Database Users

Who would swap their athena for a smaller device with the exact same specs?

I just sold my athena, and got a touch enhanced. Same rom and ram, 1/3rd processor speed and no 3g are the main differences to me.
But, I was wondering, who would swap their athena for a kaiser or touch cruise if those devices had vga, making them basically the same specs as the athena.
Edit:
It seems that people wouldnt want a vga screen on a device with a small width in inches. I think this is really funny, because all people did when both the kaiser's and Touch Cruise's specs were finalised, was say how if only it was vga. But now I thnk about it, with realvga on my athena [96dpi], it was basically 4 hermes screens glues together, in terms of size and res. So, the text was about the same size on today as ti was n my hermes. But imagine real vga on a 2.8 screen, it would be like having 4 3cm by 2 cm screens glued together. Tiny writing. So i think you're right about the vga.
Rory

I would, but I can't stress enough how much I love the VGA screen. I have a TyTN as well and although the screen size is smaller, I can't stand the QVGA resolution

i imagine most would. I don't know why htc are so slow on the uptake with vga displays, they're hardly new technology. 800 by 480 would be better though

I would not swap my athena for anything but a higher spec upgrade. I would like something with the same size screen but true native vga resolution or above with more cpu and a gpu that can be used. For me the size is no problem and i love the keyboard. People stare at my athena all the time and i think it is funny. The only person that has commented negatively was the typical iphone user. But i shut him up when i told him my device specs My favorite thing to tell iphone users is can your phone do "copy and paste" then i just laugh at them. It seems that they might be fixing that in the next firmware release though. Anyway the athena is my first step into pda phones and i don't think i would be able to use anything else.

mcwtrekkie said:
I would, but I can't stress enough how much I love the VGA screen. I have a TyTN as well and although the screen size is smaller, I can't stand the QVGA resolution
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Dido.
It is to note that I had a TyTN before the Athena, that had been given to me as a replacement for a Universal. And:
- that was the worst replacement I got ever. To me, screen was too small and low-res --> no usable Internet or word processing, however basic --> no need for the integrated keyboard, however good it may have been + no need for Wifi --> too thick and big, as well as too expensive for its practical use;
- the universal screen is 3,5" and VGA, and even if I am lucky to have excellent eyesight, I found it the bottom limit for readability.
So.... I'm not entirely sure one can really make full use of a VGA+ screen if it is not at the very least 4", and again, *at the very least*.
IMHO, of course.

Hell...I did it!!
What can I say....did I go off the Athena? Never, but my needs changed and I needed to be able to use my all-in-one device as a normal phone, without running into trouble when I forgot to charge my BT headset.
...So I ditched and got the Kaiser. Love the Kaiser even with its hardware driver issues, but I miss that large VGA display. There is nothing like it.
Having said that, that's all I miss. This thing is pocket friendly and with the exception of TV-Out (which I never really use) and the VGA screen, the Kaiser does it all.
Each to their own I guess. But I'll never have a bad word to say about the Athena....she'll always be my baby, lol. She's just too darn big to take out in public. ROFL.

Yeah i ditched too, after only 3 weeks, ive moved on to the tiny touch 256. I love my athena, and i dont want to send it off to its new home in italy, but i dont need it, and my mum's quite happy that i made 130 quid today. I think i will miss the massive screen, its area is about 3 times the touch's.
But i dont drive, so sont need gps, dont use tv out, and the touch at only 201 mhz wont make use of the hsdpa, and at school on both tytn and athena, i usually get 3g max, hardly ever hsdpa.
But theres my reasons for switching.
Oh yer, and because it couldnt make calls [check my sig]
x

No, I won't settle for a screen less than 4.5 inch big. realvga is useless for a 3.5 inch vga screen even at 128dpi.
I also hate having the integrated hardware keyboard. I'm a tablet person, loving Tengo very much.
I don't find Athen any less portable than say a Universal. I carry it without keyboard on my belt pouch, covered by my shirt so you don't even know or see me carry it.

well, before my athena i was using a mio a701 for like a year. it was quite a change because prior to that i was using an xda2i...which had a bigger screen. and switching over to the mio took some getting used to.
but now that i have a 5 inch screen it's so difficult to even think of switching back to a device with a smaller screen. i already upgraded the rom to ak 3.0 and it's the best ever. besides, the large screen is a good pacifier for my 3 year old when she want's to watch toons =)
cheers

why choose? I have both a touch, a tytn II and an Athena. My girlfriend uses the touch.. I use the Athena with a style-I in the car, as a gps, movie player or wherever i need to do work which involves browsing, excel and typing up large text bodies. Using style-i and Microsoft voice command I rarely take it out in public to make a call. The Athena is my best phone ever! The tytn II is a great side kick. Awesome keyboard for fast smses, putting in pim, even though the camera sucks, I still use it sometimes just to make a quick shot (hardly ever use the Athena camera as the quality just doesnt weigh up for the size) I even use the world card reader occasionally. Must say that I don't like browsing with the Tytn II, but it's still handy to have the chance to check some info etc in case my Athena is not close by.
in case of the Polaris, or an old universal for that matter, a 3,5 inch VGA screen is not big enough for my needs, (don't even think I would like a 4" screen) so if I had to choose, hypothetically speaking, I would still go for Athena

The large screen and internet anywhere (especially at 3G speeds) were the biggest reasons I bought it, so no, I wouldn't go back to a smaller screen even if most of the other specs on the other phone were better.

rorydaredkign said:
I just sold my athena, and got a touch enhanced. Same rom and ram, 1/3rd processor speed and no 3g are the main differences to me.
But, I was wondering, who would swap their athena for a kaiser or touch cruise if those devices had vga, making them basically the same specs as the athena.
Edit:
It seems that people wouldnt want a vga screen on a device with a small width in inches. I think this is really funny, because all people did when both the kaiser's and Touch Cruise's specs were finalised, was say how if only it was vga. But now I thnk about it, with realvga on my athena [96dpi], it was basically 4 hermes screens glues together, in terms of size and res. So, the text was about the same size on today as ti was n my hermes. But imagine real vga on a 2.8 screen, it would be like having 4 3cm by 2 cm screens glued together. Tiny writing. So i think you're right about the vga.
Rory
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I have an Athena and love it. I also have a Kaiser (2), Universal, Hermes, Wizard and a couple of other phones. I could/would never switch. The Kaiser is not that impressive. Plus performance on the Kaiser sucks until the driver issue is resolved, etc. Kaisers are also dying left and right so reliability is not up to par. I was a little upset with my Athena due to a MicroDrive hardware issue but after hooking it up to my laptop using WMStorage and formatting the MD with Windows XP and running defrag/scandisk on it, I have not had any issues with it. Let's just see how long I have before experiencing another problem..if it ever happens again.

by the way, find these threads, trying to evaluate the quality of the Athena boring and unnecessary. I will stop posting on them I think...

[email protected] said:
by the way, find these threads, trying to evaluate the quality of the Athena boring and unnecessary. I will stop posting on them I think...
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Not sure what you're trying to tell everyone but ok. Take care.

ltxda said:
Not sure what you're trying to tell everyone but ok. Take care.
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there are already many threads about what people think about the Athena. I think people keep it when they like and sell it if not.

[email protected] said:
there are already many threads about what people think about the Athena. I think people keep it when they like and sell it if not.
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Gotcha. Crystal clear.

[email protected] said:
there are already many threads about what people think about the Athena. I think people keep it when they like and sell it if not.
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absolutely a good point. Smaller devices with with equivalent specification but smaller vga screen already exist. If there are so many voting yes but don't actually do it in action, something doesn't make sense.

My name is telling you my answer
The big screen is THE reason.
I've installed realVGA and use the 96dpi resolution. My GOD! I can't believe what I'm seeing. For once, a real workable work horse can be carried around. My previous phones does not let me see enough. The only problem I have is the keyboard. It's too small, even if I chose the big key option. Is there a way to make the keyboard standard size?

athenalover get lost. learn something on xda-wiki instead.

[email protected] said:
athenalover get lost. learn something on xda-wiki instead.
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Sorry, I'm still in the honeymoon period..I'd take my time, not in a hurry.
Joking. Your point taken. Thanks Martin.

Anything similar to Athena?

Is there any device in market or coming soon similar to Athena?
Important features included:
large screen (5" or above)
under $1000
long battery life
instant on
wifi, gps
weight about 1 lb
It should have more than one in this market segment.
Thanks!

Where have you been? Look at it's successor HTC Advantage X7510: http://www.digitalburn.com/index.php/2008/05/21/review-of-htcs-x7510-advantage/
...

alui said:
Is there any device in market or coming soon similar to Athena?
Important features included:
large screen (5" or above)
under $1000
long battery life
instant on
wifi, gps
weight about 1 lb
It should have more than one in this market segment.
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good question. I'm looking for it too. I was hoping that 7510 was going to be it, but no. It was a step backward instead of forward, from my perspective and based on the way I'm going to use it.
I would add FM radio, support High Capacity external memory cards, 5MB camera, fluid video recorder, television, more rounded and thinner than 7500/7510.
I would like it to maintain the existing aspect ratio and not move toward 480x800 for the sake of software compatibility. No thanks, I don't want a 2.8" screen.
As you can see, there is none in the market that meets my dream list. So I guess I'd be using my Athena for a long long time to come still.

alui said:
Is there any device in market or coming soon similar to Athena?
Important features included:
large screen (5" or above)
under $1000
long battery life
instant on
wifi, gps
weight about 1 lb
It should have more than one in this market segment.
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
question: All the things you've mentioned are included in the Athena, so why are you looking for something else????

Or if you don't mind a small screen and the absence of a keyboard, check out the Samsung Omnia: http://samsungomnia.com/
To be honest, if this had a better screen size, I would not consider saving up for the X7510, but nothing beats the screen of the Athena and Advantage as of now.
...

cktlcmd said:
Or if you don't mind a small screen and the absence of a keyboard, check out the Samsung Omnia: http://samsungomnia.com/
To be honest, if this had a better screen size, I would not consider saving up for the X7510, but nothing beats the screen of the Athena and Advantage as of now.
...
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Indeed. You'd really appreciate Athena's (big) size when you're using e-reader program, pdf file viewer, SoftMakers (when in 92dpi especially), and internet browsing. You can see those otherwise too tiny fonts.

eaglesteve said:
Indeed. You'd really appreciate Athena's (big) size when you're using e-reader program, pdf file viewer, SoftMakers (when in 92dpi especially), and internet browsing. You can see those otherwise too tiny fonts.
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I am dying in waiting here... for the X7510. On The Go Solutions will have it in stock by tomorrow. I keep holding back because I am waiting for the price of the X7500 (brand new) to drop to at least $900. If I can't control myself, I'll be buying the X7510 by next week. But before I order, I still want to know that they have it in stock, because the release date keeps moving back.
I even purchased ahead of time the following: Brando Workshop's Ultra clear screen protector, LG HBM 700 BT Communicator, heck... I even ordered a customized belt holster from Nutshell in Horizontal Style that houses both the case and the X7510 with keyboard. I had to make sure I didn't messed up on the size specifications I provided, so I waited for some reviews to confirm it. I guess we'll know in a few days.
...

For my the Athena is the best device today even compared with with the newer devices about to be released, HTC had the chance to get out a much better device with the 7510 but they didn't deliver.
In my opinion the only better thing is they doubled the amount of memory to 16gb and that is solid state rather than a hard disk, so what (8GB micro SDs cost peanuts this days and 16gb will soon be out there) but not joypad or buttons.
I want my next device with a proper graphics chip and the most sensitive gps chip out there and a camera that actually deliver even in poor light conditions
I want the OS and applications as good as those made by Apple or better and for gods sake Athena it is a VGA device, I want VGA working out of the box.
a little more ram will hep too ( for speed) and the phone function should work flawless at all times.
transflective LCD screen any one?
those are the issues that if solved will make a difference to my, and yea they can be solved the proof is this forum and excelent roms and apps.
Is anybody from HTC reading this?
said this I still convinced than Athena+XDA develoers hard work is the best device out there even after a year.
right, I feel much better now
oh yea good try with the new keyboard but not good enough.

i was reading this thread... and i had the urge to bump it up.
lol.
ciao!

HTC SHIFT? A bit Bigger... but loses some of the mobile capabilities and batt life?

Three months later and the answer to this thread is still the same - the 7500 or 7501 are still the best on the market. 7510 gives up too much, and nothing else on the market has the screen size, battery life, instant on, wifi, bt, etc.

For me, the replacement model is the HTC Touch HD.

Touch HD
I am also intrigued by the Touch HD, but I can't see on its spec page if it has VGA out. I use my Advantage to hook up to a projector and run PowerPoint. (Maybe I need a pocket sized projector that takes an SD card instead?)

touch hd lacks the hardware keyboard and gps, right? but atleast maybe they already fixed the graphic card issue in touch hd.

jetherson said:
touch hd lacks the hardware keyboard and gps, right? but atleast maybe they already fixed the graphic card issue in touch hd.
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They have not only gps but also A-gps.
Thank goodness there is no keyboard.

Athena screen size attracted me most, though its a little bulky.
Xperia X1 is my prefer choice, if it is 1 inch more.

eaglesteve said:
They have not only gps but also A-gps.
Thank goodness there is no keyboard.
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i see, i must have misread that gps thingy somewhere.

While Touch HD is the best replacement today, I'm still waiting for a 4.5 inch minimmum screen, with FM and TV and joystick. I don't mind not having the other hardware buttons but I really really want the joystick.
I prefer no keyboard personally. Just want the same form factor as the Touch HD.

I'm intrigued by the t-mob G1
http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/19/g1-appears-on-t-mobiles-site/

black--rider said:
HTC SHIFT? A bit Bigger... but loses some of the mobile capabilities and batt life?
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"a bit" bigger. nah, it is like several times bigger, i can take and post comparison photos
the truth is, while the shift is really small for a vista pc, the athena is incredibly small. (just don't compare it to normal phones )

Touch HD vs Toshiba TG01

this is a proper contender for the touch hd. it uses the latest snapdragon processor. tell me what you think guys. is the hd better than this Toshiba TG01

The Toshiba TG01 is not even out yet, so how could anyone know? Only thing I could say about it is that the screen seems a little bit too big to carry it around in your pocket.

i tell you what, this year is WM6.5/WM7 device year, how could you buy a still-a-wm6.1 device 2009? after a half year, WM7 device will come out, so TG01 is just born in a wrong time.

Winmo 7 won't be out untill end of 2009 and will probably be avaible on devices well after to 2010. I don't even consider 6.5 a major make over either as I was not very impressed by it, most probably 6.5 going to be a free upgrade anyway, so why not. Only thing I don't like about the tg01 is that it is rather large, HD is just about manageable to me, but the tg01 adds another centimeter to it.

The Tosh looks like the bezel is a bit too substantial. Given that 4.1" is already a bit chunky, it's a bit too big for my liking.

arfster said:
The Tosh looks like the bezel is a bit too substantial. Given that 4.1" is already a bit chunky, it's a bit too big for my liking.
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Agree that it will be too big with a 4.1" screen, especially as there is a lot of "surround" above and below the screen. The pics that compare it with the Iphone (similar size to HD) makes it look huge.

I will wait and see.
But, I had a Toshiba G900 which was rubbish !! I forget all the problems but I remember the screen was very poor quality - impossible to read in bright interior lights (let alone day light !!) and the operating system was really badly unstable. I suspect they have fixed the OS by now.
Let's hope they bring out that big screen in a super clear and readable way !

the hd has hit the limit in size for me
that fone shares more with a tabletpc than a pdaphone, well size wise anyways

I've had nokia tablet n810 which has the screen size 4.13" which is almost the same as the new toshiba. I got a tell you, I can't image using it as a phone.
HD feels just right..

From a technical side, it looks really nice.
However, I think Toshiba just stepped out of the boundaries of what most people consider to be acceptable in terms of size. Yes, the phone is a bit thinner then HD, but so much bigger in all other directions. One of the key features of HD when it was discussed in media was that it had the same size as iPhone but much better feature set and much better screen.
I would always choose a thicker device with smaller pocket footprint then other way around. I hope the build quality will be able to hold pressure of everyday use.
On a side note, my first thought when reading the specifications was "what kind of battery will be able to cope with 1 gHz power-hungry processor".
Other obvious minuses are small-resolution camera, with no flash. Can't understand why they left it out on Touch HD, and now Toshiba lowers the resolution and leaves the flash out. Someone in Toshiba development should really start paying attention to what people want.

Don't get me wrong.... I love my HD but the TG01 looks hot to me. I'm not put off by the slightly bigger device because it is so thin and with my older eyes the 4.1" will make a difference. As far as the tech specs... the neat thing about the snapdragon is its ability to slow its clock down for better battery life automatically... so you get the 1Gz goodness when you want it without paying the "gas" bill on the battery when you don't. Don't forget the awesome graphics co-processor loaded on this bad boy as well... more powerful than a PSP and able to leap tall building in a single bound! (How did that slip in? - but I digress)... The best news for me is that it is a WIMO machine when means I get all the flexibilty of WIMO and all the warts (good for us software developers... gives us jobs )
It also looks like an interesting scroll bar control on the front... not quite a DPAD but better than what my HD has.

Hmmmm - wait and see, but looking at this baby in pocketpcthoughts and msmobile I think it exceed the comfortable size limits for me.
The new CPU sounds great but I'm concerned about the battery pack. Anyone seen specs on that - I think we need a pack double the capacity of the HD to make me confident of getting at least a day out of this Toshiba.
Now, an HD that is 3 mm thick - that sounds more like it !!

OK
Having now viewed the vid at http://www.engadget.com on this I'm fairly convinced it is just too big for a pocket/belt/shirt device.
The new interface looks like fun but I suspect it has the same flaws as TF3D - really very pretty but lacking in functions.
I'm waiting for "whitestone" ...

device looks awesome, am sure it will be snappier and will likely resolve the endless graphic rendering problems we have on our htc's.. but without a 3.5 mm jack this thing is useless as a multimedia device

For me even HD is little too big, which is why I still use my Diamond pretty often (I have multisim so same number on 2 SIM cards).
I believe it will be nice looking and powerfull but I see few faults:
1st. large 4.1" RESISTIVE screen == very weak
2nd. no 3.5mm audio output
3rd. Lower MP camera and no flash
4th. Cant be large capacity battery because of it is so thin. (Could be Li-Pol) but still it must be very thin.

TG01 ? oh no... I prefer th Touch HD for the moment...
TG01 has bad resolution camera (3.15 MP) and no video call capabilities !
tunppi said:
For me even HD is little too big, which is why I still use my Diamond pretty often (I have multisim so same number on 2 SIM cards).
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But for me my Diamond is little too small, which is why I still use my Touch HD pretty often

I agree the TG01 is too big.
I reckon it's too big to wrap you hand around comfortably for one handed thumb operation. Imagine having to operate this phone with two hands all the time.
Maybe too big to fit some pockets.
THD / iPhone is about the largest L x W I'm willing to go.
Also no support from XDA. The biggest

Rozenthal said:
Other obvious minuses are small-resolution camera, with no flash. Can't understand why they left it out on Touch HD, and now Toshiba lowers the resolution and leaves the flash out.
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Lowering the resolution is a good thing, it'll take better pictures at this sensor size due to less noise problems. That's why they've done it.
5 megapixels is way too many for a phone, and thus the HD's camera is rubbish.

agreed.. 5 megapixels is ridiculous for a sensor of that size and the proof is in the poor quality of the pictures taken by the hd. i think you'd find that the pictures would look better on the toshiba (if they do the job properly.. pictures taken on se's and samsungs certainly do). it's the size of the phone that's the issue for me..

also agree that 3 megapixels is way better than 5 megapixels on these devices! as for the size this toshiba is way to big for one hand operation...

HTC Touch Pro 2, or HTC Touch HD?

Hey guys new member of the forum i will soon be getting a new phone and it will be either the Touch Pro 2 or the Touch HD. I'm not sure which one to get as i can live without a hardware keyboard which makes the device slimmer and easier to hold, but the question is what is the difference between the 2 phones? are they running the exact same software with the same features etc etc? if they operate exactly the same the HD looks nicer in my opinion, this will be my first time owning a windows mobile, will both phones get the same updates/custom roms. Other peoples opinions on these phones would be a great help, thanks in advance.
Sorry if this is not the correct section to be posting this.

If it was me, I'd maybe hold out for the HTC Leo, the HD's successor
Another thread which is kinda similar regarding people asking what to get after the HD maybe worth a read

thanks for your reply i will have a read of that, the issue is my contract runs out soon and the Leo doesn't yet have a release date and will be getting a new phone the day my contract runs out as i can't get through the day without my phone lol.

Isn't much difference apart from the qwerty keyboard, screen size, D-pad and camera. Generally everything else is similar. Check both the specs and read the wiki for both devices, have a look at the rom forums on both to see whats available.
It would most likely come down what you want, or what your looking for in a device. Basically personal opinion.

TP2 every day in the week.

thanks for the feedback guys. Well i prefer a slightly bigger screen and a slimmer looking phone and find the TP2 to be a little bulky, but if the software is the same this helps a lot as i like the look of the software from the TP2 which will be the same on the HD.
ArtieQ said:
TP2 every day in the week.
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could you maybe give some reasons on your view on why this would be the best choice? Thanks

The HD .. Huge screen .. and um... rather slim and cute looking .. I have a black silicone suround for it and mirror suraface.... and a huge screen with a huge resoultion .. did I mention that?

dgattenb said:
The HD .. Huge screen .. and um... rather slim and cute looking .. I have a black silicone suround for it and mirror suraface.... and a huge screen with a huge resoultion .. did I mention that?
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Huge screen, but huge screen means less pixels = less quality. TP2 got a huge advantage when it comes down to screen resolution vs. HD. And the TP2 got a keyboard and 4 hardware buttons you can actually feel.

ArtieQ said:
Huge screen, but huge screen means less pixels = less quality. TP2 got a huge advantage when it comes down to screen resolution vs. HD.
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You're kidding, right? TP2 and HD both have WVGA - you're not seriously telling me that the pixel density on the HD is not high enough? I doubt you could even tell the difference between the two concerning DPI!
And I'd rather have a larger screen than a smaller one - even if the higher DPI would make a difference... What's the use of having a higher DPI on a smaller screen?

Hd is better in music as it has 3.5 mm audio jack which means better sound quality and also hd is higher in price (the only issue is that hd will not get wm6.5 officially from htc ) but i think it will but htc does not announce that to sell alot of the recent devices

hoss_n2 said:
Hd is better in music as it has 3.5 mm audio jack which means better sound quality and also hd is higher in price (the only issue is that hd will not get wm6.5 officially from htc ) but i think it will but htc does not announce that to sell alot of the recent devices
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I have a Touch HD, although it is in for repairs at the moment, and would consider the TP2 but the lack of a headphone jack is killing me. I live in the US and have not had a chance to play with the TP2. I have AT&T which I am assuming will not have the headphone jack like the Sprint and Verizon (CDMA) model has, Lucky Bastards!!! Anyway, that is what will probably stop me from getting the TP2.
I am sure there will be other options with a headphone jack in the future since HTC has made it clear that most future devices will have them. TP3?? I think they are a little sore from the lashing they took for not putting it in the TP2 which is clearly a great multimedia device. Kida like buying some of the original flat panel tv's that didn't have a TV tuner or speakers. Kinda defeats the purpose.

Well I personally recomend the Touch HD (not only for the reason that I have it and I love it ) when I was choosing my device I was looking for the bigest screen on the market as I like browsing the internet a lot and let me say this BIGGER IS BETTER when we are talking about PPC's nothing can change that also you get a cool design that gets the "WOW" effect from anyone and your pants will not fall to the ground when you are carying it in your pocket.It really depends on the person but for me if I have two phones with almost equal specifications I'll go for the bigger screen even if it is 0,1 inches bigger than the other one.Leo is probably my next device but I heard great things about TOSHIBA's TG01 4.1 inch monster with 1ghz proccessor that's only 10mm thick if you can get your hands on that (it's available in some areas) I would recommend that.

If you are only using one phone I would get the TP2. As I already have the E71 for emails etc I ordered the Touch HD yesterday as a semi tablet.

if it were me, id let my contract run out, continue using the service with your old phone until Leo is released, then upgrade if your carrier runs with the leo, if it doesnt id then upgrade to the most expencive phone they offer then leaving it in its box id flog it on ebay an use the money to buy the leo...
just my thoughts

HD2 Issues

i think the HD2 is an amazing piece of hardware and its clearly better than any other competing product in the coming few months. i do however hate a few things about it:
1-the lack of front camera for 3G video calls. while i may not care a lot about video calls i imagine that many will be missing it.
2-i see no point of releasing a separate delayed hardware revision for US market. especially when you consider that the rest of the world version lacks the front camera just like every other US phone. the Acer F1(another 1 GHZ 3G phone) has been available for a while and it supports US 3G bands on the same hardware and it even has the front camera.
3- considering that its the best multimedia phone made by HTC, its lacking the TV-out and the FM-Radio transmitter and better camera(all of which are supported by the N97)
4- the included 512MB ROM is a joke. i know that it can be expanded with SD card. but extra flash on the device is always useful. the 1.5 year old Omnia had 8/16/24BG+microSD why cant this have it. adding 8 or 16 GB flash costs HTC almost nothing to add
5-lack of stylus: HTC patented the capacitive stylus but they didnt use it. i know the the screen is big enough to be very finger friendly. but its still windows mobile and some applications work need stylus (for example Pocket artist).
6- lack of hardware buttons (especially camera). i wish the added 2 or 3 buttons on the empty sides. WM will always make use of the hardware buttons
7-despite the very high specs, its still less than the minimum Windows mobile7 specs (which requires Tegra level graphics performance acceleration and bigger than integrated storage ) which means that it will not be
upgradeable to wm7.
8-i dont understand the 320+128MB. the dedicated 128MB for the low performing graphics chip seems pointless to me. if they are going to put all this memory there why didnt they allocate it to program memory.
9- i really love how HTC managed to make the device reasonably small considering the huge 4.3" screen. i still think that its physically too big for many people. the HD was not very pocket friendly and this one is even bigger. i wish the screen was 4.0" or even 3.8". considering their recent improved and more efficient designs, im sure HTC would have been able to even make it friendly for one hand use with a smaller screen.
10- im not too big on the new standard micro-USB connector. they should have at lest included the hard to find mini-USB to micro-USB adapter with it. everybody already has several mini-USB cables/chargers but ive never actually seen a micro USB yet.
11- they increased up the specs (and power usage i would assume) significantly from the first HD but they reduced the battery size from 1350 to 1250mah!!!. luckily the early reports are suggesting "acceptable" battery life

Only thing missing for me on the device is a decent camera. I don't mean HTC standard... I mean the best of Nokia, Samsung & Sony Ericsson. The original HD took terrible pictures and videos. I don't think there is much improvement in this area from previews and videos.
TV-Out would of been great but sadly missing.
I don't care about front camera because I hardly ever use video call.
It's probably more of a business centric device but with such a large screen it could have so easily been the ultimate work and pleasure phone.
I'm leaning towards the Nokia N900 (Linux) but still undecided.

Just some thoughts for your annoyances! (I currently own an Omnia too)
THE GRIZZ said:
1-the lack of front camera for 3G video calls. while i may not care a lot about video calls i imagine that many will be missing it.
3G has been around for a while with a front video camera, but I can truly say that I don't know a single person that actually uses it. It's a gimmick IMO.
2-i see no point of releasing a separate delayed hardware revision for US market. especially when you consider that the rest of the world version lacks the front camera just like every other US phone. the Acer F1(another 1 GHZ 3G phone) has been available for a while and it supports US 3G bands on the same hardware and it even has the front camera.
I don't see the point either - bit silly if you ask me.
3- considering that its the best multimedia phone made by HTC, its lacking the TV-out and the FM-Radio transmitter and better camera(all of which are supported by the N97)
FM what? It still bedazzles me that people listen to FM radio these days. Surely most people have unlimited internet now and like I just use internet radio. More stations! As for the TV-out, again, I don't see the point really. Personally I use my netbook/laptop/pc for plugging into a tv since they can play HD. I supposed it would be nice if you want to show off photos to friends but then we all have facebook these days anyway For me, not a sore exclusion.
4- the included 512MB ROM is a joke. i know that it can be expanded with SD card. but extra flash on the device is always useful. the 1.5 year old Omnia had 8/16/24BG+microSD why cant this have it. adding 8 or 16 GB flash costs HTC almost nothing to add
I love the additional 8GB of the Omnia, but I guess they have to keep costs down somewhere. I have a 16GB micro SD, but when are 24/32 going to be available? Anyone know?
5-lack of stylus: HTC patented the capacitive stylus but they didnt use it. i know the the screen is big enough to be very finger friendly. but its still windows mobile and some applications work need stylus (for example Pocket artist).
I think you can still use a stylus but you have to set it up to do so (I saw it in another post on here).
6- lack of hardware buttons (especially camera). i wish the added 2 or 3 buttons on the empty sides. WM will always make use of the hardware buttons
There is no excuse for extra buttons down the side, although it makes it a bit more sleek I guess. But it's not like it doesn't take photos, it's just a useablitly thing.
7-despite the very high specs, its still less than the minimum Windows mobile7 specs (which requires Tegra level graphics performance acceleration) which means that it will not be
upgradeable to wm7.
I'm not sure that's right is it? In that original Leo thread in the main board, wasn't it confirmed that it will be upgradable? I think it's remains a bit of an unknown at the moment. That said, will wm7 be complete in 12 months? Given M$'s history of keeping to their planned dates, I doubt it. I think cookers will make it happen anyway and if not, in 12 months it will be upgrade time. Did someone say HD3?!
8-i dont understand the 320+128MB. the dedicated 128MB for the low performing graphics chip seems pointless to me. if they are going to put all this memory there why didnt they allocate it to program memory.
This one I have no idea about. Maybe they have something clever up their sleeves?
9- i really love how HTC managed to make the device reasonably small considering the huge 4.3" screen. i still think that its physically too big for many people. the HD was not very pocket friendly and this one is even bigger. i wish the screen was 4.0" or even 3.8". considering their recent improved and more efficient designs, im sure HTC would have been able to even make it friendly for one hand use with a smaller screen.
Well lets look at the iPhone. It's a huge seller. The HD2 is only a couple of mm's wider and taller so I don't see anyone is going to see it as an issue when they put it in their hands.
10- im not too big on the micro-USB connector. they should have at lest included the hard to find mini-USB adapter with it. everybody already has several mini-USB cables/chargers but ive never actually seen a micro USB yet.
I totally disagree here. It's the new universal format. You won't have seen many yet because devices are JUST beginning to emerge with it (ie Omnia 2). Already it's working because Samsung usually have their own proprietary connector so to see them go universal is a fantastic step in the right direction. It would be blind of HTC not to follow. So yes, bin those old Mini-USB
11- they increased up the specs (and power usage i would assume) significantly from the first HD but they reduced the battery size from 1350 to 1250mah!!!. luckily the early reports are suggesting "acceptable" battery life
I really hope it can last at least one full day of decent usage without the requirement of a charge. Surely they wouldn't make this wonderful device then shoot themselves in the foot??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Anyway some good points there!

7-despite the very high specs, its still less than the minimum Windows mobile7 specs (which requires Tegra level graphics performance acceleration) which means that it will not be
upgradeable to wm7
I'm not sure that's right is it? In that original Leo thread in the main board, wasn't it confirmed that it will be upgradable? I think it's remains a bit of an unknown at the moment. That said, will wm7 be complete in 12 months? Given M$'s history of keeping to their planned dates, I doubt it. I think cookers will make it happen anyway and if not, in 12 months it will be upgrade time. Did someone say HD3?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is very likely WM7 will be out by mid to late next year. WM8 is already being discussed as I understand it and WM6 and 6.5 have been universally panned (and quite rightly).
So if you purchase the HD2 assuming it will be out of date in less than 10 months then all well but I suspect many will not be happy (including me). I don't mind spending extra bucks now to avoid doubling my investment by having to purchase two devices in the space of 10 months!
Do you have the link to the original "in the original Leo thread in the main board, wasn't it confirmed that it will be upgradable? "

add this to the list:
1. lack of full-fledged graphics drivers (3D)
2. lack of d-pad; or trackball like blackberrys

1) Front Camera - most people don't use them so not a big deal
2) Buy the Acer if you like it (have fun)
3) it has got an FM Radio onboard I believe
4) Memory could be better but its got an SD card so just by a 16gb card.
5) The point is you don't need a stylus - am I missing something. If you wannt a Stylus get an Omnia 2
6) The camera button could have been useful - but nobody knows if one of the front buttons cannot be used. Shall we wait till its been reviewed fully before we slag it off.
7) Its been clearly stated that the specs do not say "Tegra" only. Thats just not true. Makes me laugh that a phone with great 3d potential and dedicated memory like the HD2 is being slagged off for no reason.
8) The screen size is the best part of the phone - it can be used to watch video, surf the net, etc. So it has to be big to fit the screen - not an issue.
9) Micro-USB!! - You mean the defacto standard now.
10) Nobody knows about battery life yet so lets hold fire.
Why are you interested in the phone if non of its main selling points you like?

because despite its "limitations" its still a lot better than the rest now.
take a chill pill dude and try to tone-down the fanboiasm. our nitpicking will make it very easy for HTC to make the HD3 a better device. also by highlighting them so early in its life, it will make easy easy for its users to deal with its potential issues

Teneka_Khan said:
1) Front Camera - most people don't use them so not a big deal
2) Buy the Acer if you like it (have fun)
3) it has got an FM Radio onboard I believe
4) Memory could be better but its got an SD card so just by a 16gb card.
5) The point is you don't need a stylus - am I missing something. If you wannt a Stylus get an Omnia 2
6) The camera button could have been useful - but nobody knows if one of the front buttons cannot be used. Shall we wait till its been reviewed fully before we slag it off.
7) Its been clearly stated that the specs do not say "Tegra" only. Thats just not true. Makes me laugh that a phone with great 3d potential and dedicated memory like the HD2 is being slagged off for no reason.
8) The screen size is the best part of the phone - it can be used to watch video, surf the net, etc. So it has to be big to fit the screen - not an issue.
9) Micro-USB!! - You mean the defacto standard now.
10) Nobody knows about battery life yet so lets hold fire.
Why are you interested in the phone if non of its main selling points you like?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haved discovered that it does support WM7http://wmpoweruser.com/?p=7528 states
(QCOM 8k, Nvidia “Tegra” AP15/16* and TI 3430 all meet spec)
Qualcomm 8k = Snapdragon's QSD8xxx-series chips = Qualcomm Snapdragon QSD8250 (which is in the Leo).. so the processor should meet WM7 chassis 1 requirement.
To answer the FM radio question - the answer is YES
http://www.gsmarena.com/htc_hd2-2957.php
I agree with the comments above. There is no such thing as a perfect device but you have got to congratulate HTC on the HD2 being one of the closest to it.

alecs said:
I haved discovered that it does support WM7http://wmpoweruser.com/?p=7528 states
(QCOM 8k, Nvidia “Tegra” AP15/16* and TI 3430 all meet spec)
Qualcomm 8k = Snapdragon's QSD8xxx-series chips = Qualcomm Snapdragon QSD8250 (which is in the Leo).. so the processor should meet WM7 chassis 1 requirement.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The processor does, but the Chassis 1 spec also specifies at least 1GB of flash (and at least 512mb fast flash).
The HD2 only comes with 512mb internal memory.

Sc4Freak said:
The processor does, but the Chassis 1 spec also specifies at least 1GB of flash (and at least 512mb fast flash).
The HD2 only comes with 512mb internal memory.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
By 1GB of flash I believe that means available storage i.e. an SD card
Memory: 256MB+ DRAM, 1G+ Flash (at least 512MB fast flash – 5MB/s unbuffered read @4K block size)
I am not sure what fast flash means but these are minumum specs and doesn't mean the device can't run WM7, it may just lag in certain spots though somehow I doubt this thing will lag even on WM7

Is the specified 65k for the screen a hardware or software limitation? I know Windows Mobile 6.5 only supports 65k effective colors, but when WM 7 launches would the device be able to display more colors?

Toss3 said:
Is the specified 65k for the screen a hardware or software limitation? I know Windows Mobile 6.5 only supports 65k effective colors, but when WM 7 launches would the device be able to display more colors?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sure it does . they dont make "65K color display" !

Most mobile phone LCD screens are 262K colours (18-bit). (This includes many of the displays used on phones that are advertised as supporting 24-bit colour.)

manuelcalavera said:
sure it does . they dont make "65K color display" !
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But does anyone know the actual maximum bit-depth of the display?

The GRIZZ said:
3- considering that its the best multimedia phone made by HTC, its lacking the TV-out and the FM-Radio transmitter and better camera(all of which are supported by the N97)
FM what? It still bedazzles me that people listen to FM radio these days. Surely most people have unlimited internet now and like I just use internet radio. More stations! As for the TV-out, again, I don't see the point really. Personally I use my netbook/laptop/pc for plugging into a tv since they can play HD. I supposed it would be nice if you want to show off photos to friends but then we all have facebook these days anyway For me, not a sore exclusion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude theres a difference between FM Receiver and FM Transmitter. A FM Transmitter is important for those who own a car. The FM Transmitter can be used to transmit Music at a certain frequency which can be tuned to in the car using the Cars FM Radio!
The HD2 already has a FM Receiver. It might also support FM Transmission capabilities but that depends on which chip its using.
Video Out is certainly a welcome addon. Showing off Photos on a LCD is way better than telling them to login to Facebook! I for one will surely miss the TV Out.
Inspite of that, I consider these two features to be of very less importance when compared to the other feature set. This is the THE KILLER phone everyone was waiting for!

Prefer Touch HD over HD2
I agree with Grizzly on almost every point he's been making so far. Before I catch the flames too I shall start with a story...
My HP iPAQ was stolen from a payphone booth within one minute where I forgot it at an airport a year ago. This was my first real PDA and I was extraordinarily disappointed. I had racked up a lot of apps on it and and had even made the home screen sexy and easy to use with a few mods. Going from interfacing my custom cycles with the PCR machine (lab work) to playing old favourites like SimCity 2000 in lectures was great!
The next thing I obviously wanted was a PDA PHONE, so I didn't have to use a payphone booth again... so I got the Touch HD when it just came out in Oz from Telstra (who still sell it for $1500 - 215% markup). And it was absolutely perfect. Did everything, well supported by the community, and using it as a phone and an organizer that synced with outlook it worked a charm. Then last month getting a taxi back from the pub, I was left at a busway because the taxi driver who was fresh from India could not find my home as it wasn't on the GPS. Calling another taxi I got mugged for it while I was using it, snatched it from my hand. So now I was faced with having to get a new phone.
I have bought a Touch HD again. You see, the HD2 as fantastic as it is, is half way between being a traditional WM phone and an Android phone. Without the use of a stylus, how can you hand write down meeting notes? How can I use all my legacy games and applications? What's the point of having something a little zippier when the new manilla (which is a bit too busy) is going to be hacked onto the Touch HD anyway and it doesn't have the Tegra for true gaming pwnage or audiophile quality audio or a true camera replacement camera? Also the lack of 3G camera ticks me off too. I can't video call my parents in NZ which although is horrendously expensive, I enjoy doing on birthdays and so on - on special occasions we're often away from our computers.
What I am going to do is stick with my tried and tested HD and see if the HD2 has any advantage over the Dragon before I upgrade. Or even other non-HTC devices (god forbid) should they provide Audio/Graphics advantages. Because really the point of this thing is to replace the need to carry around other devices. Otherwise just get something that is only a phone, right?

I just found this vid, shows the games on it and well there is only 1 teeter! How could they cut solitaire and bubble breaker! What am i gonna waste time with now...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntZQ0iXzyvc&feature=player_embedded
Its @ about 2:45

THE GRIZZ said:
our nitpicking will make it very easy for HTC to make the HD3 a better device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very much so. HTC an enormous international company dedicated to producing a whole range of phones and mobile devices needs listen to random forum posters who can't even get their facts straight.
I'd like to take the opportunity to thank you for helping make the HD3 into the perfect device, derailing HTC's initial plans of improving the phone by removing the screen entirely and replacing it with a bar of soap. Your factual inaccuracies are making the mobile world a better place.

Since there is no dedicated off/on hardware ringer switch, is there a way to silence the phone while it is locked?

the volume rocker is normally used for something like that
mr_Ray said:
Very much so. HTC an enormous international company dedicated to producing a whole range of phones and mobile devices needs listen to random forum posters who can't even get their facts straight.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please spare us your fan-boyish drivel. What I mentioned in the OP are all valid concerns