Related
Hello folks,
I just tried to benchmark my x10 with linpack and got only 6.8 or 6.9 mflops. is this normal, is there anything i can do to make it get a higher score?
I'm using the latest .435 firmware and rooted and have all the junk pps from the 'x10 junk apps' thread removed from my phone.
Thanks for any help.
How does the phone perform? Are you satisfied with it or does it lag considerably? A benchmark really means nothing other than bragging rights. If it feels fast and feels good then why worry about mflops?
Sent from my Delorean using a flux capacitor!
If you look in the developer forum just pick one of the ROMs and you will find info on enabling JIT
Sent from my 2.2.1 Beta4 using XDA App
My score for mflops is always around 39 and my highest is 40+
Sent from my X10i using XDA App
xxcysxx said:
Hello folks,
I just tried to benchmark my x10 with linpack and got only 6.8 or 6.9 mflops. is this normal, is there anything i can do to make it get a higher score?
I'm using the latest .435 firmware and rooted and have all the junk pps from the 'x10 junk apps' thread removed from my phone.
Thanks for any help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
whether you updated via flashtool or through seus or pc companion, to optimize your phone is very simple especially if not wanting to root or install custom roms. download latest flash tool, once installed and up and running. make sure your phone is set on debug mode. connect to usb and plug into comp. though you may not want the apps that are in the custom folder. hit the customize button, you can remove them later. you will now notice that the optimize button is now highlighted in black. click on that button and let it install the files. This installs JiTv2 Files. this will bring mflops up and quad scores up. it however will not give very high scores. quad will be around 800-850 tops. mflops will be increased to about 20-30 maybe 35. notice on quad when running the rotating planets test. you might hit 33fps!!! instead of the supposed 30 that its only suppose to get. if you run neocore test you might only peg and 25-28. Good Luck!!
-OP
try running the test again after the unit has settled down (no activity for a while). you might get different results.
hit the customize button, you can remove them later. you will now notice that the optimize button is now highlighted in black. click on that button and let it install the files. This installs JiTv2 Files
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi SErooted,
thank you for your helpfull respond. i pressed the customize and then the optimize button like you said and the phone rebooted and the result was better. linpack now get about 32 and some change, quadrant about 757, and neocore about 21fps, shouldn't neocore get better frame rate than this?
can i get it even faster than this?
i have heard about clearing the dalvik chache when installing JIT for the first time. well i didn't clear any cache when i press that customize or optimizer button. did it do it automatically or do i still have to do it manually?
what i wanted was to have the interface and games run fluid and smooth. like no studder at all.
does the processor throttle down when the system is at idle?
should i overclock?
also, i have notice the video recording in hd mode have less studdering now. though its still there, but less. do you think it probably have anything to do with the memory card performance. i'm still using the stock 8gb that originally came with the phone.
My score for mflops is always around 39 and my highest is 40+
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hello Michael7168,
thank you for your respond to my message. can you please elaporate more on your statement. is this an x10 you using? i would like to get this result too.
furthermore, i prefer not to use custom firmware at the moment as i use this phone frequently day-to-day and i need to have full functionality of it and reliably. custom firmware are still buggy and lacks some functionality of the phone that i still find usefull for my daily task. but if there is a better custom firmware that really does utilize all of the phone functionality, then please point me in that direction.
xxcysxx said:
Hi SErooted,
thank you for your helpfull respond. i pressed the customize and then the optimize button like you said and the phone rebooted and the result was better. linpack now get about 32 and some change, quadrant about 757, and neocore about 21fps, shouldn't neocore get better frame rate than this?
can i get it even faster than this?
i have heard about clearing the dalvik chache when installing JIT for the first time. well i didn't clear any cache when i press that customize or optimizer button. did it do it automatically or do i still have to do it manually?
what i wanted was to have the interface and games run fluid and smooth. like no studder at all.
does the processor throttle down when the system is at idle?
should i overclock?
also, i have notice the video recording in hd mode have less studdering now. though its still there, but less. do you think it probably have anything to do with the memory card performance. i'm still using the stock 8gb that originally came with the phone.
hello Michael7168,
thank you for your respond to my message. can you please elaporate more on your statement. is this an x10 you using? i would like to get this result too.
furthermore, i prefer not to use custom firmware at the moment as i use this phone frequently day-to-day and i need to have full functionality of it and reliably. custom firmware are still buggy and lacks some functionality of the phone that i still find usefull for my daily task. but if there is a better custom firmware that really does utilize all of the phone functionality, then please point me in that direction.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello xxcysxx,
yes neocore normally runs higher scores. round about 27-28 avg. i personally havent ran a stock firmware since right around mid december. i have alternated with a few and have finally settled on z.s 2.2b4. and have checked all roms available to find which is best. and custom firmware is sometimes shere you get the desired result. i have done some testing on my x10 with various settings and roms and will be happy to share with you what i have going on. my phone is very responsive. quad scores as of ten minutes ago was 2011 without having overclock widget installed. if yo install overclock widget and max out on screen and off screen min and max to 998mhz, you can achieve slightly higher quad scores. but really not needed if you follow settings below. i have a free app from market sysctl. it works!! not sure if you have read the thread on it yet but if not i will have to post there as i have found perfect settings for performance but at cost of battery drain. install if you have root, if not, the call to root is yours.
if interested.... download sysctl from market.
min free kb: 900000
dirty ratio:500000
dirty background:200000
vfs cache pressure:10
Oom allocating: checked
like i said performance not battery. i know for battery saving settings set these numbers close to what the default are. the lower the better battery, the higher, performance.
if you are really worried about daily performance and custom roms.... when/if you decide. i recommend eminence for 2.1 theme of your choice but i really dig bitsnackers theme its awsome and who wouldnt think a tron looking buzzlightyear isnt cool? its awsome. has a cool bootlogo too. all phone funstionality is there video, camera, flash. EVERYTHING!!
BELOW>>> Optimized, xrecovery, root<<<< ENABLED
if you are interested in a 2.2 rom which really does boost speed on phone and what not. i recommend z's 2.2beta4 as video is not working as of yet you might hold off. if you dont use video you should be ok with camera for now and that works. install gappsfreex10, z's data2sd, and theme of your choice. i like xfx10 cant remember name of creator (sorry) but this theme is great! all of theme are great to be honest this is just the one i use.
