is it possible to downgrade from a WM5 mobile to a WM2003SE one via editing roms? or will we have a "driver" problem later? since the WM2003 had that memory slider, that you could share more "store" memory to the RAM sector... that would be nice
Hi devilboy1488!
I am afraid you misunderstand the issue.
First, you can't downgrade a device, unless it originally had a WM2003 ROM and was upgraded. The reason is: you would have to change a lot more than just drivers to get the ROM to work.
Second, and this is the important part: The reason WM5 doesn't have the slider is because it uses memory differently.
In 2003 RAM memory was divided between storage and program, and the slider let you change the division. The down side of this was that if your battery runs out, you loos all data (=hard reset).
In WM5 flash memory is used for storage and RAM only for running programs. Since we are talking about two physically different memory types there's no way to allocate one for the use of another so there's no slider. The plus is you don't loos all your stuff if you forget to recharge your device.
Thank you, you clarified me heh
Related
I am not sure whether mine is right or not. but the version 1.5 sitll be same with before to O2:
128M for system STORAGE and PROGRAMS... another 15M for STORAGE. after release EXTROM, then extra 16M is up.
That is very excellent partition for me: I install everything in the MAIN, then just use different SD card for data, it works very good.
But after I upgrade to Version1.6. I suddently find:
the total 128M all for PROGRAMS. and the 15M STORAGE moves to be system STORAGE,
Then I have very limited functions: I can not install any software in the MAIN since after I installed CHN OS and INPUT, only 5MB left in the main storage...
:-(
not good!!!!! stupid concept!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
so what? use version 1.50h or 1.50i and be happy
YES, I AM DOWNING TO VER1.50 NOW
design is PERFECT, but unfortunately not ideal for xda2 device.
new devices are having 128MB of flash chips and 64MB of RAM chips.
the whole wm2005 on himalaya is just pure experiment...
go for 1.50i if you need more storage space.
for me it is good, coz all my progs are running off of SD card and extROM. I like, that I don't have to care about the battery...
buzz
ps. please post to the right threads...
I think that 1.60a is perfect. It uses the available Himalaya hardware to the max.
I patched the 1.60a down from 128MB ram to 96MB and installed the 32MB ramdisk. With this I have enough storage space while still having the 16MB storage and 16MB Extrom persistent.
Cheers
Pat
i think it is great
i started with 1.60a but as i do have too use wifi and lots of progs put the 96 there
as time passes i do receive a lot of emails and sms messages that wasnt enouth also so put the 64/64
i runing it with that and tell you its very good
as i agree with buzz this tecnology is for new devices and on the xda2 it still works very well
so a version with 32 mb one partition and 128 of ram if possible would be great
i would test such a config when buzz manage to make it possible
1.6a 64
hi buzz and thanks for everything
what i did install is 1.6a 128 in may imate2 (xda2) its good but having troubles with empty storage (whenever i install a program in my SD storage "0.19mb now" some of them take bite from storage and keep program untuched "still 100mb")
so can you help to change that from 1.6a to 1.6a 64mb and i will be so thankfull.
thanks
At first I find it stupid...But the purpose of this is to let the memory stay when the battery gone. You could always use the Extended Rom to become your storage or you can flash back to 150i 32mb/64mb/96mb..
Hi,
I'm using 1.60a and everything is ok!
Usually I choose if program is more or less important and install in Main or in Extended Rom.
So far no major problems.
Only Pocket Informant can't install (even they said is a WM5 compatible version).
Bye.
tony-xd_wang said:
YES, I AM DOWNING TO VER1.50 NOW
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Me too
now downgrade to 1.50i96 faster
1.60a prog memory leak?
First of all thanks to Buzz for a splendid job on the wm5. Having 120mb for running progs has its advantages. But I'd like to post an observation. When normally running after a soft reset, my prog mem is set at 106mb. Then when running the normal progs of the day w/c uses up prog mem, closing the progs would restore it back to my initial 106mb. I've noticed that even w/out running progs, the prog mem gradually drops down. After a few hours it will be at 98-99mb w/out any running progs. I don't know if anybody has noticed this behaviour on their xda2. Perhaps some entlightenment Buzz?
Fyi. i'm running dktoday and spb pocket plus3. The mem monitor from spb tallies w/ those in /settings/memory.
Forgive me for not really being able to search deeply into this matter, I've seen threads detailing updating with the JasJar ROM or an amalgamation of the the MDA/O2 ROM.
1) I have 43.72mb total storage and 47.93mb Program storage. This results in 91.65mb total storage??? Right, at 128megs where has 40mbs gone? I have pretty much the exact same set up on the MDA3 yet the two figures more or less add up to 128mb. Can someone confirm these figures with me?
