the tweak that optimises the cache. Even out of the box I didn't find the HD laggy. Afterall it's only a phone and not your desktop PC...
Screen looks nice enough in my opinion. I can't convince you that it isn't over rated as after having one for a few weeks I feel it is nothing special.
For the people that say there is no point complaining, this is true if you don't own one I suppose. Although if a person did buy one because of the hype and it doesn't live up to it then I think they have every right to say why they feel they don't like it. I spent 500 quid on mine and I should be able to criticise things about it I don't like at that point.
If a person is happy with his device that's great but others that don't share that feeling are entitled to their views too.
Like I said, each has his own need and preference, so I can only summarise for you who iphone is not worthy of comparison to hd from my viewpoint only.
1. I like the hd screen and not iphone screen: because HD screen has the right level of sensitivity and supports stylus. Stylus is a critical requirements not only it is more user friendly to me, but also because it supports hand writing. Screen brightness of HD is completely adequate under bright sunlight.
2. I need availability of tomtom or similar software. Iphone does not have an acceptable navigation software.
3 I need desktop class word, spreadsheet, and presentation editing software, which iphone doesn't have.
4.I need better software keyboard than that iphone offer and winmo platform offers that.
5.I cannot live with iphone's battery design because I'd been stuck without battery. I do not want the bulk of a mobile charger.
6. the breath and depth of software in iphone is still not there yet.
7. I prefer HD's bigger screen.
8. I like having more buttons in HD rather than just one in iphone.
9. I like being able to customise. You don't like black? No problem. Use something like spb mobile shell, or change the skin and background of tf3d.
10.I like to have lots of choices when come to firmware or ROM. You don't have that with iphone. The ability to improve is very limited.
11.I like FM radio, I like cut and paste, I like all the little things which HD can do and iphone can't.
I like the build quality of iphone. I like it's browser. I like it's smoothness in displaying web pages more than Opera mobile. I like its multimedia capability.
I almost got an iphone.
For me, iphone is a very sexy women, and the temptation to marry her is great. But if I want someone who can manage the household, bring up the kids well, wise with finance, and kind to people, HD is the plain Jane whom can deliver.
I'm currently the owner of a launch day Touch Diamond - which cost me about £465 back in June from Devicewire.
Prior to that, I had a 16gb iPhone - which I really liked, but missed the features of a regular phone like picture messaging etc.
I'm running one of Dutty's last ROMS on the Diamond, it works perfectly and does pretty much everything I want. The only downer for me is the size of the screen. I go on 3 or 4 holidays abroad a year and the iPhone was ideal for filling with videos and watching them on the plane. I'm just back from my New Year break and borrowed a friends iPod Touch to use rather than watching videos on my Diamond for the bigger screen.
I have the HTC 1340mah battery in too which makes the battery a good bit better than the stock one, but its still needs a charge most nights. I also have the HTC charging cradle...
Has anyone here upgraded from a Diamond to a Touch HD? How do you find it in comparison? Bearing in mind I've spent about £500 on this phone, cradle and extended battery - is it worth paying another £550 for the Touch HD? Obviously I can eBay my Diamond and maybe get a few quid for it - but with heaps of them on just now they're not going for that much!
yes
I had the touch pro for three weeks and hated using it. Ive had the Touch HD for four weeks now and love it. the Touch Pro was just painfull entering text or surfing.
I switched from Diamond to HD about 6 weeks ago and I don´t regret it. I still have the Diamond but never use it (I like to have a spare phone..just in case). The HD runs slick right out of the box, I don´t think I´ll flash it anytime soon. The screen is just awesome, not only because it´s big but it´s also more responsible. And you have quite a bunch of MB´s more free RAM + a Micro SD card which is included in the box. I´ll say go for it
I also had a Touch Pro and now much happier with the HD.
The HD is really great !! The Touch Pro was good but I found I did not need the keyboard so often and it was a heavy price, sic, to pay for it. The screen quality on the Touch Pro is very good but it's small compared to the HD.
The HD fits very well to my ideal device - very thin but large. The Touch Pro was too fat and had a too small display.
I upgraded to a Diamond but sent it back cos I wasnt getting on with it. Upgraded to a HD but yet to receive it.
Seriously considering just selling it on ebay and cash in. Upgrading from a nokia n95 which is all I need.
Do you think if i didnt get on with the diamond id struggle with the hd?
Hamudi2000 said:
I switched from Diamond to HD about 6 weeks ago and I don´t regret it. I still have the Diamond but never use it (I like to have a spare phone..just in case). The HD runs slick right out of the box, I don´t think I´ll flash it anytime soon. The screen is just awesome, not only because it´s big but it´s also more responsible. And you have quite a bunch of MB´s more free RAM + a Micro SD card which is included in the box. I´ll say go for it
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Same situation and opinion
i havnt had a diamond , but i did use my ipod touch a lot for movies and music so the main reason for me to upgrade from my n95 was to have an all in 1 device .
