Database Users

size and build quality

how do you guy's live with the chunky size of the unit and is the build quality as bad as some reports ?
thank you

i am on my 4th mda
1st: crashed a lot and keyboard not quite set right into the frame - wireless manager button sticks up slightly
2nd: metal top plate offset and scratching my ear
3rd: loud creaky hinge with loud clicks
4th: camera fault - big white dot on photo's
on my 1st exec i have a misaligned keyboard as with mda 1, and minor camera pixel dropouts
i think build quality is pretty awful, and will keep* my exec and get the mda swapped out for a vario or something.
* might take it back and see if I can get a fully functional device from them, after all I paid 99 pounds for it :lol:

I had one MDA Pro and now I have an XDA Exe and both were/are excellent, great quality devices.
About the size - I had all the previous XDAs so I got used to the big phones already. I'm not using any bluetooth headsets, and I always carry it in my jeans back pocket , no problems at all for me.

I am on my first and only Jas Jar - the thing is brilliant- no problems at all. As for size, I always use mine with a BT headset and voice command when making or recieving a call, so no problem there either.

I am on my 3rd Jasjar. First was taken away by my boss. 2nd had an Arabic/English keyboard and did not like it. Now on 3rd unit for over 2 months. All had excellent build quality. No complaints from me whatsoever.
Kind Regards

Mine seems fine so far. Havent noticed any problems and im usually one for spotting things. Was worried about dead pixels but both my wizard and uni are clear as a bell.

i find the entire flimsy plastic body of the MDA Pro to be quite a weak design. I put my first one in my pocket, jumped in the car, drove for an hour, took it out and the phone had been bent in my pocket slightly. No apparent external damage but the screen had a beautiful crack right through the middle.
At one of their shops they accused me of damaging the device myself, but fortunately the insurance paid out, even though I had to pay an excess. I have never had any problems with my XDA2 or my MDA3 and for this to happen within 5 days of actually getting the phone, I am not very confident it will last 18 months.
Furthermore I keep discovering pieces of software are not included - Messenger (which is a shame as always good for long journeys on a train) and most of all - Calculator - I can't believe it, not even the old basic one.

I think you should look once again :wink:
There is a calculator in PROGRAMS
and the MSN Messenger is in POCKET MSN, first position from the top

lloydalikes said:
i find the entire flimsy plastic body of the MDA Pro to be quite a weak design. I put my first one in my pocket, jumped in the car, drove for an hour, took it out and the phone had been bent in my pocket slightly. No apparent external damage but the screen had a beautiful crack right through the middle.
At one of their shops they accused me of damaging the device myself, but fortunately the insurance paid out, even though I had to pay an excess. I have never had any problems with my XDA2 or my MDA3 and for this to happen within 5 days of actually getting the phone, I am not very confident it will last 18 months.
Furthermore I keep discovering pieces of software are not included - Messenger (which is a shame as always good for long journeys on a train) and most of all - Calculator - I can't believe it, not even the old basic one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No offense but why would you drive for an hour with an MDA Pro in your pocket. Surely glove box, dashboard, passenger seat or a passenger holding it for you would have been preferable.
To be fair you cant blame the design for that. If youve had it in your pocket and obviously bent it in some way, then the screen being damaged isnt beyond reason.
Its no good buying one of these devices and then expecting it to fit in a shirt pocket like it isnt there. Its a big phone, end of !
As ive said before, the design seems ok to me and its everything I have expected it to be so far. Maybe in months to come I might find one or two shortcomings but not so far.

Maybe my opinion will sound odd to most of you, but I really find Wizard much more "bulky" looking than the Universal. This thing is so thick!!! Even if overall in size the Universal is bigger, it's got excellent proportions and it just "looks the bollocks!!" as my friend said :wink: Of course I'm talking about the XDA Exec which for me looks way better than M5000 or MDA Pro...

rottie said:
Of course I'm talking about the XDA Exec which for me looks way better than M5000 or MDA Pro...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally agree with that comment! Just swapped from an MDA Pro to an XDA Exec and it actually seems smaller. I guess what they say about black being more slimming is true

rottie said:
Maybe my opinion will sound odd to most of you, but I really find Wizard much more "bulky" looking than the Universal. This thing is so thick!!! Even if overall in size the Universal is bigger, it's got excellent proportions and it just "looks the bollocks!!" as my friend said :wink: Of course I'm talking about the XDA Exec which for me looks way better than M5000 or MDA Pro...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Couldn't agree more, I think the Wizard looks FAR bulkier, yet because it's a bit smaller and traditionally-XDA style, people say THAT's the smaller of that and the Exec.
The Wizard is a good phone, admittedly. However, a lot of excess plastic if you ask me.
And black is the ONLY colour for the Universal! hehe
Ant

