Related
Parden if this is posted somewhere else. But this needs some serious attention. As of current, I realize the 3G issues is a design flaw. So this means all N1s have this problem. You can test it for your self. The easy way to fix this would be to have stronger 3G coverage but thats not the case. Let me quote whats been said at droidstory.com and the nexus forums..
I’ve been saying all along that this is a RF issue. I noticed this right away when I got my phone and even posted this video on Jan 9 to show how the N1 drops 3G as soon as you hold it in your hand.
The problem occurs only when you are in an area with a weak 3G signal, anything less than -80dBm. (Higher negative numbers mean weaker signal.)
Basically, if you have -90dBM or less signal strength with the phone sitting on your desk, holding it in your hand will push it down to -100dBm or less. At that point all bets are off. Before the update it would switch to Edge around -100dBm, now it seems to hold on until about -105dBm.
The “dBm” (dB-milliwatt) is a logarithmic measurement of signal strength, and dBm values can be easily converted to and from mW values. So a decrease of roughly 3dBm yields a change of roughly HALF in the mW value.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
After watching that video you can decide who to blame.
Google if the device's rx sensitivity is so poor when held in hand it needs a recall. Is it a hardware issue?
After google & HTC watche the video and get to test in an area with <-84dBm signal strength reading, I'd love to hear the response from their respective tech teams soon.
The signal reading being low low doesn't mean low signal. Compare with other devices/instruments.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
.. read more here and here
The question. What is Google waiting on to say something? to do something?? its enough that we also have serious touch screen problems to deal with but come on Google..Are we really beta testers? you think its EASY to give you 500+ for a phone?
share your thoughts..
at first i thought it was just me, but now is my phone as well as my wifes phone.
and to send it back with in the 14day period they keep $45 o yours when the phone is running like a pos. Great one Google i expected way better from yall
Not sure what my take is...
1. All phones drop signals a bit when held by both hands.
2. This bouncing between edge/3g doesnt happen to me in strong 3g areas. In the area where it sometimes happens I cant replicate the issue stated it seems random. But to be fair my G1 was always bouncing back and forth there , heck even with Sprint I had mediocre EVDO steadiness.
It may be a slight hardware problem made worse by a network with very spotty 3g coverage in most areas.
j23a45m said:
at first i thought it was just me, but now is my phone as well as my wifes phone.
and to send it back with in the 14day period they keep $45 o yours when the phone is running like a pos. Great one Google i expected way better from yall
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its getting really annoying and the silence Google is practicing is getting defending..
If I cup the bottom of the phone in my hand, my signal strength does drop a bar or 2. I never lose 3G completely though. Luckily I have a strong signal where I live. I could see this becoming a real problem if I travel away from home though. It's rather annoying that Google didn't catch this before releasing the phone
I just tried the same thing (holding in both hands, covering back etc..) on my HTC Pure on at&t and my 3g connection dropped down to 2 bars from 5 bars. Seems to be normal behaviour with all phones with internal antenna.
I think the only problem seems to be that N1 is too picky about signal trength and switches to edge as soon as signal strength drops down slightly.
I do not think this is an hardware issue.
EDIT: See attached screenshot from my old Nokia 6682 user manual. They specifically warn against this.
Maybe you think it's "real on all N1s" because of anecdotic evidence and postings on the internet, but that doesn't mean proof.
Now it might have trouble with US 3g frequecies or it might just be a software "problem" where it switches to edge before the signal gets too bad.
I can safely say I've had no problems at all, the signal doesn't switch back and forth, signal doesn't change when I cup it with both hands etc.
Granted I have -75dBm signal where I live, but it's not like I sit around playing with my phone indoors all the time either
All cellular phones lose signal when you cover the antenna with your hand. ALL of them. I've had over 20 cell phones in the past 10 years, and every single one had this issue. Why this is a standout issue on the N1, I don't know.
The previous two Nokia phones I used all lose signal when holding the antenna area.
Well, again it happened to all phones with internal antenna...and not just Nexus One especially on a week 3G coverage.
ram130 said:
Parden if this is posted somewhere else. But this needs some serious attention. As of current, I realize the 3G issues is a design flaw. So this means all N1s have this problem. You can test it for your self. The easy way to fix this would be to have stronger 3G coverage but thats not the case. Let me quote whats been said at droidstory.com and the nexus forums..
.. read more here and here
The question. What is Google waiting on to say something? to do something?? its enough that we also have serious touch screen problems to deal with but come on Google..Are we really beta testers? you think its EASY to give you 500+ for a phone?
share your thoughts..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My thoughts are as follows:
The antenna is in the bottom of the phone - this isn't a design "flaw" it's how the phone was designed to fit the necessary components into a small fixed space. This isn't the first phone designed this way and it won't be the last. It was likely designed that way due to space constraints with the speaker, mic and camera up top. Again, the "issue" is only prevalent in areas of weaker 3G coverage.
The iPhone 3G is designed the same way and people see the same issues with 3G dropping when you cover it with your hand - you can find the same youtube videos on it.
Google was aware of this before it shipped and in the manual states not to cover the back of the phone and to hold it in the preferred position. I don't think Google has anything to say that isn't in the manual already...
Now, you can argue that the N1 may get poorer 3G reception compared to other phones, but to argue that covering the antenna with your hand causes a degradation of signal is a "design flaw" is asinine. This happens with all phones and all antennas. There's likely few ways they could have placed the antenna in the top of the phone with the size of the current phone and the hardware that's already up there.
I wouldn't hold your breath for Google to "do something" as people seem to want as there's nothing they can "do" other than say, "Read your manual and quit covering the antenna with your hand".
Omg really..when is this topic going to end? Those of us with common sense know that it's nothing to do with the Nexus one or Android specifically. All phones do the same thing. I just did it with a friends iPhone. I can go around my building (AT&T) and cover anybodies phone with my hand and drop a bar, sometimes two. It's common networking knowledge. You cover the antenna, you lose some signal strength.
