Related
Yep, I'm seriously thinking of selling my JAM on Ebay now so I can still get close to what I paid for it. I have spent far too long messing with this device to get it to do what it's suppossed to do. And I've spent far too much money purchasing software that should have been included with the JAM in the first place. (even the bloody 6315 came with a battery monitor)
I also think that this is not a problem with simply the Imate JAM.... it's a problem with all MS based PPC's. I'm more pissed off with the fact that Imate cannot provide adequate customer support for their devices. I think that similar to my 6315 (Which sucks as well) that there is not going to be a forthcoming patch or ROM that is actually going to make everything work. 1.3 mega pixel camera, my ***! The camera on the JAM can't take a decent picture to save it's life. The GPRS on the new ROM is useless. And in general, the JAM device is too quiet, unstable, and is made by a company who doesn't give a toss about its customers or it's products. (They don't even read their own forums to help out their customers).
I, like a lot of people, recently signed up for hosted MS exchange server to get push e-mail on the JAM. Well, it's nice when the GPRS works. What the hell is the point of having Push e-mail if the phone has to be reset to get a connection?
Am I going crazy here? I just want a device that is and does what it's meant to! -That's why it's so annoying, I can watch StarWars on my phone, but I can't check my e-mail or correctly type in a PIN code without errors......now that's ****ed up!!
I'm sure that there are people out there who are expriencing an amazing relationship with their PPC's -But am I wrong in thinking that we're all getting screwed by devices that are inherently flawed? If I bought a car, stereo, or TV that had this many problems I would have taken it back on the first day. Are we all being too accepting of our BETA projects. I'm getting tired of being the guinnee pig for these phone manufacturers who try to put their product on the market as fast as they can without fully testing them and then fail to provide adequate support for the fools who purchased them.
In my case, the JAM definitely meets my expectations and also exceeds them in many ways. To start with, it's been running stable since I installed the Qtek ROM ver 1.11 a couple of months ago. It never hangs and rarely requires a soft reset. I sometimes soft reset just to clear some memory.
It's a full featured PDA in the size of a mobile phone, which is exactly what I was after. The quality of the camera may not be that good, but 1.3 Megapixel is about the size of the picture not the quality. I had a Sony Ericsson P900 before the JAM and the quality of the camera was much worse.
From the software side of things, there's a lot of FREEWARE software available, including battetry monitors. The software available for the competition (i.e. Symbian), is far more limited!
In my opinion, the JAM was a good buy and as yet I don't think there's a replacement for it (convergence devices in a reasonable size!). I used to change my mobile phone every 4 to 6 months. But this time, I think I'll only replace the JAM with JAM2
Basically, you're right. I wouldn't sell the device though, because it delivers the most features from all mobile phones. You can have decent navigation, great games (TombRaider etc.), watch music, have a good music player and great other applications. It's like a PC and it's basically what i expected: You can watch movies but it doesn't ring reliably every morning. My PC does the same stuff, the same kind of problem - it's not mobile phone - just a small PC with a phone application.
I assure you that you won't find a phone with that amount of features that currently runs more stable than MS Phone Edition device. If you want stability - choose one of the old Nokias. They are stable, reliable, good phones - and extremely boring. If you want all features in your pocket - take the Magician. There just is no device with the best of both worlds! Get used to it.
By the way - the full featured (and not upgradeable) phones sold today are even worse with regards to their reliability and stability.
IMO hp dropped the ball with their h63xx, wanting to have the device out asap caused alot of troubles and angry customers.
--
Used to have the GPRS problem (Qtek 1.11WWE ROM) it's now gone (using i-mate 1.11WWE). The camera is still lousy (way worse than the Nokia's 1.3MP cameras) I think this is a hardware issue also (maybe they used cheaper sensors on it?).
--
as for i-mate's support it is one of the worst I've had the displeasure of going thru (or not going thru for that matter). I'm very thankful for communites that really fill the gap (i.e. this one!!!)
--
I'm happy with my JAM been using a PPC for almost 3 years I've accepted it's short comings as well as it's value... remember the i-mate JAM is a PocketPC first and a phone second. Sure there is alot of room for improvement in the platform especially the UI (it could be simpler and more one-handed friendly; MS says WM5.0 will address this but I think we'd have to wait for 6.0 or 7.0 to really have a refined OS). maybe it is time for you to explore another communication device. maybe a symbian s60 device which is a decent smartphone (used to own a Nokia 7610 and it was a pretty decent phone). i understand ur frustration and the best way to show it is with ur wallet. i'm sure you won't be buying an i-mate next time... hope u find a device that will suite ur needs. goodluck!
After The Upgrade
After the upgrade the camera is less grainy in flourescent situations, but more clear and sharp on outdoor shoots. I'm not going to sell this baby, looks are superb and hardware response is excellent just keep in mind to get a ultra fast SD card like what I did with my Sd which is a Kingston 512MB no delays no hangs and no need to soft reset.
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its on its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
I'm keeping mine. The 'faults' are mostly little niggling things that can usually be gotten round by various hacks/tweaks people have made. And yeah it's a bit big, but you do get used to it
Positives:
- It's like having a little laptop.
- Connectivity wise it truly has it all - 3G, WI-FI, BT, video calling, SDIO, IRDA, etc. No other device has all of this.
- The WM5 OS makes it very easy to write programs/hacks for, so we will see a lot of these over the coming months.
- The VGA screen has a massive "wow" factor!
- Mini-USB connector and charger are very convenient indeed.
- Full-size headphone/speaker socket.
- Built in terminal services client is VERY useful!
- Awesome little keyboard with very good looking backlights.
- Persistant flash-based storage.
- Battery life is very good, lasts for many days on one charge.
- 4 (FOUR) speakers, and 2 (TWO) cameras! Flash is a nice gimmick too.
Basically for me, the huge amount of positives outweigh the small amount of negatives. Best "phone" I have ever owned.
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
vapor said:
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bought it at Mad Monkey Boy's Gadgets for 930 USD [qtek 9000]...and 20 USD for shipping to her address...
That makes it a total of 950USD....in comparison to 1350 USD here in India!!!
San
@sl9, I can only manage one day of use from my Exec's battery. I have been very careful with it from new. My Nokia 9500 with similar use can give me twice the life of the Exec battery. With the Exec if you use BT and forget to shutdown PIE you could run out of battery while you think the unit is "off/standby".
dreamtheater39 said:
vapor said:
dreamtheater39 said:
NOT ME!
I'm yet to get my universal, its own its way
Whats worse, it'll take another 15 days...as my sister is getting it from USA for me...and i'll have to wait till she makes it
I was just freaked out by the number of ppl selling away their devices, and thought i'd just start a thread where all of them give their reasons here...so that we'd know if it was the memory problem, or battery life, or bulkiness or whatever maybe the reason....and will help others making a decision to buy it!
Also, if you're one of those hanging on to the device from a while, and feel that this is "the" device to own, then tell us why!
Keep it nice and concise, bullet points as much as possible for easy reading
S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on a side note,
how much is your sister gettin it for for you from the US? did she have to sign a line?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bought it at Mad Monkey Boy's Gadgets for 930 USD [qtek 9000]...and 20 USD for shipping to her address...