I have the Universal and the wife has the Wizard, I am costantly amazed at what both devices are capable of. When using my Universal in the car it sits on the dash with the four rubber feet, screen open and on display, works and looks fantastic. I love the larger screen on the Universal and also like the 3g support. As for size I prefer the Wizard, It just feels more comfy to hold and use like a phone, I still feel weird holding the Universal to my ear, I don't use a BT headset yet, keep trying to find a surgery that can give me a bluetooth implant behind my ear :shock: I actually find myself using the keyboard on my Universal less and less now, and opting to leave it screen out and use the onscreen keyboard. The twist is nice but I am sure its is already getting slack. I guess my ideal device would be a hybrid of the two, wishfull thinking and totally over the top but, same size as the wizard, same screen as the universal and with 3g but the screen, imagine opening a wizard with the base being thicker than the screen and as you slide it open the screen tilts up and can rotate so its perpendicular to the keyboard so it looks like the universal, keep going and it ends up facing the keyboard and would close back down screen facing in, no need to twist the screen about a single swivel anymore.
I may even knock up a short avi so you can see it in action.
Regards

I am on the whole , pretty happy with my Exec
The only thing that bothers me is that it seems (only very slightly) slower than my old Magician !
I have had to learn how to answer calls on it (i.e if it rings while it is closed then LEAVE IT CLOSED TO ANSWER IT ! ) Which leads me to my only real gripe - No way of seeing who is calling with the clamshell closed
As for the size thing - anyone who buys one of these knows exactly what they are buying into - I personally have no problem with big phones wouldn't want the Exec any smaller

I've probably said it too many times... I love my phone! in spite and despite of...
When you love something that much, you get to love every bit of it.. bulky size and all. I still look sheepish when answering a call with a brick in my ear but I glow when all my officemates jot their notes on a paper while I just type it on my dopod900.
I still go berserk when the ringtone suddenly changes to another despite my change in the registry but I think I can live with going to settings and all..
So there, Im gonna borrow McDonald's slogan and say "Im Lovin' It!"

I do not see any problem with the size and build of the Uni.
I have the first XDA for 3 years or so, and now I use both the Uni and the XDA. Because I have been using the XDA so long, I do not have any problem with the Uni. They are both relatively about the same size and weight and same usage. Nobody laughes at me when I hold the big phone next to my ear, because I have done that for years with my XDA.
I laugh at myself when I noticed how funny its when having a bug (BT headset) in my ear now.
Overall I really like the Uni though it still cannot replace my XDA fully in certain environment where I do not want to take the risk of having the Uni handles the job. But in office and home, Uni is perfect.
Software wise, when the XDA came out, the software loaded were really buggy, it took years before finally everything became really stable, so with that matter of fact, I could accept Uni at its right now with hope it will be close to 100% perfect in the near future.

jasjar with no build or quality problems, and I love everything except the name. (I'm still planning to get around to using that sugar cube.)

I'm pretty impressed by the overal feel of my Qtek. The plastic feels very strong, it doesn't look or feel like a cheap plactic box. The rotating hinge works flawlessly, but when I put my screen in laptop modus, there is a very minimal play. But I guess this is normal? Can anyone confirm!?

More Quality HTC engineering

High Tech Crap have once again surpassed themselves with the Wizard.
My stylus is held in by sticky tape and the paint flakes off, however even worse my good friend Alex's died a few days ago of its own accord. He thought maybe it had just run out of batteries so he plugged the charger in and within seconds it got so hot that it burned him and melted all the internal stickers off. god knows what would have happened if he'd left it.
Just a warning. Sounds like a lawsuit to me

Your issues seem atypical--I've been reading through this forum for a few months now and haven't come across a single one where somebody said their Wizard blew up/melted/what have you. Sorry you're having problems, but isn't that what a warranty is for?

Doubt the paint and stylus are covered by warranty, certainly not the paint as they know its just an issue full stop and would be replacing each and every unit constantly.

I disagree with your assessment. See here.

Well when your house burns down, don't say I didn't warn you
Doubt the paint and stylus are covered by warranty, certainly not the paint as they know its just an issue full stop and would be replacing each and every unit constantly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They should do. You'd think for the price these things would be built to the highest standard. They MUST know these things are issues when they start producing these. Either that or they did NO product testing. I don't understand how it passes EC quality control.
If you bought a car and the paint fell off you'd expect it sorting out. I bet the paint won't flake off the Sony Ericssion p990.
If each of us here wrote to HTC/Trading Standards/our service providers we could get a brand new handset each.
In fact, if I start a petition on here that just requires name and email address, and sent it to HTC, threatening to send it to trading standards, how many people do you think would sign it if it meant a free device for each of us?
Because TBH, I'm pretty sick of spending hundereds of pounds on HTC junk only to have it fall apart after 2 months EVERY TIME, not to mention the software issues. In fact, I'm pretty sure they're required by law to replace things like that.

mike freegan said:
Because TBH, I'm pretty sick of spending hundereds of pounds on HTC junk only to have it fall apart after 2 months EVERY TIME, not to mention the software issues. In fact, I'm pretty sure they're required by law to replace things like that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am really sorry to hear about your issues. However, you must understand that the K-JAM is nowhere near the Casio E-200 as far as quality is concerned. I went through 3 E-200's and the product line was so bad, Casio eventually pulled it off the market and not soon later exited the PPC market altogether.
I am on many forums and have heard relatively few complaint other than the standard stylus-loose issue and maybe just a complaint here and there that the paint on the blue "E" for internet explorer came off. Considering that the Wizard comes from Imate, T-Mobile, 02, DoPod, etc it seems relatively few people have the same issues as you mention. Personally, I beleive either you treat your device harshly or you got one from a bad production batch. I have had my K-JAM for 8 months already, and aside from the stylus being loose nothing else is wrong with the device.
If you are that dissapointed, get on the phone with support and demand that you want a replacement unit. Tell them exactly what you complained about here that you didn't expect such an expensive device to peel and chip. See how that goes.