2.3 roms are out and they are snappy alone without having any adjustments, however there are things that dont work, camera is really the only thing i can think of right now. but by this time it might be fixed, cant say havent checked status but will when done replying.
you can install and run sysctl on these roms as well and gives great boost.
update: not sure if this is a result of sysctl or problems due to network overrun... mflops as of now are 3.2 i normally run 38+. Mmmmm, I wonder?
update 2: double checked after a little while and low mflops was due to network overload not settings. also once upon reboot from my settings i have a quad score of 2233. screen shot below. mflops picked back up but yet are not as high as usual 34.xx
as well to answer on dalvik cache... yes clear cache and also install cache cleaner from market. i have mine set to clear every twelve hours. when installing custom rom not always a case but recommend to wipe user data as well. a few minutes to reset your phone and make sure everything smooth is worth doing this. as well, clear battery stats.
either way, let me know what you guys think and if these settings help.
SErooted
SErooted said:
Hello xxcysxx,
yes neocore normally runs higher scores. round about 27-28 avg. i personally havent ran a stock firmware since right around mid december. i have alternated with a few and have finally settled on z.s 2.2b4. and have checked all roms available to find which is best. and custom firmware is sometimes shere you get the desired result. i have done some testing on my x10 with various settings and roms and will be happy to share with you what i have going on. my phone is very responsive. quad scores as of ten minutes ago was 2011 without having overclock widget installed. if yo install overclock widget and max out on screen and off screen min and max to 998mhz, you can achieve slightly higher quad scores. but really not needed if you follow settings below. i have a free app from market sysctl. it works!! not sure if you have read the thread on it yet but if not i will have to post there as i have found perfect settings for performance but at cost of battery drain. install if you have root, if not, the call to root is yours.
if interested.... download sysctl from market.
min free kb: 900000
dirty ratio:500000
dirty background:200000
vfs cache pressure:10
Oom allocating: checked
like i said performance not battery. i know for battery saving settings set these numbers close to what the default are. the lower the better battery, the higher, performance.
if you are really worried about daily performance and custom roms.... when/if you decide. i recommend eminence for 2.1 theme of your choice but i really dig bitsnackers theme its awsome and who wouldnt think a tron looking buzzlightyear isnt cool? its awsome. has a cool bootlogo too. all phone funstionality is there video, camera, flash. EVERYTHING!!
BELOW>>> Optimized, xrecovery, root<<<< ENABLED
if you are interested in a 2.2 rom which really does boost speed on phone and what not. i recommend z's 2.2beta4 as video is not working as of yet you might hold off. if you dont use video you should be ok with camera for now and that works. install gappsfreex10, z's data2sd, and theme of your choice. i like xfx10 cant remember name of creator (sorry) but this theme is great! all of theme are great to be honest this is just the one i use.
2.3 roms are out and they are snappy alone without having any adjustments, however there are things that dont work, camera is really the only thing i can think of right now. but by this time it might be fixed, cant say havent checked status but will when done replying.
you can install and run sysctl on these roms as well and gives great boost.
update: not sure if this is a result of sysctl or problems due to network overrun... mflops as of now are 3.2 i normally run 38+. Mmmmm, I wonder?
update 2: double checked after a little while and low mflops was due to network overload not settings. also once upon reboot from my settings i have a quad score of 2233. screen shot below. mflops picked back up but yet are not as high as usual 34.xx
as well to answer on dalvik cache... yes clear cache and also install cache cleaner from market. i have mine set to clear every twelve hours. when installing custom rom not always a case but recommend to wipe user data as well. a few minutes to reset your phone and make sure everything smooth is worth doing this. as well, clear battery stats.
either way, let me know what you guys think and if these settings help.
SErooted
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
holy sh*t. is that benchmark test at the bottom for your X10?
TidusWulf said:
holy sh*t. is that benchmark test at the bottom for your X10?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no the one at the top where it says your device. 2233
or how about now after i modded my sysctl settings.screen shot below taken just seconds before this post
xxcysxx said:
Hello folks,
I just tried to benchmark my x10 with linpack and got only 6.8 or 6.9 mflops. is this normal, is there anything i can do to make it get a higher score?
I'm using the latest .435 firmware and rooted and have all the junk pps from the 'x10 junk apps' thread removed from my phone.
Thanks for any help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Install JIT from here.
batman_112 said:
Install JIT from here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Read post on first page
i have alternated with a few and have finally settled on z.s 2.2b4, and have checked all roms available to find which is best. and custom firmware is sometimes shere you get the desired result..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thank you for your respond again.
your generic test result has me sold to custom firmware. i want to try it out to see what i'm really missing.
so to your experience, z's 2.2 b4 has all functionality of the device working with only the exception of the video recording? is that correct?
perhaps i can live with that for now. i frequently record my baby playing around the house and playing outside, that's why i prefer to keep the camcorder.
perhaps i will find an old phone laying around in the house just to get by while i'm going on an adventure on custom firmware.
if yo install overclock widget and max out on screen and off screen min and max to 998mhz, you can achieve slightly higher quad scores.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
will keep this overclocking widget in mind. i just recently learned that you cant clock the processor past 1Ghz without sucessfully cracking the bootloader first. so overclocking is not going anywhere for now.
i have a free app from market sysctl. it works!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, i done this already. but still learing on settings.
i have found perfect settings for performance but at cost of battery drain. install if you have root, if not, the call to root is yours.
if interested.... download sysctl from market.
min free kb: 900000
dirty ratio:500000
dirty background:200000
vfs cache pressure:10
Oom allocating: checked
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on your x10 running at these settings, can you go at least a full day of work on a single charge with frequent text messaging, internet browsing, and phone calls?
no video games or leisure activity involve. full day of work as in taking the phone off the charger in the moning and comming home around eight or nine o'clock in the evening.
i recommend eminence for 2.1 theme of your choice but i really dig bitsnackers theme its awsome and who wouldnt think a tron looking buzzlightyear isnt cool? its awsome. has a cool bootlogo too. all phone funstionality is there video, camera, flash. EVERYTHING!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i'm confused here. is eminence 2.1 a custom firmware or is it a theme for android 2.1 firmware?
if it is a modified sony ericsson 2.1 stock firmware with a different theme, then i'm not interested.
however, if it is a fully ported open source 2.1 android firmware, (not tamper with by sony ericsson) then this is good news. i really hope it is this!
