Database Users

HSPA+???

on tmobiles site it advertises that all the new-ish phones have the ability to use HSPA+ do i need to change my APNs on The Aria ROM??? if so What Are the new APNs

You will never be able to use HSPA+ on a Slide, T-Mobile does not claim that you will be able to either.

t-mobile does claim that you can, and you can. i have experienced 6 times faster speed since they turned on the tower near my place. i have HSPA+ at home and now average 3.5-4.5 Mbps rather than the .8 Mbps i had with standard 3G. my apn says epc.tmobile.com i do not know if there are other settings needed, but i am using CM6RC1 and getting phenomenal speeds(compared to some friends that have EVO on 4G)

tubaking182 said:
t-mobile does claim that you can, and you can. i have experienced 6 times faster speed since they turned on the tower near my place. i have HSPA+ at home and now average 3.5-4.5 Mbps rather than the .8 Mbps i had with standard 3G. my apn says epc.tmobile.com i do not know if there are other settings needed, but i am using CM6RC1 and getting phenomenal speeds(compared to some friends that have EVO on 4G)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's cause sprint's "4G" is not as fast as Tmo's HSPA+...There was an article on their speeds on engadget.

that jappened to be my point, i was stating that t-mo was better(faster) and that r0manz was wrong

tubaking182 said:
that jappened to be my point, i was stating that t-mo was better(faster) and that r0manz was wrong
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Click to collapse
I'm not wrong.
There are no HSPA+ phones presently being sold in the United States, that being said you can get up to 7.2mbps on T-Mobile HSPA network at present on the Vibrant, Slide, and others

He's right they can take advantage of the speeds, but are not actually HSPA+ phones, the first one will be the t-mobile G2 as announced by t-mobile.
Sent from my T-Mobile myTouch 3G Slide using Tapatalk

What about a HSPA++ Phone?
Sent from my Htcclay's Remixed Remix

This HSPA+ has been pretty awesome..Out of every person I know that has tmobile and a 3G enabled phone I have been the only one able to pick it up and my wife has the Vibrant, plus several others that I know with the Slide and other android phones... It started about a week ago when I first noticed that 3G turn into an H. I am running the latest CyanogenMod and I have not altered any settings on my phone whatsoever. The only thing I have been able to come up with is that its because of the Froyo ROM... Anyone agree?? But this s**t is great! I ran a speedtest while I was at work yesterday and I almost got a 6 Mbps connection and a 1.5 Mbps upload while connected to the HSPA network!!!
But like others said earlier in the thread our Slides will not be able to take full advantage of the HSPA+ speeds and will never be able to...but Ill take it because its just not everyday that a cell phone provider gives you 6x speed boost and doesn't charge you extra for it... GO T-MOBILE!!!

cdt82002 said:
This HSPA+ has been pretty awesome..Out of every person I know that has tmobile and a 3G enabled phone I have been the only one able to pick it up and my wife has the Vibrant, plus several others that I know with the Slide and other android phones... It started about a week ago when I first noticed that 3G turn into an H. I am running the latest CyanogenMod and I have not altered any settings on my phone whatsoever. The only thing I have been able to come up with is that its because of the Froyo ROM... Anyone agree?? But this s**t is great! I ran a speedtest while I was at work yesterday and I almost got a 6 Mbps connection and a 1.5 Mbps upload while connected to the HSPA network!!!
But like others said earlier in the thread our Slides will not be able to take full advantage of the HSPA+ speeds and will never be able to...but Ill take it because its just not everyday that a cell phone provider gives you 6x speed boost and doesn't charge you extra for it... GO T-MOBILE!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm pretty sure the only reason you're getting the "H" instead of the "3G" logo is because in the CyanogenMOD 6 Stable release, the "3G" graphic was replaced with the "H".

uabtyler said:
I'm pretty sure the only reason you're getting the "H" instead of the "3G" logo is because in the CyanogenMOD 6 Stable release, the "3G" graphic was replaced with the "H".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have not used froyo on the SLide, the "H" icon is included with every rom but if cyan changed the name of the H icon to replace 3G then it would make sense, but i doubt he would do that to trick people. Every rom has the H icon in the framework folder.