Please read properly.
My device is fine. I was talking about my friend's device. I assure you, I take excellent care of mine.
My point was that there should be safety mechanisms to prevent things getting so hot to the point that they melt and pose a fire risk, no matter how badly you treat it (which he didn't).
The only faults on mine are the loose stylus and the flaky paint -both known problems. My point is that for £400 you shouldn't have to put up with either. I mean, if you buy a cheap, low quality phone for £20 I bet the paint wouldn't flake off, so why do HTC who charge so extortionally for what should be quality products be forgiven for cutting corners and selling shoddy hardware?
Also, it's only because of the gurus on here like Vijay and Buzz that our devices work at all. We shouldn't have to rely on these guys working volentarily to try and patch up the bugs left in by HTC/Microsoft. It's not even like the odd bug; EVERY SINGLE ROM is full of serious errors that HTC know are there and affect even basic functions. I am grateful to buzz/vijay, but it sholdn't be their job to do it. They don't get paid to do it. For the price we pay, you should expect maybe the odd bug, but not some of the ridiculous and obvious errors that HTC sell these devices knowing about (talking more about the BlueAngel/Universal really, but alot of people report Wizard bugs too)
Also, saying a device by another manufacturer is worse does not justify making a sub-quality product. If the paint flaked off you car, I wouldn't try and defend it by saying that the wheels fell off mine so you should be happy. That's ridiculous. you paid alot of money for a product which you should expect a certain quality from.
I think if just a few hundered of us petitioned, threatening to involve trading standards, it might just give HTC a kick up the arse, show them that we won't just put up with this stuff because they can't be bothered fixing it and get them to put a little more effort into ensuring the hardware and software quality of their next device.
Viva la revolution

Sleuth255 said:
I disagree with your assessment. See here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That maybe so but it doesnt change the fact that the paint flakes off.
What would the conversation to support go like ?
Consumer " Hi I bought a device from you and the paint is flaking off. "
Support " Yes but the device will survive should it be dropped in water "
Consumer " Really ? "
Support " Yes. "
Consumer " I didnt realise. Sorry to have troubled you. "
:roll:

right.... I guess I deserved that....
I'm actually wondering if HTC actually makes all the various cases for these devices. Or, do they sell the basic insides as an OEM provider and the end seller provides the rest. This wouldn't apply to Qtek devices of course as these probably would be completely produced by HTC.
Case in point: I'm not aware of paint peeling or loose stylus issues on the 8125. Perhaps somebody can correct me here.

now this is funny!!! I have not had any problems with the phone yet. But i would sign if anyone started it. I will stand by my boys in arms hehehehe
but i do think there is a diffrence between a car and phone, that the phone takes alot from being in a pocket or something ( how about we all put car paint on our phones) and a car is made to withstand rain and so fore. But i do think that it should be abit better for the price.

mike freegan said:
Please read properly.
Also, saying a device by another manufacturer is worse does not justify making a sub-quality product. If the paint flaked off you car, I wouldn't try and defend it by saying that the wheels fell off mine so you should be happy. That's ridiculous. you paid alot of money for a product which you should expect a certain quality from.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I seem to remember the old Citroen BX's cost a lot of money in their day and the paint flaked off... people still bought them though.... and they still worked... not to mention the fact the wheel could fall off and it would work too :lol:
seriously though. i agree that the paint flaking is a bit of an issue, and the stylus not seating properly is poor design. I do think however that fighting via a petition for them to replace our devices with equally as faulty devices is a waste of time. Example for this is my friend and I both have owend smart roadsters. they both slightly leaked as with nearly all cabriolets, but he moaned and demanded they fix it (i didnt!)... it went in for the supposed leak fix and came back worse than before and he had to reject the car (upsetting himself at the same time because he really loved that car for what it was). I just dont quite see why i would want to cut my own nose to spite my face right now

Cry me a river, this is what is known as the bleeding edge.
Look what you are holding in your hand, its a miniature PC with bluetooth, wifi, a phone with gprs/edge, a PDA with a full keyboard. This is an incredibly elegant device. Yes my stylus falls out but when I took it apart I was totaly impressed by the elegance of the design, flawed maybe but not the china crap I've seen. Also understand how the supply chain works. HTC contracts out with flex or foxcon or whomever which actually manufacture these, most all electronic mfg do this. So as a mfg you are dependent on the quality of your sub, yes you can and do police them but with a mobile workforce you are going to get quality issues. It's just the way the world works and as was said, that's what the warrenty is for unless of course you flashed a new rom or opened the case and voided it, then tough luck.

