Related
*edit* Feel free to delete this thread admins. I found this has already been addressed in the announcment thread.
Original post:
"So I noticed that G2 and Desire Z forums have been merged due to the fact that they are practically identical other that the radio stuff... but why are a bunch of Desire HD threads popping up here? That phone isn't really too similar.. are these mistakes or has the HD forum been merged aswell?"
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
Its a stupid idea to merge these, really. When people start bricking phones left and right... I'm not helping anyone. And usually, its people like me and the other senior members who have to deal with this crap and not the mods... Just because a few foolish people (with good intentions) who have no idea what's going on want this, it doesn't mean its a good idea. One major complaint was that the desire z isn't as active... well, tough ****! How is that OUR problem?! Just because our brothers on the other side of the pond are having trouble attracting development/theming isn't our problem. They need to jump in head first and do their own work if its lacking... I don't care about that really but this is just gonna create total confusion and many $500 paperweights, lol!
How is it going to create paperweights ? The main source of semi-bricking that I've seen is running Visionary, something that I try and steer people away from.
The same custom ROMs can be used on both phones.
Engineering hboot doesn't need to be applied any more, and shouldn't be in any guides aimed at newcomers.
I think you're misunderstanding the lack of difference between the two phones. You still mention a "framework" difference but I don't know what you mean unless you mean the Sense framework (which is purely a ROM issue and nothing to do with hardware).
Thanks for your kind welcoming words towards DZ owners though
steviewevie said:
How is it going to create paperweights ? The main source of semi-bricking that I've seen is running Visionary, something that I try and steer people away from.
The same custom ROMs can be used on both phones.
Engineering hboot doesn't need to be applied any more, and shouldn't be in any guides aimed at newcomers.
I think you're misunderstanding the lack of difference between the two phones. You still mention a "framework" difference but I don't know what you mean unless you mean the Sense framework (which is purely a ROM issue and nothing to do with hardware).
Thanks for your kind welcoming words towards DZ owners though
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Radios/hboots will still be flashed and can cause a bricked device. With frameworks... a lot of soft bricks which newbies will think its a real brick but whatever... just complicates things, that's all. Take for example, htc magic forums... complete mess because of the 32a/32b boards being in the same dev section. Brick city over there, lol! This is what we need... same subforum section with Desire z/G2/same general/same q&a/same accessories/different dev. sec/same theme. Perfect example is the htc wizard subforum, seperate board sections. Believe it or not the G2 and Desire Z have extremely similiar boards but they are different. Enough to cause problems. Wait and see... and I understand that you feel personally attacked because you were a big advocate of the merge but its nothing personal. I've been around here long enough to see a bad idea executed and the problems that arise. And no I have nothing against my desire z brothers... I had just heard someone meantion about development issues in your previous dev forum and that was their only reason for wanting a merge. That kind of pissed my off for some reason and just sounds lazy. I'm not judging everyone from the desire z subforum for that one, lone comment but it just added fuel to the fire, so to speak... I think the merge isn't bad but we need two seperate dev sections, imo. That's all...
It's ok, I don't feel personally attacked
I'd like to know what you feel is the exact difference in the boards between the two phones though ?
The only hardware difference that I'm aware of is different physical keyboard layouts (a non-issue, since that's the same issue on most phones, dealt with by software). And different radio bands set in hardware (again, the same issues on most phones, not a reason to split forums, we're not talking about GSM vs CDMA here).
How come the same custom ROMs can be used on both phones if there's such a difference ?
The guides to rooting/S-OFF now don't include instructions to flash eng hboots. And the Wiki makes it pretty clear that it's unnecessary, and lists the different ones for the two different phones if people really want to try it. I doubt many people will be looking at the Wiki when they root/S-OFF though.
We actually don't have any evidence that flashing radios from one to the other is a problem. I posted up in another thread that we really need this to be verified. I actually suspect it will work fine (e.g. the version numbering is in the same sequence across both phones).
steviewevie said:
It's ok, I don't feel personally attacked
I'd like to know what you feel is the exact difference in the boards between the two phones though ?
The only hardware difference that I'm aware of is different physical keyboard layouts (a non-issue, since that's the same issue on most phones, dealt with by software). And different radio bands set in hardware (again, the same issues on most phones, not a reason to split forums, we're not talking about GSM vs CDMA here).
How come the same custom ROMs can be used on both phones if there's such a difference ?
The guides to rooting/S-OFF now don't include instructions to flash eng hboots. And the Wiki makes it pretty clear that it's unnecessary, and lists the different ones for the two different phones if people really want to try it. I doubt many people will be looking at the Wiki when they root/S-OFF though.
