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Like many of us I've been salivating at the prospect of the HD's large screen and, having decided that as good as my Touch Pro keyboard is, I don't use it enough to hold out for an HD with a keyboard (if there is even one in the roadmap). But..... I'm still smarting at not having 3G on my Touch Pro (and I know our XDA-Developers team may yet lick that limitation) so I'm seriously questioning whether I should go for the HD knowing it may never have 3G capability in the USA. Anyone else share this concern?
My need for 3G is about 10% of its total use...and my Edge network isn't exactly a snails pace. My Raphael is the best phone I've ever had, and I truly enjoy the ability to customize it. I am jumping ship and getting the HD without second thought. If the Elite team cracks the 3G...that's just the icing on the perfect raphael cake I have.
th1nm1nt said:
My need for 3G is about 10% of its total use...and my Edge network isn't exactly a snails pace. My Raphael is the best phone I've ever had, and I truly enjoy the ability to customize it. I am jumping ship and getting the HD without second thought. If the Elite team cracks the 3G...that's just the icing on the perfect raphael cake I have.
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Click to collapse
Looks like we'll be here together too then th1nm1nt! Although I'll keep the Pro for a while once I have the HD just in case......
.
I share
yeah, ummm, no 3G coverage here, don't care, lol. your 10%, well I am about 1%, just when I travel and can't hardly tell a difference anyway. Two things: Either the HTC rep that gave us bad news about the arrival of Blackstone in US is not telling the truth or doesn't know the truth to tell it. OR..... HTC really has the wrong idea about consumers in the US. Surely they realize that we want the device because of the many other improvements that it brings. The improvements in performance and the killer screen does it for me. I have owned PDA phone after PDA phone starting with the old Verizon xv6600, which by the way has a large screen compared to kaiser and many others and I know a breakthrough when I see one. If they really don't plan to release this device, then they had better be working on a 3G version with or without a sliding keyboard that runs windows mobile 7. If their really going to skip around generations and stuff, that wm7 device better arrive on time and on par with the iPhone in refinement and usability. They should make a device that people don't really need to cook ROMs to be satisfied with. Do it right the first time, don't take backwards steps, don't take baby steps either. Turn one foot directly in front of the other, in full force and confidence; the smart way. I want it now!
brucewilsonpa said:
Like many of us I've been salivating at the prospect of the HD's large screen and, having decided that as good as my Touch Pro keyboard is, I don't use it enough to hold out for an HD with a keyboard (if there is even one in the roadmap). But..... I'm still smarting at not having 3G on my Touch Pro (and I know our XDA-Developers team may yet lick that limitation) so I'm seriously questioning whether I should go for the HD knowing it may never have 3G capability in the USA. Anyone else share this concern?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i think maybe its hidden and we can unlock it(if i get it, ill try to unlock the usa 3g) and if not maybe i can get ahold of a prototype with usa 3g. if not then oh well. ill keep it and sell it once they make one with usa 3g. i say if ur really worried then wait.......
I go all over the USA daily while driving my truck, and I've noticed that I get the big [H] in every 3G area I come to, so 3G is very important for me, but I'm still going to retire my Polaris when the HD comes out. I'll just hope and pray daily that someone figures out how to give us 3G...
Doesnt matter to me.
Only time I use it is if I accidentally update my weather application.
JesseW said:
I go all over the USA daily while driving my truck, and I've noticed that I get the big [H] in every 3G area I come to, so 3G is very important for me, but I'm still going to retire my Polaris when the HD comes out. I'll just hope and pray daily that someone figures out how to give us 3G...
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Click to collapse
We finally got 3G here when I live in Millsboro Delaware. After installing Solace I to get the Big H now. I was either dumb or confussed. LOL However after the good people on here explained that H is better then 3G I was delighted. Not sure why. Called ATT said it was a little better, well faster and was fine for me to use with my unlimited plan.
Solace 1.5 is so smooth I just can't believe that I'd think of getting or replacing my Tilt. I think I finally found the phone for me.
Beachboyde/Jon
I switched from the Tytn 2 over to the Diamond not too long ago. I gave up 3G for slimmer form factor. I barely notice the difference. Maybe occasionally when I use YouTube or Opera, I wish I had a faster connection, but my day to day use of corporate push email is unaffected.
I would like to see the XDA pros open up 3G on these phones, but I feel the features are worth living with EDGE.
...but then again, I've been tempted to pick up a Slingbox lately too. Not sure I'd trust Slingplayer running on E.
Blob8me said:
Looks like we'll be here together too then th1nm1nt! Although I'll keep the Pro for a while once I have the HD just in case......
.
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Click to collapse
So does that mean I'm no longer the stalker...but now you are?
T-mobile USA has 1700 Mhz and 2100 MHz frequencies for 3G support.
This is what I got from their website
--------------------------------------------------------------------
What frequency does your 3G network support?
Our 3G network supports both the 1700MHz and 2100MHz frequencies.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
So... I'll try 3G there once I get mine....
3G or no 3G
I have a Touch Diamond with no 3G (edge only) and one with 3G. (the big H) .