If you have 2 bars of 3G and you cover it up and lose 2 bars....What do you think happens? You go to Edge. Everybody thinks they know this issue like they invented the damn thing. There is no specific problem with the Nexus One. Give it up already.
Ironically common sense isn't so common these days...
I am sitting at my desk, I have a rooted N1 customized to the max. I am using the ERE36B Radio, (not the one in the OTA) I have 4 bars of 3G/HSPDA If I cover the bottom of the phone with both hands, I dont loose a single bar.
I fully believe this is a software issue. The leaked radio is working great for me, I almost never lose 3G now.
Yes covering the antena will cause you to lose signal, why wouldnt it?
Blah, I have a N1 and G1 on tmobile on different lines and they always have the same service same speed tests. Maybe my phone is the phenomenon, but I doubt it.
krohnjw said:
Google was aware of this before it shipped and in the manual states not to cover the back of the phone and to hold it in the preferred position. I don't think Google has anything to say that isn't in the manual already...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Whats the preferred position?
Any comfortable way caused you to block the radio.
I get the same signal strength my G1 did in all the same places. Using both the OTA radio and the 36B radio. If I'm in a place with weak 3G I force it to 2G. Why would Google give a **** about T-Mobile's 3G coverage?
JoshHart said:
Blah, I have a N1 and G1 on tmobile on different lines and they always have the same service same speed tests. Maybe my phone is the phenomenon, but I doubt it.
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Click to collapse
uberingram said:
I get the same signal strength my G1 did in all the same places. Using both the OTA radio and the 36B radio. If I'm in a place with weak 3G I force it to 2G. Why would Google give a **** about T-Mobile's 3G coverage?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is what I have been saying. I have a MyTouch, N1, and G1 and they all have the same signal strength at all times. I sold the G1 already but my wife still has the Mytouch.
Everybody who complains has nothing to compare it to. How can you say something is worse because you "remember" another phone? You can't. It's T-mobiles coverage. It has nothing to do with Google, Android or HTC.
People just need to get over it already and stop complaining.
dumbestcrayon said:
This is what I have been saying. I have a MyTouch, N1, and G1 and they all have the same signal strength at all times. I sold the G1 already but my wife still has the Mytouch.
Everybody who complains has nothing to compare it to. How can you say something is worse because you "remember" another phone? You can't. It's T-mobiles coverage. It has nothing to do with Google, Android or HTC.
People just need to get over it already and stop complaining.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, since you have access to multiple Android phones...
Can you try the TRUE test?
Open up Settings -> About Phone -> Network on both phones sitting side by side.
Can you compare the *exact* signal strength on both phones? (dBm vs dBm when side by side)
And yes I have absolutely HORRID service in my place. I'm lucky to get better than -95.
In times of change the learners will inherit the earth, while the knowers will find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists.
Good job, you apparently know it all. . . BTW, thanks for the earth
From the experience gained using mine is evident that all problems are not hardware but FULLY firmware related.
Since everytime I make a call the phone SHOWS a better coverage than staying only surfing the web. Also when tethering, if I make the phone call suddenly the HSDPA speeds tend to increase at about 20%, I presume that when you are calling, the firmware might be settled to somehow strength the radio signal. Compare this on-call speeds to my "normal" ones:
Anyway, right now the only temporal solution for the indiscriminated switch backs to GPRS when navigating is making sure of accesing the radio config (*#*#4636#*#*) and select WDMCA ONLY...
A vacation is a good test for a new phone. It isn't always difficult to hold up to day to day needs, but the demands of a smartphone on a vacation are much greater. For this 4th of July weekend I took the EVO to Baltimore and had a great experience with it. Baltimore is 4G-enabled, so speeds on things like maps and YouTube were noticeably faster. I basically used the phone for everything from the time I left my house:
- Google Maps nav was amazing and accurate, the GPS signal always picked up immediately and remained strong (something that definitely can't be said for all past devices)
- streamed music locally and from Slacker over 3G the entire time in the background without any hiccups
- further used maps and Where to find good places to eat and waking directions to get there
- forgot to charge my point and shoot (as usual) so used the phone camera a ton for pictures and video at the National Aquarium, they came out great and battery life was also very good
- made excellent use of 4G and kickstand to watch YouTube videos in bed at night, again 4G did not seem to drain the battery especially fast
- and of course sent out emails, did some other web browsing, etc.
Overall I was impressed with how the performance of the phone kept up with me and how useful all the features were. The huge screen was so handy and made it easier to show other people things, wouldn't want to go back to a smaller one now. If anyone comes across this and is on the fence about getting this device, I wouldn't hesitate!
Are you rooted? And its good to see someone use the Evo on a real test like a vacation.
Sent from my HTC EVO using Tapatalk
I have to totally agree with OP. I went all around California this weekend from San Diego to Santa Barbara just handlin business! My EVO was my best friend and made me some new friends as well. Battery life was great, GPS was priceless, Pandora blasting all the time (super loud). Had an awesome vacation and couldn't have done it without my homie in my pocket. Evo rules.
I'm in San Diego right now on vacation with my EVO. Everything has been great so far! GPS was very useful and I can't even tell you how much faster everything is than my iPhone 3G. I open maps and it loads and GPS locks on instantly. Everything was just so fast.
Right now I have it tethered to my laptop so I can post this here and so I could upload some pictures from my DSLR to my Dropbox account and to clear my memory card.
To in summary... the EVO is awesome.
It could only have been better if there was 4G coverage here (of course it wouldn't matter since I've since jacked up my 4G... )
Nice timing on this thread. I went to vegas and got a taste of 4g myself.
