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Am I the only one to fnd that WM5 is a complete waste of time and not worth upgradong for let alone buying. It is in fact a huge step back from 2003.
First of all the flaky Activesync 4 which has had minimal testing on anything approaching a real world PC. How could any developer worth anything have not tested this on a machine with half-decent secruity measures, especially moving the sync protocol to use the TCP/IP stack. TCP/IP -> firewall -doh! (not the laughable toy Windows Firewall either).
Onto the operating system itself, where do I start?
1. The new "improved" memory management???? where is the improvement. How can you class something an improvement when it slows everything down, makes usability more difficult.
2. The communications manager. ....why???? a dumb interface hiding access to needed functions, especially when you are setting up a wireless access, why put on a pointless window just to be able to "switch on" a function???
3.GPRS why hide functionality again? Why remove the connect option from the icon on the top bar. Why do I have to start an internet explorer session just to connect to GPRS?
4.Messaging. Why remove the send/receive button? now we have to press menu then navigate to the send/receive function. So much easier to use...I think not... and why is Outlook email the default, we are not all corporate clones yet
5.Contacts. Where are all the customisation funtions, why can't i arrange the display to suit me. Why can't i select more than one contact at a time, which bright spark of an MS designer (whose only experience of the real world is the trip to the coffee machine) thought it was a good idea to only select one contact at a time....
6. Uninstall programmes, doesn't work properly, stupid error message about not being able to uninstall completley, then bits being left over even in soft reset, making a hard reset inevitable. double doh!!!
7.Installation failures, for example installing MS own voice command, warns not to install on anything but main memory but then when that is selected comes up with a classic null error message, and takes up over 50% of the program memory anyway.
For those of us who haven't got time to sit and devise brilliant technical workarounds, for us who have to deal with an irate user group having this approximation of an upgrade forced upon them. WM5 is a complete waste of space.
:evil: :twisted: :x
First, I totally agree with you about ActiveSync 4 - at best the testing and quality control was simply shoddy but not different from a lot of other sw these days.
@1 I like the new memory management even though it contributes to decreased performance. To have everything stored in a non-volatile storage and then execute out of ram is a much better architecture IMHO.
@2 I disagree. The advertised direction of WM5 was toward less use of the stylus which the buttons assigned to things like the Conn Mgr improve. My beef is that there is no GPRS control in Conn Mgr - can't turn it on, can't turn it off. I would like to never have to use the stylus - never!!!
@3 Totally agree!
@4 Before I had to use the stylus - now I don't - much better for me.
@5 Agree.
@6. I didn't find the uninstall to work much better in WM 2003. One almost has to do a soft reset before uninstalling and then I always check afterwards with Resco Explorer for stuff still left around.
@7. I have found that a lot of install errors are with legacy software not upgraded to WM5. In fact, almost all the errors and soft resets on my KJAM have been caused by old software not ready for WM5.
I do wish that before MS puts out a release of any software that they force the developer(s) to live it it for a week or two. Sometimes I think that they do indeed consider the real world as a short walk from their office to the coffee machine. Maybe WM 5.1, 2 or 3 will be better.
Frank
The saying goes "never buy the first iteration of a major release", and it's true. There's teething troubles that should have been caught in testing, but for me the advantages outweigh the disadvantages, specifically stylus-free use, and persistent storage.
We all have different requirements, hence the device won't be right for anyone. I'd imagine that an inevitable service pack will fix some of your complaints, but others really won't be addressed.
As for dealing with an irate user group, well, I wouldn't roll out a device like this to a user group unless I was confident in it. If you work for a network, I guess you've got no choice.
It used to be that early adopters of this sort of thing were geeks/technophiles at heart, but now a phone is a fashion accessory they're getting into everyone's hands quickly... The good news is that pressure should force manufacturers to get fixes quickly.
As for the wish that MS wanting developers to eat their own dog food, well, they do... However, the demographic of an MS developer or even business manager is a bit different to the audience for the device. I would still imagine that a hell of a lot of "focus groups" etc have been involved in designing the OS etc.
I guess sales advisors in the phone retailers should be aware of the potential pitfalls and be advising people as to whether the device really is for them or not. I've had huge problems with AS4.0/1 and my firewall, but I know that I'm on my own and that phoning t-mobile would be as much fun and use as kicking myself hard in the crotch.
I think the AS4 issue is going to be the single largest issue posing a challenge in the uptake of newer devices in the enterprise area. Large companies will not compromise on their existing security profiles just because MS can't get its newest product to coexist with even their own firewall... What a joke!
Activesync 4.1 is much better than AS4.0. I have been using build 4807 shortly after getting my K-JAM, and its much improved over the original 4.0. I updated to the beta build 4807 about a day after getting my KJAM (and installing 4.0) and its heaps better.
fmcgirt said:
My beef is that there is no GPRS control in Conn Mgr - can't turn it on, can't turn it off. I would like to never have to use the stylus - never!!!
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Click to collapse
The red phone button will kill a GPRS session if you just hold it down for a few seconds..
Dox
Dox said:
fmcgirt said:
My beef is that there is no GPRS control in Conn Mgr - can't turn it on, can't turn it off. I would like to never have to use the stylus - never!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The red phone button will kill a GPRS session if you just hold it down for a few seconds..
Dox
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, I know about turning it off - but you need to run something like Messaging or PIE to turn it on - and some of my internet apps will no longer cause a GPRS startup so I have to run something else first - insane!!!
Frank
I feel your frustrations. I don't get it either. Microsoft seems to market their stuff to guys with a lot of time on their hands to troubleshoot problems. I always feel like a beta tester...within about 10 minutes of using something, I usually find some kind of glitch, bug, or problem like the Activesync bugs.