I play my movies using core player which i find very good (no jerkiness during playback etc)
And playing music is also fine , so while id say if i was just going to use it as a phone id have stuck with my n95 but if your going to use it for multi media id say Go for it
Recently there were a few threads that covered this topic a lot. Browse through the past 3 or 4 pages.
g4orce99 said:
I upgraded to a Diamond but sent it back cos I wasnt getting on with it. Upgraded to a HD but yet to receive it.
Seriously considering just selling it on ebay and cash in. Upgrading from a nokia n95 which is all I need.
Do you think if i didnt get on with the diamond id struggle with the hd?
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Hard to say mate since we are not aware of what you where struggling it functionality wise... all I can tell you is that ive had a few windows mobile devices and always liked them due to suiting my lifestyle just fine...the hd is by far the one is use even more of its achievable function on such as web (most pages can be fully viewd without side scrolling and still looking pretty much as seen on your desktop and pages are readable without zooming in) and general digging into the menus without the need of the stylus!! but windows mobile is like marmite...you either love it or hate it
agent003 said:
windows mobile is like marmite...you either love it or hate it
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That should be a tagline here, it's the perfect answer!
I also traded in my 16GB iphone for a first release diamond which was great at first but had me craving the speed and the screen of the apple product despite it's limitations.
Moving up to the HD was, for me, the perfect blend of the two. With a few tweaks i have considerably better speed than the Diamond and a bigger better screen than the iphone.
iphone movie playback and touch is still better but being able to copy text from websites and send in an email via exchange to work colleagues when researching stuff is invaluable.
the camera indoors and at night is a pile of poop tho
my diamond sits in a drawer, the HD does everything better and faster.. what DPad?!? Don't even miss it
2unique said:
the camera indoors and at night is a pile of poop tho
my diamond sits in a drawer, the HD does everything better and faster.. what DPad?!? Don't even miss it
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I bet the camera is still better than the iPhone's measly 2mp camera in the dark though.
To be honest the only time I ever use the D-pad on my Diamond is to zoom in / out on links that are too small to hit with my fingers!
How do you mean the movie playback isn't as good on the HD as the iPhone?
Another good reason for changing it to save carrying a stupid USB headphone adapter about with me!
I've been watching a couple of Dimonds on eBay - and I can probably get about £200 for it - plus another few £'s for my dock and extended battery.
I was hoping that some people would tell me not to bother changing as they were very similar - but it seems everyone prefers the Touch HD! Looks like my wallet is going to take another battering!!! I think play.com seems to be the cheapest at £500 inc delivery?
I might have a look in my Orange store today and see what they can give me on a contract - as I currently have no ties.
Thanks for all the input though...
p3eps said:
How do you mean the movie playback isn't as good on the HD as the iPhone?
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allow me to retract that as of today http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=467112
ask in the diamond forum, might get a few reasons to save your money !!
Heck yea its worth it I am with sprint....about to cancel to jump ship to T-mobile. I had the TOUCH, DIAMOND, and TOUCH PRO. None of them compare to the Blackstone. The vogue was ok, which i kept as my back-up phone. The diamond, I hated the bottom buttons, kept freezing up and not responding. The TOUCH PRO let me down because i thought i could convince myself that the whole "Slide out keyboad" was ok for me, but after a week, i realized I was a touch screen person. So now when i cancel my sprint plan in a day or two, i will be selling the TOUCH PRO, and Vogue. Trust me, the HD is worth it
agent003 said:
Hard to say mate since we are not aware of what you where struggling it functionality wise... all I can tell you is that ive had a few windows mobile devices and always liked them due to suiting my lifestyle just fine...the hd is by far the one is use even more of its achievable function on such as web (most pages can be fully viewd without side scrolling and still looking pretty much as seen on your desktop and pages are readable without zooming in) and general digging into the menus without the need of the stylus!! but windows mobile is like marmite...you either love it or hate it
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Good post!
It's coming at some stage on Monday but as i said i'm questioning even opening the seal as I could sell it on ebay as a sealed box and make a few quid on it.
The way I look at mobiles I always ask myself could i answer a call or send a brief text message while im driving? like I can with my Nokia N95. (Not that i use my phone when driving but to me thats classed as "easy usage".
With the Diamond I found that calls were being answered in my pocket which was pissed me off something cronic. I found the touch screen un-responsive and after I installed tomtom it slowed the whole phone down and made touch flo very blocky and slow.
That was pretty much it and I wasnt 100% that I could live with these problems for 18 months so took advantage of the 7 day return policy.
Can anyone name another phone that has:
-The same size screen as the HD
-An accelerometer
-7.2 mbit HSDPA
-GPS
-Front facing camera for videophone
-Video recording capabilities
-Expandable ram to 64gb
-5+ megapixel camera
-Hotswap SD cards
-User removeable battery
Afaik there is no other phone with this functionality.
gold333 said:
Can anyone name another phone that has:
-The same size screen as the HD
-An accelerometer
-7.2 mbit HSDPA
-GPS
-Front facing camera for videophone
-Video recording capabilities
-Expandable ram to 64gb
-5+ megapixel camera
-Hotswap SD cards
-User removeable battery
Afaik there is no other phone with this functionality.