BELOW>>> Optimized, xrecovery, root<<<< ENABLED
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i have a question about xrecovery.
are you familiar with bare metal restore, acronis true image, or norton ghost.
i use these software to customize my laptop for different occations. whether i use my laptop to play games with my buddies at break hours durring schools, or do homework assignments in the library, or other general work. all i have to do is lay the image at boot and i have a completely different pc. it can be any os using any software customize in anyway, and took about five to ten minutes to lay down the image.
now back to the xrecovery question. can i do a "full backup" or a complete snap shot of the flash of my current android os and then restore it back at a later time in the same state and condition it was in just before i left it?
this is just incase i might have a remorse when i try the custom firmware.
i put a lot of time in making all the settings and adjustments just to the way i like it and i prefer not to have to do it all over again.
I have another question about the JIT software.
how many jit versions are out there?
i'm using the x10 flash tool version 0.2.6 to install the jit software on my phone. do you know what version of jit was distributed with this flash tool version?
thanks again, your time and help is very much appreciated.
your generic test result has me sold to custom firmware. i want to try it out to see what i'm really missing.
Bold step... always worth a shot.
so to your experience, z's 2.2 b4 has all functionality of the device working with only the exception of the video recording? is that correct?
perhaps i can live with that for now. i frequently record my baby playing around the house and playing outside, that's why i prefer to keep the camcorder.
perhaps i will find an old phone laying around in the house just to get by while i'm going on an adventure on custom firmware.
i always keep several older phones for camera use, or other things so this is always a good idea.
will keep this overclocking widget in mind. i just recently learned that you cant clock the processor past 1Ghz without sucessfully cracking the bootloader first. so overclocking is not going anywhere for now.
i agree in holding off, really overclock widget should be utilizes when operating stock 1.6. anything after that 2.1 2.2 2.3 their optimized with jit or are optimized enough without it
on your x10 running at these settings, can you go at least a full day of work on a single charge with frequent text messaging, internet browsing, and phone calls?
no video games or leisure activity involve. full day of work as in taking the phone off the charger in the moning and comming home around eight or nine o'clock in the evening.
these settings, im actually getting stats on this today as i was modding my phone alot yesterday and did not much have chance to let charge until last night. will let you know how well those settings work through out the day.
i'm confused here. is eminence 2.1 a custom firmware or is it a theme for android 2.1 firmware?
if it is a modified sony ericsson 2.1 stock firmware with a different theme, then i'm not interested.
however, if it is a fully ported open source 2.1 android firmware, (not tamper with by sony ericsson) then this is good news. i really hope it is this!
to my knowledge is has not been tampered with by sony, cant recall if the dev had placed any se apks in theme. but it is a great rom. so is blue sparks. if going 2.1 anyway. these are roms and not just themes overlay. so should be as open source as the dev made it.
i have a question about xrecovery, can i do a "full backup" or a complete snap shot of the flash of my current android os and then restore it back at a later time in the same state and condition it was in just before i left it?
this is just incase i might have a remorse when i try the custom firmware.
i put a lot of time in making all the settings and adjustments just to the way i like it and i prefer not to have to do it all over again.
yes you can. when in xrecovery, go to back up and restore. and backup. this will save all settings, phone book, contacts text message, everything! if not happy with custom software you have installed. just go back to xrecovery>backup and restore> restore. back to 2.1 software before the custom rom
I have another question about the JIT software.
how many jit versions are out there?
i'm using the x10 flash tool version 0.2.6 to install the jit software on my phone. do you know what version of jit was distributed with this flash tool version?
the JiT version that is with the new flashtool is JiTv2 i believe.. dont quote me on that. i believe it is as i have looked at the files in the optimizer and compared them to the copy of JiTv2 i have saved on my comp. to my knowledge, there is only two versions. again, dont quote me on it. i havent seen an chatter going on about newer versions so this might be all we get. not sure though
thanks again, your time and help is very much appreciated.[/QUOTE]
always happy to try and help.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=935919
Refer this
Cheers!
AdY
SErooted said:
your generic test result has me sold to custom firmware. i want to try it out to see what i'm really missing.
Sorry took so long to kget back to you. hope you catch this.
Sysctl settings really dont make large change in how fast all functions of the phone operate. most increase in performance for settings is shutdown and power on time. as well as a little better scrolling of menus.
basically running the 2.2 software from z or trip, adding the data2sd.zip will get you well into having quad scores of 2+++. if aiming for higher closer to around 3000. which i am very near doing. ill show when i have the proof not till then
anyway, getting mid 2+++ scores and higher, do require using something like set cpu or Overclock widget, in order to get your phone to run at top speed while doing the test..
after that run a test then another and so on until you have achieved what is perfect W/O for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i did tried the setting parameters you suggested earlier before your latest post and i found the improvement is not that noticable, but the battery did die very quick. i found the original configuration work just fine at this point.
i'm still doing some reading on the custom firmware to make sure i make the proper approach without any hickups. i still have a lot of school work to finish and a part time job so the custom firmware is moving along quite slowly.
Hello all!
Just upgraded my wife from the MyTouch 3G Slide to the G2 as she has to have a keyboard and we were on our 5th replacement Slide. So, as she is not the geek that I am, she will not be constantly flashing new ROMs and such. However, I am going to at least install the latest CM and I am looking for kernel suggestions. I already have root, s-off, new hboot, and all that, I'm just waiting for CM7 to finish downloading.
I started using Android with the G1 and constantly updating Radios, as well as ROMs and I currently use a Samsung Vibrant running a TeamWhiskey ROM. It's stable as anything, I like the theme, and CM7 still has some broken stuff on the Vibrant. I'm glad to see that Eugene recently picked up a G2 as he made some bad ass kernels and ROMs for the Vibrant.