To me, not a big enough difference to worry about. The Edge connection is actually fast enough for me. May a half sec. difference in connection to web pages. Im getting the Touch HD. Besides most of the time I'm on wifi anyway. No big deal
So what exactly determines if we can get 3G in the US? Is it the radio? I have never quite understood this part.
bartimeus said:
So what exactly determines if we can get 3G in the US? Is it the radio? I have never quite understood this part.
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Click to collapse
Not determined yet. The Elite team in the Raphael ROM forum does admit there is different hardware. They have connected to the US 3G, but don't think it is stable. They haven't finalized their research as of yet, but sure some more information will be coming shortly.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=420586
ok so it is hardware inside the phone that differs between US and EU 3G?
So if the bands on the specs page of the phone list US bands then it should be good to go?
Not trying to hyjack the thread I am just curious.
i will be getting an HD and droppign the touch pro... i think
bartimeus said:
So what exactly determines if we can get 3G in the US? Is it the radio? I have never quite understood this part.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As far sas i heard. its the onboard chip that does the differents. HTC said that on some of the old phones, where it got hacked and worked with 3G, hardware was there but not activated. thats why the people here could get it to work. But HTC stated that this is not the case in the HD. THey said that the HD can not be hacked to work with 3G, as it is not possible hardware wise for the HD to recieve 3g signals on the USA network
i believe i said this already once but its more of a matter of just the antennas and if they can recieve the usa 3g bands or not. the actual chipset i know can use the bands its a matter or just enabling them.
I thought the 3g put a 3g icon not the big h? Thats how it shows on my friends tilt. Me i have not had 3g ever since i have used at&t lol cause i had the wizard and now the wing. Does 3g affect call performance or just data, if so i could care less about 3g then. Although i would rather no pay the premium price on the hd buying from europe
AT&T has HSUPA but you have to activate it in the settings.
Hey guys looking into purchasing an HD. Was reading this review, http://pocketnow.com/index.php?a=portal_detail&t=reviews&id=1111&p=4 , and it says that there is no 3G available for the USA. It's in the last paragraph named PURCHASING and it's also under the CONS section.
Is this true?
Unfortunately, NO USA 3G is correct...only EDGE. For more info, there are already a number of threads about this.
galaxys said:
Unfortunately, NO USA 3G is correct...only EDGE. For more info, there are already a number of threads about this.
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Click to collapse
Tried doing a search, but didn't find anything. I guess I wasn't using the right keywords.
Are there any developments with this? Like is there going to be a later version with 3g capability?
Because of this, I'm going to have to look for another phone.
No further developments or announcements yet...maybe after the New Year we'll hear something.
Here's one of the threads: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=450670
you should be fine with edge. enough to push email and light browsing. 3g just means more battery drainage imo. plus the pricy data package. I mean if your really need 3g, I'd rather get it for a notebook, then you would have full potential. Most of the locations have wifi now a days so hopefully 3g won't be your downfall on not getting the phone.
EkS said:
Hey guys looking into purchasing an HD. Was reading this review, http://pocketnow.com/index.php?a=portal_detail&t=reviews&id=1111&p=4 , and it says that there is no 3G available for the USA. It's in the last paragraph named PURCHASING and it's also under the CONS section.
Is this true?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very true but I've been using mine on AT&T's edge network and performance is not bad... there is wifi at both home and work so in those enviroments really fast... 3G would be nice but at the end of the day not a real deal breaker -- for me at least
I agree, Edge is also fine with me and worth it just to have all the other functionality of this great device!
galaxys said:
I agree, Edge is also fine with me and worth it just to have all the other functionality of this great device!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does one need a 3G (fast) network in order to have GPS or mapping capabilities in the US?
I'm seriously thinking about getting this phone, but I really won't be able to use it to its full extent until April, 2009. I'm currently in the middle east and will be moving back to the states next year.
galaxys said:
No further developments or announcements yet...maybe after the New Year we'll hear something.
Here's one of the threads: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=450670
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you!
Cheeze[iT] said:
you should be fine with edge. enough to push email and light browsing. 3g just means more battery drainage imo. plus the pricy data package. I mean if your really need 3g, I'd rather get it for a notebook, then you would have full potential. Most of the locations have wifi now a days so hopefully 3g won't be your downfall on not getting the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
galaxys said:
I agree, Edge is also fine with me and worth it just to have all the other functionality of this great device!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I won't be getting it because there is no 3G. I use it to tether with my notebook when nothing else is available, and most of the time I have 3G service. I do pay for the expensive data plan. I thought I had found my next phone, but I guess not.
Another US user on the AT&T network here. I, too, "downgraded" from a 3G phone. I haven't regretted it.
I did a couple of speed test comparisons between my old phone on 3G and the Touch HD on EDGE. I found that the bandwidth test results showed my 3G phone to have around four times the bandwidth that the Touch HD has on EDGE.
However, the real difference is much less than that suggests. For most online activities, unless you're dealing with the download of large files, most of the time is spent during connection overheads and latencies. In practice, I find that the difference in speed is less than a factor of two. That is easily worth the additional capabilities of the Touch HD.