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Yes stats are great. But as much as i hate saying it the iphone has something unrelated to stats. It has the (make up some word) WOOOOOWZER factor to it. The touch screen is the best, the web browsing is the best so i keep hearing & (nothing todo with the phone) it has REAL unlimited internet. Swings and Roundabouts my friend.
+ ive gotta be honest Id rather use a 2mp cam with a flash than a 5 without. I goto a lot of parties!
g4orce99 said:
Yes stats are great. But as much as i hate saying it the iphone has something unrelated to stats. It has the (make up some word) WOOOOOWZER factor to it. The touch screen is the best, the web browsing is the best so i keep hearing & (nothing todo with the phone) it has REAL unlimited internet. Swings and Roundabouts my friend.
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I got unlimited internet for less on my HD, cause I don't pay apple tax. I pay 24 euro a month(18 months) which includes 200 min calling and unlimited internet access, Iphone starts at 35 euro a month(24 months) here and only 150 min. No matter how I look at it, iphone was a bummed deal(especially not able to do whatever you want unless you jailbreak).
edit:
PS. Iphone doesn't have flash either last time I checked. But I do have to say I was thoroughly not amused by the 3 seconds autofocus/shutter time on the HD. Other than that I love my HD more than any phone I owned previously.
I currently have a touch HD/Blackstone and I love it to bits, but the prospect of having a capacitive multitouch screen and much faster responses when navigating round the phone/opening/running apps etc is starting to tempt me very strongly to the HD2/Leo.
Have any of you Leo owners upgraded from the Blackstone? If so, please can you let me know your thoughts on whether it was a good move, what the pros & cons are etc, and whether the new phone really is super fast and slick like the reviews I've read say it is.
If I get one I'd probably want to be running SPB shell on it, which from looking through here I assume it works, but will most apps for the blackstone also work on the Leo?
I know there's no stylus with the Leo for instance, but for fiddly stuff does the screen accept the use of a fingernail for 'precision' (ish!) stuff like checkboxes & small menus, or does it have to be skin contact or a real capacitive stylus etc?
Regardless of whether you upgraded from a Blackstone, are you very pleased with the way the phone works in terms of performance and 'slickness'?
Last questions are - what's the video performance like on the Leo, ie does it have all the problems the HD has in terms of poor out of the box performance with video playback?
And is the bluetooth stuff still hardcoded for the HTC music player (like the blackstone), or would I be able to properly use my sony bluetooth headset to control the likes of coreplayer?
Sorry for all the questions - I really want to upgrade to the Leo, but it will cost me a lot and I don't want to make a mistake.
Many thanks for any useful replies!
Jim
After having the Touch HD for 2 month I really loved it. Everything was running as I wanted it to be ... But then HTC announced the HD2 and I decided to switch to it after watching lots of videos in youtube an other sites. I would do it again ...
I don't have any problems using the OS without a stylus. In fact I wasn't using the stylus or my fingernails on my Touch HD either. I only needed to adapt to the higher screen responsiveness, but that was it.
HD2 pros compared to the Touch HD:
+ MUCH higher build quality. The Touch HD always felt somehow cheap, except it actually wasn't ...
+ Everything is just faster. I wasn't too thrilled with TouchFLO 3D on the Touch HD, as it slowed down the device too much. No problems on the HD2, although the new version of TouchFLO 3D (Sense ...) grew in so many aspects and is now pretty well integrated into the OS.
+ The bigger screen. Didn't thing its a big deal, but the screen-difference between the two devices is astonishing. Its much more fun to use multimediacontent on the HD2.
+ Pinch to Zoom.
I had a HD for nearly a year now and loved it - yes, TF3D ran slowly but it also was more "form than function" and I stopped using it in favour of simple SPB Diary with multiple tabs.
Now having a HD2 for over a month I do love the high speed and slick operation and I even stick with TF3D (or HTC Sense, whatever it's called).
But, there are apps from HD that don't run well on the screen as they expect the precision of a stylus. One example is SPB Finance that I used to record all my expenditures on an almost daily business. This just does not work with a big fat finger !
But, but others work great - CoPilot works really nicely. I tried Route66 on the HD2 as this was a fully legal working purchase on the HD but on the new HD2 it's not good. Nice surprise is the new CoPilot works really well and super fast. Even indoors near a window I can get enough satellites for a 3D fix and moving next to the window gets 7 or 8 sats. HD never achieved that.
My build quality on the HD was fine. On the HD2 you get a real solid feel from the metal battery cover where you naturally hold the device.
HD2 is super quick but the capacitive screen is a weakness. However, this is because most applications have not yet caught up. Many exist that are great with fingers like Resco explorer but others expect a stylus and are hard to use.
As a year long HD user I doubt very much that I won't move back after having got the HD2. My old HD is sitting in a box and I have not been tempted to get it out !
Thanks for the replies guys - I like what I hear!
I think the only thing that might delay me upgrading to an HD2 is the difference in value between selling HD and buying HD2 but we'll see....