So, let's here those kernel recommendations and why you recommend them.
Thanks!
Well am currently using mexdroidmod and their kernel is pretty awesome because its fast and stable. My best advice is to test the diffrent kernel and read through the tread, see what people say about it. All the kernels I have tried are all awesome so you should try them
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA Premium App
pershoot's kernel. great batt life and OCing
Umaro's kernel has been rock solid for me and has tons of features as well. You can OC all the way to 1.9 Ghz if you so please and it has smartass.
well considering your wife isn't much of a techie.. i say you should go with pershoots kernel because he's always releasing updates and i've never had a problem with any of them. the battery life is excellent if you use the right radio (.17 and .30 have been good to me), but you need to experiment with this though. the phone runs beautifully, just make sure you use superwipe+ to format/wipe so you don't end up with gps issues like many people have had, good luck!
I've run umaro, eugene, pershoot, flippy, pyro, etc etc... aaand I've decided that the provided kernel is pretty much good to go. yeah, there are some little trinkety things with a few of the above kernels that the standard CM7 kernel doesn't support... but honestly, they're worthless to a user who just wants to turn the phone on and have it work.
set her up with the stock kernel @ 245-1017 (I haven't found a reason yet to ditch the ondemand governor, it seems to work best with CM7) and a vanilla gingerbread launcher and she'll be blown away.. that's my $.02
Like said above, CM kernel is great. I've tried most or even all available kernels for CM and finaly decided to stick with original one. It's stable and supports OC (up to 1.5GHz) "out of box", so really, I see no single reason to use the other ones.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
AllWin said:
Like said above, CM kernel is great. I've tried most or even all available kernels for CM and finaly decided to stick with original one. It's stable and supports OC (up to 1.5GHz) "out of box", so really, I see no single reason to use the other ones.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm also thinking about changing the kernal, but only for smartass. Does smartass offer that much of an increase on battery life or anything else? Also, when you OC, do you use SetCPU or just CyanogenMod Settings?
slapshot30 said:
I'm also thinking about changing the kernal, but only for smartass. Does smartass offer that much of an increase on battery life or anything else? Also, when you OC, do you use SetCPU or just CyanogenMod Settings?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
not at all pooping on any of the guys who swear by smartass/other governors, but the change in battery life is almost unnoticable for me.. the change in performance however can be pretty apparent.
here's my problem with "battery saving" governors:
in order to save battery, these governors are supposed to be more intelligent about which frequencies they select once a task is called... well, that's all well and dandy, but the problem is that the majority of battery-hogging apps (ie streaming music/video, gaming, browsing for a long time, being on the phone, etc) are still going to be battery hogs with or without a fancy governor. the governor isn't capable of making an app that needs a lot of processing power run well at a lower frequency, it can only try to be more selective about which frequencies it uses in order to attempt to save battery life.
additionally, most people use their phones like this: phone is idle (ie screen off), and a call arrives. call ends, phone is back to idle. texting a few people, back to idle. playing a game for 15 minutes, back to idle.
is it really logical to assume that these short bursts of activity are going to benefit at all from a fancy shmancy governor? I doubt it.
I still swear by ondemand or interactive (both work well for me) thru built-in settings if possible (ie cyanogen performance settings). second choice would be setcpu with no profiles (unless you're overclocking heavily, then you should at least have a temp warning profile). at this point, screen-off profiles don't do a damn bit of good, because pretty much every kernel we have for the vision is going to scale down during inactivity.
Feel Free to post and give feedback ^_^
Also feel free to Vote the thread ^_^
Q&A is in Post 2
_____________________________________
Hi Everyone, Arrow here and this is my guide to find what is the best aosp setup for your evo or android. It is true when people say "every phone is different." However there is an average of people that get similar results. At the moment people have different interest such as some people want performance and some want to improve their battery life. Of course certain people want both but only some get both.
*Remember what i put here is an average and may be different on your evo*
AOSP GB ROM'S: Ok so to start off, these are aosp roms still being updated as of now.
CyanogenMod 7 (CM7) - The most famous aosp rom out there, all or almost all other aosp roms are based off of this rom. This rom has a stable rom and experimental nightly builds. Anyone will tell you that you can't go wrong by choosing this rom. and believe me you will enjoy it.
CyanogenMod 7 Thread
Miui - This rom has the longest battery life and is very customizable. This rom is based off of CM7 and is an excelent rom. However unlike CM7 this rom does not have 4g so if you are willing to sacrifice 4g then believe me this is your rom.
Miui Thread
Gingerbread Evo Deck - Ok so although CM7 is amazing decks gb rom has said to be the exact same thing but giving off better battery life. other then that it is pretty much the same thing with some minor tweaks and some bloat ware removed.
Gingerbread-Evo-Deck's Thread
Xplod E4G - Team Nocturnal designed this rom and it is pretty much CM7 with the Sony Launcher + their apps. This rom will give your phone a nice cool feel that other people don't have. If you like a lot of eye candy then get this rom because it is CM7 just with a different look and feel.
Team Nocturnals Xplod E4G RLS1.2
teh roxxorz said:
using Xplod: there's a 50/50 chance the new tiamat kernels [4.0.7+] may not boot, in that case, they should use 3.3.7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ICS(mod7) - Team Blaze designed this rom and you can consider this rom like Xplod E4G, a rom just like CM7 with some minor tweaks but with a different look and feel. None the less this rom has something very special this is the closest rom to being like ICS (Ice Cream Sandwich). I 100% support this rom because they are doing the best they can to make this rom look and run as smooth as ICS. so if you want to look like your ahead of the game definitely get this rom.
ICS(mod7) Thread
AOSP GB Kernels: These are three kernels that i know of, if you know of more please let me know and i will add them.