ModernMuseum said:
Does one need a 3G (fast) network in order to have GPS or mapping capabilities in the US?
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Click to collapse
No.
Even the Google Maps location feature based on cell-tower triangulations works fine on the Touch HD in the US using the EDGE network (at least here in the San Francisco Bay Area).
guney said:
Another US user on the AT&T network here. I, too, "downgraded" from a 3G phone. I haven't regretted it.
I did a couple of speed test comparisons between my old phone on 3G and the Touch HD on EDGE. I found that the bandwidth test results showed my 3G phone to have around four times the bandwidth that the Touch HD has on EDGE.
However, the real difference is much less than that suggests. For most online activities, unless you're dealing with the download of large files, most of the time is spent during connection overheads and latencies. In practice, I find that the difference in speed is less than a factor of two. That is easily worth the additional capabilities of the Touch HD.
No.
Even the Google Maps location feature based on cell-tower triangulations works fine on the Touch HD in the US using the EDGE network (at least here in the San Francisco Bay Area).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks.
One more noob question: does a (an expensive) data plan usually have to be purchased to activate google maps? I'd probably only be using google maps and light browsing on my phone. Approx how much would I be looking at concerning monthly cost?
Yes, you'll need a data plan for google maps as each map has to be downloaded for each new GPS location. The "all you can drink" data plan for AT&T is about $30 a month.
I actually miss the 3G on my Kaiser and its a bit embarassing trying to show an iPhone user something web related on your HD at Edge speed.
Anyone heard a release data and country yet?
No, but I really hope they do before my Costco 90-day return limit comes up in May (but I'm not too optimistic- might end up with two )
kcrudup said:
No, but I really hope they do before my Costco 90-day return limit comes up in May (but I'm not too optimistic- might end up with two )
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Click to collapse
Yeah that'd be what I'd do too, or Amazon. How you like it? I'm just not loving my ipad 2
I think the UK release date is the 9th?
ydaraishy said:
I think the UK release date is the 9th?
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Click to collapse
Of April?!? Where you see that?
Actually carphone warehouse are releasing the 3G version on the 19th. Wifi only is 9th from Dixons group uk.
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App
burden010 said:
Actually carphone warehouse are releasing the 3G version on the 19th. Wifi only is 9th from Dixons group uk.
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm curious where you saw Carphone Warehouse is getting a gsm model in April when moto has said almost nothing of it. Price? Have you seen anything online about the release? Link?
Thx
Edit: I see it at http://www.carphonewarehouse.com/laptop-redirect/motorola-xoom
Damn £579!?!?! that's horrid when converted to USD$... Hope they release here but I'm sure it'll be carrier contract only :-(
bella92108 said:
I'm curious where you saw Carphone Warehouse is getting a gsm model in April when moto has said almost nothing of it. Price? Have you seen anything online about the release? Link?
Thx
Edit: I see it at http://www.carphonewarehouse.com/laptop-redirect/motorola-xoom
Damn £579!?!?! that's horrid when converted to USD$... Hope they release here but I'm sure it'll be carrier contract only :-(
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It probably won't be all that useful for the US, because the frequency bands will be different. The CPW site says it works on 3 and TalkMobile==Vodafone UK, which means 900MHz and 2100MHz -- no UMTS operators in the US use those bands. To get something on 850MHz for AT&T, you're going to probably have to wait until it's released in the US
ydaraishy said:
It probably won't be all that useful for the US, because the frequency bands will be different. The CPW site says it works on 3 and TalkMobile==Vodafone UK, which means 900MHz and 2100MHz -- no UMTS operators in the US use those bands. To get something on 850MHz for AT&T, you're going to probably have to wait until it's released in the US
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Click to collapse
I wonder why they'd only make them dual band... today tri band and quad band is the norm, and as many networks at the different frequencies, it seems like they're shooting themselves in the foot with only 2 frequencies, which don't work in some fairly large markets, like the US. On the flipside, they may have struck a deal with AT&T or T-Mo to offer the device through them, of course with their bloat\crapware installed. Ugh.
In any event, if this really is the case, then I'll pass on the Xoom.
bella92108 said:
today tri band and quad band is the norm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, and the MDM6600 is definitely 800/850/900/1700/1900/2100 (Bands I/II/IV/V) capable (of course, because of antenna-tuning and certification requirements, most devices only support a subset of those frequencies as a cost-saving measure).
In any case though, we'll still have at the very least EDGE data worldwide.
... of course with their bloat/crapware installed. Ugh.
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Click to collapse
OT: I still don't get folks' hate on apps they'll never use, esp. with tens of GBs of available space. There's lots of SW on there you might not use either as part of the basic OS; what's the difference?
kcrudup said:
In any case though, we'll still have at the very least EDGE data worldwide.
OT: I still don't get folks' hate on apps they'll never use, esp. with tens of GBs of available space. There's lots of SW on there you might not use either as part of the basic OS; what's the difference?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
EDGE? Wow, I'll be lined up to buy that one. NOT, lol.
