Database Users

Cingular 3G in the US

Hello All,
I recently bought a 3G Cingular service plan with unlimited data. I have a Qtek 9000. Do you think I can use it in markets where cingular offer 3G to make use of video calls/ high speed internet etc?
Thanks,
Gilbert

The Universal only supports UMTS 2100 Mhz not the Cingular 1900Mhz based system.

Bummer. This is a sad day in the history of sad days :evil: Ok but I can still use my unlimited GPRS to surf the net, right?
With the new devices planned for this year, are they planning multi UMTS bands along with GSM quad/ multi bands?
Thanks,
Gilbert

You can only use GPRS on the 1900 network. If you're outta luck there are no 1900 masts in your area (only 850) and it will be a really, really sad day and you wished you had bought a quad band device etc...
There is also some rumour that US UMTS will not use the 2100 band - that would be a real bummer.

I remember in the US when the Jam came out there was two radio versions. One for the US, I cannot remember the bands and another for the rest of the world. But I clearly remember that it was a software issue and not a hardware as the software could change the frequency to match your requirements.
Does this exist for UMTS?
Regards,
Gilbert

this depends more on the antenna design, and how far away the bands are. The radio tuner should not be the issue.

Thanks for the reply. Does a software band switcher exist to do the switch to 1900 UMTS from 2100 UMTS?
Thanks,
Gilbert

The Truth
USA uses the 2100 frequency for US satalites this is why Cingular does not support the 2100 frequency. They will never have 3G on 2100, FCC crap the only thing we can only hope for is a hardware upgrade for the antenna but I doubt it. GPRS only works on 1900 so who ever told you the 850 crap doesn't know. this is why you can get voice calls in certain area but no data + if you only had an 850 towers you wouldn't beable to make a call scince you don't have that band on your device. I don't think there would be a way to hack it to use the 1900 mhz frequency because it would take a really smart developer that can do a lot more than registry tweeks to wirte a relay to the 1900mhz antenna. sorry guys.

I did a lot of reading on this last night. Rumor is Cingular is to start using the 1900 band for incoming and outgoing and then add the 850 band latter since the 2100 band is not available.

just a rumor
It is just a rumor. They already have 3G on 1900 and that's it, 850 is old technology if anything the 1900 tower are going to be eventually replace the 850 tower. Trust me, I live in LV where 3G is all over, GPRS, and 3G is only on 1900mhz if you look at the coverage maps for gprs vs the cellular coverage map you'll see what I'm saying.

High speed on cingular with X1i

Hi Everyone,
I got my X1i on Tuesday. It's obviously a UK import, but so was my TyTN II and it worked great. When I got everything set up, I couldn't get more than 200kbps on dslreports. I put the sim card back in my TyTN II and retested, and got 1.2Mbps.
If I turn off HSDPA/HSUPA the data rate drops to 30kbps. I've played with every combination of data and voice bands and can't get the same performance as the TyTN. I do notice that my X1 never shows the H icon in the status bar like my other phone to indicate high speed (HSDPA).
The bands are exactly the same with a minor addition.
GSM: 900+1800 UMTS: 2100 + 800
GSM: 1900 + 850 UMTS: 1900 + 850
UMTS: 2100 + 800
AT&T seems to run on the middle one.
Does anyone have any thoughts on what could be holding my back? Same SIM, same data plan, etc.
Thanks very much in advance!!!

Hi,
Where do you live? Could be you only have UMTS 850 coverage... But, could also be something else..

dbond45 said:
Hi,
Where do you live? Could be you only have UMTS 850 coverage... But, could also be something else..
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I live near Reno, NV. The wierd thing is I literally power down, move the sim to my TyTN II and bingo! I get incredible speeds. Short of getting into the registry I have gone through and confirmed all the GPRS and HSDPA settings are exactly the same.

I think what dbond45 was saying is that you might be in an area that uses 850 band which isn't actually on the x1i. The tytn II on the other hand has the 850 band from what i understand so that might be why ur getting great speeds with ur tytn II.