Wouldn't this be obvious to a big company who spends a lot of effort on R&D?
inbox7 said:
I feel your frustrations. I don't get it either. Microsoft seems to market their stuff to guys with a lot of time on their hands to troubleshoot problems. I always feel like a beta tester...within about 10 minutes of using something, I usually find some kind of glitch, bug, or problem like the Activesync bugs.
Wouldn't this be obvious to a big company who spends a lot of effort on R&D?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe they have so much effort in R&D and so little in Testing and QC because they have learned there are many of us that will buy new, shoddy stuff and spend the time to help get the bugs out that they don't have to bother - just get it out there and all of us dummies will gobble it up..
I am with you in feeling like the beta (or even alpha) tester - it doesn't take that much effort to discover bugs, glitches, inadequate user interface features, sync problems, etc., usually an hour or two with a new device is more than enough for me.
Maybe our expectations about converged devices are way too high. I know I compare the phone part to my old cell phones and without exception think: "Why did they leave out that feature?" or "Why doesn't this work?", "Why is the RF so lousy?", etc. And do exactly the same thing with the PDA part. I really don't think we will ever see a converged device that is as good as two very good separate devices - at least with the present set of OS developers and hardware manufacturers. Their mindset simply won't allow it.
But for me, I like my KJAM very much and even though I hate some of its problems and dumb implmentations, I would never go back to seperate devices. I think my frustrations are more with my feeling that with a little more effort things could be a lot better. And with the prices we pay I think we deserve that effort.
Frank
k_kirk said:
I think the AS4 issue is going to be the single largest issue posing a challenge in the uptake of newer devices in the enterprise area. Large companies will not compromise on their existing security profiles just because MS can't get its newest product to coexist with even their own firewall... What a joke!
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Click to collapse
This could not be more wrong. From direct experience of corporate network protection, WM 5's dependence on AS 4 is a Good Thing (which is why MS state it is a concession to Enterprise pressure). The move to use the standard IP stack means the network manager can regain control of who has access to his network and who doesn't. It puts an end to people connecting their PPC to their work PC and syncing over all the crap they have stored in their home PC, deliberately or otherwise. That includes virus infected files in My Documents, porn, and pirated software/music/video. Or just personal information that in hindsight they rather we didn't see. Millions is invested in protecting corporate networks and this has been long been comprimised by PDA users (on all platforms) "innocently" syncing their personal devices. It's not just one sided - it protects the user against accidentally loading something onto the corporate network that could instantly lead to dismissal under most corporate network usage/abuse policies.
There's no unforeseen "bug", or technical reason why AS4 doesn't work with a firewalled PC. It just needs the appropriate policies setting by the firewall administrator (be that personal or corporate). That's how it should be.
I got tired of the random misbehavior of ActiveSync 4.1 (Official Version) via USB and decided to try a Bluetooth connection using the instructions under the Help Menu. No problems setting it up, connecting or syncing so I think BT is the way to go for me from now on.
Frank
EDIT - Still having problems!!! Faster connecting but still slow "Looking for Changes", hanging, etc. Soft reset sometimes required.
Ineedtoys said:
k_kirk said:
I think the AS4 issue is going to be the single largest issue posing a challenge in the uptake of newer devices in the enterprise area. Large companies will not compromise on their existing security profiles just because MS can't get its newest product to coexist with even their own firewall... What a joke!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This could not be more wrong. From direct experience of corporate network protection, WM 5's dependence on AS 4 is a Good Thing (which is why MS state it is a concession to Enterprise pressure). The move to use the standard IP stack means the network manager can regain control of who has access to his network and who doesn't. It puts an end to people connecting their PPC to their work PC and syncing over all the crap they have stored in their home PC, deliberately or otherwise. That includes virus infected files in My Documents, porn, and pirated software/music/video. Or just personal information that in hindsight they rather we didn't see. Millions is invested in protecting corporate networks and this has been long been comprimised by PDA users (on all platforms) "innocently" syncing their personal devices. It's not just one sided - it protects the user against accidentally loading something onto the corporate network that could instantly lead to dismissal under most corporate network usage/abuse policies.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Although it's annoying, as I can't affect the firewall policy on my work PC, I have to concede it does offer a way to close a big hole in corporate security...
Ineedtoys said:
There's no unforeseen "bug", or technical reason why AS4 doesn't work with a firewalled PC. It just needs the appropriate policies setting by the firewall administrator (be that personal or corporate). That's how it should be.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't agree with that though. It should be the case, but in my case (on my own PC), with all the correct policies in place, AS4.1 still refuses to connect until I actually unload the firewall completely. If I set the f/w to "Allow All", it still won't sync. The logs show no packets being rejected, so it should work. The comments on the MS ActiveSync help pages suggesting users may have problems with VPN clients and other applications that slot themselves into the protocol stack suggests that one or both parties are using coding techniques/functions that aren't as robust as they could be and have left, in my case at least, something that looks like a "bug". When it does work smoothly, and I can petition our IT people to amend the corporate policies and maybe open up AS over SSL for my GPRS connection, it'll save them having to shell out for as many Blackberries for people who've already paid for their own devices...
Dox.
There's no unforeseen "bug", or technical reason why AS4 doesn't work with a firewalled PC. It just needs the appropriate policies setting by the firewall administrator (be that personal or corporate). That's how it should be
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd love that to be right, but it's really appearing that it isn't. Sygate Security Agent just doesn't seem to be compatible. When set to "pass all traffic", it doesn't work, and when I manually configure around every blocked piece of traffic, it still doesn't work.
Weird...
If you have any suggestions for what else I can do to get this working then I'd really be grateful for them.