He did not replace it, I am running a CM6 rom and in certain areas I will pick up HSPA, but in most places I go in Huntsville, AL its 3G signal, with the 3G icon showing in my status bar.
There is also a noticable difference in browsing and download speeds when I am able to pull HSPA, so its not just displaying it in error.

On the stock ROM you never see the "H" icon, but if I look in About Phone -> Network I often see "HSDPA" under mobile network type. I assume T-Mobile has mapped the 3G icon to that network type to minimize user confusion. I also see the 3G icon when connected to a UMTS network.
As has been pointed out earlier, that doesn't mean you will get the HSPA+ speeds and in fact they haven't even rolled out HSPA+ in my area yet.

I am running the latest CM for the slide. Ever since I flashed it, I haven't seen the 3G symbol, only H. I live in Salt Lake City Utah, and according to T-Mobile, they haven't enabled HSPA+ here yet. So I'm not sure why H would be showing up instead of 3G. Since I've tested my speed using the Speedtest.net app, and it comes up with ping 103ms D:637kbps U:759kbps, I highly doubt that is HSPA+ speeds.

uabtyler said:
I'm pretty sure the only reason you're getting the "H" instead of the "3G" logo is because in the CyanogenMOD 6 Stable release, the "3G" graphic was replaced with the "H".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought it was the radio update that had the H in it.
Using Chiefz rom I get H when I'm by my school.

slughappy1 said:
I am running the latest CM for the slide. Ever since I flashed it, I haven't seen the 3G symbol, only H. I live in Salt Lake City Utah, and according to T-Mobile, they haven't enabled HSPA+ here yet. So I'm not sure why H would be showing up instead of 3G. Since I've tested my speed using the Speedtest.net app, and it comes up with ping 103ms D:637kbps U:759kbps, I highly doubt that is HSPA+ speeds.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Check under settings, about phone, status and look at what it says under Mobile Network Type. If it says HSDPA you will see the H icon, if it say UMTS you will see 3G. The H Icon is showing up because it is the begginings of HSPA+ without the fiber back haul ran to the tower, or they haven't switched it on yet. The phone sees the H network and displays the H icon, it doesn't know that it isn't HSPA+ or HSDPA, if your were still stock you would only ever see 3G.

So does that mean that stock rom (I have ChiefzReloaded's modified 1.35.531 rom) still takes advantage of HSPA+ even though it will only show 3G on the status bar? Or would I have to switch to another ROM to take advantage of it?
I remember when I was testing which rom I liked, I had tried a 2.2 rom and seen the H in my status bar, but never tested the speed. At the moment, I don't get speeds faster than 750 kbps down and 70 kbps up.. really disappointed since they already have HSPA+ here in Houston (and its suburbs).

Butzacooky said:
So does that mean that stock rom (I have ChiefzReloaded's modified 1.35.531 rom) still takes advantage of HSPA+ even though it will only show 3G on the status bar? Or would I have to switch to another ROM to take advantage of it?
I remember when I was testing which rom I liked, I had tried a 2.2 rom and seen the H in my status bar, but never tested the speed. At the moment, I don't get speeds faster than 750 kbps down and 70 kbps up.. really disappointed since they already have HSPA+ here in Houston (and its suburbs).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Look to see if youre on UMTS, thats 3G...if it says HSPA then you will see H..

archie53 said:
Check under settings, about phone, status and look at what it says under Mobile Network Type. If it says HSDPA you will see the H icon, if it say UMTS you will see 3G. The H Icon is showing up because it is the begginings of HSPA+ without the fiber back haul ran to the tower, or they haven't switched it on yet. The phone sees the H network and displays the H icon, it doesn't know that it isn't HSPA+ or HSDPA, if your were still stock you would only ever see 3G.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mine says HSDPA. So I guess that is because they haven't flipped the switch here yet. Thanks for the information.