Well, I would agree with thompsd. I mean, HP and others have phones that work much stable, better and the paint doesn't flake off. So, why don't you just go ahead and buy yourself an HP Phone? I'm not sure about your reason, but I just can't affort an HP, and I don't really like the bulky HP (though their recent device looks promising, not sure about the price).
Hey, consider the HTC company is like.. how old? Oh man, give them some slack. I think they are pretty good in putting in so many things into such a small unit and if they aren't that good with their paint job, so be it. However, having said that, I'm still expecting them to be getting much better soon, inside out. Go ahead with your petition thing and good luck.
BTW, how does the 'easily scratched' iPod case ended?
Anyway, as for the fire thing, it is not an HTC issue only. The invincible Apple had laptop camp fire here and the mighty Dell had their contribution on the conference.
My advise is, don't leave any electronic stuff left unattented.

@ JNGold
First of all sorry for deviating from the true subject of this thread.
I am glad that you are happy with the build quality of your wizard. Since you have been using your device for 8 months I would like to know if the keyboard sliding mechanism is showing any signs of wear / looseness. I am interested in this because previously I owned the i-mate pda2k (HTC magician) and over few months of use the keyboard became quite loose to the point that it would slide open by its own weight if held vertically.
I am now considering going for the HTC TyTn once this is out. My only apprehension is the quality of the slide mechanism and your comments would be really helpful.
Thanks and Regards

Why do you repeat buy HTC if you're having such issues with their devices?

My point is, if HTC can do such an excellent job (and it is excellent) of getting so much technology into such a small space, and charge so much for their devices, why not just spend the extra 5 minutes to make sure the paint doesn't flake off? I don't understand why they think they can sell something which is faulty.
It's a device designed to be mobile and carried in a pocket (hence pocket pc/windows mobile). For £400 you are entitled to expect that the paint will be to a reasonable quality like EVERY other phone on the market.
I have just noticed that every HTC device has a whole host of small flaws that could be avoided so easily and at no extra cost, if they just thought about what they were doing. My friend has programmed for Windows Mobile and he tells me that they know its full of bugs and clashing scripts because of a lack of cummunication between departments, but they just release the software anyway, where an extra couple of days resolving the clashes between each application would solve the problem.
I mean, someone's worked really hard making all the hardware fit in the case which is the difficult part, but then not bothered designing or testing the stylus issue, something which is obviously gunna suffer from wear and tear.
I don't want a replacement device, but I just think that if we scare HTC/our service providers a bit with threats of trading standards, and show that alot of us are interested then it might make them spend the extra couple of weeks testing their next device and making sure it works well before they sell it.
I mean, the Sony Ericsson P990 does everything the wizard does, and more, but I bet they made sure the paint doesn't fall off and the stylus stays in. high functionality does not have to mean low quality.

Err... Can't speak for the p990 but the p800 I had suffered from peeling paint and stylus issues as well (cracking styluses, styluses that fell off) as well as a notorious keyboard design that actually worked until you put it in your pocket and broke the two tiny tabs that held the top of the keyboard away from the screen. So Sony-Ericsson isn't the acme of product perfection you hold them to be.
The only peeling paint I have had with my wizard has been the qtek label on the bottom. Which to me was no great loss.
To me the biggest issue with this phone has always been the software. Which honestly has improved dramatically since the 1.x firmware days.
I knew going in that the wizard had the potential to be a disaster of a phone hey lets see, an innovative package and feature set and new software from Microsoft is quite the triple threat for product mayhem but 9 months into it I have little to complain about.
That may all change tomorrow when the phone decides to self-whimilate or some such thing. but for now I'm content.

How good is Hermes as a phone?

Hey,
I am confused by the number of choices I have of purchasing HTC devices (of course this is a good thing ). I currently have HTC Magician and am looking to upgrade to a newer device. My question is mainly for people who have owned Magician.
How does Hermes compare with Magician as a phone? How is the reception? How is the in call audio quality? Can the person on the other end hear you? This is important for me as this will be my primary phone.
Is weight/size difference noticeable?
Thanks for your help!

at this moment, i think hermes the best phone ever i had. i'm previous owner of magician. with all the improvement features from magician, it also has more features that magician.

I upgraded from the Magician to the Hermes (Vario II) a month ago - and it cost me since my old contract still had time to run.
The Magician is a decent PDA/phone and it convinced me that a combined phone/PDA was the way to go for me. But it was limited (slow, no 3G, no wi-fi, no keyboard etc.) so I decided to upgrade.
As a phone, the two devices are virtually identical. There is no real difference. Both are fine as phones. I've had no problems whatsoever making or receiving calls on the Hermes (or the Magician). But as a PDA/communication device, there is no comparison. The Hermes blows the Magician out of the water.
The form-factors are similar. The Hermes is slightly thicker (thanks to the real keyboard) and slightly heavier (same reason - plus the extra features) but I store both in their cases on my belt and I don't notice any difference.
The Hermes is a next-generation mobile device. There is no comparison with previous models.

The Cingular 8525 I just got has better voice quality for both sending and receiving than my previous Motorola V551 and v557 phones. It is also better at picking up the signal when it is weak and holding onto it.

Agreed. As a phone, the Hermes has superb sound quality, and the speakerphone is top notch!