I got my MDA Vario on 5th November. It's my first PPC/WM device ever, after owning a Palm T3 for two years and Psion 3c and Revo before that.
For me, ActiveSync 4.0 (supplied with the Vario) has worked smoothly and flawlessly right out of the box over USB and BT connections. I've now upgraded to the new official 4.1 release and that is just as reliable. I'm syncing with my personal laptop running Win XP Pro SP2 and all MS Windows updates.
I have the standard Windows firewall enabled, NOD32 AV and MS Antispyware Beta for my system protection. As I use a NAT router with SPI I think I have enough protection to not need any further/alternative firewalls running.
I haven't added much software to the Vario, just....
SPB GPRS Monitor supplied with the Vario;
Mapopolis mapping and route planning;
Ghisler Total Commander;
Eidos Tomb Raider.
It is all working just fine
I think it's generally well accepted that AS works fine as long as you're not running anything strange (and by strange, I mean "non-Microsoft" ) on the firewall front. Unfortunately some of us are
Chiark, fair enough, I understand that. But I question why people feel the need to run alternative firewalls. I understand they stop "phone home" type contacts, which a NAT router won't, nor Windows firewall, but I feel it is enough to be protected from external attacks and to let my AV and anti-spyware take care of the trojans and worms.
But each to his own, I suppose.
Windows Firewall is not popular with a lot of corporations... My company has decided on Sygate Secure Agent and has deployed it to over 30,000 employees. They're not going to change as a result of an incompatability with AS4!
The point is that MS needs to be working hard to correct this fault, and address the issues in the above posts.
:?:
I am just about to purchase a new PDA. I am deciding between the Wizard (o2 xda mini s) and Universal (o2 xda exec).
The universal seems to have everything I want, but I am scared by the posts here.
So I have one basic question for you guys:
Do you think:
1. There are basic hardware problems which can't be resolved until there is a new version
2. It is just a buggy software/firmware issue, and this will be fixed by the current and future firmware upgrades ?
If it is 2, I will not mind buying it ?
thx
Only a personal viewpoint, but my view is that most of the problems are being caused by software that claims to support WM5.0 - but the reality is that although they do support it, not all software is as robust as it should be. I have installed and uninstalled a whole range of applications (purchased and trial versions) - and found that many cause lock-ups etc. After trial and error I have settled on a PIM (Pocket Informant) and a closer/launcher (GSPocketMagic) that work reliably, do not cause my Universal to lock up and do not seem to have any effect on system speed. Others I have tried may cause lock-ups or at least really slow the system performance down significantly. Not sure if others have found the same - just what I have found by trial and error. Hope it helps
that is a very interesting point. I was very influenced by this article:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=35177
Also it seems if you read aximsite re: dell x51v, that Wm5 is not as compatable with wm2003se software as people think.
What also seems to be adding to the issues is that the service providers (o2, orange, etc.) are NOT aware of this and are installing applications as standard (e.g. battery meter) which actually cause lags in answering phone calls as they are not correctly for Wm5.
I guess the question is now, does the jasajr work fine when all bad the sowftare is uninstalled, and is it possible to uninstall monitoring software that service providers have installed ?
I just bought mine on Monday... great piece of kit!
If you are just going to use the software that came with it you shouldn't have any problems at all (i haven't anyway) all is working well.
I think as soon as WM2005 becomes more established and more developers cater for it the glitches will go, like NH said, it's more 3rd party software that's causing the problems
hey budo, which service provider did you buy from ?
how is surfing the internet using 3g (the real reason I want to buy it, as I will keep my normal mobile for phone calls)
rgds
My position is clear. WM5 itself has bugs and does things you don't expect. Here are just four examples of WM5 probelms which are nothing to do with third-party apps:
- If the Camera app is left on it heats-up the devices as it drains the battery
- On downloading email over GPRS/3G the Messaging app can freeze
- Media stored on the SD card when used by apps when the "suspend" option is used can cause the app to fail when you re-start your device
- WM5 can report it has insufficient memory even when it has 20MB of RAM free
- Memory leakage means you need to reset the device daily
- If you do reset it is possible to loose settings and data if this data has not been written back to the persistent storage from the real RAM
O2, and they give you 3 options for "install type" so if you want all the bells and whistles you can switch it on, or if you want just the basic software you can switch that on lol...
I have to sort my internet out for 3G, needs to be config for some reason.... but from what i have seen from GPRS it's top dog esp with sites that cater for mobile internet....
this is not good jah, i am put off again. although this could be fixed with a firmware update if htc provide that kind of thing. Anyone know their record on this for other devices ?
hey budo. If 3g is turned on, it should use it automatically for connection, even if it says gprs. that is normally how all my 3g phones have worked when 'bluetoothed' with a pda.
Colonel
I assume you have seen this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33871
I am not trying to put you off but just want to make sure you have a balanced perspective. I have an Exec and all I can say is that it is "high maintenance" like all M$ based systems
thanks, i'll read.
