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Hello all . . . need I say it? But, I'm new. Not just to this forum, but also to pda/smart phones.
I got an O2 XDA Mini S yesterday and began playing. Firstly, quick basic question, are all these the same thing:- i-mate, K-JAM, HTC Wizard and O2 XDA Mini S?
OK, next, I've been reading some sites today and one of the most repetitive things I've found is the recommendation to remove the O2 software from my device - on the basis that it is causing it to run slowly. But, I haven't found that to be the case, but remember I'm new to these toys.
I also came across Magic Button for closing apps properly, not just hiding them.
Lastly, before I move on to the subject of this post - can someone clarify the difference between a hard reset and a soft reset. In particular, if I do a hard reset, do I loose eveyone from my Contacts?
But, here is the question that relates to the subject:-
I turned on bluetooth and tried to send a picture from a Samsung D500 to the XDA Mini, but no luck. I also tried with a Samsung E720, no luck there either. Lastly, I also tried with an Apple PowerBook G4 and it was unsuccessful also - but it was more informative - it basically suggested that the capability didn't appear to be there.
I did turn on bluetooth on all the devices and I also made the XDA Mini discoverable. The two phones could scan and find the XDA, as could the Apple, but neither of the phones could retain the name of the XDA in the list of previously identified devices (I hope that is clear what I mean). The Apple could retain the name, but still can't interact with it.
I have tried changing the COM ports round - ie COM 7 incoming COM 6 outgoing AND COM 6 incoming and COM 7 outgoing, but that didn't make any difference.
The most bizzare thing (not really all that bizzare I suppose) is that Infra-Red works, so I could transfer stuff (albeit awkwardly) from my old phone to the XDA.
I was wondering (probably stupidly) if the 02 software could be limiting the functionality associated with the bluetooth, or if Windows has restricted it to only be used with ActiveSync [I just can't think of any other reason for it not to work].
Any light that could be shed on this would be appreciated.
Cheers.
1. Yes they are all the same things.
2. The o2 software tends to be quite animated, this slows down the device a little, it also masks the way the phone was intended to be used. Its not really necessary which is why its best to remove it. Plus, it free's up memory for other stuff.
3. There is a lot of talk on these forums about different programs that can "really" close an app as opposed to "minimising" to the background. There are "for's" and "against" arguments regarding this. It is true that programs only minimise when you press the "x" button but it does state, er, somewhere, i think it was in one of the help files in the device, that memory is managed automatically by windows and that programs are shut automatically to make room for new ones if memory becomes low. So you shouldn't have to worry about running out of memory, also when minimised the programs appear quicker than if they had been shut down, usually from where you last were too. This can be a good or bad thing depending on the point of view of the user. However, from my point of view and i think i share this with many other users, i "feel better" knowing that a program shuts when i've finished with it and it will start from a common point when i next open it. I think this is more down to the fact that people are used to this than anything else.
The program i use for this purpose is called SmartSkey, made by one of the people on this forum,it can do either and you can have an exception list of apps that minimise only, which is quite useful. Also it makes navigating the device easier with one hand, which is REALLY handy, it may be worth looking into.
4. A hard reset will make your device appear exactly how it did when you first switched it on. Anything at all that was on there will be gone, so yes you will lose your contacts. There are 3rd party applications you can use that can back up the whole device though. A soft reset just restarts the device and nothing is lost. Its equivelent to restarting a windows PC as opposed to Re-formatting one.
5. As regards you bluetooth problem, the only thing i can think of is that i have noticed that the device needs to actually be "ON", not in "sleep mode" or obviously "OFF", in order to successfully receive files via bluetooth. If it is in sleep mode then devices can see it but can't connect. I can honestly say i've had no problems as you describe with bluetooth names and stuff on mine.
Sorry i can't help you more with the bluetooth, but i hope the other info was of help to you. Enjoy your new toy, they are very customisable and as a result of which can be very annoying too. :wink:
Be prepared for late nights and hair loss, else, ignorance is bliss
Thanks for the reply Clivectmob. Very informative.
I've been playing again. This time I sent a picture from the XDA to the Samsung E720 and I was successful, but it doesn't seem to want to work the other way around . . . very strange.
I might bring it back and see if they can figure it out.
If anyone else fancies a shot at a solution, just fire away, I'll take any suggestions.
Again, thanks Clivectmob
Last question.
If I take the O2 software off of this, can I return it to factory settings by doing a hard reset?
Yes you can, as I said, it will be as it was when you first switched it on.