Can you clarify a couple of things I'm still not sure about though?
Dave - you said you can't use certain apps from the HD because of the capacitive screen as you don't have a stylus with it (and can't use a normal one I believe), but is it possible to use these apps with a finger nail if you really need to?
I know it might be awkward or not very practical, but I want to know whether it's actually possible at all, ie if the screen will physically work like that, or if it's literally impossible to do?
Secondly (don't get me wrong here) whilst I don't want an iphone, is the responsiveness of the HD2 screen the same kind of thing? Local shops here don't have one I can try so I have to go by what others tell me, and I'd like it to work as smooth as the iphone screen, ie no actual pressure etc.
I know it's capacitive so it should be like that but I don't know if there are differences aside from that to how the screen responds. Hope that makes sense!
Last question - I believe the screen is glass on it? Is it toughened in any way? Presume the fact that it's glass will mean that it's much harder to scratch than the HD screen and also means a clearer, brighter display by not having a resistive layer?
Thanks for the replies - I appreciate the info!
I'll try again but I don't think finger nails work ...
I upgraded from the Blackstone and for me, it was definitely worth it.
First thing you notice is the amazing speed if the device. I just saw that I had TomTom (among a couple of other programs) running in the background for several days and I didn't even notice it.
The HD2 is really insanely fast. I sometimes take my old Blackstone in order to try new WM builds, but its slowness makes me sick after some minutes of using it.
Next big thing, for me, is the camera. The light sensitivity has been greatly improved and the flash works stunningly good for an LED flash.
It takes really great pictures for a smartphone, much much better than the HD, finally I have a phone that lets me capture the important moments
(btw. the 'red tint bug' is present but not noticeable on most pictures)
Third thing is the screen. It''s capacitive, that means you can NOT use your fingernail, and no stylus. But I really like the sensitivity, it's much more comfortable to use. And it feels a lot better, it's not the 'cheap' feel of the resistive panel's plastic layers anymore.
And this brings me to the fourth and last point: Build quality. I've never ever seen such a high build quality and high quality materials on a phone. It looks and feels just amazing, even the iPhone feels like a cheap toy in comparison.
Video playback is of course a lot better and it plays high quality video without stuttering.
Well actualy you can use stylus without problems, you just have to buy a special one (whitch buy the way also works on the iPhone)
http://cgi.ebay.com/2x-DAGi-Stylus-...wItemQQptZPDA_Accessories?hash=item414b467e4a
Like they other says there are applications who can be a bit of a hassel with using with the finger...
But I suspect you would love it... I could newer go back to my HD after being used to the buitiful racer the HD2 is, and i absolutely love the screen to.
Hi,
I've spent 1 week with the HD2 after a year on the HD. Mobile Shell 3.5 on both.
The main difference is speed. HD2 is soooo much faster. Didn't notice the HD was particularly slow whilst I was using it, but going back to it now is PAINFUL.
I struggled a bit initially with the capacitive screen, found it a bit hit and miss. In particular I found the HTC keyboard a nightmare, way too sensitive. Installing the .cab that decreases screen sensitivity has improved things greatly, and installing Spb Keyboard has also helped. It's improving with practice, there are still times when I do something and it doesn't register, but overall I'm starting to like it. There's a definite knack to it: much lighter touch, smoother motions. So there's a learning curve here + a need to tweak. And I'm sure the experience will continue to improve as third party software is adapted for it.
Mobile Shell has a few minor compatability issues but nothing to worry about (screen brightness control doesn't work, voicemail indicator widget doesn't work, a few other minor things). Spb are generally good at updating for significant new hardware releases, same thing happened with the HD when it was first released and they fixed everything quickly. I tried the Sense interface for a day or two to see if I could get used to it, it IS very pretty. But went back to Mobile Shell, I find it much more functional.
The HD2 build quality is excellent vs good for HD. And the additional screen size is a significant plus too. I was initially worried it would be a step too far in terms of the overall size of the device, but no. As soon as I laid eyes on the actual device + picked it up I knew it wouldn't be a problem.
Browsing in Opera is fantastic. Fast and the big screen helps. Still not comparable to a desktop browsing experience but very usable and way better than the HD due to the speed.
Overall it's a big step forward from the HD and highly recommended. Like I said, I find going back to the HD to dig out a few files I need to be surprisingly painful...
Cret said:
Secondly (don't get me wrong here) whilst I don't want an iphone, is the responsiveness of the HD2 screen the same kind of thing? Local shops here don't have one I can try so I have to go by what others tell me, and I'd like it to work as smooth as the iphone screen, ie no actual pressure etc.
I know it's capacitive so it should be like that but I don't know if there are differences aside from that to how the screen responds. Hope that makes sense!
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Click to collapse
I tested the HD2 besides both, an 3G and 3GS, and really couldn't find any real difference in the screens responsiveness. You don't have to do any pressure on the HD2's screen ... I have to say, that I had a problem with the high sensitivity at first, but when playing around with an Nokia N900 last week, I noticed how fast I adapted to the capacitive screen of the HD2. The N900's screen was a pain in the ass (although its actually quite good for a resistive screen), because slight fingerswipes and tips didn't to anything ...