I got like 7mbps when in the right spot but too much fluctuation
Swyped from my Evo 4G
r546 said:
A vacation is a good test for a new phone. It isn't always difficult to hold up to day to day needs, but the demands of a smartphone on a vacation are much greater. For this 4th of July weekend I took the EVO to Baltimore and had a great experience with it. Baltimore is 4G-enabled, so speeds on things like maps and YouTube were noticeably faster. I basically used the phone for everything from the time I left my house:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey OP,
While in Baltimore (my hometown), did you notice how many bars of 4G you were getting? Did you at any time measure your bandwidth? I love my Evo, but I'm finding the 4G coverage in Baltimore is spotty and only sometimes faster than 3G.
robpet2 said:
Are you rooted? And its good to see someone use the Evo on a real test like a vacation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope, not rooted. Pretty happy with the stock ROM with Sense and haven't wanted to do anything that requires root yet.
ViViDboarder said:
I open maps and it loads and GPS locks on instantly. Everything was just so fast.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah I can't speak enough about how quickly the GPS locks and how accurate it seemed to be. Way better than my Pre and I think even better than my old Garmin! Won't be needing to take that out again anytime soon.
topdnbass said:
Nice timing on this thread. I went to vegas and got a taste of 4g myself.
I got like 7mbps when in the right spot but too much fluctuation
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice to hear! I'm going to Vegas myself in a little over three weeks! I'm sure I'll be finding the 4G very useful. Any attractions or bars I shouldn't miss?
DrawnToScale said:
Hey OP,
While in Baltimore (my hometown), did you notice how many bars of 4G you were getting? Did you at any time measure your bandwidth? I love my Evo, but I'm finding the 4G coverage in Baltimore is spotty and only sometimes faster than 3G.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When indoors I sometimes lost the 4G completely or dropped to one or two bars. Outside I had anywhere from one to full depending on location, but this was mostly directly around the Inner Harbor. I did measure bandwidth, consistently got between 2.5 to 3 Mbps. This is at least twice as fast if not more than I usually get with 3G (Sprint's 3G speeds are pretty good).
As many people here are probably aware of...the Nexus One had some 3G reception problems on T-Mobile. How is the Vibrant working out for those who have it (or get it today)?
EDIT: I'm not here to argue about whether or not the N1 had 3G reception issues. I'm really just interested to hear about the Vibrant's 3G performance in real world use. If you have a vibrant please let me know how it is for you. Thanks!
will let you know in about an hour and 10 minutes. I have had 2 different HD2's in the past 3 months, the first one had a consistent 5 bars of 3G at my house, and my last one would average 2-3, so I'm hoping the Vibrant will be more like my first hd2 in that regards lol
sounds good. will wait to hear about it. this was my biggest gripe with the nexus one, so hopefully it is better in this phone.
N1 does not have reception issue... its tmobiles coverage .. it does the same to my tp2, tmobile dash and I even saw the galaxy doing it in poor signal... in strong area it wont even drop a bar...
And galaxys antenna is at the bottom like the n1...
Check video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LROTHrTR92k&feature=player_embedded#
And here's my tp2 doing it.... its tmobile and of course covering it. Together is the issue.. forgive the language in the video..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Eo7uFtAKDY
temperbad said:
N1 does not have reception issue... its tmobiles coverage .. it does the same to my tp2, tmobile dash and I even saw the galaxy doing it in poor signal... in strong area it wont even drop a bar...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not referring to what happens if you're in poor signal area. I'm talking about average signal areas where you have decent 3G and very good EDGE reception. The N1 loses 3G reception when held in a specific way, or often defaults to EDGE while other phones such as the G1 hold onto 3G just fine. I've tested this thoroughly, and am quite certain of this.
^ I have both, an N1 and G1. You are either very unlucky or full of $hit.
s15274n said:
^ I have both, an N1 and G1. You are either very unlucky or full of $hit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow, seems like you need to grow up a bit.
These are my observations, and the N1's signal simply wasn't good enough for me to keep the phone. I no longer own it. I'm not the only person who has had issues with the N1's signal in comparison to other phones. It is true that you can hold many phones in a specific way to drop signal, but on the N1 holding it in a natural way causes a drop, which is a pretty big issue - at least it was for me.
gsvnet said:
I'm not referring to what happens if you're in poor signal area. I'm talking about average signal areas where you have decent 3G and very good EDGE reception. The N1 loses 3G reception when held in a specific way, or often defaults to EDGE while other phones such as the G1 hold onto 3G just fine. I've tested this thoroughly, and am quite certain of this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Watch my vids, most phones do this. Just cause ya got full bars 3g doesn't make it a strong signal.....
temperbad said:
Watch my vids, most phones do this. Just cause ya got full bars 3g doesn't make it a strong signal.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've tested this firsthand and don't need to watch any videos. natural use of other phones results in better 3G reception than natural use of an N1. unless you're actually *trying* to hurt the signal on a G1, it's not going to happen easily. That's my experience, anyways. By the way, I use the actual dbm's to measure the signal, not just bars. To say that "full bars" is not strong signal is actually pretty ignorant anyways. Generally full bars is a minimum of around -90dbm which is definitely a good signal. It differs a bit based on how they are calibrated on a particular phone, but this is an approximate rule.
gsvnet said:
Wow, seems like you need to grow up a bit.
These are my observations, and the N1's signal simply wasn't good enough for me to keep the phone. I no longer own it. I'm not the only person who has had issues with the N1's signal in comparison to other phones. It is true that you can hold many phones in a specific way to drop signal, but on the N1 holding it in a natural way causes a drop, which is a pretty big issue - at least it was for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've read the issue .. I've owned a n1 for 6 months. The issue is tmobile not the phone... I.e. my videos. They do the same.... Its tmobile.. and partially bad antenna placement but its ultimately the poor signal That causes your hand to deflect signal... and from the video the sgs has the antenna in the same place as then1
gsvnet said:
I've tested this firsthand and don't need to watch any videos. natural use of other phones results in better 3G reception than natural use of an N1. unless you're actually *trying* to hurt the signal on a G1, it's not going to happen easily. That's my experience, anyways. By the way, I use the actual dbm's to measure the signal, not just bars. To say that "full bars" is not strong signal is actually pretty ignorant anyways. Generally full bars is a minimum of around -90dbm which is definitely a good signal. It differs a bit based on how they are calibrated on a particular phone, but this is an approximate rule.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ignorance is starting a thread about signal and not watching vids people post to help you out... one of them vids is the galaxy s... your answer is in that video
temperbad said:
I've read the issue .. I've owned a n1 for 6 months. The issue is tmobile not the phone... I.e. my videos. They do the same.... Its tmobile.. and partially bad antenna placement but its ultimately the poor signal That causes your hand to deflect signal... and from the video the sgs has the antenna in the same place as then1
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can point figures at T-Mobile all you want but I constantly have 3G on a G1 in a lot of places where I didn't on an N1 (tested different radios as well, with similar results). The same goes for my Nokia N900, which I can't deplete the signal by the way I hold it no matter how much I try.