2) Is there a new ROM coming out and soon? I'm not one to complain if results are going to happen, but the memory issue is a biggy to me as there is one more program I want to install on the thing and I doubt there will be enough free memory.
3) Software, I'm sure there was a better suite of software on the MDA3 when that came out. Okay time consuming it may be but sometimes I do like to run Messenger when I'm on the train - where has it gone? And if Microsoft think I'm going to pay £10.99 more for that feature they can go swivel. I followed a thread that said it's included in Windows - it's not on the MDA Pro.
I really love the design of the thing but the software just seems to be a joke. Where do I start? I have posted the MDA3 for sale on Ebay and I want to honour that sale, but I also want a device that replaces my MDA3 100%.
This includes getting TomTom 5 to work with my BT GPS receiver!!!
1. Sorry not sure about the memory
2. I havent heard of a new T-mobile ROM being available and they never seemed to work on any updates for the MDAiii
3. The software suite was better - I miss my messenger too and like you I am reluctant to pay microsoft a tenner! The backup software isnt avialbel either which is an arse.
4. Good luck with TT5 I had to upgrade my co-pilot to get it to work on new os.
If at all possible could anyone with the MDAPro and the carrier ROM please do a memory check on theirs to compare with mine?
If you're not sure how to do it - Start/Settings/System/Memory, I just need the total figures for Storage and Program
I have the same memory CONFIG as you have stated!
In WM5 you have separate ROM & RAM configuration unlike WM2k3...
So here's how ur memory is split up -
1. RAM 64MB
Out of 64 megs of RAM, you loose roughly 17MB on internal allocation. For the device to run perfectly it has various fixed RAM permanently allocated (DMA buffers (for ur cameras etc.), kernel level memory allocation, GSM memory, video memory, mem swap space, cache etc.). This total memory fixed can vary from device to device, and each company can tweak it accordingly. Eventually, the OS has roughly 47MB for use. Now again, when WM5 powers up, it again consumes around 17megs of RAM, giving you 30-32 megs of ram to use for your programs or apps!
2. ROM 128MB (permanent storage)
This is divided into the following -
a. OS install: This is where WM5 related files etc. gets stored. This is a total of 64Megs
b. Extended ROM: This is used by maufacturers to store their customizations etc. Another 20megs allocated for this
c. User storage: This is the space available for you to install programs, and for windows to bloat Thats 43megs that you find!
Hope this clears out
Cheers,
San
Thanks for you response having had an XDA for some time and then the MDA I was just quite suprised to see a Memory low warning message so quickly as I never saw one on the MDA3. I wanted to confirm that I wasn't having memory issues.
I have a question which puzzles me - perhaps the knowledgeable amongst us can answer it for me.
I have 2 devices, an Orange SPV M2000 (Blue Angel) and an O2 MDA Mini S (Wizard).
When I look at the device info I see this
........................................BA......................Wizard
RAM Size.........................128MB....................64MB
Flash Size..........................32MB....................128MB
Storage Size..................43.26MB.................47.46MB
When I look at the Memory Screen, the BA has 125.77MB main memory showing 62.88MB allocated to Storage and 62.89MB allocated to Program and a slider to alter the split of memory.
When I look at the Memory on the Wizard there is no slider and it shows 44.76MB allocated to Storage and 44.01MB allocated to Program.
Whichever way I look at it I cannot seem to make sense of the figures.
Can someone explain (in simple terms) what these figures mean and why there is such a dramatic difference between the RAM and Flash sizes on these two devices?
First the major difference between Blue Angel and Wizard. Blue Angel stores everything - your programs, data, etc. in RAM. It uses this same RAM for program memory. That's why you get a slider. It's also why, if your battery runs out or your reset it, you lost all your stuff. The Wizard, on the other hand, has memory dedicated for data/settings storage that's like flash memory (so you won't lose your stuff), and different memory for the RAM.
depending on the ROM/ExtRom/Radio Stack, etc. installed there's...
128MB total ROM
of which
44MB is available for storage of applications/user files
the rest is the operating system, extrom, etc.
and
64MB total RAM
of which
49MB is available for running programs/memory
the rest of which is the PIM running in the background, the phone running in the background, the radio stack running in the background, etc. All stuff that either the OEM or Microsoft decided you wouldn't want not running.
Thanks 'Z'.
Now it all makes more sense.
Sorry to resurrect a somewhat buried thread, but I was doing my research before posting by using the search function -- not bad for a newbie, eh? -- and ran across this thread which directly addresses some questions I've been dealing with, but I'd like to throw some stuff out to see if I understand completely.
As I understand it, the Wizard has 64MB of SDRAM, and 128MB of Flash storage memory, correct? On the developer.cingular.com it says 64MB Flash ROM and 128MB SDRAM which appears to be backwards.
On the device Memory manager after a hard reset and installing the Qtek 9100 customization .cab Storage shows Free 43.75 of 47.46MB and Program shows Free 27.18 of 44.01MB.
As I understand it, "Storage" is refering to the Flash non-volatile memory, and "Program" is referring to RAM, correct?
So this means that of the 128MB of flash memory, ~80MB is hidden, including the customization .cab. Of the 64MB of flash memory, more than half is taken up by OS, radio and other things.
Do I have that right?
Now, one more thing. If I drag a 5MB file onto the device, the storage in use increases 5MB but Program isn't affected. This makes perfect sense.
Syncing, however is a different story. A small test sync of email, contacts, and calendar uses 2.68 Storage memory but 3.7MB of Program memory.
I take it from this that when you sync, it writes the pim info to the flash memory but then also automatically expands it into system memory. Do I understand that correctly?
If I am correct, is there any registry hack or anything that can change this behavior? Would it really slow things down so much if your PIM info had to be taken out of Storage memory? Or am I missing something?
Thanks for any responses.
Gene
I hope no one minds that I bump this, it's been several days.
I'm fairly sure my basic understanding of the situation is correct: contacts etc are loaded into persistent memory (ROM) then loaded into system RAM as well -- I speculate to speed searches and such because RAM is so much faster than Flash memory.
However this has a drawback in that whereas a 64MB RAM-only ppc 2003 device was able to handle >5,000 contacts with ease, on the Wizard it takes almost all of the RAM.
I know it's possible to reduce the amount of RAM (and ROM for that matter) being used by other applications but I'm wondering if anyone has explored or figured out a way to keep the PIM info in ROM (registry hack, perhaps) until it's actually needed, and what the repercussions if any were, ie did it make using the pim info unbearably slow?
I have a question here. Why doesn't HTC put more flash ROM storage (maybe 1GB of flash ROM) into its mobile phone? Then we don't need external SD memory card.
I have a question here. Why doesn't HTC put more flash ROM storage (maybe 1GB of flash ROM) into its mobile phone? Then we don't need external SD memory card.
I'm sure they'll be increasing that in upcoming models. Only reason not to, typically, is to keep cost down a bit - and let the user add as much storage memory as they want; this is under the assumption that anything put on the storage card will work just fine, which is not the case with many applications :|
Hi friends,
After almost half a year using this O2 Exec, I found it's really good and met all my needs. However, there is still problem with the insufficient program memory even though I used the "closed" functions by pocket plus and clean the device from time to time by memaid. I also use the clearnotification.
Is it possible to adjust the memory allocation the same as the Magician or Himalaya? I know they are all different. If we can combine the extended rom of my Exec to the program memory, it may help a lot.
Cheers,
Doesnt work like that anymore. Try a search for persistant storage or the like. Now with WM5 you have storage memory (built-in flash) and RAM. This has been brought up many times.
Know how this works. But, one day I playing with my O2 Exec, landed in the Memory applet. I suddenly had an image on the PPC, which had a slider to allocate memory . The image was merged with the background. But, my PPC had freezed.
Wish I had the presence of mind to click a photograph , before I did a soft reset.
Food for thought, maybe there is something in there, not known to us.
I think maybe the freeze was because you crashed your machine showing that slider.
I have seen someone post on here about seeing it, and the fact that MS recycled the memory screen from WM2003SE and hid that part.
You're never going to be able to change Flash into RAM, they are (three) distinct chips and used separately by the OS.
The only way you could do it is to write a virtual memory driver the same way that WinXP and other desktop OSs use paging files on the hard drive to simulate RAM. Slow, lots of overheads, no advantage whatsoever on the Universal.
So the solution to your problem may be the same as mine:
I wrote off to a company that does electronics work and asked them if they can fit another couple of RAM chips to my device. This page says that there is room for two more (another 64MB?) RAM chips on the mainboard if you can BGA solder. Still waiting on a reply.
A 128MB Uni would kick the backside out of all other handhelds. Oh, and USB host, but that is a whole world of work that nobody has tried yet. Damn you HTC!
Of course you realise that the more RAM you have the worse the battery life will be.
I'm also thinking to put more chip into the free space but not sure that we need to do anything with the OS to run on 128MB hardware.
Can we just put more chip on it? I want to try
xenon_art said:
I'm also thinking to put more chip into the free space but not sure that we need to do anything with the OS to run on 128MB hardware.
Can we just put more chip on it? I want to try
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I remember, Asukal or Mwang(mwang - sorry if I misspelled Ur nick) already tried to add more ram chips, but wothout any effect - no raam increase - unfortunately for us
:-(
phsnake said:
xenon_art said:
I'm also thinking to put more chip into the free space but not sure that we need to do anything with the OS to run on 128MB hardware.
