I have recently purchased a Mugen 3000 mA battery. I am thrilled with the extended battery life after fully charging and discharging it three times as recommended by the manufacturer. What I find annoying is that WM6 no longer gives accurate information regarding remaining battery strength. If I run the battery down to 2%, remove the battery and restart WM6 says 37%. At 2% I can repeat and WM6 still says 37%. After running down to 2% a third time and repeating WM6 says around 10%. After that it varies a bit but you get the picture.
What I would like to know is if one of you geniuses out there has discovered a registry edit, hack or 3rd party software that will provide accurate battery info so I don't have to be distracted by having my battery say 2% for hours on end or repeatedly remove and restart.
BTW, BatteryStatus Ver. 1.04.200 beta2 build 0173 reports the same incorrect info and so does SPB Mobile Shell 1.5 Home Tab.
Thanks in advance for your informed guidance. OK, that is laying it on a bit thick but I always highly recommend this site to anyone I know interested in really learning how to take full advantage of that little computer in their pocket.
Take a search on XDA for Ariel monitor maybe it solves your problem.
Thanks for the suggestion. It is a nice little program but it suffers from the same problem. I suspect I need to find a way to change the mA capacity WM6 bases it's battery calculations. I don't know if that can be done with a registry edit or if there is a third party battery monitor that has an option to change the battery capacity for calculation of percentage remaining or better yet auto detects the actual battery capacity. Ideally it would be able to both accurately read remaining percentage and make reasonably accurate time remaining estimates based on current and historical battery drain data.
It is like driving a car with a broken gas gage. Sure, you can use the odometer to estimate how much gas you have left but you are always worried your estimate is off and you will be left stranded without a phone ... oops crossed metaphors.
How do the rest of the users with extended batteries handle this irritating situation?
Bump. I can't believe i'm the only one with this problem.
I know this problem also i will wait with buying a high capacy battery until i find such a hack
The Kaiser uses a smartbattery. The battery capacity is based on the information that a small processor inside the battery tells the phone's main processor. There are several things that could be the problem:
1. The small processor in the 3rd party battery is programmed with the old specs for the standard battery. The is nothing you could do about this.
2. The small processor needs to be calibrated. You would do this as follows; set your phone to never turn off no matter how low the battery got. Now, run the phone down until the thing dies from lack of power. Then charge it all the way up. This should fix that issue. I don't recomend doing it many times, because it is not good for Lion batteries to be fully discharged too often.
This is a very valid issue which I have faced many times when using a 3rd party extended battery with other phones.
Not sure how to solve it though, although I have the 3000mah on order myself.
I think the battery reading is given by the battery itself, and most of these 3rd party manufacturers don't really care to put a smart processor in the battery (to reduce costs/make it smaller/etc).
I have the exact same issue and although it is a nuisance, I have found a workaround to keep using the phone. Simply physically removing the battery and replacing it will increase your remaining battery power substantially. I normally wait till the first low battery reminder to do this. Also, how do I set the phone to never turn off no matter how low the battery gets? This would also be fine with me.
utbiglall said:
I have the exact same issue and although it is a nuisance, I have found a workaround to keep using the phone. Simply physically removing the battery and replacing it will increase your remaining battery power substantially. I normally wait till the first low battery reminder to do this. Also, how do I set the phone to never turn off no matter how low the battery gets? This would also be fine with me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't run into this issue until I reflashed my ROM to one with W6.1. Then, rather than get 12-13 hrs with my 3amp battery, I'd get 6. I used my original battery, but when I put the 3amp back in, I still had 47% left.
It's the ROM, and until there's a fix, it would be a pain to pull and replace the battery just to work around. I've done this several times recently when I'm on battery power, but I'd rather not.
Anybody heard of any other fixes, outside monitor, or do we wait until we get a Windows Mobile 6.1 fix?
Still no luck?
Hello,
Has anyone been able to find a solution for this. I am ordering the extended battery today. I will try to fully discharge it and then recharge it as was suggested and report back.
I emailed Mugen. We went back and forth with them trying to troubleshoot whether it's the battery or OS. They were clueless, but did offer an RMA to replace the battery. I pay the postage. Not sure if I'll send it back if it's the OS. I pull and replace the battery right now. It's a real pain, and I hate opening the case so much, but it's the only way I can get an accurate read.
PhoenixAG said:
This is a very valid issue which I have faced many times when using a 3rd party extended battery with other phones.
Not sure how to solve it though, although I have the 3000mah on order myself.
I think the battery reading is given by the battery itself, and most of these 3rd party manufacturers don't really care to put a smart processor in the battery (to reduce costs/make it smaller/etc).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The processor is required for these types of lithium ion batteries because it regulates the charging of the battery. If it didn't the battery would not charge properly, or maybe not even charge at all.
There is no solution for now, people from other forums tries to patch battdrvr.dll.
But two things may help a little:
1.You may completely disable battery monitoring
HKLM\Drivers\BuiltIn\Battery rename or remove string battdrvr.dll
But you lost monitoring completely.
2. change HKLM\Drivers\BuiltIn\Battery\Order change value from 15 (in my case) to 0. - After this battery lasts longer until power off.
There is not complete hardware or software solution for this problem. We need to wait.
Low Battery warning:
By default, a PPC will sound a warning sound when the battery is running low (10%, fixed value), but there's no way to disable or change the notification. To enable this, so that it is visible in the "Sounds & Notifications" control panel, set:
HKCU\ControlPanel\Notifications\{A877D663-239C-47a7-9304-0D347F580408}\Default = "Low battery warning" (REGSZ string, no quotes)
Anybody have any updates on this? I have noticed this more on WM6.1, but it was still an issue on WM6. I just find this so annoying!