When browsing the forums you will notice, that most ppl here have/had a problem with the keyboard of the HD2. Besides the bugreporting here (I don't have any of these problems), I imagine that most of the problems with the keyboard just come from the unfamiliar sensitivity. By lifting the fingers a little higher when typing, I managed to type pretty accurate.
I don't have a Touch HD to compare side by side, but had the possibility to compare the HD2 to an iPhone 3G ... the 3G was very slow compared to the HD2 ... So wouldn't really go back to a last-gen phone ...
Had a Touch HD for a year until i bought my HD2 last month.
I Had Dutty's Leo rom running since he started releasing those, so I felt completely at home with my HD2 when i had it in my hand. (For those not knowing : Leo rom for Touch HD is just that. Winmo 6.5 running HTC Sense, just like the HD2)
A few things felt wonderfully different tho :
Screen is beautifull. The glas type used is almost impossible to scratch. I have my phone in my pocket unprotected. Even accedently slipped my keys in with it a few times. Not a mark on it! What is this screen made of ? Diamond ??
Speed. Wow! This phone is fast. I ran the weather demo simultaniously, side by side with the Touch HD. And the difference makes the Touch HD look like a joke. (it's not, but compared, its sloooow)
Pinch zoom. OMG now i know why Iphone has been the king of mobile browsing. HAS been! HD2 is now the new king! Opera + capacitive screen with multi touch AND a 1 ghz processor ? It is a match made in heaven. Mobile browsing is EASY and fun now. Thank god i have an internet sub on my simcard...
Camera. Remember how a big hazzel it was to take a pic with Touch HD ? I mean, the moment is GONE, before the camera is ready to take the picture!
With HD2 and a shortcut on the Sense start screen , it takes around 1 second(!!) from press on camera icon till your ready to take the picture!. The flash LED (Which can blind a man btw) makes it possible to shoot in the dark, FINALLY!
Well those things was EXACTLY why I upgraded, and I have not been dissapointed.
Some had a huge problem with the sensitive screen. Not me, I adapted quickly, and the keyboard I was used to from leo rom on the Touch HD, so i guess it's a matter of taste, or fat fingers .
Also
There are a LOT of the tweaks and programs for Dutty's leo rom that works great with the HD2, like BG4all etc.
rd2000 said:
The flash LED (Which can blind a man btw)
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Click to collapse
yep, fortgot to mention the LEDs. I love them. Not to take pictures, but for everydays things. Really missed a LED on the Touch HD.
I got my HD2 a week ago, and I'm loving it, other than the rather short battery life (may be a temporary issue, some people do not have this issue).
It's definitely faster than the HD. Going through the Windows folder in File Explorer takes 2 seconds, rather than 6-8 seconds on the HD. Going through tabs in TouchFlo 3D (Sense) is fast, and tab contents are displayed lightning fast.
TomTom works great on the HD2, haven't tried CoPilot because they do not have maps that I could purchase for my region yet (which is funny, since I can download the map while trialling the software). TomTom is rather smooth on the HD2, the position cursor does not jerk forward when moving. With valid QuickGPS data, getting a GPS fix is faster than on the HD.
The speaker is a little worse than the HD in my opinion, although it's somewhat louder than the HD.
Moving from Resistive (HD) to the Capacitive screen in the HD2 may take some time to get used to it. Drawing/scribbling notes can be hard, so is selecting the directory/folder you want to go to in File Explorer. Maybe it's me, I have large fingers.
Reception compared to the HD, Nokia N82, N95 8GB.
The 3G network I'm on is rather bad in my room.
Nokia N82 and N95 8GB - 4 of 7 bars (estimated equivalent on the HD2 would be 3 of 4 bars)
HTC Touch HD - 1 of 4 bars
HTC Touch HD2 - 3 of 4 bars, sometimes full signal.
The signal bars on the HD2 tend to fluctuate at times, while holding the phone in landscape mode and browsing the internet, the signal may drop to no bars, disconnect from the network, then come back on with 1 or 2 bars.
Camera is great. Autofocus seems to be 'continuous', focusing when the camera is moved or after a few seconds. Shutter lag is much shorter than on the HD, but taking moving subjects may still result in a blurr (cranking up the ISO setting doesn't help much). Sharper than on the HD, and the automatic white balance is definitely better than on the HD under certain lighting conditions. LED Flash works OK for objects further than 30cm most of the time, using it for close ups may sometimes result in a bright, white mess.
I'm using the 1.43 ROM, so some of these issues may be fixed in the updated ROM. There are some issues in TouchFlo/Sense, but they are easily corrected by taking a trip down the Tips & Tricks Post in the Leo Forum.
tbela
I'd used Blackstone for some monthes, and overall I was satisfied. (I'd used Xanny Grid Leo rom)
I've a Leo for a week, and now I'm not simply satisfied but I'm happy with it. The speed, the huge screen and the build quality are fantastic. It's very rear, when I have to fight with small old-fashioned windows controls, but with some patience and practice it is also manageable. Nail-touching definitely doesn't work. Althogh, you can buy capacitive-compatible stylus on ebay.