We actually don't have any evidence that flashing radios from one to the other is a problem. I posted up in another thread that we really need this to be verified. I actually suspect it will work fine (e.g. the version numbering is in the same sequence across both phones).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You might be correct... I'm just going from past experiences. We can confirm with some version numbers. But I guess time will tell. I do hope things work out. Its just nice to have less headaches though... with s off things can get dangerous, complete bricks. I've bricked a few phones as a former cell tech and its never fun. I even bricked my wife's phone back in the day, lol! But... that's how things go sometimes, you live and learn. I just don't want to see new folks bricking phones with complete s off... I know its gonna happen but we don't have enough proof yet that things are completely safe as far different bootloaders go. I think we should have been 100% certain that cross flashing radios is safe.. etc before the merge. Maybe I missed something and everything has been tested before hand?
I'm not going to enter into G2 and DZ merging, I don't know well enough how similar they are. Accessories for one would definitely work with the other though, right?
The point asked about in the original post, WHY ON EARTH ARE DESIRE HD THREADS BEING MOVED OVER HERE??!?!?!
We're talking about cases, batteries, screen protectors... these are nothing like the G2 versions. Take a look -
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=764
Half the threads have been moved! Why?!?!?!
Before the G2 and the Z came out I had heard on good authority that the same radio's could be flashed on either device, leaving the only real difference being the partition sizes which is infact a non-issue.
Although I know of no-one who can confirm or deny the radio point since release
AndyCr15 said:
The point asked about in the original post, WHY ON EARTH ARE DESIRE HD THREADS BEING MOVED OVER HERE??!?!?!
We're talking about cases, batteries, screen protectors... these are nothing like the G2 versions. Take a look -
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=764
Half the threads have been moved! Why?!?!?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, something went wrong there. But I think most of that has been sorted out now.
If you see any DHD threads that are still in the wrong place, then please PM the mods about it.
There's loads! Click the link. Half the threads are moved!
I can see 11 on page 1 alone. I'm not listing them all for a mod. This is the second time the Desire HD forum has been messed up...
Well, who wants to be the test subject and flash the other's radio? I would but I'm a broke college student and can't afford a replacement lol.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App
AbsolutZeroGI said:
Well, who wants to be the test subject and flash the other's radio? I would but I'm a broke college student and can't afford a replacement lol.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol, there is always someone willing to try it, but not me, I can't afford a replacement phone at the moment.
AbsolutZeroGI said:
Well, who wants to be the test subject and flash the other's radio? I would but I'm a broke college student and can't afford a replacement lol.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've made a couple of posts up in the dev threads on this. Specifically, we have what appears to be a significantly newer radio version (just based on the numbers being higher numerically, not that scientific I know lol) for the DZ Egypt ROM.
Now *if* we could verify this is fine for the G2, it may benefit a lot of G2 owners to be able to try it out. DZ owners can try it too though.
I was asking in those threads if someone who's a bit of a radio expert could perhaps try it (e.g. those involved with writing gfree to unlock our radios).
DO NOT TRY THIS YET UNLESS YOU REALLY KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING
(sorry for shouting )
By the way guys, remember the G2 and DZ are both codenamed "Vision" by HTC.
So we can always start referring to "Vision" in threads if we're talking about issues which will affect both phones (i.e. not specific to stock ROMs).
Forgive the terminology if it's wrong, but I currently have 1.0 autonooter and pressing home ('n') lets me go from the regular nook color to my Zeam launcher. Is there something like this yet for the new 1.2 NookColor update? I see lots of threads talking about CM7 but nothing for this kind of setup. Has a new autonooter simply not been developed yet?
It's been 1 day since the 1.2 update came out. Have some patience.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1051235
So far there is a modified stock ROM with non-market APK installing possible and root access, but there's a lot of other work to be done still.
I'm not an android developer but I gleaned that much from simply reading in the 1.2 threads.
It took a couple of weeks for the autonooter to be really perfected, and before that there was nooter (which I used).