It is true that T-Mobile uses the 1700/2100mhz bands for 3G, while AT&T uses lower bands (850/1900mhz). The lower bands are less susceptible to interference like this, and that's probably why the issue wasn't very noticeable on the AT&T version of the N1. However, a properly designed phone will not have as much of a problem on T-Mobile's network as the N1, especially when you're holding the phone in a natural way, and not an obtrusive way.
gsvnet said:
You can point figures at T-Mobile all you want but I constantly have 3G on a G1 in a lot of places where I didn't on an N1 (tested different radios as well, with similar results). The same goes for my Nokia N900, which I can't deplete the signal by the way I hold it no matter how much I try.
It is true that T-Mobile uses the 1700/2100mhz bands for 3G, while AT&T uses lower bands (850/1900mhz). The lower bands are less susceptible to interference like this, and that's probably why the issue wasn't very noticeable on the AT&T version of the N1. However, a properly designed phone will not have as much of a problem on T-Mobile's network as the N1, especially when you're holding the phone in a natural way, and not an obtrusive way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thinks its both. But safe to say if we had better signal I.e. building penetration we would never see the issue...past this.. back to sgs
Please watch the video. The first one shows the same as how the n1 was. Imo the antenna is in the same spot. So that may help you out on your question
temperbad said:
Ignorance is starting a thread about signal and not watching vids people post to help you out... one of them vids is the galaxy s... your answer is in that video
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the Galaxy S, not the Vibrant.
The Galaxy S had issues with GPS signal, so far reports are that the Vibrant does not. Clearly there are some changes to the phone in that case. It could be an updated firmware. Thus I can't go by issues that the Galaxy S has, as the Vibrant could very well be different - especially considering that video seems to be from a completely different network operator/country, with different network characteristics, etc. On the other hand, on the N1, the 3G reception issue was a widespread problem, even recognized by Google to some extent - though they never did 'truly' fix it. I'll be the first to say the N1 is a really nice phone, even today - a good 6 months after its release. But it isn't quite as good as other phones in 3G reception, which I determined after owning the phone for almost three months.
temperbad said:
I thinks its both. But safe to say if we had better signal I.e. building penetration we would never see the issue...past this.. back to sgs
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
These are the frequencies that T-Mobile was allocated, and they are not the only carrier using higher bands for 3G. It is the job of the phone manufacturer to develop a device that is optimized for the frequencies the intended network uses. The N900 is an example of a device that does really well in this area, the G1 isn't too bad either. In creating this thread, I was hoping to hear about actual usage of the Vibrant on T-Mobile's network, so how about we leave the thread to just that?
Thanks.
gsvnet said:
These are the frequencies that T-Mobile was allocated, and they are not the only carrier using higher bands for 3G. It is the job of the phone manufacturer to develop a device that is optimized for the frequencies the intended network uses. The N900 is an example of a device that does really well in this area, the G1 isn't too bad either. In creating this thread, I was hoping to hear about actual usage of the Vibrant on T-Mobile's network, so how about we leave the thread to just that?
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its a fact tmobiles 3g doesn't penetrate buildings as well. I don't care what phone you have...
Anyways. I'm saying the antenna is more than likely at the bottom as well. So you may be getting n1 issues... anyways I'm done. Your pretty set in what you believe ...
Hope its well for you...
temperbad said:
Its a fact tmobiles 3g doesn't penetrate buildings as well. I don't care what phone you have...
Anyways. I'm saying the antenna is more than likely at the bottom as well. So you may be getting n1 issues... anyways I'm done. Your pretty set in what you believe ...
Hope its well for you...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When did I argue anything about building penetration? Of course it's not as good as some other carriers, due to the higher frequencies in use. However, some phones handle this better than others, and I created this thread to learn about the Vibrant's 3G performance. You came here and began arguing over practically nothing, without any experience of the Vibrant yourself. And as 'heygrl' pointed out, you're clearly going out of your way to deplete the signal on the TP2, holding it an unnatural way. Thus the video is not really relevant.
heygrl said:
The vidzzzzzz you posted are crap.
Anyway I ACUTALLY have a Vibrant in a few hours and I will let the OP know how the reception is instead of posting up a bunch of stupid Youtube videos.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. Glad to see somebody who knows what they're talking about.
gsvnet said:
When did I argue anything about building penetration? Of course it's not as good as some other carriers, due to the higher frequencies in use. However, some phones handle this better than others, and I created this thread to learn about the Vibrant's 3G performance. You came here and began arguing over practically nothing, without any experience of the Vibrant yourself. And as 'heygrl' pointed out, you're clearly going out of your way to deplete the signal on the TP2, holding it an unnatural way. Thus the video is not really relevant.
Thanks. Glad to see somebody who knows what they're talking about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hows that a unatural way? people hold the top alot, think about holding it in landscape, if your holding it with your left hand, your gonna cover the antenna even more so than I was especially typing.. HOW was that Unatural. LOL Thats how you hold your phone....
Edit: and what consists of Unatural? lol Its a 4 inch device, your hands are gonna cover it no matter how hard you try and avoid it... Once again hows holding it at the top vs bottom unatural?
So basically since im holding it at the top vs bottom Im holding it wrong. lol
temperbad said:
hows that a unatural way? people hold the top alot, think about holding it in landscape, if your holding it with your left hand, your gonna cover the antenna even more so than I was especially typing.. HOW was that Unatural. LOL Thats how you hold your phone....