Only disadvantage for me: fring doesn't work, but I hope it will be fixed soon. Temporarily I use Nimbuzz for chatting.
Overall I can highly recommend the upgrade. If you can do, DO IT!
Thanks very much for all the replies guys. The fact that most of you have written wuite a bit tells me you're very enthusiastic about the phone!
I want one for sure now. The only thing is the cost - I can't renew my contract and there are very few Leos on Ebay and around £500, but only maybe £250 sale proceeds from my HD, so it's quite a hit to take.
If I can get a few quid together to help ease the difference then I'll definitely get one.
Thanks for the comments
Same here, had the HD for about a year and liked it in many respects, the HD2 is a much nicer experience though and if you can afford it at some point I highly recommend to get it.
Well I've made my mind up to get one for sure. The only question really is when.
I'll have to buy an unlocked one on Ebay I think and there are very few on there at the moment because the phone is so new. This is obviously therefore keeping the prices really high.
I'm dying to say 'sod it' and get the credit card out but I know I ought to wait a month or two to see if they get a bit cheaper once more are being sold.
I've read reviews on it and most things I see say that this is basically the best piece of hardware on the market in terms of phones, but that it's "let down/ruined" etc by having winmo on it. I like winmo and have used it for years, so for me, that's a plus!
Having said that, I'd kill to see/have winmo7!
Yep. Those reviews are nonsense.
Powerful hardware like this needs a powerful OS, and WinMo really is by far the most powerful OS you can get.
It doesn't ruin anything. It's the perfect OS for a phone like this.
WinMo bashing is a current trend that you can't do anything against when sites like Gizmodo or Engadget spread the FUD. It's really sad.
I wouldn't want any other OS on the HD2.
maati said:
I wouldn't want any other OS on the HD2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Overall I agree, But Android 2.0 would be very interesting
Well I'm sure I'll be quite happy since it's exactly what I'm used to.
Last phones I've had have been Touch HD, Omnia, XDA Orbit etc - loved them all.
Can't WAIT to get the HD2 though. Especially now I've bought one this afternoon.
Cret said:
Well I'm sure I'll be quite happy since it's exactly what I'm used to.
Last phones I've had have been Touch HD, Omnia, XDA Orbit etc - loved them all.
Can't WAIT to get the HD2 though. Especially now I've bought one this afternoon.
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Click to collapse
Congrats to get this lovely phone. I'd wager you will like it .
OK - so aside from bias/ability to afford/shipping/tax/price or other logistical factor - can we have a show of hands as to who has already bought a HD2 and has something to say - particularly what about the device makes you happy, what makes you sad?
Let's try keep it away from supplier/delivery issues or local network/band/signal issues - just pure usability/hardware/software.
Personally after trying one out in a store last week I finally received the experience I feel you want when moving to a PDA from a smart phone. What does our community think after using it for a while?
noofny said:
OK - so aside from bias/ability to afford/shipping/tax/price or other logistical factor - can we have a show of hands as to who has already bought a HD2 and has something to say - particularly what about the device makes you happy, what makes you sad?
Let's try keep it away from supplier/delivery issues or local network/band/signal issues - just pure usability/hardware/software.
Personally after trying one out in a store last week I finally received the experience I feel you want when moving to a PDA from a smart phone. What does our community think after using it for a while?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
too subjective a question....for every person on here that says get it, there will be one that says don't get it.
the final decision must be yours....nobody here can make your decision for you. Make a list of the important things for you in a phone, then find the phone that matches those needs the best.
for example, I think the iphone has a much nicer interface, more apps, better screen (touch interface, not size or clarity), but for me it just doesn't handle business functions very well and that made me choose the HD2 since this was my primary need.
if you do the same process you might find the ideal phone for you
I got mine on Sunday just gone, was an upgrade from a Diamond. I loved my diamond, but as soon as I had setup my HD2 with contacts and apps etc I was loving this even more. Each time I use it I find something new, like facebook linking, then seeing in a contact card all communications with that person.
I'm yet to use the footprints, but look forward to trying it out.
The main thing for me was the screen size, I always had problems with the tiny diamond screen, but this is so crisp, easier to use and much easier to keyboard with.
Also the damn speed of the device is amazing, so fast, the OS loads so quick. I soft resetted it and put it down to expect a few minutes wait like on the diamond, but was rebooted so quick!
The one thing I would love to see is a facebook tab, like the twitter tab, shame they didn't implement that!