I'm not sure I totaly agree with you about M$ stuff. I had a dell x50v and currently have an orange m500, and they are perfectly reliable and low mainentance. It does seem however that the hardware people have rushed out wm5 systems without really doing their research and I am sure M$ is responsible for a load of bugs. Roll on WM5se ......
colonel said:
hey budo, which service provider did you buy from ?
how is surfing the internet using 3g (the real reason I want to buy it, as I will keep my normal mobile for phone calls)
rgds
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sux. This pixel doubling issue means that you don;t get anywhwere near the estate you expected. U can switch to Oz VGA but that costs a 5 min reset either way - easier to get to a PC! The other issue is that the IE browser is SO bad that 3G surfing feels like GPRS - in fact I used to fire up my laptop just to check that I had a good 3G signal in the area and was indeed surfing on UMTS!! Issue is that browser renders slowly, and cache's so badly that it actually reloads the whole friggin page when u go 'back'. I could have my laptop working on a 3G card right alongside my JJ on 3G, type in xda-developers and press 'go', and my laptop would give me the screen in seconds, whilst my JJ would take a full minute!! We're taking over 10x slower. Also, many sites do not render in PIE - blank drop boxes etc. In SA that's movie booking gone, not a SINGLE TV guide site works, and altho my private bank works, my company bank does not. However, terminal services in VGA is awesome...
craigiecraigie4
I don't really have problem with 3G and PIE. I use T-mobile and o2 in the UK and the rendering etc is reasonable given that I did not expect laptop like performance on my Exec. The Exec in corp mode with GSPMagic+ is very quick.
I love my MDA more and more now. But after my first week or two i was begining to think i had made a mistake buying it. Thanks to the kind and helpful folk around here and other forums, i now have it doing everything i wanted it to do and in the way i want it to do it.
I use it for TomTom, playing DIXed DVD's, music, podcasts, games, the usual email/web duties and more. And thanks to the great WiFi 'G' reg hack i can now stream my large lossles FLAC files (with the help of fantasitc Conduits Pocket Player) right into my Hifi system, just like my Squeezebox 3 media player. It's actually much better than an ipod (albeit with less storage when out of the house - although i could access my music at home from a hotspot). A fully fledged media streaming device for free! (well, a small fee for Pocket Player and a 2.5mm to 3.5mm jack adaptor).
Not only does this hack also enable 'g' speeds, but i can confirm that it also massively increases performance on 'b' speed networks too (which mine is limited to due to being an 'adhok' network).
Sure, a faster proc, better camera and maybe even 3G would be nice. But i have no wish to ever make video calls or use Skype (i'm the geek of the group and no-one else i know uses it).
I understand there will always be better third party software (Media Player is an utter waste of space for example) but why should we have to make techy and annoying tweaks to the registry, just to get the best from the unit? Why the hell do we need to hack the reg just to make a basic settings change, such as hiding SIM contacts (which is an option in just about every mobile from the last 5 years).
Is it just bad planning? Poor thinking on the manufactures part? or is there just a genuine reason for 'hiding' these settings and not making them accessable from standard menu's?
The older i get, the less time i have to mess around so much. I have better things to do these days to be honest.
Surely they would have more to gain by activating the performance increases themselfs, rather than us more tech savy types to figure out how to alter the registry. Half the things this device has been slated for in reviews can actually be sorted, but the average (make that normal) buyers of this device will be feeling a bit short changed if you ask me.
I guess the only thing left for me to do now is dump the T-Mobile ROM and use a more slimline one. Or maybe i should just figure out who to lose some of the crap from my existing install?
What is it with these companies? Don't they know when they are on to a good thing? Or maybe, just maybe it to keep us coming back for more and upgrading year after year? Hey ho...
/rant over.
Dom
Very interesting topic, well put and one which I'm sure will be relevant to me very soon...y'see my Wizard arrives in two days and it was reading posts such as yours which helped me take the plunge.
I don't mind messing about with PDAs, phones, PCs etc to get the the best performance but (as you rightly point out) we shouldn't have to. However, given the thousand of threads and posts on this (incredibly good) site, I am somewhat confused about what to do first with my Wizard.
So, could you please take a few minutes to post what changes, hacks etc you have done to get yours where you (almost) want it to be?
Many thanks in advance.
Mos
mosgeo said:
So, could you please take a few minutes to post what changes, hacks etc you have done to get yours where you (almost) want it to be?
Many thanks in advance.
Mos
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The first things i would always do after a hard reset (format), after syncing back all my contacts/callender of course...
Reg hacks (main ones, i have forgot a few) -
*Hide SIM contacts (so the dont appear pointlessly twice)
*Enable 'g' speed Wifi
* Disable the annoying 'you are about to go online' message. You will understand when you get yours, VERY VERY annoying - you get it even when you are online and just switch back to PIE.
* There are some good performace tweaks to, which i forgot about.
Essential software i could not be without (some free, some not - unless you are naughty. Don't be naughty now )
*TomTom (Sat Nav)
*Memory Map Pocket Nav + GPS and the O.S. maps i use for walking
*TCPMP - The best video player
* Conduits Pocket Player - the best music player IMO (Streaming, gapless playback and OGG/FLAC support - nice). costs a few beer tokens, but free good alternatives are available.
*Resco File explorer and Reg editor.
*Opera Browser - Renders pages faster than PIE, handles java script etc better and Tabbed browsing makes GPRS speeds much less of a pain.
*Memmaid - for cleaing up temp files, dead registry entries etc.
*Storage tools - for formating and sorting out MiniSD cards - WM5 can't even format a bloody memory card!
*Wififofum - for finding WiFi networks (more for fun than anything).
*OMAPclock - for a bit of overclocking (more for fun again, i rarely feel the need is that great)
*And of course registry wizard for the good people of these forums
Thats about it really for me, but i am finding more cools things everyday to play with but those are my must have ones - i have had to install
A few must have games include, AOE, UFO, 3D pool and Soduko.
Personally i dont use a today plugin. I have not found one i like yet and most have icons etc that are to small on the MDA's small screen or just make clutter rather than really help me. A well organised start menu is enough for me.
Oh, and of course you can flash the ROM. But i have not done this yet. T-Mobiles version does not seem that bad but i hear the O2 version is a real dog and well worth doing. I just worry about lost Wifi and GPRS functionality i have heard about some people having.