Edit: and what consists of Unatural? lol Its a 4 inch device, your hands are gonna cover it no matter how hard you try and avoid it... Once again hows holding it at the top vs bottom unatural?
So basically since im holding it at the top vs bottom Im holding it wrong. lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Whatever you say - I've used a T-Mobile TP2 (in areas with slightly sketchy 3G) and didn't notice this problem. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, but under my usage I didn't see this. I don't see it on a G1 or N900 either.
Anyway, I don't care about the TP2 - I'm concerned with the Vibrant, so let's see what people have to say in terms of real world usage.
temperbad said:
I've read the issue .. I've owned a n1 for 6 months. The issue is tmobile not the phone... I.e. my videos. They do the same.... Its tmobile.. and partially bad antenna placement but its ultimately the poor signal That causes your hand to deflect signal... and from the video the sgs has the antenna in the same place as then1
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there's a 78 page thread w/about 3300 posts on google's nexus one support forum that refutes your assertion that it's Tmo's signal or coverage - when the AT&T versions came out, they had same issues
convince them http://www.google.com/support/forum/p/android/thread?tid=0c0fb2a46ad64955&hl=en&start=3040
So this whole reception vs wrong bar display has really been bugging me. I decided to run a test . Took my son's Nuron to Target. Went to the back of the store and the bars dropped a little but stayed 3G the whole time. Took the sim card out and placed it back in my Vibrant standing in the same spot. Phone came up. 3G/Zero bars. After just a few seconds it switched to Edge.
What does this tell me? That the Vibrant is definitely weaker in the recption department. I'm on the fence whether on keeping it now. I have 2. Already swapped both of them out once just to make sure. All 4 phones are pretty bad in reception. My wife can't even get a 3g connection in her office and she sits by a window. Opinions?
My vibrant gets 3g in places my nexus dreamed of getting it wiithout the force 3g hack..
I'm happy with the reception. I do think it does lose some signal but not as much as the bars are leading. ..
But yea my n1 was worse in the 3g department in my opinion. ...
Bars are definitely misleading. As a matter of fact, I'm not even concerned with the bars anymore. I'm concerned with maintaining a 3G connection and not swapping to Edge. I've been looking at the actual -dB via *#*#197328640#*#* and it's at around -105 plus/minus 5 when the bars go to zero.
I really think it's just a software glitch. I've done this a few time with speed tests where I take my SIM out of the Vibrant and back into the G1, run some tests, then put it back into the Vibrant, and run some more tests. The Vibrant, while displaying 3-4 fewer bars, is about 3-4x faster than the G1.
So I take it for what it's worth.
The reception with the device is definitely a concern.
I live in the best 3G coverage area this city has to offer. I'm surrounded by HSPA+ antennas, and if I don't touch the device (and have a 'clear signal'), I can pull down 8 6Mbps, easily. As soon as I enter a building, I can barely stay connected to 3G, with speeds that fluctuate wildly (but are mostly in the sub 1Mbps range. Outside, things are a bit better, and that's understandable. But other 3G phones on the network (like the cheapo MyTouch 3G) do not skip a beat in their reception capabilities, when it comes to indoor performance.
I'll put it like this: There's something wrong in the world, when my bleeding-edge phone can't out-perform the MyTouch 3G in GPS, 3G reception or digital compass tests.
If a fix isn't issued, I'll be waiting for the HTC 'Vanguard / G1 Blaze / whatever'.
MMcCraryNJ said:
I really think it's just a software glitch. I've done this a few time with speed tests where I take my SIM out of the Vibrant and back into the G1, run some tests, then put it back into the Vibrant, and run some more tests. The Vibrant, while displaying 3-4 fewer bars, is about 3-4x faster than the G1.
So I take it for what it's worth.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've done the whole speedtest thing with zero bars and speed doesn't really change. The problem is dropping a 3g and switching to edge. My wife can't even get 3g in her building and she's only about 3 miles from me. Granted she's on the 12th floor but does sit by a window. The thing that bugs me is, I'm paying for the speed but her phone is not getting it. I guess another way to look at it is she should be working anyway and not playing with her phone! But then again, if mama ain't happy, nobody is happy
I don't believe this one bit for the exact same reasons I outlined at the T-Mobile Forums
Flawed, maybe, but still a valid concern. I failed to mention I made calls as well as did a little surfing. Nokia stayed 3g the whole time and never dropped to edge. Samsung switched to edge and didn't come back up to 3g until I walked out of the store.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nearly all of what you said doesn't add up or make sense.
T-Mobile's 3G network coverage doesn't match it's GSM/EDGE/2G network coverage yet and thus, they've setup the network to handoff calls to GSM when your 3G signal is poor. There is no WAY that the Nuron kept 3G, especially during a call next to the Vibrant on 0 bars unless your phone is defective.
Secondly whenever I've rebooted my phones and EDGE is far stronger than 3G, to the point where the phone won't stay on 3G.. it will default to the much stronger EDGE signal first before attempting to connect to the 3G network because the signal strength is too low.
Third of all I've had the Nuron next to my CLIQ, and it's switched over to EDGE at the drop of a hat where my CLIQ stayed on 3G completely. I've gone to the same exact places with my Vibrant and it stayed on 3G just like my CLIQ would albeit without the same number of bars. The Nuron is the one of the quickest phones I've ever seen to drop a 3G connection and that's why I dumped it.
So yeah, we need some proof in this case.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Jon C said:
I live in the best 3G coverage area this city has to offer. I'm surrounded by HSPA+ antennas, and if I don't touch the device (and have a 'clear signal'), I can pull down 8Mbps, easily. As soon as I enter a building, I can barely stay connected to 3G, with speeds that fluctuate wildly (but are mostly in the sub 1Mbps range. Outside, things are a bit better, and that's understandable. But other 3G phones on the network (like the cheapo MyTouch 3G) do not skip a beat in their reception capabilities, when it comes to indoor performance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pulling down 8Mbps on a phone that is hardware limited to 7.2Mbps, that's a first! We really need some proof that you "TOUCHING" your phone with one finger drops the signal to EDGE but when you don't touch the phone, you get an impossible 8Mbps... not only is this impossible in all respects, you've yet to prove any of it.
