Slash Gear Reviews Note... - Galaxy Note GT-N7000 General

Slash Gear Reviews Note... - Galaxy Note GT-N7000 General

Review here:
http://www.slashgear.com/samsung-galaxy-note-review-04193076/
Highlights:
"Niche? Certainly, but Samsung hasn’t allowed fears of that to stop it from targeting pretty much every segment of the mobile audience. Niche needn’t mean unimpressive, either: what the Galaxy Note does, it does exceptionally well. Right now, if you want the precision an active digitizer gives you, plus more than all-day battery life, top-tier multimedia credentials and the range of apps the Android platform is blessed with, it’s your only choice. If you want a compact tablet that you can actually carry out of the house without needing a bag, it’s your best option. And if you want a smartphone that allows you to work and play and replace your paper notebook, it’s hugely compelling in many senses of the word “huge.”
Not for everyone, then, but that’s part of the Android charm: a huge array of devices catering to those for whom the “one size fits all” approach doesn’t fit. The Galaxy Note may not prove to be Samsung’s best-seller of the quarter, but those who succumb to its sizable charms will have a smartphone/hybrid that’s attention-grabbing in every sense."
-Alex-

Related

GTab >>>> Ipad

I posted this in another forum, thought I will re-post it here.
I had Ipad2 for 2 weeks and returned it. Once you use android tablet for a week, you can't go back to Ipad 2.
There are lot of reasons to choose android over ipad. Couple of examples:
=> Google maps kicks ass in android. IPad also has google maps, but its crippled - there are no reviews, no 3D view, no rotating using multi-touch, etc..
=> Widgets make a big difference in the 10" screen. You get the see emails, weather, calendar in the main screen, esp. with re-sizable widgets. Switch on the tablet, look at important stuff, move on with your life. In Ipad, you need to search for the three apps in the sea of icons, open one, close, look for next app and so on. There's a sea of difference in usability.
=> Android task bar has short cuts to change lot of settings like brightness and is available without the need to close the app that you are on. Say, you are reading a webpage that has a link to youtube. For reading you may like low brightness, but video with dark background requires more brightness. Steps to change screen brightness in IPad: you need to close the current app, search for settings icon in the sea of app icons, open settings, look for 'screen' settings, open the settings, look for brightness control, change brightness, double tap the hardware button to see the previous app, click it to open where you were. In honeycomb, you just click the task bar icon, change brightness, done. Now, that's usability.
=> Ipad is 4:3, pretty useless for viewing videos/movies. Watching 16:9 movies in Ipad is painful. Netflix works in Ipad (in the works for android, not out yet), but I honestly couldn't use it in Ipad because of the 4:3 screen. It's like watching movie on the old CRT screen.
=> IPad has no flash.
=> IPad has no back button. Every app implements 'back' functionality in their own way. You need to search for the 'back' button in every app. It gets frustrating very fast. Android has a beautiful back button that's available always and behaves exactly the same way in every app. It's magical. Really.
This is just the tip of iceberg. The list goes on and on.
If you are not big on games, then the several thousand apps in the app store means nothing. Because every useful app has a counterpart in honeycomb.
I know this is a android/gtab 10.1 forum so we'll be obviously biased, but what do you think of ipad?

I agree with everything you have said - not to mention the specs are under that of the 10.1, and if the rumors are true around the place there will be an updated model either at the time of the release of the 4G (unlikely), or within a few months after...
I am crossing my fingers and waiting for the rumors to be confirmed because if an updated model with wqxga (retina display competitor) 300+ dpi, plus microSD (if it's not released with the coming model), and possible quad core cpu (although it might just be the exynos 1.2Ghz), comes out within that sort of time frame then bugger me you are already beating the released 'possible' specs of the 2012/2013 release of iPad3!
lol - I am seriously excited about the 10.1. I have no doubt it is going to rock the crap out of the iPad2 for all the reasons you have stated and many more.
I have no concerns about possible build issues with the device as I have an Omnia 2 which is the same high grade plastics they are using in the 10.1 and i have dropped it many many many times - the phone has no issues, no cracking no warping etc it is just like the day i bought it (with some minor scratches of course).
Also people say customer service is crap for Samsung - well that depends on the country you are in and your expectations but let me tell you here in the philippines where customer service for the majority of companies is unheard of, I have had my screen replaced on the Omnia 2 when i had some white dots appear (probably due to me dropping it down some stairs on to concrete), no questions asked, within 3 to 5 days. and that was with a cooked rom that came up with a naughty boot message.
So yeah I don't blame you for trading in your iPad2

I started writing out this long response on all the positive points I see with the iPad 2 over the Galaxy Tab 10.1. Not because I think the iPad 2 is better. Just wanted to point out some of the iPad's strengths because I do think the device is pretty good.
But I like the Galaxy Tab 10.1 more, got worried I might come off wrong and get riped apart like a rabbit before a pack of wolves. Haha.
So instead of the long post, I'll just give a brief short list of what I consider some pros for the iPad 2 over the Galaxy Tab 10.1... and I emphasis I still like the Galaxy Tab 10.1 more and am waiting to buy one.
* Over 50,000 tablet optimized apps. Original iPad came out over a year and has been massively successful. Apple has a huge head start. I think the Android optimized apps still count in the low hundreds right now. And I often see lesser quality with the Android versions. It'll improve, but it's going to take time.
* iOS is more stable. 3.1 has helped, Android Market doesn't bug out on me as much. But there are still stability issues with Honeycomb. I'm a little fearful to install too many apps on my Android tablets because I've had some apps have a negative impact on the entire tablet's performance. Even Motorola's CEO commented recently on this being a concern. iOS on the other hand I have no fear installing everything I see (had over 120 apps on my iPad 1) without fear of performance issues.
* iPad has excellent standby battery life. I can leave the iPad asleep for 24 hours and find it the next day still at 99 or 100% battery life. My Android tablets seem to lose about 25% or more battery life a day just sleeping. I wish more review sites would measure this. I'm curious how much it varies between Android tablets and wouldn't mind seeing more light shed on the issue.
There are other things I could bring up. But generally iPad's strength is the maturity and polishness of it's OS, it's 1 year head start and massive number quality apps.
Still. An exciting thing about Android is this is it's first tablet OS, I think things are moving fast for Android, and we get to be along for the ride. It's only going to keep getting better. And we are already blessed with amazing freedom, flexibility, and customization options. This is what I love about Android.
And I had seriously thought about getting an iPad 2. There are some apps I know I like much more on iOS than Android. But I feel like I'm just giving up way too much control for that. And I think the apps will get better here.

Ravynmagi said:
* iPad has excellent standby battery life. I can leave the iPad asleep for 24 hours and find it the next day still at 99 or 100% battery life. My Android tablets seem to lose about 25% or more battery life a day just sleeping. I wish more review sites would measure this. I'm curious how much it varies between Android tablets and wouldn't mind seeing more light shed on the issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, this is weird. Samsung has a bigger battery, but 2 1/2 hours less runtime on the Anandtech review.

Again I agree with everything you said as well and as far as summaries are concerned you are probably summing up the majority opinion on the overall apple or something else debate.
I am an intel person myself because of that very freedom Apple lacks. I love intel because if I want to dual boot, or just feel like blowing my machine away and running pure linux, or windows or whatever even a hacked version of OSX, I can do that. You go apple, you have to use their hardware - while it is pretty sexy etc it is expensive and you can't mix and match the way you can with intel or make your own best of breed monster. If it had of been they didn't customise OSX to only run on apple hardware i probably would have switched to OSX and been laughing - but again they chose to limit their market and for whatever reason maintain the big f you apple sentiment (maybe just in my opinion only )
The same goes for the tablets - with IOS you are stuck with IOS - you can jailbreak it but with more and more difficulty, and gain access to 100,000's of really cool apps and games, it seems to flow a bit better (well at least in the iphone arena) than other OS's etc but at the end of the day you are stuck with IOS and their way of doing things as otherhawkeye said in his/her post.
My biggest dislikes re apple mobile technology - no common connectivity options (micro usb connector), cannot remove the battery and replace it yourself, no microSD, limited to itunes for a lot of things, lack of common options like gps, 3g etc until their customers all complain and then they add one in and then their customers complain some more and they add some more in. Some people like to be ripped off and jerked around and played like the fools apple must think of the majority of people out there... but sorry it's just not to my liking.
I have to give props to Samsung for actually stating once Apple had released iPad2 that they were going to delay the release of their product revamp it and release a better product because he felt (ceo of samsung) that the 10.1v was inadequate! This is a Korean based company and they are known for quality - that is what the Korean's pride themselves on - best quality from clothes, food, appliances, cars etc - you ask a Korean and they will say everything of theirs is better quality than anywhere else from rice to well everything. That's the mindset they have ... so while it may not always be the case in the real world and is a little biased etc, you have a company trying to live up to that ethos and saying while the 10.1v is good and in many ways still better than the competition they can make it better before finally releasing it.
Apple - ummm well just look here and see what has changed from iPad 1 to iPad2 http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/02/ipad-2-vs-original-ipad-whats-changed this is a YEAR between release dates also....
Remember this is an entirely NEW product yet only a few things have changed. and the cameras they added in are of particularly crap quality according to many reviews. Pleeeease don't tell me that they couldn't have included a better camera, please don't tell me they couldn't include a microSD card, or micro USB or put in the retina display like they did for the iPhone4, or a host of other things that are in smaller devices already. Your probably going to talk quality control and proper lead time for adding in things right - or give other reasons why they don't want to "clutter" the thing with microSD or micro USB etc but ... faf that!
As I have said in my previous post there are already hints that later this year (we're already half way through), that Samsung will more than likely release another version of the same tab with a few extras, if they don't release them along with the 4g version... this is the same product getting revamped for the 2nd time WITHIN the same year! Why? It would be nice to think of it as living up to the ethos but I like to think that it's more that they are sick of Apple releasing inferior products and cleaning up the market with hype and sexiness and they really want to stick it to Apple.....
lol I hope that doesn't come off as apple bashing too much....

Ravynmagi said:
There are other things I could bring up. But generally iPad's strength is the maturity and polishness of it's OS, it's 1 year head start and massive number quality apps.
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Click to collapse
I'm not sure about the "more polishness", but its more stable than honeycomb. I think honeycomb is more polished than ios, but it's less stable right now due to the FCs.
About battery life - honeycomb tablets don't have bad battery life. 8-10 hours battery life is not bad. Apple does have couple of more hours of battery life and better standby battery life, but then we are now in the bragging rights territory. If you charge every day and not going on international trips, the extra hour of battery life is not going to matter to most of the tablet buyers.
Same goes for app store. You said you have 120 apps installed in your ipad, average person has 5 to 20. Honeycomb had every app *I* wanted. The quality of third party apps was similar between Ipad and Honeycomb. But YMMV. If a person needs a specialized app that's not available in HC, then they need to stick with Ipad. OTOH, google apps are vastly superior to the ones in Ipad. That was the deciding factor for me.