The specs that come with this phone are truely awesome, and that was the overall selling point for me, as I knew how good HTC phones were I just had to have something with the specs that this phone comes with.
twisted-pixel - good point about the subjectiveness. I suppose what I'm fishing for here are peoples post-usage horror/love stories - moreso with regard to hardware and usability. It's a nice big screen but it's also a nice big slab of tech - how do you find the size, whats the battery life like, do you notice anything bad about the capacitive screen, how often (if ever) do you feel the need for a stylus and say 'doh', does the headphone port become dodgy after use - or the micro usb port? I suppose because of this community we all have flexibility and solutions around software, so I meant to make this more hardware related I guess.
noofny said:
twisted-pixel - good point about the subjectiveness. I suppose what I'm fishing for here are peoples post-usage horror/love stories - moreso with regard to hardware and usability. It's a nice big screen but it's also a nice big slab of tech - how do you find the size, whats the battery life like, do you notice anything bad about the capacitive screen, how often (if ever) do you feel the need for a stylus and say 'doh', does the headphone port become dodgy after use - or the micro usb port? I suppose because of this community we all have flexibility and solutions around software, so I meant to make this more hardware related I guess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I admit to loving the phone...with one exception...the sensitivity of the screen is a complete disaster for me. it's very difficult to type on, someones it responds to the slightest touch, other times it doesn't. accuracy is also an issue (that was to be expected on a screen with high resolution I suppose)
and yes, I've tried all the tweaks going before anyone suggests it (currently running v3.3 of the tweak with sensitivity on)
I think if I had come straight from my HD then I would have been impressed, but I come from an iphone where the screen was a delight to use.
however, the rest of the phone makes up for that small failing.
noofny said:
twisted-pixel - good point about the subjectiveness. I suppose what I'm fishing for here are peoples post-usage horror/love stories - moreso with regard to hardware and usability. It's a nice big screen but it's also a nice big slab of tech - how do you find the size, whats the battery life like, do you notice anything bad about the capacitive screen, how often (if ever) do you feel the need for a stylus and say 'doh', does the headphone port become dodgy after use - or the micro usb port? I suppose because of this community we all have flexibility and solutions around software, so I meant to make this more hardware related I guess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unfortunately, you will find more people venting than praising any device on this forum, as people only seek help when they have problems.
I must admit, I personally think it is the best device I have ever used.
For a quick overview from me (in comparison to the X1, but most comments are applicable):
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=5667230&postcount=6
I stumbled on this video on youtube;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-3Bi-Eg2gQ
...and love his brutal (albeit bias and sometimes naive) honesty, it helps you make a decision because it's not a rant. So far you guys are proving some intelligent feedback also - so thank you and let's keep it coming!
I got the HD2 the day it was available in my country (one of the first in europe) and despite all the fixes and xda-dev recommendations i couldn't have it for more then 1 weekend. I sold it on monday morning.
I hated typing (i did try the keyboard cab which should lower the sensitivity), loading sms with some exchanged texts already (loading was awful for such powerful device), visibility outside was horrible, battery,..
Maybe my rant will be understanded better if i mention i'm a blackberry user that likes to try out new "hot phones" (no matter which brand or type of usage).
I've also tried the Nexus One and would say i liked it a tiny bit better then HD2, but still couldn't have it for more then a week.
So, why am i writing this.. After MWC last week, i've kind of wanted to give HD2 another shot. For the following reasons..
I've came across some nice taskbar buttons (which make it look so much better..), I saw there is a fix for sms loading time, i guess i could always install a different keyboard,.. and most imortantly i got a very nice (cheap) offer for a brand new HD2. Yesterday i even ordered a nice case (didn't like the one that comes in the box) and a screenprotector (which might reduce the fingerprints, which i hated so much and a visibility outside,.. hope i'm not too optimistic).
If i somehow manage to be happy with HD2, i might even go for the exnteded battery. And i'm kind of feeling the hype for WinMo7 rom for this device.. Don't know if it will be any better or worse, i just know there is some excitement about it
Hope my rant / "long mess" didn't bore you too much
+1 to buy with eyes closed.
OK, this will be quick because I'm supposed to be doing something else right now but anyway...
I've just sent my HD2 back because of a problem with the microphone so if anyone should be telling you to think of other alternatives - it should be me.
But I can't because I love the phone. It's fast, responsive, it's got most of the features that you could ever want (minus USB host), the screen is gorgeous and the interface is pretty damn usable.
It's not perfect however... Customising it is more trouble than it should be. There is a slight pink hue in the middle of the camera when the contrast and saturation are turned up high enough to make the colours look half lifelike and when the screen is completely white, at certain angles you can see the grid dots that make the screen's matrix.
So to resume, if you don't mind spending some time on it and you're not completely obsessive about things being absolutely perfect (I am and I can still get to sleep at night) then you should be very happy with an HD2.
NeoGreendawg said:
There is a slight pink hue in the middle of the camera when the contrast and saturation are turned up high enough to make the colours look half lifelike and when the screen is completely white, at certain angles you can see the grid dots that make the screen's matrix.
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Click to collapse
The pink hue is solved with an update from HTC (here)
The dots are also visible on an iPhone, its down to the technology, not the device alone.
rp-x1 said:
The pink hue is solved with an update from HTC (here)
The dots are also visible on an iPhone, its down to the technology, not the device alone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I'm sorry but the HTC hotfix did slightly improve the issue but it certainly didn't resolve it in my case. I love the phone believe me but I somehow doubt that anyone who isn't employed by HTC or affected by Daltonism could honestly claim that it has completely solved the issue.