People hate on bloatware because it ties up system ram and performs tasks the user doesn't want it to do. For example, I have a HTC Inspire 4G. AT&T so lovingly loads an app that latches onto an AT&T WiFi network where available, and that app also puts a big orange WiFi logo in the upper left anytime I've been in the presence of AT&T WiFi at any time in the day. Ridiculous.
It's not an issue of space, it's an issue of Google is the expert in making the OS, and it downgrades the performance of the OS when AT&T installs FamilyMap, Navigator, Barcode Scanner, AT&T Shopper, and games I don't want. Much like a PC the more you have on the drives, the slower the unit performs because there's always background indexing and tasks going, even if you've "disabled" those apps. :-(
Wish google would sell one unlocked like they did with the Nexus S, but on a truly unlocked for any GSM basis.
bella92108 said:
People hate on bloatware because it ties up system ram and performs tasks the user doesn't want it to do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm an Android developer- it's not significant, and just like with Task Killers or "Where did all my RAM go" posts, it's more about people not knowing about how these things work. 90% of the code necessary to make that AT&T hotspot work is already in the OS, for example; get an Intent notification on a WiFi scan and if it matches a DB entry, use the system to pop up a widget on-screen. Viewing even a single simple webpage uses probably 20x the "resources" people worry about unecessarily about, and unused code, even if it's even been loaded has no effect on battery life and even gets invalidated out of the system when necessary.
BUT we're way OT.
kcrudup said:
I'm an Android developer- it's not significant, and just like with Task Killers or "Where did all my RAM go" posts, it's more about people not knowing about how these things work. 90% of the code necessary to make that AT&T hotspot work is already in the OS, for example; get an Intent notification on a WiFi scan and if it matches a DB entry, use the system to pop up a widget on-screen. Viewing even a single simple webpage uses probably 20x the "resources" people worry about unecessarily about, and unused code, even if it's even been loaded has no effect on battery life and even gets invalidated out of the system when necessary.
BUT we're way OT.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The point is they bake it into their device, so it's impossible to remove without rooting. I don't want AT&T to decide they want to put their advertisement in my OS. I'm perfectly happy with the native apps, and if I CHOSE to add their apps, I can DECIDE to download them.
My whole reason for not wanting them is I don't want to see them, lol
So ATT is advertizing as having the Note and on the commercial is states the device as being a phone and a tab, so why will they not allow the 7.7 to run on their system the same way? I am not an ATT customer but if i were and had both devices i would be extremelly upset if they were giving me a hard time with the 7.7. Please share your thoughts.
Sent from my GT-P6800 using xda premium
adinis78 said:
So ATT is advertizing as having the Note and on the commercial is states the device as being a phone and a tab, so why will they not allow the 7.7 to run on their system the same way? I am not an ATT customer but if i were and had both devices i would be extremelly upset if they were giving me a hard time with the 7.7. Please share your thoughts.
Sent from my GT-P6800 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have both devices on AT&T. No issues using either (both are unlocked and international).
7.7 is my primary daily driver. Note is cool and all, but without ICS, it kinda sucks compared to the 7.7, especially for web browsing.
I used Straight Talk for the Note I had. I also have the 7.7 6800 (WiFi only).
My Razr is my go to phone. The Note is too big for a phone and too small for a tablet IMHO. The Note, to me, was a fun toy and that was about it. Now when the waccom tech comes out for the 7.7/8.9/10.1 Tabs and if they have 3G/LTE/Data capabilities, I think the Note will all but become useless.
I've had quite a few Galaxy Tabs, but the Note just felt cheaply made to me. It was nice don't get me wrong, but nothing like the others I've had. Also the price to play w/ an International Note is not worth it when looking back on it.
I'd get a 7.7 International 3G if I were you. Many people have reported using it w/ AT&T and if you want to use it as a phone just use a bluetooth headset. Save your money and don't buy a Note.
---------- Post added at 09:35 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:34 AM ----------
Jade Eyed Wolf said:
I have both devices on AT&T. No issues using either (both are unlocked and international).
7.7 is my primary daily driver. Note is cool and all, but without ICS, it kinda sucks compared to the 7.7, especially for web browsing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had the leaked Chinese ROM on my Note and was sorely disappointed with Samsung's TW'd ICS...
RocketROM was better, smoother, clocked higher, etc.
got556 said:
I had the leaked Chinese ROM on my Note and was sorely disappointed with Samsung's TW'd ICS...
RocketROM was better, smoother, clocked higher, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TBH, I'm not so interested in ICS for using it as a phone on the Note; I want to mod the DPI so that the Note behaves in tablet mode instead. Been doing that with CM9, and I can't go back. I love it! Until there's a fully functioning ICS ROM for the Note that will allow me to run in Tablet mode, I'm sticking to my 7.7. Oh and by fully functioning, I mean everything from S-Pen to MHL, to USB OTG, etc.
The 7.7 would be perfect it it has an S-pen and the note is just an amazing device for drawing and note taking.
To be clear I do have the import 7.7and using straight talk. I wanted to get everybodies opinions on as to why ATT has no issues running their version of the Note as phone and tab but has major issues running the 7.7 which is pretty much the same as Note just bigger size.