Is there any radio that can fix this? I noiced that this battery reading issue only occurs when the Phone Signal is on. When off, it never happens to me. Or it seems. So it has something to do with the radio.
bump, anyone got a solution?
this is very interesting, i bought the seidio 3200 battery i am having the same problems. i just tired the
change HKLM\Drivers\BuiltIn\Battery\Order change value from 15 (in my case) to 0
i am going to see how that works out throughout the day
Tried It
I am having same issue, reset the registry key to "0" and ran for a full day, no change, still incorrect reading. I have a 2700 Mah battery and the charge indicater is completely wrong on it. I have cycled the battery as per reccoemndations, but still get wrong power remaining readings. Can remove the battery and resets itselft to a more correct reading.
I am out of ideas, guess we need someone from HTC to chime in with a hardware fix.
MWS
ms0529 said:
I am having same issue, reset the registry key to "0" and ran for a full day, no change, still incorrect reading. I have a 2700 Mah battery and the charge indicater is completely wrong on it. I have cycled the battery as per reccoemndations, but still get wrong power remaining readings. Can remove the battery and resets itselft to a more correct reading.
I am out of ideas, guess we need someone from HTC to chime in with a hardware fix.
MWS
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i have tried it too and it still does the same thing. i would still need to pull the battery and restart the device for the batt meter to get a more accurate reading. i could do it about 3 times before the battery dies completely.
is there this problem with all extended batteries or just with the larger ones?
the reason I ask is that I've got a $17 credit at Amazon and was thinking of grabbing a 1600mah battery, it's only like $22 with ship so I'll only pay a few bucks for it really...
I wanted to get the larger one but it's fat and won't fit standard carrying case, but the 1600 is slim and will fit in place a regular battery
Related
Hi!
I'm using the latest QTEK ROM with A2DP.
The problem is that my set blacks out at 38% battery power and refuses to power up after that unless I re-connect to the AC for charging. It happens a couple of times already. Any setting(s) in the Universal to check this?
I remember I managed to get the battery level at real low level (less than 5%) previously prior to the ROM upgrade.
Thanks
Hi,
I have a similar problem.
I charged the unit till 100% then reflush the Rom
Regards
JoseF
RE
Hi JoseF
Thanks, however, I'll consider this as my last option
Meanwhile I would like to get more feedback on this issue
Qtek 13077 ROM ????
My i-mate continues to crashes with the battery is less then 43%, apparently the problem occurred when I made the upgrade to ROM Qtek WWE_13077_130176_10900, was looked like that this version has something that change the battery configuration, since Qtek 9000 comes with 1750 battery mAh? I reinstalled the i-mate ROM 1.30.82 and the problem persists?
I made a test leaving the i-mate on, without using the radio until the battery miter showed 23%, then I made a phone call, the i-mate crashes in seconds. Could somebody inform what is the true voltage of the battery in the i-mate is 100% and when it is 10%, in the miter?
I have charged the unit till 100% led = Green, then soft reset, the problem persist?
Now I am 100% certainty that the problem occurred when I made upgrade for Qtek, we needs to investigate what the the Qtek ROM this doing with the JasJar?
Ive 3 batteries
The standard 1620mah dynapack which works fine 100% to flat no worries
A 3200mah extended which will charge to full but dies at 43%
(the guy replaced it with another which did the same thing)
and
A 3000mah which will go flat ok but wont charge beyond 47% and the orange light stays on forever, although luckily it doesnt fry.
has anyone had any of these extended batterys work ok?
Just to add a bit of info, all modern li-ion have a built in fuel guage chip which tells the device its in how much power is left in the cell. so its possable this is a battery issue rather than phone problem
r 1.03.00
g 42.36.p8
d 1.30.90.wwe
RE
You may be right about the battery thing
However, I've tested my existing battery to very low level prior to the ROM update without problem
And with other feedbacks in this forum I doubt it could be a coincidence that our batteries are having the same issue.
I would rather think its a ROM thing.
I'll need to test my battery on another Universal before confirming.
I just tried to flash to an older rom but got a country error, there seems to be no old orange uk rom i can find.
Im a bit new to all this rom flashing business and also wanted to try an older rom to check out the camera as im not sure if i have a realy poor camera or if there is a software issue with that in the new orange rom also as one guy in another post is getting far better results out of his camera mines like a real snow storm in the dark parts of pictures
RE
Yes, the new QTEK ROM update does cause the camera quality to suffer especially when in night mode
Well, just have to wait for another ROM update to resolve these issues :roll:
Fosa or Zarn
You have a digital multimeter?
Case yes: You it could measure the voltage of the battery when is total loaded 100% led=green, and when the battery will be flat 0%. This test would be excellent to verify if the Battery power remaining is correct. Currently when my battery is with 3.28V = 55% in the battery power remaining = crashes.
ok, can do, not that it will help much unloaded.
I'll charge the original cell and post the results shortly.
The battery management wont always turn the battery off at the same point as the battery ages it will change. You have to bare in mind that a battery is a little like a piece of rubber the harder you push on it the bigger the dent but when you stop pushing it recovers its shape.
The same goes for the voltage of a battery, when you draw a large current the voltage will drop further than if the device is in standby but once you disconnect the load there will be an amount of recovery
li-ion batterys are far more complicated than they first appear.
The battery is by no means connected directly to the phone.
there is a microprocessor in the battery that controls both charge and discharge via 2 fet transistors, buy doing this it protects you against the battery exploding/catching fire from over charging or over discharging.
As far as im awaire the microprocessor will adjust both switch on and switch off from many variables not just voltage drop.
The phone its self mearly supplies power to the charger built into the battery and draws power from the battery all the measurement and battery managment is within the battery
This is why the battery suddenly just stops and you need power to bring it back to life.
so in theory no matter what the condition of the battery it should always give a full scale deflection from full to empty as the onboard management should know how much capacity is left in the cell and report this via the data lines to the phone
If you connect a bulb to an almost flat li-ion battery you will find little drop in brightness before the battery just cuts power totaly to protect the cell within from over discharge.