Is it true that iPhone apps do not scale on the iPad? I am sure I heard this somewhere, but I cannot imagine it's true.
With that said, while there are not many Honeycomb-specific apps, at least most pre-3.0 apps play nice with HC (upscaling for screen size).
I had a brief time (about 3 hours) where I thought the iPad2 would be a better option for me than the Galaxy Tab 10.1. Luckily, I was talked off the ledge. The only thing that had me leaning towards the Pad is tablet-specific apps, but in the end most of my tablet usage is through the browser.
What sealed the deal in my getting the Galaxy Tab 10.1 was the deep integration of Google services. Until iOS5 comes out, there is definitely nothing on the iPad that holds a candles to Google's Android-account management system (not that I'm aware of, but I an ignorant on this subject).

mightymouse2045 said:
Again I agree with everything you said as well and as far as summaries are concerned you are probably summing up the majority opinion on the overall apple or something else debate.
I am an intel person myself because of that very freedom Apple lacks. I love intel because if I want to dual boot, or just feel like blowing my machine away and running pure linux, or windows or whatever even a hacked version of OSX, I can do that. You go apple, you have to use their hardware - while it is pretty sexy etc it is expensive and you can't mix and match the way you can with intel or make your own best of breed monster. If it had of been they didn't customise OSX to only run on apple hardware i probably would have switched to OSX and been laughing - but again they chose to limit their market and for whatever reason maintain the big f you apple sentiment (maybe just in my opinion only )
The same goes for the tablets - with IOS you are stuck with IOS - you can jailbreak it but with more and more difficulty, and gain access to 100,000's of really cool apps and games, it seems to flow a bit better (well at least in the iphone arena) than other OS's etc but at the end of the day you are stuck with IOS and their way of doing things as otherhawkeye said in his/her post.
My biggest dislikes re apple mobile technology - no common connectivity options (micro usb connector), cannot remove the battery and replace it yourself, no microSD, limited to itunes for a lot of things, lack of common options like gps, 3g etc until their customers all complain and then they add one in and then their customers complain some more and they add some more in. Some people like to be ripped off and jerked around and played like the fools apple must think of the majority of people out there... but sorry it's just not to my liking.
I have to give props to Samsung for actually stating once Apple had released iPad2 that they were going to delay the release of their product revamp it and release a better product because he felt (ceo of samsung) that the 10.1v was inadequate! This is a Korean based company and they are known for quality - that is what the Korean's pride themselves on - best quality from clothes, food, appliances, cars etc - you ask a Korean and they will say everything of theirs is better quality than anywhere else from rice to well everything. That's the mindset they have ... so while it may not always be the case in the real world and is a little biased etc, you have a company trying to live up to that ethos and saying while the 10.1v is good and in many ways still better than the competition they can make it better before finally releasing it.
Apple - ummm well just look here and see what has changed from iPad 1 to iPad2 http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/02/ipad-2-vs-original-ipad-whats-changed this is a YEAR between release dates also....
Remember this is an entirely NEW product yet only a few things have changed. and the cameras they added in are of particularly crap quality according to many reviews. Pleeeease don't tell me that they couldn't have included a better camera, please don't tell me they couldn't include a microSD card, or micro USB or put in the retina display like they did for the iPhone4, or a host of other things that are in smaller devices already. Your probably going to talk quality control and proper lead time for adding in things right - or give other reasons why they don't want to "clutter" the thing with microSD or micro USB etc but ... faf that!
As I have said in my previous post there are already hints that later this year (we're already half way through), that Samsung will more than likely release another version of the same tab with a few extras, if they don't release them along with the 4g version... this is the same product getting revamped for the 2nd time WITHIN the same year! Why? It would be nice to think of it as living up to the ethos but I like to think that it's more that they are sick of Apple releasing inferior products and cleaning up the market with hype and sexiness and they really want to stick it to Apple.....
lol I hope that doesn't come off as apple bashing too much....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
umm.. you do realize that apple computer run on intel chips, right? saying that you're "an intel person" doesn't really many any sense..
anyway, you say that the ipad sucks because they use proprietary ports, don't have sd, etc. but... the galaxy tab 10.1 doesn't have those things either

ralexand said:
Is it true that iPhone apps do not scale on the iPad? I am sure I heard this somewhere, but I cannot imagine it's true.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's true. iPhone apps run on iPad /w the same resolution (occupy a tiny area in the middle of the tablet) or 2x the resolution (occupy most of the tablet screen, but /w blurry text, etc.). Either way, I found it unusable.
OTOH, many, but not all, phone apps run well in HC. They scale nicely and you would hardly know that they are not designed for HC. Case in point, engadget app or many of the news apps.

smaskell said:
umm.. you do realize that apple computer run on intel chips, right? saying that you're "an intel person" doesn't really many any sense..
anyway, you say that the ipad sucks because they use proprietary ports, don't have sd, etc. but... the galaxy tab 10.1 doesn't have those things either
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol yes i know they changed over to intel hardware - however OSX only supports their combination of hardware, won't install on other hardware etc unless you get the hacked boot image and then the drivers that are in the 'hacked' OSX support some hardware and not others and the hardware that is supported it varies on either partial support to full support. when i played with it last year i could only get a single gpu working on my dual gpu video card, no wifi support, no 3d effects, multi threading and virtual support and some other issues that I just wasn't willing to accept. They have a kickass OS why don't they release it to the masses - because they want you to buy the hardware as well from them to get more money. It's like the Catholic church - the only path to God is through the church.
The intel man statement was more meant to describe the freedom you have when using intel based hardware, windows and linux OS's compared with if you go OSX and in the past risc based Apple - you need apple hardware. I like open standards, compatibility and choices for my computing experience.
Yes I am aware of the 'potentially' missing microSD port, and the proprietary 30 pin port to USB cable it comes with. You didn't read what I said about possible 2nd revamp and release of another version which would include the microSD along with an even better screen and maybe a quad core later this year?
Look through some other posts about what supercurio is saying about the current gtab 10.1 - transformer has a screen - gtab 10.1's screen is art, and other comments comparing ips (apple) to pls (gtab 10.1).

mightymouse2045 said:
lol yes i know they changed over to intel hardware - however OSX only supports their combination of hardware, won't install on other hardware etc unless you get the hacked boot image and then the drivers that are in the 'hacked' OSX support some hardware and not others and the hardware that is supported it varies on either partial support to full support. when i played with it last year i could only get a single gpu working on my dual gpu video card, no wifi support, no 3d effects, multi threading and virtual support and some other issues that I just wasn't willing to accept. They have a kickass OS why don't they release it to the masses - because they want you to buy the hardware as well from them to get more money. It's like the Catholic church - the only path to God is through the church.
The intel man statement was more meant to describe the freedom you have when using intel based hardware, windows and linux OS's compared with if you go OSX and in the past risc based Apple - you need apple hardware. I like open standards, compatibility and choices for my computing experience.
Yes I am aware of the 'potentially' missing microSD port, and the proprietary 30 pin port to USB cable it comes with. You didn't read what I said about possible 2nd revamp and release of another version which would include the microSD along with an even better screen and maybe a quad core later this year?
Look through some other posts about what supercurio is saying about the current gtab 10.1 - transformer has a screen - gtab 10.1's screen is art, and other comments comparing ips (apple) to pls (gtab 10.1).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, of course. I couldn't agree more. Just thought it was a bit of an odd way of putting it haha.

10.1 vs Transformer vs Ipad2

After I could compare the Ipad2, 10.1 and Transformer for days now, I decided to go and buy an Ipad2. Yes, I turned my back on Android and here's why:
10.1:
Very nice lookings, high quality and hardware but there is a big problem: the colors. On some pictures the saturation is so high that it kills lots of details every time 2 similar colors are nearby. Here you can see what I mean, check the right circle where orange and red meets - if the orange circle would be more reddish, you could hardly tell there are 2 rings: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1bkovoLXw4&feature=player_detailpage#t=208s
If you compare it to a perfect calibrated monitor, it looks like crap. Flashy, colorful and nice but details are gone. That's the one and only weaknes from what it offers. It's 16:9 display is a winner when it comes to videos but video playback is poor. Ipad2 is much better, even for flash, later more to come about it.
Another MAJOR problem is Samsung support. Android is a fresh system and needs tons of support. Samsung provides NONE. For EU, they still have no release dates or closer info about their device - just lol. For me, the 10.1 is just a step in the process to upgrade to Tegra3. They built the shell now and can use it for the next device to compete with Apple. Same like they did to the 10.1v - no support, they just forgot about it.
Transformer:
Diplay is pretty good but the build quality is crap. After I saw the Archos tablets with the bronze frame, I knew where Asus bought their stuff. Both have those sharp metal frames which are wrapped around the screen. TF and Archos have gaps between the frame and glas, with some kind of rubber to fill it. Asus tried to even out the sharp edges but you can see how cheap it is. Archos tablets can cut in your finger if you swipe around the edges ! For me: complete garbage quality, should cost 250$ max to satisfy the minimalist who just want's to read or something.
Ipad2:
This device is pretty awesome. First I thought the 4:3 diplay sucks for reading but after I measured books and calculated ratios, they were ALL closer to Ipad2 standards. That menas you will have less wasted space on Ipad. When surfing internet you will learn to love 4:3, everything fits perfectly while you feel how broken sites are on 16:9. The drawback are 16:9 movies without a border and the good about it, you have FULLSCREEN ! in emulators without scaling. There are also a lot of older movies/series with 4:3, which I prefer on travel anyway.
It is fluent everywhere and feels like my Galaxy S after getting the lagfix. Stock 3.1 is bull**** compared to it. The only point where it is superior, are widgets.
Root/Jailbreak/Flash:
Jailbreaking an Ipad is a piece of cake, visit a website, click on a button, your done. No bull**** to flash around or to risk your device. After that you have Cydia which is an alternative market. You can also add repos to it, so you gain access to apps of all kind, also the not so legal ones.
You can play Flash Videos on Ipad using Iswifter or other apps. Inconvinient sometimes but to my surprise, they are fluent on the Ipad - Androids are sluggish. The Ipad even played a movie fluent with 10 other flash animations around it !
The crappy part about the Ipad is itunes and the structure how app files are arranged. Every app has it's own folder, so if you use FTP or something to transfer via network, you have to put those files IN the app folder, so they can find it. Not a big deal, if the app folder wouln't be named like 429403290239203023948393. Android is way better, copy somewhere on SD and browse it. Sure you can use itunes to put everything together but Itunes won't work with Jailbroken apps from Cydia. This breaks the use of my NAS server at home, leaving me with ****ty USB-to-PC solutions if I want it the easy way. Music and Videos which are supported by NAS can be played over UPNP but I found more nice apps for that on Android as I could on Ipad.
Conclusion:
10.1 is a nice device but it's like to own a ferrari and only have crappy roads to drive on. Android kills the Tab, sadly. It's good for smartphones but not for tabs - it's worse as an alpha build of windows. Every manufactuerer does what he wants, there are no standards. Compatibility between Android versions are a joke - imagine you upgrade from win7 to win8 and everything stops working - arrrrrrrgh.
This may be fixed with 4.0 but it will take another 1-2 years for the software. Until then, there will be Win8, which could break Androids neck (if it's compatible to Win7 programms!). Also I can sell the Ipad2 for 200-300 bucks, even if Ipad3 is released, so screw it, will lose ~150-200€ to it. But it will buy me at least 6 months of fun.
The best is, I don't have to care about the future. There is no "will it work after OS upgrade" problem with Apple.

Wow there are so many problems with this post I don't even know where to begin. I think I will just address your last line:
The best is, I don't have to care about the future. There is no "will it work after OS upgrade" problem with Apple.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try telling that to the iPhone 3G users who upgraded to ios4 and had a device that was next to worthless. Apple pushed that update out to ose iPhones knowing it would turn it into a piece of **** 100% of the time.

dcc22 said:
Root/Jailbreak/Flash:
Jailbreaking an Ipad is a piece of cake, visit a website, click on a button, your done. No bull**** to flash around or to risk your device. After that you have Cydia which is an alternative market. You can also add repos to it, so you gain access to apps of all kind, also the not so legal ones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Having met way more people with iPodTouch4/IP4/IPad1&2 that do this than those who DO NOT do this, it makes me wonder if the ideology of app devs to take preference to iOS for financial considerations is not completely flawed.