The myTouch 3G you spent so much time around has a Video Camera.
heygrl/spottbby, is it me or are you basically accusing me of lying? If so, wth would I be lying for? Phone wise, I love it. GPS even works for me. I'm asking for opinions not accusations. I don't go around accusing people of lying and asking for proof that their GPS is broken.
ljv said:
heygrl/spottbby, is it me or are you basically accusing me of lying? If so, wth would I be lying for? Phone wise, I love it. GPS even works for me. I'm asking for opinions not accusations. I don't go around accusing people of lying and asking for proof that their GPS is broken.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. I've spent time with the Nokia Nuron, and most importantly lots of time on T-Mobile's 3G network and there is NO way you held 3G with a Nokia Nuron during an active call next to a Vibrant on EDGE.
And actually, come back to us in 3 days so we can still see if your GPS is still locking in under 5 seconds.
Wow, I hope you're an exception and not the rule of a Senior member. Anyway, I'm done with you. Thanks for being so helpful.
Sell your phone! No seriously, sell it... If you're not happy with it then do it now while you still can. You, I, we can speculate on what the issue is, there can be an update today, tomorrow, or never. If your that dissatisfied move on or please give it more time.
Catchin' the VIBE on the XDApp
heygrl said:
I don't believe this one bit for the exact same reasons I outlined at the T-Mobile Forums
Pulling down 8Mbps on a phone that is hardware limited to 7.2Mbps, that's a first! We really need some proof that you "TOUCHING" your phone with one finger drops the signal to EDGE but when you don't touch the phone, you get an impossible 8Mbps... not only is this impossible in all respects, you've yet to prove any of it.
The myTouch 3G you spent so much time around has a Video Camera.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry for the typo, I meant to hit "6" and was in a rush and didn't check before I posted. My average for the USB modem is 8 (indoors), and my brain was sleepy at the keyboard and autopilot failed me. The T-Mobile twitter account was posting about 9Mbps speeds here (in Seattle), and I was posting on somewhere else for that, making the point that we have amazing HSPA+ coverage in the city. Too much internet for this sleepy person. Been awake since 4AM. Forgive me, internet. I am only human.
Phone: 6Mbps (until handled by flesh)
USB Modem: 8 (always)
Also, the MyTouch 3G doesn't belong to me, so I can't really just take her home for the night to make pointless internet videos to please someone who identifies themselves as 'heygrl'. If you want to blow the lid off of this conspiracy, you can mail me a video camera, which I will ship back to you once the video is complete. But that would be crazy, no?
Oh, I can't maintain this web of lies any longer!
Actually, you're right: It's all a conspiracy to troll you and your perfect phone that has no problems at all. I decided to come here, create a handle with my real name and location, just to give you **** and lie. My plan was to build up the illusion that I was just "some guy" experiencing problems with his device. I'm actually a sleeper cell for HTC, trying to give the Vibrant bad press, so that the upcoming HSPA+ device can overtake it in market share! And it would've worked too, had it not been for you rotten kids!
Or, maybe, you're just an asshole fanboy that fights every person on these forums who has a problem with their phone because they have nothing better to do than play a written game of 'Defender'?
Watch it, now: those landers can appear out of thin air!
My house is gets marginal reception and the Vibrant was consistently getting no bars, whereas my old Treo had been generally getting one.
When I complained to T-Mobile they said they had seen such problems and that I should activate the SIM card that came with the phone rather than continue to use my old SIM card. They did that, and things improved slightly - still not as good as the Treo, but it is getting one bar now and then, whereas it never did before changing to the new SIM card. As far as 3G at home, thank god for Wifi!
When out and about, the bad spots are still bad spots, but generally I'm getting 3G most places I go.
Jon C said:
Sorry for the typo, I meant to hit "6" and was in a rush and didn't check before I posted. My average for the USB modem is 8 (indoors), and my brain was sleepy at the keyboard and autopilot failed me. The T-Mobile twitter account was posting about 9Mbps speeds here (in Seattle), and I was posting on somewhere else for that, making the point that we have amazing HSPA+ coverage in the city. Too much internet for this sleepy person. Been awake since 4AM. Forgive me, internet. I am only human.
Phone: 6Mbps (until handled by flesh)
USB Modem: 8 (always)
Also, the MyTouch 3G doesn't belong to me, so I can't really just take her home for the night to make pointless internet videos to please someone who identifies themselves as 'heygrl'. If you want to blow the lid off of this conspiracy, you can mail me a video camera, which I will ship back to you once the video is complete. But that would be crazy, no?
Oh, I can't maintain this web of lies any longer!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lots of fluff with no delivery..
I live in the best 3G coverage area in my city. I'm blanketed in T-Mo towers on every side. Inside my house, if I don't touch the phone, I pull down 5Mbps+, and Upload at ~2-3Mbps. It's fast enough to tether and use as my primary connection. Latency is ~35-50ms. I can stream Hulu with no hiccups.
However, if I so much as touch the back of the device with a single finger, the 3G drops until it reverts to EDGE. This is with a silicon case, and I can replicate it every time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because you don't have the means to get a video recorder, lets see some speedtest.net results showing your 3Mbps upload and ~35ms ping. I'll wait.
Anyone with half a brain can blow a hole through your "one finger, fully cased drop to EDGE" theory. Your flesh is NOT touching the phone itself, there is no way the phone can be affected by "One finger, in between silicone" theory.
Moreover, how are you doing this? On a glass table with the phone face down so you can see the bars drop as your finger touches the silicone case?
Maybe you've got the phone floating in mid air.
I just used PDAnet last night, when my cable modem died. This phone is really puzzling to me with 3G reception. One moment, I'll have phenomenal speeds (5Mbps down), the next moment, I'll be barely pushing EDGE.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did you just acquire that USB modem you have now?