One thing I have noted though is that the loudspeaker is very loud - a little 'too' loud for me, I wish that sometimes I could turn it down just another couple of notches, especially when using it for handsfree. It always distorts a bit, and that really bugs me.
I'm sure there's something that could be done about that in software, as the in-call volume slider seems to do little if anything at all...
The Hermes blows my last phone (the Alpine) out the water though. Hardware keyboard, slinkier form factor, WM5, all those lovely features - granted I have had problems with mine but I think that was due to it being one of those problematic early model revisions. I had a herm634, my replacement (which I got today) is a new herm643, so hopefully all should be solved now!
One bugbear: no 3.5mm headphone socket. Whyyyyy do I have to use the glorified mini-USB connector headphones (which incidentally are SHOCKING)?! Granted I know I could get some good quality in-ear headphones, do a bit of soldering and homebrew my own headset, but I really can't be bothered.

Hermes is a great phone, slightly too chunky though, but perfectly reasonable for what it does.
I miss my Magician, and frankly would be quite happy with it still, but the keyboard on the Hermes has grown on me. Of the HTC phones on the market right now, it's perhaps the best (Herald might be attractive, Trinity and Artemis have CPU issues I guess, and lack keyboard)...
I also had the problem with the speakerphone being too loud, had to return it. Watch for manfacturing issues - I had a dodgy scroll wheel (sometimes scrolls the wrong way for one click), speakerphone, and there used to be touch screen issues. These have probably all been corrected in manufacturing now, but check...
A great phone. But do check out the new Etens.
V

Not sum of its parts..
I came from Treo 650, as it died and I needed a new PDA/phone. I like the Hermes, but from a comparison point of view I am on the fence.
I like the WM5, better than PalmOS. I like Hermes' speed of operation and its networking capabilities/speed better. But Hermes' accessibility (one-hand dialing, contacts, etc) is nowhere near Treo650/PalmOS. If it wasn't for voice dialing, Hermes would have been returned long ago.
As a phone, I also think Treo 650 is stronger. I had better call hold times with Treo. With Hermes, I think the earpiece volume is low, and I experience fequent call drops, which I didn't have with the Treo. I tried fixing the mode on GSM or on UMTS, but I didn't feel a difference. I also tried at least 4 different ROMs and radio-only ROMs. I am now on the latest HTC ROM (with Cingular in NC USA), using the same SIM card as my Treo had, and I have call drops at least two times out of ~ 10 calls a day.
As a package, however, Hermes is better than Treo 650. Slide-out keyboard alone, is enough for me to live with the other shortcomings.

I also came from the 650.
I was never happy with the reception.
And I needed VC just to get the volume up to a decent level.
Even with the latest Rom Update, it still wasn't as good as my wifes cheap moto 180.
I am even more disappointed with the 650's reception now that I have the 8525.
The 8525 is the best phone I have ever owned. I may even pass on the 750.
Oh, and my speakerphone is too loud also.

I know how you feel about the magician vijay555. Its a terrific phone and wm2003se works so much better than wm2005 imo. BUT the hermes is better, everything I liked about the magician I also like about the hermes, it seems to run a lot faster than the atom and the 3g is very fast (when covered). For me the only thing that could make my dopod better is if it was double the size and vga. I like big screens and it would be more usable for internet browsing or reading.

HTC done good!
I've been thoroughly impressed by the quality of my Cingular 8525 as a phone. Better signal acquisition especially inside buildings where I previously could find no reception, calls are (to my ear) clearer, and the mic is quite sensitive. My speakerphone is too loud in a non-noisy environment and the volume controls are somewhat coarse, but overall, it's a better phone than my old Nokia.
mdf

Also have to mention that the protection for the loudspeaker is much better than on the Alpine - on the Alpine, it's very flimsy: the cover, held in by what appear to be two prongs, can be easily dislodged if you bash or push it, and then it rattles against the speaker all the time. Without totally removing the case and pushing it back in from behind (because that's how it's fitted), or even better glueing it in place, it becomes REALLY ANNOYINg and it makes telephone conversations nigh impossible to understand unless you have it turned up full volume.
Now I have my Hermes, I might take apart the Alpine (I was afraid to while I was still using it as a phone in case I broke it) and try to fix it. Believe me, don't carry one of those around in your pocket for a year (like I did) without some kind of case for it! I feel much safer with having the Hermes in my pocket, though: the screen is recessed more, the speaker is fully protected (just a tiny slot through which you use it to listen, and the actual handsfree loudspeaker is on the back of the device), and it fits in your pocket better (not as wide, a little thicker but meh, works for me). It also doesn't slip out of my hand nearly ALL THE TIME like my Alpine did, particularly when i was using it drunk

christopherwoods said:
It also doesn't slip out of my hand nearly ALL THE TIME like my Alpine did, particularly when i was using it drunk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And didn't you notice that the screen alignment problem miraculously disappeared when you were drunk and it was the chicks that slipped out of your hand. A sad and lonely guy, tapping away in a dark corner, pissed but happily grinning with a Hermes in hand and drool puddling on the beer soaked lino of a dingy Brummy dive. The joint went silent, the seedy creatures of the night; painted drugged up waifs eye the guy with the TyTn and you know they're yours cos you're an XDA developer and quicker than they can ask....got the time mister?, you'd done it again but hard this time yep soft was good but as resets go this was a hard moment. The scene ends as Hermes bursts in a climatic, tinny rendering of "Baile la bamba, baile la bamba" as boyo's girl phones to see if he's been arrested for flashing his ROM again.
The very definition of happiness!!

aarman said:
..using the same SIM card as my Treo had, and I have call drops at least two times out of ~ 10 calls a day.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It may be worth your while to try one of the new USIMs that Cingular offers with the 8525/3G phones.