....what is the point of this post?
your inability to play with android OS and tweak it is not an excuse for you to say that android is flawed..with that said, i agree some stuff need to be fix, but its minor stuff such as typing on the browser...and...well thats it for me.
if you want something that work out of the box, agreed pick ipad 2, but if your geeky or you like linux pick android, more custimization then IOS can ever dream of.

THE firmwares with ripped features for different devices, as they become incompatible with every next release the iphone 3g and now 3gs with ios5. Don't tell me jailbreak is easy, it took the developers 3 months to make a jailbreak for ipad 2 which is still raw with compatibility issues! If buying the idevice is an excuse for free apps...probably games in your case with a new handheld gaming device than off board ye pirate! People jailbreak the device for customisation which is the soul of android os (which is not fresh but time tested and evolving i need not wait a whole year for new features to sprout, mostly inspired and already popular in other os!).
Ever heard of DFU mode, recovery mode? Similar terms and combos are used here! Atleast in android thanks to diversity if one model ain't suitable there is a myriad to choose from! Compare two devices of same platform when making a point.

I agree with G1 and the person above but since you decided to share...let me take a turn.
Why you felt the need to justify your iPad 2 choice in an Android related forum is beyond me.
You either realize or fail to see that Apple purposefully limits their tech. Minimal upgrades between generations. Even the newest iPhone won't support 4G from what I have heard yet they want to use LTE patents against Google?
Your train of thought that the iPad 2 is perfect is already starting to form.
The iPad's dimensions do not in any way make it better for video, reading, and web surfing. I was just having a debate with a friend who started complaining about where the dock port was on my Galaxy Tab 10.1. He was quickly shut up when I pointed out that cell phones have the port at the bottom so our hands can grip the sides. However a tablet is meant to be held in LANDSCAPE...that's why sticking the port in a different place was a smart decision.
Point being...he turned into another person claiming everything is horrible with Android. Guess what? He never owned an Android device. He actually has a Touch Pro 2 right now. IGNORANCE!
Look I've had an iPad. I know that jailbreaking it is POINTLESS. Your battery dies out super fast, the app selection is fairly weak, and all of that jailbreaking does nothing but try to replicate an Android experience. But it fails.
Unlike you, I do care about the future. I don't want to live in a world where everybody has the same glossy tablet with a slippery back so you can drop the darn thing. I don't want to be told what I can and cannot do on my tablet. I do not want to support any company intent on holding back technological progress for the sake of money or who buys patents just to sue other companies out performing them.
You have EVERY right to buy an iPad 2 but just know that your choices and who you choose to support speaks volumes. I have friends just like you. One day they're talking about freedom and openness. The next day they're justifying EVERYTHING Apple does. Cool. As long as I have a choice too.
As for your claims about Windows 8, it only serves to buttress how you allowed us yourself to come to your decision.
"Ignorance is bliss." That should be Apple's new tagline.

I love the OP and how he compares the worst of Android tablets to the best of iPad2 lol
4:3 is perfect for reading books with less wasted screen space. Yay! Now try reading comics and watching WS movies You prefer 4:3 movies? Good for you
Jailbreaking is easy for the iPad2 NOW! But do you know how long it took for the jailbreak to come out? That's right, they've been working on it since the iPad2 was released in March. Four months for a jailbreak to give you the 3rd party features equivalent of... Android. Who knows how long it will be the next time a new iPad/iDevice comes out. Compares that to the usual quick turn-around of rooting an Android device.
I'm happy that you're happy with your iPad 2. It's a nice device. But it sounds like you're just an iOS fan who tried Android and didn't like it.

I'm so glad you guys posted such thorough responses, so now I don't have to. I particularly like the point about why an Apple Fanboy felt the need to post his decision in an Android forum was beyond sensible.

goalweiser said:
I agree with G1 and the person above but since you decided to share...let me take a turn.
Why you felt the need to justify your iPad 2 choice in an Android related forum is beyond me.
You either realize or fail to see that Apple purposefully limits their tech. Minimal upgrades between generations. Even the newest iPhone won't support 4G from what I have heard yet they want to use LTE patents against Google?
Your train of thought that the iPad 2 is perfect is already starting to form.
The iPad's dimensions do not in any way make it better for video, reading, and web surfing. I was just having a debate with a friend who started complaining about where the dock port was on my Galaxy Tab 10.1. He was quickly shut up when I pointed out that cell phones have the port at the bottom so our hands can grip the sides. However a tablet is meant to be held in LANDSCAPE...that's why sticking the port in a different place was a smart decision.
Point being...he turned into another person claiming everything is horrible with Android. Guess what? He never owned an Android device. He actually has a Touch Pro 2 right now. IGNORANCE!
Look I've had an iPad. I know that jailbreaking it is POINTLESS. Your battery dies out super fast, the app selection is fairly weak, and all of that jailbreaking does nothing but try to replicate an Android experience. But it fails.
Unlike you, I do care about the future. I don't want to live in a world where everybody has the same glossy tablet with a slippery back so you can drop the darn thing. I don't want to be told what I can and cannot do on my tablet. I do not want to support any company intent on holding back technological progress for the sake of money or who buys patents just to sue other companies out performing them.
You have EVERY right to buy an iPad 2 but just know that your choices and who you choose to support speaks volumes. I have friends just like you. One day they're talking about freedom and openness. The next day they're justifying EVERYTHING Apple does. Cool. As long as I have a choice too.
As for your claims about Windows 8, it only serves to buttress how you allowed us yourself to come to your decision.
"Ignorance is bliss." That should be Apple's new tagline.
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Click to collapse
God, I really like this post. Spoke about everything I wanted to say.
I dont want to be told what I can or cannot do. I want to tweak, optimize and control every setting that I can. There are tons of problems with JB and everyone, even a non-apple user like me, knows it. And without JB youre just living in a matrix that Steve Jobs dictates.
I would really like to hear the OP thoughts on flash. My friend tried to buy something on the web and couldnt use her credit card on the iphone. in the end I bought it for her using-yes my samsung 10.1- and she wrote me a check. And Steve Jobs is saying people dont need/shouldnt use/ cannot use flash on their mobile device.
This kinda makes me think of how I am training my 2 year old son to use the potty.

hmmm
I just recently got a galaxy tab 10.1, after spending the last month using an ipad2, I need both tablets for an app i am building.
And I can tell you this much, anyone that has an iphone will love an ipad2. Anyone that uses an ipad2 will be very very very happy with it.
But trust me, use that device for a month, then switch to honeycomb..... and it will blow you away.

One think I can say about apple is so easy to use, than it becomes boring after a while.thats why I have the samsung galaxy tab.

evolishesh said:
One think I can say about apple is so easy to use, than it becomes boring after a while.thats why I have the samsung galaxy tab.
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Click to collapse
Apple's draw over its competitors has been its simplicity for years - well before Android. Back in the day it was Microsoft. The sad truth is that reduced functionality in a shinier package is what most people want. Thankfully for those of us with a bit more intelligence, we have products like Android to keep us entertained.

SolusCado said:
Apple's draw over its competitors has been its simplicity for years - well before Android. Back in the day it was Microsoft. The sad truth is that reduced functionality in a shinier package is what most people want. Thankfully for those of us with a bit more intelligence, we have products like Android to keep us entertained.
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Click to collapse
You are right. I love android and its platform

Um, wow. Glad everyone else said already literally everything I could think of responding to the OP with.
And personally, I will never buy a Win8 tablet until I can wipe it and install Android, Ubuntu or MeeGo on it.

Lorddeff07 said:
hmmm
I just recently got a galaxy tab 10.1, after spending the last month using an ipad2, I need both tablets for an app i am building.
And I can tell you this much, anyone that has an iphone will love an ipad2. Anyone that uses an ipad2 will be very very very happy with it.
But trust me, use that device for a month, then switch to honeycomb..... and it will blow you away.
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Click to collapse
For the non-ipad users, could you elaborate some points on that? I just want to know some actual comparisons aside from the well advertised facts, ex: flash.

All of these tablets have their quirks and flaws. Mostly with the software. I actually need to return my second 10.1 because it's been randomly turning off like my first. Must be due to heat.
In any case, I will wait for the next batch of tablets instead. Hopefully we start getting some stuff that's really spectacular. Like a processor that can handle the native resolution of HC and has more video codecs.

Colors are pretty drab on ipad and saturated on tab. Both screens need calibration.
Tabs screen is brighter and higher Res. Side by side with same pics regardless of source tab wins everytime. Anyone saying otherwise needs prescription checked.
There's a reason ipadhd is coming. Apple knows full well there display is now second rate.

dcc22 said:
After I could compare the Ipad2, 10.1 and Transformer for days now, I decided to go and buy an Ipad2. Yes, I turned my back on Android and here's why:
10.1:
Very nice lookings, high quality and hardware but there is a big problem: the colors. On some pictures the saturation is so high that it kills lots of details every time 2 similar colors are nearby. Here you can see what I mean, check the right circle where orange and red meets - if the orange circle would be more reddish, you could hardly tell there are 2 rings: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1bkovoLXw4&feature=player_detailpage#t=208s
If you compare it to a perfect calibrated monitor, it looks like crap. Flashy, colorful and nice but details are gone. That's the one and only weaknes from what it offers. It's 16:9 display is a winner when it comes to videos but video playback is poor. Ipad2 is much better, even for flash, later more to come about it.
Another MAJOR problem is Samsung support. Android is a fresh system and needs tons of support. Samsung provides NONE. For EU, they still have no release dates or closer info about their device - just lol. For me, the 10.1 is just a step in the process to upgrade to Tegra3. They built the shell now and can use it for the next device to compete with Apple. Same like they did to the 10.1v - no support, they just forgot about it.
Transformer:
Diplay is pretty good but the build quality is crap. After I saw the Archos tablets with the bronze frame, I knew where Asus bought their stuff. Both have those sharp metal frames which are wrapped around the screen. TF and Archos have gaps between the frame and glas, with some kind of rubber to fill it. Asus tried to even out the sharp edges but you can see how cheap it is. Archos tablets can cut in your finger if you swipe around the edges ! For me: complete garbage quality, should cost 250$ max to satisfy the minimalist who just want's to read or something.
Ipad2:
This device is pretty awesome. First I thought the 4:3 diplay sucks for reading but after I measured books and calculated ratios, they were ALL closer to Ipad2 standards. That menas you will have less wasted space on Ipad. When surfing internet you will learn to love 4:3, everything fits perfectly while you feel how broken sites are on 16:9. The drawback are 16:9 movies without a border and the good about it, you have FULLSCREEN ! in emulators without scaling. There are also a lot of older movies/series with 4:3, which I prefer on travel anyway.
It is fluent everywhere and feels like my Galaxy S after getting the lagfix. Stock 3.1 is bull**** compared to it. The only point where it is superior, are widgets.
Root/Jailbreak/Flash:
Jailbreaking an Ipad is a piece of cake, visit a website, click on a button, your done. No bull**** to flash around or to risk your device. After that you have Cydia which is an alternative market. You can also add repos to it, so you gain access to apps of all kind, also the not so legal ones.
You can play Flash Videos on Ipad using Iswifter or other apps. Inconvinient sometimes but to my surprise, they are fluent on the Ipad - Androids are sluggish. The Ipad even played a movie fluent with 10 other flash animations around it !
The crappy part about the Ipad is itunes and the structure how app files are arranged. Every app has it's own folder, so if you use FTP or something to transfer via network, you have to put those files IN the app folder, so they can find it. Not a big deal, if the app folder wouln't be named like 429403290239203023948393. Android is way better, copy somewhere on SD and browse it. Sure you can use itunes to put everything together but Itunes won't work with Jailbroken apps from Cydia. This breaks the use of my NAS server at home, leaving me with ****ty USB-to-PC solutions if I want it the easy way. Music and Videos which are supported by NAS can be played over UPNP but I found more nice apps for that on Android as I could on Ipad.
Conclusion:
10.1 is a nice device but it's like to own a ferrari and only have crappy roads to drive on. Android kills the Tab, sadly. It's good for smartphones but not for tabs - it's worse as an alpha build of windows. Every manufactuerer does what he wants, there are no standards. Compatibility between Android versions are a joke - imagine you upgrade from win7 to win8 and everything stops working - arrrrrrrgh.
This may be fixed with 4.0 but it will take another 1-2 years for the software. Until then, there will be Win8, which could break Androids neck (if it's compatible to Win7 programms!). Also I can sell the Ipad2 for 200-300 bucks, even if Ipad3 is released, so screw it, will lose ~150-200€ to it. But it will buy me at least 6 months of fun.
The best is, I don't have to care about the future. There is no "will it work after OS upgrade" problem with Apple.
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Click to collapse
I did the same thing,I had the transformer for week return it and waited for the galaxy tab,I love the galaxy tab but too much force closes and app crashing.I exchange tab for ipad2 and jailbreak it.
I am very happy with the ipad,but I miss honeycomb,hope ice-cream sandwich and all manufactures they stop using nvidia Tegra