Maybe you're just making it up as you go along. RETURN THE PHONE WHILE YOU STILL CAN.
Apparently, it has a CRIPPLING defect! One finger on the Vibrant encased with silicone (NOT a conductive material) will drop all 3G connectivity!
Why would you want to keep a phone that does this? Why do you still have a phone that behaves like this?
Especially since you proclaim it's not normal and not limited to just your Vibrant. "It's definitely a concern with this device"
I mean that myTouch 3G you barely have any access to doesn't display the same behavior!
Jon C said:
This locational stuff is driving me crazy. And it's the only complaint I really have about the device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
...Oops..
You're not terribly bright, I suppose...
So, I have the phone, flat on a surface (say, a table). I hit "begin test" and off go the horses!
I lift the phone, with a single finger touching the 'hump', and the ping doubles, and data speeds are halved (if not worse).
Speeds aren't as amazing tonight, but it's just as well. Enjoy.
Flat on table. No finger.
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Flat on table. A single finger lifting phone by the hump.
Don't ask me why the date isn't correct. It puzzles me as well.
Tests were performed minutes ago, in the exact same conditions, in the exact same spot. The only difference is that I touched the device during the second test.
Either way, you're still an asshole, and I'm still right. Conductive materials or not: it works every time.
Shall I provide more evidence for His Majesty, the Asshole? Or are we satisfied? Let me know.
Jon C said:
You're not terribly bright, I suppose...
So, I have the phone, flat on a surface (say, a table). I hit "begin test" and off go the horses!
I lift the phone, with a single finger touching the 'hump', and the ping doubles, and data speeds are halved (if not worse).
Speeds aren't as amazing tonight, but it's just as well. Enjoy.
Flat on table. No finger.
Flat on table. A single finger lifting phone by the hump.
Don't ask me why the date isn't correct. It puzzles me as well.
Tests were performed minutes ago, in the exact same conditions, in the exact same spot. The only difference is that I touched the device during the second test.
Either way, you're still an asshole, and I'm still right. Conductive materials or not: it works every time.
Shall I provide more evidence for His Majesty, the Asshole? Or are we satisfied? Let me know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not only is this completely UN replicable on MY Vibrant, where are the record breaking upload/ping results?
No ~3Mbps upload. No ~35MS ping. You're still on 3G in the second test, NOT on EDGE..
There are only a few things that could be happening here.
Your 3G signal is not as strong as you think it is(this is the case), I will bet you any amount of money that both of those tests we're performed on completely different towers, and I know you DON'T know which towers have HSPA+ and which don't. T-Mobile did not and has not upgraded each and every 3G tower to HSPA+. And last but not least, your phone is DEFECTIVE!
This antenna signal bar display problem just came up after the iPhone 4 fiasco LOL! I don't have any problem on mine. Keeps going strong! My iPhone 4 is collecting dust on my desk LOL!!!!!!!!!!
Yeah, we got lucky with this one, old chum! It usually drops below even that. You should see how much it degrades if it's held...*GASP*...in your palm! Oh my goodness! Such a concept! Holding a phone!
Like I said, but it bares repeating since you're hard of reading: speeds weren't stellar tonight. And hey, lookitthat! The date info is all whacky! Man, must be 'shopped! I can tell, because of the pixels!
Ping was a little higher than usual, and U/L wasn't as fast as it can be. Why? Don't know. Point still remains, and there's your proof of the problem. My old phone can't record video, but I can take a million photos for you, and make an animated .gif, just to be a ****.
I had this issue with the first Vibrant, and I have it with the second. Probably have it with the third.
Tell you what, though: I'll grab a third and report back. Maybe it is defective. Maybe there is a perfect Vibrant, like yours. But still, two 'defective' phones seems kind of unlikely. But we'll see! Oh, shall we ever see...
Cheers, old buddy.
P.S. I will drive to the actual tower and sit next to it, replicating this exact problem, if you'd like.
Jon C said:
Yeah, we got lucky with this one, old chum! It usually drops below even that. You should see how much it degrades if it's held...*GASP*...in your palm! Oh my goodness! Such a concept! Holding a phone!
Like I said, but it bares repeating since you're hard of reading: speeds weren't stellar tonight. And hey, lookitthat! The date info is all whacky! Man, must be 'shopped! I can tell, because of the pixels!
Ping was a little higher than usual, and U/L wasn't as fast as it can be. Why? Don't know. Point still remains, and there's your proof of the problem. My old phone can't record video, but I can take a million photos for you, and make an animated .gif, just to be a ****.
I had this issue with the first Vibrant, and I have it with the second. Probably have it with the third.
Tell you what, though: I'll grab a third and report back. Maybe it is defective. Maybe there is a perfect Vibrant, like yours. But still, two 'defective' phones seems kind of unlikely. But we'll see! Oh, shall we ever see...
Cheers, old buddy.
P.S. I will drive to the actual tower and sit next to it, replicating this exact problem, if you'd like.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your old phone can't record video? This is your first T-Mobile 3G phone and you've got no experience of your own prior?! Wow.. explains it all. You wouldn't be able to reproduce any speed drops next to a T-Mobile tower, no ma'am. Won't happen. There is no chance for the phone to switch to a neighboring cell site - without HSPA+ - to give you those non-HSPA+ speeds.
First of all you would have to verify that the tower is 3G is also upgraded to HSPA+ and then you would have to verify that it's the CID/tower for EVERY test. Your phone is switching between different towers. It's blantant
Do you just stay at home all day, writing "Stargate: Atlantis" fan fiction?
First off I'd like to say I'm thankful for everything the devs here do. I've tried the 3g fix and it didn't do anything, so now I'm just curious if there is anything else out there that fixes it.
I'm on the newest DL09 and the problem is still there. Bad reception. I'm serious when I say I get full 3g bars maybe 1% of the time, and I'm dead center in a verizon 3g area. I've never seen a signal jump around as much as on the fascinate. It will switch between 3g and 1x constantly throughout the day, and when it's on 3g it looks like the bars are dancing all day long because they just jump around.