Honestly, sometimes a firmware update on any device hardly causes any kind of delay and just as many times a new root method has to be developed altogether so given that these things vary from device to device and from update to update I don't think I really deserved the "have some patience" comment. I think it was a fair question. Sometimes people get this sense of entitlement around here just because they happen to know more about things than some of us. Anyway, thanks for answering.
tinpanalley said:
Honestly, sometimes a firmware update on any device hardly causes any kind of delay and just as many times a new root method has to be developed altogether so given that these things vary from device to device and from update to update I don't think I really deserved the "have some patience" comment. I think it was a fair question. Sometimes people get this sense of entitlement around here just because they happen to know more about things than some of us. Anyway, thanks for answering.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm also waiting for the new 1.2 to be (auto-) nootered, so was hoping for some sort of an update in terms of how the nooter-development is going for the new update. I agree that it is a fair question - sometimes jailbreak/root appears within hours of an update, sometimes it takes days but there is always some sort of info. Granted, our nook color is not an iPhone or a droid/evo and has nookie froyo, CM7 and even HC but I want to stick with rooted stock because it fits my needs.
Um...don't understand why you guys wouldn't just go over to the development section and check for yourselves for an update. Maybe that's part of the reason for the terseness in the reply.
I also think it was a little impatient when you couple the timing with not only the lack of an effort to see the myriad posts regarding the topic with the fact that this isn't just a "firmware upgrade", it's a whole new OS version (2.1->2.2).
To each his own though, just understand why your question could have engendered such a response.
In the meantime, there is no autonooter for 1.2 yet, although a mostly functional manual nooter has been developed. The market seems to be causing major issues and I would strongly advise waiting until the dust settles.
doncaruana said:
In the meantime, there is no autonooter for 1.2 yet, although a mostly functional manual nooter has been developed. The market seems to be causing major issues and I would strongly advise waiting until the dust settles.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dev section is full of other threads on other subjects making the search more difficult. Thanks for the update.
For Nook Color you can run CM7 directly off an SD card withouth touching the internal emmc:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1000957
Has anyone tried to do that for the Nook Touch? It's an obvious thing to try and I couldn't find any reference to it when I searched the Nook Touch forum, so I assume it does not work, but I thought I should ask...
First of all nothing is impossible. But you see Nook is avaible on market since 4-5 months i think. And there wasn't any breakdown bigger than rooting it ;( mayby working market can be counted in but it still is just a small thing. So in my opinion we just don't have a expert involved/eknowledged enough (xboxexpert maybe) to make a update for you nook (2.3.4 even?).
The other problem is it doesn't have sense yet. Mayby android 4.0 will bring us some easier ways? I am not expert unfortunetly.
domi.nos said:
First of all nothing is impossible. But you see Nook is avaible on market since 4-5 months i think. And there wasn't any breakdown bigger than rooting it ;( mayby working market can be counted in but it still is just a small thing. So in my opinion we just don't have a expert involved/eknowledged enough (xboxexpert maybe) to make a update for you nook (2.3.4 even?).
The other problem is it doesn't have sense yet. Mayby android 4.0 will bring us some easier ways? I am not expert unfortunetly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess I didn't make myself clear. The key reason why it's so easy and convenient to rule alternative ROM off sdcard on a Nook Color is because of NC's bootloader; by design it boots from any ROM off an sdcard, and only when that fails/not present would it go to emmc.
So what I'm really asking is: Does the Nook Touch have the same/similar bootloader? Unfortunately I don't have one so I can't try it, which is why I ask the question here...
Thanks!
I'm not sure at all but I guess that it has a similar bootloader as some tools like TouchNooter or Noogie start from sdcard
Yes tried it and posted about it here several months ago. It boots but without specific driver support doesn't get too far (no graphics). I even tried using the nook kernel for grins on cm7 and it only got a hair farther in the process.
Bottom line it needs drivers in the cm7 codebase to work. It should be a straightforward effort, however, one that has little roi for me personally.
zonyl said:
little roi for me personally
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fair enough, I can see your point and thanks for the info.
Well, that is the situation now. We have some attention on the NookTouch at the moment. If we can get CM7 on there we've future proofed it a little. Just think of those other electronic devices from the past to compare with.
Is there going to come a point where a rooted NookTouch won't be able to run newer Android stuff? That's my only worry. It would be handy to be in line with other CM7 users. Sometimes something doesn't work. Not a major disappointment, but a bit of a bummer.
Couldn't find your post with the info you mention:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/search.php?searchid=93655130 ,unless it's buried in a reply somewhere?
I have no idea how the CM7 people get drivers for devices, whether they pull them out of stock ROMs or what I don't know... will have to search.
I don't get it, what do you expect to gain from CM7 on a Nook Touch?
This device has nothing but wifi and a fundamentally slow eInk display,.. there's no GSM, 3G, Bluetooth, Audio, GPS or Camera
While CM7 and other roms can make things run smoother on normal devices with an LCD-type screen, this won't help the Nook Touch with it's eInk screen at all.
All those fancy themes, with transparency and cool animations will never ever work properly on this eInk display, it cannot be solved trough clever programming.