That makes it a total of 950USD....in comparison to 1350 USD here in India!!!
San
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wow thats crazy man. but thanks for the heads up
I echo everything sl9 has said. The most important positives for me are:
- persistent storage
- WM5 means I never have to use my stylus, except for 3rd-party apps that haven't caught up yet
- full keyboard makes SMS a breeze
- some very useful touches in the software, like the easy switch on/off of BT and WiFi using just a couple of keyboard presses
- flexible and automatic speaker usage depending on the machine's orientation
- the way the thing feels in your hands (cool/cold, solid, 'tight'): it's nice to hold
- the VGA screen for browsing, Excel, calendar, contacts, ListPro and Today screen (I'm in proper VGA mode)
- battery lasts days for me, but I'm probably a lighter user than y'all and now (because most are awful on WM5) have no 3rd-party apps except PocketZenPhone, TomTom and ListPro (per day: 8 hrs Bluetooth, 1 hr phone, 10 SMS, 1 hr general use, 30 mins WiFi browsing)
- stability: Haven't done a reset in a week or so. I never force-close apps, but rely on WM5 to handle it. I have no idea how much program memory I have free, and I don't care: it just works
- Microsoft's contacts app is very good for keyboard-only use: makes dialling a contact easy
- there are some neat improvements in the UI, such as the way BT comes on automatically when you choose 'ActiveSync over Bluetooth', and headset mode is always on automatically if BT is on and the machine has found your headset to pair with
Negatives for me:
- WiFi reception is very poor
- OEM-supplied voice dial is poor. I hate having to record voice tags, and it's not 100% reliable with detection. This could be my HBH-65 headset though. Sometimes the voice dial prompt cuts in when I'm trying to answer a call on the headset :evil:
- Microsoft's calendar app is very very weak, as is PocketIE, and PocketOutlook for emails
- the phone app should scale to VGA properly and it should have a built-in T9 contact finder (the O2-supplied 'Smart Dialler' doesn't take advantage of the hardware keyboard, so is pointless)
- speaking of which, O2's bundled software is pointless and unhelpful
Umm....
- oh yeah: the cameras are still very weak and useful only for taking emergency pictures, such as recording car accidents that you have and newsworthy moments
- the camera flash is useless as a camera flash, but very good as a torch, if only the machine had an easy way of using this feature
- the hardware application buttons aren't as programmable or flexible as they could/should be. I wish we could program each button through the OS for both Press and Press-'n-Hold
Of course a big negative ATM is the lack of 3rd-party apps that are truly compatible with WM5, but this is hardly the fault of HTC or the mobile operators.
So, the hardware is excellent (with the exception of the cameras and WiFi reception) but the OS-bundled software is flawed. Hopefully we'll get ROM updates that will improve things, just like we did for earlier HTC machines.
jah said:
@sl9, I can only manage one day of use from my Exec's battery. I have been very careful with it from new. My Nokia 9500 with similar use can give me twice the life of the Exec battery. With the Exec if you use BT and forget to shutdown PIE you could run out of battery while you think the unit is "off/standby".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then I would say your battery may be faulty. Do you have wi-fi on?
With bluetooth on permenantly, my MDA PRO lasts for 3~ days on one charge. Without bluetooth, it lasts for 4-5 days.
I'm a fairly light user though, 1 short voice call a day on average, although I do open it up and turn on the screen about 10 times a day to check for reminders, text, notes etc.
Perhaps you are a much heavier user of it than I am? Even so, battery life on your device does seem unusually short
@sl9,
Without BT I get 3.5 hours of use with a combination of eBooks, PIM, email & web browsing (50% using 3G). With BT on that reduces to 3 hours. I use my Nokia in a similar was as a phone, ebook reader, PDA, etc. This is my second Universal as I had a JJ before the Exec and the JJ's battery life was a little worst. This level of use is not unusual for a business user who also travels a lot.
SiliconS said:
I echo everything sl9 has said. The most important positives for me are:
- persistent storage
- WM5 means I never have to use my stylus, except for 3rd-party apps that haven't caught up yet
- full keyboard makes SMS a breeze
- some very useful touches in the software, like the easy switch on/off of BT and WiFi using just a couple of keyboard presses
- flexible and automatic speaker usage depending on the machine's orientation
- the way the thing feels in your hands (cool/cold, solid, 'tight'): it's nice to hold
- the VGA screen for browsing, Excel, calendar, contacts, ListPro and Today screen (I'm in proper VGA mode)
- battery lasts days for me, but I'm probably a lighter user than y'all and now (because most are awful on WM5) have no 3rd-party apps except PocketZenPhone, TomTom and ListPro (per day: 8 hrs Bluetooth, 1 hr phone, 10 SMS, 1 hr general use, 30 mins WiFi browsing)
- stability: Haven't done a reset in a week or so. I never force-close apps, but rely on WM5 to handle it. I have no idea how much program memory I have free, and I don't care: it just works
- Microsoft's contacts app is very good for keyboard-only use: makes dialling a contact easy
- there are some neat improvements in the UI, such as the way BT comes on automatically when you choose 'ActiveSync over Bluetooth', and headset mode is always on automatically if BT is on and the machine has found your headset to pair with
Negatives for me:
- WiFi reception is very poor
- OEM-supplied voice dial is poor. I hate having to record voice tags, and it's not 100% reliable with detection. This could be my HBH-65 headset though. Sometimes the voice dial prompt cuts in when I'm trying to answer a call on the headset :evil:
- Microsoft's calendar app is very very weak, as is PocketIE, and PocketOutlook for emails
- the phone app should scale to VGA properly and it should have a built-in T9 contact finder (the O2-supplied 'Smart Dialler' doesn't take advantage of the hardware keyboard, so is pointless)
- speaking of which, O2's bundled software is pointless and unhelpful
Umm....
- oh yeah: the cameras are still very weak and useful only for taking emergency pictures, such as recording car accidents that you have and newsworthy moments
- the camera flash is useless as a camera flash, but very good as a torch, if only the machine had an easy way of using this feature
- the hardware application buttons aren't as programmable or flexible as they could/should be. I wish we could program each button through the OS for both Press and Press-'n-Hold
Of course a big negative ATM is the lack of 3rd-party apps that are truly compatible with WM5, but this is hardly the fault of HTC or the mobile operators.
So, the hardware is excellent (with the exception of the cameras and WiFi reception) but the OS-bundled software is flawed. Hopefully we'll get ROM updates that will improve things, just like we did for earlier HTC machines.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
woah! your negatives sure scares the daylights out of me!
- bad wifi reception??? what seems to be the problem???! for me, this is going to be really important!
- bad camera quality? how bad is it??? I saw a few pictures taken from the universal on a couple review sites, and they looked pretty good! am i missing something? (damn i didnt play around enough with the camera when i had the device with me the last week )
S
Well, the WiFi is hard to measure, but the range is nowhere near as good as my HP laptop. I struggle to get a signal on my Exec if I'm not within about 4 metres of my Access Point in my house. (Standard modern house, thin internal wooden walls.) I can use my laptop anywhere in the house (up to 10 metres away) and in the garden too, but no chance with the Universal. I need to move the Access Point.