Really wasn't expecting a reply so soon, and certainly not such a comprehensive one. Thanks for your time. I may be back with more questions once I actually get my mitts on a Wizard. Cheers!
yes I agree , it is great post, specially for new people like me, I got mine (Qtek 9100) just on Friday, and I am still figuring out its functions.
But I have question - if you have time to answer - I really don't know about WiFi function -which is in the device- , if I want to connect to the internet I should have a wireless router connected to my main PC, is that right ? I have read some of posts in here, that they can connect to the Internet - through their PPC - when they are outside or walking or traveling from area to another, by scanning for the nearby Connection, then they can use it to visit websites, does this cost money when they connect to the Internet using the WiFi ? And how can I do the same if it doesn't cost m money ? Can the "WiFi Fofum" program do this o is it only to scan any available connection nearby ? How can I connect to the internet (through WiFi) when this programm finds connection? And if it is really totally free..
I know this are bunch o Questions But I really want to use this function - if possible - specially that I work outside my city and I have to spend couple of hours travelling almost everyday. I appreciate any comment.
Wireless router at home if you want to use it wirelessly or if you do what I do now and then..... connect via the USB cable to your PC. Out and about you can connect for free if someone has a wireless network within range that has no WEP security enabled
There are wireless spots around the country but you have to pay for the main ones via an account you have to set up (kind of pay as you go) Cloud is one company that runs WiFi hotspots on a PAYG basis.
If you leave your WIFI scanning it will tell you if you are within range of a network, it will also tell you if it is secured or not, if it isn't then 9/10 you can just connect and use it
I have been meaning to make a post just like the OP. You are on the mark, IMO! This situation really begs the question, how can this thing be so feeble out of the box?
Thank you XDA and all of the kind people on this forum. You have been the best!
Thomas1234 said:
if I want to connect to the internet I should have a wireless router connected to my main PC, is that right ? I have read some of posts in here, that they can connect to the Internet - through their PPC - when they are outside or walking or traveling from area to another, by scanning for the nearby Connection, then they can use it to visit websites, does this cost money when they connect to the Internet using the WiFi ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In my case, my service provider (Cingular) offers a service called GPRS/EDGE, which lets the Wizard access the Internet through the cell phone connection.
I use the WiFi when I don't have a good connection. Most of the time, for browsing mini-websites and sending e-mails, there isn't much speed difference between WiFi and GPRS. I don't think the Wizard is fast enough to process more than a few 100 kbps of data.
If you don't want to (or can't) pay for a GPRS service, it's possible to "war drive" for access points. The Wizard will find them, although its WiFi reception isn't as powerful as a laptop's.
On my phone, if I enable WiFi, the phone will automatically use WiFi instead of GPRS when WiFi is available. If you don't want to pay GPRS charges, you might want to configure the phone so that it doesn't use GPRS.
can you explain 'wardriving' please? is it just freely using wifi points without paying? bit confused
Thanks
Jamie,
You are correct in your assumption !! You would be amazed at the number of 'unlocked' WiFi routers out there....
Ever tried running Bluetooth detection in a pub and seen how many phones are out there too ?
If you can find an unlocked WiFi router running DHCP - 'Fill your boots' !! Sometimes it's even possible to guess IP addresses of other PC's on the network, access em and leave a kindly note to thank them for their hospitality but warn them of their folly and the potential for disaster......I know I have but then that's me: Mr Altruism
Ok how can I get any internet connection through WiFi ? Should I just enable my WiFi and it'll scan for any available connection nearby ? I did but nothing happened, it wants from me to fill form which I really don't know anything about it... Or do I have to use a program to scan for connection ? And if yes, should my WiFi be enabled ? What is the best program for scaning ? I wish if someone explains me all that and how can start using WiFi to get a connection and an access to the internet but slowly, will be thankful.
Im new to all of this, but what can you do with the registry wizard and how do you install it? I foud a zip file for it, but cant get it to load.
Thanks!
i have a question too if you have the time mate,
I don't exactly want to use the edge since i dont have an unlimited plan or something.how can i delete these settings and do you think any problems will occur?(sending recieving mms)
basicly i don't it to connect to edge(gprs)auto.is there a way to fix this
thanks so much.
In fact, it's a 400 bucks piece of utterly unreliable, useless crap.
Since I got my device back from "repair", it's been a mixed experience. Most things work, some make me cringe in despair.
Today is a bad-TyTN day and I'm really, really <expletive/>.
After the repair, I thought my "No GSM" problems were gone. But today, the first time I really couldn't do without it, it crashed a couple of minutes after I unplugged it from the USB-ActiveSync 4.5 link and told me again "No GSM".
And of course, the result being:
- All POP3 accounts lost, and now I lost all emails and have to use different account names to set them up again
- Network connections credentials lost, even built-in. No I can, again, connected by other means, go figure out how to set these up or,
- finally, hard-reset the device, which is a pain in the neck because I have no out-of-the-box backup.
I'm not even running any third-party software on the device for fear of introducing non-linearities. I did not even install the brand-new TomTom 6, also since nobody seems to be able to sell a sufficiently large MicroSD card at this time.
Who's to blame for my bad experience?
Did I do something wrong? Setting the lock-timeout to 2 hours instead of 12, so it locked during the ActiveSync session?
Did HTC screw up so it would reset some "protected storage" when the GSM card is not detected for some magical reason?
Does Windows Mobile 5.0 AKU2 just have too much bugs to be reliable?
Does my provider E-Plus Germany suck for confusing the device with poor, unreliable UMTS coverage and internet connection problems?
It's a mixture of all these things, I guess. There are too many moving parts, most of which aren't sufficiently documented by Microsoft, or kept up-to-date software-wise by HTC and the service providers.