I am running a stock ROM and under mobile network type I usually see "HSDPA" even though the "3G" icon appears. The point is that on the stock ROM you will see the "3G" icon whether you are connected to a UMTS or HSDPA network, and on the CM ROM you see the "H" icon when you connect to an HSDPA network. But the icon does not limit your speed. You will still get the benefit of HSDPA (and to some degree HSPA+) networks either way.

for those with network signal (possible help)

just recently a guy posted about the *#*#4636#*#* code and changing network preference. well fooling around at work yesterday i tried it out and i picked "WCDMA only" and before this, i get prettu good 3g and H signals but very few edge spots (inside). after i selected that though my signal was still on H speeds so i didnt think much of it but its been 15 hours and ive been around and my phone hasnt even as much as dropped down to 3g. so maybe or maybe not this could help you guys out but i just wanted to give a heads up. try out for yourself
p.s. i also heard it helps with battery because your phone isnt always busy switching back and forth between network.

"H" is what is displayed when you have a 3G signal.

dronepop said:
"H" is what is displayed when you have a 3G signal.
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Click to collapse
There's a g for that
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App

dronepop said:
"H" is what is displayed when you have a 3G signal.
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Click to collapse
no its not. download this app called "mobile signal widget" and it will show you when u cross between 3g and H

johnxjets said:
There's a g for that
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah. I've seen E, G, and H on my G2... granted I rarely ever see G. I actually thought it was a glitch when I saw it lol.

johnxjets said:
There's a g for that
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Click to collapse
Well, according to T-Mobile's G2 Guide:
H = Connected to the fastest 3G networks (UMTS or HSDPA)
E = Connected to the second-fastest network (EDGE)
G = Connected to a 2G network (GPRS)
You will see an "H" while you are using 3G. This means the "H" is shared for UMTS or HSPA as well ("4G"). I don't agree that this is how it should be noted, but that is how it is noted on the G2 without any 3rd party widgets installed.

H and G only in West Texas
Out here we are still stuck on a 3G network. (No idea when HSDPA or + will be here), but NO EDGE, unless you roam... It is 3G/H or GPRS... It kinds sucks, thank goodness for WIFI..

bigstunta101 said:
no its not. download this app called "mobile signal widget" and it will show you when u cross between 3g and H
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry you are wrong. H = 3G or 4G (HSPA or HSPA+)
I have that widget too, but the OP never said that widget is what he was looking at. Presumably, he was looking at the stock notification on the phone, showing "H". My point is that he would see "H" while on 3G or 4G, so he'd only be able to tell the difference by speed tests or some other measurement (such as a 3rd party widget).

I wanna get more replies and see from more people, the problem with me is, at school in campus the signal is really spotty, where I can even have 3 or 4 bars and be still on edge.
Another thing is where when the signal goes haywire, it will drop from either utms or hspa into edge and the data connection will just stop and it won't work unless I get the H. Its been happening for a week now and I'm up to a week on my remorse period and want to handle this before its too late.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App

dronepop said:
Well, according to T-Mobile's G2 Guide:
H = Connected to the fastest 3G networks (UMTS or HSDPA)
E = Connected to the second-fastest network (EDGE)
G = Connected to a 2G network (GPRS)
You will see an "H" while you are using 3G. This means the "H" is shared for UMTS or HSPA as well ("4G"). I don't agree that this is how it should be noted, but that is how it is noted on the G2 without any 3rd party widgets installed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What he said + if you do this and u get to were there is no 3g or 4g then you will get no signal because the phone isnt looking for an egde but only 3g/4g.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App

dronepop said:
Sorry you are wrong. H = 3G or 4G (HSPA or HSPA+)
I have that widget too, but the OP never said that widget is what he was looking at. Presumably, he was looking at the stock notification on the phone, showing "H". My point is that he would see "H" while on 3G or 4G, so he'd only be able to tell the difference by speed tests or some other measurement (such as a 3rd party widget).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think that they were saying for the OP to download that widget so that they will know when they are on HSPA+ or 3g. I'm pretty sure they didn't think the OP was already using the widget or they wouldn't have suggested downloading it.