My original Droid will have a steady 5 bars pretty much all day. Fascinate...not even close. It's getting ridiculous actually. I can download updates for apps on my droid no problem, but I actually wait til I get home on my wifi to download updates on my fascinate. I constantly get "stuck" loading a page on the net because of the ridiculous reception.
Now my question is...is there any fix out there that actually works that I might have skipped over? Good reception is a HUGE thing, especially when I'm dead center in a 3g area, and the fascinate doesn't have it. I'm thinking about selling it in the next few days because it's absolutely crazy.
People complain all day long about the GPS and no froyo...and I'm actually confused as to why many do not complain about the reception. That's the biggest issue with the phone IMO.
Thanks for any help.
Have you actually tried contacting Verizon about it? It sounds like you've got an antenna issue, which should be pretty easily addressed with a phone swap.
AlexDeGruven said:
Have you actually tried contacting Verizon about it? It sounds like you've got an antenna issue, which should be pretty easily addressed with a phone swap.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My friends has the same issue, and I've seen people complain about it before. So I think it's a fairly common issue.
brian85 said:
First off I'd like to say I'm thankful for everything the devs here do. I've tried the 3g fix and it didn't do anything, so now I'm just curious if there is anything else out there that fixes it.
..
Thanks for any help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm assuming you tried the reprogramming codes?
http://www.ehow.com/how_4532332_reprogram-verizon-phone.html
probably the 1st thing you tried, but just checking. I know for me, i went from being in the -102 range (1 bar) to -89 range (2 to 3) at work. Also at home i went from -92 to -51 (MAX)
You did option 2 correct?
Just did option 2 and it seems to have done nothing. Going back and forth between -96 and -101
If you dont see people compalining about reception, its largely due to the fact that the phone doesnt really suffer from reception issues. If I were you, I'd call verizon and make a formal complaint about the hardware restricting your usage, I'm sure they will work with you.
I'm a sales rep at a Verizon corporate store, 4 of my co-workers have Fascinates and we ALL experience a MAJOR difference in signal quality compared to co-workers with Droid X's and Droid 2's...
There's a five page thread on droidforums (fascinate section) about every single person in that thread having reception issues on the fascinate. And if you do a "fascinate reception issue" search on google, there are threads everywhere about that.
I just have a feeling everyone is focused on froyo and GPS so that's why reception isn't brought up much. I highly doubt, with as many people that have this problem, that it's just a problem on some of the galaxy s phones.
agreed bro i lose signal from my bars are really sporadic
BlackHoleSlam said:
agreed bro i lose signal from my bars are really sporadic
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah it's very frustrating.
What's even more frustrating is even when I get 4 full bars I only get -89 on the mobile signal widget..that's far from max reception.
I've never had reception problems per se but I have full bars and 73 dbm. Also for some reason my 3g download rate is nerfed. Earlier today on speed test got 63 kbps and 462 ping dunno why. Mostly hovers in the 300kbps range
Sent from my sch-i500 using dl09 supah clean
AlexDeGruven said:
Have you actually tried contacting Verizon about it? It sounds like you've got an antenna issue, which should be pretty easily addressed with a phone swap.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've had two phones now, and they both have very poor signal strength. Comparing my Fascinate to a friends Droid, sitting just a few inches apart, he had a dbm in the mid to high -70's, while mine was in the high -90's.
If you're in a solid coverage area, it gets fine reception and you're not likely to see the problem, but as you travel into a lower signal area, the Fascinate trails off very, very sharply. Even though I live in an area with supposedly blanket coverage, my house is towards the bottom of a small hill and I typically get zero or 1 bars on the display, every once in a while 2, but it'll drop back to 1 or 0 as soon as I pick the phone it.
The Fascinate does have a very week antennae design.
I rarely see 3 or 4 bars...come to think of it, I don't think i've ever seen 3 or 4 bars. This is when I'm in an area which should definitely have excellent coverage.
OP: do you have actual symptoms of poor signal like slow down/up load or dropped calls?
My speed tests when i have 1bar 3G are about 800Mbits up and 500Mbits down. Never dropped a call (rarely make calls, though). I have read that some folks suspect that the Fascinate has reporting issues? I don't know...but since I'm not seeing horrible speeds I've tried ignoring the fact that its always reporting 1-2 bars.
Kind of similar to the TWoS thing. I chased this one for a little bit too before dismissing it as a reporting issue (for now).
I originally was upset about the reception but came to realize that the office building I work in is built like a bunker. Other then when I am in the center of the building I get good reception, at my desk near a window I get 1-3 bars. However anytime other then when I am in this building I almost always have full bars.
However I have noticed that when I am in my office what ever bars I get my friends droid gets one more. But when it comes down to that it isn't Verizon...again the problem is with Samsung.
Hey guys,
what if I did option 1 instead of option 2 in *228 reprogramming?
On another note, my 3g indicator constantly disappears in verizon hotspot areas, it is really quite the annoyance.
Are you on a stock kernel?
Sent from my USCC SCH-I500..
Negative, I'm on Dl09 supah clean with adry's 12/30 test kernel.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
The reception for my Fascinate isn't spectacular. I don't know how it ranks among smart phones, but there is a definite difference between it and my chocolate 8550. In known holes in vzw's coverage I occasionally lose signal, but I don't use it as a phone enough to drop many calls.
However, I spend the majority of my time in strong signal environs, so it doesn't really come up as an issue for me, and I just accept it. It will be a decision factor for my next phone though.
Maybe others have a similar situation: worse yes, but liveable.
Swyped w/ XDA App. When in doubt, mumble.
I have noticed the signal over the past 24 hours has been jumping all over the place like Verizon may be running tests or something. The drop being very consistent intervals of no bars but still 3g.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
My brother has Fascinate as do I and out of the Box his got 2 more bars than mine and his almost always has more signal.
Remember this was before I started rooting and all that.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk