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This happens randomly about 5x a day. When I try to put my phone away (press red button) the screen turns off (like it should) but immediately turns back on again.... all on its own. The screen wont stay off so it drains my battery.
The only way to make it stop is to plug the phone into a charger. Eventually it stops... But, the problem comes back later in the day. Its a struggle I'm facing throughout the day... ugh!!
Any ideas? I've tried restarting, soft reset, taking the battery out for long periods of time... nothing works!
THX!
Couple of questions.
Has this been happening since the day you got it?
Are you using the stock battery?
Have you flashed a custom rom?
What apps have you installed?
Any damage to the phone?
Have you spilled any liquid on it?
Are any of the buttons (volume, windows key, home, etc.) possible stuck down?
Faelok said:
Couple of questions.
Has this been happening since the day you got it?
Are you using the stock battery?
Have you flashed a custom rom?
What apps have you installed?
Any damage to the phone?
Have you spilled any liquid on it?
Are any of the buttons (volume, windows key, home, etc.) possible stuck down?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It started doing this about a week or so ago. I have a Pandora, Shazam, pretty simple apps... nothing crazy.
Yes it is the stock battery.
I have not updated or installed any custom ROMS... although I am looking into it.
No Damage to the phone
No liquid damage
And I doubt the buttons are stuck... ive checked.
my first thought is that you have some app running that is waking up the phone. have you tried (i know it's a pain) uninstalling any apps you've added recently? When your phone wakes up is it locked as it should be?
yes, the phone is locked when it wakes itself up. I've tried uninstalling the very few apps I have installed... no luck. Do you think a ROM change my help? Been looking into installing the Kumor Rom. thx again
Hi. I have the same problem for almost 2 months. I have loaded 3 different roms but nothing changed. I dont know what to do
tmo replaed my batt
I had this same exact problem last month. Called TMO support and after a couple questions, the dude told me he would send me a new battery....I was skeptical, but thought hey, why not...got nothing to lose. I replaced the battery as soon as the new one arrived and the problem went away instantly! have not had this occur for a month(fingers still crossed). Like I said, I was skeptical, but the new batt worked for me. I didn't have to send back the old battery, so just for S&G's, I put the old batt back in and the problem returned after a full charge.....go figure. Call up TMO and see if you can get a new batt. BTW...my ROM is totally stock and only have CHT installed...no other 3rd party apps of any kind.
hmmm im calling them today. I'll let you all know what turns up!
To follow up...
I talked to a Tmobile rep (via their chat support on tmobile.com) and after answering a few questions I got them to send me a replacement phone. Although I'll have to pay for the shipping myself, I'm glad to know I wont have the issue anymore.
I'll let you all know if something else comes up.
Hi guys,
Not exactly the most positive of first posts but here we go. There's a problem with my phone that I can't find the solution for...
Essentially my phone randomly turns itself off (no power down sequence, almost as though the battery's being taken out if you know what I mean) and then it has difficulty in fully booting again. For some reason it also likes to revert my wallpaper back to the original as stock.
The first thing that I thought of was malware, with the wallpaper - so I tried a couple of anti-malware apps to no avail. As my device was rooted, I then flashed back to stock, locked and unrooted it and checked the behaviour. Again to no avail (then again I've never rooted/unrooted so this may have been done incorrectly). By the looks of it, the worst case scenario is a problem with battery connections/hardware...
So the question is have you guys come across this before? Is there a solution to this or is Google/LG going to have to give me a replacement?
Many Thanks.
Weird, I just had this happen couple hours ago, I was watching a video and close the app. I press the power button to put it to sleep. Just like 20 second later, I press the power to wake it and it don't do anything. I had to hold the power button to turn it on. I check the battery status afterward and it looks like it drop between 5-10 percent in the chart after it turn on. The battery must have failed or something. This also happen to my wife phone couple weeks back, although she had to do a hard reset(power+volume up and down) it have not happen again though.
Hello
First of all, welcome to XDA community!
Now, have you done anything with your phone? As in, root it? Flashed custom kernel? Flashed custom ROM? We would love to help, but you need to provide us what we need
maintains
kyokeun1234 said:
Hello
First of all, welcome to XDA community!
Now, have you done anything with your phone? As in, root it? Flashed custom kernel? Flashed custom ROM? We would love to help, but you need to provide us what we need
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay, here's what I had done when this all started:
- Rooted and unlocked.
- TWRP custom recovery
- Standard Kernel, no custom ROM.
I've reverted as much of this back to stock as possible through a nexus tool-kit, but it still has the issue. If I'm missing anything out let me know.
Thrice87 said:
Okay, here's what I had done when this all started:
- Rooted and unlocked.
- TWRP custom recovery
- Standard Kernel, no custom ROM.
I've reverted as much of this back to stock as possible through a nexus tool-kit, but it still has the issue. If I'm missing anything out let me know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did this happen before you had the phone rooted? Also did this happen one time only or happened multiple times? I also had this problem, but just turning off and not turning back on part. But that was only one time event and I believe it was because of the custom kernel.
kyokeun1234 said:
Did this happen before you had the phone rooted? Also did this happen one time only or happened multiple times? I also had this problem, but just turning off and not turning back on part. But that was only one time event and I believe it was because of the custom kernel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This started yesterday, and I rooted it as soon as I got it 2 weeks ago, so I don't think the root has caused any issues. It's now happening rather often, to the point where it's unuseable
Thrice87 said:
This started yesterday, and I rooted it as soon as I got it 2 weeks ago, so I don't think the root has caused any issues. It's now happening rather often, to the point where it's unuseable
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's odd. Did you download any apps recently that might've caused this issue? Maybe root apps?
kyokeun1234 said:
That's odd. Did you download any apps recently that might've caused this issue? Maybe root apps?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only 2 apps that I downloaded the day before were cerberus and titanium backup, both of which are well known. Either way they were the day before the problems started.
Thrice87 said:
The only 2 apps that I downloaded the day before were cerberus and titanium backup, both of which are well known. Either way they were the day before the problems started.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Doubt that these will cause any issues, but could you try uninstalling Cerberus just in case? Thanks
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
kyokeun1234 said:
Doubt that these will cause any issues, but could you try uninstalling Cerberus just in case? Thanks
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, after completely reverting the phone back to its stock version and pretty much everything else, it's still doing it - which surely points to a problem with the chip (or something). So, I've contacted google about a replacement and so far so good - got through in 5 minutes and sorted out the RMA and everything, should be delivered in the next few days.
Thanks for the help anyway. I'm going to avoid rooting this one for the time being to see how it behaves.
I experienced "random shutdowns" and even posted about it here. Turns out it was my belt holster that was somehow the culprit. I don't know if it was mashing some weird button sequence to turn off the phone, or if the magnet interfered or something else, but as soon as I got it out of that holster I had no more random shutdowns.
I doubt yours is the same problem but I thought I'd post mine.
hfuizo said:
I experienced "random shutdowns" and even posted about it here. Turns out it was my belt holster that was somehow the culprit. I don't know if it was mashing some weird button sequence to turn off the phone, or if the magnet interfered or something else, but as soon as I got it out of that holster I had no more random shutdowns.
I doubt yours is the same problem but I thought I'd post mine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah that's not my problem at all Lol. Glad you've figured it out and I bet that magnet caused the issue IMO
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
Funny I had the same thing happen to me last night. I was using the phone put it down for a minute or two and then could not wake the phone. What was interesting was when I couldn't get it to turn on I plugged in into the charger and let it sit for a few hours. When I was finally able to restart it using the the power, vol button the battery was at the same level before the incident. In other words whatever happened prevented the battery from being charged. I am stock and rooted and haven't loaded any new apps in over 2 weeks
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
I have almost the same problem as the op but I do have a shut down sequence. It does randomly shut down itself. The first thing I got the phone I rooted it and it was fine working on modaco for 2 weeks then one day it kept shutting down upon boot until like 10 tries later I successfully got back in but lasted only a few mins and sometimes hours. Im gonna rma this pos and I hope I can get it replaced soon. I try it with stock rom and kernel then modaco with stock kernel then modaco with faux kernel. Same problem.
I had these problems earlier ... I just gave HARD RESET by pressing power key for more than 5 sec.
Then i figured, it was due to Undervolting ! and Processor going to a DEEP SLEEP all together !
So i removed UVing and it was cool since then ! ... Although my signature says the rest !
I bought my N4 about 2 weeks ago, and it has turned itself off 3 of the nights I've had it. I don't have any hard evidence, but I have a theory on why it's doing it.
At first I thought it was because I used a Motorola usb cord instead of the stock cord because I read some people's theories on the internet, but it happened again (twice) after using the stock cord.
It seemed like it only shut off if I left WiFi turned on when I went to sleep (even then it was still a random occurrence). I went into my advanced WiFi settings and noticed Wi-Fi Optimization was turned on with the text "Minimize battery usage when Wi-Fi is on". I thought it might be the problem, so I turned it off. I left WiFi on last night, and the phone was still on in the morning. Again, it is still a random occurrence even with WF on, so I'm going to leave WF on at night for a few days/weeks and see if it happens again. I'll post back with results.
If anyone else has already tried this or has figured out a solution, let me know.
The same happens several times a week with my nexus 4 running latest cyanogenmod. I will revert it to clean stock in a few days to see how it goes. I don't think that is a hardware problem but time will tell.
MildewMan said:
I bought my N4 about 2 weeks ago, and it has turned itself off 3 of the nights I've had it. I don't have any hard evidence, but I have a theory on why it's doing it.
At first I thought it was because I used a Motorola usb cord instead of the stock cord because I read some people's theories on the internet, but it happened again (twice) after using the stock cord.
It seemed like it only shut off if I left WiFi turned on when I went to sleep (even then it was still a random occurrence). I went into my advanced WiFi settings and noticed Wi-Fi Optimization was turned on with the text "Minimize battery usage when Wi-Fi is on". I thought it might be the problem, so I turned it off. I left WiFi on last night, and the phone was still on in the morning. Again, it is still a random occurrence even with WF on, so I'm going to leave WF on at night for a few days/weeks and see if it happens again. I'll post back with results.
If anyone else has already tried this or has figured out a solution, let me know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't know if anyone is keeping up or cares, but I wanted to update and say that this did not fix the problem. 4.2.2 also did not fix the problem. I guess I could try getting a new one from Google.
My wife and I are both having this problem. Hers is completely stock, I'm unlocked and rooted. I was hoping it would be fixed with 4.2.2, but if it hasn't then it maybe time to get replacement N4s
I can't imagine this issue is very widespread, since there have only been a few threads about it. Its a big nuisance especially because it usually happens at night when I'm expecting my alarm to go off at night.
I hadn't wanted to send for replacements since it seems like a software issue but I'm getting fed up.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
Just had this problem occur with my N4 last night..... Phone is 2 weeks old.
Went to bed, plugged in the phone to charge [it was at about 50% or so, so not exactly low].
Woke up at 8.30 wondering why my alarm didn't go off at 7.30.... looked over and the phone was off.
It also didn't want to turn back on either. Took about a minute of holding in the power button for various amounts of time before it finally kicked to life [at 100% charge too].
This is going to be a real problem if this problem reoccurs. At home I have a clock radio but I travel a lot and rely on my phone to wake me up!
Here's hoping we can start to identify what is causing this issue. All I can add is that it is not low-battery related.
As stated in the sig. Phone is unlocked/rooted with stock rom.
Unplugged my phone this morning at 100%, went to charge it just now with factory charger and cable and nothing. Tried reboot and battery pull. Sitting at 60% right now. It's off in case I need to return to stock to exchange it. Any ideas?
Planktron said:
Unplugged my phone this morning at 100%, went to charge it just now with factory charger and cable and nothing. Tried reboot and battery pull. Sitting at 60% right now. It's off in case I need to return to stock to exchange it. Any ideas?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had a bad cable, it is not the phone...damn cables were cheaply made.
Tried 2 cables. When the phone is off I get the battery icon with the circle in it, but it just loops this icon. It comes up, vibrates, turns off repeatedly. I tried to wipe cache and it said error. I'm rooted, defrosted everything I had frozen.
What I don't understand is why I'm getting an error when trying to wipe cache partition.I unrooted, so as far as I know im now totally stock. Is it safe to try to do a factory reset?
Planktron said:
Tried 2 cables. When the phone is off I get the battery icon with the circle in it, but it just loops this icon. It comes up, vibrates, turns off repeatedly. I tried to wipe cache and it said error. I'm rooted, defrosted everything I had frozen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds like kernel panic. Whatever rooting/custom mod/ blabla you have on that device is either buggy, badly flashed or something like that.
You need to have a good connection to Odin established, flash only stock rom (the untouched version/odexed), let it reboot normally from Odin, and wait. (it is important to have at least 50% battery left, you don't want it to quite on you in the middle of a flash)
Doesn't matter if it doesn't go all the way and setup the first time. Just pull the batter (after Odin rebooted), go into recovery, cleanup everything, and reboot.
Thank should get you back in the world of the living ...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2261573&highlight=return+to+stock
So just do exactly what is written in this thread then? Do I have to go that far or can I try a factory reset from recovery?
Thanks BTW
Planktron said:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2261573&highlight=return+to+stock
So just do exactly what is written in this thread then? Do I have to go that far or can I try a factory reset from recovery?
Thanks BTW
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Easier things first, so if you haven't tried a factory reset yet then go ahead ( although that won't unroot you) try your factory reset first.
But then if your battery gets too low and still doesn't charged, you need to get it charged up first.
And yes that hotfile link is the original factory ROM dump, it is good.
That is the at&t stock file or you're on bell or rogers or ... get a samfirmware/sammobile account and download your ROM from there.
No dice on the factory reset, and I'm about 40%. I'm thinking I'm just going to exchange it. Device status says Official so I should be good, no?
Planktron said:
No dice on the factory reset, and I'm about 40%. I'm thinking I'm just going to exchange it. Device status says Official so I should be good, no?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you should be ok exchanging it although for most devices rooting voids the warranty
that was my main reason sending you the odin flashing route in case you wanted to exchange it but it is no big deal.
Well I'll be...
Did another factory reset from the settings menu this time, ON THE WAY to the AT&T store(while parked, of course), plugged it into the 'ol 12v and she fired right up. I agree about the kernel panic deal. I've had strange things happen before. The only thing that changed on my phone from last night until the no-charge state was the installation of SugarSync. It kept FC'ing so I uninstalled it. I think it may have changed some items deep deep in the areas of the OS that I know nothing about and it freaked out the bowels of Android.
Back when I had my Atrix 4G, I installed Dolphin Browser, and it sent my phone into a whirlwind of FC's.
Thank you for your assistance, Commodore.
Planktron said:
Well I'll be...
Did another factory reset from the settings menu this time, ON THE WAY to the AT&T store(while parked, of course), plugged it into the 'ol 12v and she fired right up. I agree about the kernel panic deal. I've had strange things happen before. The only thing that changed on my phone from last night until the no-charge state was the installation of SugarSync. It kept FC'ing so I uninstalled it. I think it may have changed some items deep deep in the areas of the OS that I know nothing about and it freaked out the bowels of Android.
Back when I had my Atrix 4G, I installed Dolphin Browser, and it sent my phone into a whirlwind of FC's.
Thank you for your assistance, Commodore.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is always good to hear. thanks for reporting back.
Plus if you did reset it while you were driving, not that some people haven't ... , at&t will start making new screen stickers saying :
"don't factory reset your phones and drive ... it can wait".
Oh well. Since im a junkie and couldn't wait to re root, as soon as it charged back up I re rooted. All was well until I started freezing bloat, then it stopped charging. Got a replacement on the last day of the return period. Wish I knew what was causing this. Looks like im staying stock until we get recovery.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk 2
It's been a few days so I'm bringing this thread back from the grave, but I want to know if anyone else has experienced similar issues. It's really strange, what happened, and I'd like to know more about why it happened. I should have made a logcat but too late now. I'm not the type of person to experience something like that and take the easy way out with an exchange (I've experienced worse), but with my battery percent remaining an ODIN flash would have been risky at best. Like I said, everything was fine for days until I installed sugarsync.
I only froze bloat. Everything starting with AT&T, and some Samsung apps like S-Voice, ChatOn and push service.
Until I can figure this out or get custom recovery, I'm stuck stock because I'm not going to cheat again for another exchange.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk 2
I had exactly the same thing happen to my rooted s4. Took it back to the shop i bought it ( Unrooted ) and they replaced it.
Same here.
I get it to charge sometimes for about 10 minutes and then it'll disconnect.
USB via the PC doesn't work as well.
I think replacement is probably a safest bet.
We aren't the only ones either...
http://forums.androidcentral.com/samsung-galaxy-s4/275276-galaxy-s4-wont-charge.html
This has just happened to me. I plugged it in last night with about 19% remaining, woke up this morning and it was at 7%-- hadn't charged. I tried a couple different chargers and cables, and nothing has worked so far. The charge has since dwindled to 4%. I'm running slimrom, and I guess I can't risk flashing back to stock since the battery is likely to die completely during the process.
When I did a shutdown and then plugged it in, I got the "charging" icon, of the battery with the green bar repeatedly moving up through it. But after leaving it for half and hour, I tried to boot it, and that was the point where it had gone from 7% to 4%, so apparently it wasn't really charging. Might have to buy another battery and see if that's the problem or the charging circuit in the phone.
---------- Post added at 03:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:48 PM ----------
Ok, so this is weird. I have been using some older chargers/cables that I had left over from my Captivate, and they've been working fine for a month, until now. But I went and got out the charger that came with the GS4 and tried that, and although the ROM still says "not charging/connect your charger", the battery % is increasing. Very strange.
I think u need to get back to stock rom to solve this issue..and u won't get warranty as your device is rooted even if u revert back to stock your bincounter will ramain same that's of you had flashed your device twice with custom rom your bin counter will be 2...so samsung can easily understand it by going into download mode...u can also see the number of bin counts by entering into download mode screen ....so u need to reset bin counter before taking it to customer care otherwise they will woid ur warranty:thumbup:
Sent from my GT-I9500 using xda premium
Phone keeps turning off! Never while using it & sometimes when phone is not moving.
I have an LG-D801 running 4.4.2 kernal 3.4.0 and software D80120a. I also have and use TWRP for recovery. Ever since I rooted my phone and installed this rom, everything has been perfect! That was about 4 months ago. I have and use lots of apps, most of which I have been using for years without any issues. Lately I have been finding my phone off in my pocket for some reason. It now is happening maybe 6-10 times a day which is really getting annoying.
The LG G2 battery doesn't come out so not like it got loose. I have tested it by sitting on the desk lightly and checking it later to STILL find it turned off. So I know I'm not bumping it. I have tried an app killer to kill apps before turning off the screen but it still seems to happen. The phone is still relatively new so I doubt it's hardware, I baby my phones.
Any ideas for ways to make it STAY on without flashing a new rom? Or maybe ideas for how to diagnose what is shutting it down?
(I am looking for ideas and useable feedback, please don't respond that my phone has hardware issues and needs to be replaced!)
UnknownCloakedMan said:
I have an LG-D801 running 4.4.2 kernal 3.4.0 and software D80120a. I also have and use TWRP for recovery. Ever since I rooted my phone and installed this rom, everything has been perfect! That was about 4 months ago. I have and use lots of apps, most of which I have been using for years without any issues. Lately I have been finding my phone off in my pocket for some reason. It now is happening maybe 6-10 times a day which is really getting annoying.
The LG G2 battery doesn't come out so not like it got loose. I have tested it by sitting on the desk lightly and checking it later to STILL find it turned off. So I know I'm not bumping it. I have tried an app killer to kill apps before turning off the screen but it still seems to happen. The phone is still relatively new so I doubt it's hardware, I baby my phones.
Any ideas for ways to make it STAY on without flashing a new rom? Or maybe ideas for how to diagnose what is shutting it down?
(I am looking for ideas and useable feedback, please don't respond that my phone has hardware issues and needs to be replaced!)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you sure it's actually off and not just asleep and not waking up. I've never seen a generally working phone turn itself off. On another device we called it the SOD (Sleep of Death) and required a long press on the power to reboot. It's most likely a rooted app like something Xposed related perhaps.
wolfclan68 said:
Are you sure it's actually off and not just asleep and not waking up. I've never seen a generally working phone turn itself off. On another device we called it the SOD (Sleep of Death) and required a long press on the power to reboot. It's most likely a rooted app like something Xposed related perhaps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How can I tell the difference? Basically I press the power button once quickly to turn the screen on and it doesn't come on. I hold it for maybe 3 seconds and get the booting up stuff. I am guessing if it was sleeping I'd have to hold it much longer?
UnknownCloakedMan said:
How can I tell the difference? Basically I press the power button once quickly to turn the screen on and it doesn't come on. I hold it for maybe 3 seconds and get the booting up stuff. I am guessing if it was sleeping I'd have to hold it much longer?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah bud, that's a new one on me. Do you have any root apps that could be the cause? Like Xposed.
wolfclan68 said:
Yeah bud, that's a new one on me. Do you have any root apps that could be the cause? Like Xposed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the help. After reading your previous post, I decided to remove GravityBox KK and Xposed. I was using it because I find it annoying that when I plug in my phone at night, it turns on my screen. Not a big deal...
I also use SuperSU and LuckyPatcher which both use root. The only other thing I can think of is that I semi-recently upgraded my Play Store (v4.8.19 using Lucky Patcher) which I had some troubles with. It kept saying my /system was out of space and for some reason, even with root, it tells me acces denied when changing stuff inside the /system such as boot animation.
so... just an update. It's still doing it even after I uninstalled all the apps that need root. I really wish there was a log or something (like Windows) to tell me why it keeps turning off!
I have noticed it seems to happen much more often if I am texting somebody even though I'm using the default app for messages. It literally was turning off after every message I sent early before the other person was able to reply for about 5 messages in a row.
Has anyone had issues with the notification LED blinking when you don't have any notifications? This is really frustrating and I can't figure out how to fix it. I've restarted, cleared the cache for the phone and cleared the cache for messages.
Is it supposed to blink with the phone turned on? It only blinks while charging with the phone off
willclein said:
Has anyone had issues with the notification LED blinking when you don't have any notifications? This is really frustrating and I can't figure out how to fix it. I've restarted, cleared the cache for the phone and cleared the cache for messages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is not a notification LED, it is a special purpose charge indicator.... It should only blink/light when the battery is too low to turn on and it is charging... If it is doing it at other times the problem is a hardware fault (usually moisture related).
acejavelin said:
It is not a notification LED, it is a special purpose charge indicator.... It should only blink/light when the battery is too low to turn on and it is charging... If it is doing it at other times the problem is a hardware fault (usually moisture related).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think it's a hardware fault. It only happens when then screen is off.
willclein said:
I don't think it's a hardware fault. It only happens when then screen is off.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Boot in Safe Mode or factory default... if it still occurs, it's a hardware fault, if it goes away it's an app conflict.
We have seen this before though, it is almost always hardware when the light comes on when it shouldn't because the stock ROM has no provisions for any control of the light.
acejavelin said:
Boot in Safe Mode or factory default... if it still occurs, it's a hardware fault, if it goes away it's an app conflict.
We have seen this before though, it is almost always hardware when the light comes on when it shouldn't because the stock ROM has no provisions for any control of the light.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Definitely an issue with my ROM or an app. I ran a backup then Factory Reset which fixed the issue. I'll ask this question in the rom thread.
willclein said:
Definitely an issue with my ROM or an app. I ran a backup then Factory Reset which fixed the issue. I'll ask this question in the rom thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds good... Good luck!
I just assumed you were stock since you didn't state differently in your OP.