3g vs. HSPA on at&t

I've been noticing on liberated aria roms that instead of 3G, it is reporting data as being HSPA. I was curious as to the authenticity of this.
On liberated aria, speedtest.net reports I am getting about 4mb/s for downloads in H area. I was wondering if anyone with an aria reporting 3g would be willing to run a speedtest to see if they get the same results?

shark0807 said:
I've been noticing on liberated aria roms that instead of 3G, it is reporting data as being HSPA. I was curious as to the authenticity of this.
On liberated aria, speedtest.net reports I am getting about 4mb/s for downloads in H area. I was wondering if anyone with an aria reporting 3g would be willing to run a speedtest to see if they get the same results?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HSPA is the same as 3G on AT&T. HSPA is the technology AT&T uses for their 3G, and for some reason on the Froyo ROMs, it shows up with an H.

People have told me that its the same but when I speedtest my 3g and hspa the 3g is a little less for me. Like one time I had 3.87mb on 3g and when I flashed the hspa Rom it came up with 4mb.

I always throught the OEM rom had 3G (3.6mbit), while CM6 and perhaps the modified liberated roms had unlocked 3.5G (7.2mbit).

NO^^^ the speeds you experience on both roms are the exact same... who ever created the rom just decided to replace the 3G symbol with an H!

Quanni90 said:
NO^^^ the speeds you experience on both roms are the exact same... who ever created the rom just decided to replace the 3G symbol with an H!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Any proof to back it up?

kaschenberg said:
Any proof to back it up?
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Click to collapse
Yeah I dunno if I'd necessarily believe that. I notice when I do speedtests the HSPA is a bit faster, or at least thats what the speedtest app says. You notice it more on uploads, than downloads.

I believe the correct abbreviation is "HSDPA", or no?
Per:
http://www.gsmarena.com/htc_aria-3392.php

The difference is that the ROMs with 'H' has HSUPA (faster uploads) turned on and the stock AT&T with '3G' does not. Category 5 HSUPA to be exact. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-Speed_Uplink_Packet_Access

kaschenberg said:
I believe the correct abbreviation is "HSDPA", or no?
Per:
http://www.gsmarena.com/htc_aria-3392.php
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The technology is HSPA, HSDPA is the download speed, HSUPA is the upload speed, that is why you see the 2 different mnemonics used interchangeably.

foit said:
The difference is that the ROMs with 'H' has HSUPA (faster uploads) turned on and the stock AT&T with '3G' does not. Category 5 HSUPA to be exact. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-Speed_Uplink_Packet_Access
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This at least goes along with what I've noticed.

kaschenberg said:
I always throught the OEM rom had 3G (3.6mbit), while CM6 and perhaps the modified liberated roms had unlocked 3.5G (7.2mbit).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I always assumed the same thing(never did any research to actually confirm). But from a practical point of view, I never noticed a significant speed increase when switching from stock to CM6.

You are all wrong. Att roms are compiled to use the 3g icon. When compiling roms/or using overseas roms its usually compiled to use the HSDPA icon. Its a known fact. HSPA and HSDPA are two totally different things. Proof to back it up? Its a build flag when compiling roms. You can also.check in settings->phone status. They both say hsdpa. So both roms get the exact same speed. Just use different icons. The speed changes you may notice are just placebo. Nothing more, nothing less.

Yeah I have had no speed increase from 3g to h...both pretty much same using 3g speed tester
Sent from my Liberty using XDA App

seanfinn said:
Yeah I have had no speed increase from 3g to h...both pretty much same using 3g speed tester
Sent from my Liberty using XDA App
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Click to collapse
same here, I do multiple speed tests a week, difference is minimal

ls377 said:
HSPA is the same as 3G on AT&T. HSPA is the technology AT&T uses for their 3G, and for some reason on the Froyo ROMs, it shows up with an H.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it's not. HSPA is not the same as 3g - it is faster, and yes, ATT has had HSPA for quite a while.