All that software is stored on a hidden ROM on the device, when you hard reset it goes through a customization sequence afterwards where it puts it all back on. One trick is to wait until it displays the customization message, then pull out the battery. Switch back on and it will not customize it, but then you need to manually configure all your conection settings and so on, so you need to be reasonably up on the use of them for that.
I am an airline pilot and noticed a bug with my HD. It seems that after putting the phone in Flight Mode, it is not turning off the "radio" every time. During flight I clip my holster/phone fairly close to where my aviation headset cord is routed so I know immediately if my phone is not turned off as I can hear the GPRS data transfer clicking through the headset.
I have tried "Flight Mode" and "Phone Off" but it only works some of the time. Amazingly, the screen shows an X for the radio and an X for my Edge connection but there is no question that the radio is still on. The radio is only turning off about 30% of the time from what I can tell. On one occasion, after putting it in flight mode and seeing the X's, I was able to place a call (although again, not every time)
Another good indicator that this is happening is when I turn the radio back on (turn flight mode off) the signal indicator pops up almost immediately. Normally after turning the radio on it takes about 10-15 seconds to connect to the system so I believe it never disconnected to begin with.
Thankfully, the new full power-down method of holding the power switch in is coming in handy until I can figure this out. I will experiment a little more on my next trip.
Kind of funny when the Captain is not complying with the Flight Attendants instructions to turn of those damn cell phones!!
Any one else notice this?
Regards,
Gordo
jetjockgordo said:
I am an airline pilot and noticed a bug with my HD. It seems that after putting the phone in Flight Mode, it is not turning off the "radio" every time. During flight I clip my holster/phone fairly close to where my aviation headset cord is routed so I know immediately if my phone is not turned off as I can hear the GPRS data transfer clicking through the headset.
I have tried "Flight Mode" and "Phone Off" but it only works some of the time. Amazingly, the screen shows an X for the radio and an X for my Edge connection but there is no question that the radio is still on. The radio is only turning off about 30% of the time from what I can tell. On one occasion, after putting it in flight mode and seeing the X's, I was able to place a call (although again, not every time)
Another good indicator that this is happening is when I turn the radio back on (turn flight mode off) the signal indicator pops up almost immediately. Normally after turning the radio on it takes about 10-15 seconds to connect to the system so I believe it never disconnected to begin with.
Thankfully, the new full power-down method of holding the power switch in is coming in handy until I can figure this out. I will experiment a little more on my next trip.
Kind of funny when the Captain is not complying with the Flight Attendants instructions to turn of those damn cell phones!!
Any one else notice this?
Regards,
Gordo
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is it really necessary to turn off mobile phone these days? I might have mistaken, but recall reading somewhere that some airlines are going to permit the use of mobile phone as they don't really affect safety. True or false? Or it is just rumours?
Not in USA
eaglesteve said:
Is it really necessary to turn off mobile phone these days? I might have mistaken, but recall reading somewhere that some airlines are going to permit the use of mobile phone as they don't really affect safety. True or false? Or it is just rumours?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The USA has made it clear that it will not approve the use of cell phones in flight because not enough in known about what potential problems may exist if allowed to do so. In Europe, some countries have approved a "Pico Cell" system that places a cell repeater, or effectively a cell tower, on the aircraft so cell phones using the system will throttle to their lowest setting. Since all new cell phones can adjust their power/signal output in response to their proximity to a cell site, airborne phones attempting to communicate with ground towers pose the greatest threat to aircraft systems. There has even been some discussion of putting a Pico Cell on aircraft to throttle back phones that have been left on inadvertently just to lessen the chance of interference.
I will admit that my phone can impede my ability to hear the air traffic controllers if my phone is on and I can also tell if a controller has their phone near their headset jack. It is not uncommon to hear the telltale clicking of a GSM phone receiving a call or pinging a cell tower while talking to someone on the aircraft radio.
As I fly a rather advanced commercial jet, I have seen a noticeable increase in system "anomalies" over the years (most just nuisance stuff, not dangerous!) but the big question begs: Do you REALLY want to take a chance? I am an advanced techno geek and licensed aircraft mechanic and I am the first to make sure my phone is off.
For Flight Attendants it has become a nightmare of electronic gadgets on every flight and they are just complying with regulations when bugging passengers. Their concern is someone from the FAA might be on board and may notice that they are not enforcing the regulation and get violated. My worry is something eventually may happen that can be attributed to the use of PED's (Portable Electronic Devices) causing a ban on carrying PEDs as a shotgun method to make sure it is turned off.
Regards,
Gordo
dang! i had a similar experience today while we were preparing for takeoff. i put the HD in flight mode, put the phone in my shirt pocket, somehow dialed voicemail and i could hear the voice prompts. fortunately, we hadn't taken off yet so i just powered off the phone. i don't know if it was delayed going into airplane mode or not. an hour into the flight i turned the HD on and had no issues with it in flight mode.
Thanks for your very detailed explanation. Appreciate it.
Does it not also pose danger if we just change the setting to flight mode then? Or is it just the GSM portion that is giving the interference?
So, as long as it is in flight mode, we can safely use the "non-phone" features such as game, word procesing, dictionary, etc, right?
I had always wanted to know, because in the past, I had received different information from the flight attendants. Some of them would want me to stop using my PDA all together, while some did not seem to be bothered.
Glad to have two commercial pilots here to give us authoritative information.
Another question that I have is, if an HD with flight mode on does not completely disable the GSM signal as it should, would the interference be significant enough since we're so far from the cockpit?
If the interference of a passenger HD with flight mode on is still emitting significant interference despite the distance from the cockpit, then I think we have an issue that must be brought to HTC's attention. If this is the only handset with this problem, should that require a recall by HTC???!!
Gordo, have you tried getting one of your flight attendence to bring your HD with flight mode on to the passenger cabin and see if the interference is still there?
Whatever is the FAA and JAA tolerance - it looks a real bug. I am a private pilot and constantly kept on the GSM as an additional security in case the aircraft radio or headset would go bad - to call the tower. the tickling of the GSM on the headset is a bit annoying, but since we fly at much lower altitudes than commercial aircrafts we are probably within the field of the GSM cells and switching between them at more reasonable rate.
Indeed, I also noticed that newer TAA (technologically advanced aircrafts), like the diamond da40 with G1000 Garmin glass cockpits, explicitly say in the AFM (aircraft flight manual) to switch off GSM or electronic devices since they COULD interfere with the on-board electronics. Notice that here we are speaking of few GSMs phones, not hundreds like in the case of Gordo which is definitely frightening: in a 747 you could have 1.6 kW of GSM radio emission!!! it could almost heat up the aluminum skin of the fuselage
Let me try to play with the registry and check how to do it. I cannot believe it is hardware related...
eaglesteve said:
Does it not also pose danger if we just change the setting to flight mode then? Or is it just the GSM portion that is giving the interference?
So, as long as it is in flight mode, we can safely use the "non-phone" features such as game, word procesing, dictionary, etc, right?
Another question that I have is, if an HD with flight mode on does not completely disable the GSM signal as it should, would the interference be significant enough since we're so far from the cockpit?
Gordo, have you tried getting one of your flight attendence to bring your HD with flight mode on to the passenger cabin and see if the interference is still there?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The HD is not unique with regard to possible interference and my earlier description of interference from my phone (or my co-pilots phone) is noticeable only within a few feet of my aviation headset.
Use of the PED with the cell phone off (PDA part on) is considered safe during cruise flight. They ask that ALL electronic devices be turned off (including electronic noise canceling headphones eg: Bose) while operating in close proximity to the ground since takeoff and landing is classified as a "critical phase of flight". Heck, we are not even allowed to "chit-chat" on the flight deck until above 10,000 feet because of the importance of being vigilant on the task at hand.
The greatest concern from passenger phones is their proximity to navigational and communication antennas on the top and bottom of the aircraft and the proximity to the Avionics Bay (big room of system computers, navigation radios, communication radios). Each aircraft is configured differently and even though each system/computer is shielded from EMF and even EMP, the big issue is at what point can PED's break through those defenses?
As for my HD, I am just trying to understand why it looks like the radio and GPRS is off but, in fact, it remains on in many instances. I have only had my HD on one 4 day trip and noticed the problem on the last couple of flights so I intend to do more testing to find the best way to reproduce the anomaly. I might just bring my sons TMobile phone with me and place calls to the HD to find out if I can hear the interference in my headset while safely at the gate.
I am passing this on so you won't get an angry tongue lashing from an FA when your phone starts ringing during the takeoff roll after you though it was off!
I have to pass this story on also. In the early 90's (way before PED's and cell phones) I was operating a flight from Atlanta to Cincinnati and at cruise flight a very loud buzzing was heard from our radios. My co-pilot and I tried everything to establish communication with controllers but we could hear nothing through the loud buzz. After several minutes of trying different radios and frequencies, I called the lead Flight Attendant to walk through the cabin and see if anyone was using some kind of electronic device. A minute later the buzzing stopped and the FA called to say the only thing she found was a passenger using a 1960's vintage electric shaver in the aft lavatory. Turns out this old shaver had a brush type motor that emitted so much EMI that it rendered our radios useless! Of course, I submitted a safety report to our union over that.
Gordo
Thanks for your response and posts gentlemen. I find the information fascinating.
I'm also relieved that other than during take off and landing, we can still use our beloved HD, provided we set it to flight mode.
I will be sure to turn off my HD completely until HTC releases a fix.
And thank you for answering the off topic questions! I have always wondered how cell phones could be so critical to the plane's operation. I have especially wondered how it is OK to have PED's turned on during the flight, but not during take off and landing - thank you for clearing this up.
Oh, another question from one who has played some Flight Simulator a few years back. Sorry if it's a stupid one. When do you use VFR, and when do you use IFR? Is it, for instance, the way that you mainly use VFR as the rule of the thumb, and IFR is only used when needed (or vice versa)?
If HD is not unique in this regard, I doubt there will be a fix. After all, HTC could argue that we're supposed to turn them completely off during take off and landing anyway. Not sure if there is a need to completely turn them off mid air, but from I'm hearing, there is no need to go to that extreme. I supposed it would be preferable to do so, but I think airlines would not impose any unnecessary rules on the passenger from marketing viewpoint.
Would the professionals please correct me if I'm wrong, thanks.
pzucchel said:
Whatever is the FAA and JAA tolerance - it looks a real bug. I am a private pilot and constantly kept on the GSM as an additional security in case the aircraft radio or headset would go bad - to call the tower. the tickling of the GSM on the headset is a bit annoying, but since we fly at much lower altitudes than commercial aircrafts we are probably within the field of the GSM cells and switching between them at more reasonable rate.
Indeed, I also noticed that newer TAA (technologically advanced aircrafts), like the diamond da40 with G1000 Garmin glass cockpits, explicitly say in the AFM (aircraft flight manual) to switch off GSM or electronic devices since they COULD interfere with the on-board electronics. Notice that here we are speaking of few GSMs phones, not hundreds like in the case of Gordo which is definitely frightening: in a 747 you could have 1.6 kW of GSM radio emission!!! it could almost heat up the aluminum skin of the fuselage
Let me try to play with the registry and check how to do it. I cannot believe it is hardware related...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmmm, this is an interesting discovery. I wonder if it will switch off by toggling the "phone" radio button in the Connection Manager?
Peppep said:
Oh, another question from one who has played some Flight Simulator a few years back. Sorry if it's a stupid one. When do you use VFR, and when do you use IFR? Is it, for instance, the way that you mainly use VFR as the rule of the thumb, and IFR is only used when needed (or vice versa)?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Visual Flight Rules are used when the weather at an airport has clouds not closer than 1000 feet above the ground and the visibility is not less than 3 miles. Once airborne, VFR rules require (in general) that you stay a minimum of 500 feet below, 1000 above and 2000 feet horizontally from any clouds. If you are IFR rated (Instrument Rated=licensed to fly in weather less than listed above), you file an IFR flight plan and can then play in the clouds! People get confused between what is considered VFR/IFR conditions versus VFR/IFR flight regulations/procedures. John F Kennedy Jr. died while flying in VFR conditions (hazy with 5 miles visibility and no clouds) but over the ocean with no lights at night and no outside visual references, he needed IFR skills that he didn't have and thus lost control and crashed. Another 20 hours of IFR training towards his Instrument Rating would have given him the skills needed to fly solely by reference to his instruments. Non IR Private Pilots only get instrument training needed to get out of a cloud if one is flown into inadvertently, not sustained flight while multi-tasking/navigating.
Matterhorn said:
Hmmm, this is an interesting discovery. I wonder if it will switch off by toggling the "phone" radio button in the Connection Manager?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is what I am noticing, Flight Mode or the Phone button in CM are not turning off the "phone" although it looks as if it is off. My guess is the UI gets the command but the radio does not. I also have PhoneAlarm installed and will try that flight mode also but I really like the "Phone Disconnect" (full right button) long press that brings up the dialog box to turn on flight mode. It is quick and easy but doesn't seem to do the job every time.
Gordo
Hi,
I don't know if anyone from HTC reads this forum, but has anyone reported this problem to them, as it seems a pretty serious bug!
A bug report may have some extra weight coming from a commercial pilot too!
Cheers,
Ben
eaglesteve said:
If HD is not unique in this regard, I doubt there will be a fix. After all, HTC could argue that we're supposed to turn them completely off during take off and landing anyway. Not sure if there is a need to completely turn them off mid air, but from I'm hearing, there is no need to go to that extreme. I supposed it would be preferable to do so, but I think airlines would not impose any unnecessary rules on the passenger from marketing viewpoint.
Would the professionals please correct me if I'm wrong, thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most airlines I travel on specifically allow phones and PDAs in 'flight mode' to be used during the flight (even the safety videos say: put your phone in 'flight mode' now before switching it off for take-off).
However it if turned out that 'flight mode' on lots of devices wasn't turning off the radios, then maybe they will withdraw permission for ANY use of your devices during the flight.
From a purely PR perspective, I don't think a company like HTC would dare not fix a bug like this. They presumably wouldn't want their products to be associated with any doubts over causing problems with air safety.
There is also the 'trade description' aspect. If they advertise a working 'flight mode' on their sales materials, then they have to provide it, or will be in breach of consumer laws (at least in some countries).
I do think that anyone who has experienced this problem should report it to HTC, and refer them to this thread too.
Regards,
Ben
ben_gb said:
Most airlines I travel on specifically allow phones and PDAs in 'flight mode' to be used during the flight (even the safety videos say: put your phone in 'flight mode' now before switching it off for take-off).
However it if turned out that 'flight mode' on lots of devices wasn't turning off the radios, then maybe they will withdraw permission for ANY use of your devices during the flight.
From a purely PR perspective, I don't think a company like HTC would dare not fix a bug like this. They presumably wouldn't want their products to be associated with any doubts over causing problems with air safety.
There is also the 'trade description' aspect. If they advertise a working 'flight mode' on their sales materials, then they have to provide it, or will be in breach of consumer laws (at least in some countries).
I do think that anyone who has experienced this problem should report it to HTC, and refer them to this thread too.
Regards,
Ben
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Air Carriers actually have gone a long way to permit as much as possible the use of PED's during the cruise part of the flight, (as a courtesy to Bussiness/first class pax mainly) but "transmitting" devices are fully forbidden, to the point of detailing even Bluetooth (mouse, headsets) devices. So I consider this a serious bug.
Hopefully we will get a fix, but I will check during my next flight, since I too had noticed the "surprisingly fast" signal pick up time.
If HD is not unique is this, should'nt the airline simply forbid the switching on completely rather than allowing the flight mode during take off and landing? Airline can't take the chance that some device are not completely stopping some of signal being transmitted IF it is true that this level of transmission affects take off and landing.
Unless I'm wrong, the impression I'm getting is that once the phone moves a few feet away from the pilot, then at flight mode, they will not be affected. Yes? No?
eaglesteve said:
Unless I'm wrong, the impression I'm getting is that once the phone moves a few feet away from the pilot, then at flight mode, they will not be affected. Yes? No?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From directly affecting the pilots communication headsets, you are probable correct, however the real issue is the cabin has many areas in close proximity to antennas on the top and bottom of the fuselage, cable runs under the cabin floor, and avionics equipment/computers.
Interesting report here:
http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/print/3069
and from NASA
http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/20010066904_2001108092.pdf
It really seems that most likely a single cell phone left on may not cause trouble but the Airbus A380 holds over 500 passengers....what if one in five leave their cell phone radios on (including Bluetooth and WiFi transmitters) and are using 100 laptops, video games, noise canceling stereo headphones, etc. You get the idea, just read the first link above and you will understand.
Sorry to stray off topic a little here but I would really like to get more info from HD users if they think their phone/data transmitter is not turning off even though it looks like it is. I am trying to reliably reproduce the problem so I can find a remedy and not contend with annoying GSM clicks in my headset after we push from the gate and get scolded from my co-pilot that I forgot to turn off my phone (he/she can also hear the clicking through the intercom we use when that happens).
Regards,
Gordo
have you guys tried to just turn off the radio manually in comm manager instead of using airplane mode? Just wondering if that works instead.
For you that carry a GSM phone in the plane in case of a radio failure, beware that the GSM system was designed to allow communication in terrestrial vehicles, not in planes and it is affected by Doppler effect. If you are running faster than 200Km/h respect to the base station, the frequency tracking loop of the GSM cannot correct the Doppler offset, so you could not place a call to ground. With the airborne picocell it is different because it is not moving with respect to the passengers.
The bug you refer about the flight mode I think It's reallly a software bug. Switching off the radio chipset is very easy form a software point of view, all radio chips have registers that can be adressed by the processor to make them enter in power down or sleep conditions. (this is how the handset saves battery power). However, Windows Mobile is built on the premises that a IP data link is always available. This is a heritage from desktop computers. If your phone is configured to be always connected to the GPRS service (a G or 3G or H letter is present above the signal strength indicator), some applications which require "always on" feature like MSN, may try to connect to the data network "disregarding" the status of flight mode. You can try to open the task manager before setting the phone to flight mode and close all applications, to make sure you kill all processes that try to acces the network, not only the phone application, which is just one of them. In any case, a firmware update could fix this problem, I don't think they need to recall the devices.
hello,
on android phones, it is possible to see the actual consumption for bluetooth, gps and so in, and to disable anything shortly before the phone gets down due to a empty battery.
is something like this also available for the hd2?
that means, is there something to:
- see the actual consumption for any running application?
and/or
- to disable (a)gps, for a longer lifetime of the phone? (it is only possible to switch bluetooth/gsm/dataconnection etc. on/off)
many thanks in advance.
best regards
mario
GPS can only be turned on/off by the applications which use it. It is automatically turned off if you close the application (Navi, GoogleMaps). Be sure to have a look in your TaskManager whether the Progs are really closed.
Greets
Uhh, I cannot post this in development as I am still a newby :-(
However:
Hello,
I came from Symbian (Nokia C7-00) and liked the phone very much. Everything worked the way it should. (I was especially interested in office functionality.)
Now I bought a Galaxy Note and I really love the hardware.
But I discovered that it uses much energy and it doesn't like to sleep as often as it could. (I already returned to Android GB, which gives a better experience, but there still is room for improvement.)
1. Sometimes even though the phone simply lies around and does nothing, the last app that I forgot to close is hindering the CPU from sleeping. Why? The is no need.
2. At night I am used to turn the phone into flight mode. However I found out that this isn't the best thing for Android. In the morning, when the email app goes to push phase, the phone leaves sleep mode and seems to excitedly wait for the flight mode to get switched off. This uses *quite* a bit of battery!
These things seem strange to me. My impression is that Android is not really optimised for cell phones. If the screen is off, there is no need for CPU time, doesn't it? There is nothing urgent to do; everything could be done slowly; no hurry.
I guess the battery could last *much* longer if this would be improved.
Greetings,
corcov
corcovo said:
Uhh, I cannot post this in development as I am still a newby :-(
However:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which is handy, because this thread has nothing to do with development and thus saved you from some abuse!
Regards,
Dave
Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2
But I already know how to click the "thanks" button
corcovo said:
But I already know how to click the "thanks" button
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Doesn't matter.
Development, if you did not create IT, then it does not belong in development. Remember that. Otherwise you will get flamed.
Android is a mobile OS, so of course it is optimised for smart phones - not ordinary cell phones. Android acts like a computer and, if you keep a computer running Crysis 2 for example, it would burn more power than a computer just playing some music off of iTunes.
In terms of improving your battery, check your brightness. You can download widgets to adjust the brightness right from the home screens. I use these to set my brightness to its lowest whilst at home (perfectly adequate for night and indoor use away from sunlight) and turn it onto automatic when I go outside. This has saved my a bunch of battery.
If you are running a stock Samsung ROM, turn on power saving mode. I always leave it on and, frankly, I have no idea as to what it actually does. I haven't noticed a performance drop in the slightest, but if it saves a bit of battery it is worth it. Also, you could try Juice Defender or some other battery saving apps which work for some people - others not.
Finally, ensure you haven't left GPS, Bluetooth or WiFi on when not needed. Try downloading CPU Spy to check your phone deep sleeps, yet mine even without it ever deep sleeping gets around 16 hours of battery life which is still the best I have ever gotten on a smart phone. Bettery Battery Stats can show you wake-locks (apps that are keeping your phone active) also.
Brad387 said:
Android is a mobile OS, so of course it is optimised for smart phones - not ordinary cell phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see. Well it might be a nice feature if one could add an "now be a cell phone"-option for energy enhancement, which means: if screen if off, sleep.
c.
corcovo said:
1. Sometimes even though the phone simply lies around and does nothing, the last app that I forgot to close is hindering the CPU from sleeping. Why? The is no need.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are some legitimate needs for keeping the CPU from sleeping for a short period of time - such as finishing a sync operation (otherwise, the radio power spent beginning the sync is wasted). Unfortunately, some poorly written applications (Facebook for example) abuse the wakelock mechanisms and hold wakelocks when it is not justified.