Examples:
- Messaging that unrecoverably screws up my POP3 accounts and there is no documentation in the SDK about the setup to fix it myself.
- The worthless MediaPlayer, that abandons it's meta-data when the storage card is released.
- The HTC phone software that at times wouldn't let me hang up on occasions, or doesn't start, or keeps using a bad UMTS connection even if GPRS is available and good.
I thought the TyTN would make a great every-day device for a phone and a software development platform for new-class applications.
So far, it's been one of the greatest time-wasters I've ever acquired.
Just like any other toy.
Useless crap.
Not had anything quite as bad as that. Never had to hard reset due to irreversible problem. But, yes quite a few soft resets and in a way although I want to disagree with you I think the device is cutting edge and could easily have been held back a year to iron out some problems. However as you say some of these problems are down to WM and telecoms providers. For business I would not get one of these but probably something with fewer features but high reliability.
For trying out the new or new combinations of features I would still buy a TyTn in preference to anything similar and yes a large part of this is about experimentation and an acceptance that if this were not cutting edge in some ways then reliability would not be acceptable. As it is though my business use is low on TyTn having "Fun" and experimenting is high. My rant is about releasing the device with obvious hardware irritations, the software.. well that can always be upgraded.
Mike
HB_TyTN said:
Does Windows Mobile 5.0 AKU2 just have too much bugs to be reliable?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Surely not - the problems you've listed (particularly the stale e-mail accounts) are not MS-related problems but because of stale WinCE database entries.
Next time DO run SKTools 3 to clean up the mail databases instead of hard resetting your device.
Furthermore, it's a very bad a idea to send a device in for service that still has data on it. You should have wiped it before sending anyway...
If you view a PPC Phone as a primary data storage/communications center, then you're in for a disappointment. On the other hand, if you use it as an extension of your personal computer, then not only will you have a very productive device but you'll keep your sanity.
I've always used this strategy since my first sync experience on a Nokia 6210 six-years ago. Appointments and contacts all easily synced to my phone. Replaced that with grey t68. Then came the PocketLOOX 600 (touted as first convergence device - nice idea, poor execution). I tolerated the buggy loox for 18-months before trading UP to an h4150 running wm2003se. Great device. Kept a t610 for phone, ppc as outlook back-up.
Arrived in Taiwan for an extended business trip end of July -- immediately picked up the local version CHT9000 (aka Dopod 838pro). Through this forum, someone graciously made available the first English language ROM -- a tad buggy, but later upgraded to my current ROM (dopod 1.23) and in everyway it has exceeded my expectations. I take it to the US and it my t-mobile account with gprs keeps me connected. Recently spent two weeks in Korea and all over China -- again, UMTS available most places, GPRS/EDGE filled in the blanks. Mobile carriers everywhere will love HTC for bringing this device to the masses.
Don't have to, but it's prudent to sync the device at least once a day. In the event you lose the device, it's stolen, or you're forced to hard reset, because it's just a 'copy' of your outlook system, it's no big loss.
All that said -- I'd recommend this device to anyone with at least some technical savvy. Without this, they could never appreciate truly the first quad-band gsm/tri-band UMTS, BT2.0, WiFi G, PPC Phone with both a useable keyboard AND a real scroll wheel and would be better off owning a Chocolate or some other Nokia/SonyEricsson 'fashion accessory'.
Cheers
Menneisyys said:
Surely not - the problems you've listed (particularly the stale e-mail accounts) are not MS-related problems but because of stale WinCE database entries.
Next time DO run SKTools 3 to clean up the mail databases instead of hard resetting your device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why do I have to use 3rd-party tools to fix such a problem? Where is the KB article about it, either on Microsoft's or HTC's or on my provider's website?
goestoeleven said:
Furthermore, it's a very bad a idea to send a device in for service that still has data on it. You should have wiped it before sending anyway...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Before repair, my device had the "Does not reliably detect SIM card" problem, that clearly discouraged me to put any data on it.
As requested by my service provider, I sent in the device hard-reset, without SIMcard, SDcard, battery, or stylus. I even removed the screen protector.
So all that's lost now (EMail accounts, passwords, WiFi, and what not), has been set completely new AFTER repair.
aquanaut88 said:
If you view a PPC Phone as a primary data storage/communications center, then you're in for a disappointment. On the other hand, if you use it as an extension of your personal computer, then not only will you have a very productive device but you'll keep your sanity.
[...]
Don't have to, but it's prudent to sync the device at least once a day. In the event you lose the device, it's stolen, or you're forced to hard reset, because it's just a 'copy' of your outlook system, it's no big loss.
All that said -- I'd recommend this device to anyone with at least some technical savvy. Without this, they could never appreciate truly the first quad-band gsm/tri-band UMTS, BT2.0, WiFi G, PPC Phone with both a useable keyboard AND a real scroll wheel and would be better off owning a Chocolate or some other Nokia/SonyEricsson 'fashion accessory'.
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I appreciated the great feature list of the TyTN by putting more than 400 bucks on the table and commited to an additional data plan as well as another 24 months of mediocre network coverage and service.
As I said, I planned to use it for developing pocket pc applications and little helpers to make my life easier.
I use it as an extension to my laptop, it is connected to it via USB most of the time, to charge and sync.
But feel like I could demand that it reliably keeps my data until I sync again.
If I have to always carry my laptop around to get that reliability, then it would have been way cheaper to go with a UMTS modem card instead.
If something is only useful to technologically savvy geeks, without reliability for the Joe Public every-day user, then I consider it a toy. Maybe a great, feature-overbearing, remarkably innovative toy, but nevertheless, something to play with, not to rely on.