Why Tytn looks so cheap? Shouldn't be the king?

I own this jewel since September and I'm very very happy with it. Nothing compare to symbian or any other smartphone. Palm OS 5.4 was good but is now definitely outdated.
Recently I had the chance to play the new HTC P series products. Although specs are not comparable to Tytn, quality of materials and built finitures are way way way better.
P series quality and look are simply stunning, Tytn is a plastic toy.
To provide an example, it's like holding in one hand a classic nokia plastic shell phone, such as 1100 or 3310, and a Vertu in the other one (or a SE K800 or a Moto K1). I know how many discussions can be raised on materials, look and built quality. Is a V3 really better than a N70, etc. Yet, you get the point.
Tytn is specs leader, but its plastic housing really doesn't fit its overall quality (even Qtek 2020 was better refined).
Why? Simple budget restriction? Tytn price is still higher than any HTC P product though.

Well.. you're flying the Italian flag and they are renouned for their style and culture. On the other hand your location is London so I guess you should be used to over-looking the grim exterior and seeing the quality that lies beneath??
I prefer to say the Hermes (TyTn) is modestly understated as befits a device that does not need frills and frippery to draw attention!!!
As a matter of fact sometimes it does not even ring when people phone it - how's that for modesty!
Mike

and i think i am one of the very few that think this phone feels better constructed and more solid than the wizard... and thats my opinion..
But we all know what they say about opinions..

Italy, as London, is look and inner beauty at the same time.
I'm not discussing its specs or saying that I'm unhappy with it or that is overrated.
My point was that older and newer HTC products look and feel better than Tytn from a strictly materials and built quality perspective.
Just hold for a second in your hand a P series device or any HTC old model (2020, 9090) and you'll fell like Tytn was the black sheep. (I would still get one though!)
HTC claims to be the best manufacturer in the world, but why its best product so far feels like a common plastic nokia?

ergonomically speaking, it's not that great either... especially the buttons. Makes me envy the Treo 750v.. mmmm..

I have a JasJam and i think the device looks great.
Its not all bells and whistles as compared to toy mobiles etc because the jasjam offers solid guts and doesnt need to draw attention to itself.
speaking of the p series, like the p3600 (trinity), yes, they look nice with their black or white polished surfaces etc, but have a look at what is happening to people trinity's after a couple weeks use http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=287713
the casing itelf is actually peeling.

I dunno... I like the look & feel of my TyTN much more than I liked my 8125 (Wizard). I especially like the kbd backlight. That's a real eye-catcher IMO.

Sleuth255 said:
I dunno... I like the look & feel of my TyTN much more than I liked my 8125 (Wizard). I especially like the kbd backlight. That's a real eye-catcher IMO.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I like the design. I agree on the backlight. Not so nice that they used cheap-grade plastic parts for the cover, in particular the back-side cover is cheaply made and looks like "made-in-Yugoslawia" in 1960. But really, really bad is the sliding mechanism. That's really poor, considering the suberb "content", and the fact that this device is sold unlocked for up to 700 US$.

chainbolt said:
I like the design. I agree on the backlight. Not so nice that they used cheap-grade plastic parts for the cover, in particular the back-side cover is cheaply made and looks like "made-in-Yugoslawia" in 1960. But really, really bad is the sliding mechanism. That's really poor, considering the suberb "content", and the fact that this device is sold unlocked for up to 700 US$.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And there's no real reason for the sliding mechanism problem as anyone who's read my fix will know. A tiny detail in manufacture and it would be fine - and maybe is in the newer devices.
Mike

chainbolt said:
I like the design. I agree on the backlight. Not so nice that they used cheap-grade plastic parts for the cover, in particular the back-side cover is cheaply made and looks like "made-in-Yugoslawia" in 1960. But really, really bad is the sliding mechanism. That's really poor, considering the suberb "content", and the fact that this device is sold unlocked for up to 700 US$.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Heavy off-topic: What's was wrong with 'Made in Yugoslavia' products in '60?!? I think they were great if you ask me... Btw, it used to be great country unlike nowadays ones... Over nostalgic...

Maybe it looks cheap (to my taste it doesn't), but it is NOT to my opinion.
I dropped my device several times, on solid surfaces!, but never a scratch!
After about 4 months heavy use it still looks like new.
So I'm very happy with it.

pietrucci said:
Maybe it looks cheap (to my taste it doesn't), but it is NOT to my opinion.
I dropped my device several times, on solid surfaces!, but never a scratch!
After about 4 months heavy use it still looks like new.
So I'm very happy with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm agree with you, but i'l take care on it, realy happy too.

i think that the M3100 looks are deffinately dull and plasticated. the tytn's metal plate and grey plastic make the handset look a lot better i think.
one of the p-series that looks like the hermes/tytn (forgot its name) i think looks more toy-ish.