Bxsteez said:
I think what dbond45 was saying is that you might be in an area that uses 850 band which isn't actually on the x1i. The tytn II on the other hand has the 850 band from what i understand so that might be why ur getting great speeds with ur tytn II.
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Click to collapse
Ah, so you're thinking that even though it says it supports 1900+850 in the control panel, the 850 band may be disabled in the radio? I'm pretty technical, but would have no idea how to test that. Any ideas?
By the way, thanks for talking this through with me. I hope it's benefitting others too.

Yes from what i've read all over the place that the 850 radio is disabled. I know that even though the software says u can enable those bands it doesn't actually mean u can. I have the touch pro and it has all of the different bands in the settings and we all know no one can get 3G in the US. So it looks like that is what ur running into. I've read on howard forums at some point a way to test to see if u are working on the 850 band but i don't remember how they did it.

Bxsteez,
The program is fieldtest.exe, and you can find it under windows in your file explorer on the X1, once in WIndows, scroll down to fieldtest.exe and run, although I'm not sure what all the values me..
There is a dispute as to whether the X1i has UMTS 850 (see pocketnow.com post, but, IMHO, I don't think it does, although I wished it did)
Lemme do some research and see if I can find what band Reno is running on. It's very likely it's 850 3G since a) it's a newer market, and b) it's a rural area compared to large cities which use 1900 mhz UMTS...

From what i was reading on howard forums Canada only uses UMTS 850 and the people who have the x1i are reporting only edge speeds.

Indeed you all were right about the discussions on Howard Forums. Read through a lot of them. Thanks for the pointer to fieldtest.exe. I'm digging through it now. I'm hopeful that S/E just threw a software switch in their stack for 850Mhz so the X1i wouldn't carp any of Cingular's sales on the upcoming X1a. Hopeful and maybe a little naive.

X1 on AT&T
I had a similar instance yesterday, sent the X1 back. The same 3 choices for UMTS in WM Phone settings, I selected the 850/1900 bands. I got the H but it was slow. Moved my SIM back to the BlackJack II and worked just fine.
I think the ROM or WM6.1 Stamp they are using is incorrect.
The Xperia Box, on the white label shows UMTS EU1 US3 EU4 I believe which to me would mean 900/1900/2100 I am not positive about the last EU being 3 or 4 since I have mailed the phone already. There are a lot of listings on ebay which show UMTS 850/1900/2100 which I truly believe is incorrect and are being used from a Feb 08 page on gsm arena. Expansys USA told me they had both flavors, then the next day all you see on the US site is the 900/1900/2100.
The US ver is not released ( X1a) from what I read here and everywhere else.

dbond45 said:
Bxsteez,
There is a dispute as to whether the X1i has UMTS 850 (see pocketnow.com post, but, IMHO, I don't think it does, although I wished it did)
Lemme do some research and see if I can find what band Reno is running on. It's very likely it's 850 3G since a) it's a newer market, and b) it's a rural area compared to large cities which use 1900 mhz UMTS...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. There is no dispute. Only dumb people. the X1i DOES NOT have 850mhz UMTS band, the hardware isn't even in the phone. It falsely displayed 850+1900MHZ because it does 1900MHZ and WM assumes that if it has 1900 it must have 850. It doesn't..
2. Reno does in fact run a predominately 850mhz 3G networking using At&t (not cingular, its been over a year since they got bought out) Your speed is likely because of this. Oddly if your phone is set to auto negotiate networks it should pick up EDGE service and show a "G" does it display a G rather than an H? You said the H doesn't display when you force 850+1900 UMTS right? The question is what does come up? Signal strength etc.?
If you import a phone from the UK you need to be prepared to be disappointed with speeds, simple fact, most UK phones don't even support 1900mhz, its there for roaming purposes on the X1. Same reason the X1a will have 850/1900/2100 UMTS. 1900mhz band is the weaker of the 2 used by At&t... 1900mhz was the first frequency they used, they used it so save costs and setup a marginally OK 3G network on a larger area. 1900mhz being a higher frequency means it can travel further than 850, this results in slower speeds and poor reception depending on your location from the nearest tower. 850 is lower frequency and there for more dense, this translates into faster speeds and better reception. Most new areas of at&ts 3G network are spread around with 850mhz. Older markets are a combination of 850mhz/1900mhz and some just 1900mhz.
The point is, if you are blissfully unaware of all this then your best bet is to send the phone back and wait for the US release.