2. At night I am used to turn the phone into flight mode. However I found out that this isn't the best thing for Android. In the morning, when the email app goes to push phase, the phone leaves sleep mode and seems to excitedly wait for the flight mode to get switched off. This uses *quite* a bit of battery!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is not something I have ever encountered myself. "push" relies on the server to trigger something - in airplane mode, this trigger can't happen.
These things seem strange to me. My impression is that Android is not really optimised for cell phones. If the screen is off, there is no need for CPU time, doesn't it? There is nothing urgent to do; everything could be done slowly; no hurry.
I guess the battery could last *much* longer if this would be improved.
Greetings,
corcov
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Android is well optimized for cell phones - However, it assumes that third-party applications follow Google's recommendations for power management. Unfortunately, many of them do not. The number of IM applications which choose to use their own proprietary and poorly optimized network protocols (such as Skype, it's atrocious) as opposed to Google C2DM (optimized and efficient) is astonishing.
An interesting note was that I believe much of the focus at Google I/O was on reminding app developers that they need to play nice with the system and other apps.
There are some cases where there are device-specific nonoptimalities. Compared to most Nexus devices, Exynos devices have an absurdly long time to resume from wake (1000 milliseconds), and during that resume cycle CPU frequency is locked to 800 MHz and cpuidle is disabled. This is one of the #1 causes of power drain on our device. This is also exclusively a Samsung kernel/hardware architecture problem that does not affect the Nexus S (similar CPU, but completely different modem interface) or the Galaxy Nexus (different CPU/modem interface).
In the case of our device, the modem is hung off of the CPU on a USB bus - this makes for very long resume times.
Here are obvious reasons the CPU should occasionally turn on when the screen is off:
1) MP3 playback in the background
2) Handling of background syncs - e.g. when an email or Google Talk IM comes in, wake the CPU, handle it, and pop a notification sound, then go back to sleep. Normally, this means the CPU sleeps while waiting for an interrupt from the WLAN chipset or the cellular radio. Unfortunately, some apps drive incoming data to the device far too frequently. (See my above rant about Skype's network protocols being crap compared to Google's C2DM protocol.)
3) Handling of scheduled wakeups (alarms, calendar events, etc) - these are rare and almost never consume power
Most power drain is from item 2, with third-party apps frequently behaving extremely poorly compared to Google's own application suite and sync protocols.
Now this an extensive answer which is very informative and helpful for me since insights are always soothing. Love it. Thanks!
not much to add after Entropy, but if you feel the need to get some control over battery usage you could try betterbatterystats app (and the thread) to identify battery eaters, besides that, there are few apps to check what is going on with your system when it sleeps:
- CPU Spy to show cpu states time
- Autorun Manager or Autostarts to disable triggers causing apps like FB to run without reason (those which you will find with betterbatterystats)
- Battery Monitor Widget, to check battery current consumption (mA) - this app is generally not recommended, because Note's hardware does not report the actual current, so the readings are highly estimated and because when poorly configured it can drain your battery faster, BUT otoh with refresh rate set at 5 minutes or more, it can give you some approximate orientation on how much battery you lose (better than counting %/hour by yourself) at negligible battery usage
- also, if you feel the need to disable net and sync during night, you could automate it using "lama", which is free, and in my experience does not eat much battery by itself
- and last but not least, avoid taskillers, those apps may have adverse effect, i.e. self restarting apps (by the triggers mentioned above), will get killed then restarted and so on and so on, leading to much higher battery drain
Following up with my new work S5 (thanks to the guys in my other thread who schooled me on Knox). Bottom line, we moved from Blackberry to the (our) neutered version of the S5. I am trying to replicate some of the simpler functionality of the BB with the new phone. Now, I have a rooted G3 as a personal phone, so I know how Android works pretty much, but the work phone is pretty locked down. We use Knox for work email and stuff, and the Play store is whitelisted to select apps. No free downloading. Here's what I am trying to do...
#1
My BB has a stupidly simple magnet in the case, so when I put the device in the holster, it went to vibrate-only mode. When I took it out, it would go back to the normal sound profile. No fuss, no user intervention needed. So, TecTiles is one of the apps I was able to get installed, and I ordered some. I can program them to set the phone to silent mode, but am I correct that I would still need to trigger the device to come OUT of silent mode? It's not automatic when it loses connection to the tile?
#2 (bigger)
I have the wireless charging back plate, and I have two issues. First, the "DU-DUNK" sound when the device gets fully charged, discharged a little, then starts charging again. I can't install Battery Doctor to silence it, I can't root to silence it. Can I write a tag with enough specificity to allow sounds for text and phone calls (I have an on call job) and keep the rest quiet?
The other nut kicker is the simple act of going in to clock mode (like a nite stand). Samsung removed the clock from Daydream (FFS), and I can't install any from Play (all I have tried are locked out). Any ideas on that one? Silly as it sounds, I used the BB as my alarm clock, especially while traveling. Timley looks GREAT. Can't install it.
Any help from the pros here would be appreciated.
ret4425 said:
Following up with my new work S5 (thanks to the guys in my other thread who schooled me on Knox). Bottom line, we moved from Blackberry to the (our) neutered version of the S5. I am trying to replicate some of the simpler functionality of the BB with the new phone. Now, I have a rooted G3 as a personal phone, so I know how Android works pretty much, but the work phone is pretty locked down. We use Knox for work email and stuff, and the Play store is whitelisted to select apps. No free downloading. Here's what I am trying to do...
#1
My BB has a stupidly simple magnet in the case, so when I put the device in the holster, it went to vibrate-only mode. When I took it out, it would go back to the normal sound profile. No fuss, no user intervention needed. So, TecTiles is one of the apps I was able to get installed, and I ordered some. I can program them to set the phone to silent mode, but am I correct that I would still need to trigger the device to come OUT of silent mode? It's not automatic when it loses connection to the tile?
#2 (bigger)
I have the wireless charging back plate, and I have two issues. First, the "DU-DUNK" sound when the device gets fully charged, discharged a little, then starts charging again. I can't install Battery Doctor to silence it, I can't root to silence it. Can I write a tag with enough specificity to allow sounds for text and phone calls (I have an on call job) and keep the rest quiet?
The other nut kicker is the simple act of going in to clock mode (like a nite stand). Samsung removed the clock from Daydream (FFS), and I can't install any from Play (all I have tried are locked out). Any ideas on that one? Silly as it sounds, I used the BB as my alarm clock, especially while traveling. Timley looks GREAT. Can't install it.
Any help from the pros here would be appreciated.
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Question...
I didn't read your other thread, but do you have the ability to use outside Media sources? MicroSD or MicroUSB flash drives?
If so, perhaps consider locating .apk's that you want/need for your functions and side load them by running the .apk's from the external drive.
What I use... http://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Andro...-fkmr0&keywords=sandisk+flash+drive+dual+mode
And I can't imagine them whitelisting the app to go with it, as it is a storage device, not something malicious.
kprice8 said:
Question...
I didn't read your other thread, but do you have the ability to use outside Media sources? MicroSD or MicroUSB flash drives?
If so, perhaps consider locating .apk's that you want/need for your functions and side load them by running the .apk's from the external drive.
What I use... http://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Andro...-fkmr0&keywords=sandisk+flash+drive+dual+mode
And I can't imagine them whitelisting the app to go with it, as it is a storage device, not something malicious.
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Thanks for responding. I'm sorry for sounding like a n00b, is this functionally any different from downloading an .apk on the SD card and installing it through a file explorer? As an aside, the way the restrictions work, the apps will install for a brief moment, and then they are uninstalled by the device. Is this method any different?
Thanks
ret4425 said:
Thanks for responding. I'm sorry for sounding like a n00b, is this functionally any different from downloading an .apk on the SD card and installing it through a file explorer? As an aside, the way the restrictions work, the apps will install for a brief moment, and then they are uninstalled by the device. Is this method any different?
Thanks
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If you can manually put the .apk on the SD card, or microusb capable flash drive, it may work and stick. Not guaranteed as I have not tried on a phone like yours. GL
kprice8 said:
If you can manually put the .apk on the SD card, or microusb capable flash drive, it may work and stick. Not guaranteed as I have not tried on a phone like yours. GL
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Yeah no dice, it works more like a removal than a block. It will install any app, then remove it when it checks it against the security policy. It's weird, some apps that seem just as innocuous (and are not on the list) install and work. Who knows. The whole thing feels very...unfinished. Like the whole Android enterprise thing isn't quite all put together yet. But I guess free it free, even if it's nerf'd free.