Dropped a power cable on mine and I've got a deepish small scratch on the navigation button. Noone else can notice it but I can, bloody annoying .

pob said:
i think that the M3100 looks are deffinately dull and plasticated. the tytn's metal plate and grey plastic make the handset look a lot better i think.
one of the p-series that looks like the hermes/tytn (forgot its name) i think looks more toy-ish.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
which metal plate?

I think they just have given up a bit of its looks to add more on the inside! Dont judge a book by it cover!! So far my TyTn is the ****! Wonder why i never got one before! I like the layout! Looks nice! Could have been black, but over long period of use the black would fade and scratch more easy, so gray and silver was the best bet i think!!
If it was made out of stainless or any other metals, then cost would go up! Could also affect signal and whatnot! Also, plastic is more shock resistant!

I've got it and I Like it
I've had the tytn for a few weeks now and I love it. I am not a very flashy guy, and I like the fact that it isn't too flashy. I have the black version and it fits my hand jsut fine.

My problem with the Hermes is the damn front cam. In a video call it is too close compared to my Nokia 6630. They should have put a wider lens or something.

I owned two Nokia 8800 series phones, which were definitely flashy. The 8860 I had (the little chrome phone) was such a pain in the arse though... Fingerprints and cheekprints really ruined the slick look as did the car kit which put scratches on the backside; the chrome on the battery got quite scratched.
I think the TyTN/CHT9000 (HERM200) looks ok; it has the brushed metal look on the front side, which is a nice way to add a little style. Either way though, I'll take the HTC features over the flashy looks of other phones any day.

Some phone companies have better cases than other. The T-Mobile version has nice styled case with a part metalic front and Gunmatel colour. Very cool

Finally, my 4th HD2, a FLAWLESS device !!

As you may have read before, I was really complaining because of the poor voicecall quality, screen alignment with the plastic cover and many other flaws. I have replaced my device twice and got each time a different problem. I decided not to give up...
Today, I got my 4th HD2 and the earpiece problem is GONE!!
The first thing I did was to have a look at the screen. It is perfectly flush/aligned with the cover. It used to be either deeper somewhere at the corners or higher.
The problem with the light sensor doesn't exist anymore and after more than 12 hours of extensive testing, I can say I don't have any problem with machine anymore. Finally a flawless HD2.
One thing I've noticed ( because I'm used to register all my devices the 1st day I buy it ) that the serial number is almost the same as the 1st device having too many problems, the difference is like 372 only and the 4th HD2 is even older than all the previous handsets ( Manufacture date: 2nd of Nov. 2009 )
I believe that this is not a problem with some specific affected batches. IMHO, it is random...
Hope that helped

I didn't follow your previous thread. Do you have a summary on the problems you encountered and may I ask how you proceeded with your reclamation? Was it directly with HTC or through your vendor?
I also notice that my screen isn't perfectly aligned with the cover, it's a bit of gap to the top right, whereas on the top left i don't feel any gap. This doesn't kill me but if there are handsets that are perfectly made, I want one when I'm paying this much money. I also encounter sparkling sounds when talking, specially when using the speaker.

umiss said:
I didn't follow your previous thread. Do you have a summary on the problems you encountered and may I ask how you proceeded with your reclamation? Was it directly with HTC or through your vendor?
I also notice that my screen isn't perfectly aligned with the cover, it's a bit of gap to the top right, whereas on the top left i don't feel any gap. This doesn't kill me but if there are handsets that are perfectly made, I want one when I'm paying this much money. I also encounter sparkling sounds when talking, specially when using the speaker.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually I was forced to sell the devices because they refused to consider the problems as well known... I lost around 100 Euros but got a good device after all... you know we all like perfectionism
Some of the problems like I mentioned :
-The screen not correctly aligned with the plastic cover
-Crackling and noisy earpiece when making voicecalls
-Very loose hardware keys and buttons. They are not rock solid now but way better
-Light sensor behavior was somehow weird. Doesn't always work, dont ask me why
- Screen jitters like the ones posted on youtube.
you can also have a look here : http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=590425
Cheers

Xeon said:
The first thing I did was to have a look at the screen. It is perfectly flush/aligned with the cover. It used to be either deeper somewhere at the corners or higher.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, so as to be perfectly aligned after applying the screen protector. I installed mine two days ago and now the screen is perfectly aligned.

thehawkCB said:
Yes, so as to be perfectly aligned after applying the screen protector. I installed mine two days ago and now the screen is perfectly aligned.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a glass screen, no protector is required. Most HD2 screens are flush with the rubber/plastic sides - there isn't a recess, I would say the ones that aren't flush are manufacturing defects.

I've had 2 HD2s so far and both have the earpiece issue. The 2nd had what felt like poor fitting keys initially, but over the week I've had the phone they've bedded in nicely and now have perfect feel.
I'm just going to put up with the earpiece quality for now, it's not perfect but I'm sure future ROMs will reduce the volume which should be a good start.