Sent from my GT-P6800 using xda premium
adinis78 said:
To be clear I do have the import 7.7and using straight talk. I wanted to get everybodies opinions on as to why ATT has no issues running their version of the Note as phone and tab but has major issues running the 7.7 which is pretty much the same as Note just bigger size.
Sent from my GT-P6800 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure what you're talking about here. What major issues do you think people are having by running an unlocked 7.7 on AT&T? I've been doing this since January with no issues whatsoever (apart from having been throttled, but that's neither here nor there).
adinis78 said:
To be clear I do have the import 7.7and using straight talk. I wanted to get everybodies opinions on as to why ATT has no issues running their version of the Note as phone and tab but has major issues running the 7.7 which is pretty much the same as Note just bigger size.
Sent from my GT-P6800 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What are "major issues"? I'm using an unlocked international 6800 on AT&T with no issues at all. Are they sending you messages about not using it or changing your plan?
Jade Eyed Wolf said:
TBH, I'm not so interested in ICS for using it as a phone on the Note; I want to mod the DPI so that the Note behaves in tablet mode instead. Been doing that with CM9, and I can't go back. I love it! Until there's a fully functioning ICS ROM for the Note that will allow me to run in Tablet mode, I'm sticking to my 7.7. Oh and by fully functioning, I mean everything from S-Pen to MHL, to USB OTG, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Chinese Rom w/ 240 DPI was pretty stable for me. And I too don't understand what major issues you think AT&T users are having. Many of us have stated multiple times there are no issues.
There are many people that get messages that their tab is unsupported and need to change plan and stuff like that. The 7.7 is both a tab and a phone so is the Note, so why would the ATT branded version of the Note be OK to use but the 7.7 won't be. I am talking about those that get a sim with voice and data and insert it on the 7.7 and then start getting messages stating they need to change plan but if they use that same sim on an ATT branded Note they will not have that issue. I hope people can understand what I am trying to point out. Why does ATT have an issue with the tab working like the Note.
EDIT : another reason I started this is because there is another thread about ATT blocking the 3G data on their tabs while using an old sim that already has 3G service. I know that their are work arounds to this but I am sure that if that same sim where to be put into the ATT branded Note it would not be a problem so why is it with tab, again the tab and Note are essentially the same device.
Will not try to continue this thread if people are not getting what I am trying to point out.
Sent from my GT-P6800 using xda premium
adinis78 said:
There are many people that get messages that their tab is unsupported and need to change plan and stuff like that. The 7.7 is both a tab and a phone so is the Note, so why would the ATT branded version of the Note be OK to use but the 7.7 won't be. I am talking about those that get a sim with voice and data and insert it on the 7.7 and then start getting messages stating they need to change plan but if they use that same sim on an ATT branded Note they will not have that issue. I hope people can understand what I am trying to point out. Why does ATT have an issue with the tab working like the Note.
EDIT : another reason I started this is because there is another thread about ATT blocking the 3G data on their tabs while using an old sim that already has 3G service. I know that their are work arounds to this but I am sure that if that same sim where to be put into the ATT branded Note it would not be a problem so why is it with tab, again the tab and Note are essentially the same device.
Will not try to continue this thread if people are not getting what I am trying to point out.
Sent from my GT-P6800 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mainly, because AT&T doesn't sell the 7.7 but they do sell the Note. That's really it. They're not getting any cash from Samsung when you use the 7.7 on their network. You should be able to add an APN named "Broadband" to your to continue to use data.
Ok, I consider myself to be somewhat of an AT&T expert here, so let me set some things straight:
If you have an unlimited data plan for NON-smartphones ($15/month), then AT&T is likely to get nasty with you.
If you have an unlimited data plan for iPhone, or Blackberry, ($30/month), then AT&T will likely ask you to switch to an unlimited smartphone data plan for the same price, but you can continue to use that with no issues, apart from the throttling woes that ALL grandfathered unlimited users are experiencing.
If you already have an unlimited smartphone plan ($30/month), you should have no issues again, apart from the aforementioned throttling issues.
These legacy unlimited plans should only work with the Phone and the wap.cingular APN's. The Broadband APN shouldn't work, nor should the pta APN (unless you're on an unlimited LTE plan).
The more modern plans (tiered plans) should all work just fine without any issues. The Broadband APN on those plans should only work if you have a tethering add-on.
AT&T is a GSM provider, and as such, to remain GSM compliant, they need to allow unlocked devices to work on their network, whether they like it or not.
Essentially it is all about money and how much they can get out of you.
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Jade Eyed Wolf said:
AT&T is a GSM provider, and as such, to remain GSM compliant, they need to allow unlocked devices to work on their network, whether they like it or not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do the actually dislike it, though? I mean, sure, you don't have to sign a contract to use an unlocked phone, but as long as you're still paying the same monthly service fee as everyone else, why would they care? (Of course if you're abusing the medianet plan, then I can understand them trying to crack down.) They still have a paying customer AND they don't have to pay a phone subsidy to keep you. Being one of only two national GSM carriers in the US, and given that T-Mo requires AWS for much of their 3G coverage, AT&T basically has a lock on you if you want to use the vast majority of unlocked GSM phones.