mlinz said:
...
1900mhz band is the weaker of the 2 used by At&t... 1900mhz was the first frequency they used, they used it so save costs and setup a marginally OK 3G network on a larger area. 1900mhz being a higher frequency means it can travel further than 850, this results in slower speeds and poor reception depending on your location from the nearest tower. 850 is lower frequency and there for more dense, this translates into faster speeds and better reception. Most new areas of at&ts 3G network are spread around with 850mhz. Older markets are a combination of 850mhz/1900mhz and some just 1900mhz.
...
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FYI: The data transmission speed doesn't depend on frequency. Both 850 and 1900 bands are capable to provide the same speed.

mlinz said:
1. There is no dispute. Only dumb people. the X1i DOES NOT have 850mhz UMTS band, the hardware isn't even in the phone. It falsely displayed 850+1900MHZ because it does 1900MHZ and WM assumes that if it has 1900 it must have 850. It doesn't..QUOTE]
Actually, I along with many others are fully aware the X1i does not have 850 UMTS listed on the box, in the specs, etc. I even made a post about it. HOWEVER, there is a VERY SLIGHT chance it does, and SE never mentioned it in the specs for some unknown reason. If you go to pocketnow.com, Brandon CONFIRMS he spoke to 3 SE reps from the X1 support line who said the X1i had 850 UMTS support. Only 1 said it only had 900/1900/2100 UMTS as listed on the box. 3/4 reps saying it has 850 UMTS, along with the fact he supposedly only gets 850 UMTS where he lives, and is getting HSDPA on the X1i leaves a glimmer of hope for everyone out there, even if it is dismally small.
As far as the "false display" 850/1900 mhz option it is not so much a false display as a software option on most HTC phones, including the euro touch pro...
Anyways, I'm getting decent HSDPA coverage in Chicago...
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Click to collapse

joedoe said:
FYI: The data transmission speed doesn't depend on frequency. Both 850 and 1900 bands are capable to provide the same speed.
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They may output the same speed initially, but 1900 you usually get less bars depending on your location to the tower and less bars means slower speeds.

mlinz said:
...
1900mhz being a higher frequency means it can travel further than 850
...
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Click to collapse
You got this backwards. Think AM and FM. AM can be picked up much farther away.

veloaudio said:
You got this backwards. Think AM and FM. AM can be picked up much farther away.
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My bad, I do that a lot

X1 not working with USA 3G ?

X1 has -
2G Network GSM 850 / 900 / 1800 / 1900
3G Network HSDPA 850 / 1900 / 2100
ATT - is
850/1900
why cant i connect to 3G here in the US ?

You may have a X1i. Which has 3G bands 900/1900/2100 and you live in an area with 850MHz 3G.

Since the X1a, which is the model with the specs you posted, hasn't been released yet (apparently ships today according to Sony Style), I doubt you have the right Model. You have the X1i.

No i have
GSM 1900-850 and UMTS 1900 850

says so in my settings.. but i dunno

it reads X1
not X1i
and has an FCC ID under the battery where the S/N is

Did you get it from US? Or overseas? Europe Asia?
If not from US, then its X1i version.
And I think the X1a was just released today, right?

Sorry, but you probably have the X1i, unless you got a very lucky prerelease of the X1a which has not shipped yet. There are numerous posts that are confirming that there is only 1900 on the X1i and not 850. This means that it will work in some 3g areas, but not all.
The X1i lists all of the bands in the settings menu despite the above info. It's a bit misleading, but even though the software lists both, it doesn't always mean that the hardware supports it.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2765192

Uberfishyskillz said:
says so in my settings.. but i dunno
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi Uber,
You have an X1 also known as X1i
The UMTS is 900/1900/2100
Europe uses UMTS 2100 so you select setting 1= 1900/2100
USA AT&T uses UMTS 1900 in some areas, while in other areas it's 850
The reason your Xperia also have setting 2 as UMTS 850/1900
is for when you travel to a UMTS 1900 country like parts of USA
But since your device doesn't have UMTS 850
it won't work in a country with UMTS 850 like
Australia, Canada and some areas of USA.
Where in USA are you located?
.

im using AT&T here in the los angeles area. i got 3G no problem indoors as well as out. so hope this helps others. also...you might have to disable the hsdpa/hsupa in the advanced network. if you dont, you get the "H" symbol...which i heard is a little bit slower than 3G. hope this helps

Hi vicsingh71
Sorry to tell you but that is wrong as 3G is a max speed of 384kbps whilst HSDPA is max speed of up to 7.2mbps for download and i think HSUPA is 2mbs for uploading. Anyway super fast Data also called 3.5G is what these two are and they are both much faster and a better service then just 3G.
Marc

i also have a x1i purchased in the uk. i live in Los angeles and the 3g works perfect! The only reason sony made the x1a is to be able to sell it in the us. the x1i uses a qualcomm prossesor that is in litigation with nokia here in the us, so it cannot be sold here. that is why the downgraded the chip for the x1a. my advice is to get the x1i

850 band 3g net work.

I live in the U.S. Virgin Islands.
We have AT&T wireless 850 band 3g.
I want to buy this phone but the idea of not being able to get 3g on it is scaring me.
I heard it has 850 band 3g built in but it is turned off by htc.
Is this true?
Do it have a crack?
Can you tell me what i can do?

There are 2 versions of this phone:
1) The T8282, which doesn't not have the 850 capability at all (not even crippled). This phone will not work at 3G speeds down there, if you're only on 850.
2) The T8285 (Telstra - Australia) version, which does have the 850 capability. You can find them on eBay - and they're generally a little more expensive. I live in the US - and own this version. The only problem I have in Chicago though is that AT&T also uses their 1900 frequency in many areas downtown. I only get Edge speeds down there, but as soon as I'm outside that area and close to an 850 tower, I get 3G speeds again.
Good luck!

It would not be the first time HTC did that.
Remember the touch diamond.

[Q] Will Euro Tab work on US 3G?

I haven't seen any specs for North American Galaxy Tab so I don't know if the AT&T version will have UMTS 850. I have ordered a Euro version that has UMTS 1900 so I presume it "should" work on AT&T 3G but I'm worried because what I can find on this subject implies UMTS 850 is essential for AT&T 3G. Can anyone with experience in US tell me how well the UMTS 1900 only works? Thanks.

Yes
To be more specific, it will if your city still has the 1900 mhz band. Check here: http://www.cellularmaps.com/att_850_1900.shtml

Funk2641 said:
Yes
To be more specific, it will if your city still has the 1900 mhz band. Check here: http://www.cellularmaps.com/att_850_1900.shtml
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Click to collapse
Thanks for the quick response and the maps (first time I've seen coverage maps by frequency, since AT&T no longer offers them) Very helpful and I feel better about haven ordered the Euro version.

Are there any owners of cellphones using the Euro 900/1900 UMTS frequencies on US 3G networks who can share their experience?

I live in the SF Bay Area and here the network is mainly 1900Mhz so the device works very well.
If you live in a market that got 3g fairly early, your network in probably 1900Mhz.
If you live in a market that only recently (1-2 years) got 3G, you might be on a 850Mhz network.