Something that springs to mind that hasnt been mentioned here is have you checked all 4 battery contacts are clean? just a thought because the two larger outer pads provide power while one or both of the smaller pads send data on the charge status to the phone.
heres some interesting reading
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/parttwo-34.htm
Intresting reading on the care of li-ion as they dont like being either fully charged or fully discharged..strange eh...
http://www.maxim-ic.com/appnotes.cfm/appnote_number/128
http://www.intersil.com/data/an/AN1174.pdf
two examples of li-ion battery management.
safety law dictates any li-ion that is user replaceable must have one of these little chaps built in.
hope that makes sence
/ramble
RE
Sorry zarn, but I don't have a digital multimeter.
Is your test going to prove that the battery is going to its end of life soon?
How could that be since the Universal is less than a year old? :roll:
At any rate I'll be testing my battery on another Universal without the QTEK ROM update to determine whether its a battery issue or the ROM update issue.
Im just going to do it out of interest... like i said in the previous post its not likely to prove anything except if the guys battery is totaly out of whack
Dear Fosa and Zarn,
I’ve already known those URLs:
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/parttwo-34.htm
http://www.maxim-ic.com/appnotes.cfm/appnote_number/128
I liked very much this article:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/appnotes.cfm/appnote_number/128
However, when I asked to verify the voltage of the battery and without taking it off the charger, I’ve put two tiny wires on the terminal of the battery, in the manner I could verify the voltage without taking it off from the Jasjar. Last night I’ve left it charging until the green-led light and I’ve noticed that the voltage was 4,231V = to 100% on the battery power remaining miter.
I’ve did a test putting the light of 4V to discharge the battery, and at the 2,83V, it disconnected automatically (stopped to supply current). In more or less one minute, it starts to provide energy again, in other words, the protection circuit of the battery is Ok, and is not with this tension (2,83v) that the Jasjar stops, and only when is 3,28v.
I’ve got the feeling that the problem is on the ROM, however I did reinstall the original ROM and yet the Jasjar still crashes at 58% of the battery(= 3,28v).
Before making the upgrade the miter was going from 100% to 5% without crashing.
With the ROM Qtek WWE_13077_130176_10900 the miter shows 100% to 42%, and at this point it starts to crash.
I’ve already bought a new battery just to test it, but it still not arrived from Hong Kong, and as the customs is on strike here in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, I don’t know when I’ll get it.
Until now I think the problem is that the Qtek ROM made some changes on the firmware or in the register of the battery, changing the miter calibration.
Battery results
Im suprised it cut of that low, thats very low for a 3.7v li-ion, thats more what you would expect from a 3.2v.
Anyways, as requested heres the resuts of checking the voltage at various points.
This is using an original dynapack 1620mah battery as supplied by orange with the phone, but its around 3 or 4 months old now so far from fresh.
the meter used was a Avo M801 (not a cheap one though is probably due to be calibrated...)
100%----4.16v straight off charge still warm
75%-----3.93v
50%-----3.78v
38%-----3.76v
25%-----3.73v
10%-----3.65v
5%------3.63v
cutoff----3.58v
Im going to do the same with the extended batterys im having problems with just as a comparison, will post the results here if anyone is interested
Whats going off here...?
I just put one of the extended batterys in which was fully charged..
to be greated with a blank batery bar, and unknown in the chargeing remaining window... unpluged and repluged the charger and was then told battery at 225%
doh.....
Jasjar battery miter
Hi Zarn
Thanks a lot for the table of % * V, now I am certain convinced that the Jasjar miter needs to be calibrated again, I believe that the problem is the DLL or the responsible register for this detail(miter)?
While I or somebody of the forum does not find the solution, I will continue using this way, because the battery still lasts for 24h.
RE
OK guys, bad news
I used my battery which knocks out at 43% from my QTEK 9000 set and put it into another QTEK 9000 set without ROM update and it also fails to boot up unless I connect it to an external power
I hope that QTEK can release a small ROM update to resolve this issue
so hang on..
you put your battery into another non updated rom handset and it still wasnt working properly...
surely that means your battery is at fault not the rom..
cant u borrow the other guys battery for a few hours?
Are these original batterys were talking about btw (1620mah dynapacks)?
or cheap replacements?
RE
Hi zarn,
My battery is the original default battery....the Universal is less than a year old
Could it be that the new ROM update has changed something in the battery...maybe the IC chip in the battery, if any?
RE
zarn,
If you'll read another similar thread you'll find many others with different variants of the Universal facing the same problem after upgrading the new QTEK ROM update with A2DP
Are you saying their batteries are faulty too...such a coincidence?
I have charged my Nexus One yesterday for the first time. I live in holland so i had to use my USB cable, and the power adapter that came with my HTC hero to plug my USB cable in.
After the phone was charged 100%, i disconnected it from the charger and only downloaded + added a widget to my home screen. After i did that the battery was already down tot 97% :O:O
Is it defective ?
i noticed having to complete a few charge cycles.. charge fully, use it till dead, charge again
now it seems to hold out much longer
Hmm ok i'll try that. But did yours also drain this fast?
what setting is your screen on? seriously though, im sure some other battery experts here would know, but i think they take a few cycles to get to maximum efficiency
malicious85 said:
what setting is your screen on? seriously though, im sure some other battery experts here would know, but i think they take a few cycles to get to maximum efficiency
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do you mean with screen setting, and what should i put it on?
Sorry totally new to the phone hehe
I've noticed this too. However as soon as the battery reaches around 50% it takes a lot more to drain so it evens out in the end I guess
teihoata said:
I've noticed this too. However as soon as the battery reaches around 50% it takes a lot more to drain so it evens out in the end I guess
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm ok so it also went that fast on your phone? i have been using it for about an hour now and its down to about ~90% =\, concerns me a bit.