Tiamat 4.1.0 - This is the latest kernel made by Tiamat and this is the only aosp kernel still being updated. This kernel on average gives people great performance but lacks on battery life. The main Governor for this kernel is SmartassV2 which is a balanced governor, good to turn on your phone and good to use on a normal day to day bases. For this kernel i do recommend using this governor. It does have SBC and Non-SBC kernels. *Side Note* (Some people say Tiamat 3.3.7 works better for them and is also known as the LEE Kernel because it was awesome like Bruce Lee and looks like Lee backwards [337])
Tiamat Website I also put the Zips in the Attachment (At The Bottom)
Savaged-Zen - This kernel is no longer being updated, however it is still amazing this kernel seems to be Tiamat's competition. Where Tiamat lacks on battery Savaged-Zen does not. However it's performance is not as good as Tiamat. This Kernel comes in two version BFS (Brain F***ed Scheduler) and CFS (Completely Fair Scheduler). BFS is said to give better performance and CFS is the normal kernel. This kernel only comes with SBC however you may download "SVZ Manager" which will allow you to turn SBC on or off. The main governor for this kernel i believe is on demand However i use smartass and a lot of people us InteractiveX.
Savaged-Zen CFS sbc I also put the Zips in the Attachment (At The Bottom)
Savaged-Zen BFS sbc in attachments (At The Bottom)
SVZ Manager I also put the Zips in the Attachment (At The Bottom)
GoDm0de - This Kernel was made by toastcfh and is no longer being updated. It is non-sbc and in my opinion definitely the best non-sbc kernel. This Kernel has insane battery life and a pretty good performance. If you do not want to use an sbc kernel i recommend for you to 100% use this kernel. The Governor for this kernel is set on on demand (i think) however i got the best battery/performance using Interactive.
GoDm0dE Kernel I also put the Zips in the Attachment (At The Bottom)
AOSP ICS ROM'S:
ICS rom by: the_Plattypus and it is still in Alpha testing. however the development for this rom is moving really fast so hopefully a beta will come soon.
EVO 4g Ice Cream Sandwich from source
ICS-evo-deck: This Rom is by kushdeck, After testing out Decks ICS Pre-Alpha 4 & 7 rom i conclude that although it is a alpha it can easily be used as a day to day rom. extremely fast and very snappy. only thing that i found not working was the camera. (Now on Alpha5)
[ROM][ICS][1-11-12][WIP] ics-deck-evo [alpha5]
All Decks ICS Pre-Alphas
All Decks ICS Gapps
AOSP ICS Kernels:
Jaredthegreat ICS - jared has the most advanced ics rom which is in beta 2 but does not have a working camera to check this rom go here:
[ROM's] -ICS- 4.0.1-4.0.3>[AOSP]<--~B.2.0~
Will post them when they are released!!!
Rom Manager/Kernel Manager:
Rom Manager: This is an app from the android market and is extremely useful for pretty much anything. you can back up your rom, you may go into boot loader and you can check if certain roms such as "CM7 Nightlies" have been updated. However people do prefer Amon Ra for flashing, which is another plus of Rom Manager it allows you to flash alternative recovery, which will flash Amon Ra for you.
Kernel Manager: This app was working before but has stopped now, however if it does start working again what it had was pretty much all the kernels that you needed for any rom. this app would allow you to flash a new kernel immediately by going to the kernel you want to flash.
Reserved
Q&A:
Q: What is SBC?
A: SBC stands for super battery charger. SBC is trickle charging, It stops your battery from dropping from 100% to 90% right when you take it off the charger. Some say that it harms your battery but i haven't seen any harm and plus it only costs $5 to get a new battery on Amazon.
Q: How to set up and flash your roms and kernels?
A: well my friend "Crossrocker" made a guide for this with everything you need. so just click to go to his thread. [GUIDE||Oct/23]Best AOSP(CM7|Decks|MIUI) configuration.
Q: What is the difference between governors?
A: This Thread by "RJackson" explains it all:SetCPU governors (explained)
But if you're too lazy to click it here they are:
As explaind by RJackson:
ondemand - Available in most kernels, and the default governor in most kernels. When the CPU load reaches a certain point (see "up threshold" in Advanced Settings), ondemand will rapidly scale the CPU up to meet demand, then gradually scale the CPU down when it isn't needed. - SetCPU website
conservative - Available in some kernels. It is similar to the ondemand governor, but will scale the CPU up more gradually to better fit demand. Conservative provides a less responsive experience than ondemand, but can save battery. - SetCPU website
performance - Available in most kernels. It will keep the CPU running at the "max" set value at all times. This is a bit more efficient than simply setting "max" and "min" to the same value and using ondemand because the system will not waste resources scanning for the CPU load. This governor is recommended for stable benchmarking. - SetCPU website
powersave - Available in some kernels. It will keep the CPU running at the "min" set value at all times. - SetCPU website
userspace
A method for controlling the CPU speed that isn't currently used by SetCPU. For best results, do not use the userspace governor. - SetCPU website
Interactive - The 'interactive' governor has a different approach. Instead of sampling the cpu
at a specified rate, the governor will scale the cpu frequency up when coming
out of idle. When the cpu comes out of idle, a timer is configured to fire
within 1-2 ticks. If the cpu is 100% busy from exiting idle to when the timer
fires then we assume the cpu is underpowered and ramp to MAX speed.
If the cpu was not 100% busy, then the governor evaluates the cpu load over the
last 'min_sample_rate' (default 50000 uS) to determine the cpu speed to ramp down
to.
As explained by MDJ:
SMARTASS GOVERNOR - is based on the concept of the interactive governor.
I have always agreed that in theory the way interactive works - by taking over the idle loop - is very attractive. I have never managed to tweak it so it would behave decently in real life. Smartass is a complete rewrite of the code plus more. I think its a success. Performance is on par with the "old" minmax and I think smartass is a bit more responsive. Battery life is hard to quantify precisely but it does spend much more time at the lower frequencies.
Smartass will also cap the max frequency when sleeping to 245Mhz (or if your min frequency is higher than 245 - why?! - it will cap it to your min frequency). Lets take for example the 998/245 kernel, it will sleep at 245. No need for sleep profiles any more![/QUOTE]
As explained by teh roxxorz:
Lagfree - like the performance governor. It will scale the cpu to higher frequencies when needed, but not to 100% like performance, so you'll get a lil better battery out of it
SmartassV2 - A smarter smartass governor. Code was re-managed/removed to make it more optimized, and have better scaling performances
InteractiveX - a better interactive governor I believe; low scale cpu settings, for texting, browsing, ect, nothing intensive. I wouldn't use it for emulators, ect.