I just don't see why AT&T would have a problem with this from a corporate policy perspective. Obviously some devices, especially ones that are sort of corner cases like the P6800, will have issues, and their call center people are probably clueless in most cases to help resolve these issues. But you can't logically go from "this device has some issues with AT&T's default network configuration" to "AT&T hates this device and all unlocked devices."
adinis78 said:
To be clear I do have the import 7.7and using straight talk. I wanted to get everybodies opinions on as to why ATT has no issues running their version of the Note as phone and tab but has major issues running the 7.7 which is pretty much the same as Note just bigger size.
Sent from my GT-P6800 using xda premium
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the major issuses people had was when we tried to use a go-phone sim card in the 7.7 and the data did not work. As far as i know regular att plans work fine and i can confim that tablet data plans work if you care.
Jade Eyed Wolf said:
The more modern plans (tiered plans) should all work just fine without any issues. The Broadband APN on those plans should only work if you have a tethering add-on.
AT&T is a GSM provider, and as such, to remain GSM compliant, they need to allow unlocked devices to work on their network, whether they like it or not.
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The broadband apn works for tablet specific data plans
teiglin said:
Do the actually dislike it, though? I mean, sure, you don't have to sign a contract to use an unlocked phone, but as long as you're still paying the same monthly service fee as everyone else, why would they care? (Of course if you're abusing the medianet plan, then I can understand them trying to crack down.) They still have a paying customer AND they don't have to pay a phone subsidy to keep you. Being one of only two national GSM carriers in the US, and given that T-Mo requires AWS for much of their 3G coverage, AT&T basically has a lock on you if you want to use the vast majority of unlocked GSM phones.
I just don't see why AT&T would have a problem with this from a corporate policy perspective. Obviously some devices, especially ones that are sort of corner cases like the P6800, will have issues, and their call center people are probably clueless in most cases to help resolve these issues. But you can't logically go from "this device has some issues with AT&T's default network configuration" to "AT&T hates this device and all unlocked devices."
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You underestimate how much AT&T and most carriers love putting bloatware on your phone. For example most carriers until recently shipped phones with carrier IQ which would not be on your device if it was and unlocked international version.
Another example of carrier changes to stock, my sprint phone, when stock, runs through a sprint proxy and it can jack up media streaming and internet speeds until i remove it
teiglin said:
Do the actually dislike it, though? I mean, sure, you don't have to sign a contract to use an unlocked phone, but as long as you're still paying the same monthly service fee as everyone else, why would they care? (Of course if you're abusing the medianet plan, then I can understand them trying to crack down.) They still have a paying customer AND they don't have to pay a phone subsidy to keep you. Being one of only two national GSM carriers in the US, and given that T-Mo requires AWS for much of their 3G coverage, AT&T basically has a lock on you if you want to use the vast majority of unlocked GSM phones.
I just don't see why AT&T would have a problem with this from a corporate policy perspective. Obviously some devices, especially ones that are sort of corner cases like the P6800, will have issues, and their call center people are probably clueless in most cases to help resolve these issues. But you can't logically go from "this device has some issues with AT&T's default network configuration" to "AT&T hates this device and all unlocked devices."
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See that's just it though, even though technically I am playing by the rules, in the sense that I am not abusing the medianet plan, and that I am still a loyal paying customer, they still don't like the fact that I am using a tablet as a phone as well, because they're not getting as much money out of me as they could be, and in their eyes, should be.
Think about it. Can you go into an AT&T store right now and buy a tablet from them for anything other than pay-as-you-go? Nope. If you want data on your tablet, and you don't want to pay extra for its own 3G service, then you have to give up unlimited data and get an extra tethering add-on, so you'd have to pay extra that way instead.
AT&T doesn't want you to have a device that simply does it all. That's why they don't mind the Note so much, because frankly, having owned one since November, at the end of the day, it's really just a big Galaxy S2; if you want to do tablet stuff on it, you need a proper tablet, which the 7.7 is.
So here's the thing: By my buying an unlocked 7.7, thereby consolidating a true tablet and a smartphone, and by continuing to pay my $30/month unlimited plan, in AT&T's eyes, I'm effectively cheating them out of either pay-per-use data on one of their own 3G/LTE tablets, or I'm cheating them out of paying for a tiered plan instead, plus a tethering option. So yeah, they don't like that...
If US carriers had no issues with tablet's doubling as phones, then they would have allowed the original tab to keep its phone abilities, and Verizon wouldn't have gimped their version of the 7.7 so as not to be capable of making normal phone calls.
P.S. Let's just say for a moment that I played by their rules even more, and didn't seek any perfectly legitimate loopholes like buying unlocked, and say I buy their 5GB/month tiered plan at $50/month, and let go of my unlimited data at $30/month. That means that I'm locked in for at least $480 more over the course of a new 2 year agreement, and potentially more if I end up paying any overages. Now that's just me, one person. I'm effectively cheating them (in their eyes) out of that money. Imagine if every unlimited data user did that too (and there are millions of them). Now can you see why AT&T would hate to be cheated (in their eyes) out of all that money? No can you see why they hate having to honour service to unlocked devices?