Found out something else, concering the usage of the screen. When i look here:
Menu -> Settings -> About Phone -> Battery Use
The phone tells what uses the battery the most or something, but the strange thing is that it says:
Display 55%
Isn't that very high? Maybe that is causing my battery to drain so fast
Battery meters are not an exact science. Its using what it knows about the battery's state to guess of how much % is remaining. The battery meter will need to be calibrated once, and then overall battery should improve with your next normal 3-6 full charges.
Again, you do not need to and you shouldn't repeatedly drain the battery to 0, only once is this needed to set the phones battery meter, unless you clear it (possible within amon ra's bootloader).
As for your observation, yes that is completely normal, there is not a whole lot of definition within 3% of battery as far as displaying it. What the real picture? Enter in #*#*4363*#*# on your dial pad and then go to battery information, and you'll see the accurate voltage. (this is also accessible from "spare parts" if you have it)
Nipje said:
Found out something else, concering the usage of the screen. When i look here:
Menu -> Settings -> About Phone -> Battery Use
The phone tells what uses the battery the most or something, but the strange thing is that it says:
Display 55%
Isn't that very high? Maybe that is causing my battery to drain so fast
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All %'s here are vs the amount of time on battery (shown at the top in h:m). If you just unplugged your phone and you go looking here, you'll see the display % VERY HIGH... because the screen has been on the entire time its been unplugged
Its a % after all of the usage since last unplugged.
i've noticed my battery life is much better since i got the desktop dock.. lots of people charge until the light turns green then immediately grab it and start using..
leave it for another hour or two and it seems to get much better.
dont know if anyone else has noticed this but the top corner indicator light turns green once the battery goes somewhere over 90%, leaving it charge longer will get you to 100
malicious85 said:
dont know if anyone else has noticed this but the top corner indicator light turns green once the battery goes somewhere over 90%, leaving it charge longer will get you to 100
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good point, I did notice this by accident a few times.
Nipje said:
What do you mean with screen setting, and what should i put it on?
Sorry totally new to the phone hehe
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You probably found this by now, but one flick to the left and you should have a widget for WiFi, GPS, etc. The far right one toggles 3 levels of screen brightness. The brightest two settings really suck down battery.
just a tip, when you are draining it to recalibrate the battery, after you get to the point that the phone shuts off, boot into the bootloader and run that thing till it completely dies... i did this for my phone, sat it in bootloader with a bright ass screen for like 15 min before it finally finished off... get every last ounce of juice out of it before you start charging it back up
Hmm thanks for al the reactions guys. I'm going to recalibrate my battery now, and lets see if that helps a bit .
Then i have a other question, its not about my battery but since i already have a open topic i dont want to create another one .
Can anyone of you test the following:
When you are calling with someone, and your calling volume is on the maximum (so the volume of the speaker that you hold against your ear). Can anyone notice a little crack from the speaker when the other person talks a bit loud or make's a loud noise? I'm wondering if there is something wrong with mine. With several tones the ear speaker cracks a little bit, like the sound is to loud or something?
Nipje said:
Hmm ok so it also went that fast on your phone? i have been using it for about an hour now and its down to about ~90% =\, concerns me a bit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep sounds about the same on my phone, dont worry about it lol
The draining thing is from the old nickel days, the lithium batteries are made for daily use so just treat the phone as you would normally. The battery will get better as time goes by.
Also I am not having that problem with the speaker
Hmm, I have my device since last week (Netherlands) and the battery usage is frightening. Sucking it dry in about 24 hours. I haven't let it die out completely though: I thought lithium batteries were not supposed to be used that way. Ni-Cad batteries were used that way.
Ah, see here:
Guidelines for prolonging lithium-ion battery life
Lithium-ion batteries should never be depleted below their minimum voltage (2.4 to 2.8 V/cell, depending on chemistry). If a lithium-ion battery is stored with too low a charge, there is a risk that the charge will drop below the low-voltage threshold, resulting in an unrecoverable dead battery.[citation needed] Usually this does not instantly damage the battery itself but a charger or device which uses that battery will refuse to charge a dead battery. The battery appears to be dead or not existent because the protection circuit disables further discharging and there is zero voltage on the battery terminals.
Lithium-ion batteries should be kept cool. Ideally they are stored in a refrigerator.[citation needed]
Aging will take its toll much faster at high temperatures.[citation needed]
[edit] Prolonging life in multiple cells through cell balancing
Analog front ends that balance cells and eliminate mismatches of cells in series or parallel significantly improve battery efficiency and increase the overall pack capacity. As the number of cells and load currents increase, the potential for mismatch also increases. There are two kinds of mismatch in the pack: state-of-charge (SOC) and capacity/energy (C/E) mismatch. Though the SOC mismatch is more common, each problem limits the pack capacity (mA·h) to the capacity of the weakest cell.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, if you want to brick your battery, by all means, suck out all the power.
i have a mytouch but i think the things i do can be used with all androids....first recalibrating is a good way to get a fresh battery...then the brightness also helps along with any wireless things u dont use like wifi gps etc.. they should be turned off an brightness should be low...i have downloaded a app lately called automatic task killer..i think this is better than any other task manager because other task managers dont kill apps wen phone is on standby ..apps r still running wen screen is off an automatic task killer kills them..i think u should download this and also have a task manager to kill apps wen u use the phone..another thing is charging the phone wen its completely off..wait until the the light turns green then leave it on for another hour or two then turn it back on....i have seen an increase in bettery life by doing all this...any one esle have any tips ..let me kno
After being dropped while charging, the battery of my Kaiser just use almost a day (previously from 2 to 3 days).
I installed acbPowerMeter to measure power consumption and it shows an unbelievable value: 4294967mA
When plugged into the charger, the power consumption back to normal (I think), between 90-275mA. I wonder if Kaiser power circuit is broken or not.
Who have experience please give me an advice. Thanks!
Hi, if you've dropped your device you should check the connections to the batery. Try pulling out the batery, check if the "pins" are aligned, check if you batery isn't cracked.