Q: Do you need PRL/Profile/Radio updates? Do you need to go back to sense based to do these still?
A: No you don't have to go back to sense to do these and you don't have to do these because Rom's will come with what you need. None the less if you would like to update your radios here is a thread by "Calkulin" where he keeps the latest radios updated: [ Radios ][ 9-5 ] All EVO Radio, WiMAX, PRI, NV & HBoot versions
Q: Does HDMI mirroring work on these roms?
A: As of this moment Miui and CM7 both have HDMI mirroring working, and sense all the other ones are cm7 with some tweaks they as well have HDMI working however from what i have read the only one that has not had problems with HDMI is Decks Gingerbread Rom
Q: Are all other major features (4G (except for Miui), bluetooth, front & rear camera, GPS, apps such as Netflix, Skype, Google Voice, Sprint Visual voicemail) all working at least as well as on a Sense or stock ROM?
A: Yes everything is working, however on CM7 and i presume on some others you also have to flash a gps fix which you can get from this thread: [GUIDE||Oct/23]Best AOSP(CM7|Decks|MIUI) configuration. and the Voicemail seems to have some issues for some people but works flawlessly on Decks with it's gapps + Voicemail which you may also get from this thread: [GUIDE||Oct/23]Best AOSP(CM7|Decks|MIUI) configuration.
Q:My wifi is connecting/disconnecting after a second, what should i do?
A: This answer was given to me by "teh roxxorz." This has nothing to do with your rom or kernel, do this:
Back up everything into Titanium Backup
Boot into recovery
wipe cache, Dalvik, and pretty much everything
reflash your rom,kernel and gapps (or if you would like to check out some other roms and kernels just click on the link in my sig)
once you've set up your phone download Titanium Backup from the market
in titanium backup restore all your apps ONLY!!! (don't get apps w/ data - only get apps, and do not get system data)
after this your wifi should be working just fine
Q: I am having wake issues?
A: Here is a Guide made by JBabey[FIX] Wake Issue (Android OS) - Combination of Radio/PRI/NV/Wimax/GPS !Solved!
Q: Can i make my 3g speed faster?
A: Yes, This answer was given to me by teh roxxorz:
You need to flash a sprint sense rom. I emphasize sprint because it won't work on the sense 3.5 roms, as they're all ports of other non sprint roms.
1. Flash sense rom
2. Obtain your msl, download msl reader from market, use it, write it down
3. type in ##3282# , input your msl (you can get this from the app msl reader)
4. Click edit mode > advanced
5. Scroll down to HHTD proxy port and address
6. Change the proxy port to 0 and proxychange the address to 0.0.0.
Q: How can I fix my GPS?
A: This answer was given to me by teh roxxorz:
- flash a sense rom
- open up the dialer
- Type ##GPSCLRX# or ##4772579#
- Your enter your MSL at the prompt
- Your phone will soon reboot > done
Q: Is there a guide like this but for sense roms?
A: Yes if you are looking for a sense guide rather than aosp then check out this thread by tropicalbrit
Q: What is your setup at the moment?
A: Rom - Decks 4.0.3 Pre-Alpha 7 ICS Rom
Kernel - Stock
Governor - Conservative
CPU Max/Min Frequency - 729/128
IncrediControl (app) - (-100) [I get to (-100) by first doing (-75) and leaving it there for 3 days and then I do another (-25)]
Car-o-Dope (CoD) setup
Nice setup. Thanks
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
Steven 1 said:
Nice setup. Thanks
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and thank you for such a quick reply ^_^
Not too bad. Good thing on steering them to tiamat. Lemme know if you need anything.
teh roxxorz said:
Not too bad. Good thing on steering them to tiamat. Lemme know if you need anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol i was about to message you to check out this thread, but actually i do need something. do you happen to know a description of: lagfree, smartassV2, and interactiveX? or at least where i can get one?
Green_Arrow said:
lol i was about to message you to check out this thread, but actually i do need something. do you happen to know a description of: lagfree, smartassV2, and interactiveX? or at least where i can get one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lagfree - like the performance governor. It will scale the cpu to higher frequencies when needed, but not to 100% like performance, so you'll get a lil better battery out of it
SmartassV2 - A smarter smartass governor. Code was re-managed/removed to make it more optimized, and have better scaling performances
InteractiveX - a better interactive governor I believe; low scale cpu settings, for texting, browsing, ect, nothing intensive. I wouldn't use it for emulators, ect.
Also, you should also disclose to people using Xplod: there's a 50/50 chance the new tiamat kernels [4.0.7+] may not boot, in that case, they should use 3.3.7.
And any reason you were gona message me?
teh roxxorz said:
Lagfree - like the performance governor. It will scale the cpu to higher frequencies when needed, but not to 100% like performance, so you'll get a lil better battery out of it
SmartassV2 - A smarter smartass governor. Code was re-managed/removed to make it more optimized, and have better scaling performances
InteractiveX - a better interactive governor I believe; low scale cpu settings, for texting, browsing, ect, nothing intensive. I wouldn't use it for emulators, ect.
Also, you should also disclose to people using Xplod: there's a 50/50 chance the new tiamat kernels [4.0.7+] may not boot, in that case, they should use 3.3.7.
And any reason you were gona message me?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
pretty much so you can check it out and see if it was good, you seem to post everywhere i do and you seem to know a lot.
Green_Arrow said:
pretty much so you can check it out and see if it was good, you seem to post everywhere i do and you seem to know a lot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe there's a case of a stalker?! [kidding]
Though glad I could help. And thank you.
teh roxxorz said:
Maybe there's a case of a stalker?! [kidding]
Though glad I could help. And thank you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No problem ^_^
Green_Arrow said:
No problem ^_^
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tis all good.
has anyone tried that ICS(mod7) rom?