attn1 said:
No it's not. HSPA is not the same as 3g - it is faster, and yes, ATT has had HSPA for quite a while.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right - case in point - I had another unlocked phone (SE K850i) in late 2008, which typically read '3G' throughout the SF Bay Area, but I noticed it turned to 'H' when I traveled to Seattle at the time.
Tethered to a laptop, I got (roughly, from memory)
H 1.5MB down 700K up
3G 1.1MB down 144K up
Sometime in spring of 2009 ATT upgraded their network in the SF Bay area to HSPDA from the former UMTS (3G) network. The phone then read H thereafter and got similar speeds to what I'd seen on my trip in Seattle.
So, the older 3G network was UMTS, not HSPA. It's possible ATT still has some UMTS / 3G networks laying around elsewhere in the country, but I haven't seen '3G' on any of my phones that make the distinction recently in the SF Bay area, they're either on Edge or HSPA these days.
What's really funny is that, with all the current 4G marketing blitz, ATT probably missed out calling their HSPA network something better than 3G very early on, but instead just dumbed down their phones to all read 3G...perhaps to hide the extra time it took them to roll out HSPA...perhaps to avoid questions from thousands of people that would call in wondering why their phones didn't say 3G.
Anyhow right - Edge (2.5G) < UMTS (3G) < HSPA (3.5G)

Disable HSPA+

Does anyone know if its possible to remove or disable HSPA+ from a rom? I just wanna use 3G cause the HSPA+ is just to slow?
Sent from my HTC Magic using XDA App

CarneDeluxe said:
I just wanna use 3G cause the HSPA+ is just to slow?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That doesn't make sense.
It's almost like saying 3G is slower than Edge.
How's your signal strengh?

HSPA+ is a faux 4G standard, you can't utilise HSPA+ on an HTC Magic.

Same here
I also have the same problem. I understand HSPA+ is supposed to be faster, but it runs really slow on my G1. Getting back to the point, does anyone know how to disable it? I am running Biffmod 2.1

CarneDeluxe said:
Does anyone know if its possible to remove or disable HSPA+ from a rom? I just wanna use 3G cause the HSPA+ is just to slow?
Sent from my HTC Magic using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its your phone or the rom im runnin HSPA on my mytouch and its fast.
Sent from my HTC Magic using XDA App

CarneDeluxe said:
Does anyone know if its possible to remove or disable HSPA+ from a rom? I just wanna use 3G cause the HSPA+ is just to slow?
Sent from my HTC Magic using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OP. Shouldn't HSPA+ be faster. Im pretty sure our phones (HTC MAGIC) doesnt support it. The 4G and the G2 do support the HSPA+. I think u are using 3G, but the coverage is just bad in your area. Try going to the closest "big" city, tmo likes spamming hspa towers there

jedi_gman said:
I also have the same problem. I understand HSPA+ is supposed to be faster, but it runs really slow on my G1. Getting back to the point, does anyone know how to disable it? I am running Biffmod 2.1
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're confusing HSPA+ (which your phone does not support) with HSPA, HSPA is part of the 3G standard which allows higher bandwidth. Due to a number of factors, such as how bandwidth is split among users, this does not mean you will get faster speeds, just that the network has the capacity to carry them.

What ROM are you using?
Sent from my HTC Magic using Tapatalk

CarneDeluxe said:
Does anyone know if its possible to remove or disable HSPA+ from a rom? I just wanna use 3G cause the HSPA+ is just to slow?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For those not interested in debating the theoretical speeds of T-Mobile's 3G and 4G service with the OP on a 3G only device -
Yes, do a search on editing the build.prop file in your system folder.
Find ro.ril.hsxpa and set to ro.ril.hsxpa=0
Individual results vary, may have to reboot more than once to flush the old settings. If it really really sucks, just change it back.
Kind Regards,
Kevin

NEwbie question H symbol

Ok so i updated to 2.2 using the qdl tool., everything seems to be working fine but I dont have 3g symbol, just a H which seems to be getting good speeds, does the H replace 3g?

muddy00 said:
Ok so i updated to 2.2 using the qdl tool., everything seems to be working fine but I dont have 3g symbol, just a H which seems to be getting good speeds, does the H replace 3g?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes! it does. It means you're getting 3G speeds.

muddy00 said:
Ok so i updated to 2.2 using the qdl tool., everything seems to be working fine but I dont have 3g symbol, just a H which seems to be getting good speeds, does the H replace 3g?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes its the european version of 3g.
Sent from my Dell Streak using XDA App

European version!? OMG.
where do you get your info from?

BrokenPixel said:
European version!? OMG.
where do you get your info from?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its no big deal the uk will use the h instead of 3g.
Sent from my Dell Streak using XDA App

I'm pretty sure it stands for HSPDA which I think is high speed PDA.
Sent from my Dell Streak using Tapatalk

High Speed Packet Data Access

HSDPA, High Speed Downlink Packet Access
HSUPA, High-Speed Uplink Packet Access

carhigh said:
I'm pretty sure it stands for HSPDA which I think is high speed PDA.
Sent from my Dell Streak using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes thats what it stands for but he updated through qdctool ihas the O2 version and they use the h instead of 3g.
Sent from my Dell Streak using XDA App

ATT, for whatever reason dumbs down their phones to not distinguish between the older UMTS 3G and HS*PA flavors which are technically 3.5G. Most unlocked (read non-ATT) phones on ATT will show up as H when they're getting their fastest speeds, although I have an old Nokia that actually has a '3.5G' indicator.
In short, if your phone says 'H', it's better than '3G'.

Nosfrat said:
HSDPA, High Speed Downlink Packet Access
HSUPA, High-Speed Uplink Packet Access
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the correction! All those letters can get confusing, and where I am, no one but me cares what they mean, so when I am wrong, nobody is here to correct me...

johdaxx said:
ATT, for whatever reason dumbs down their phones to not distinguish between the older UMTS 3G and HS*PA flavors which are technically 3.5G. Most unlocked (read non-ATT) phones on ATT will show up as H when they're getting their fastest speeds, although I have an old Nokia that actually has a '3.5G' indicator.
In short, if your phone says 'H', it's better than '3G'.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When I updated thru the QDL tool, I had the H on the 305 or 309 (whichever one it was)...then when I put DJSteve's 1.5.1 on my Streak, it went back to 3G.
Two questions:
1. Can I go into the build.prop files and change a line somewhere to get the H back?
2. If the answer to Q1 is yes, is it really going to get the faster speed, or is it just gonna give me the H instead of the 3G symbol?

borijess said:
Yes its the european version of 3g.
Sent from my Dell Streak using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
carhigh said:
I'm pretty sure it stands for HSPDA which I think is high speed PDA.
Sent from my Dell Streak using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
johdaxx said:
ATT, for whatever reason dumbs down their phones to not distinguish between the older UMTS 3G and HS*PA flavors which are technically 3.5G. Most unlocked (read non-ATT) phones on ATT will show up as H when they're getting their fastest speeds, although I have an old Nokia that actually has a '3.5G' indicator.
In short, if your phone says 'H', it's better than '3G'.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
anyways. its not european, its hsdpa not hspda. and the reason you see 3g instead of hspa on att devices can be for multiple reason. the obvious is that people see it and think "herp derp, im not on 3g! att suxors". another reason is that it will just show up as 3g on android 1.6 on most any device. and unless its told to show, if hsUpa is deactivated, the H wont show and att has made it a habit to remove hsupa from as many phones of theirs as they can.

tmotytn said:
2. If the answer to Q1 is yes, is it really going to get the faster speed, or is it just gonna give me the H instead of the 3G symbol?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I install Ferrari badge to my Fiat would it go faster?
Sent from my Dell Streak using Tapatalk

muddy00 said:
Ok so i updated to 2.2 using the qdl tool., everything seems to be working fine but I dont have 3g symbol, just a H which seems to be getting good speeds, does the H replace 3g?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
H > G and if you ever see N your streak connected at 'Nirvana' speed, there is just no faster than 'N', yes your streak does support N speed as well but only temporarily and only when you let it go above 5m (~15') high
Sent from my Dell Streak using Tapatalk

subvecto said:
If I install Ferrari badge to my Fiat would it go faster?
Sent from my Dell Streak using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only when you're in Italy