Unfortunately, beside the technical problems that could be overcome by updates and repairs, it's a systematic issue that support is split across Microsoft, HTC and my provider.
As I said, it's terrible hard to figure out if a problem is caused by my fault, inappropriate settings, too little or too much tweaking, mediocre network coverage, hardware faults or software problems.
I wouldn't mind hard-resetting the device every day, if there was something resembling a simple backup _out-of-the-box_.
By backup I mean settings, including personalization, network connections, email accounts, sms/mms, custom ringtones, etc.
And that's exactly what I'm into finding to buy or writing myself.
Finally, again
Hang, bang, gone. "No GSM" again.
This time not recovering.
The new thing this time: My service provider E-Plus doesn't accept it for repair.
I should quit my day job so I can fully concentrate on the struggle with this heap of crap.
HB_TyTN said:
In fact, it's a 400 bucks piece of utterly unreliable, useless crap.
Since I got my device back from "repair", it's been a mixed experience. Most things work, some make me cringe in despair.
Today is a bad-TyTN day and I'm really, really <expletive/>.
After the repair, I thought my "No GSM" problems were gone. But today, the first time I really couldn't do without it, it crashed a couple of minutes after I unplugged it from the USB-ActiveSync 4.5 link and told me again "No GSM".
And of course, the result being:
- All POP3 accounts lost, and now I lost all emails and have to use different account names to set them up again
- Network connections credentials lost, even built-in. No I can, again, connected by other means, go figure out how to set these up or,
- finally, hard-reset the device, which is a pain in the neck because I have no out-of-the-box backup.
I'm not even running any third-party software on the device for fear of introducing non-linearities. I did not even install the brand-new TomTom 6, also since nobody seems to be able to sell a sufficiently large MicroSD card at this time.
Who's to blame for my bad experience?
Did I do something wrong? Setting the lock-timeout to 2 hours instead of 12, so it locked during the ActiveSync session?
Did HTC screw up so it would reset some "protected storage" when the GSM card is not detected for some magical reason?
Does Windows Mobile 5.0 AKU2 just have too much bugs to be reliable?
Does my provider E-Plus Germany suck for confusing the device with poor, unreliable UMTS coverage and internet connection problems?
It's a mixture of all these things, I guess. There are too many moving parts, most of which aren't sufficiently documented by Microsoft, or kept up-to-date software-wise by HTC and the service providers.
Examples:
- Messaging that unrecoverably screws up my POP3 accounts and there is no documentation in the SDK about the setup to fix it myself.
- The worthless MediaPlayer, that abandons it's meta-data when the storage card is released.
- The HTC phone software that at times wouldn't let me hang up on occasions, or doesn't start, or keeps using a bad UMTS connection even if GPRS is available and good.
I thought the TyTN would make a great every-day device for a phone and a software development platform for new-class applications.
So far, it's been one of the greatest time-wasters I've ever acquired.
Just like any other toy.
Useless crap.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is the first BIG complaint i have heard about the product.. Second, wow, what did you do to it that it had to end-up in repairs? (fiddler??) Third, if it does give this much problems, then there was something wrong with it from the start, but you didnt take it back an did not insist on a swop?
Look at this app, install it and see if your gsm still is disabled?
Also check your settings again to make sure all is set to the right ones! Else you got a big problem or just dono how the thing works(just saying this coz 80% of all problems are caused by the user him/herself!! See it everyday then they blame me!).. RTFM
Or it could be a virus!! hahah That would be funny!!
OH, your rom version!! Wow dude!! Update the thing!! ROM Version: 1.18.257.2; ROM Date: 05/30/06
http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=Hermes_Upgrades
HB_TyTN said:
Hang, bang, gone. "No GSM" again.
This time not recovering.
The new thing this time: My service provider E-Plus doesn't accept it for repair.
I should quit my day job so I can fully concentrate on the struggle with this heap of crap.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just as testing purpose: superCID it and try to flash with HTC South African 1.35 Rom
The ROM update worked for me. It took a lot of work to get mine running how it should after that, 3rd party software, reg settings, and I must admit it runs beautifully now. But when it came out of the box it was bloody awful, wouldn't turn on, take 5 seconds to hang up, freeze etc.
One word ... iPhone, hmm.
Hallo HB_TyTN
Like you I am on the E-Plus network (at Hannover), and use a O2-branded Tytn, same firmware. However, I never experienced problems like you, and like us others got used to occasional soft reset requirements, mainly related to the 3rd party Today items I use.
Now that HTC is in the retail market by itself it is certainly not wise to buy their wares over service providers (unless like you one buys on contract), since HTC for machines bought with them will go to greater efforts to repair or exchange machines. Eplus will not repair your Tytn, but usually just send you another "refurbished" one from the same batch they got from HTC.
For the moment you seem stuck with E-Plus, and you can attempt to pressure them into proper service according to German law. Another possibility is in fact to try the South African ROM, and see if it improves your machine. Third option is to beg HTC for direct repair, maybe with confirmation from E-Plus that they cannot help you, and send the machine directly to a HTC repair centre. If you send in your machine, please mail a copy of your attached letter to Fred Liu, HTC COO office, 23 Hsin Hua Rd., Taoyuan 330, Taiwan, R. O. C.
He is the COO of HTC and the top boss of HTC Europe. Coming to Germany soon, he will not want to make enemies here ))
Now after 10 hours it booted just fine and I'm just rapiconfigging back my email accounts and networks.
Reestablishing Bluetooth pairings and TomTom actvation is still manual.
I'm not fiddling. First time it failed right out-of-the-box. After repair #1 I only installed SKTools and TomTom Navigator 6.
ROM upgrade is no option, E-Plus/Brightpoint have not published an update. So there would be no way back.