As for the camera, I guess it's subjective, but I wouldn't rely on it for decent photos. It's OK for times when you just have to record an image but you're not needing to print it out. Here's a comparison between my Universal and a 4 year-old 2 MPixel Canon Ixus300. Both photos without flash, because the Universal's flash has no effect on photos when the subject is more than a metre from the lens. Both photos are at 640x480 and at the same compression level (filesize 38KB). Neither camera is at its native resolution, to make it a realistic comparison.
Edit: moved photos to a new thread
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33960
Hmm. Not sure why they don't both appear as thumbnails. :roll:
Forgot to add: Universal was in 'Night' ambience mode.
Edit: Incidentally, when you take pictures at the Universal's native resolution (1280x1024) the quality is better, but the same problems are there: poor light sensitivity, poor light colouration, blurred focus, indistinct details etc.
It's better, but a long way from good.
And don't forget, the Canon camera is old now: 4 years. Just 2 MPixel - only twice that of the Universal.
Edit edit: Moved photos to a new thread so they don't break this one
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=33960
@SiliconS
thats a nice comparison shot! ( still wondering if you took them both with similar lighting conditions!!! )
i did read that the universal is fairly bad with "colors" as such....guess we have to live with it!
with the wifi range issue....gosh!! 4metres??? tell me your joking please!
S
dreamtheater39 said:
thats a nice comparison shot! ( still wondering if you took them both with similar lighting conditions!!! )
i did read that the universal is fairly bad with "colors" as such....guess we have to live with it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same room. Same lighting. Photos just one minute apart.
It's not really much better than my XDA2. Just bigger resolution. Low-light shots are really not its strong point though. Only by comparison can you see how bad it really is.
dreamtheater39 said:
with the wifi range issue....gosh!! 4metres??? tell me your joking please!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry - I'm serious. Maybe others can confirm, or tell me that mine is worse than theirs. It's hard to measure objectively though.
You have to be kidding about the 4m WiFi range. I have the router placed in my bedroom and i can actually connect 2 rooms away which are in serial. Oh and there are 2 concrete walls in between.
I still get 2 bars inspite of all this. If you call this weak, then i dont know what to say.
Regarding the camera, its oodles better than the xda2 or the xda2s. It is also much better than the JAM, but then again these are not very good standards to compare to. Yes, it is not as good as Nokia or SE but if the camera is the reason one decides not to buy this device, then this device is clearly not for you.
Yeah, the camera sucks. Who cares? The rest of what's on the Uni - the critical stuff - works great. Quality in a cell phone camera is few years off ...
universaldoc said:
You have to be kidding about the 4m WiFi range. I have the router placed in my bedroom and i can actually connect 2 rooms away which are in serial. Oh and there are 2 concrete walls in between.
I still get 2 bars inspite of all this. If you call this weak, then i dont know what to say.
Regarding the camera, its oodles better than the xda2 or the xda2s. It is also much better than the JAM, but then again these are not very good standards to compare to. Yes, it is not as good as Nokia or SE but if the camera is the reason one decides not to buy this device, then this device is clearly not for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi universaldoc!
i currently have an xda2 running on wm5! So when i junk my device and buy a new one, i'd first of all see what are the pluses i get by making such a decision.....
heres what i can count -
1. Awesome keyboard (i really love it!)
2. VGA screen (finally!)
3. Built in Wifi
4. Better Camera
5. 3G support (currently useless to me....but its still good!)
6. The cool factor???
7. 10MB more device root space??
8. I'm running out of points!!!
Having said that....I still have bought my universal (but i'm waiting for it get here :evil: ) only because, i'm a god damned gadget freak and wouldnt mind trading away my spare kidney for one!
I'm just reconfirming my buy....the "reality hits" phase....you know???!!
San
I totally agree with all the positives already mentioned. As far as negatives are concerned, I have none. I love my O2 XDA Exec!
One point I'd like to mention though. My XDA Exec has GREAT WiFi. When I was setting-up my MSN Messenger, my Exec detected 4 different access points including my own. I happen to notice my neighbors' access point which I helped her setup included in the list. Now, she lives about 3 apartments down, so you can just imagine the lenght and obstacles my Exec has to traverse.
I don't have wi-fi yet though hoping to get it sorted in the next month or so. Though on the odd occasion I've switched the Exec's on, I've picked up stuff that must be about 30 - 40 metres away. I know for sure I picked up my cousin's network from around 20 metres outside his house the other week - and he lives in a converted barn with thick interior / exterior walls!
Regarding everyone else's positives and negatives, I agree with most. The camera is a LOT better, and is better than the 2.0MP one we had up to a few months ago. However, it's certainly not the main reason for buying a phone and certainly not in a feature-rich device such as the Exec. The pose factor alone is worth it, especially when sat in laptop mode in the car :wink:
It's 3G. It's an awesome looking bit of kit. One or two niggles in the software that will be ironed out. It's inspired 3 of my colleagues and bosses at work to get one. Less kit to carry around between home and work (no cradle, just a lead). VGA screen - which I STILL look at in awe sometimes. I didn't think I'd get to like landscape mode, but now I LOVE it.
Best XDA by far for me, and I've had most :wink:
Cheers
Ant
if else is positive, the main negative would be the response to incoming phone calls especially thru BT headset :evil: ... you would be lucky to take it from the 1st time ... usually it takes 2-3 sec which is more than enough for the caller to hang up :evil:
Believe it or not ... I use the Universal now only for data activities (e-mail, net, ...) and I have to carry my old i-mate for phone things ... nice scene ... huh ? :x
I can't wait to see a real update for the Radio ROM
ohh ... and a one hell missing feature ... a secondary LCD on the cover to avoid opening the screen just to see who's calling ... a very simple idea you find on almost all flapping mobile phones!!!!
I am considering purchasing the Atom as a replacement for my much-loved XDA2. However, several reviews and user comments in other forums have indicated that the Atom suffers from:
1) Poor quality construction- Cheesy plastic case
2) Buggy/Slow WM5 OS
3) Poor camera
What about the experience here? Do you all agree with the comments above? Would you recommend Atom as a replacement for the XDA2, or another device? Thanks
Someone has already asked this question, see my response.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=50054&highlight=
and
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=49399&highlight=
Bad Buzz Responses
Thanks, Experimenter for your post, but no one has addressed the issues I raised except to say that they love the device. Many more reviews say exactly the opposite....... my favorite "looks good, works bad". Can the users in this forum polear give me some advice on this? Thanks
Here's my 2cents opinion
Hi Pharmer,
Well let me address the issues u raised :
1) Poor quality construction- Cheesy plastic case
2) Buggy/Slow WM5 OS
3) Poor camera
Its hard to answer your questions simply because it can be quite subjective.
Best is for u to walk into a shop and handle one yourself, then you can decide on 1) ... try out the camera and decide on 3)
Some ppl complain that the black makes fingerprint smudges obvious ... but really, my peeve, which applies to almost all PDA phones, is when u hold it to your ear to make calls you'll get a greasy touch screen.
I use a casing to protect the screen.
As for your point #2 I've not had problems after the ROM upgrades ... then again, just like a PC, it really depends on what you install into the handheld. Lots of times its the quality of the additional software u install, or if u install and uninstall lots of stuff to try em out.
Software I currently use :
TCPMP to watch movies and listen to MP3 using STEREO bluetooth
HICALC calculator
Resco Explorer and Registry Editor
Pocket Informant
O2 Plus
Not had any problems using my Atom with all these loaded. In fact, I'm extremely pleased with my Atom right now.
As for the camera, yes it has been pretty poor (by my standards for a 2MP) but seems to have improved with each ROM upgrade. Seems to take pretty decent pictures now. I have found you get best results outdoors on a bright day and indoors don't do as well.
well end of the day I can only say that if you are looking for perfection then it'll be a long wait ... every device will have its flaws ...
I made my purchasing decision based on :
1. Decided on Atom's slower wireless 'B' instead of other devices which had faster 'G' as I don't expect to be doin major surfing on a tiny device ... just needed the connectivity for email and occasional browsing if a PC is not available. What is important is at least WPA support which the Atom has. Even the 'B' is faster than my broadband access and I transfer files via active sync or using a card reader so wireless speed not an issue there.
2. Selected the Atom because of the STEREO bluetooth which allows me to watch movies and listen to MP3 in full stereo ... This feature has not been available on most other devices until recently I think.
3. Sleek and small size. Not too clunky, but some ppl prefer a keyboard for SMS so I suppose it may not be for everyone.
Atom Qualities
Hi, Experimenter- Thanks for your reply. As to why I don't just go look at one in a store, you might be interested to know that the US carriers generally do not carry these phones. As far as I am aware, no US carrier has the Atom. In the US, we usually purchase them unseen (except for pictures) from websites. Even T-Mobile US doesn't carry the phones the T-Mobile in Europe carries. As for any carrier-based service- for the phone, forget it.
Anyway, sorry for the rant, but that's why we depend on people like yourself to give honest opinions before we buy. The pictures of the Atom look pretty good, but the majority of the revierws have been bad suggesting that perhaps this is a phone that needs some improvement. My second choice is the 128mb Jam(charcoal). Looks like a similar phone to the Atom but with WM2003se instead of WM5. All the reviews on WM5 indicate that this os needs a little improvement too.
Finally, your comment that none of these phones are perfect is true and I'm certainly not looking for perfection. My MDA2 is still pretty good and perhaps its not time yet to upgrade.
atom's camera
hi experimenter i would like to inquire about the atom's camera in the latest official rom.. how many seconds does it take the atom to load the cam? and how long does it take to save pics shot? thanks dude.
about the overall performance, would you give a rough percentage of its increased speed performance compared to the previous rom (it's ok if it's your opinion). thank you very much
Re: Atom Qualities
Hi
Giving my 3 copper coins worth on ATOM too, since I am a user since last December 2005. I've been carrying other larger and powerful XDA devices before this, so I think the ATOM has it's hits and misses. IMHO, the usual benchmark on buying an ATOM is based on 2 very important criteria:
(a) Are you a COOL GADGET person?
(b) Are you tech-savvy and able to tinkle a bit on the the WM2005 registry?
I am not sure about the specs of the alternate JAM devices you have mentioned, but I reckon the hardware specs should be similar to ATOM except for the cover design and the OS.
WM2003SE is in the market longer, and there are better support of software. But that will means that it is possible for ATOM to downgrade to WM2003SE as well?
Very few pple however, will do that. WM2005 is here to stay, but as with everything M$, gave every1 more time to tweak the bugs.
I've been buying HTC devices every year since the very first XDA came out. It seems to get harder each year to choose a device as more choice becomes available. I don't think the Athena was out last year (or only just out and a bit out of my price range) so it wasn't really a consideration.
Anyway I went for an Orbit/Armatis which I've really enjoyed, it has just about everything I need. Perhaps the only improvements I would make is 3G, VGA, more memory, faster processor and I do like the sound of the tv-out. So sounds like the Athena is still on the cards.
I'm just a bit worried I've missed the boat. What I mean is, is it a bit outdated now? Will they bring out a smaller/lighter version soon?
Other questions you could answer for me are as follows..
How have you all coped with the size?
For those of you using them as phone (rather than a umpc) how have they stood upto being in your pocket (without the case/keyboard)
I've heard they're not too good playing Divx movies (700mb variety). Is this true. Will the Roms available here correct this?
Any more advice great fully received.
Many thanks
DannyBoy
Now is good many peoploe are looking for something new Umpc's, Asus eee or shift type things and a few going on ebay mine will be gone soon i expect but its a great device if ur using as a phone a lot get a good BT headset like LG Style-i
Id recommend it, as long as you wanted a mini-pc, rather than a phone. The internet features, harddisk, screen, and connectivity options really tick all the boxes, and the enhanced roms really improve the product.
If you want to use it as a phone, be prepared to use a BT headset or the wired option, or the speakerphone. I can't fault it on sound quality, but if you're a pub regular, you'll feel like a bit of a tit having it on your belt or in your pocket. Either that, or face swapping your sim out to another more portable phone. Luckily I've got a work mobile as well, so I can take that out with me.
The TV out is pretty good as is the VGA, provided you're not putting it on too large a screen (only 640x480 res). But is ok on my work monitor, watching last nights telly programme that I missed, or a film. One thing to be wary of, is that you MUST run the movies off the Microdrive (or memory). If you try and play it off a USB keyfob, its just too slow to support it. MP3's are ok (although can take a fair few seconds to load).
All in all, it comes down to if you want a mini-pc, or a phone with PDA functionality.
the size took quite a bit of getting used to but once u get the feel of its awsome w/the 5" touch screen.i use my jabra bt8010 and its probably the best bluetooth stereo headset for the athena coz its got a caller ID and vibrate.i usually keep the athena in a pouch or in my pocket.i dont use the case since it makes it fatter and kind of akward to hold.playing divx,xvid,flv..etc videos are great on the athena.there are specific settings to be made in TCPMP and once they are set ur good to go.ive never had any problems playing videos after making the settings.just make sure u go look for a demo or someone with on and test it out for a while and try to get a feel for it.hope this helps
If you're mainly looking for a phone, I suggest you look elsewhere. But if you want internet on the move, this is just about the only device in the market currently. The smaller screens may be VGA, but the're too small to run REALVGA program. REALVGA is one of the greatest improvements to WM6's useability. If I have access to a notebook, I would of course prefer to use that to surf internet. But on the road, do I want to carry a ASUS eee with me just to surf internet or would I prefer to just carry an Athena? The answer is clearly Athena. But please don't expect the speed and functionality of a full web browser like some do.
Besides the large VGA screen, the presence of harddisk AND MicroSDHC is also brings about benefits that no other devices AFAIK can offer. By installing all your programs in the Microdrive, you give yourself the ability to swap the MicroSDHC (currently 8GB each max) in and out. I place all my musics, pictures, and videos on MicroSDHC. This means I have UNLIMITED storage capacity. Currently I have close to 80 applications on my microdrive, and uses less than 10% of microdrive's capacity.
GPS works great on screen of this size, although it looks good enough on smaller screen.
Another application of mine that works great on this 5 inch screen is Meta Trader 4, which displays chart of shares, currencies, commodities. The ability to know what's happening to your investments anywhere anytime is just fantastic.
Carrying it around has not been an issue for me. I have a home made belt pouch with velcro flap. I carry the device without keyboard, as a software keyboard called Tengo is far better than the hardware keyboard anyway.
I don't have any issue using the phone even without bluetooth headset, but others prefer to use it with one. Someone just posted a wristwatch styled headset which should complement this device perfectly. Google "bluevision watch" and you will be able to read more about this.
I don't have any issue with playing videos. It looks excellent from my perspective (always smooth and clear), although some think that it is crap, something I could never never understand. I don't compare that with my home theatre system's quality.
Next comes the camera. Its quality under bright daylight is excellent, but in indoor situation it is a bit lacking.
MP3 plays very very well on this device. Battery life is reasonably long. Depending on the use, about a quarter of people polled in another thread run it down in less than one day, a quarter in one day, a quarter in two days.. something like that.
In summary, this is the best convergent device in the market with the most ideal size imaginable. HTC SHIFT has got the size completely wrong IMHO. It is too big to be carried around 24/7 whereas Athea is not.
I've been a very very satisfied owner for about 9 months now. If I lost it today, my next phone is still going to be Athena, of course, unless they come up with a skinnier and lighter version, with FM radio, TV tuner, and infra, without reducing the size of the screen.
Thankyou for giving such detailed opinions guys. It is much appreciated.
I think i'll get one but probably second hand rather than start a new contract.
Looking forward to playing with the Rom's in here. they look great.
The athena is a cracking device, but for me it was a case of it falling between two devices and not doing either as well as they could be done.
too small to be a laptop and too big to be fone
so i have gone down the separate small fone and small laptop route.
i found after a while the phone function just became a pain in the bum and i actually wanted XP and not WM6 functionality
spacecat said:
The athena is a cracking device, but for me it was a case of it falling between two devices and not doing either as well as they could be done.
too small to be a laptop and too big to be fone
so i have gone down the separate small fone and small laptop route.
i found after a while the phone function just became a pain in the bum and i actually wanted XP and not WM6 functionality
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And I'm the opposite - I want a machine for instant email access and web access with GPS etc which I can carry. I ahve a computer at work and at home.
The truth is, I'm afraid, you're going to have to make up your own mind! It is a big device but very usable (especially with a bluetooth headset). Everyone has their own opinion of it / uses for it but they may not match yours.
if you use the GPS function in a car its a no brainer, as its nearly as a cheap as a decent satnav and can do a lot more.
otherwise ..like he said
spacecat said:
if you use the GPS function in a car its a no brainer, as its nearly as a cheap as a decent satnav and can do a lot more.
otherwise ..like he said
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GPS in a car does not meet my need. Only a mobile one allows me to find direction after parking my car. You don't have to drive to enjoy the benefits. I use it to find points of interest such as restaurants . I use it while walking downtown to get to unfamiliar places rather than carrying a heavy streets directory.
Only a mobile one lets me play golf with a golf GPS software, telling me how far I'm from water hazards, from green, from trees, etc.
Only mobile GPS allows me to bring it overseas.
Also, after trying out a few 'dedicated' GPS, they are just inferior to mobile ones in terms of functionality.
Sure you can tell me that there are dedicated mobile GPS around which can satisfy my needs. But how many devices do you want to carry? For me, I want to take with me only one convergent device. I don't want a dedicated phone, another dedicated GPS, another dedicated web surfing subnotebook, another dedicated mp3 player, another camera, another video recorder. I'm sure there are people who fervently wants the best equipment dedicated to every single task, but that's their choice. I'm very happy to have made the Athena choice and sticking with it until a better convergent device comes along.
eaglesteve said:
GPS in a car does not meet my need. Only a mobile one allows me to find direction after parking my car. You don't have to drive to enjoy the benefits. I use it to find points of interest such as restaurants . I use it while walking downtown to get to unfamiliar places rather than carrying a heavy streets directory.
Only a mobile one lets me play golf with a golf GPS software, telling me how far I'm from water hazards, from green, from trees, etc.
Only mobile GPS allows me to bring it overseas.
Also, after trying out a few 'dedicated' GPS, they are just inferior to mobile ones in terms of functionality.
Sure you can tell me that there are dedicated mobile GPS around which can satisfy my needs. But how many devices do you want to carry? For me, I want to take with me only one convergent device. I don't want a dedicated phone, another dedicated GPS, another dedicated web surfing subnotebook, another dedicated mp3 player, another camera, another video recorder. I'm sure there are people who fervently wants the best equipment dedicated to every single task, but that's their choice. I'm very happy to have made the Athena choice and sticking with it until a better convergent device comes along.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
? im referrering to the GPS system in the Athena
Let's not forget I've had it built into a device literally half the size of the Athena for a year so its not really a selling point for the Athena.
Have you seen this? ...7501!
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3153290&Sku=H224-1010
As an ex Clie pda user, I have ditched the little keyboard and use the WM6 version of graffiti text input, and have never looked back at the keyboard again. With the supplied leather case, it improves portability so much it can fit into the back of my jeans pocket.
Haven't loaded gps, but will in the coming year.
A must is the Jabra bt8010 for stereo bluetooth, and phone use, so you don't have to pull out the athena everytime. Otherwise you are using the speaker phone to talk to people, not the best.
I would have to say, if you want the screen size, the Athena is hard to beat when you look at the spec sheet. Most UMPC's don't have a cell phone built in. Most cell phones don't have a big screen that give you pda functionality.
I would say the only other alternatives is the HTC Touch, if you can live with the smaller screen size.
My only gripes on the Athena:
Video performance @30fps is BAD
Occasional A2DP stereo bluetooth skips, A2DP is so good I would never use an iPhone or iPod or any phone without it again!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
If they come out with an Athena2, this is what I would like to see:
Solid State Hard Disc of at least 32GB
Solid video performance
Drop the keyboard - it scared away a lot of people with the gimmicky magnet attachment and small useless size.
To sum up, if you like the large screen of the PDA's (480x320), and love pda functionality, then you will like the Athena. It lets me carry only one device.
DON'T FORGET THAT THE CES SHOW IS ONLY A MONTH AWAY, there could be a new device that manages to top the Athena there, lets hope it is the Athena 2!
keithwwalker said:
As an ex Clie pda user, I have ditched the little keyboard and use the WM6 version of graffiti text input, and have never looked back at the keyboard again. With the supplied leather case, it improves portability so much it can fit into the back of my jeans pocket.
Haven't loaded gps, but will in the coming year.
A must is the Jabra bt8010 for stereo bluetooth, and phone use, so you don't have to pull out the athena everytime. Otherwise you are using the speaker phone to talk to people, not the best.
I would have to say, if you want the screen size, the Athena is hard to beat when you look at the spec sheet. Most UMPC's don't have a cell phone built in. Most cell phones don't have a big screen that give you pda functionality.
I would say the only other alternatives is the HTC Touch, if you can live with the smaller screen size.
My only gripes on the Athena:
Video performance @30fps is BAD
Occasional A2DP stereo bluetooth skips, A2DP is so good I would never use an iPhone or iPod or any phone without it again!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
If they come out with an Athena2, this is what I would like to see:
Solid State Hard Disc of at least 32GB
Solid video performance
Drop the keyboard - it scared away a lot of people with the gimmicky magnet attachment and small useless size.
To sum up, if you like the large screen of the PDA's (480x320), and love pda functionality, then you will like the Athena. It lets me carry only one device.
DON'T FORGET THAT THE CES SHOW IS ONLY A MONTH AWAY, there could be a new device that manages to top the Athena there, lets hope it is the Athena 2!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with your wishlist. I'd add to that TV tuner, FM radio, infra. Would also be nice to shed some weight and thickness.
I hope there is an Athena 2 soon. This is a wonderful size for a convergent device.
Just a reiteration here, but it is about personal preference. I tried to get along with the athena with pks rom, and although it was noticeably better than before it still didn't quite do it for me. I had constant complaints about the quality of voice calls using the speaker phone, and although a bluetooth headset worked fine, for me it still wasn't as practical as i would've liked. I went back yesterday to an n95, and bought a nokia n800 for portable browsing and email (although the n95 is more than capable here anyway). The two combined cost me about the price of an athena, and for my personal needs they work together to give a superior experience. The n95s gps locks on much quicker than the athena's so is in many ways a more practical device to use for personal navigation - especially with google maps' integration of the internal gps. The browser on the n95 is also better than pocket internet explorer, but when required i have the unbeatable os2008 browser to hand with the n800. Nokia have also just released a firmware update for the n95 which makes everything snappy and enjoyable - how it should have been all along really! The only thing i really miss about the athena is texting on a big screen. For some reason i really enjoyed that. The wmwifirouter app was useful too, though that's not exclusive to the athena. I think among the current fold of handsets the only thing that sets the athena apart is the screen size. There is nothing else on the device that can't be seen elsewhere. It just didn't cut the mustard for me as i had to persevere too much and it was a little embarrassing to use, but as they say - each to their own. One final point i will make is that i DON'T THINK the athena is a good convergence device. It provides no more than a big screen. Video performance is often shoddy, browsing does not offer full internet, the camera is pretty crap and usb host is only really of use for hid and playing music\photos. Aside from the large screen, usb host and touchscreen the n95 8gb offers: better multimedia playback (multi codec with coreplayer), a far superior camera, with shockingly better video recording functionality, integrated gps which locks on quicker than the athena and a quicker browser which allows effortless access to all but flash sites (soon to be remedied. With flash lite 3.0).. If the athena is a convergance device then the n95 8gb is just as good, particularly given it's size. You can even use a bluetooth keyboard with it. P.s. I typed all this on an n95 and it was a piece of cake!.
leoni1980 said:
Just a reiteration here, but it is about personal preference. I tried to get along with the athena with pks rom, and although it was noticeably better than before it still didn't quite do it for me. I had constant complaints about the quality of voice calls using the speaker phone, and although a bluetooth headset worked fine, for me it still wasn't as practical as i would've liked. I went back yesterday to an n95, and bought a nokia n800 for portable browsing and email (although the n95 is more than capable here anyway). The two combined cost me about the price of an athena, and for my personal needs they work together to give a superior experience. The n95s gps locks on much quicker than the athena's so is in many ways a more practical device to use for personal navigation - especially with google maps' integration of the internal gps. The browser on the n95 is also better than pocket internet explorer, but when required i have the unbeatable os2008 browser to hand with the n800. Nokia have also just released a firmware update for the n95 which makes everything snappy and enjoyable - how it should have been all along really! The only thing i really miss about the athena is texting on a big screen. For some reason i really enjoyed that. The wmwifirouter app was useful too, though that's not exclusive to the athena. I think among the current fold of handsets the only thing that sets the athena apart is the screen size. There is nothing else on the device that can't be seen elsewhere. It just didn't cut the mustard for me as i had to persevere too much and it was a little embarrassing to use, but as they say - each to their own. One final point i will make is that i DON'T THINK the athena is a good convergence device. It provides no more than a big screen. Video performance is often shoddy, browsing does not offer full internet, the camera is pretty crap and usb host is only really of use for hid and playing music\photos. Aside from the large screen, usb host and touchscreen the n95 8gb offers: better multimedia playback (multi codec with coreplayer), a far superior camera, with shockingly better video recording functionality, integrated gps which locks on quicker than the athena and a quicker browser which allows effortless access to all but flash sites (soon to be remedied. With flash lite 3.0).. If the athena is a convergance device then the n95 8gb is just as good, particularly given it's size. You can even use a bluetooth keyboard with it. P.s. I typed all this on an n95 and it was a piece of cake!.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, I disagree that web browsing and emailing experience is even practical at all with N95. The device is just too tiny for such purposes. I went to the shop and asked the assistant to demo it. It is way way too slow for once. The screen shows a small portion of that Athena would have shown. The input with the keypad is completely unacceptable and unpleasant.
I hate to say this, while I understand your desire to find a better browser and email client on Athena, I don't think N95 is a better one.
eaglesteve said:
Sorry, I disagree that web browsing and emailing experience is even practical at all with N95. The device is just too tiny for such purposes. I went to the shop and asked the assistant to demo it. It is way way too slow for once. The screen shows a small portion of that Athena would have shown. The input with the keypad is completely unacceptable and unpleasant.
I hate to say this, while I understand your desire to find a better browser and email client on Athena, I don't think N95 is a better one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think that was too polite.
Leoni, you can't seriously be suggesting that a buggy S60 phone with a tiny screen and a gimmicky media player is even close to the Athena. My other half has an N95 and even she (a gadget hater!) thinks it is a dysfunctional version of the Iphone (now that is quite an insult, coming from her!). The only good think about it is the camera.
Leoni is right, it is about personal preference. But iof you want decent browsing, decent email, decent screen size, decent satnav, the N95 is most certainly not the way to go. Sorry.
a viewty and an EEE pc thats the way to do it
spacecat said:
a viewty and an EEE pc thats the way to do it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
my brother just got the viewty, nice camera but the rest sucks lol
As stated in the thread title, I am seriously considering returning my HTC Touch HD2, because I find it almost completely unusable compared to the iphone that I owned previously.
Pros
- Amazing screen
- Everything else that has been highlighted in all the positive reviews that persuaded me to buy the device in the first place (spec, camera, connectivity etc.)
Cons:
- Touchscreen keyboard is unusable and not accurate, even after calibaration (compared to an iphone)
- Web browsing using Opera is frustrating due to the unreliable touchscreen - I find it impossible to click on links; particularly on sites such as this one (with small page numbers etc.) - even when I zoom right in I still can't click the link - there is a huge delay before anything happens, without any feedback to show the link has been clicked - this stuff just worked on the iphone, depsite the smaller screen
- Random app switching, erratic behaviour (screen moving on its own) and regular freezes in all modes/apps
For those who think I am some kind of Apple fan-boy, that couldn't be further from the truth - my iphone developed a dead strip of icons, which forced me to sell it for peanuts, so I vowed to never buy another! The truth of the matter is that the UI of the HD2 just isn't in the same league as the iphone - it's just a cheap imitation.
Maybe if it had Android instead of WM it would stand a chance, but as things currently stand, I find the HD2 completely unusable and will probably be returning it on Monday and getting an iphone, assuming I can persuade Mobile Phones Direct to adhere to the distance selling regulations that provide a 7 day cooling off period (according to their T&C's this only stands if the box is unopened, which is wrong)
Please note that I am posting this for the benefit of others, to provide my personal feedback after using the phone for the last few days. If anyone has any suggestions for how to rectify the problems noted above, I will happily try them.
Catman
I feel your pain...
Hi,
I know how you feel - I've only had it a day and i'm already getting that dreaded feeling! On the plus side I'm delighted to be away from that Stalin 'Jobsie' and his locked down iPhones - on the down side this HD2 is about as user friendly as the space shuttle compared to the jesus phone, and I sued to be so impressed with the iPaq from 6 years ago!!
I do think that I can live with it - just it's not going to be the long winded love affair type relationship - more the 'throwing at the wall' one minute, loving it the next!
Luckily, mines through o2 so i'm going to run with it for 10 days and see how we get along - if all else fails then there's always the 3GS to fall back onto. Although I wasn't for Android on this handset to begin with - from where i'm sitting now it does make more sense!
Good luck figuring it all out!
Look here :http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=583638
For some handy tweaks including, haptic feedback in Opera and the abiltiy to click links without zooming in!!!
But I do feel your pain, a little let down with the OS on this phone, everything else is excellent..... build quality, screen, asthetics, CPU, RAM, etc.. Just the OS is a pile of poo! lol
The truth of the matter is that the UI of the HD2 just isn't in the same league as the iphone - it's just a cheap imitation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks a lot. You just proof yourself wrong ^^. Whether its better or worse is another question, but imitation? You mean the shortcuts on home screen? You're just *****in'. Pls close this thread we dont need that destructive posts.
Advice: Sell the HD2 and dont complain. I can click even the small ugly boxes in Windows Mobile itself. I dont know how long you've tried to click somethin', but if you really feel that it is impossible for you go back to resistive screen, on the Touch HD it wasnt that bad IMO.
NetDwarf said:
Thanks a lot. You just proof yourself wrong ^^. Whether its better or worse is another question, but imitation? You mean the shortcuts on home screen? You're just *****in'. Pls close this thread we dont need that destructive posts.
Advice: Sell the HD2 and dont complain. I can click even the small ugly boxes in Windows Mobile itself. I dont know how long you've tried to click somethin', but if you really feel that it is impossible for you go back to resistive screen, on the Touch HD it wasnt that bad IMO.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Everyone's entitled to their own opinion...even one sided twerps like you.
It's kinda strange for me to read your feedback, I had chance to play with the test version of the HD2 and things worked pretty well, most of your "cons" I could not find on my preliminary experience!?
Catman3146 said:
assuming I can persuade Mobile Phones Direct to adhere to the distance selling regulations that provide a 7 day cooling off period
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
(hollow laugh)
Good luck with that.
I hear you man. I have the same considerations..
I don't have freezes or random app switching though. and I don't really care about the UI since I use spb mobile shell which runs excellent and so god damn fast on this thing.
but the screen is a problem when browsing. it's not accurate enough for my taste. and using the keyboard is also more cumbersome than on my Topaz...
it really is a beautiful and fast device. sometimes it feels like using a computer more than a phone and that's pretty cool too.
I'm still thinking...
Your poor experience seems to be the result of a faulty handset. For the first 4 days of receiving my HD2, the phone's touchscreen kept making its own decisions, even when left idling on the desk. The touchscreen registered wrong inputs and I had the same impressions of the phone as you have now. It was the final straw when the phone just kept registering the 2 option in Phone mode and refused to stop until I hit the soft reset button.
I took it down to the shop I bought the phone from, had it exchanged after explaining the situation (it did take a threat of wanting a full refund when they initially refused to classify the phone as faulty) and the replaced new handset is a complete different phone to the first one I had, the touchscreen does what suppose to do!
Before throwing all hopes away on the HD2, trying getting it replaced first. It is a genuinely good product, it's a shame that quality control has let some of us down.
Your experience with Opera should be resolved by Karlos G's link.
[EDIT] My phone was also purchased from Mobile Phones Direct. They are rather poor when it comes to refund and exchanges, trying to make up excuses as to why you cannot refund or exchange the phone (lies, lies and more lies... just don't go with the flow). State your case and don't let them push you around.
I guess your are one of the unlucky people to get a "monday"-device. mine has none of the problems you have. my screen is accurate, opera is sometimes picky when you don't zoom in, and I have never experienced any erratic behaviour. the only problem I can recall is the camera issue (pink teint).
I applied Karlo G's link but I still have problems clicking links when zoomed out. maybe I have to get more accurate I'm still getting used to a capacitive screen.
chronicle said:
Everyone's entitled to their own opinion...even one sided twerps like you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think NetDwarf has a point... an imitation? Hello? on the iphone you've got hundrets of icons and THAT'S IT!... but this beautiful Sense UI. an Imitation? omg
I agree about the keyboard. I don't understand why they couldn't just have made it the same as the one on the Hero, which is excellent.
Maybe in the next software update they will sort the problem. I have tried some other keyboards and they are even worse than the stock one IMHO, so I'm starting to think it's partly to do with the screen sensitivity. I have tried the sensitivity tweak .cab which purports to help the issue but still it frustrates me.
The word prediction algorithms on the iPhone are infinitely superior, and the screen sensitivity is balanced just right. I have both phones in front of me right now and so have a good balanced perspective on this issue.
Here's my opinion on what is better and what is worse of the two based on a year's ownership of an iPhone and a week's ownership of the HD2 (just based on my USAGE, not pure spec!)
iPhone 3G Pros
More balanced screen sensitivity compared to the HD2 - fewer mistakes with the keyboard or onscreen selections.
More efficient and reliable browsing experience
Transflective screen.
Built in podcatching client. I'm yet to find one to compare with iTunes on the iPhone, although Google Listen comes close on Android. Hopefully they will port it to Windows Mobile soon. iTunes finds even the most obscure Podcasts, most other podcatchers require going online to find feeds that are not well known as their database doesn't have the same span as Apple's iTunes store.
Comparatively small in the hand
Better loudspeaker - clear and resonant.
Better Facebook client (by a HUGE margin)
Better BBC iPlayer experience/general online multimedia experience. Many sites tailor their output to iPhone.
Easier to quickly send/reply to a text (I use iRealQuickSMS and I dont think anything similar is available on WinMo)
Built in App Store with 100s of thousands of apps at very reasonable prices (yes I know a lot of them are crap)
Better Youtube app with full sign-in option which includes subscriptions' newest videos
I prefer the iPhone email client.......the Windows one is horrible for HTML content (sorry guys)
Much better IM client in the form of Beejive than anything Windows Mobile currently has on offer. IM+ is slow and ugly.
More tightly knit development and modding scene (XDAs is split over multiple handsets)
iPhone 3G cons
Inconvenient for quickly adding music - iTunes can be a bit of a cludge
Conversion of Video content is almost always required and takes so long that I don't usually bother unless I'm going on a long journey.