Helpful threads for the win, thanks mr arrow
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
Nice helpful thread , I like that you attached the kernels seeing that a lot of people these days are always asking for links to them.
linsalata28 said:
Nice helpful thread , I like that you attached the kernels seeing that a lot of people these days are always asking for links to them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thank you, and yea it was a pain for me to find them just to attach them lol
Toney Starks said:
Helpful threads for the win, thanks mr arrow
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no problem ^_^
Green_Arrow said:
no problem ^_^
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could have asked I keep all of them just incase.
Edit: I quoted the wrong post lol.
I was talking about the kernels.
cnstarz said:
has anyone tried that ICS(mod7) rom?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i actually did, it runs really smooth and i believe atm everything is working. if there is anything wrong with it, then it was something cm7 did because it is the same thing with a few tweaks and a different look.
linsalata28 said:
You could have asked I keep all of them just incase.
Edit: I quoted the wrong post lol.
I was talking about the kernels.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
oh lol i was like huh , and well now i know lol
Hi,
Thanks for guide... I am considering changing from
my stock rooted ROM, so very timely for me!
Some features that you don't mention or summarize
that may help me and others.
PRL/Profile/Radio updates? I believe you need to
go back to sense based to do these still? [yuk]
HDMI mirroring?
Are all other major features (4G (except for Miui),
bluetooth, front & rear camera, GPS, apps such as
Netflix, Skype, Google Voice, Sprint Visual voicemail)
all working at least as well as on a Sense or stock ROM?
Thanks in Advance,
Peter
So I've got some time at the moment to work on the vibrant again, so I figured I'd ask you guys a question.
What are you guys wanting out of the vibrant?
I'm not really one to go for the latest and greatest buzz word feature like "Linaro build" or "optimized build prop," etc.
lengthy posts are encouraged, tell me what you still want out of this device. What do you use it for? What do you want to use it for? Etc.
Like I said, not looking for "gimme 500MB ram" or " an updated 2.3 kernel", I wanna know what user experience your looking for.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
No takers?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
Now we have almost faultless ROMs and kernels, the only issue is GPS.
+1 on GPS
lorendroll said:
Now we have almost faultless ROMs and kernels, the only issue is GPS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Point if the question was missed, it's not about faults. Also there are very talented individuals working on the GPS issues. I cannot test GPS as mine no longer works. I want to know not just for me but also the talented Devs working on the vibrant, what ideas do you guys have for improving the Android experience, just in this case I happen to be gearing it toward the vibrant as I won't be working in anything else myself. That doesn't mean it's faulty, there is always room for improvement.
Anyway...not monitoring this thread anymore....Idgaf anymore and people not gonna answer :3
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
ECOTOX,
Just in case you do monitor this thread Ill give you a request. Ive built a couple of Froyo ROMs now, and plan to stick with Froyo for some time (at least until the EU error fixed)
That said I usually package the Bali 18.8.UV kernel with them. My favorite Froyo kernel is the DMZ kernel.
http://rootzwiki.com/topic/633-kernel2213ghzdragonmodz-nightly3smartassscary8262011140pm/
What set your work apart is the fact it could stepclimp in 100mhz increments. My phone pukes at anything over 1100mhz. Its has the smartass governor (the one I want) that works perfectly. It is smooth, quick, and almost perfect for my needs. Ive only packaged it with one of my ROMs due to the lack to stepclimbing. Here is a request:
Ive tried up to 3 different overclock / volting programs. Tried to set it manually via init script, but the kernel has 2 stock settings: 500mhz / 1000mhz. If I I overclock to 1100mhz I only get three settings: 500/1000/1100. Is there any way you could get a 200mhz in there?
That said your git is available. I don't know how but I guess I could try and build my own based off your source / patches. You kinda sounded like you wanted to help/work some on the T959. With the EU error we have more folks coming back to Froyo every day. Froyo is not dead if I have anything to say about it -
Thanks for your time (I if read this)
+1 on GPS
Sent from my SGH-T959 using xda premium
GPS is primarily due to inadequate or faulty hardware design. We have pushed the limits of trying to fix it with software guys.
I personally would love more battery life. I truly cannot get more than 45 minutes of screen time in ICS.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA
How about intergrating more RAM?
Sent from my SGH-T959 using xda premium
Moped_Ryder said:
ECOTOX,
Just in case you do monitor this thread Ill give you a request. Ive built a couple of Froyo ROMs now, and plan to stick with Froyo for some time (at least until the EU error fixed)
That said I usually package the Bali 18.8.UV kernel with them. My favorite Froyo kernel is the DMZ kernel.
http://rootzwiki.com/topic/633-kernel2213ghzdragonmodz-nightly3smartassscary8262011140pm/
What set your work apart is the fact it could stepclimp in 100mhz increments. My phone pukes at anything over 1100mhz. Its has the smartass governor (the one I want) that works perfectly. It is smooth, quick, and almost perfect for my needs. Ive only packaged it with one of my ROMs due to the lack to stepclimbing. Here is a request:
Ive tried up to 3 different overclock / volting programs. Tried to set it manually via init script, but the kernel has 2 stock settings: 500mhz / 1000mhz. If I I overclock to 1100mhz I only get three settings: 500/1000/1100. Is there any way you could get a 200mhz in there?
That said your git is available. I don't know how but I guess I could try and build my own based off your source / patches. You kinda sounded like you wanted to help/work some on the T959. With the EU error we have more folks coming back to Froyo every day. Froyo is not dead if I have anything to say about it -
Thanks for your time (I if read this)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol happened to be browsing the forum for info and saw you posted here.
I'll make you a kernel, but I'm not 100%sure I'm sticking with the 100mhz steps for my own release but I'll make you one specifically. I might, but I want to get voltage control working with 100mhz steps, I also gotta work on keeping the gpu clocks more stable.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
I would be in your debt sir. Thanks for your time.
I just wanted to say thanks for the great work on DMZ, ECOTOX. It has surpassed Overstock as my kernel of choice, but I had one quick question/request. Is it an issue with the kernel or with a particular ROM for some functions to get a little quirky when you start to overclock into the 1.2Ghz range? Whenever I set the CPU ceiling to 1.2Ghz the long press functions on the haptic buttons of the Vibrant would become flakey. I read that's fairly common with overclocking, but was curious who the culprit might be.