Edit : Not trying to be rude or make out that it's a deal-breaker but I know that as a potential buyer I'd want to know about it.
I've had the HD2 for three weeks and use it every day. I also end up resetting it every day. I've come from a Nokia N96 and before that the N73, so I'm comparing it to the N96. I am very pleased with the speed of the phone and how operations take way less than a second to perform, instead of several seconds a la N96.
The phone itself is a bit too big. Perhaps a 4 inch screen would have been enough. Even though I have big hands, it's just too big to walk around and hold the phone with one hand. I'm scared of dropping it. The headphone port's on the bottom of the phone - it causes the cable to tangle up around the phone when in a pocket.
I have found plenty of bugs in the stock O2 1.43 firmware and know how to deal with the main ones.
I didn't realise the phone had an FM tuner until I found it after a few days on the Start menu - I used the N96 FM tuner almost every day. Unfortunately the tuner on the HD2 is really poor. It is unable to obtain a good quality signal. Sound dips out. There's an awful lot of interference in places where the N96 would have relayed a good quality signal. In places where the N96 got a poor signal, the HD2 has static. BBC Radio 1 has the most powerful signal in my area, yet the HD2 fails to get consistent reception. There's just too much interference and I often just shut the radio off. A huge let down; I wonder if it's hardware or software at fault.
The N96 music player was very well featured, but incredibly (pathetically) slow. In contrast, the HTC Music app has no such delays, is very fast but somewhat basic in comparison. A lot of cool N96 features are missing; there's no way to call up the keyboard to locate tracks, track details can't be edited, tracks can't be deleted, backing out of an album takes you to the top of the album list and not to where you were. There's no hardware buttons to change tracks when the phone's in a pocket (a swipe up/down on the lock screen to change tracks would be nice). Volume control has too few stages so is either too loud or too quiet; volume within the Music tab has more stages but doesn't always work (error in Services.exe). General audio quality is rather poor - even the iPod classic 5G sounds better! Occasional unexplained sound dips and audio which lacks in bass and treble. The oddest thing is the shuffle feature tends to replay swathes of tracks that have already been played.
Video playback is very impressive because of the screen size. Can't fathom why the Windows Mobile OS cannot play WMV. Get quite a few dropped frames and put that down to the poor quality 1.43 ROM and perhaps not-fully-developed decoders. Video viewing in general is very nice, although an afterthought within HTC Sense, as the video playback has essentially just been tacked on to HTC's photo viewing app.
I do like the phone, it is good enough to stop me wanting to go back to my last phone. I'd get one, but the HD2's not quite the tech lover's wet dream that some of the big review sites make it out to be. Having bought it from the O2 network, I'll seriously doubt I'll ever be able to officially upgrade the firmware (HTC isn't even listed on their software upgrade pages), so I'll have to learn alternative methods one of these days to see if I can iron out some of the bugs!
Wish they would just whack a snapdragon and capacitive screen in a HD and re-release it....think that would satisfy a lotta folks. Cheers all for your input, it's really helping me to set realistic expectations.
I was contemplating on whether I should buy a Nexus One instead of the HD2, but I decided to go for the HD2 instead because it was cheaper, had a nice screen resolution, specifications don't differ much between both devices, and i'm looking forward to the Windows 7 release on the HD2
i am currently contemplating to switch from HD to HD2....is it worth it?
Buy it!
I come from the HD. The HD2 is what the HD should have been from the first instance.
Fantastic:
- speed (and I am using a stock French Orange ROM based on 1.43!)
- screen
- usability
As far as precision is concerned: I need a phone to check and type (even long) emails, and read documents. XT9 works just great, but even in ABC mode in landscape the accuracy is pretty good (and I type fast!).
If you need to play around with programs using stylus-based input, yes, then it gets really annoying (try to edit your registry in Total Commander and you'll get crazy).
In summary: if you want to tweak it like crazy all the time or intensively use older programs with small menus, then consider buying an alternative with a resistive screen and a stylus. But if you actually want to USE your phone with the standard applications, just buy it and you'll get the best of the market today imo!
to buy or not
i have it for a month after the trinity.
sorry but it hasnot voice call
no handwriting recognition
battery ends quickley
no video call
no .chm file reader
all of these were on the trinity.
so i am sorry buing it
Mastoid said:
I was contemplating on whether I should buy a Nexus One instead of the HD2, but I decided to go for the HD2 instead because it was cheaper, had a nice screen resolution, specifications don't differ much between both devices, and i'm looking forward to the Windows 7 release on the HD2
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Click to collapse
I hope you do realize that there may eventually never be a WP7 release for the HD2?
rottttman said:
i have it for a month after the trinity.
sorry but it hasnot voice call
no handwriting recognition
battery ends quickley
no video call
no .chm file reader
all of these were on the trinity.
so i am sorry buing it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
U'd better search for infos about the phone after buying it