Comparatively low screen resolution, screen isn't as bright and clear as the HD2
Limited bluetooth support (although I don't GENERALLY need bluetooth
No option to buy an extra battery so I often have to carry an external one with me.
Low RAM so things often slow down with heavy usage.
Processor not as powerful as that of the HD2 (although it does have hardware acceleration)
HD2 Pros
Gorgeous, huge screen
Multitasking (although I only use it for IM and the iPhone has push notifications which don't use anywhere near as much battery as having an App constantly running in the background and connected to the internet.)
1ghz processor and plenty of RAM means few slowdowns
Video playback without conversion (through Coreplayer)
Nicer weather integration than the iPhone
Better camera than iPhone 3G (but not 3Gs), dual flash.
Great built quality, slimmer than the iPhone.
More comprehensive browser, similar speed but greater screen real-estate and download support. More browser tweaks available.
Open operating system....supports third party skins such as Touchflo and PointUI
Better sound quality through the same Apple headset as the iPhone (in my opinion). Richer, warmer sound.
Easily customisable ringtones and message tones through the device itself, with no jailbreaking required.
Once unlocked, stays unlocked. No worries about device baseband update causing SIMlock.
Facebook and Youtube account/upload integration.
Expandable memory, easier to add files than the iPhone.
HD2 cons
Fiddly UI generally compared to iPhone.
Oversensitive keyboard. Poor prediction algorithms that seem to rely too heavily on getting the first letter right.
Tinny and poor quality speaker. Sounds like an old AM radio on full blast. Awkward positioning on the back.
Paltry 2g card included in box. iPhone comes preloaded with 8gb minimum
Battery charges a lot slower than iPhone
Poor App store - overpriced Apps, too few innovative ones....most of the best ones such as Coreplayer just aren't there. This is not the HD2s fault, it's just that it has a big effect on the user experience when an App store has such a lame selection. Hands up the man who'd pay £5.99 for Pacman, or £18.14 for SPB Wallet!!!
Youtube app is limited and doesn't support account subscriptions. For such a socially-orientated device this is poor show for HTC, and I'm disappointed.
Inbuilt Twitter app is inferior to most iPhone freebies such as Echofon, and a million miles away from being as good as Tweetie. The nearest Windows Marketplace Equivalent TouchTwit costs £3.99 (Tweetie is £1.79 and still a lot better). Microsoft need to get their arse in gear and sort out the Marketplace.
Rubbish Facebook app, browser is better.
These points are just what came to mind for me based on MY WANTS AND NEEDS.
I do like the HD2, I'm not saying it's rubbish. Most of the problems are just about the software, and if Microsoft step up and get the Marketplace right, and HTC release a new ROM with some upgrades and tweaks then who knows.....things might be ten times better.
Aside from it's **** speaker and the slightly dodgy camera tint issue I cannot fault the HD2's hardware. It is really lush, and I love holding it. It is a joy to have in the hand.
Catman3146 said:
As stated in the thread title, I am seriously considering returning my HTC Touch HD2, because I find it almost completely unusable compared to the iphone that I owned previously.
Pros
- Amazing screen
- Everything else that has been highlighted in all the positive reviews that persuaded me to buy the device in the first place (spec, camera, connectivity etc.)
Cons:
- Touchscreen keyboard is unusable and not accurate, even after calibaration (compared to an iphone)
- Web browsing using Opera is frustrating due to the unreliable touchscreen - I find it impossible to click on links; particularly on sites such as this one (with small page numbers etc.) - even when I zoom right in I still can't click the link - there is a huge delay before anything happens, without any feedback to show the link has been clicked - this stuff just worked on the iphone, depsite the smaller screen
- Random app switching, erratic behaviour (screen moving on its own) and regular freezes in all modes/apps
For those who think I am some kind of Apple fan-boy, that couldn't be further from the truth - my iphone developed a dead strip of icons, which forced me to sell it for peanuts, so I vowed to never buy another! The truth of the matter is that the UI of the HD2 just isn't in the same league as the iphone - it's just a cheap imitation.
Maybe if it had Android instead of WM it would stand a chance, but as things currently stand, I find the HD2 completely unusable and will probably be returning it on Monday and getting an iphone, assuming I can persuade Mobile Phones Direct to adhere to the distance selling regulations that provide a 7 day cooling off period (according to their T&C's this only stands if the box is unopened, which is wrong)
Please note that I am posting this for the benefit of others, to provide my personal feedback after using the phone for the last few days. If anyone has any suggestions for how to rectify the problems noted above, I will happily try them.
Catman
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Click to collapse
for me the HD2 is the best. I agreed with the keyboard but i found a solution.
Install Touch Pal and a cab in order to reduce the sensentive leval of the screen (the cab you can download on this forum). Now i can write even better as on the pro 2 - its really great. Forget I-Phone now.
I always find, the best thing to do with a new phone, is try some tweaks etc and then if it doesn't work out, return it. The tweaks usually fix most of the issues that people have. Without this site I would have really regretted getting my X1 for example. But XDA made it amazing.
I love the HD2, and the only problem I have had so far is getting used to the capacitive screen. Any of the other things (like task manager) have been fixed using tweaks from here.
We are so lucky to have all the amazing guys here on XDA developing and discovering all these tweaks for us, and keeping them all in one place.
I suggest you try some of these (they should fix most of your issues).
I would agree, the keyboard can be crazy. But I think it is a case of getting used to it. Every phone is going to be different. That's the nature of the world we live in.
Even then, I think the cons you have mentioned (most of which are fixable).
I hope you do try those tweaks and that they work for you.
Thanks for all your helpful suggestions and comments. I think it is important for people to get a balanced view about the device (particularly compared to the iphone), after reading so many unilaterlly positive reviews that fail to mention many of the flaws I have highlighted.
I will try the tweaks suggested and see how I get over the next couple of days before making a final decision (I'll post an update here), but HTC really should have done a better job with the initial release (the iphone had none of these problems - I bought one of the very first handsets in the US way before it was released here in the UK).
I am still hopeful that the issues are primarily software-related rather than dodgy hardware, but I will try to get a replacement out of MPD to try if this proves to not be the case.
I think you will find Catman, that most of the issues are related to the way the ROM is setup.
I think the tweaks should fix some of them. Have a read through the tips and tweaks list, and see what you can find. Some of them should help. Also, the CABs from smaberg here should also help.
If you sell it, contact me asap !
I am ok to buy !
For anyone struggling with the keyboard, go to the hints and tips thread and install the referenced CAB to reduce screen sensitivity. My keyboard was basically unusable but installed it and it works about the same as the iPhone maybe slightly better because errors are still corrected with the dictionary a lot better...
Catman3146 said:
but HTC really should have done a better job with the initial release (the iphone had none of these problems - I bought one of the very first handsets in the US way before it was released here in the UK).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow if you think the iPhone had no problems at launch, you really are living in backwards land.
BTW, I don't think any HD2s have exploded yet either. I'm not sure if you think incendiary injuries are a positive or negative feature? To be "balanced" we should agree that it is both.
Wow, I find the keyboard excellent, I wonder whether its a ROM-version thing...
Regards browser - have you tried Opera Mobile 10?