Ah Im glad you finally got one that works for you
Hope you enjoy it
Im loving mine Im not as much as a noob as I was when I first posted a month or so ago, where I got flamed

I think I only have the two following problems:
-The screen not correctly aligned with the plastic cover
-Crackling and noisy earpiece when making voicecalls
The buttons are a bit loose but I didn't even notice that before someone else told me about it.
But I totally agree with you, I'm also a perfectionist, but I doubt I'll make any effort beyond contacting the support and see what happens. Specially the bad sound quality.
Oh well, I'm glad you finally found a nice piece. Take care of it now, don't drop it or scratch it

Ah you managed getting another one
Good luck with it! Treat it carefully

Xeon said:
( Manufacture date: 2nd of Nov. 2009 )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How did you get the information about the manufacture date of your device?
It would be really interessting for me to, when my device was builded.
Thank you in advance!

Xeon,
You seem to have gone through quite a few devices so, if you don't mind me asking, does your device have a rattle in the head of the device. I have got replies from quite a few people saying it is normal, but a few also don't have it. It's really starting to annoy me, I thought I'd live with it, but not sure I can now. Shaking the device hardly makes a sound, however, tapping it lightly near the camera gives me a big rattle.
Thanks in advance

My phone has a rattle toward the head area, and upon close examination, it appears to come from the camera at the top ofthe phone.
Since our phone doesn't havevs fixed focus lens, I'm assuming the rattle noise isthe autofocus mechanism.Therefore the noise is perfectly normal in my opinion.

Actually i think you are a bit too paranoic. That's fine, was same with me when I bought it and I think with everyone else. This feeling comes away after 1-2 months of actually using the phone rather than staring at it as at faberge egg from 2cm away everyday to find a scratch or a piece of dustd
p.s. - hardware keys are made that way for a reason and every hd2 has them the same way

NO actually mine doesnt ratltle but I discovered I got a faulty screen with the 4th device... shaking screen/cardio/untyped keys... the screen starts acting weird sometimes. IMO the last device is the worst as the noise problem during phone conversation wasn't solved and the distortion is so much annoying....
**** HTC, I am sorry to say it but nothing more to be expected from a device Made in Taiwan...
That's my last device, mark my words.

Xeon said:
**** HTC, I am sorry to say it but nothing more to be expected from a device Made in Taiwan...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You know where the iPhone is made, do you? And besides the iPhone, pretty much every electronic device you're using...

[sarcastic] You're really lucky man! [/sarcastic]
My first HTC HD2 got broken and I've changed it, bought another HTC HD2.
Noticed that its build quality is really excellent compared to my old HD2 (that was one of the first produced), I've only had some weird problems with the touchscreen like yours, but I've solved it pressing it in the four HD2 angles: now the screen is more IN the device housing in the top right angle, but all of my digitizer problems are now solved.
Now my HTC HD2 is perfect.
Try with that.
Ouh, and remember that the noise in conversation can be a ROM problem!
Mine had too, but updating to the newer TMOUS radios I don't have it anymore!
Just software/network problems
And.. don't be paranoic, the PERFECT thing doesn't exist (talking of the rattle..)!

freyberry said:
You know where the iPhone is made, do you? And besides the iPhone, pretty much every electronic device you're using...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK Apple is robbing people and HTC is following.. thank you.
And no.. Nokia is made in Finland and some other European countries including Germany. You can guess that by looking at the serial number that's why you get what you pay for...
Sony low end laptops are made in china but high end ones are made in Japan like the S/Z/T series... You see, you pay for a top notch device that much of money expecting it to be almost fault free. With HTC you never know, it's all about luck.
It makes me laugh reading how many people here got a faulty handset. When someone states a problem experienced with his heaset, the first answer is " seems you got a faulty device"
For god's sake a fault should not affect more than 0.5% of the devices.. but with HTC, it's like a feature; each client gets a different problem with the hardware. I can't tolerate the polls results.. Like the one with Weird touch screen behavior and issues. More than 55% have a buggy screen.. I know that it's not a case study nor a realistic accurate interpretation but it gives you a clear idea about what's going on.
I swear on my mother's life that this device( including all the previous 3 ) has the worst call quality a handset could produce. Believe me everytime I make/get a call I start blaspheming. I burned more than 1000$ on this device but thanks I took the lesson.
I still have my HD which is almost flawless compared to this product but slow as hell.
Don't mention iphone and apple things as I'm not apple fan-boy

Well, reasoning is obviously no strength of yours. Sad.

Xeon said:
I can't tolerate the polls results.. Like the one with Weird touch screen behavior and issues. More than 55% have a buggy screen.. I know that it's not a case study nor a realistic accurate interpretation but it gives you a clear idea about what's going on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
55% of people looking for answers to a buggy screen have a buggy screen, , , hold the press!
I'd wager most people in a petrol station have a low fuel problem. hehe

samsamuel said:
55% of people looking for answers to a buggy screen have a buggy screen, , , hold the press!
I'd wager most people in a petrol station have a low fuel problem. hehe
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is not a repair center thus not a fuel station, its a poll where anybody looking for applications/tweaks/discussion participates so your " joke" is irrelevant