The hardware is there, and Google is revving up for Ice Cream Sandwich right now, which will hopefully bring some much needed changes to current Android
Tablets.
Sent from my Fascinate with MIUI Gingerbread

The fact that you're here means you don't mind getting your hands dirty.
So you have one simple choice - have your device running as you want it by managing the device yourself, loading ROMs from XDA - or not and wait until Apple decide to fix something.
XDA is fantastic - here there's talented bunch of guys & gals mixing & matching the best features from roms of different vendors into something unique.
There is no comparison between Apple & Android.

Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 vs Window based Tablet experience

I have been a pen/tablet enthusiastic for many years and have owned (and still own) loads of tablet over the years. I currently own and use 4 window based pen-tablets (2 XP, 1 Vista, and 1 Window 7), 2 iPads, 2 iPod touch, Apple Macbook Pro (2009), Apple Macbook Air 13" (2012), Samsung Galaxy Note 5.3, and then the latest Galaxy Note 10.1. I also used to own loads of Window powered PDAs, palm, casio, etc.
As you can see for the list above, I have been looking for the perfect computing experience, especially the pen/tablet experience. I bought the Note 10.1 because of my Note 5.3. IMHO, the Note 10.1 is a decent pen-tablet, and it had made vast improvement over the Ntoe 5.3 in terms of hardware. However, it is the software where I feel is limiting the Note 10.1 from being a perfect pen-tablet machine.
People have already disregard the window based PC as being a serious tablet and they are rightfully so. The XP, Vista, and Window 7 while can be used to run as a tablet, have never been designed for tablet. So my experience with them have always been frustrating. HOWEVER, it was a pleasant surprise to me when I loaded the release preview of Window 8 few weeks ago onto 3 of my old Window tablets.
I have a Samsung Q1UP (6 year old, XP, w/resistive pen, 2GB ram, 64GB SSD), a HP 2710P (4 years old, w/Wavcom pen, 1GB ram, 80GB HDD), an ACER W500 (2 year old, w/touch pen, 2GB ram, 32GB SDD), and when loaded with the Window 8, all 3 machines even though are old have given me a VERY good pen/tablet experience. All 3 tablets now run much faster and very very smooth. The surprise comes when all these tablets are now running more like an Andriod/IOS instead of a typical window os. You can smoothly scroll, zoom, etc just like an iPad or Galaxy Note. The battery life seems to have improved in all these machines, and the time from sleep to logon screen is about 2-3 seconds. Loading programs used to take forever under the old OS, but now I can load excel, word, one-note, etc from cold in about 2 seconds.
Now to the most important part, the pen use with Window 8. The handwriting recognition is much better and faster than the Note 10.1 (for all 3 devices with the resistive pen, wavcom pen, and touch pen). The S-Note in the Note 10.1 is just a tiny program, but the One-Note is a full blown application with seamless integration with Office and Sky Drive, etc.
With the new tablets coming designed specifically with Window 8 in mind, I think Microsoft has risen the par on tablet competition. As the upcoming Samsung Series 5 hybrid tablet, for example, is coming with a $650 based price, 11 hrs battery life (with the optional keyboard), 750g weight, and can run all window software. Even though I have not seen, touch or used one of these new machines, the fact that Window 8 has turned my 6 years old tablet into a brand new machine is exciting for me.
Please don't get me wrong. I think the Samsung Note 10.1 is a decent machine which I will definitely keep. I bought it because I can carry it all day and not worry about battery, and I hardly need to run any PC applications these days when I am out. More importantly if I plan to use the PC all day, I probably need to bring the charger with me which will bring the weight up to 1kg or more. Since I carry my camera with me all day, the Note 10.1 is a better choice for me.
However, if you are looking into serious note taking and also need to run pc applications, I think the Window 8 tablets may be a good alternative. We will all know if this is true when the machines are officially announced in late Oct.
PS: I am in absolutely no way affiliated with any of the companies mentioned about, I am just giving my take on using all these devices over the years.

Good post.
What's your take on the new slate 5 vs surface pro?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Well you are comparing apples and oranges and also making the logical fallacy that just because you like something others will as well. Based upon your large collection of tablets, price is not a big issue for you. You just want the best tablet experience, period. Thats all good, but the majority of buyers don't share your enthusiasm.
Keep in mind that most people think of their tablets as an accessory and not a primary computing device. As soon as you get much above the $500 price point you are getting into primary computing device territory. But with an 11.6 inch screen, tablets do not offer enough real estate to be an ultrabook replacement, especially for a business person running larger format legacy corporate software. I would go blind trying to read my company's database forms on an 11.6 inch HD screen - they cant just be resized as a Word document can be.
Also, will most business people think touch and pen input are worth trading in their 15 inch ultrabook screens for? I have been using Office for 20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen. Office needs two things - lots of screens space and a mouse, a W8 Tablet offers neither.
Samsung makes a good profit on the SGN10.1. They could easily drop the price another $50 and still make money. In addition, one would assume that Samsung will be updating the SGN10.1 to the Note 2.0 software which is far far superior. Whereas W8 is a bit of a lumbering behemoth that will take years to see any major upgrades, Android can change and improve quickly. Also Android is far more customizable. Dont forget that word on the street is Windows 8 as a true desktop OS sucks and wont see broad corporate acceptance.
So you have to ask yourself, will the market as a whole be ready to pay 30% more for a device that does a lot of things (touch and pen) on a Windows device they may not need? Don't forget that we are already competing with very good 7 inch tablets that cost less than a third the price of the new W8 tablets.
Windows 8 tablets will be stuck in the middle. Too expensive for the casual user and too small for the serious user. When it comes to tablets most people want one that costs the least and does the job well enough. Think of it like cars. They sell a lot more Ford Focuses than Porsche 911's. The Porsche is a better car but the Ford just does the job for less. SGN10.1 will continue to be the cheapest usable pen input large format tablet on the market for the foreseeable future. It may not work quite as well as the W8 tablet but it works well enough for 1/3 less.
The good news is the competition will force Android to be better but no, I think Android has got little to worry about from Windows 8.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2

My point is that pound for pound, at least with the Samsung units, you will pay signficantly more for the same level of tablet, even the RT. As a matter of fact the W8 RT offering from Samsung will be slightly worse than the SGN10.1 since the screen is larger with roughly the same resolution. If you dont like the SGN10.1 screen youll hate the W8 RT screen.
For me at least, the primary benefit of Windows over Android is Office programs like Access. Word and Excel are emulated on Android just fine. I dont believe W8 RT will even run Access and if it does I believe the screen is too small to use it effectively with forms designed for a larger screen.
Again, what is the benefit to the consumer of using touch with Office? There is none. So you are trading in a big screen that you do need for touch that you dont.
Tablets are not laptop replacements and if you price them like one you are going to have a problem. They need to be priced like an accessory. Right now at least, Android does that better at the SGN10.1 price. Even $500 is close to being too high.
My conclusion is that W8 Tablets will be too much for a tablet and do too little to replace a laptop. Just my opinion. It may sell gangbusters but I dont think so. We'll have to wait and see. Nevertheless, its presence in the marketpalce will make Android products better
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2

mitchellvii said:
Well you are comparing apples and oranges and also making the logical fallacy that just because you like something others will as well. Based upon your large collection of tablets, price is not a big issue for you. You just want the best tablet experience, period. Thats all good, but the majority of buyers don't share your enthusiasm.
Keep in mind that most people think of their tablets as an accessory and not a primary computing device. As soon as you get much above the $500 price point you are getting into primary computing device territory. But with an 11.6 inch screen, tablets do not offer enough real estate to be an ultrabook replacement, especially for a business person running larger format legacy corporate software. I would go blind trying to read my company's database forms on an 11.6 inch HD screen - they cant just be resized as a Word document can be.
Also, will most business people think touch and pen input are worth trading in their 15 inch ultrabook screens for? I have been using Office for 20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen. Office needs two things - lots of screens space and a mouse, a W8 Tablet offers neither.
Samsung makes a good profit on the SGN10.1. They could easily drop the price another $50 and still make money. In addition, one would assume that Samsung will be updating the SGN10.1 to the Note 2.0 software which is far far superior. Whereas W8 is a bit of a lumbering behemoth that will take years to see any major upgrades, Android can change and improve quickly. Also Android is far more customizable. Dont forget that word on the street is Windows 8 as a true desktop OS sucks and wont see broad corporate acceptance.
So you have to ask yourself, will the market as a whole be ready to pay 30% more for a device that does a lot of things (touch and pen) on a Windows device they may not need? Don't forget that we are already competing with very good 7 inch tablets that cost less than a third the price of the new W8 tablets.
Windows 8 tablets will be stuck in the middle. Too expensive for the casual user and too small for the serious user. When it comes to tablets most people want one that costs the least and does the job well enough. Think of it like cars. They sell a lot more Ford Focuses than Porsche 911's. The Porsche is a better car but the Ford just does the job for less. SGN10.1 will continue to be the cheapest usable pen input large format tablet on the market for the foreseeable future. It may not work quite as well as the W8 tablet but it works well enough for 1/3 less.
The good news is the competition will force Android to be better but no, I think Android has got little to worry about from Windows 8.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2
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Click to collapse
WOW!! I wished someone had warned me about troll living here and that no comments other than good Note 10.1 comments are allowed in this forum. This will be my last post in the forum, leaving you alone to harass other people.
The observation in my original post is based on actual experience. Yours seemed to be based on pure speculations and imaginations. I truly doubt you have similar experience before making your comments. I welcome you to try them first and proof me wrong, or stop making illogical fallacy.
1. I read many of the owners who bought the Note 10.1 because of the S-Pen. Some owners even suggested potential buyers to look elsewhere if they are purely looking for an Android tablet as there are better alternatives out there. At present, only the Note 10.1 and Window tablets offer pens experience, so I don’t understand why you think it is an apple to orange comparison.
2. When I composed the list of devices I own, I was hoping to give some background on the wide variety of devices/OS I have used, so that I can make my points. But you turned it into a show-off list.
3. You mentioned “…20 years and never once felt the need to touch the screen”, then you went to buy the Note 10.1 and other touch devices, interesting!
4. The ACER W500 Win 7 tablet I bought 2 years ago brand new was $550 then (the Note 10.1 is about the same price range). The hardware was mediocre at the time, and it sucked with Win 7. I was amused how Window 8 has turned it into a very respectable tablet, with very fast and accurate hand writing recognition, and good note experience with One-Note, then further suggested today’s hardware could only do better. You turned it into a Ford and Porsche comparison. I bet you had never owned a Porsche before, so it is a mood point arguing with you here.
5. You must be the CFO of Samsung as you knew how much profit they are making on the SGN10.1, and can easily drop the price by another $50. BTW, Samsung also makes the upcoming Window 8 tablet with MSRP of $649 and respectable hardware (S-PEN, 11.6” , 1366 x 768, 2GB Ram, 9 hrs battery life, 750g, and 64GB SSD http://www.engadget.com/2012/08/29/samsung-announces-series-5-slate-series-7-slate/). Based on your insider knowledge, Samsung could also easily drop the price by another $50 for the Window tablet. Then there are other tablets makers that produce cheaper devices.
6. I had never once suggested Window 8 will take over Android or even compete with it, so I think you are making your comments based on illusion.
Best wishes!

Lol, i guess your definition of "troll"is anyone who disagrees with you? You come to the SGN10.1 Forum announcing that our tablet is "just ok" while the W8 tablets will be the Second Coming and you don't expect any pushback?
I made the argument that the W8 tablets will have a difficult time finding their place in a competitive market. Many pundits online agree with me. Too expensive for a tablet, too small for a laptop. You imply that I said you were bragging about all your tablets. I simply said that you were concerned more about performance than price. How did you get from that that i said you were bragging?
As far as knowing the Samsung can cut the price of the SGN10.1 and still make money that is a well established fact. Google is your friend.
Oh well, if you must leave I am sorry. Im sure there is someone in here that will miss you praising the W8 tablets and putting down the SGN10.1.
P.S. Actually I am a BMW man myself. The center console on Porsche is too wide and presses against my shin because I am tall. The Ford/Porsche comparison was an attempt to compare a tool which can do the job at a lower cost vs one that offers good things but perhaps things that cost conscious people dont need.
Touch with Office is a perfect example of this. Why does anyone need touch with Office? Id rather have a 15 inch screen.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2
---------- Post added at 10:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:34 AM ----------
For those who feel, as the OP does, that I am pulling my concerns about W8 Tablets from my backside, here is a quote from PCWorld Magazine:
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscent..._8_tablets_have_what_it_takes_to_succeed.html
There are a number of issues that could make Windows 8 tablets dead on arrival, or at least a very tough sell. Two of the biggest will be price, and confusion over differences between Windows on ARM (WOA) tablets, and x86/x64 architecture tablets.
ARM-based devices will probably be better tablets than their x86/x64 counterparts. WOA tablets will most likely be lighter, cooler, have longer battery life, and--most importantly--be cheaper. ARM-based tablets will be more on par with the competing tablets already in the market like the iPad, Motorola Xoom, Samsung Galaxy Tab, and others.
That all sounds great, but WOA tablets also come with significant handicaps that nullify most of what makes a Windows 8 tablet appealing. For example, WOA tablets can’t run traditional Windows software--they require apps written for the Metro UI.
Wes Miller from GetWired.com and Directions on Microsoft poses the question, “For enterprises who will have to rewrite their (non-Web) applications in Metro for WOA anyway, the question comes up, "why wouldn't I rewrite it for iOS instead?", since there is no way to run non-Microsoft Win32 apps on WOA.”
The bigger issue for WOA tablets is that Microsoft has revealed they are intended for “unmanaged environments”. What that translates to is that WOA tablets will not be able to connect to Windows domains and be managed like x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets, and other Windows systems.
Amobi says that there are arguments to be made for and against WOA tablets, and it’s still too early for a final verdict. But, he stresses, “If they cant join domains--game over.”
No worries. We still have x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets to fall back on, right? True, but there are some caveats.
An x86/x64 tablet is just squeezing a notebook or desktop into a touchscreen, flat-panel form factor. That has advantages, but we also know that running Windows takes a fair amount of processing horsepower and memory. While it may be possible to run Windows 8 with less RAM, 4GB is probably the minimum for acceptable performance. That is four times what most ARM tablets use.
When you build a tablet on x86/x64 architecture, and try to beef up the RAM to deliver adequate performance, the tablet starts to face other issues. As previously mentioned, users want tablets that are thin, light, and have endurance to last all day on a single charge. It is unlikely that x86/x64 tablets can truly compete with ARM-based rivals in these areas.
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As I have stated, W8 Tablets will be stuck in the middle. RT too underpowered to run true Windows software and Pro too small to run true Windows software properly.
DOA.
Hopefully these facts have taken some of the emotion out of this argument.

What the heck OP, please respond to my original question!
New slate 5 vs surface pro. Based on your experience, should we (consumers) wait for the SP release before purchasing.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

mitchellvii, you are assuming too much and treating your "opinion" as the gospel truth.
Have you used OneNote on a tablet computer? S-Note is the extremely light version of OneNote when it comes to note-taking (not doodling or sketching, etc). It is certain that it will get better over time, but the current/first generation is a good introduction to what it can do in the future.
From drawing and sketching point of view, I can make the same argument that you are making for Office and touch. Note 10.1 most likely won't replace anyone's Wacom tablet to produce art on a 10.1" screen. With the same perspective as yours, this falls right in the middle: not enough for professionals and little more than people who aren't into drawing/sketching necessarily.
Just like the OP, I'm not putting down the Note 10.1; I'm actually waiting for the UPS truck to bring a 32GB version today. However, you don't have to blindly defend it when an alternative view is presented. Just embrace the fact that for every device with additional features (e.g., being able to run OneNote and a full OS on a tablet), there's a segment out there. If you are outside of that segment or find some of those features not very useful for your way of using a tablet, it's perfectly fine, as long as you realize the advantages and disadvantages of each device with an open mind.

tenderidol said:
mitchellvii, you are assuming too much and treating your "opinion" as the gospel truth.
Have you used OneNote on a tablet computer? S-Note is the extremely light version of OneNote when it comes to note-taking (not doodling or sketching, etc). It is certain that it will get better over time, but the current/first generation is a good introduction to what it can do in the future.
From drawing and sketching point of view, I can make the same argument that you are making for Office and touch. Note 10.1 most likely won't replace anyone's Wacom tablet to produce art on a 10.1" screen. With the same perspective as yours, this falls right in the middle: not enough for professionals and little more than people who aren't into drawing/sketching necessarily.
Just like the OP, I'm not putting down the Note 10.1; I'm actually waiting for the UPS truck to bring a 32GB version today. However, you don't have to blindly defend it when an alternative view is presented. Just embrace the fact that for every device with additional features (e.g., being able to run OneNote and a full OS on a tablet), there's a segment out there. If you are outside of that segment or find some of those features not very useful for your way of using a tablet, it's perfectly fine, as long as you realize the advantages and disadvantages of each device with an open mind.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The OP said:
"Please don't get me wrong. I think the Samsung Note 10.1 is a decent machine which I will definitely keep."
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Click to collapse
Nice of him to let us know our SGN10.1 is "a decent machine" (compared to the glowing oracle of W8). I consider that a put-down.
"Blindly defending"? As in, just making up stuff you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.

mitchellvii said:
The OP said:
Nice of him to let us know our SGN10.1 is "a decent machine" (compared to the glowing oracle of W8). I consider that a put-down.
"Blindly defending"? As in, "just making up stuff" you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You really must love the Note 10.1 like your significant other. Calling it a "decent machine" is an insult? As I mentioned above, keep an open mind, and you'll be able to see the strengths and the weaknesses of each device.

mitchellvii said:
The OP said:
Nice of him to let us know our SGN10.1 is "a decent machine" (compared to the glowing oracle of W8). I consider that a put-down.
"Blindly defending"? As in, just making up stuff you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
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Click to collapse
Yes you are. You posted an article filled with opinions from Mar and think that these are facts. They are not.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app

mitchellvii said:
"Blindly defending"? As in, just making up stuff you mean? Did you even bother read the article? Lol. Read it and get back to me on my blind defense.
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So, stating someone else's opinion is a fact, now? Got it! Let me find that Verge review and link it here as the "fact" about Note 10.1.
Again... I purchased the damn thing and will be using it to its full potential. However, unlike you, I'll keep an open mind and try the Samsung Smart PC offerings (specifically the Series 5). If it performs well, it'll replace the Note 10.1 (or I may keep both, since they serve different functions); if not, I'll continue to use it happily.

tenderidol said:
Have you used OneNote on a tablet computer? S-Note is the extremely light version of OneNote when it comes to note-taking (not doodling or sketching, etc). It is certain that it will get better over time, but the current/first generation is a good introduction to what it can do in the future.
From drawing and sketching point of view, I can make the same argument that you are making for Office and touch. Note 10.1 most likely won't replace anyone's Wacom tablet to produce art on a 10.1" screen. With the same perspective as yours, this falls right in the middle: not enough for professionals and little more than people who aren't into drawing/sketching necessarily.
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Click to collapse
Three things are missing from this conversation to make it worthwhile.
1) Everyone uses their tablets differently. A gamer, heavy productivity user, graphic artist, reader, and someone who uses it primarily for consumption all have different needs. And someone's personal weighting of those things determine which product is "best" for them. I could easily see someone needing OneNote (and MS Office in general) jumping on W8 just for that. Same thing for a graphic artist who wants access to desktop versions of tools they typically use. How many of them there are and how well W8 tablets do more pedestrian things will determine their success, not our discussion.
2) We're comparing something that doesn't exist to something that does. Unless you all intend to go out and buy an Acer W500 with 4 hours of battery life and that weighs two pounds this is at best a theoretical conversation until actual W8 tablets are in people's hands and can be evaluated in real-world use. And don't forget the Pro tablets come with all the stuff we love about Windows: 1) driver incompatibilities, 2) control panel, and 3) multiple menus, clicks, and "enters," to launch or access something. The UI formally known as Metro doesn't hide the fact that there's a huge resource intensive hulk of an OS to be tamed running in the background. How many general-use iPad candidates do you think will find that acceptable? And they’re MS’s bogie, not the 20% of the tablet market that’s using Android.
3) Until the complete feature set is known for both RT and Pro tablets and what apps will be available to them initially you can't have a price-value conversation. I highly doubt entry-level consumer targeted RT tablets will do some of things being discussed. Similarly if a loaded Pro tablet is $1K that changes the conversation when comparing it to a $500 Android tablet.
I'll check back in with you guys once the tablets are in people's hands for a while and then we can have a legitimate conversation of the pros and cons of each.
BTW, here's an excerpt of a review of the HP TouchPad when it was first released. Just because a monolithic company launches something its success isn't guaranteed. It’s too early to say whether W8 tablets will be a Zune or an XBox 360 for MS and no one here can do anything but proffer an opinion as to which way it will go.
"You would almost think that webOS had been designed for tablets from the very beginning. It feels more native to tablets than any other software on any other tablet, despite being an almost exact translation of the phone interface (minus almost all of the bezel gestures). Multitasking on anything else feels almost stupid compared to Cards. An open app is a card. You can stack them, sort them, re-arrange them, and when you're done, close them. Juggling a bunch makes you feel like you're getting stuff done. Palm's big tablet adaptation, panes, is a straight riff on the iPad Twitter UI. So in email and other complex apps, you slide layers—inboxes, message lists, actual messages—back and forth to move between them. Notifications, which pop down from the top of the scree, let you flip through the pile, one at a time, without ever opening the app-handy if you get IMs from five different people. They're great ideas."

BarryH_GEG said:
Three things are missing from this conversation to make it worthwhile.
1) Everyone uses their tablets differently. A gamer, heavy productivity user, graphic artist, reader, and someone who uses it primarily for consumption all have different needs. And someone's personal weighting of those things determine which product is "best" for them. I could easily see someone needing OneNote (and MS Office in general) jumping on W8 just for that. Same thing for a graphic artist who wants access to desktop versions of tools they typically use. How many of them there are and how well W8 tablets do more pedestrian things will determine their success, not our discussion.
2) We're comparing something that doesn't exist to something that does. Unless you all intend to go out and buy an Acer W500 with 4 hours of battery life and that weighs two pounds this is at best a theoretical conversation until actual W8 tablets are in people's hands and can be evaluated in real-world use. And don't forget the Pro tablets come with all the stuff we love about Windows: 1) driver incompatibilities, 2) control panel, and 3) multiple menus, clicks, and "enters," to launch or access something. The UI formally known as Metro doesn't hide the fact that there's a huge resource intensive hulk of an OS to be tamed running in the background. How many general-use iPad candidates do you think will find that acceptable? And they’re MS’s bogie, not the 20% of the tablet market that’s using Android.
3) Until the complete feature set is known for both RT and Pro tablets and what apps will be available to them initially you can't have a price-value conversation. I highly doubt entry-level consumer targeted RT tablets will do some of things being discussed. Similarly if a loaded Pro tablet is $1K that changes the conversation when comparing it to a $500 Android tablet.
I'll check back in with you guys once the tablets are in people's hands for a while and then we can have a legitimate conversation of the pros and cons of each.
BTW, here's an excerpt of a review of the HP TouchPad when it was first released. Just because a monolithic company launches something its success isn't guaranteed. It’s too early to say whether W8 tablets will be a Zune or an XBox 360 for MS and no one here can do anything but proffer an opinion as to which way it will go.
"You would almost think that webOS had been designed for tablets from the very beginning. It feels more native to tablets than any other software on any other tablet, despite being an almost exact translation of the phone interface (minus almost all of the bezel gestures). Multitasking on anything else feels almost stupid compared to Cards. An open app is a card. You can stack them, sort them, re-arrange them, and when you're done, close them. Juggling a bunch makes you feel like you're getting stuff done. Palm's big tablet adaptation, panes, is a straight riff on the iPad Twitter UI. So in email and other complex apps, you slide layers—inboxes, message lists, actual messages—back and forth to move between them. Notifications, which pop down from the top of the scree, let you flip through the pile, one at a time, without ever opening the app-handy if you get IMs from five different people. They're great ideas."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With the exception of one person, we are all on the same page here. Below is an excerpt from the OP. To me, it overlaps very well with your points and my argument. Somehow, this was turned into "How dare you put down Note10.1? Windows 8 tablets are DOA!" bickery.
With the new tablets coming designed specifically with Window 8 in mind, I think Microsoft has risen the par on tablet competition. As the upcoming Samsung Series 5 hybrid tablet, for example, is coming with a $650 based price, 11 hrs battery life (with the optional keyboard), 750g weight, and can run all window software. Even though I have not seen, touch or used one of these new machines, the fact that Window 8 has turned my 6 years old tablet into a brand new machine is exciting for me.
Please don't get me wrong. I think the Samsung Note 10.1 is a decent machine which I will definitely keep. I bought it because I can carry it all day and not worry about battery, and I hardly need to run any PC applications these days when I am out. More importantly if I plan to use the PC all day, I probably need to bring the charger with me which will bring the weight up to 1kg or more. Since I carry my camera with me all day, the Note 10.1 is a better choice for me.
However, if you are looking into serious note taking and also need to run pc applications, I think the Window 8 tablets may be a good alternative. We will all know if this is true when the machines are officially announced in late Oct.
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[email protected] said:
WOW!! I wished someone had warned me about troll living here and that no comments other than good Note 10.1 comments are allowed in this forum. This will be my last post in the forum, leaving you alone to harass other people.
Best wishes!
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Click to collapse
[email protected], welcome. Sorry about the resident W8 Hater. I recommend to just ignore him.
Thank you for sharing your experience with your Note(s) and your tablets with Windows 8! My experience with my Note 10.1 is pretty much the same as yours. I am really looking forward to trying out a Surface Pro or one of the other new W8 tablets that are coming out. Your post has just seriously reinforced that!
When you use One Note on a tablet, does it give you inking features for drawing pictures and hand writing notes similar to what S-Note does? I have W8 and One Note, but no Ink-enabled device to put them on to play with it myself.

tenderidol said:
With the exception of one person, we are all on the same page here.
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Click to collapse
Who are "we?" I have no idea what everyone here's needs are. I also have no idea what the "cons" are going to be that will without doubt go along with the rosy PR blurb “pros” being thrown out. I'm in marketing so perhaps I'm less susceptible to spin than some of you guys because I create it. MS lost their way and have a bunch of simultaneous "Hail Mary's" launching concurrently (Cloud, W8 the OS, and W8 the tablet). I wish them nothing but the best. But I'd like to see some traction gained before drinking their Kool-Aid and declaring their success. And that will take months to realize. I'm a heavy productivity user and use OneNote, MS Office, and SharePoint so therefore a candidate for a W8 tablet. Only I'm not as eager to throw out my fairly evolved Android device to experience V1 of the h/w and s/w of an alternative. Months from now I may own a W8 tablet. Based on my personal needs and usage there's absolutely no rush. You guys can go first and if the world's not flat I'll follow you.

BarryH_GEG said:
Who are "we?" I have no idea what everyone here's needs are. I also have no idea what the "cons" are going to be that will without doubt go along with the rosy PR blurb “pros” being thrown out. I'm in marketing so perhaps I'm less susceptible to spin than some of you guys because I create it. MS lost their way and have a bunch of simultaneous "Hail Mary's" launching concurrently (Cloud, W8 the OS, and W8 the tablet). I wish them nothing but the best. But I'd like to see some traction gained before drinking their Kool-Aid and declaring their success. And that will take months to realize. I'm a heavy productivity user and use OneNote, MS Office, and SharePoint so therefore a candidate for a W8 tablet. Only I'm not as eager to throw out my fairly evolved Android device to experience V1 of the h/w and s/w of an alternative. Months from now I may own a W8 tablet. Based on my personal needs and usage there's absolutely no rush. You guys can go first and if the world's not flat I'll follow you.
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Click to collapse
"We" as in "people who currently own the Note 10.1 and wanted to try and see the potential of upcoming Windows 8 tablets without forming any assumptions based on others' opinions". As you can see, nobody is saying that this will be a huge success, it's going to be "superior" or will definitely trump other tablets, etc. Let's see if the potential of the device is met by the hardware and the software first. As I stated, I have my reservations for the Atom-based CPU and 2 GB RAM in the Series 5. If it can't handle the load, I won't be moving over to the Series 7, because it's too heavy and pricey for me. I thought this was the original discussion.

tenderidol said:
see the potential
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Promise and potential are very different from practice and reality. And sometimes when they collide it isn’t pretty. Since this entire conversation is theoretical there can never be a decisive conclusion. I really don't have an opinion and won't until I can personally play with a W8 tablet and see how well it does the things I need it to do. Even then, my conclusion will only apply to me and my individual needs.
Think about this. Here's the iPad demographic.
iPad ownership is skewed toward young customers, with 27% of owners between 25 and 34. The average iPad owner is affluent, with a median income of $85,000 a year. Most importantly, they are much more likely to be buying things.
Don't you think that audience is using MS Office and OneNote professionally to earn the higher median income they do? Apple's sold 100MM iPads with no native access to MS Office. Taking a broader view I don't think it's the "killer app" many of you believe it will be. Especially if it comes at the price of a less refined h/w and s/w experience. There's also a certain cache that comes from owning an iPad. Android tablet owners tend to be classified as rugged individualists and technology enthusiasts. What will W8 tablet owners be? People that need access to MS apps? Pretty low on the "cool" scale, no? There’s more to a product’s success than just functionality.
Just food for thought while we're discussing the potential mass-market (in other words, not us) success of W8 tablets.

BarryH_GEG said:
Just food for thought while we're discussing the potential mass-market (in other words, not us) success of W8 tablets.
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Which we weren't until some folks hijacked the thread and went totally OT from the OP...

For those who insist the Windows 8 tablets will be superior, please read:

We have had a number of people coming into our Forum praising the upcoming Windows 8 tablets and putting down our beloved SGN10.1. Before any SGN10.1 owners fall for their hyperbole, please consider the following from PCWorld Magazine:
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscent..._8_tablets_have_what_it_takes_to_succeed.html
Potential Stumbling Blocks
There are a number of issues that could make Windows 8 tablets dead on arrival, or at least a very tough sell. Two of the biggest will be price, and confusion over differences between Windows on ARM (WOA) tablets, and x86/x64 architecture tablets.
ARM-based devices will probably be better tablets than their x86/x64 counterparts. WOA tablets will most likely be lighter, cooler, have longer battery life, and--most importantly--be cheaper. ARM-based tablets will be more on par with the competing tablets already in the market like the iPad, Motorola Xoom, Samsung Galaxy Tab, and others.
That all sounds great, but WOA tablets also come with significant handicaps that nullify most of what makes a Windows 8 tablet appealing. For example, WOA tablets can’t run traditional Windows software--they require apps written for the Metro UI.
Wes Miller from GetWired.com and Directions on Microsoft poses the question, “For enterprises who will have to rewrite their (non-Web) applications in Metro for WOA anyway, the question comes up, "why wouldn't I rewrite it for iOS instead?", since there is no way to run non-Microsoft Win32 apps on WOA.”
The bigger issue for WOA tablets is that Microsoft has revealed they are intended for “unmanaged environments”. What that translates to is that WOA tablets will not be able to connect to Windows domains and be managed like x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets, and other Windows systems.
Amobi says that there are arguments to be made for and against WOA tablets, and it’s still too early for a final verdict. But, he stresses, “If they cant join domains--game over.”
No worries. We still have x86/x64 Windows 8 tablets to fall back on, right? True, but there are some caveats.
An x86/x64 tablet is just squeezing a notebook or desktop into a touchscreen, flat-panel form factor. That has advantages, but we also know that running Windows takes a fair amount of processing horsepower and memory. While it may be possible to run Windows 8 with less RAM, 4GB is probably the minimum for acceptable performance. That is four times what most ARM tablets use.
When you build a tablet on x86/x64 architecture, and try to beef up the RAM to deliver adequate performance, the tablet starts to face other issues. As previously mentioned, users want tablets that are thin, light, and have endurance to last all day on a single charge. It is unlikely that x86/x64 tablets can truly compete with ARM-based rivals in these areas.
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As I have stated, W8 Tablets will be stuck in the middle. RT too underpowered to run true Windows software and Pro too small to run true Windows software properly.
DOA.
Hopefully these facts have taken some of the emotion out of this argument.
The SGN10.1 is and will be the most bang for your buck you can get in a pen based tablet for quite a while. If we get the Note 2 software, that will be even more true than it is now. No need for buyer's remorse. You made the right call.

Good thing most reviews are **** or we wouldn't have got the Note 10.1 based on reviews, amiright?
Quit white knighting the Note. It's a good tablet but there will come along better ones.
Every review of every tablet has a slant. There are no unbiased professional reviews. Or amateur reviews for that matter.

Nefariouss said:
Good thing most reviews are **** or we wouldn't have got the Note 10.1 based on reviews, amiright?
Quit white knighting the Note. It's a good tablet but there will come along better ones.
Every review of every tablet has a slant. There are no unbiased professional reviews. Or amateur reviews for that matter.
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Click to collapse
So you are claiming this review is innacurate? Please point out what you specifically find to be false? Those are not opinions but just facts about how Windows 8 will work in a tablet environment. The reviewer is not discussing the merits or inadequacies of any particular tablet.
If you can debunk any of those claims now is your chance.
As far as "white knighting" the SGN10.1, this IS the SGN10.1 forum is it not? Maybe you got lost? The better question would be why are Windows 8 fanboys coming to our forum to disparage our device? I have drawn two conclusions regarding our visiting Windows 8 protagonists thus far. They are very enthusiastic and they are very thin skinned. Can you imagine someone coming to OUR forum to tell us the SGN10.1 is inadequate and then calling ME a troll when I dare disagree?
Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk 2

I can't believe you rose to the bait in [email protected]'s original thread. He's comparing old-school Windows tablets that he upgraded to W8 and declaring victory for the platform going forward. People have been posting screen-on times for the Note of over 10 hours. An earlier Windows tablet would be lucky to clear 4 and weigh easily twice as much to do it. Like the rest of you I made a substantial investment in the Note knowing W8 tablets were around the corner. The reason I did it is that every new platform that's launched goes through start-up issues, suffers from lack of refinement, and has a dearth of apps in the beginning. If I jump on the W8 tablet band wagon it’ll be months after their launched and I feel no urgency to dump the Note which will without doubt continue to be a better consumption device for the foreseeable future. If your use of a tablet is 75+% complex inking and MS Office apps maybe you should jump on W8 Pro faster than me and join [email protected]
The challenge with W8 is that you can't make a generalized comparison to Android. The RT tablets are going to be low-feature consumer versions and the Pro versions higher-end (and priced) productivity devices. It's too early to say but I doubt a $300 RT tablet will deliver the stellar Wacom-driven inking experience [email protected] is hoping for. Similarly the starting price for a Pro tablet is probably for a pretty barren model. By the time you upgrade the various h/w components I can see them easily reaching the $1K that you originally suggested for a “loaded” model.
Regardless, the fat lady won't sing for at least a couple of months until after they're in people's hands so it's way too early to get in to a discussion about "my tablet (or OS) can beat up yours.” Why [email protected] decided to come to an Android forum just to share his personal opinions of his old-school Windows hardware is beyond me.

I'm a bait-riser from way back :silly:
I just get tired of the breathless hyperbole from these W8 disciples. I wouldn't have minded if he had just talked about how well his old tablets were running on W8, but he put our tablet down as second best and I can't have that

Nefariouss said:
Good thing most reviews are **** or we wouldn't have got the Note 10.1 based on reviews, amiright?
Quit white knighting the Note. It's a good tablet but there will come along better ones.
Every review of every tablet has a slant. There are no unbiased professional reviews. Or amateur reviews for that matter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Excellent point! If you take a look at Verge's "professional review", you wouldn't touch the Note10.1 with a ten-foot pole. Then again, here we are talking about it happily. Note 5.4 was declared DOA by almost every "professional reviewer" and we know how that went.
Let's wait and see before moving into a cult-like behavior over a tablet.

Even on the arm tablets the windows 8 interface will be present. There will be full office 2013, OneNote, and all metro apps. Plus it seems to be really smooth and slick on the reviews.
And this without the biggest thing. In one move the windows ecosystem will be bigger than the Android ecosystem. Apps will not be the super stretched phone apps, and but rather full tablet apps (witness the xda app as on example).
Does this mean I regret buying the note? No not all. But it does mean that once the windows 8 tablets are out I will not be taking it in to work or on trips. It will become more consumption based then productivity.
Lets not pretend that windows will somehow disappear just because you think it will be doa. Even vista sold more than all android tablets combined.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app
---------- Post added at 05:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:38 PM ----------
Without even reading the full article I know the claim about windows requiring beefy hardware is bull****. I I have run windows 8 on a touch smart tx2 with 2 gigs, and on a q6600 with 1 gig and an i7 with 16 gigs. And I am running the note right now. Even on the touch smart win8 was smoother and performed better. I sadly the ntrig drivers don't work and the thing weighs a ton, and but the Clover trail smart pc from Samsung willost likely have a better experience than the note.
Also multitasking. I real split screen for almost every app.
And the finishing blow? OneNote. Nothing compares with OneNote.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app
---------- Post added at 05:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:43 PM ----------
I do not have any idea why people are ignoring the published price of the Samsung tablets. Samsung has already said that the smart pc with Clover trail will be 650 with 64gig storage. We know it won't cost significantly more than top of the line android tablets, and will have free OneNote mx, and have comparable weight and battery life (if I believe samsung) and will use the same spen.
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app

oh mitchellvii. Poor, poor, mitchellvii.
Owning both a Win8 tab [Asus Eee Slate] and (obviously) the GNote10, I can say that no matter how hard Samsung or Android try, Windows is the true multi-tasker. No way around it. Also, definitely more capable to do ANY task.
The GNote10 does have it's advantages. Prolly the same reasons I bought one is the same reasons y'all bought one. Battery life, weight, slim, no fan, s-pen, and I guess Android based.
Just because Windows is hands down better doesn't mean the GNote is inadequate.
Don't be mad that the GNote is second best to a Windows tablet, be mad that the GNote will always be second best to an iPad.

I have my N10.1 3G for 3 weeks now, it accompanied me to travels and never ever failed..Neither failed my wife' s N10.1 her (she is more the gaming fraction in my family )
I worked easily in the plane in plane mode with stylus having four apps open, read some kindle books, diagnosed HR X-Rays preloaded, drawed comments on them for my junior docs, prepared some drafts for lectures, in summary the time was highly productive, more than ever achievable with my Vaio Z 14 supernotebook.
Why ? Its almost impossible to decently work with a notebook on the plane, at least in eco class .......
With the N10.1 You can !
With a fair data roaming fee I read my newspapers and PC/Android mags at breakfast and dinner, follow my beloved Ida community, post, answer emails and so forth.
I could do last aactivities also with my SGS III, but I LOVE the big screen and multitasking, I can do everything I did not do with my Note, this was finally too small for me for serious work.
But why am I still curious of the Win8 Surface?
For my lectures worldwide I need a fully functional PowerPoint including the capability to play embedded vids (every third slide is a vid!) and edit every slide as a would do it on my PC. I did not find an Android app capable of THIS. And I need fully functional Word and Excel (not stripped versions)
Second: I need connectibility to standard beamers with the good old VGA-D-sub connector
All this my beloved N10.1 can't give me.
If Surface Win8 provides these features I will buy it and be happy working with it, but my N10.1 will always be Nr. 1 (until Note 10.1 / 2 arrives :angel:)

mitchellvii said:
I'm a bait-riser from way back :silly:
I just get tired of the breathless hyperbole from these W8 disciples. I wouldn't have minded if he had just talked about how well his old tablets were running on W8, but he put our tablet down as second best and I can't have that
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Click to collapse
No one is providing breathless hyperbole, everyone I have seen here is cautiously optimistic at best about Windows 8 tablets. If you think that's fanboyism then perhaps you need to take a good hard look in the mirror. No one here, including [email protected], has bashed the Note 10.1 in any way. You need to separate praising another OS from praising a specific device, and both of those from bashing our device. I love my Note 10.1 but there are obviously things it can't do, and to deny that is stupid. I do agree with you overall that Windows 8 tablets appear to be stuck on two extremes with Pro and RT and not able to meet the middle ground that the Note 10.1 reaches, but I think with time and competition they will be at least competitive with Android tablets on at least 2 or 3 out of functionality, battery life, and form factor, and value.
Personally I don't think I need my tablet to be a full Windows PC and do full multitasking with floating windows and the like, but that's because I've got plenty of beefy systems for real work and my tablet is a great supplement to them. Also I use Linux primarily and Windows only for gaming but that's a separate point. For those that want or need to have one device that does everything, a Windows 8 Pro tablet may be that device. You'll compromise on battery life and weight but gain a lot of extra functionality. And you keep ignoring the possibility of Atom powered Windows 8 Pro tablets that could be competitive on battery life and weight too (not equal to ARM, but at least in the same ballpark) in addition to cost.
Honestly, I think everything that can be speculated about W8 at this point as been said and we should have a moratorium on further discussion here until the first devices are actually out.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

My "other" portable device next to the OG G-Tab in its BT keyboard case. It weighs the same as the Note, runs W7 Ultimate (for now), has all the MS Office apps including Access, packs a 256GB Samsung SSD, has a 1600x768 display, GPS, and a built in VZW card. The Android tablet's a better consumption device and the VAIO's a better productivity device. They both are adequate in reverse. Which I travel with depends on what I'll be doing. If I had to pick one I'd pick the Note because it's more versatile and can "fake" productivity better than the VAIO can "fake" consumption. Who knows? Maybe a W8 tablet will end up being the perfect blend.

mitchellvii said:
We have had a number of people coming into our Forum praising the upcoming Windows 8 tablets and putting down our beloved SGN10.1. Before any SGN10.1 owners fall for their hyperbole, please consider the following from PCWorld Magazine:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The reason you are getting such a cross-comparison is because the SGN 10.1 is marketed as an alternative to Windows tablets. People buy the SGN 10.1 to do things that an IPad can't with handwriting functions. People want to know if the 10.1 really fills the gap between the IPad and Windows devices.
I think the general consensus is that for light note taking and sketching it does and for hardcore professionals (like lawyers) it doesn't.
I loved the Note 10.1... but I returned it as I'm in the latter category. I need seemless cloud and app integration.
FWIW, I went ahead and put the IPad 3 screen up against the Note. It really would be difficult for me to accept a lower resolution than the Note 10.1 provides. The new Slate 5 is going to have a worse PPI than the Note. I don't think I'll be purchasing that device.

crazeco said:
the SGN 10.1 is marketed as an alternative to Windows tablets.
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Click to collapse
It's actually marketed as a creativity and consumption device.
“Our goal with the Samsung GALAXY Note 10.1 was simple – redefine the tablet experience,” said Tim Baxter, President, Samsung Electronics America. “The S Pen offers both active content creation as well as passive content consumption, while the Multiscreen capability finally enables true multitasking. For the user, the resulting experience is completely new and quite unexpected.”
http://www.samsung.com/us/news/20228
But you raise an interesting question. How will companies like Samsung, Asus, Acer, and Lenovo market and position their W8 tablets, especially RT, when they all offer similarly priced and featured Android tablets? The only one that can/will go balls out and say W8 is better than Android is MS. Maybe that's what they were afraid and what caused them to build the Surface on their own.

BarryH_GEG said:
It's actually marketed as a creativity and consumption device.
“Our goal with the Samsung GALAXY Note 10.1 was simple – redefine the tablet experience,” said Tim Baxter, President, Samsung Electronics America. “The S Pen offers both active content creation as well as passive content consumption, while the Multiscreen capability finally enables true multitasking. For the user, the resulting experience is completely new and quite unexpected.”
http://www.samsung.com/us/news/20228
But you raise an interesting question. How will companies like Samsung, Asus, Acer, and Lenovo market and position their W8 tablets, especially RT, when they all offer similarly priced and featured Android tablets? The only one that can/will go balls out and say W8 is better than Android is MS. Maybe that's what they were afraid and what caused them to build the Surface on their own.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I stand by my statement that the SGN 10.1 is marketed as an alternative to the W8 tablets like the Surface because this is the (earlier) Microsoft press release:
"Surface is designed to seamlessly transition between consumption and creation, without compromise."
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/press/2012/jun12/06-18announce.aspx

crazeco said:
I stand by my statement that the SGN 10.1 is marketed as an alternative to the W8 tablets like the Surface because this is the (earlier) Microsoft press release:
"Surface is designed to seamlessly transition between consumption and creation, without compromise."
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/press/2012/jun12/06-18announce.aspx
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Don't you mean that you see the Note 10.1 as an alternative to W8 tablets? Because from what I read, the statements from Samsung don't really say that at all. You're using a statement from Microsoft (who, last I checked does not make nor market the Note 10.1) as the basis for how Samsung is marketing its device.
Uh, forgive me, but that makes no sense. How Samsung attempts to sell its device is how it is marketed, not how people and other companies respond to it. I think the point you're actually making is that the Note 10.1, competitively speaking, is seen as an alternative device to a W8 tablet, but that's not the same thing as saying that's how it's being marketed. Samsung hasn't said flat out that they want it to be an alternative to W8. They're aiming it at students and businesspeople for creative tasks, general multi-tasking, and note-taking. Somehow I think a W8 tablet should be able to do far more than that, productivity-wise.
Just my two cents, though...

wingzero2085 said:
How Samsung attempts to sell its device is how it is marketed
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To add to your post, PR's crafted months in advance. The words Samsung chose were with clear knowledge of the imminent announcement of the Ativ(s). It'll be interesting to see how competing Android and Windows tablets are marketed and positioned by the different OEM's. Kind of like a single dealership selling Honda's and Toyota's in the same showroom.

wingzero2085 said:
Don't you mean that you see the Note 10.1 as an alternative to W8 tablets? Because from what I read, the statements from Samsung don't really say that at all. You're using a statement from Microsoft (who, last I checked does not make nor market the Note 10.1) as the basis for how Samsung is marketing its device.
Uh, forgive me, but that makes no sense. How Samsung attempts to sell its device is how it is marketed, not how people and other companies respond to it. I think the point you're actually making is that the Note 10.1, competitively speaking, is seen as an alternative device to a W8 tablet, but that's not the same thing as saying that's how it's being marketed. Samsung hasn't said flat out that they want it to be an alternative to W8. They're aiming it at students and businesspeople for creative tasks, general multi-tasking, and note-taking. Somehow I think a W8 tablet should be able to do far more than that, productivity-wise.
Just my two cents, though...
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Microsoft's PR came first. Samsung responded by mirroring Microsoft's PR.
Microsoft on June 18, 2012: "Surface is designed to seamlessly transition between consumption and creation, without compromise."
Samsung on August 15, 2012: “Our goal with the Samsung GALAXY Note 10.1 was simple – redefine the tablet experience,” said Tim Baxter, President, Samsung Electronics America. “The S Pen offers both active content creation as well as passive content consumption..."
I'm happy to have a debate with you regarding which device will better achieve "consumption" and "creation" - but I'm not going to debate facts. It's a fact that Samsung is marketing this device to the same type of consumer that Microsoft is marketing a pen supported Surface tablet. That's why threads like this exist in the Samsung Note 10.1 forum, because the SGN 10.1 is an alternative to the forthcoming Windows 8 tablet.

My personal config will be:
Win8 Surface Pro to run full "Office" and special medical apps not available for android (CAT-Scan-Viewer etc.) + connect to beamers for lectures (since it has Miniport-Display plug)
+
Beloved SGN 10.1 on the go and during lectures remote control Win8 surface Pro :laugh::laugh::laugh:
Makes 1,6 kg to carry around ..........................

troed said:
My personal config will be:
Win8 Surface Pro to run full "Office" and special medical apps not available for android (CAT-Scan-Viewer etc.) + connect to beamers for lectures (since it has Miniport-Display plug)
+
Beloved SGN 10.1 on the go and during lectures remote control Win8 surface Pro :laugh::laugh::laugh:
Makes 1,6 kg to carry around ..........................
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Click to collapse
Funny... I have the same plan for very similar reasons.

tenderidol said:
Funny... I have the same plan for very similar reasons.
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Click to collapse
Honestly I don't see why you would want something other than the Surface Pro in that situation. Its going to have similar battery life, better pen support and will not weight a lot more. Not to mention higher res screen.
Personally I'll be getting the Ativ Smart PC (the atom one with the low res screen) to replace the note. I have a student I can gift the note 10.1 to if he does a good job with an upcoming conference. SmartPC will probably be my go to laptop/tablet hybrid device.
I would sell a right leg for a kindle paperwhite with an active digitizer and direct export to OneNote.

[Discussion] Neptune ecosystem with the Hub and Duo?

Neptune, the company behind the Pine wearable phone, is coming back around, but their efforts are curious now. First, they boast the Neptune Duo, an idea of flipping the watch and phone to make the phone the companion and the watch the core.
The phone part is considered a peripheral. Replaceable, non-essential. The watch is where the magic happens.
But then they update their website. The ability to reserve or pledge for a Duo disappears. In its place, a teaser for their newest idea, one to truly make the personal computer...
It mentions the Hub, as a primary source. I have nothing but speculation and curiosity.
Neptune made a name for themselves when they proposed the idea of a smartwatch that could truly be your only device. The Pine didn't quite live up to those expectations. It fell flat as fast as it rose. But Neptune looks like they're far more professional about this, with plans to change the world through a model that merges two other models that most of us weren't aware of. They plan to balance the understanding of use cases, but make it work with one device? It's interesting, but impossible considering there are many kinds of people.
This isn't even the first time. Canonical built Ubuntu Touch with an intent on allowing you to make a dockable phone that would allow the phone to be a full-on computer for easy and simplified use. That is still in the works, and not even being seen yet from the Aquaris E4.5, the only phone with Ubuntu Touch currently.
What do you think? Can Neptune pull it off for real this time?

A good concept
I recently became the proud owner of a stand alone smart watch.
The main disadvantage of super small stand alone smartphone watches (with only 1.5 inch screen) is that typing sms-es or search criteria becomes a true challenge.
The usage of a companion screen that allows for a bigger interface (and thus a larger keyboard), only when needed, is the perfect solution.
Why is the protocol between the "hub" and the screen a propriatary thing?
I think there is a market for the Duo, if the price is right.

It's no longer the Duo, but the Suite. The protocol is not proprietary. It is actually WiGig, an advancement on existing Wi-Fi that takes form in the unused 60Ghz band, able to send 700mb/s wirelessly. The Hub is the center of the system with flagship specifications. The Pocket Screen is the most equivalent to a phone. The Tab screen is a 10-inch display, Keys for physical function, Earphones for sound and charging, and a dongle for TV use.
WiGig technology is simply not consumer-grade yet. Neptune Suite should change that.
The Hub uses a 2.4in display, and they're currently arguing the choice of OLED vs. E-Ink display. I personally think OLED is a better option. Since the WiGig technology is energy-efficient, the worry of OLED for energy consumption sort of gets canceled out due to streaming data to a completely different device.
Since you'll get the equivalent of a flagship phone in watch size, a phone, tablet, keyboard, headphones and dongle bundled, the price comes out to $900.

Interesting. Thanks for that information. Price seems high.
A nice spec Android smart watch phone: less than $200
A nice Android tablet : less than $200
If one has both already, what does it take to use te tablet as a second screen and keyboard? If tablet connects through the Phone hotspot, All I would need it for is to:
Surf: tablet
Sociale networks: tablet
Video: tablet
Phone: phone
Music: Phone or tablet
Edit contacts, type sms: both with tablet to help me for typing
I admit that it would require some user discipline to do all what the duo/suit can do,
....... for half the price of less

Well, to be fair, this is potentially the strongest smartwatch that will be available. It does more than the Samsung Gear S or Apple Watch, it runs Android, it has Bluetooth, NFC, GPS, 802.11b/g/n/ac + ad for WiGig.
The extra hardware doesn't even operate without the Hub. That seems bad, but it acts as a sort of security feature, and the Hub is the center of all the hardware, so you have the same data at your disposal whether you use the phone or the tablet. Your idea has that issue where data and apps would potentially be out of sync.
With 64GB, this is likely supposed to be the answer to the businessman on the go. Tired of carrying cables to sync data over, and doesn't care about the operating environment, someone who can use Android, iOS, OS X, or Windows. Carries his data on his wrist, never worries about leaving hardware because if it's a good enough product, he can just buy a new Pocket screen at a Wal-mart. Maybe wouldn't mind going out for a jog once in a while, and won't need to carry the Pocket screen because the Hub is a phone at the heart of it.
The price sort of makes sense. On the Indiegogo page, they offer the devices individually, and the Hub + wireless earphones came up for $400, which seems good for a watch of this magnitude. Likely, that's backer price, and it would be $500+ on its own. $900 seems worth it, of course, if you want to entrust the time between here and now, it's $649.

Extremely intrigued by the Neptune...
I'll admit, I'm a bit obsessed with the concept of a true standalone smartwatch, and am a big believer that delegating simple tasks like phone calls and sending/receiving texts and emails (made easier by voice) to a smartwatch while using a small tablet for heavier browsing/app usage is simply a more effective and efficient use of technology. For those reasons, I LOVE what Neptune is trying to do here (especially leveraging WiGig, which I didn't obviously know they were doing...) A few concerns I still have:
- How are app developers realistically supposed to design apps (both in terms of UI and functionality) for a platform that scales from 2.4" all the way up to potentially 60-80" TV's (using the dongle?)
- What's the point of having a hub "always on me" when the cuff is so darn thick that I can't possibly wear it comfortably during my workday, or fashionably outside of work?
That said, I love that they've made the necklace both a charging cord and a more attractive alternative to the standard Bluetooth necklace/headset. They've done a LOT of brilliant things with their new suite, but a few glaring holes still terminal in my mind.

Well, you have the passion for the idea like I do. Something about all that power in a pocketable form factor is always so intriguing, and we already carry phones with high specs, so a high-spec smartwatch would be impressive, as Neptune is going for.
Regarding your issues, I can see what you mean, but this is a fairly moot point. Let me explain...
Android devices of all shapes and sizes exist for all types of purposes. The core of the display driver is the resolution and the pixels per inch. Now, I don't know the PPI for the Hub itself, but it's certainly going to be high. Apps will probably display at their "full size" in the 2.4inch display, but that's like reading a microscope. My mother has an LG Optimus Fuel, and apps such as Pinterest are impossible to use on that thing, as they are sizing for large displays, while being on a very small display. So, yes, some apps won't be optimized to be viewed on that type of display.
As for stretching through the dongle, I'm sure it'll hit a limit and it'll perform like, say, the Amazon Fire TV. A fair size, almost like a tablet was blown up, but you'll have the keyboard at your disposal to manage it. I can't explain that bit, you'd just have to use a Fire TV and see what I mean.
Regarding the design, Neptune is working with Pearl Studios on that front. Pearl Studios focuses on design above all else, so the appearance of the device should be fittingly elegant, especially in workplaces with the suit and tie attire, the business-centric lifestyle. Ultimately, though, it's personal preference, and you probably need to know if you like a 36mm watch before you purchase this. They'll also offer sizes for various wrist sizes, so it won't quite be one-size-fits-all.
I do see what you mean, though. As someone who's mostly working in environments where your appearance should be presentable at minimum, as well as continuing his education, I am not certain how it will be to wear it in my every day life. It's going to be a waiting game from here to April.

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