Other thing that might have happened is that if you install new software it may drain you batery, i had the same problem after flashing and was only solved after getting a fix from the chef.
Thank you for reply me!
I checked the battery connectors and tried different battery (borrowed from my friend), so the result is still the same. I did not install any software before and then.
Hello, I have same issue with battery drain. I don;t know if it was droped because I just bought it used and battery is draining in one day. I tried another tool called Mobadi, and it saying that my Kaiser using 90-200mA. how about you?
90 -200mA is normal draw. Your battery is losing capacity over years of use, thats normal.
V3rt!g(o) said:
90 -200mA is normal draw.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
...normal draw during screen on and active use...
with these older devices, there are too many tiny things that can go wrong which cause weirdness.
1. Testing with a known good battery (NEW does not equal 'known to be good'-- I had two new batteries which would not even take a charge, followed by a new NON OEM battery with a low capacity cell inside! they use some undersized cells probably for pricing reasons... sort of like sticking an AA battery in a C cell shell. Not really sure what you can do in that case...)
2. Hard reset and see if the problem persists before doing any more troubleshooting.
I´ve just come back from a two month expedition on Borneo. But when i got back to civilization and turned on my trusty N1 I quickly realized that my battery performance has dropped significantly. Before I usually had one day of heavy use (including Wifi, 3G, tethering and GPS usage), but now I only have about 7 hours standby with everything except GSM turned off. Which renders the phone useless for my (normal) use. The phone actually consumes so much power that the battery level drops while charging. The only way to charge it up is to turn the phone completely off.
I flashed the RoDrIgUeZsTyLe™ MIUIMOD -ROM before I left for my trip, so I thought maybe that was the problem (some bug i the kernel or something), so i flashed back to CM6 with no success. I have also tried a new battery.
Anyone knows what can be the cause?
All help is deeply appreciated --- I miss my good old N1!
I accidentally placed this in the wrong section - can anybody move it to Q&A?
Try the battery app in my sig to pull your battery values, then post in that thread and one of us can help you see what's happening with your battery.
maybe the charger is the problem?
Just throwing it out there... I've seen it happen for Laptop users...
Try the battery app in my sig to pull your battery values, then post in that thread and one of us can help you see what's happening with your battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Voltage (mV): 4035.84
Current (mA): -464.98
Temp (C): 30.2
Percent: 90
Batt age: 94
Full40(mAh): 1452
Min Chg Curr(mA):80
Min Chg Volt(mV): 4099
Empty Curr (mA):200.0
Empty Volt (mV): 3.426
Capacity(mAh):1273
Aged Capa(mAh): 1393
BTW...I have also tried several different chargers without any success.
Hi,
I had similar problems with my rooted N1 with stock Froyo.
The problem for me was a radio image older than regular. Baseband version should be something _4.06 or higher.
You can check this information in Settings ->About Phone
Sent from my Nexus One
Fulvio Minichini said:
Hi,
I had similar problems with my rooted N1 with stock Froyo.
The problem for me was a radio image older than regular. Baseband version should be something _4.06 or higher.
You can check this information in Settings ->About Phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I got 32.41.00.32U_5.08.00.04 so it doesn't seem to be old, but I'll try to update the radio anyway with a custom stock rom from modaco. Will let you guys know if it helps
Update: I'm now back at *****_4.06****. No change
My first thought is: what level of power did you leave your battery with before you went away?
Lithium batteries are permanently damaged if the voltage drops below a certain level. Leakage will mean that any battery left for a while will lose charge.
Therefore, if you leave a battery with close to zero power left for a long time, leakage can mean the charge level drops below the critical minimum level and the cells become damaged.
As such, it is recommended to never store lithium batteries with below 40% charge, and to store them in a cool environment, since leakage is faster at higher temperatures.
Yeah, that was my first thought too, since I forgot to turn it off before I left (the phone was stored in a room with AC at least). However, I have now gotten a new battery and it doesn't help...
I have tried to check if there are any programs that are running in the background that draw unnecessary power, but i cant find any ---at least not with system panel. The cpu-load also seem to be normal.
Anyone got some ideas?
Thats really wierd... The only thing you can do is reflash the radio and flash it to stock. Then use the new battery and charge it overnight - so it overcharges slightly. Let it totally drain till the phone turns off, and repeat a coupla of times. Ignore the levels reported by the phone.
See if it starts to behave normally after that. If not you either have another dud battery or there's something wrong with the charging circuit in your phone.
If you have a friend with an N1, you could try charging your respective batteries in your phones, then swap batteries. See how much time each phone lasts
Thanks for the tip.
I'll try that before I buy a new cellphone.
I'm really frustrated because i really used to love the n7 so much I was an early adopter and bought another one after I dropped my first and then went on to buy my girlfriend one. But after being plagued with this issue and stuck on 4.1 its just not the same anymore since I cant flash custom roms all day :/
I've been having a charging issue with android 4.2.1 since it came out (both stock and all the roms I tried) but I noticed that whenever I reverted to 4.1.2 the issue went away completely. So I've been waiting for 4.2.2 to come out for a while now to see if it fixed the issue and after flashing the update tonight it seems to have the same problem.
I've tried searching for months now and haven't found any answers.
So this is the issue with both 4.2.1 and 4.2.2:
The battery charges at an insanely slow pace to the point that it ruins the tablet completely. I'll plug it in over night for 8+ hours and it will not gain more then 40% battery life in that time.
Its to the point that when I was just using it right now on the charger with brightness turned all the way down and nothing on other then sync and WiFi that light web browsing for 10 mins caused it to discharge a percent after being plugged in for 19 minutes.
Notes:
Its a c70 16gb
I tried 3 different stock N7 chargers with stock cables as well as trying them with other cables.
I'm not plugged into any kind of extension cords and I've tried multiple wall sockets at different locations.
My girlfriends nexus 7 32g charges fine on 4.2.1 and I have not updated her to 4.2.2 to test yet.
I haven't checked the battery connection because like I said whenever I revert to stock 4.1.2 or any 4.1.2 rom it charges in 4 hours flat or 6 hours with heavy usage while charging.
So anyone have any ideas? If not I guess I have to rma.
Do both, yours and your girlfriend's devices take that long to charge?
sl4y3r88 said:
Do both, yours and your girlfriend's devices take that long to charge?
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Nope her nexus 7 charges fine. ( a little slower on 4.2 then 4.1 but nothing like mine)
Her nexus does have issues with turning on sometimes on 4.2.1 like a lot of other users but its nothing holding the power button for 10 seconds doesn't fix.
It also just noticed it seems to discharge at an extremely fast pace. (still on 4.2.2)
It just dropped from 55% to 51% in the time I've typed these responses with brightness all the way down.
So anyone want to try and help me figure this out before I send it in friday? I called it in to Google play device support to try and report the software bug and they said its the first they heard of it and they would pass it on but I felt like the rep didnt want to help as I bought it from a third party. I'm willing to do any tests suggested and hop between software versions to try and figure out this bug.
Why do you think it is a "software bug" when millions of people running the "same software" don't experience the same behavior?
I realize that software can exhibit data-dependent behaviors, and thus exhibit low occurrence rates... but there is no "software" involved in charging the battery.
Do you think a booted Linux kernel is needed to charge a battery? How would the battery get charged when the device is turned off in that case? C'mon!
Send it back and tell them the battery (or charge contoller CIRCUIT) is defective.
If it's out of warranty, PAY them to replace it.
bftb0 said:
Why do you think it is a "software bug" when millions of people running the "same software" don't experience the same behavior?
I realize that software can exhibit data-dependent behaviors, and thus exhibit low occurrence rates... but there is no "software" involved in charging the battery.
Do you think a booted Linux kernel is needed to charge a battery? How would the battery get charged when the device is turned off in that case? C'mon!
Send it back and tell them the battery (or charge contoller CIRCUIT) is defective.
If it's out of warranty, PAY them to replace it.
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Click to collapse
Then how do you explain that if right now I flash back to 4.1.2 it will work fine? If you want I'll provide screenshots.
I just flashed back to 4.1.2 this morning and it worked perfectly. Just now I flashed codefires 4.2.2 build and the problems back.
Please explain how that is hardware related.
I may of jumped the gun assuming it was a charging issue. It seems like it might be a battery drain issue. Here's a couple screenshots from a fresh install of codefirex 4.2.2 build.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using XDA Premium HD app
All I was trying to say is that when the OS is booted, at most all it does is monitor battery voltage and current - it doesn't get actively involved in control of charging circuitry.
At most this historical data can be used to *predict* when the battery will run out of juice, and this number is what is shown to the user as a % charge number. Hopefully that allows the prediction to be sort of correct as the battery ages and it's characteristics change.
This "calibration data" is only used for prediction - it does absolutely nothing to alter the rate at which current is drawn from the battery by the motherboard, nor for attempting to alter the behavior of a battery charge controller.
Li-Ion and Li-Polymer batteries are indeed complicated enough that they should not be charged by extremely simple circuits if a long operating lifetime is desired. For this purpose though, monolithic battery charge controllers chips are used - they do not need any assistance of a micro-controller or advanced CPU running a modern OS. That's why they are able to charge batteries rapidly and appropriately when the motherboard is in a "powered down" state.
Relative to a big multi-core CPU chip, which might have hundreds of millions of transistors, battery charge controllers are extremely small circuits - they are sold by the billions and cost in the ballpark of one to several pennies. They don't need the support of a CPU or even a microcontroller to operate correctly.
Good luck with your tab; I hope you enjoy it.
bftb0 said:
All I was trying to say is that when the OS is booted, at most all it does is monitor battery voltage and current - it doesn't get actively involved in control of charging circuitry.
At most this historical data can be used to *predict* when the battery will run out of juice, and this number is what is shown to the user as a % charge number. Hopefully that allows the prediction to be sort of correct as the battery ages and it's characteristics change.
This "calibration data" is only used for prediction - it does absolutely nothing to alter the rate at which current is drawn from the battery by the motherboard, nor for attempting to alter the behavior of a battery charge controller.
Li-Ion and Li-Polymer batteries are indeed complicated enough that they should not be charged by extremely simple circuits if a long operating lifetime is desired. For this purpose though, monolithic battery charge controllers chips are used - they do not need any assistance of a micro-controller or advanced CPU running a modern OS. That's why they are able to charge batteries rapidly and appropriately when the motherboard is in a "powered down" state.
Relative to a big multi-core CPU chip, which might have hundreds of millions of transistors, battery charge controllers are extremely small circuits - they are sold by the billions and cost in the ballpark of one to several pennies. They don't need the support of a CPU or even a microcontroller to operate correctly.
Good luck with your tab; I hope you enjoy it.
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Thank you for taking the time to write out this detailed explanation. I read it over a couple times and that all makes a lot of sense and now I have a little better understanding of how things work charging wise.
But I still can't wrap my head around how the problem DISAPPEARS COMPLETELY on any 4.1 based build...
I'm not trying to contradict you in anyway it seems like you are way more knowledgeable then me on the subject.
It just doesn't make any sense and I was hoping you could make more of it for me.
Maybe it isn't the charging but a battery drain issue something on 4.2 based builds is draining more current then the charger can dish out.
But while i was doing research I read that chargers up the current they dish out if the device is in use. Is that correct?
I've looked into the media server bug but as I just did a fresh install of stock 4.2.1 and haven't changed or added anything to the file structure that wasn't included in the factory image, I also went through and turned off the keyboard press sound and all other sounds like explained in some of the threads I have read. I also read that the problem is supposed to be fixed in 4.2.2. I also haven't installed any apps from the market.
I guess all I'm looking for is the answer to this question:
Could there really be a hardware related problem of any sort (not just charging and battery problems but anything) that causes problems with 4.2 based builds specifically but doesn't cause problems with 4.1?
If the answer is yes then I don't have to feel bad about sending it in but if its software based issues I'll be upset that I wasn't able to fix it and gave up.
Have you let the battery drain all the way or do you just plug it in at a certain point? if not let it get to the point were it will turn itself off. if the battery with the cross in it stays for more than it would take for 1% to drain then it just might be your battery stats file. even if its not let it drain and then charge it while its off. you can check the battery by pushing the power button quick. i know i have had this problem with other devices that were fixed by doing this. and my N7 did it last night were i updated and plugged it in, it was at 60% and when i woke up it was at 46%.
projectzro said:
Have you let the battery drain all the way or do you just plug it in at a certain point? if not let it get to the point were it will turn itself off. if the battery with the cross in it stays for more than it would take for 1% to drain then it just might be your battery stats file. even if its not let it drain and then charge it while its off. you can check the battery by pushing the power button quick. i know i have had this problem with other devices that were fixed by doing this. and my N7 did it last night were i updated and plugged it in, it was at 60% and when i woke up it was at 46%.
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I'll give this a try right now then post results, the battery is already pretty low so It shouldn't take very long. Thanks for the response.
projectzro said:
Have you let the battery drain all the way or do you just plug it in at a certain point? if not let it get to the point were it will turn itself off. if the battery with the cross in it stays for more than it would take for 1% to drain then it just might be your battery stats file. even if its not let it drain and then charge it while its off. you can check the battery by pushing the power button quick. i know i have had this problem with other devices that were fixed by doing this. and my N7 did it last night were i updated and plugged it in, it was at 60% and when i woke up it was at 46%.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I let it run dry and am getting some weird behavior...
The dead battery symbol did not pop at all. It actually booted played the low battery sound half way through the nexus logo loaded into the OS and immediately was greeted by the battery to low logo powering down message and then it returned off. It did this cycle all the way through three times in a row before holding the power button did nothing. I let it sit for a minute before trying again and I got another boot out of it all the way to the OS again. But I've yet to be greeted by the battery with the cross symbol. Holding the power button will do the cycle described above or do nothing at all.
krisserapin said:
But while i was doing research I read that chargers up the current they dish out if the device is in use. Is that correct?
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Click to collapse
Well, the 120v->5v converter certainly can be providing more current @5v because the device is active, but that's only because the motherboard is drawing current in parallel with the battery charging circuit. It doesn't mean the battery charge rate is higher.
krisserapin said:
Could there really be a hardware related problem of any sort (not just charging and battery problems but anything) that causes problems with 4.2 based builds specifically but doesn't cause problems with 4.1?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I suppose so.
I would do a few things to determine whether that is a reasonable hypotheses, though.
1) See how fast the battery charges with the tablet turned off. Should be close to 40%/hour for a new battery. You know there is no "software" running with the tablet turned off, so if you don't see some reasonable number here (say > 20%/hr) then a bad battery or charge controller circuit in the tab are the most likely culprits. Also, if the temperature rise of the tablet while doing this seems higher than the gf's unit, that would implicate the battery, not the charging circuit.
2) There's software, and then there's software. (Preinstalled vs. User installed) Run the battery down a ways, and then observe the battery charging rate with the device on but screen off (sleeping), but on a stock 4.2 install with ZERO user apps installed. Then, install/restore all your favorite apps, reboot, maybe use a couple of your fave apps, and repeat the same charge rate trial (screen off/sleeping). Are there large differences between the two cases? If so, that would implicate one of your apps in causing either lots of additional compute operations or preventing entry into the LP0 state (perhaps because of wakelocks?)
The thing is, the N7 battery is rated at 4325 mAh; that is sort of the same thing as 4.325 amps of current for 1 hour. (Voltage range of roughly 4v to 3.5v).
So, if a "good battery" can be charged in 2.5hrs, that is sort of like stuffing 1.73 amps into the battery for that time (1.73 x 2.5 = 4.325 A-h or 4325 mA-h). That's pretty near to the max capacity of the AC charger (2A)
Now, some users have reported discharging their tabs in 4 hours under heavy continuous use; that would be about 1.08 amps for 4 hours.
Since the wall charger is rated to produce 2A, this suggests that very heavy usage simultaneous with charging would indeed cause battery charging to slow down significantly - let's suppose it drops from 1.73a to 0.65a. Now it takes the battery 6.6hrs to charge ... but that is still just over 15%/hr ... with the tab in active use.
But that's not what you were noticing - you were seeing much worse charge rates than this when the tablet was supposed to be more or less idle!
Finally I should point out that I previously mentioned that the % charge number is a prediction, not a measurement! If for some reason this number were screwed up, then the "charge rate" observations could be completely screwed up. (Think of this as being analogous to trying to partially fill a gas tank in a car or estimate fuel mileage with a broken gas gauge) The only way to be sure that you are not falling victim to something like this is to record battery voltages - the 100% level should be up around 4v, and the 10% values down around 3.5v.
You can observe this value at /sys/devices/platform/tegra-i2c.4/i2c-4/4-0055/power_supply/battery/voltage_now
(note value is reported in uV)
Whew - long post. It doesn't directly answer your question about "why was 4.1 so different?" - but gives you an idea about why I was skeptical when you saw charging rates as low as you did.
I dunno, maybe the % charge prediction value numbers are screwy on your tab for some strange reason in 4.2, perhaps because of a minor hardware difference. I can't rule it out - I once saw a bug expression in a hardware/software combination that required three independent conditions (from three separate vendors!) to have precise configurations before the bug would show itself.
I hope this post gives you some ideas to try; it certainly doesn't give a solution.
Good luck - if you feel like spending more time investigating, go for it; just don't let the clock run out on the warranty period if you have one left.
bftb0 said:
Well, the 120v->5v converter certainly can be providing more current @5v because the device is active, but that's only because the motherboard is drawing current in parallel with the battery charging circuit. It doesn't mean the battery charge rate is higher.
I suppose so.
I would do a few things to determine whether that is a reasonable hypotheses, though.
1) See how fast the battery charges with the tablet turned off. Should be close to 40%/hour for a new battery. You know there is no "software" running with the tablet turned off, so if you don't see some reasonable number here (say > 20%/hr) then a bad battery or charge controller circuit in the tab are the most likely culprits. Also, if the temperature rise of the tablet while doing this seems higher than the gf's unit, that would implicate the battery, not the charging circuit.
2) There's software, and then there's software. (Preinstalled vs. User installed) Run the battery down a ways, and then observe the battery charging rate with the device on but screen off (sleeping), but on a stock 4.2 install with ZERO user apps installed. Then, install/restore all your favorite apps, reboot, maybe use a couple of your fave apps, and repeat the same charge rate trial (screen off/sleeping). Are there large differences between the two cases? If so, that would implicate one of your apps in causing either lots of additional compute operations or preventing entry into the LP0 state (perhaps because of wakelocks?)
The thing is, the N7 battery is rated at 4325 mAh; that is sort of the same thing as 4.325 amps of current for 1 hour. (Voltage range of roughly 4v to 3.5v).
So, if a "good battery" can be charged in 2.5hrs, that is sort of like stuffing 1.73 amps into the battery for that time (1.73 x 2.5 = 4.325 A-h or 4325 mA-h). That's pretty near to the max capacity of the AC charger (2A)
Now, some users have reported discharging their tabs in 4 hours under heavy continuous use; that would be about 1.08 amps for 4 hours.
Since the wall charger is rated to produce 2A, this suggests that very heavy usage simultaneous with charging would indeed cause battery charging to slow down significantly - let's suppose it drops from 1.73a to 0.65a. Now it takes the battery 6.6hrs to charge ... but that is still just over 15%/hr ... with the tab in active use.
But that's not what you were noticing - you were seeing much worse charge rates than this when the tablet was supposed to be more or less idle!
Finally I should point out that I previously mentioned that the % charge number is a prediction, not a measurement! If for some reason this number were screwed up, then the "charge rate" observations could be completely screwed up. (Think of this as being analogous to trying to partially fill a gas tank in a car or estimate fuel mileage with a broken gas gauge) The only way to be sure that you are not falling victim to something like this is to record battery voltages - the 100% level should be up around 4v, and the 10% values down around 3.5v.
You can observe this value at /sys/devices/platform/tegra-i2c.4/i2c-4/4-0055/power_supply/battery/voltage_now
(note value is reported in uV)
Whew - long post. It doesn't directly answer your question about "why was 4.1 so different?" - but gives you an idea about why I was skeptical when you saw charging rates as low as you did.
I dunno, maybe the % charge prediction value numbers are screwy on your tab for some strange reason in 4.2, perhaps because of a minor hardware difference. I can't rule it out - I once saw a bug expression in a hardware/software combination that required three independent conditions (from three separate vendors!) to have precise configurations before the bug would show itself.
I hope this post gives you some ideas to try; it certainly doesn't give a solution.
Good luck - if you feel like spending more time investigating, go for it; just don't let the clock run out on the warranty period if you have one left.
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Click to collapse
Wow thank you so much for the help. I'll play around with this tonight and see what happens. If I can't figure it out by the morning I think I'll be able to RMA it without feeling like I just rolled over and let my n7 get the best of me.
So after charging it on stock 4.2.1 with the power completely off it only charged 3% in a little over a hour and voltages read 3.6. I'm gonna leave it on the charger over night turned on starting from 3% with only two extra battery monitoring apps installed and report back in the morning with screenshots of the results. After that ill probably revert to 4.1.2 drain the battery fully, charge it off for an hour report the values then let it charge fully with the battery apps on for reference take a few more screenshots then lock the bootloader install the ota and ship it off to good old ASUS since it sounds like its hardware from whats been explained.
FWIW, I drained my N7 last night (LOL, typing novels into XDA threads) - when I finished I was at 6% charge - that was 3.66v. In the morning @ 100%, the battery voltage was 4.1-something.
Sounds to me like you've definitely got a hardware problem.
Good luck with the RMA.
Canyou help me?
Since I flashed 4.2.2 my 240V-USB charger only cahrges thes battery about 5% in one hour.
Before (with 4.2.1) It was definitely faster. It charged more tha 5% per hour (maybe 20-25%).
I double checked the plug in the socket. checked the correct fit of the USB cable on the docking station.
Everything fits tight. No wiggle.
It must be software related, since it started after flashing the OTA zip from 4.2.1 to 4.2.2
Polarfuchs said:
Canyou help me?
Since I flashed 4.2.2 my 240V-USB charger only cahrges thes battery about 5% in one hour.
Before (with 4.2.1) It was definitely faster. It charged more tha 5% per hour (maybe 20-25%).
I double checked the plug in the socket. checked the correct fit of the USB cable on the docking station.
Everything fits tight. No wiggle.
It must be software related, since it started after flashing the OTA zip from 4.2.1 to 4.2.2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From a partially charged state, say below 50%, turn the device off, (NOT sleeping, but powered OFF) and put it on the charger for one hour.
It should charge at around 30-40%/hr.
As I pointed out above, how is it possible that software would be affecting the charging with the device turned OFF?
I believe you are seeing exactly what you report; my best guess is that a hardware problem occurred just about coincidentally with your upgrade. Just coincidence - not causation.
You also should inspect the battery voltage (see above for path in /sys) in case something crazy is happening with the %charge *prediction* (it is not a measurement) - because the total charging range is from about 3.65v-4.15v, a normal charge rate should be roughly 150 to 200 mV/hr
good luck