Not knowing anything about how scalers/governers can be implemented, what would the chances be to get something like Smartass v2 or a few more options on a new Froyo kernel? I liked messing around with them when I was running Sub-Zero on ICZen to find that happy medium of battery life vs performance.
I say a Galaxy S III themed gingerbread ROM. Anyone?
I see a lot of people are quick to flash AK, Franco, Tyr, etc before they even give the kernel that comes with the ROM a try.
From my personal experience, the kernel that comes with a ROM is always faster & snappier than aftermarket kernels (no overclocking).
Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but the kernel that comes with the ROM is optimized to perform best with the ROM. Optimization is the main reason why Android is one step behind of iPhones. I don't know about you guys, but I want my phone to be fully optimized which is why I stick with the stock kernel most of the time.
I guess I'm also one of these people who are quick to flash a aftermarket kernel.
But I think the aftermarket ones are the more optimized ones.
Anyway I never had problems with the stock kernels.
I love the extra work devs like Franco and AK do. Sometimes I get some reboots with Franco but overall its a good experience. I just have some Franco loyalty from when I used his kernel on nexus 4 lol best kernel ive ever used. Not sure if I'd say the same about his one plus kernel but if there's any issues I'd blame cm not him
Klobal said:
I guess I'm also one of these people who are quick to flash a aftermarket kernel.
But I think the aftermarket ones are the more optimized ones.
Anyway I never had problems with the stock kernels.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I used to be the same way on my older android devices.
It seems like now flashing a kernel is no longer need to improve performance (sorta)
The hardware on the oneplus one is beast & android has come a long way in terms of software.
Because I love the sound control in AK Kernel
jousa11 said:
Because I love the sound control in AK Kernel
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Better than Viper or DSP?
OmegaBlaze said:
Better than Viper or DSP?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I use viper as the audio processor AK's kernel just gives good audio gain without any distortion
OmegaBlaze said:
I used to be the same way on my older android devices.
It seems like now flashing a kernel is no longer need to improve performance (sorta)
The hardware on the oneplus one is beast & android has come a long way in terms of software.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe the same. I get most battery savings from deleting bloat off the phone.
NJGSII said:
I believe the same. I get most battery savings from deleting bloat off the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do the exact same thing. I try and delete all of the unnecessary google play stuff as well as apps I don't use often. And use greenify as well.
jousa11 said:
I use viper as the audio processor AK's kernel just gives good audio gain without any distortion
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I definitely have to try that out. I usually always skip pass it lol..
I use franco kernel because I get better battery with his kernel (compared to stock), and it's always up-to-date with most of the patches, while with stock you'll have to wait until the next OTA to get some patches.
NJGSII said:
I believe the same. I get most battery savings from deleting bloat off the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you please name bloat stuff which still comes with Cyanogenmod what should be deleted? Would be helpful for me to get my phone as clean as possible/neccessary.
m4soN said:
Can you please name bloat stuff which still comes with Cyanogenmod what should be deleted? Would be helpful for me to get my phone as clean as possible/neccessary.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Meant that with other phones I have
So, there is no stuff which still comes with systems like cyanogenmod which i can delete without getting any trouble? If yes, how do i know which stuff this can be?
Purchased Franco Kernel Updater and if I didn't use a custom kernel (or Franco Kernel) then I spent money on something I'm no longer using.
Also because I'm not a fan of mpdecision.
zephiK said:
Purchased Franco Kernel Updater and if I didn't use a custom kernel (or Franco Kernel) then I spent money on something I'm no longer using.
Also because I'm not a fan of mpdecision.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here switching between AK and Franco.
Both are a good choice.
But as mentioned before, the hardware of our phone is :good: so no need to flash a aftermarket kernel to gain more performance.
zephiK said:
Purchased Franco Kernel Updater and if I didn't use a custom kernel (or Franco Kernel) then I spent money on something I'm no longer using.
Also because I'm not a fan of mpdecision.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why not? Intelliplug?
OmegaBlaze said:
Why not? Intelliplug?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Anything other than mpdecision, I personally prefer Franco's hotplug algorithm which is his own implementation of powering on/off cores.
Mpdecision is Qualcomm's implementation of powering on/off cores.
I personally am not a fan of Intelliplug,
3 - Don't even bring intelliplug on this. With all due respect to faux, that driver is a butchered solution to control the cores. The code is a mess and, in my opinion, just doesn't make any sense. I've worked on my Hotplug driver for years and it works as simple as need be, with appropriate userspace tunables for users to tinker with.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=55667033&postcount=3981
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.reddit.com/r/nexus4/related/158t1i/custom_kernels_a_guide_on_what_you_need_to_know/ has a great reading on mpdecision and why it is not good in their opinion.
--mpdecision--
All Qualcomm based phones have Qualcomm prorprietary userspace binary called "mpdecision" aka m(ake)p(oor)decision. Instead of letting the kernel itself to decide what frequencies and how many cores to run, this "mpdecsion" binary polls the kernel run queue statistics and decides for the whole system the "optimal" frequency and the "optimal" number of cores to use. The concept is fine, except the decision making is done in userspace and it's 100% closed source so there's no way to tweak it and there's a latency (because all userspace binaries needs to "poll" the kernel for the latest information which is slightly delayed). - faux123
ELI5: mpdecision is a proprietary Qualcomm daemon that makes calls to the SoC (the entire chip your phone uses) to manage the cores. The OS (PowerHAL) makes a request to mpdecision and then mpdecision makes a request to the first two cores to ramp them up. - _motley
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I like to mess with my phone. Simply because I need a kernel fully optimised kernel for the device. Not to say that the developers aren't doing a good job, but in my case, a user sometimes knows better than the creator themselves.
Unless the custom kernels do not satisfy me, I'll revert back to stock.
m4soN said:
So, there is no stuff which still comes with systems like cyanogenmod which i can delete without getting any trouble? If yes, how do i know which stuff this can be?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This phone is fairly clean out of the box. About the only stuff worth freezing or deleting would be some of the google play apps if you don't use them. For example Google play books, news stand, or games.