In the end AT&T is still a corporation, so it's all about the money for them. Thus, if by buying an unlocked device you are keeping them from getting more money out you, then by corporate default, they are not going to happy with that.
Masterface7 said:
You underestimate how much AT&T and most carriers love putting bloatware on your phone. For example most carriers until recently shipped phones with carrier IQ which would not be on your device if it was and unlocked international version.
Another example of carrier changes to stock, my sprint phone, when stock, runs through a sprint proxy and it can jack up media streaming and internet speeds until i remove it
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Carrier IQ sure, but it's being/has already been removed from AT&T devices, so it's no longer relevant. I didn't know about the Sprint proxy thing, but I've never heard of AT&T doing that. As for bloatware, my gut says that people who are knowledgeable enough to buy an unlocked handset from elsewhere are also not dumb enough to *use* AT&T bloatware when they do have AT&T-branded devices, and probably root and get rid of it immediately anyway.
I don't disagree with anything you said, but I don't see it as a compelling reason to try to block out non-AT&T-branded devices. Maybe the AT&T execs do.
Jade Eyed Wolf said:
See that's just it though, even though technically I am playing by the rules, in the sense that I am not abusing the medianet plan, and in the sense that I am a paying customer, they still don't like it because of the fact that I am using a tablet as a phone as well.
Think about it. Can you go into an AT&T store right now and buy a tablet from them for anything other than pay-as-you-go? Nope. If you want data on your tablet, and you don't want to pay extra for its own 3G service, then you have to give up unlimited data and get an extra tethering add-on, so you'd have to pay extra that way instead.
AT&T doesn't want you to have a device that simply does it all. That's why they don't mind the Note so much, because frankly, having owned one since November, at the end of the day, it's really just a big Galaxy S2; if you want to do tablet stuff on it, you need a proper tablet, which the 7.7 is.
So here's the thing: By my buying an unlocked 7.7, thereby consolidating a true tablet and a smartphone, and by continuing to pay my $30/month unlimited plan, in AT&T's eyes, I'm effectively cheating them out of either pay-per-use data on one of their own 3G/LTE tablets, or I'm cheating them out of paying for a tiered plan instead, plus a tethering option. So yeah, they don't like that...
If US carriers had no issues with tablet's doubling as phones, then they would have allowed the original tab to keep its phone abilities, and Verizon wouldn't have gimped their version of the 7.7 so as not to be be capable of making normal phone calls.
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Yeah this makes sense I suppose. They want to either screw you on a tethering package or a separate tablet data plan, though if you're me you just don't play by the rules and tether without getting caught (please don't notice AT&T). I guess this also explains why people only have issues with tablets or things that seem like tablets (I recall seeing a lot of APN issues for the int'l Note as well).
Personally, I probably wouldn't pay for a data plan for my tab even if couldn't tether--while the tab is pocketable, it makes an uncomfortable bulge (and I don't really want to get into carrying a murse around), so I stick to my GS2 as an actual phone. Plus, 80% or so of my tab use is at home, and if you add in places where there is wifi anyway that's probably more like 95%.
For those of you who have a phone and separate tab data plan, I'm curious: why are you willing to pay an additional $20-$35 every month for tab data? Need a general-purpose hotspot for, say, a laptop? Can't tether to your phone? Laziness/convenience?
teiglin said:
Yeah this makes sense I suppose. They want to either screw you on a tethering package or a separate tablet data plan, though if you're me you just don't play by the rules and tether without getting caught (please don't notice AT&T).
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Just another reason to buy unlocked. I tether all the time with no issues. Just because they may have removed CarrierIQ, doesn't mean they haven't possibly baked their own monitoring tools into their devices and we just haven't found them yet. (I'm paranoid like that). I mean, I know they could technically do deep packet inspection and figure out that you're tethering anyway, regardless of whether you're using an unlocked device or not, but as a network engineer myself, I know that doing that is VERY resource intensive, and probably not nearly as cost effective for them compared to running a small client-side monitoring tool that alerts them to anomalous user activity.
Not saying they wouldn't possibly perform packet inspection, just saying it's not as likely as monitoring tools of some kind or another.
teiglin said:
Personally, I probably wouldn't pay for a data plan for my tab even if couldn't tether--while the tab is pocketable, it makes an uncomfortable bulge (and I don't really want to get into carrying a murse around), so I stick to my GS2 as an actual phone. Plus, 80% or so of my tab use is at home, and if you add in places where there is wifi anyway that's probably more like 95%.
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Valid points indeed. In fact, before getting my 7.7, I almost decided on sticking with my GS2 and getting a Prime instead. As you said, WiFi is just about everywhere, and for places where WiFi isn't present, I could have just tethered to my GS2.
At this point, it's a matter of personal preference really. For me, I would much rather have only to carry one device on me than two, even if it does kinda force me into using a murse, which I've actually come to like quite a lot! That's why I went with the 7.7 instead; all-in-one device consolidation.