Are there things in NST with its 2.1 that doesn't work? What does 2.3 offer that is of any use to the NST? The only thing I can think of would be the numeric screen lock..
The few developers that are showing interest in the NST are much better off putting their skills into writing tools and apps specialized for the NST and its eInk.
Hell, for starters, give me a web browser that actually supports pagination instead of scrolling
The only reason I'd be interested in upgrading the OS to 2.2 + would be the ability to use apps like apptosd. No matter how I tried I've been unable to get linktosd to work for the Nook.
Good screen locking is a must for people who may have unwanted people fidgeting on your ereader, and I do agree regarding the browser too. And maybe a good email program that makes the email fit on its width (k9 is the best so far, but usually emails stretches sideways...
ros87 said:
I don't get it, what do you expect to gain from CM7 on a Nook Touch?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Among other things: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1105497
cm7 means for me future proofing, easier to develop new things because we're all on the same page.
I think if it doesn't happen in 5 years time the nook'll be on the shelf obselete because no new software is made for 2.1 devices anymore.
When i get back from holiday i'll try to duplicate what someone did before and host an image of cm7 that can be written to sd with logging enabled to show what drivers are needed. It's a good point that devs who'd normally work on cm could be doing better things like partial screen updates.
If more android eink devices come out there will be more wieght to the cause. Personally what i really want is an eink android phone...
jago25_98 said:
cm7 means for me future proofing, easier to develop new things because we're all on the same page.
I think if it doesn't happen in 5 years time the nook'll be on the shelf obselete because no new software is made for 2.1 devices anymore.
When i get back from holiday i'll try to duplicate what someone did before and host an image of cm7 that can be written to sd with logging enabled to show what drivers are needed. It's a good point that devs who'd normally work on cm could be doing better things like partial screen updates.
If more android eink devices come out there will be more wieght to the cause. Personally what i really want is an eink android phone...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I plan on replacing my NST long before 5 years have passed. For one, the battery will be dead by then
There's a new Pearl eInk player on the block, Sony PRS-T1, so yes, there are more and there will be more Android eInks
don't get me wrong, if an android phone with eink comes out i'll drop the nook in a flash. But even so, having cm7 is useful. I don't like throwing things away. Also, theres the resell value. it makes a difference when selling it down the line. I'd rather have something useful even if it's not me personally benfitting from it.
I don't like that whole, i'll buy something new again, i enjoy the upgrade cycle trap.
I enjoy getting new toys but i also like things that last, and the latter makes more sense.
I haven't done much dev before but i think i'll give a go with this, checking out that kernel hacking thread and looking for ways to log the boot. If nothing else it's good fun
Personally, I do not think CM7 would be the best for Nook. I think this rom is too much "phone related" which would result it big battery consumption. Beside the kernel/rom update, could you name 3 things from CM7 missing on nook STR?
Well built in tablet ease-of-case?
cceerrtt said:
Personally, I do not think CM7 would be the best for Nook. I think this rom is too much "phone related" which would result it big battery consumption. Beside the kernel/rom update, could you name 3 things from CM7 missing on nook STR?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, a CM7 port would need customising to remove the phone stuff. Personally I removed the phone and dialler apks from my rooted Nook. They run on a rooted Nook just the same as a CM7 port would.
1) Any apk that needs a newer version of android. I did find something the other day like this but I can't remember what it was.
2) Being on the same page as other CM7 mods; you can port ideas more easily, whereas the knowledge for NookTouch is a very small community
3) I think it could become a dominent thing. Less confusions with NookColor and the B&N software. More resources for help.
4) The B&N software could cause unforeseen problems down the road with new software of the future. Who knows, there could be a new killer app that clashes with the B&N software and B&N do nothing to fix it, for example.
^ Note that few of the reasons are about what functionality currently available. I've seen it plenty of times; buy new tech, tech is perfectly fine, phone becomes obselete because of the software and no documentation, have to buy a new device even though there's nothing wrong phyically with the old one (software hassle only). For all we know, a new standard for ebooks could come out next year, B&N choose not to support it and the only software around to read it is only available for Froyo. Get me?
You have a point. I'm lucky enough to blow money on the upgrade cycle, why do I care about other people after it gets sent recycling to Africa? I don't know, it seems like a simple bit of work. I agree that effort shouldn't be redirected away from other more important efforts.
edit:
+5) We could move the `USB Mode` notifier more easily so the Nook is still usable while charging.
+6) We can more easily modify WiFi ability to connect to peer-to-peer networks rather than just access points. This means no need to carry a MiFi portable access point in order to use TetherGPS. With stock Nook rom the Nook only sees accesspoints.
I think lets add:
1) Android 4.0 supports both tabs and phones, and your Nook it honestly more like a tablet that a phone, and really many, many, MANY apps will be compatible only with 4.0 (IMO only)
2) We need somebody to write that system right?
I would go more for a good customization ROM oriented to an eInk Android device... The latest apps for tablets will be all LCD oriented, and it would be much more useful a custom android that removes all animations, allows correct paging and lateral buttons to work propperly, etc...
Looking forward to an ICS port on NST!
domi.nos said:
I think lets add:
1) Android 4.0 supports both tabs and phones, and your Nook it honestly more like a tablet that a phone, and really many, many, MANY apps will be compatible only with 4.0 (IMO only)
2) We need somebody to write that system right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm pretty sure the Nook doesn't have enough resources/power to run 4.0, and probably not even 3. Then again, I'm new to android and tablets and rooting, so I might be wrong.
I've rooted and re-flashed three original Nook Colors so far, one being my own, all with CM7.1 and all with no problems. A friend of mine brought me his and asked if I could root and flash his too, but he bought one of the newer Nook Color 2.
As far as I can tell, the stock firmware is different, and the internal hardware is a bit different. I've been searching this forum and elsewhere for two weeks now, and can't find a definite answer. CAN I root and re-flash his newer Nook Color, or is it not possible yet?
If it is possible, can someone point me at a guide please?
Just to be clear: You mean a newer a NOOKcolor with the new screen hardware, and NOT a NOOKtablet, right? There's a big difference.
My apologies for being unclear, I was unaware there was a difference.
I'm referring to the Nook Tablet then, model BNTV250.
Start reading through the NOOK Tablet threads. Totally different animal in terms of rooting and loading alternate firmware. Due to the locked bootloader on the NT, things are taking longer than usual, but progress is being made daily. There are bootable SD options, but they are still alpha.
Thanks for the info. I've got plenty to look over it seems.
Sadly, from what I've read so far, my buddy is SOL for the time being.
Well, you can still root it and get a lot more functionality over stock. Believe me, once he sees the paltry offerings available in the B&N App store, he'll be screaming for escape from the Walled Garden. Put a door in for him. He'll appreciate it.
I'm perverse enough to rather like the B&N 1.4.1 interface, so I'm running my NOOK color on B&N firmware (rooted, of course). Once I jump out to an alternate launcher, there's not a huge difference. There are performance tweaks I'd like to have from CyanogenMod, but the device is definitely improved.
Some NT owners might have to correct me but I glanced through the NT room and have seen that with version 1.4.1, side-loading feature was removed regardless of virgin or rooted. Reports that we must downgrade to version 1.4.0 to regain that capability.
I just received a NEW NC from B&N as a replacement for my certified pre-owned unit that was damaged upon arrival. They upgraded me to a new one which was very nice of them indeed. They told me it would already have v1.4.2 on it. I just checked it out and this one has v1.3 on it. Is there a reason that I would want to keep 1.3 on it and block all future OTAs? Or does it not matter and should I just let it upgrade itself?
P.S. - I'm going to be running CM7 from an SD card.
Thanks folks.
Hi I literally received my Nook Color 1.3.0 on the mail today. This afternoon I rooted mine watching this youtube video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UV1cBDpNQic which made the process super easy.
I would recommand keeping 1.3.0 for root because I found the whole process to be quite easy although I don't know if new updates necessarily make it any harder. I mean after all if you are gonna go Cyanogemod why bother with the Nook updates.
I installed and tried two of the unoffical CM9 all day. Loved the interface, but after constant wifi issues and such I decided CM9 is just not ready yet for me. Been playing with CM7 Mirage Kang all night. Other than it being super fugly compared to CM9 things are working great so far.
Thanks to all Nook Color CM9 Developers for their hard work by the way. Looking forward to the Offical Nightly Builds whenever that may be.
I just bought a new Nook Color last week from Staples. It still only has 1.2 on it.
AirplaneCrazy said:
[...] I mean after all if you are gonna go Cyanogemod why bother with the Nook updates.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you are going to run CM exclusively, why keep B&N firmware on eMMC? You'll gain a lot of flexibility loading CM on there instead.
If you are going to bother with B&N firmware (I do), then 1.4.x is a significant change. I think it's better than older versions, but a lot of folks liked the previous functionality. A big question is what you intend to do with it. For some magazine subscriptions, you must be running 1.4.x.
And of course, the bloody thing will update itself at some point if you don't block OTA updates.