Can we just put more chip on it? I want to try
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I remember, Asukal or Mwang(mwang - sorry if I misspelled Ur nick) already tried to add more ram chips, but wothout any effect - no raam increase - unfortunately for us
:-(
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so disappointed.
thanks for your info.
Hi everyone,
am quite new to these boards, and have only just got myself a secondhand xda IIs. In the last half a yer I have owned a HTC hermes, universal & kaiser but have finally settled on the BA because the design just suits me more. So far so good- am very happy!
I am a complete noob though and having just upgraded to WM6 from WM2003SE (following the WIKI guide & wizard) I am a bit puzzled about my phomnes' memory capacity and what goes where....
Reading over the forum I have heard how the reformating of exended rom (?) etc can increase your available storage to 128mb as part of the upgrade process. This I did with the unlocker and formatting tool. But upon upgradeing it seems I have only 64mb available for storage , but 100mb for 'programs'.... I am a bit confused. To make it worse when I load programs on the phone it actually reduces the storage capacity available rather than the 'program' memory- of which I have 75mb free that I can't seem to get at!! Can anyone please tell me what I am doing wrong or else point me in the direction of where I can educate myself about this? ....I know it is a very basic question, but am a complete novice to pdas since the last 6 months so please don't flame me!!
Thanks
Think of this in desktop computer terms.
Storage == hard drive
Program memory == RAM
explanation:
programs are installed to either storage or storage card. programs run using program memory.
hey tnx, i was looking for such info too tnx m8 for the help
Thanks! Crystal clear now!
one (or so) more quetion...
Hi- quick folow up question if anyone has the time to answer...
So I understand I have 64mb storage- but in WM2003 you could allocate how much to put to RAM & how much to put to storgae right? So therefore if I had lots of apps I wanted to load onto the phone and I needed more storage I could just reallocate. Was there not a way in the whole upgrade process to allocate less than 128mb to RAM so that I have more storage? I think I missed something here. If it is safe to have less than 128mb RAM i think I may go back and do the repartitioning thing again. Some advice would be much appreciated.
If so my question is why is it recommended to have 128mb RAM- would reducing it to less than that cause the phone to run too slow under WM6?? Is there a 'safe' guideline for minimum amount of RAM to allocate? Further clarification would be greatly appreciated! (As I see it I have lost some 'storgare' capacity this way, beecause programs excluded from the WM6 rom, eg powerpoint etc , be reloaded and so eat away at my new storage of 64mb)
I think you may have missed the point: storage is flash memory, program memory is RAM. The difference is that pre-WM5 flash memory held your vanilla system, Extended ROM, and the default (for hard reset). Everything else that you customised or installed went into RAM, which was therefore split between storage of programs and data and program memory. Remember how when your battery went flat your device lost everything? That's why, and why a backup battery was needed. WM5 and later devices do not need or have backup batteries.
Since WM5 all programs and user data are stored in flash: this can make performance slower but ensures that you survive a power failure unscathed. There are ways to get round the performance issues, compressing files with UPX saves space AND time because reading a smaller file from flash is obviously quicker, and expanding it in RAM goes very fast indeed. However I would not want to overstate the performance hit that you experience working from flash.
So this is why you have lost the ability to manage the memory split - it's nothing to worry about and indeed I am very pleased because my BA now has more program memory than my Hermes.
Hope this helps!
jbn
ssjw1000 said:
Hi- quick folow up question if anyone has the time to answer...
So I understand I have 64mb storage- but in WM2003 you could allocate how much to put to RAM & how much to put to storgae right? So therefore if I had lots of apps I wanted to load onto the phone and I needed more storage I could just reallocate. Was there not a way in the whole upgrade process to allocate less than 128mb to RAM so that I have more storage? I think I missed something here. If it is safe to have less than 128mb RAM i think I may go back and do the repartitioning thing again. Some advice would be much appreciated.
If so my question is why is it recommended to have 128mb RAM- would reducing it to less than that cause the phone to run too slow under WM6?? Is there a 'safe' guideline for minimum amount of RAM to allocate? Further clarification would be greatly appreciated! (As I see it I have lost some 'storgare' capacity this way, beecause programs excluded from the WM6 rom, eg powerpoint etc , be reloaded and so eat away at my new storage of 64mb)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In addition to jbn's answer above you can also use a ROM that has a RAMDISK. This takes a portion of the RAM and creates a folder that you can use as a filesystem. Many people prefer these, I do not. I use my SD card and my onboard storage and have no problems with space. If you decide to go with a RAMDISK enabled ROM beware that you will loose anything you install to that section of the filesystem if your batter and backup batter go dead. Exactly the same behavior you had with WM2003 in your BA originally.