Last repair the device wasn't switched (same S/N, IMEI, ROM version), so I guess they couldn't repro the problem (that would also explain their refusal to repair it again).
Next time I'll rush to an E-Plus shop as soon as it happens.
lol < well this sucks. cant use less than 10chars.. > lol
My first experiences with the TyTn also were disappointing. It took me weeks to get it more or less useable, and even now some things are not as convenient as they were on my Symbian phone. Here are the things that bother me (some are solved by 3rd party applications, others are not):
General:
- onscreen keyboard pops up even when one is using the hardware keyboard
- no way to backup all the settings
- often hard to navigate when not wanting to use the stylus
- only one language for text entry (word completion and transcriber)
- no data counter (gprs traffic)
- wordcompletion intervenes too much (when I type a Dutch word "wel", after typing the space after the word it changes it to we'll, no way to prevent this)
- wordcompletion only shows one possible next word (no way to scroll between different candidates)
- any setting that is slightly more advanced or deviates from tradition is either hard to set or impossible
Messaging:
- no way to specify the imap-root folder
- not possible to switch SMTP servers (even the from field cannot be chosen when sending a mail, nor can mails be moved from one outbox to another) (other mail clients I tried have problems with my VPN)
- cumbersome downloading (headers only: one has to open a mail and then choose to download it, then click send/receive; why not download it when this is chosen? or even when it is openend?)
- many notifications for sms (sent notification in messaging client, sent notification from network, receipt notification) when sending messages (and one cannot mark them as "read" from the todayscreen)
- applications are not very well integrated (e.g. file explorer cannot send a file via bluetooth)
Calendar:
- always opens on day view, would like to change this to month view (but is not possible)
- day view should be scrolled down to show the start of the day (e.g. 8.00 at the top of the screen), now I have to scroll from 00.00 down before I can see stuff)
- cumbersome entry of time (esp. when entering times that deviate from the time slots)
Phone:
- no support for different call profiles (where a profile is essentially a call filter)
- when one contact has multiple numbers, the phone application only shows the last used one
Network:
- when you add a VPN server, then delete it, you can't add one with the same name (even though it has been deleted)
- wifi starts detecting all networks, and does not necessarily start with the networks one has been connected to in the past
Bluetooth:
- limited profiles
- sometimes counterintuitive
ActiveSync:
- sees the device as new every now and then (causing it to say it conflicts); I have to delete the device on my PC and let it find it all over again
Programs folder:
- is alphabetically, would be nice if one could order this to his own liking
Alarm:
- no snooze function
- unnatural way of entering time and repeat options
File explorer
- no way to view extensions of files
I've learned to live with some of these problems, but I would have expected Windows mobile to be a more mature system. I had to choose a WM5 device (so I new I had to compromise), due to the fact that I wanted to run some specific application (PocketFMS), but didn't anticipate I had to compensate this much. (of course, no of my issues is purely HTC related, but will be present on all WM5 devices)
In total, I personally consider Symbian (Series 60) to be more efficient, better customisable (one is less forced to do things one way) and (never thought I'd say this) more stable.
Jörg
hmmm.... the fact that I'm listening to mannheim steamroller over A2DP at Las Vegas airport while typing this reply on my TyTN is evidence of my disagreement with the OP. This device has done incredibly well at CES. unbelievable functionality in tough tradeshow conditions. i'm really happy with this little gizmo!
Nevermind, I really love it, too. Otherwise I wouldn't spend so much time with it.
But posting in a stable network environment (I'm on home WLAN right now) is not really a proof.
Try this when moving in a crowded area with weak 3G coverage, say on the subway. Add sensitive hardware and a mediocre provider and things go south.
It's unfortunate your having so many of these problems - my Hermes has been excellent! I haven't had any of the issues you listed. In fact, mine has only locked up once, and that was today (and I use it religiously). I've had it hard reset on it's own, but that was caused by Hackmaster. You should definitely try a ROM upgrade, if you haven't already.
At CES, I was using my TyTN on Cingular's network with 110,000 other geeks (kudos to Cingular btw... coverage was great!). Even so, my device was handing off between GSM and UMTS constantly and Cingular experienced at least one major data network meltdown that I could detect. Perhaps it was the combination of 1.35 & the 1.20 radio that made mine work so well.
The worst problem I had was A2DP, but after the first day I found out it was because so many other people had bluetooth going that there were simply not enough available frequencies to support A2DP's high bandwidth demands. All the vendors were bemoaning the fact that their A2DP stuff "just wasn't working right"....
My main usage in priority order are (a) mp3 player, (b) phone, (c) contacts, (d) notes and (e) browser (but only via wifi at home).
The iphone seems quite a bit slimmer and appears to have better browser capabilities. While I've never had a data plan, it would be great to be able to surf the web better at home. I've never used the 8525's keyboard nor the preceding 8125's so the built-in kybd is lost on me.
I don't use the 3g, text msg, skype e.g.
I do use the mp3 player function quite a bit; I have 2g and 1g microSDs.
Any other pros and cons of the iphone for my five main usage I've missed ?
Thanks
The iPhone sounds ideal for the functions that you need. The only drawback I can see is that you can never change your mind.
Let's say in 6 months time, if you/your job suddenly have the need to have task management, or gps or you need a finance program, tough. You kind of lose out on all the versatility of WM/Palm devices. And it's expensive.
But, as long as you're convinced that's all you'll ever need, then you are probably right in your choice IMHO.
The lack of open architecture is a problem..... not providing long term flexibility. If you use your phone a lot, you may sometimes become bored with the look or the interface and want to change it. That's not an option with iPhone. Then there's the cost of the phone and the plans.... too high for me. I prefer to have carrier options as well.