Jade Eyed Wolf said:
I mean, I know they could technically do deep packet inspection and figure out that you're tethering anyway, regardless of whether you're using an unlocked device or not, but as a network engineer myself, I know that doing that is VERY resource intensive, and probably not nearly as cost effective for them compared to running a small client-side monitoring tool that alerts them to anomalous user activity.
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Actually, I think the way they're figuring out if users are tethering isn't from any logging utility on the device, but that they are using some kind of pinging utility from their server side. When they get a response with a TTL of a different value than whatever the default is then they can derive that your device is functioning as a router. That's just a guess and I could be totally wrong about the specifics, but I think that they're not really doing deep packet inspection but rather just tracing back requests for internet data and comparing that to the baseline device profiles they have.
Jade Eyed Wolf said:
Just another reason to buy unlocked. I tether all the time with no issues. Just because they may have removed CarrierIQ, doesn't mean they haven't possibly baked their own monitoring tools into their devices and we just haven't found them yet. (I'm paranoid like that). I mean, I know they could technically do deep packet inspection and figure out that you're tethering anyway, regardless of whether you're using an unlocked device or not, but as a network engineer myself, I know that doing that is VERY resource intensive, and probably not nearly as cost effective for them compared to running a small client-side monitoring tool that alerts them to anomalous user activity.
Not saying they wouldn't possibly perform packet inspection, just saying it's not as likely as monitoring tools of some kind or another.
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It's certainly possible, though I'm pretty sure I've heard of people getting caught on non-AT&T devices, as well as AT&T devices with non-AT&T-based ROMs, so at least in some cases they are performing deep inspection of packets (unless they just send out the effing letters at random, which is certainly plausible given the false positives some people have reported). And really, it's not like I need more reasons to prefer an unbranded device, since AT&T makes their equivalents worse almost every time. Still, I think there are a hundred other threads on these forums with all the various theories about how, when, and why they detect tethering, and I'm sure we have both read a number of them, so it probably isn't worth rehashing all this here.
Jade Eyed Wolf said:
Valid points indeed. In fact, before getting my 7.7, I almost decided on sticking with my GS2 and getting a Prime instead. As you said, WiFi is just about everywhere, and for places where WiFi isn't present, I could have just tethered to my GS2.
At this point, it's a matter of personal preference really. For me, I would much rather have only to carry one device on me than two, even if it does kinda force me into using a murse, which I've actually come to like quite a lot! That's why I went with the 7.7 instead; all-in-one device consolidation.
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I totally agree that it's about personal preference phone use. If you're liking carrying a murse around, more power to ya, but I'm happier being able to keep everything in my pockets.
Plus, when I am carrying the tab around, I like not having to worry about keeping it charged. I don't treat my GS2 batteries very well because I am always leery of having my phone battery die while I'm out somewhere, especially when I know I'll be tethering or playing games. But I'm really not worried about the lifetime of my $12 Anker batteries; if they don't hold a charge well tomorrow, they're super easy to replace. With the tab, I feel more obliged to take care of the non-replaceable battery--always let it almost fully discharge, not leaving it plugged in too long when fully charged, that sort of thing--and I would find that very inconvenient for my primary device.
Hello,
i am planning to buy nexus 7 next month. i'd look over the shop around my country and it says its available. so, here's the couple question from me:
i would like to know which one is better, the Wifi or GSM model?
is there any specific different between the GSM and Wifi Only Model?
how is the development section which is more active and crowded between those model?
is there any major/knowing bug for any custom ROM in the Development section?
are there any reviews for the comparation for Wifi an GSM Model?
Please advice and Thank you..
Post deleted.
No difference spec wise, apart from the Obvious GSM abilities.
No difference in performance.
I would suggest, if you plan on it being a couch-potato device like mine, which rarely leaves the house, get WiFi.
If you plan on travelling with it etc, get the GSM.
Wilks3y said:
No difference spec wise, apart from the Obvious GSM abilities.
No difference in performance.
I would suggest, if you plan on it being a couch-potato device like mine, which rarely leaves the house, get WiFi.
If you plan on travelling with it etc, get the GSM.
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Agree with this, it'll help a lot.
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GT-P3100 | Android 4.0.4 ICS | Sun Cellular
PM me if you need help
Wilks3y said:
No difference spec wise, apart from the Obvious GSM abilities.
No difference in performance.
I would suggest, if you plan on it being a couch-potato device like mine, which rarely leaves the house, get WiFi.
If you plan on travelling with it etc, get the GSM.
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Click to collapse
Thanks man, hopefully at the beginning of the month i receive this tablet..
Btw, it's just my feelings or not, the GSM development not so crowded as the wifi only development, is that right?
Sent from my HTC EVO 3D X515m using Tapatalk 2
strykerider said:
Thanks man, hopefully at the beginning of the month i receive this tablet..
Btw, it's just my feelings or not, the GSM development not so crowded as the wifi only development, is that right?
Sent from my HTC EVO 3D X515m using Tapatalk 2
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No worries
Ehm, most dev's have a ROM for each, or Hybrids that support both.
But yes, WiFi only probably pips the 3G development.
Have fun with the Nexus