Database Users

High speed on cingular with X1i

Hi Everyone,
I got my X1i on Tuesday. It's obviously a UK import, but so was my TyTN II and it worked great. When I got everything set up, I couldn't get more than 200kbps on dslreports. I put the sim card back in my TyTN II and retested, and got 1.2Mbps.
If I turn off HSDPA/HSUPA the data rate drops to 30kbps. I've played with every combination of data and voice bands and can't get the same performance as the TyTN. I do notice that my X1 never shows the H icon in the status bar like my other phone to indicate high speed (HSDPA).
The bands are exactly the same with a minor addition.
GSM: 900+1800 UMTS: 2100 + 800
GSM: 1900 + 850 UMTS: 1900 + 850
UMTS: 2100 + 800
AT&T seems to run on the middle one.
Does anyone have any thoughts on what could be holding my back? Same SIM, same data plan, etc.
Thanks very much in advance!!!

Hi,
Where do you live? Could be you only have UMTS 850 coverage... But, could also be something else..

dbond45 said:
Hi,
Where do you live? Could be you only have UMTS 850 coverage... But, could also be something else..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I live near Reno, NV. The wierd thing is I literally power down, move the sim to my TyTN II and bingo! I get incredible speeds. Short of getting into the registry I have gone through and confirmed all the GPRS and HSDPA settings are exactly the same.

I think what dbond45 was saying is that you might be in an area that uses 850 band which isn't actually on the x1i. The tytn II on the other hand has the 850 band from what i understand so that might be why ur getting great speeds with ur tytn II.

Bxsteez said:
I think what dbond45 was saying is that you might be in an area that uses 850 band which isn't actually on the x1i. The tytn II on the other hand has the 850 band from what i understand so that might be why ur getting great speeds with ur tytn II.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, so you're thinking that even though it says it supports 1900+850 in the control panel, the 850 band may be disabled in the radio? I'm pretty technical, but would have no idea how to test that. Any ideas?
By the way, thanks for talking this through with me. I hope it's benefitting others too.

Yes from what i've read all over the place that the 850 radio is disabled. I know that even though the software says u can enable those bands it doesn't actually mean u can. I have the touch pro and it has all of the different bands in the settings and we all know no one can get 3G in the US. So it looks like that is what ur running into. I've read on howard forums at some point a way to test to see if u are working on the 850 band but i don't remember how they did it.

Bxsteez,
The program is fieldtest.exe, and you can find it under windows in your file explorer on the X1, once in WIndows, scroll down to fieldtest.exe and run, although I'm not sure what all the values me..
There is a dispute as to whether the X1i has UMTS 850 (see pocketnow.com post, but, IMHO, I don't think it does, although I wished it did)
Lemme do some research and see if I can find what band Reno is running on. It's very likely it's 850 3G since a) it's a newer market, and b) it's a rural area compared to large cities which use 1900 mhz UMTS...

From what i was reading on howard forums Canada only uses UMTS 850 and the people who have the x1i are reporting only edge speeds.

Indeed you all were right about the discussions on Howard Forums. Read through a lot of them. Thanks for the pointer to fieldtest.exe. I'm digging through it now. I'm hopeful that S/E just threw a software switch in their stack for 850Mhz so the X1i wouldn't carp any of Cingular's sales on the upcoming X1a. Hopeful and maybe a little naive.

X1 on AT&T
I had a similar instance yesterday, sent the X1 back. The same 3 choices for UMTS in WM Phone settings, I selected the 850/1900 bands. I got the H but it was slow. Moved my SIM back to the BlackJack II and worked just fine.
I think the ROM or WM6.1 Stamp they are using is incorrect.
The Xperia Box, on the white label shows UMTS EU1 US3 EU4 I believe which to me would mean 900/1900/2100 I am not positive about the last EU being 3 or 4 since I have mailed the phone already. There are a lot of listings on ebay which show UMTS 850/1900/2100 which I truly believe is incorrect and are being used from a Feb 08 page on gsm arena. Expansys USA told me they had both flavors, then the next day all you see on the US site is the 900/1900/2100.
The US ver is not released ( X1a) from what I read here and everywhere else.

dbond45 said:
Bxsteez,
There is a dispute as to whether the X1i has UMTS 850 (see pocketnow.com post, but, IMHO, I don't think it does, although I wished it did)
Lemme do some research and see if I can find what band Reno is running on. It's very likely it's 850 3G since a) it's a newer market, and b) it's a rural area compared to large cities which use 1900 mhz UMTS...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. There is no dispute. Only dumb people. the X1i DOES NOT have 850mhz UMTS band, the hardware isn't even in the phone. It falsely displayed 850+1900MHZ because it does 1900MHZ and WM assumes that if it has 1900 it must have 850. It doesn't..
2. Reno does in fact run a predominately 850mhz 3G networking using At&t (not cingular, its been over a year since they got bought out) Your speed is likely because of this. Oddly if your phone is set to auto negotiate networks it should pick up EDGE service and show a "G" does it display a G rather than an H? You said the H doesn't display when you force 850+1900 UMTS right? The question is what does come up? Signal strength etc.?
If you import a phone from the UK you need to be prepared to be disappointed with speeds, simple fact, most UK phones don't even support 1900mhz, its there for roaming purposes on the X1. Same reason the X1a will have 850/1900/2100 UMTS. 1900mhz band is the weaker of the 2 used by At&t... 1900mhz was the first frequency they used, they used it so save costs and setup a marginally OK 3G network on a larger area. 1900mhz being a higher frequency means it can travel further than 850, this results in slower speeds and poor reception depending on your location from the nearest tower. 850 is lower frequency and there for more dense, this translates into faster speeds and better reception. Most new areas of at&ts 3G network are spread around with 850mhz. Older markets are a combination of 850mhz/1900mhz and some just 1900mhz.
The point is, if you are blissfully unaware of all this then your best bet is to send the phone back and wait for the US release.

mlinz said:
...
1900mhz band is the weaker of the 2 used by At&t... 1900mhz was the first frequency they used, they used it so save costs and setup a marginally OK 3G network on a larger area. 1900mhz being a higher frequency means it can travel further than 850, this results in slower speeds and poor reception depending on your location from the nearest tower. 850 is lower frequency and there for more dense, this translates into faster speeds and better reception. Most new areas of at&ts 3G network are spread around with 850mhz. Older markets are a combination of 850mhz/1900mhz and some just 1900mhz.
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FYI: The data transmission speed doesn't depend on frequency. Both 850 and 1900 bands are capable to provide the same speed.

mlinz said:
1. There is no dispute. Only dumb people. the X1i DOES NOT have 850mhz UMTS band, the hardware isn't even in the phone. It falsely displayed 850+1900MHZ because it does 1900MHZ and WM assumes that if it has 1900 it must have 850. It doesn't..QUOTE]
Actually, I along with many others are fully aware the X1i does not have 850 UMTS listed on the box, in the specs, etc. I even made a post about it. HOWEVER, there is a VERY SLIGHT chance it does, and SE never mentioned it in the specs for some unknown reason. If you go to pocketnow.com, Brandon CONFIRMS he spoke to 3 SE reps from the X1 support line who said the X1i had 850 UMTS support. Only 1 said it only had 900/1900/2100 UMTS as listed on the box. 3/4 reps saying it has 850 UMTS, along with the fact he supposedly only gets 850 UMTS where he lives, and is getting HSDPA on the X1i leaves a glimmer of hope for everyone out there, even if it is dismally small.
As far as the "false display" 850/1900 mhz option it is not so much a false display as a software option on most HTC phones, including the euro touch pro...
Anyways, I'm getting decent HSDPA coverage in Chicago...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

joedoe said:
FYI: The data transmission speed doesn't depend on frequency. Both 850 and 1900 bands are capable to provide the same speed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They may output the same speed initially, but 1900 you usually get less bars depending on your location to the tower and less bars means slower speeds.

mlinz said:
...
1900mhz being a higher frequency means it can travel further than 850
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You got this backwards. Think AM and FM. AM can be picked up much farther away.

veloaudio said:
You got this backwards. Think AM and FM. AM can be picked up much farther away.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My bad, I do that a lot

X1a or X1i...which is better? and whats the difference..?

i did use the search button, but everytime i click on it i get an error saying Page Cannot Be Displayed so i dont know whats goin on, but i just wnat to know what is the difference between the X1a and X1i and want to know which one of them is better? Please let me know guys, and sorry about the search...i did try

X1i = interesting
X1a = awesome
You didn't search, Google it!

x1i == 3g but not with 850umts band and record at 640_480 30fps
x1a == 3g with 850umts but think it's lacking support for some the umts bands used outside America and can't record 640_480 at 30fps

I picked up an X1i myself due to the 30fps recording.

X1a: UMTS 850/1900/2100 MHz (15fps video recording - lowered due to patent infringements)
X1i: UMTS 900/1900/2100 MHz (30fps video recording)
If you're a a North American using an 850MHz provider (such as AT&T), go the X1a, if you're in Australia, go the X1a (for Telstra/3 customers) and the X1i (for Optus/Vodafone/Virgin/etc customers), if you're in Europe go the X1i.
I'm not sure about Asia though, sorry.
I got the X1a because of Telstra's 3G network using the 850MHz band.

I was wondering if some one could help me please. I read in the above thread to buy the X1a if on telstra/3 but 3 have just released the X1i. Now i was just about to buy an X1a because 3 are launching the mega 3g soon which allows 3g on telstras umts 850 band (of which the x1i doesnt have).
The question i have is if i buy a X1a can i configure it to run all of the 3 networks stuff (net, mms, planet 3) or will i be stuck buying an X1i and missing out on the extra coverage that mega 3g will be offering. (which really isnt an option for me)
Any help would be greatly appreciated
Jamin

I have an X1i myself and I must say the videos are very good

X1i also support 850 band..?
I have X1i, and according to the phone settings, it supports both UMTS bands, 850/1900 and 900/2100..
I have no problems whatsoever using UMTS with my provider, telenor, will try to check which band they use..

badboy70 said:
I have an X1i myself and I must say the videos are very good
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the general consensus is that provided there's plenty of light, the videos are good. Once the ambient light starts to drop, it's as if the camera is hardware/driver level coded to increase the exposure to make the most of what light is there. Unfortunately this leads to motion blurring.

mzoran said:
I have X1i, and according to the phone settings, it supports both UMTS bands, 850/1900 and 900/2100..
I have no problems whatsoever using UMTS with my provider, telenor, will try to check which band they use..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmmm so do i, GSM 850/900/1800/1900 & UMTS EU1/US2/EU8
manufactured 09W08
in my opinion the x1i is better

You guys do realize that the hardware's the same and its just the ROM that changes, right?
Just get any X1 and check out both ROMs and see which one you like better / if you have compatibility issues with your carrier.

stormlv said:
You guys do realize that the hardware's the same and its just the ROM that changes, right?
Just get any X1 and check out both ROMs and see which one you like better / if you have compatibility issues with your carrier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, but that is plain wrong !!
This issue has been posted many times:
the X1i is not capable of UMTS 850Mhz reception. It uses the Qualcomm 7200 CPU and has a hardware filter to prevent reception on UMTS 850Mhz (patent infringement issue). The video recording rate is uncrippled
the X1a uses Qualcomm 7201A CPU and can receive the UMTS 850Mhz frequency (Canada, USA, Aus, S Americas, S Africa etc). Video recording rate is crippled (patent infringement issue)
SE had separate factory assembly runs for the X1i and X1a to ensure this situation actually prevailed.
The X1i does list the UMTS 850Mhz frequency in the phone bands but the device does not receive this frequency. Changing ROM's does not alter the hardware limitations.
The retail price difference between the X1i and X1a is up to 50% higher for the X1a. This seems to be for the purpose of paying Qualcomm royalties to Broadcomm for the patent infringement.

I guess I really f....d up this time, haven't I?
Sorry for that then. I had a friend that bought an X1i here and went to the US changed the ROM and worked perfectly... I guess the carrier must have been using something other than 850 Mhz...
Oh well...I apologize for talking out of my ass...
Will do more research before stating something I'm not 100% sure of

mzoran said:
I have X1i, and according to the phone settings, it supports both UMTS bands, 850/1900 and 900/2100..
I have no problems whatsoever using UMTS with my provider, telenor, will try to check which band they use..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
x1i does not support the same 3g bands as the x1a.
The x1i is "better" because it has a better video camera, but if it doesn't work with your carrier's 3g bands then it doesn't really matter.
I am almost positive the x1i does NOT support 850/1900/2100 for 3g.

ianl8888 said:
Sorry, but that is plain wrong !!
This issue has been posted many times:
the X1i is not capable of UMTS 850Mhz reception. It uses the Qualcomm 7200 CPU and has a hardware filter to prevent reception on UMTS 850Mhz (patent infringement issue). The video recording rate is uncrippled
the X1a uses Qualcomm 7201A CPU and can receive the UMTS 850Mhz frequency (Canada, USA, Aus, S Americas, S Africa etc). Video recording rate is crippled (patent infringement issue)
SE had separate factory assembly runs for the X1i and X1a to ensure this situation actually prevailed.
The X1i does list the UMTS 850Mhz frequency in the phone bands but the device does not receive this frequency. Changing ROM's does not alter the hardware limitations.
The retail price difference between the X1i and X1a is up to 50% higher for the X1a. This seems to be for the purpose of paying Qualcomm royalties to Broadcomm for the patent infringement.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just on a slightly seperate topics.. if 2 factory assemble both x1a and x1i, why is most silver ones which are both x1i and mostly x1a in aust have cracking issues? must have been the materials itself then..
while on the topic of the bands.. does 3 has 850 band yet? if so i can give a try on my x1i to see if it does have 850 band or not.. Optus dont use it btw..

Cutefox said:
Just on a slightly seperate topics.. if 2 factory assemble both x1a and x1i, why is most silver ones which are both x1i and mostly x1a in aust have cracking issues? must have been the materials itself then..
while on the topic of the bands.. does 3 has 850 band yet? if so i can give a try on my x1i to see if it does have 850 band or not.. Optus dont use it btw..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The colour, black or silver, is irrelevant to the UMTS frequency capability. The cracked case issue is likely to be related to early production run issues, but we'll never know for certain, I think.
Which carrier is also irrelevant - the X1i will not receive UMTS 850Mhz irrespective of who broadcasts it. I have no clue about 3 except that because this small carrier is city-centred, it is most unlikely to broadcast on the UMTS 850Mhz frequency ... this low frequency high-wavelength broadcast is used in regional areas for distance penetration.
Optus uses UMTS 900Mhz, which the X1i should receive (it is "tuned" for 900, 1900, 2100Mhz), and which is OK for distance as well. But Optus' regional coverage is woeful, both for GSM and UMTS. Suits if you never much leave the city areas, of course.

T-mobile's US HD2 works on 2100 MHz 3G in Europe?

Hi,
The official specs of T-mobile's HD2 says that the supported 3G bands are: WCDMA/HSPA: 1700 MHz (AWS) / 2100 MHz
Does it mean it will work on European 2100 MHz 3G too? Nexus one does so I suspect HD2 could too but as far as I could digg nobody had a straight answer to this question yet.
-AlefSin

actually i asked HTC CS before, and the answer is NO!
european countries WCDMA frequencies are the same with ASIAN countries. So no chance for European countries either.

hmmm I don't know JohnQ. In your attached email HTC is saying China's frequencies are different from the rest of the world so how do you say it's the same as Europe? I don't know much about 3G network in China though.

Just a few weeks back it was annoounced that the US operators had all signed up to migrating to the rest of the wold's GSM standards!
So in time we will all be singing from the same hymn sheet!

Accoridng to Wikipedia, while 3G in China is using the same frequencies as Europe in UMTS-I band, the air interface is different (TD-SCDMA vs TD-CDMA).
(sorry, cannot link to the docs since as junior member cannot embed links yet).

pa49 said:
Just a few weeks back it was annoounced that the US operators had all signed up to migrating to the rest of the wold's GSM standards!
So in time we will all be singing from the same hymn sheet!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow, that's... odd! It seems US operators cannot even agree whinin US and now they all want to use the rest of world's standards! That's so un-american!

At&T, rogers, etc are all using european 3G frequencies, which is why you can use device from europe on their networks.
T-mobile US uses 1700 & 2100 (one for up stream, one for downstream) which is why it won't work on at&t etc or european frequencies.
The t-mobile 3G phones use both 1700 and 2100 at the same time; and they cant use 2100 seperately on other networks.

erm att uses 850/1900,and very few operators use the same,none in Europe use these bands

alefsin said:
hmmm I don't know JohnQ. In your attached email HTC is saying China's frequencies are different from the rest of the world so how do you say it's the same as Europe? I don't know much about 3G network in China though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you can check though. google it

Yes it does!
alefsin said:
Hi,
The official specs of T-mobile's HD2 says that the supported 3G bands are: WCDMA/HSPA: 1700 MHz (AWS) / 2100 MHz
Does it mean it will work on European 2100 MHz 3G too? Nexus one does so I suspect HD2 could too but as far as I could digg nobody had a straight answer to this question yet.
-AlefSin
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've tested mine on a 3G only network (2100mhz) and it works fine. What I mean by "only" is that the Digi Mobil in Romania works only on 2100Mhz.
I hope it helps!
GG

JohnQ said:
you can check though. google it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did, check post #5

Well, it seems the answer is negative. I asked HTC:
Hi, I'm very excited about HTC HD2 on T-Mobile USA. However there is a cruicial question taht I could not find an answer for yet: Should I get this phone, when I travel to Europe, can I use 3G? The specs say this phone will support AWS/2100 MHz UMTS. Since the 2100 MHz is the dominant frequency for western european 3G networks, does it mean this phone would work on their 3G networks? Nobody at T-mobile's support could answer me so I hope you could solve this mystery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And they answered:
Thank you for contacting HTC Technical Assistance Center. I understand the importance in researching a phone before you purchase it. This is a unusual situation and one T-mobile may not have been experienced with. For T-mobiles network the phone will be using the 1700 and 2100 bands. Although the 2100 band is common world wide. allowing the phone to pick up the edge network. T-mobile uses the 1700 for there 3G services. This band as far as we are aware is only used by T-mobile when it comes to major carriers world wide. More then likely the phone would not be able to pick up 3g if taken over seas.
However. T-mobile dose have a few branches in Europe. You may wish to check with them to see what bands they use for 3G, and if they have had any conflicts with American phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

wmfreak said:
I've tested mine on a 3G only network (2100mhz) and it works fine. What I mean by "only" is that the Digi Mobil in Romania works only on 2100Mhz.
I hope it helps!
GG
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But T-mobile's HD2 is not out yet! Are you sure you didn't test European HD2?

OK things are starting to get weird. I received a negative answer from HTC's customer support but then I found USA T-mobile G1 users that reported their phones were working on 2100 MHz 3G in Europe (G1 like US T-mobile version of HD2 only supports 1700/2100 MHz 3G). I need to buy a phone and these contradictory reports leave me confused

Here is what T-mobile says in the specs sheet of the new HD2:
Band (frequency): 850 MHz;900 MHz;1800 MHz;1900 MHz;UMTS: Band I (2100);UMTS: Band IV (AWS);UMTS: Band IV (1700/2100)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Isn't it interesting that 2100 Mhz is listed both separately and in with combintaion with 1700 Mhz?

JohnQ said:
actually i asked HTC CS before, and the answer is NO!
european countries WCDMA frequencies are the same with ASIAN countries. So no chance for European countries either.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nice email address you have in that picture John

I tested my unlocked TMOUS HD2 in Sweden using 3's network and worked like a charm in 3G

Bit of a bump here as I'm trying to use my unlocked US T-Mobile HD2 with Orange in France and I can't do better than Edge (it went down to GPRS at one point...). I guess it could come down to spotty reception but I do get 3G speeds in my current location with an iPhone 3GS so I'm not so sure...
I'm using the AmericanAndroid ROM, maybe that's why my speed is throttled ;-)

I am using HD2 T-mobile in Serbia and i have no problem with conection or data speed.
I was on vacation and i didnt use Wifi ,and i used the phone all the time on 3G - the 3G network is incredibly fast, I even think that it is twice as fast as the EU HD2, which I used before..

Thanks, will check again then, maybe bad reception then!

[Q] Using the phone on another carrier

I am planning to buy MT4G, unlock it and use it on another carrier with compatible frequencies of course. Will I be still able to get updates using for example a wifi connection? or should I download updates manually? Is there something that I will lose when I use the phone on another carrier ?

I don't know if you mean overseas or in any place other than the U.S. but the only "compatible" carrier for this phone besides T-Mobile is AT&T. The reason why compatible is in quotes is because yes the phone would function and make calls on that network, but you will lose 3G and HSPA+ service as AT&T's equivalents operate on a different and incompatible spectrum.
I would also assume that you would not receive OTA updates either.

unremarked said:
I don't know if you mean overseas or in any place other than the U.S. but the only "compatible" carrier for this phone besides T-Mobile is AT&T. The reason why compatible is in quotes is because yes the phone would function and make calls on that network, but you will lose 3G and HSPA+ service as AT&T's equivalents operate on a different and incompatible spectrum.
I would also assume that you would not receive OTA updates either.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Overseas, on a network that is compatible with regard to GSM/ UMTS frequencies. So the only way to get updates is to download them from forums like this one?

raeef said:
Overseas, on a network that is compatible with regard to GSM/ UMTS frequencies. So the only way to get updates is to download them from forums like this one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know for absolute certain, but I'm 95% sure you wouldn't recieve OTA since it goes out over the network your phone is connected to.
You can usually snag the update from here, but unfortunately, a lot of people didn't run aLogcat to log the download and get the link. Including myself, though I'm trying now with my second device.

unremarked said:
I don't know for absolute certain, but I'm 95% sure you wouldn't recieve OTA since it goes out over the network your phone is connected to.
You can usually snag the update from here, but unfortunately, a lot of people didn't run aLogcat to log the download and get the link. Including myself, though I'm trying now with my second device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Another question, does anyone know if this device works on UMTS band I 2100 ( 2100/1900)? I really can't make up my mind because it's not clear on T mobile website. It says UMTS 1700/2100/AWS and this looks like it's referring only to UMTS IV

raeef said:
Another question, does anyone know if this device works on UMTS band I 2100 ( 2100/1900)? I really can't make up my mind because it's not clear on T mobile website. It says UMTS 1700/2100/AWS and this looks like it's referring only to UMTS IV
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The phone is compatible with almost every gsm band the specs are:
GSM 850 / 900 / 1800 / 1900
HSDPA/HSUPA 900 / 1700 / 2100
In the US most carriers are using GSM 850/1900 and 3G 1700/2100 you will only get OTA from T-mobile in the US if you are using their cellphone service or you can hope and wait for the update to show up here on XDA in the forum.
http://www.worldtimezone.com/gsm.html
In Israel where I am, and England, France and Germany etc. the bands are
2G 900/1800 and 3G 2100
so you should have no problem using 3G or even 3g+ "4G" on this phone if your cell provider offers it. But it may require an advanced sim card or signing up for a special data service.
Dont get confused by the various terms (UMTS EDGE HSPA etc.) a phone that is guad-gsm and tri-3G will run the data services just fine but T-mobile will tell you we dont guarantee the data capabilities outside of our network... because they dont want lawsuits

mo976 said:
The phone is compatible with almost every gsm band the specs are:
GSM 850 / 900 / 1800 / 1900
HSDPA/HSUPA 900 / 1700 / 2100
In the US most carriers are using GSM 850/1900 and 3G 1700/2100 you will only get OTA from T-mobile in the US if you are using their cellphone service or you can hope and wait for the update to show up here on XDA in the forum.
In Israel where I am, and England, France and Germany etc. the bands are
2G 900/1800 and 3G 2100
so you should have no problem using 3G or even 3g+ "4G" on this phone if your cell provider offers it. But it may require an advanced sim card or signing up for a special data service.
Dont get confused by the various terms (UMTS EDGE HSPA etc.) a phone that is guad-gsm and tri-3G will run the data services just fine but T-mobile will tell you we dont guarantee the data capabilities outside of our network... because they dont want lawsuits
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually I am a telecom engineer so I know about the terms. You didn't get my question about the bands. Look here for example support.t-mobile.com/doc/tm24233.xml?&A2L.SERVICE=FeatureSummary
The listed Bands: 1 (2100) and 4 (AWS 1700/2100)
and that clearly shows that G2 supports 2 UMTS bands , 1 and 4
1 is 2100 paired with 1900 ( EU)
4 that is used by T mobile in the US.
So I am confused because on this page mytouch.t-mobile.com/mytouch-4g-features#/specs-and-manualsthey listed the bands like this
Bands 1700/2100/AWS that's why it's not clear for me if MT4G supports UMTS I or not.

This is the official reply from HTC when asked:
Dear ....,
I understand that you would like to know if your T-mobile Mytouch 4G device can use the 2100 MHZ band over in Europe for 3G. I do apologize your device is not compatible with the 2100 MHZ back over in Europe for 3G service. I do apologize for all the inconvenience that this may cause you.
To send a reply to this message or let me know I have successfully answered your question log in to our ContactUs site using your email address and your ticket number .....
Sincerely,
Victor
HTC
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

raeef said:
Actually I am a telecom engineer so I know about the terms. You didn't get my question about the bands. Look here for example support.t-mobile.com/doc/tm24233.xml?&A2L.SERVICE=FeatureSummary
The listed Bands: 1 (2100) and 4 (AWS 1700/2100)
and that clearly shows that G2 supports 2 UMTS bands , 1 and 4
1 is 2100 paired with 1900 ( EU)
4 that is used by T mobile in the US.
So I am confused because on this page mytouch.t-mobile.com/mytouch-4g-features#/specs-and-manualsthey listed the bands like this
Bands 1700/2100/AWS that's why it's not clear for me if MT4G supports UMTS I or not.
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Click to collapse
AWS is the data delivery method used only by Tmo in the US. So the 4G service may not work outside the US but according to the phone specs it states that it supports UMTS and GPRS/EDGE so it should support 3G UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ and gprs/edge for 2G everywhere. Ill test my HD (from England) when I get to new york in a day or so and see if I can get proper 3G speeds.
Todays smartphones are designed to be used worldwide with full service as much as possible.

AWS is just another name of UMTS band IV. This is the only UMTS band the MT4G supports, so you'll be able to use it for 3G on carriers that use this band. You can see the list of bands and operators that use them here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UMTS_frequency_bands
In short, outside of the US, Canada, and Chile you're out of luck for 3G. You'd be able to use 2G fine though.

athakur999 said:
AWS is just another name of UMTS band IV. This is the only UMTS band the MT4G supports, so you'll be able to use it for 3G on carriers that use this band. You can see the list of bands and operators that use them here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UMTS_frequency_bands
In short, outside of the US, Canada, and Chile you're out of luck for 3G. You'd be able to use 2G fine though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is really confusing, look at this page http://support.t-mobile.com/doc/tm24243.xml?&A2L.SERVICE=FeatureSummary

mo976 said:
AWS is the data delivery method used only by Tmo in the US. So the 4G service may not work outside the US but according to the phone specs it states that it supports UMTS and GPRS/EDGE so it should support 3G UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ and gprs/edge for 2G everywhere. Ill test my HD (from England) when I get to new york in a day or so and see if I can get proper 3G speeds.
Todays smartphones are designed to be used worldwide with full service as much as possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Frequency bands differ for different technologies on the same phone. For example there are 2 versions of Nexus one one for ATT and one for T mobile although they work on GSM level because the support both GSM bands on T mobile and ATT but not the UMTS bands on both networks. UMTS and GSM frequencies are not necessarily the same for each network and most probably they won't be the same. In my country we licensed 3G services ( UMTS) on 2100 band or UMTS 1 . GSM on 900 and 1800 only.

Can someone provide me with the FCC id from the back of the phone ?
I tired to search for it on the web but I don't think what I found was the correct one.

Update
I went to T-mobile store today, the guy was helpful and he printed out the official full technical specifications for the device that he pulled out and here what I got:
3G/UMTS Bands
Band I / UMTS2100 Yes
Band II / 1900 No
Band IV 1700/2100/AWS Yes
Band V/850 No
Band VII/ 900 No
The page was titled " Enablers" and listed specs for GSM and UMTS bands with their features. So I think this ends it for me, it does support both bands I and IV.

mo976 said:
AWS is the data delivery method used only by Tmo in the US. So the 4G service may not work outside the US but according to the phone specs it states that it supports UMTS and GPRS/EDGE so it should support 3G UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ and gprs/edge for 2G everywhere. Ill test my HD (from England) when I get to new york in a day or so and see if I can get proper 3G speeds.
Todays smartphones are designed to be used worldwide with full service as much as possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did it work with you in 3G speed in England ?

Good luck but I've taken my nexus one all over the planet... you'll get 3g in the countries listed above plus Japan (softbank only) but I haven't gotten 3g anywhere else....
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App

raeef said:
I am planning to buy MT4G, unlock it and use it on another carrier with compatible frequencies of course. Will I be still able to get updates using for example a wifi connection? or should I download updates manually? Is there something that I will lose when I use the phone on another carrier ?
Click to expand...
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@OP: have you gotten the MT4G to work with UMTS Band I frequencies?

I got the update by only using my friend's t-mobile sim card, I think I got it via wifi since he doesn't have data plan.
unremarked said:
I don't know if you mean overseas or in any place other than the U.S. but the only "compatible" carrier for this phone besides T-Mobile is AT&T. The reason why compatible is in quotes is because yes the phone would function and make calls on that network, but you will lose 3G and HSPA+ service as AT&T's equivalents operate on a different and incompatible spectrum.
I would also assume that you would not receive OTA updates either.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App

3G would not work in Europe, correct?

Hi, Just making sure this phone's 3G bands wouldn't work in W. Europe's 3G 2100 bands. Can anyone confirm? AWS is 1700/2100, which I think is upload/download. AFAIK, you would need the phone to do both upload and download in the 2100 region.

This phone works perfectly fine in europe on 3g.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App

apple_g said:
This phone works perfectly fine in europe on 3g.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What makes you say that? Not that I know for sure either way, but I've just seen answers going in either direction. Some say yes, some no.
Here's what I know:
Most of W. Europe uses 3G 2100 (perhaps a little 900?).
This phone has bands listed as 1700/AWS/2100.
This phone uses Band IV (T-Mobile) which uses both 1700 and 2100 (one for upload and one for download I think).
When the phone is listed as "1700/AWS/2100", does that mean it will do both AWS *and* 1700 upload/download *and* 2100 upload/download? If so, then I'm golden. But, I think this phone only does AWS, meaning that one of the bands is dedicated to one data direction only, i.e. one upload and the other download. So, I'm inclined to believe it wouldn't work on 3G in Europe.

It DOES WORK in Europe!
The phone DOES work in Europe. I used it in Norway in December, France and Portugal in January.
The thing is be very careful no to roam data or it is going to cost you a fortune!!!
If you must roam data, take a look at http://xcomglobal.com/. I used their MiFI and simply loved it!
Hope this helps,
Q

Q.Entity said:
The phone DOES work in Europe. I used it in Norway in December, France and Portugal in January.
The thing is be very careful no to roam data or it is going to cost you a fortune!!!
If you must roam data, take a look at http://xcomglobal.com/. I used their MiFI and simply loved it!
Hope this helps,
Q
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the reply, but did you see the H icon then, and not just the E icon while in Europe? I realize that EDGE/GPRS would work just fine for data, but 3G is still in question. Even HTC says this phone, which is equipped only with AWS (Band IV), will not work in Europe for 3G data. I'm moving to Europe soon, and I'd just as soon sell it here before I leave. Thanks...

WHat I remember is seeing an R icon to warn me about the roaming. I turn the data off almost immediately so I did not pay much attention to it. I am not back in Europe until the first week in March. I guess by then you will know the answer...

In Europe ... data not working w/ Euro SIM card
I'm in Germany with an unlocked MT4G and, while the calling feature works, the data/internet package does not. Per the carrier here (Tchibo/O2), they use the 1800 band which to my knowledge IS supported by the device.
Any ideas of why this isn't working would be appreciated ... of course more appreciated would be any ideas for a solution.
Cheers,

The phone works fine with AWS and 2100 bands.
AWS is 1700 MHz band.
The device ONLY supports AWS and 2100. It doesn't support 1800 (which doesn't even exist) or 1900 or any other bands.

This phone is quad band for voice and GPRS/EDGE data - meaning 800, 1900 for N. America and 900, 1800 for Europe. It does not support the 2100 3G band as found in Europe. 3G is only supported over the AWS band in N. America, which is *both* 1700 and 2100 simultaneously.
EDIT: It appears that the specs on this phone are somewhat ambiguous. The phone supports "1700/2100/AWS". It's not clear whether the phone supports BOTH Band I (Europe 2100) and Band IV (N. America 1700/2100). There are very sporadic reports that 3G does indeed work in Europe, and hence, Band I. There are other reports to the contrary. It could be that one group is right and one is wrong, and it could also be that there are multiple batches.

floepie said:
This phone is quad band for voice and GPRS/EDGE data - meaning 800, 1900 for N. America and 900, 1800 for Europe. It does not support the 2100 3G band as found in Europe. 3G is only supported over the AWS band in N. America, which is *both* 1700 and 2100 simultaneously.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please set your facts straight / upgrade your knowledge.
AWS is using frequencies in 1700-ish and 2100-ish MHz range.
But:
2100 MHz is a separate band, found in Europe, as well as in most of the world.
It's supported by this phone, regardless of AWS.
I'm using it RIGHT NOW.
And it happens to be fully functional.
When phone specs refer to frequency, they actually refer to an operating band name.
MT4G technical specs state that it supports 1700 and 2100 bands - which are IV and I, respectively.
Thus, it works in Europe, using band I.
And I'm only referring to UMTS bands, not GSM.

Jack_R1 said:
Please set your facts straight / upgrade your knowledge.
AWS is using frequencies in 1700-ish and 2100-ish MHz range.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice edit! Looks like you've upgraded yourself too.
Jack_R1 said:
I'm using it RIGHT NOW.
And it happens to be fully functional.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
...while others claim otherwise. See my "edit" above.
Jack_R1 said:
When phone specs refer to frequency, they actually refer to an operating band name.
MT4G technical specs state that it supports 1700 and 2100 bands - which are IV and I, respectively.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wikipedia isn't so great for supporting evidence. Also doesn't explain why the manufacturer lists the 3G specs as "1700/2100/AWS". The AWS is both ambiguous and redundant if the above were true.

floepie said:
Nice edit! Looks like you've upgraded yourself too.
...while others claim otherwise. See my "edit" above.
Wikipedia isn't so great for supporting evidence. Also doesn't explain why the manufacturer lists the 3G specs as "1700/2100/AWS". The AWS is both ambiguous and redundant if the above were true.
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Click to collapse
Yes, edited the post. My problem - sometimes the urge to make sure I'm not writing bullstuff occurs after I actually write some
I'll explain the sporadic reports: at least in part of Europe, the coverage is 900/2100 bands and not only 2100 band. In these cases, phones like Nexus One would work, but Mytouch 4G wouldn't. There is another Wikipedia link, list of UMTS carriers with their bandwidth, and you can see which countries are "affected". I remember for sure that France is.
Very few people are credible sources for reports.
First Google result for "Mytouch 4G specs":
http://mytouch.t-mobile.com/mytouch-3g-slide-phone-specifications
UMTS: Yes; Bands: 1700/2100
I don't see any mention of AWS and 1700 in the same place as 2 different bands. And I don't believe that specs should be taken from other sites, that aren't hosting official data. They're definitely not so great for supporting evidence
The phone is 100% working with 2100 band.

Fair enough. Although, it states directly on the box ----> "1700/AWS/2100". Therein lies the ambiguity and/or redundancy.

hi,
would 3G work in the UK with this phone? O2 in Uk uses 2100 W-CDMA so would it work?
Does anyone have it in the UK?
sorry if this is a stupid question.

Aiex Rlder said:
hi,
would 3G work in the UK with this phone? O2 in Uk uses 2100 W-CDMA so would it work?
Does anyone have it in the UK?
sorry if this is a stupid question.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I use O2 in Ireland with my mt4g when I'm over there with no problems, however my O2 plan is pay as you go with no data so I cant comment on the data there.

I bought a one month PAYG data-only plan while in Sweden (Telia).
I was averaging 3-4mb downloads in areas where I got 3G reception (reception at my in-law's summer house, on the other hand, is a different matter).

I am going over to europe soon, i plan on just turning on wifi and starbucks hope all over faster than 3G

any more helpful insights anyone?

I believe you've got your answer.
The phone works with 2100 band, so you'll have 3G.